Shadow Cloak

wraith808 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Stop calling me a man -.- I'm not, it's beginning to annoy me.

Not agreeing or disagreeing with either side... but man is a figure of speech when used in that way. Especially if the gender is unknown. Calling someone to task over that is... petty. IMO.

Dracane · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

wraithguknub18_ESO wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Can't believe people are really protecting cloak and denying how OP it is when used properly.
It's about time my Nightblade reaches vr14 and I manage to record gameplay already. Then I'm going to send Zenimax some interesting stuff.

Its funny I get away alot on my NB but I get pulled out alot to and killed. Thats my only defense. And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place and thats not OP? Dont get me wrong im not saying to nerf anything. However having played both I think bolt escape is SO much easier to use to get away than Shadow Cloak.

My personal feeling is that no matter what changes happen I will adapt or play another class if I have to. Im not going to come on the forums QQ'in everytime I dont get my way.

Have a nice day

Sorcerers can't blink all over the place. Seems like you didn't even realize the nerf.

Have you actually tested 1.7?
A sorc may not be able to steak across cyrodiil, but they can cetainly streak all over the place. The nerf merely stopped overly excessive streaking. You can still streak a ton.

But he said, 'And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place ' place might be a vague description, but it's still exaggerated.
And even if, people fail to understand that the Sorc is OOM after a few blinks which makes him basically free AP.

But that's impossible to understand for you.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Xeven · August 2015

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius, which does not mind you, solve any of the previous problems I mentioned. It merely gives you the ability to see the person who is killing you, maybe!

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

wraithguknub18_ESO wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Can't believe people are really protecting cloak and denying how OP it is when used properly.
It's about time my Nightblade reaches vr14 and I manage to record gameplay already. Then I'm going to send Zenimax some interesting stuff.

could you possible QQ some more? Seriously? I normally dont bother coming to the forums because all it seems to be is a bunch of QQ "nerf this nerf that" omg its so OP wah wah wah.

Its funny I get away alot on my NB but I get pulled out alot to and killed. Thats my only defense. And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place and thats not OP? Dont get me wrong im not saying to nerf anything. However having played both I think bolt escape is SO much easier to use to get away than Shadow Cloak.

My personal feeling is that no matter what changes happen I will adapt or play another class if I have to. Im not going to come on the forums QQ'in everytime I dont get my way.

By the way if you give me your address Ill ship you some tissues.

Have a nice day

Could you silence your outragous mouth ? Is that possible ?

Sorcerers can't blink all over the place. Seems like you didn't even realize the nerf.
How about you give me your address and I ship myself over to you ?

Have a bad day (hopefully)

Have you actually tested 1.7?
A sorc may not be able to steak across cyrodiil, but they can cetainly streak all over the place. The nerf merely stopped overly excessive streaking. You can still streak a ton.

But he said, 'And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place ' place might be a vague description, but it's still exaggerated.
And even if, people fail to understand that the Sorc is OOM after a few blinks which makes him basically free AP.

But that's impossible to understand for you.

The conversation was grated toward numbered of blinks not ehat occurs after. I was merely adding to the scope of the argument not broadening the scope. The point of BE is to not only use it strategically in battle, but also to leave a bad situation. When a sorc wants to leave a bad situation they can bolt escape 6, 7, 8 times or even more if specced for it. The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak. Sure a sorc may be out of juice after streaking that much, but they can still streak way more than needed to escape. In fact, 2 or 3 is more then enough in the majority of cases to do so. The nerf essentially gave a penalty to using it that much. That is to say that they will be out of magicka. On live they can steak 6,7,8 times or more and still have a sustained fight. That is what the nerf was geared at. Actually lowering a sorcs fighting capability after streaking so much. But that does not matter b/c if you have not gotten out of harms way in no more than 4 streaks then you are not streaking efficiently. Same goes for dodgeroll. I can dodgeroll upwards of 6 times until I actually notice a disadvantage in stamina management for fighting.

contact.opiumb16_ESO · August 2015

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius, which does not mind you, solve any of the previous problems I mentioned. It merely gives you the ability to see the person who is killing you, maybe!

L2P bro' ! (sarcastic content inside)

Dracane · August 2015

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius.

Xeven, all of that is true and people will come to recognize, that Nightblade is the I-win class and that all other classes are nothing but NB toys, especially in IC. They will get nerfed, don't you worry. It might take a week or 2 or 3 maybe.
But they will do something to bring Nightblades in line with the inferior classes.

I already feel sorry for all non Vampire Templars and Dragonknights who can't use mistform to stay mobile. They'll be suffering the most at the beginning. I see why @DDuke suggested turning cloak into a camo instead of 100% invisibility. Cloak as it is right now, allows them to be dark puppetmasters.

