[ZOS UPDATE] Mercenary style mat (laurel) is BoP and only drops if you know the style?!

ThatNeonZebraAgain · October 2015

James-Wayne wrote: »

I think this is genius, this stops people selling Laurel for insane prices where it really should be used by players who have learnt the system, the crafters of the game world. Why earn something when you don't understand the system its been built for, great job ZOS love it!

Maybe because players have built up their crafters over the last year, long before this absurd system was even conceived..?

Synozeer · October 2015

As usual, the PVP stuff is BoE and PVE is BoP. I want to PVP, not PVE.

How about we make the new armor sets BoP, allow you to get the new armor sets in the end of campaign PVP rewards (like we were able to before this patch with trials gear and master weapons). After all, in IC PvP gear is BoE, the PvE gear is BoP. Now it appears the new motif components are like that too.

Xendyn · October 2015

I'm starting to feel like I somehow wandered into the middle of a bad social experiment with some of the decisions ZOS is making lately.

redspecter23 · October 2015

maysonet_ESO wrote: »

As usual, the PVP stuff is BoE and PVE is BoP. I want to PVP, not PVE.

How about we make the new armor sets BoP, allow you to get the new armor sets in the end of campaign PVP rewards (like we were able to before this patch with trials gear and master weapons). After all, in IC PvP gear is BoE, the PvE gear is BoP. Now it appears the new motif components are like that too.

It really is starting to get blatantly obvious that pvp players are allowed to earn gear during their play time that they can either use or sell, but pve players are stuck with anything of note being completely bound. Is it done this way on purpose? I'm starting to wonder.

AhPook_Is_Here · October 2015

Maybe their motivation was to stimulate the crafted economy. If everybody just ships everything to an alt there is no specialization and no demand. Not saying this is the right time to do it, nor that it isn't a shift in what their policy appears to have been for over a year but it will make it so if you get motifs, if you want the style drop you will need to use the motif chapters on your character you do dungeons with.

Xendyn · October 2015

AhPook_Is_Here wrote: »

Maybe their motivation was to stimulate the crafted economy. If everybody just ships everything to an alt there is no specialization and no demand. Not saying this is the right time to do it, nor that it isn't a shift in what their policy appears to have been for over a year but it will make it so if you get motifs, if you want the style drop you will need to use the motif chapters on your character you do dungeons with.

Well, all I can say is that I would like to know what the motivation actually is. We're just swingin' in the dark here with no indication of the game's direction or if/how all these changes are supposed to work out in the end.
Is it worth it for me to redo all the trait research? I don't have a clue.

I used to know exactly what to expect for my crafters and I was set up in a way that was satisfactory for me.
Now, for all I know, next Spring this will all take some other left turn. I have no idea of the big picture anymore.

I expect this kind of thing for dropped gear and new levels, but crafting? I've never played a game where they suddenly changed it all midstream and you're faced with redoing a years work.

It would be a great time for a Road Ahead or something.

Kartalin · October 2015

It's all cosmetic, isn't it? Granted I really like the look of Mercenary style compared to the last two, but most of the time I wear a costume anyway.

Honestly I'm surprised they aren't any motifs yet that are solely found in the crown store.

slumber_sandb16_ESO · October 2015

Considering the insane time it takes to learn crafting traits etc it would be better if crafting was account wide rather than bound to characters.

ThatNeonZebraAgain · October 2015

milthalas wrote: »

It's all cosmetic, isn't it? Granted I really like the look of Mercenary style compared to the last two, but most of the time I wear a costume anyway.

Honestly I'm surprised they aren't any motifs yet that are solely found in the crown store.

It is indeed cosmetic. But for someone like me, who has dedicated master crafter alts that have taken over a year to develop, this is really a slap in the face. I also forwent learning Xivkyn and Glass because they are fugly, but at least the grinds were doable, unlike with Mercenary where you are intrinsically gated if you don't have your crafters leveled/geared up to do Undaunted dailes. This mechanic is unlike anything currently in the game, especially in comparison to other crafting styles. There seems to be no real reason for it either, which makes it all the more frustrating.

Lithium Flower · October 2015

Ridiculous! Ridiculous! This is the most disingenuous, crafter unfriendly alt unfriendly decision possible. I have 6 veteran 16s and one crafter and I am now meant to only play this character and ignore the rest? Why? What benefit is there to the game with this policy? Every unique design in the DLC's appears to be specifically engineered to stop me playing my alts - not being able to get proper nodes in Orsinium on any except my crafter, vet dungeon trophies bound to characters instead of account in IC, general trophies bound to characters for no reason whatsoever and now this mentally challenged game design.

