Feedback: Shieldbreaker 5p-set - it´s OP and should not go live.

Soulac · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

Looks like the SHIELD BREAKER set is working as intended.

How would you like a DODGE BREAKER, CLOAK BREAKER or BLOCK BREAKER set (I know, there is a bug that lets the shield breaker ignore blocks anyway at the moment)

Guess many people would complain and call these sets OP. But as long as you're not affected yourself, it's easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right ?

Undaunted Unweaver together with Heavy Lightning / Resto Attacks.
Undodgeable, strong heavy Attack which isn´t interruptable.
In case you don´t know, the Set increases your heavy Attack damage by 1k per tick.
In total its more than the new shield breaker set, why are you not running it?

Why sets for cloak and block if both already got hard counters.
Cloak: any AoE, Potions
Block: unblockable stun (no stamina recovery while blocking)
Dodgde: said set and penalty on dodge rolling

What about we shut down your recovery while your shields are up? Or we put in stuns which removes your shields? Or AoE which ignore shields?
Guess many people would complain and call these skills OP. But as long as you´re not affected yourself, it´s easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right?

See what I did there?

Chrlynsch · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

It is unresistable damage. Goes straight to the healthbar effective against shield stackers.

Truth of the matter sorcs have been running around with unbeatable scissors for a while now, good to see @ZOS bring a rock into the mix to add some danger to their bubble boy lives.

Tankqull · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

Looks like the SHIELD BREAKER set is working as intended.

How would you like a DODGE BREAKER, CLOAK BREAKER or BLOCK BREAKER set (I know, there is a bug that lets the shield breaker ignore blocks anyway at the moment)

Guess many people would complain and call these sets OP. But as long as you're not affected yourself, it's easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right ?

its irresistable dmg - wich ignores blocking and reflects (if applied by a range attack) by default no bug involved.

cschwingeb14_ESO · August 2015

Sallington wrote: »

]
You could throw on a few pieces of heavy armor or use some pieces of a more defensive set. Invest more points in HP even.

No, you can't. In 1.6 this will not help, and in 2.1 it won't help either. You will just die faster due to having smaller shields.

Healing, armor-based damage mitigation, Max health and blocking all have a synergy that damage shield do not participate in.

Ie, if you double your hps healing and double your mitigation, you get 4x survivability.

As for shield breaker, i'd much rather this mechanic reflect the # of shields that the target has on. Ie, either deal 1k unmitigated damage to the target per damage shield they have active. Or deal x bonus damage (with all attacks) per shield active on target.

The problem is not any single shield, because if it were, that one shield could be nerfed. It's with the use of several shields at once

Derra · August 2015

Xeniph wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

lol, I love that there are countless suggestions to make this set pointless, my fav so far was the 4 second cool down one, because it comes even worse the it was prebuffed.

I think Sorcs should sit through a patch with this set so they ger to see what patched in skill looks like on the other side.

So do you have a suggestion to make the set vaible without breaking healing for non templars completely or...?

Just leave set as it is, so people will realise that this is Templar time, and will mass reroll into templars.
On a serious note, it not possible to balance this set without balancing damage shields mechanic.

Why do you thing for example letting the set do 3000 dmg to the actual shields a person has would not be a better solution than it´s current implementation?

Because shields are refreshable. So it wouldn't change anything from what's live, except people would have to refresh their shields a bit more often.

And thats exactly the point? I mean are hp via heals not "refreshable"? Have you actually tried to kill someone spamming breath of life? It´s about how much dmg you can do vs how much dmg does a shield absorb. You don´t want shields to be vaible selfdefense at all.
Give magica sorcerers and nightblades classheals that are equal to the mechanics templars and DKs have access too then!

Derra · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Soulac · August 2015

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

Derra · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

Honestly i don´t think the current dmgvalue is fair at all. Currently you have to dedicate 4 slots to defense when using shields. You can add 3 skills ontop of that just to combat that set. I don´t think thats appropriate.

Erondil · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

Derra · August 2015

You can still add purge to the mix for stamina classes too. You have to slot it to combat healing debuffs. Still it´s 4 slots vs 6 to 7.

Mr_Nobody · August 2015

Looks like a templar trying to outheal a stamina NBs damage on 1.6 and eventually dieing after running out of stamina.

Anyone else?

ewhite106b16_ESO · August 2015

Shield breaker set needs to stay as is - I'm so bloody sick of light armor shield stackers having the most effective defenses by a long shot that only requires spamming multiple shield skills, especially considering the dodge/block nerf in Imp City patch. Only way that shieldbreaker should be changed is if shield stacking is removed altogether (which still needs to happen, it's a nonsensical mechanic from both the gameplay and balance standpoints).

I also think people are overestimating how many players are going to be using shield breaker set, it means losing out on other bonuses like has been mentioned already. Far as player skill goes....getting a huge amount of magicka/magic regen and spamming shields requires no real skill, why should the counter be overly complicated?

I probably won't use igneous shield after the patch, this is NOT due to shield breaker but rather the fact the strength of igneous shield as an individual power has been nerfed so badly in PVP. IMO shield breaker is a step in the right direction - but it's a bandaid for fixing the real problem which is shield stacking.

hellkrasher · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

Looks like the SHIELD BREAKER set is working as intended.