Xeniph · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

wraithguknub18_ESO wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Can't believe people are really protecting cloak and denying how OP it is when used properly.
It's about time my Nightblade reaches vr14 and I manage to record gameplay already. Then I'm going to send Zenimax some interesting stuff.

Its funny I get away alot on my NB but I get pulled out alot to and killed. Thats my only defense. And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place and thats not OP? Dont get me wrong im not saying to nerf anything. However having played both I think bolt escape is SO much easier to use to get away than Shadow Cloak.

My personal feeling is that no matter what changes happen I will adapt or play another class if I have to. Im not going to come on the forums QQ'in everytime I dont get my way.

Have a nice day

Sorcerers can't blink all over the place. Seems like you didn't even realize the nerf.

Have you actually tested 1.7?
A sorc may not be able to steak across cyrodiil, but they can cetainly streak all over the place. The nerf merely stopped overly excessive streaking. You can still streak a ton.

But he said, 'And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place ' place might be a vague description, but it's still exaggerated.
And even if, people fail to understand that the Sorc is OOM after a few blinks which makes him basically free AP.

But that's impossible to understand for you.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

This statement is an over simplification. Just because you can't BE all around, does not mean someone else can't. My sorc can get 6-8 BE's in a row without using a potion, or waiting for the debuff between applications. That's a minimum of 90m of distance, assuming only 6 successive. Tie in a potion, refreshing Ward, other buffs, roll dodge and other things I do when I want to wait out the timer and I can do it indefinitely. So no, a properly geared pvp Sorc will get a lot more than a few BE's if he's really trying to get away. Because after all, we are comparing escape mechanics.

Dracane · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

wraithguknub18_ESO wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Can't believe people are really protecting cloak and denying how OP it is when used properly.
It's about time my Nightblade reaches vr14 and I manage to record gameplay already. Then I'm going to send Zenimax some interesting stuff.

could you possible QQ some more? Seriously? I normally dont bother coming to the forums because all it seems to be is a bunch of QQ "nerf this nerf that" omg its so OP wah wah wah.

Its funny I get away alot on my NB but I get pulled out alot to and killed. Thats my only defense. And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place and thats not OP? Dont get me wrong im not saying to nerf anything. However having played both I think bolt escape is SO much easier to use to get away than Shadow Cloak.

My personal feeling is that no matter what changes happen I will adapt or play another class if I have to. Im not going to come on the forums QQ'in everytime I dont get my way.

By the way if you give me your address Ill ship you some tissues.

Have a nice day

Could you silence your outragous mouth ? Is that possible ?

Sorcerers can't blink all over the place. Seems like you didn't even realize the nerf.
How about you give me your address and I ship myself over to you ?

Have a bad day (hopefully)

Have you actually tested 1.7?
A sorc may not be able to steak across cyrodiil, but they can cetainly streak all over the place. The nerf merely stopped overly excessive streaking. You can still streak a ton.

But he said, 'And sorcs can bolt escape all over the place ' place might be a vague description, but it's still exaggerated.
And even if, people fail to understand that the Sorc is OOM after a few blinks which makes him basically free AP.

But that's impossible to understand for you.

The conversation was grated toward numbered of blinks not ehat occurs after. I was merely adding to the scope of the argument not broadening the scope. The point of BE is to not only use it strategically in battle, but also to leave a bad situation. When a sorc wants to leave a bad situation they can bolt escape 6, 7, 8 times or even more if specced for it. The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak. Sure a sorc may be out of juice after streaking that much, but they can still streak way more than needed to escape. In fact, 2 or 3 is more then enough in the majority of cases to do so. The nerf essentially gave a penalty to using it that much. That is to say that they will be out of magicka. On live they can steak 6,7,8 times or more and still have a sustained fight. That is what the nerf was geared at. Actually lowering a sorcs fighting capability after streaking so much. But that does not matter b/c if you have not gotten out of harms way in no more than 4 streaks then you are not streaking efficiently. Same goes for dodgeroll. I can dodgeroll upwards of 6 times until I actually notice a disadvantage in stamina management for fighting.

That's true and I don't even disagree.
You can blink around 7 times, if:

-Your Magicka is fully charged, which is not the case when a fight is already going for some time
- If your enemy is uncapable to charge you instantly, which maaany melees are capable of nowadays
- If your enemies don't focus on you> Don't follow you.

Because if they follow you, you're a free kill. Because your Magicka is gone and you are unable to fight back or to defend yourself. Bolt Escape spam is suicide if someone (and the majority of people will) runs after you. And 7 blinks don't create enough distance to make it hard to run after you

And no, this is no qq. I'm simply giving you some facts to show you, that Bolt Escape is not as strong as many people want to tell me here.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius.