Between theses changes and the constant lag and poor latency, I just don't know why I bother signing in.

Can I get a refund on my subscription which goes through to April. I don't feel like playing this diarrhea any more.

timidobserver · October 2015

I think this is a good thing. I am a master crafter(all traits in everthing), but I dislike crafting for people because it isn't worth the time. As if I want to go sit in 15 minutes worth of load screens to make the measly 2-5k tip that most people try to pay. It is much more productive to just farm and sell mats. It is nice that they are taking steps to make actually crafting stuff for people profitable as opposed to just farming and selling the mats.

BuggeX · October 2015

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

Teargrants · October 2015

BuggeX wrote: »

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

IKR?! Gotta punish those ppl that dedicated the time needed to lvl up alts and grind out their skills. How dare they expect to be rewarded for their hard work.

Rosveen · October 2015

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

milthalas wrote: »

It's all cosmetic, isn't it? Granted I really like the look of Mercenary style compared to the last two, but most of the time I wear a costume anyway.

Honestly I'm surprised they aren't any motifs yet that are solely found in the crown store.

There seems to be no real reason for it either, which makes it all the more frustrating.

The reason is fueling crown store sales of motifs and style stones.

BuggeX · October 2015

Teargrants wrote: »

BuggeX wrote: »

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

IKR?! Gotta punish those ppl that dedicated the time needed to lvl up alts and grind out their skills. How dare they expect to be rewarded for their hard work.

And wath about the ppls which are punished to have - 120 Skillpoints on the main cause of the crafting?
But yea lvling an alt is hard work, lvl to v1 and max crafting with destruction Items from main, rly hard work.
Im so impressed.

Teargrants · October 2015

BuggeX wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

BuggeX wrote: »

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

IKR?! Gotta punish those ppl that dedicated the time needed to lvl up alts and grind out their skills. How dare they expect to be rewarded for their hard work.

And wath about the ppls which are punished to have - 120 Skillpoints on the main cause of the crafting?
But yea lvling an alt is hard work, lvl to v1 and max crafting with destruction Items from main, rly hard work.
Im so impressed.

If it's so easy to do, then why don't you go make alts for yourself, instead of complaining about 'benefits' people get for having alts?

And please don't give me the "1 to V1" crap, you specifically cited leaderboards + dailies in your complaint, not just crafting. That means V16. Don't even get me started on Undaunted & Alliance War rank grinds to optimize your character.

BuggeX · October 2015

Teargrants wrote: »

BuggeX wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

BuggeX wrote: »

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

IKR?! Gotta punish those ppl that dedicated the time needed to lvl up alts and grind out their skills. How dare they expect to be rewarded for their hard work.

And wath about the ppls which are punished to have - 120 Skillpoints on the main cause of the crafting?
But yea lvling an alt is hard work, lvl to v1 and max crafting with destruction Items from main, rly hard work.
Im so impressed.

If it's so easy to do, then why don't you go make alts for yourself, instead of complaining about 'benefits' people get for having alts?

Cuz i dont want do do any *** over and over aigan, mostly Master Angler, Trophy Hunter etcetc.
So second you just punish anyone with just a single chare with achivments wich require more time to complete than grind a alt to v16 and max out the few skills?

Alphashado · October 2015

SleepyTroll wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

From notes:

This chance is also modified by your knowledge of the Mercenary style: If you know zero Chapters of the style, you will never receive a Laurel from any source. If you know all 14 Chapters, you will always receive a Laurel from Veteran dungeon final bosses, every time you kill one.
Laurels are Bind on Pickup - they cannot be sold, traded, or mailed.

I'm usually not one for hyperbole, but I really, really do not understand this decision at all. This means my account will probably never be able to have Mercenary styled items (which was shaping up to be one of my favorites based on the initial designs) because of how I've spread out/leveled my crafting abilities. My crafting alts are level 16ish and all have 8+ traits learned and know all styles (except Glass and Xivkyn because I find them ugly). My main is a VR16 tank who has no traits researched and no rare styles learned, but who recently gained level 50 of all crafting lines (except enchanting) for purposes of writs. So, while doing dailies on my main I can get motif pages alright, but if I give them to my alts to learn and use like I have with every other style, my main will then never be eligible to receive the mat for a drop. BUT, if I learn the pages on my main, the style is virtually wasted because I've yet to research any traits on that character. Given the significant time and gold investment in building a crafter (traits and styles), this design penalizes all those who don't have crafters as main characters. Please at least give some drop chance or other way to get the style mat even if you haven't learned any part of the style.

ZOS needs to start supporting account wide setups.

Exactly. I don't think they have the slightest clue in regards to the concept of alternate characters.