Xeven, all of that is true and people will come to recognize, that Nightblade is the I-win class and that all other classes are nothing but NB toys, especially in IC. They will get nerfed, don't you worry. It might take a week or 2 or 3 maybe.
But they will do something to bring Nightblades in line with the inferior classes.

I already feel sorry for all non Vampire Templars and Dragonknights who can't use mistform to stay mobile. They'll be suffering the most at the beginning. I see why @DDuke suggested turning cloak into a camo instead of 100% invisibility. Cloak as it is right now, allows them to be dark puppetmasters.

Here is the thing. NB and sorcs are better for solo. Dk and Temps are better at group. Bottom line. I see no problem with that. Sure play as you want blah blah. That does not translate to play as you want and be the most efficient set up to pull it off. That siad, IC was geared toward small group pvp. Therefore making templars and dk's inherently better 8n IC when running in a group. If your running in a group, pulling aggro on trash to kill a solo player is a cake walk. Moreover, people can say all they want t NB being IC dream. But, magika Dk are back and back hard. People focus on nb because they weigh nb current effectiveness in live against the effectiveness of other classes in live. However, magika Dk will be the bread and butter in ic. Magika Dk sword and board is back with vengeance and even more powerful than other patches previously a use they have added proxy to theit bar. I'm telling you now that in a month we will be seeing nerf dk threads again and nb will be an afterthought

Dracane · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius.

Xeven, all of that is true and people will come to recognize, that Nightblade is the I-win class and that all other classes are nothing but NB toys, especially in IC. They will get nerfed, don't you worry. It might take a week or 2 or 3 maybe.
But they will do something to bring Nightblades in line with the inferior classes.

I already feel sorry for all non Vampire Templars and Dragonknights who can't use mistform to stay mobile. They'll be suffering the most at the beginning. I see why @DDuke suggested turning cloak into a camo instead of 100% invisibility. Cloak as it is right now, allows them to be dark puppetmasters.

Here is the thing. NB and sorcs are better for solo. Dk and Temps are better at group. Bottom line. I see no problem with that. Sure play as you want blah blah. That does not translate to play as you want and be the most efficient set up to pull it off. That siad, IC was geared toward small group pvp. Therefore making templars and dk's inherently better 8n IC when running in a group. If your running in a group, pulling aggro on trash to kill a solo player is a cake walk. Moreover, people can say all they want t NB being IC dream. But, magika Dk are back and back hard. People focus on nb because they weigh nb current effectiveness in live against the effectiveness of other classes in live. However, magika Dk will be the bread and butter in ic. Magika Dk sword and board is back with vengeance and even more powerful than other patches previously a use they have added proxy to theit bar. I'm telling you now that in a month we will be seeing nerf dk threads again and nb will be an afterthought

Hm I agree, Magicka DKs are pretty strong now. Stronger than in 1.6.

Xeniph · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius.

Xeven, all of that is true and people will come to recognize, that Nightblade is the I-win class and that all other classes are nothing but NB toys, especially in IC. They will get nerfed, don't you worry. It might take a week or 2 or 3 maybe.
But they will do something to bring Nightblades in line with the inferior classes.

I already feel sorry for all non Vampire Templars and Dragonknights who can't use mistform to stay mobile. They'll be suffering the most at the beginning. I see why @DDuke suggested turning cloak into a camo instead of 100% invisibility. Cloak as it is right now, allows them to be dark puppetmasters.

Here is the thing. NB and sorcs are better for solo. Dk and Temps are better at group. Bottom line. I see no problem with that. Sure play as you want blah blah. That does not translate to play as you want and be the most efficient set up to pull it off. That siad, IC was geared toward small group pvp. Therefore making templars and dk's inherently better 8n IC when running in a group. If your running in a group, pulling aggro on trash to kill a solo player is a cake walk. Moreover, people can say all they want t NB being IC dream. But, magika Dk are back and back hard. People focus on nb because they weigh nb current effectiveness in live against the effectiveness of other classes in live. However, magika Dk will be the bread and butter in ic. Magika Dk sword and board is back with vengeance and even more powerful than other patches previously a use they have added proxy to theit bar. I'm telling you now that in a month we will be seeing nerf dk threads again and nb will be an afterthought

Actually, with my exhaustive testing, thus far, I find the stam Templar to be the most effective class in IC. This is from testing both magicka and stamina on all 4 classes during the current pts patch. One caveat though, this is with the templates and no access to some of the popular gear combinations I will have once NA copies are back. So things may or may not change for me.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Xeniph wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius.

Xeven, all of that is true and people will come to recognize, that Nightblade is the I-win class and that all other classes are nothing but NB toys, especially in IC. They will get nerfed, don't you worry. It might take a week or 2 or 3 maybe.
But they will do something to bring Nightblades in line with the inferior classes.

I already feel sorry for all non Vampire Templars and Dragonknights who can't use mistform to stay mobile. They'll be suffering the most at the beginning. I see why @DDuke suggested turning cloak into a camo instead of 100% invisibility. Cloak as it is right now, allows them to be dark puppetmasters.

Here is the thing. NB and sorcs are better for solo. Dk and Temps are better at group. Bottom line. I see no problem with that. Sure play as you want blah blah. That does not translate to play as you want and be the most efficient set up to pull it off. That siad, IC was geared toward small group pvp. Therefore making templars and dk's inherently better 8n IC when running in a group. If your running in a group, pulling aggro on trash to kill a solo player is a cake walk. Moreover, people can say all they want t NB being IC dream. But, magika Dk are back and back hard. People focus on nb because they weigh nb current effectiveness in live against the effectiveness of other classes in live. However, magika Dk will be the bread and butter in ic. Magika Dk sword and board is back with vengeance and even more powerful than other patches previously a use they have added proxy to theit bar. I'm telling you now that in a month we will be seeing nerf dk threads again and nb will be an afterthought

Actually, with my exhaustive testing, thus far, I find the stam Templar to be the most effective class in IC. This is from testing both magicka and stamina on all 4 classes during the current pts patch. One caveat though, this is with the templates and no access to some of the popular gear combinations I will have once NA copies are back. So things may or may not change for me.

Yes stam templars are pretty strong. But the utility options and versatility of a dk gives them the edge imo. Stam templars are basically stuck with the same skills. Magika Dk can mix it up a bit more. But yes stam Temps hit real hard.

Xeniph · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

byrom101b16_ESO wrote: »

Sharee wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Nightblades, and Nightblades alone have the power to shed aggro at will

Cloak does not shed aggro. As soon as cloak expires, mobs you previously aggroed will get right back to chasing you.

That's less than half the story.

They have a reset range, so it's easy to lose them. They also don't aggro in the first place if cloak is up when you get within range.

Cloak is ezemode enough in the likes of Memorial District, but even more cheesy in open areas of IC, with short reset ranges and large open areas to move around in.

So yes - anyone with half a brain and a NB can shed aggro almost at will.

Moreover, any NB player with even a basic understanding of placement and tactics can shed player pursuit through groups of mobs... that's unique, and used over and over and over in IC.

Thanks for that post. Anyone can see after 15 minutes PvPing inside the IC Districts/Sewers that it's a Nightblades wet dream.

Defending yourself from Nightblades in the IC will be almost futile.

1) AOE is no longer a detection option because of mass aggro.
2) Running away is no longer an option because of mass aggro.
3) Fighting/Killing any decent NB will be almost impossible because they can hide behind an army of Daedra at will.
4) Aggroing other monsters while fighting Nightblades will be common because they will quickly learn to play peekaboo near a pack of mobs.
5) For 30 seconds out of every 45, you will be a Nigthblades play thing, or you can give up two skill slots and 5% magicka for a pisspoor detection radius.

Xeven, all of that is true and people will come to recognize, that Nightblade is the I-win class and that all other classes are nothing but NB toys, especially in IC. They will get nerfed, don't you worry. It might take a week or 2 or 3 maybe.
But they will do something to bring Nightblades in line with the inferior classes.

I already feel sorry for all non Vampire Templars and Dragonknights who can't use mistform to stay mobile. They'll be suffering the most at the beginning. I see why @DDuke suggested turning cloak into a camo instead of 100% invisibility. Cloak as it is right now, allows them to be dark puppetmasters.

Here is the thing. NB and sorcs are better for solo. Dk and Temps are better at group. Bottom line. I see no problem with that. Sure play as you want blah blah. That does not translate to play as you want and be the most efficient set up to pull it off. That siad, IC was geared toward small group pvp. Therefore making templars and dk's inherently better 8n IC when running in a group. If your running in a group, pulling aggro on trash to kill a solo player is a cake walk. Moreover, people can say all they want t NB being IC dream. But, magika Dk are back and back hard. People focus on nb because they weigh nb current effectiveness in live against the effectiveness of other classes in live. However, magika Dk will be the bread and butter in ic. Magika Dk sword and board is back with vengeance and even more powerful than other patches previously a use they have added proxy to theit bar. I'm telling you now that in a month we will be seeing nerf dk threads again and nb will be an afterthought

Actually, with my exhaustive testing, thus far, I find the stam Templar to be the most effective class in IC. This is from testing both magicka and stamina on all 4 classes during the current pts patch. One caveat though, this is with the templates and no access to some of the popular gear combinations I will have once NA copies are back. So things may or may not change for me.