Alphashado · October 2015

Rosveen wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

milthalas wrote: »

It's all cosmetic, isn't it? Granted I really like the look of Mercenary style compared to the last two, but most of the time I wear a costume anyway.

Honestly I'm surprised they aren't any motifs yet that are solely found in the crown store.

There seems to be no real reason for it either, which makes it all the more frustrating.

The reason is fueling crown store sales of motifs and style stones.

It would be a terrible idea to put these stones on the crown store considering their decision to have them drop for crafting characters only. That would be a very bad idea. Might be the straw that breaks the camel's back for many people.

Docmandu · October 2015

I'd be perfectly fine with this, if it not were for the fact that we pretty much know this will hit the Crown Store too. If it was only attainable in-game without cash shop, then it'd be something to differentiate people that like to craft and run dungeons, but without power change.. ie visual gimmick, which is quite ok. Just another carrot for people to chase, without imbalancing the game.

But it will probably just end up as another cash grab.

agro2014 · October 2015

Zero drop rate if no motif parts learned is unacceptable. I will be forced to learn motif on non-crafter toon just for get style mat or to buy mat in Crown store.

SorataArisugawa · October 2015

I like the system. I didn't needed all skillpoints for my skills so I desided to learn all armor cafts with my main. And now it seems it was a great decision

Kyoma · October 2015

The real problem lies in the chance to get the laurel, if they would add a small chance to get it from the chests regardless of how many chapters you know on that character it would allow ppl to collect them through that.

GuyNamedSean · October 2015

Great. Now I'm not only going to have to grind AP to get Akaviri, but I'm going to have to go all in and make my non-crafter replace my crafter.

Lithium Flower · October 2015

It's not just about crafting characters. I will have a v16 crafter tank to do dungeons with for the laurels. It's about making it increasingly unrewarding to play on different alts. I don't have a main but I have invested time and effort into 7 different veteran characters. Not only will Orsinium punish me for having played all this time by taking an axe to my ability to earn CP but also make it unrewarding to play on any character except the one I craft with

Thanks ZoS, I'm finally motivated to play Dragon Age Inquisition and Witcher 3 instead.

Zinaroth · October 2015

BuggeX wrote: »

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

This.

Teargrants wrote: »

BuggeX wrote: »

I find this good, you know why?
until today, anyone with alts got a advanced over someone without someone with alts.
More Hirelings, more Leaderboards, more Daylis, more *** anything.

IKR?! Gotta punish those ppl that dedicated the time needed to lvl up alts and grind out their skills. How dare they expect to be rewarded for their hard work.

Currently the only ones being punished in the game are the people who chose to focus on advancing a single character over 7 alts. You don't think reaching a high alliance rank, earning all achievement points and unlocking all skills and every single morph is hard work either?

You will still have plenty of things in the game where having all those alts gives you an edge, this will just be one of the things that acts as a boon to the people focusing on a single character.

People were QQing about the scalable crafting notes and now this, come on...

Lithium Flower wrote: »

It's not just about crafting characters. I will have a v16 crafter tank to do dungeons with for the laurels. It's about making it increasingly unrewarding to play on different alts. I don't have a main but I have invested time and effort into 7 different veteran characters. Not only will Orsinium punish me for having played all this time by taking an axe to my ability to earn CP but also make it unrewarding to play on any character except the one I craft with

Up until this point there hasn't been many penalties for spreading your effort over so many characters compared to all the benefits you got.

Now something finally comes along that rewards people focusing on a single character and you're being punished?

That is the same as saying that every single person who doesn't have many alts have been punished in the game up until now...

As much as we had the options to roll alts then you have the option to focus on a single character now.

myrrrorb14_ESO · October 2015

Looks easy enough to game the system to me.

Having zero % drop chance if you dont have a chapter seems a bit much. But it is what it is.

Slurg · October 2015

Argonian master crafter soon-to-be LFG for laurel dungeon run. Not a healer and my lava whip appears to actually be a wet noodle. But I can swim really fast!

myrrrorb14_ESO · October 2015

Slurg wrote: »

Argonian master crafter soon-to-be LFG for laurel dungeon run. Not a healer and my lava whip appears to actually be a wet noodle. But I can swim really fast!

You got cookies?

code65536 · October 2015

There is a bit of a workaround: Find a V16 buddy to group with your level 10 crafter. Make your level 10 the leader. Go to Fungal Grotto. Follow the V16 as he 1-shots the whole dungeon in 5 minutes. Collect laurel. Rinse and repeat?

Easiest solution would be to make the laurel drop based on the chapters known by the most learned of your characters. Avoids all the problems here while adhering to the spirit of this reward-for-knowing system (which I actually like).