Yes stam templars are pretty strong. But the utility options and versatility of a dk gives them the edge imo. Stam templars are basically stuck with the same skills. Magika Dk can mix it up a bit more. But yes stam Temps hit real hard.

It's not even the damage, it's like you say, the utility. Between cleanses, regen, buffs and the passive heals, played correctly I have yet to find any class that brings this much and certainly not in a stamina spec. Magicka DK does come the closest though. But again, I will continue my testing.

Xeven · August 2015

The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak.

That's incorrect. The penalty is there after the first. Also, a v16 with food and a full bar of magicka can streak 7 times when magicka spec'd. This means that it can NOT be used to "leave a bad situation". If the situation is bad, youre at half magicka optimistically, and you can now only streak 3 times. You will be decimated.

Bolt Escape is now bordering on not worth the skill slot.

Xeniph · August 2015

Xeven wrote: »

The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak.

That's incorrect. The penalty is there after the first. Also, from a full bar of magicka you can streak 7 times when magicka spec'd. This means that it can NOT be used to "leave a bad situation". If the situation is bad, youre at half magicka optimistically, and you can now only streak 3 times. You will be decimated.

Bolt Escape is bordering on not worth the skill slot.

This right here is a perfect example of tunnel vision. Every class, given the same criteria, would have the same challenge as described above. That's like saying, any ability is not worth slotting, because you were low on resources. The amount of resources one has does not determine an abilities effectiveness, it's the players use of said ability that does.

But you are right, there are a lot of bad sorcs out there that have no clue how to mange resources, let alone use BE to it's fullest advantage in any given situation. However that can be said of people playing all classes and specs.

Rune_Relic · August 2015

Davkin wrote: »

Draehl wrote: »

@Davkin
I agree with you, the skill makes us quite the one-trick-pony, but I won't support nerfing it until some of the other NB skills are increased in power/usability. All the nerf calls in this thread are clearly aimed at NB assassins (stam and mag both), however none of you pause to consider how it affects other NB builds that aren't OP and have to deal with several mediocre skills in our kit. You're just as blind as the assassins defending Shadow Cloak, or just don't care.

I am saying the permacloak and cloak escape should be nerfed, not necessary the ability itself. This can happen via higher ranged counter, a percentage cost for cloak or something like not beeing able to sprint while cloaked. I am plainly stating that the current option of beeing permacloaked or having an almost guranteed escape are drasticly imbalanced and have to go. If in this case all nb stay there without any defensive mechanism you have to get an alternative, be it heal or something else. Like in most cases there is no one simple solution, espacialy if its a rather complex system you have to account for, but not doing anything atm and leave it as is is not an option. Zenimax has to invest time and will into fixing this.
And if there is no nerf that targets this issues but keeps the rest of the class balanced than so it is. For the whole balance of the game one OP class is much worse then one UP class.

The main problem with that is if you nerf magicka builds to a reasonable level, you absolutely Nuke stamina builds to the point of making cloak useless.
For my build for instance cloak is a magicka dump that you can use now and learn as an oh crap moment or a opportunistic attack.
Thats before any nerfing at all.
I am sure that applies to sorcs bolt escape too.

This is the problem having defensive and offensive abilities running off the same stat.
Especially when you have stamina and magicka builds.
You have class defining skills...that cant actually be used depending on build.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Xeven wrote: »

The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak.

That's incorrect. The penalty is there after the first. Also, a v16 with food and a full bar of magicka can streak 7 times when magicka spec'd. This means that it can NOT be used to "leave a bad situation". If the situation is bad, youre at half magicka optimistically, and you can now only streak 3 times. You will be decimated.

Bolt Escape is now bordering on not worth the skill slot.

You misunderstand my point on the penalty. Currently on live you get the cost increase on the second streak. So, on pts the first two streaks are the same cost as you see on live. Thereby making the nerf penalty not kick in until the 3rd streak because of the stacking mechanic.

Also, to increase the amount of streaks it is not merely max magika you have. It heavily relies on cost reduction and magika regen. Sure I can stack max magika but the difference comes into play with the amount of regen you have really. A sorc with 2k regen is going to steak more than a player with 1200 regen and more magika.

Again, the previous scope of the conversation was amount of streaks. Add in a battle situation. You can still hit 3 streaks np when engaged in battle unless you are completely out of magika ofcourse and that is just bad management then. Anyway, you can easily hit 3 streaks. Your first two are the most crucial. If you don't effectively streak then ya you will be decimated. But the situation should not turn on what bad players do nor players that make mustakes. It should turn on a player who plays good, manages resources well, and has a working knowledge of the game and their class. A decent player can do this. But returning to what I was say8ng, you can easily streak those 3 times with the first two being the most meaningful and disengaging you from combat and the 3rd being the one that allows you to finish off your escape. And lets be honest for a minute. You don't really see the cost effecting magika management until after the 4th one at a min. So, you should be able to streak that 4th time even after fighting. Regardless, if by that 3rd or 4th time you were not able to escape, then you did something wrong. There is no need to streak across cyrodil to escape or disengage. It is all about being efficient.

Master_Kas · August 2015

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

Dracane · August 2015

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying

you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Dracane · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. The Sorc strenght got nerfed, while the Nightblades strenght got 'buffed' or rather emphazised.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. The Sorc strenght got nerfed, while the Nightblades strenght got 'buffed' or rather emphazised.

umm what about stamina nb. also, once again, cloak was not buffed but fixed and still is not even that on pts. again, sorcs are guranteed to BE whereas cloak is not.

that aside, lets look at your statement. you are talking about strength. yes, i agree BE and cloak are strengths. When i see that word though and think of class abilities i think about what it does for me in a fight. in a fight, there is no reason to spam either of them. they are used for repostioning, or stuns, something of that nature. in a fight, both work equally well. the nerf to BE plays no part in using it in a fight, only running from one. which, imo, is not pvp.

Dracane · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. The Sorc strenght got nerfed, while the Nightblades strenght got 'buffed' or rather emphazised.

umm what about stamina nb. also, once again, cloak was not buffed but fixed and still is not even that on pts. again, sorcs are guranteed to BE whereas cloak is not.

that aside, lets look at your statement. you are talking about strength. yes, i agree BE and cloak are strengths. When i see that word though and think of class abilities i think about what it does for me in a fight. in a fight, there is no reason to spam either of them. they are used for repostioning, or stuns, something of that nature. in a fight, both work equally well. the nerf to BE plays no part in using it in a fight, only running from one. which, imo, is not pvp.

Still people tend to spam it. Hands down, Cloak spam performs much better than bolt escape spam after the nerf.

And I wasn't talking about the fixes to cloak I also said 'buffs' so no real buffs you know ? The heavy nerf to detection potions is a direct + point for cloak, as detection potions are the only reliable and most popular way to counter cloak. It took a hard hit and this helps Nightblades a lot.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. The Sorc strenght got nerfed, while the Nightblades strenght got 'buffed' or rather emphazised.

umm what about stamina nb. also, once again, cloak was not buffed but fixed and still is not even that on pts. again, sorcs are guranteed to BE whereas cloak is not.

that aside, lets look at your statement. you are talking about strength. yes, i agree BE and cloak are strengths. When i see that word though and think of class abilities i think about what it does for me in a fight. in a fight, there is no reason to spam either of them. they are used for repostioning, or stuns, something of that nature. in a fight, both work equally well. the nerf to BE plays no part in using it in a fight, only running from one. which, imo, is not pvp.

Still people tend to spam it. Hands down, Cloak spam performs much better than bolt escape spam after the nerf.

And I wasn't talking about the fixes to cloak I also said 'buffs' so no real buffs you know ? The heavy nerf to detection potions is a direct + point for cloak, as detection potions are the only reliable and most popular way to counter cloak. It took a hard hit and this helps Nightblades a lot.

i would just have to say that in my experience on pts detect pots have worked just as well for me for the most part. I only rely on detect pots to get the nb initial location. once i have him targeted i use my skills together with the skills given to me to take them down. sure sometimes they get away and sometimes they dont. it ultimately comes down to player skill imo. if the nb player is better they get away. if i am better they die. simple as that. I never make it easy for them to escape, so if they do they earned it. likewise, when i run a nb a skilled player will still kill me. the only time it is "easy" for a nb to spam cloak is when the opposing player does not react and counter properly or they are out of range when I see them and never actually engaged me.

Dracane · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. The Sorc strenght got nerfed, while the Nightblades strenght got 'buffed' or rather emphazised.

umm what about stamina nb. also, once again, cloak was not buffed but fixed and still is not even that on pts. again, sorcs are guranteed to BE whereas cloak is not.

that aside, lets look at your statement. you are talking about strength. yes, i agree BE and cloak are strengths. When i see that word though and think of class abilities i think about what it does for me in a fight. in a fight, there is no reason to spam either of them. they are used for repostioning, or stuns, something of that nature. in a fight, both work equally well. the nerf to BE plays no part in using it in a fight, only running from one. which, imo, is not pvp.

Still people tend to spam it. Hands down, Cloak spam performs much better than bolt escape spam after the nerf.

And I wasn't talking about the fixes to cloak I also said 'buffs' so no real buffs you know ? The heavy nerf to detection potions is a direct + point for cloak, as detection potions are the only reliable and most popular way to counter cloak. It took a hard hit and this helps Nightblades a lot.

i would just have to say that in my experience on pts detect pots have worked just as well for me for the most part. I only rely on detect pots to get the nb initial location. once i have him targeted i use my skills together with the skills given to me to take them down. sure sometimes they get away and sometimes they dont. it ultimately comes down to player skill imo. if the nb player is better they get away. if i am better they die. simple as that. I never make it easy for them to escape, so if they do they earned it. likewise, when i run a nb a skilled player will still kill me. the only time it is "easy" for a nb to spam cloak is when the opposing player does not react and counter properly or they are out of range when I see them and never actually engaged me.

Come on

don't play this game with me. You're a Nightblade yourself and you're protecting your own class and I don't blame you for that.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Master_Kas wrote: »

Brace yourselfs nightblades. Everyone crying about cloak will screw it up for all nightblades.

Wether you're a magicka nb permacloaking or a stamblade cloaking occasionally.

The whine has started "wää why can they do that and I can not?"

Let's dumb down the game make every class identical. That way noone can cry about unbalanced stuff.

But oh wait, they will still because so many people just suck and blame it on "waaa he has OP skill that's why he wins"

People hardly played on PTS outside imperial city, noone knows what the meta will be there yet.

What's most funny is all who play's sorc and I've never seen touched a nightblade are here writing about how its OP.

Nightblades are by far the easiest class for me to kill on my sorc, got plenty of vids where I obliterate most nightblades (except the good ones) but the good ones will still kick your ass even if you "nerf op cloak" which can be countered by skills, pots.

/rant over

But you're nothing better than those that you accuse of crying you always pretend that Nightblade is the weakest class and Sorcerer the strongest.

imo they are both equals in pvp

Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. The Sorc strenght got nerfed, while the Nightblades strenght got 'buffed' or rather emphazised.

umm what about stamina nb. also, once again, cloak was not buffed but fixed and still is not even that on pts. again, sorcs are guranteed to BE whereas cloak is not.

that aside, lets look at your statement. you are talking about strength. yes, i agree BE and cloak are strengths. When i see that word though and think of class abilities i think about what it does for me in a fight. in a fight, there is no reason to spam either of them. they are used for repostioning, or stuns, something of that nature. in a fight, both work equally well. the nerf to BE plays no part in using it in a fight, only running from one. which, imo, is not pvp.

Still people tend to spam it. Hands down, Cloak spam performs much better than bolt escape spam after the nerf.

And I wasn't talking about the fixes to cloak I also said 'buffs' so no real buffs you know ? The heavy nerf to detection potions is a direct + point for cloak, as detection potions are the only reliable and most popular way to counter cloak. It took a hard hit and this helps Nightblades a lot.

i would just have to say that in my experience on pts detect pots have worked just as well for me for the most part. I only rely on detect pots to get the nb initial location. once i have him targeted i use my skills together with the skills given to me to take them down. sure sometimes they get away and sometimes they dont. it ultimately comes down to player skill imo. if the nb player is better they get away. if i am better they die. simple as that. I never make it easy for them to escape, so if they do they earned it. likewise, when i run a nb a skilled player will still kill me. the only time it is "easy" for a nb to spam cloak is when the opposing player does not react and counter properly or they are out of range when I see them and never actually engaged me.

Come on don't play this game with me. You're a Nightblade yourself and you're protecting your own class and I don't blame you for that.

I have a nb in fact 2. I also have 6 other characters. many people play all classes. to simply lump all players into one class is ignorant. by that logic anyone who plays a nb would not be able to give their opinon. they would simply be labled as a a person who plays nb and therefore defending them. this is a false logic that is too wide spread on these forums. the largest population of players to this game have, if not all slots filled, then multiple. the only way this argument has a leg to stand on is if all of my characters were NB. then, maybe, you can use that. I simply stated my experience both in playing other classes v. nb and being a nb facing other classes. are your experiences different, sure. that does not mean mine are invalid. also, given the hours I have in this game, i would say that i have a plethra of expereince to draw from. sure it took some time to figure out how to adjust, but i did and fighting a nb is liking fighting anyone else. (in a general sense anyway)

Xeven · August 2015

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak.

That's incorrect. The penalty is there after the first. Also, a v16 with food and a full bar of magicka can streak 7 times when magicka spec'd. This means that it can NOT be used to "leave a bad situation". If the situation is bad, youre at half magicka optimistically, and you can now only streak 3 times. You will be decimated.

Bolt Escape is now bordering on not worth the skill slot.

You misunderstand my point on the penalty. Currently on live you get the cost increase on the second streak. So, on pts the first two streaks are the same cost as you see on live. Thereby making the nerf penalty not kick in until the 3rd streak because of the stacking mechanic.

Also, to increase the amount of streaks it is not merely max magika you have. It heavily relies on cost reduction and magika regen. Sure I can stack max magika but the difference comes into play with the amount of regen you have really. A sorc with 2k regen is going to steak more than a player with 1200 regen and more magika.

Again, the previous scope of the conversation was amount of streaks. Add in a battle situation. You can still hit 3 streaks np when engaged in battle unless you are completely out of magika ofcourse and that is just bad management then. Anyway, you can easily hit 3 streaks. Your first two are the most crucial. If you don't effectively streak then ya you will be decimated. But the situation should not turn on what bad players do nor players that make mustakes. It should turn on a player who plays good, manages resources well, and has a working knowledge of the game and their class. A decent player can do this. But returning to what I was say8ng, you can easily streak those 3 times with the first two being the most meaningful and disengaging you from combat and the 3rd being the one that allows you to finish off your escape. And lets be honest for a minute. You don't really see the cost effecting magika management until after the 4th one at a min. So, you should be able to streak that 4th time even after fighting. Regardless, if by that 3rd or 4th time you were not able to escape, then you did something wrong. There is no need to streak across cyrodil to escape or disengage. It is all about being efficient.

I hear you, but I still have to correct you. The penalty is now exponential. This means that the cost of the 8th and 9th streak is so high, any regen that you add to squeeze them out will be relatively insignificant. You cannot build for bolt escape anymore. If you do youre trading everything for just one more streak.

bowmanz607 · August 2015

Xeven wrote: »

bowmanz607 wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

The penalty does not even kick in until the 3 streak.

That's incorrect. The penalty is there after the first. Also, a v16 with food and a full bar of magicka can streak 7 times when magicka spec'd. This means that it can NOT be used to "leave a bad situation". If the situation is bad, youre at half magicka optimistically, and you can now only streak 3 times. You will be decimated.

Bolt Escape is now bordering on not worth the skill slot.

You misunderstand my point on the penalty. Currently on live you get the cost increase on the second streak. So, on pts the first two streaks are the same cost as you see on live. Thereby making the nerf penalty not kick in until the 3rd streak because of the stacking mechanic.

Also, to increase the amount of streaks it is not merely max magika you have. It heavily relies on cost reduction and magika regen. Sure I can stack max magika but the difference comes into play with the amount of regen you have really. A sorc with 2k regen is going to steak more than a player with 1200 regen and more magika.

Again, the previous scope of the conversation was amount of streaks. Add in a battle situation. You can still hit 3 streaks np when engaged in battle unless you are completely out of magika ofcourse and that is just bad management then. Anyway, you can easily hit 3 streaks. Your first two are the most crucial. If you don't effectively streak then ya you will be decimated. But the situation should not turn on what bad players do nor players that make mustakes. It should turn on a player who plays good, manages resources well, and has a working knowledge of the game and their class. A decent player can do this. But returning to what I was say8ng, you can easily streak those 3 times with the first two being the most meaningful and disengaging you from combat and the 3rd being the one that allows you to finish off your escape. And lets be honest for a minute. You don't really see the cost effecting magika management until after the 4th one at a min. So, you should be able to streak that 4th time even after fighting. Regardless, if by that 3rd or 4th time you were not able to escape, then you did something wrong. There is no need to streak across cyrodil to escape or disengage. It is all about being efficient.

I hear you, but I still have to correct you. The penalty is now exponential. This means that the cost of the 8th and 9th streak is so high, any regen that you add to squeeze them out will be relatively insignificant. You cannot build for bolt escape anymore. If you do youre trading everything for just one more streak.

i dont necessarily disagree with that. my point is more along the lines of if you have streaked 6, 7, or 8 times and you are still not out of harms way, then you did something wrong. unless of course someone was gap closing you the whole time. that said, gap closers are the counter and everything should have counters.

Xael · August 2015

Threads like these and the authors of a lot of these posts are a cancer to this game.

There is so much false information in this thread alone I question whether any of you actually PvP or just simply parrot the conjecture you read in other threads.

Also comparing Sorcerers to Nightblades is pointless. They are not the same class and all 4 classes are meant to be distinct not carbon copies of each other. So stop this nonsense rhetoric, it's dumb and tiresome. If some of you (you know who you are) actually PvPed half the time you took stinking up the forums, you wouldn't be spouting all this garbage.

pmn100b16_ESO · August 2015

All these posts comparing Sorceror Bolt Escape to Nightblade Cloak, and thus cloak needs same nerf. Does that mean Nightblades get a big spammable class shield to fall back on too?