Why sets for cloak and block if both already got hard counters.
Cloak: any AoE, Potions

-Sry for my bad English.-

Men im so tired of reading this poor excuses from NB. AoE to counter stealth? Thats almost funny. 90% of the NB that use cloak have high speed bonuses that makes impossible that you hit them with aoe when they use cloak. Ofc there are some targeted aoe skills that you can throw like blazing spears, but for example, as a DK, its almost impossible to catch someone with talons when they use cloak. And yes, im talking about average/good players, not newbies. In a sec they are 20m from you, talons cant even rasp them.

So no, against decent players, AoE is not a great counter, even targeted aoe most of the time is a waste of magicka.

Does AoE takes players out of stealth? Yes. In theory, AoE counter Cloak? Yes. Is AoE a great counter to cloak? No!.
Speed bonuses when stealth are so common that its almost a joke to think that are a good counter for it. Also, remember that most clases dont have targeted AoEs, and that in most cases, they are much more expensive that single target skills which means that you waste a ton of resources throwing them blindly like a crazy person.

Im not complaining and not calling for a nerf, i dont care, but i do think that you ppl should stop using AoEs as a way to defend cloak, its a joke.

Dracane · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

Looks like the SHIELD BREAKER set is working as intended.

How would you like a DODGE BREAKER, CLOAK BREAKER or BLOCK BREAKER set (I know, there is a bug that lets the shield breaker ignore blocks anyway at the moment)

Guess many people would complain and call these sets OP. But as long as you're not affected yourself, it's easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right ?

Undaunted Unweaver together with Heavy Lightning / Resto Attacks.
Undodgeable, strong heavy Attack which isn´t interruptable.
In case you don´t know, the Set increases your heavy Attack damage by 1k per tick.
In total its more than the new shield breaker set, why are you not running it?

Why sets for cloak and block if both already got hard counters.
Cloak: any AoE, Potions
Block: unblockable stun (no stamina recovery while blocking)
Dodgde: said set and penalty on dodge rolling

What about we shut down your recovery while your shields are up? Or we put in stuns which removes your shields? Or AoE which ignore shields?
Guess many people would complain and call these skills OP. But as long as you´re not affected yourself, it´s easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right?

See what I did there?

Good jokes. Potions.... Are you talking about 10 second detection potions ? That's not a counter anymore, it's weakening myself to make it even easier for the Nightblade.

Undaunted Weaver might become a bit more attractive with the changes to lightning staff and restoration staff. But the way it works is silly. All the traits are trash for Mages and the requirement is not possible to maintain for me.
I would make it maintainable, but I have to sacrifise a lot of damage and magical sustain. So I could as well do heavy attacks without this set.

Darnathian · August 2015

Derra wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

lol, I love that there are countless suggestions to make this set pointless, my fav so far was the 4 second cool down one, because it comes even worse the it was prebuffed.

I think Sorcs should sit through a patch with this set so they ger to see what patched in skill looks like on the other side.

So do you have a suggestion to make the set vaible without breaking healing for non templars completely or...?

Just leave set as it is, so people will realise that this is Templar time, and will mass reroll into templars.
On a serious note, it not possible to balance this set without balancing damage shields mechanic.

Why do you thing for example letting the set do 3000 dmg to the actual shields a person has would not be a better solution than it´s current implementation?

Because shields are refreshable. So it wouldn't change anything from what's live, except people would have to refresh their shields a bit more often.

And thats exactly the point? I mean are hp via heals not "refreshable"? Have you actually tried to kill someone spamming breath of life? It´s about how much dmg you can do vs how much dmg does a shield absorb. You don´t want shields to be vaible selfdefense at all.
Give magica sorcerers and nightblades classheals that are equal to the mechanics templars and DKs have access too then!

Then give us an escape. It's not that easy.

Dracane · August 2015

Darnathian wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Xeniph wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Xsorus wrote: »

lol, I love that there are countless suggestions to make this set pointless, my fav so far was the 4 second cool down one, because it comes even worse the it was prebuffed.

I think Sorcs should sit through a patch with this set so they ger to see what patched in skill looks like on the other side.

So do you have a suggestion to make the set vaible without breaking healing for non templars completely or...?

Just leave set as it is, so people will realise that this is Templar time, and will mass reroll into templars.
On a serious note, it not possible to balance this set without balancing damage shields mechanic.

Why do you thing for example letting the set do 3000 dmg to the actual shields a person has would not be a better solution than it´s current implementation?

Because shields are refreshable. So it wouldn't change anything from what's live, except people would have to refresh their shields a bit more often.

And thats exactly the point? I mean are hp via heals not "refreshable"? Have you actually tried to kill someone spamming breath of life? It´s about how much dmg you can do vs how much dmg does a shield absorb. You don´t want shields to be vaible selfdefense at all.
Give magica sorcerers and nightblades classheals that are equal to the mechanics templars and DKs have access too then!

Then give us an escape. It's not that easy.

I also don't agree, that Sorcerers should have a strong self heal, neither should Nightblades have one.
Sorcerers should have a strong class shield and Nightblades will turn out unkillable anyway, as soon as people find out, how OP cloak will be with this comming update and that there is an unavoidable escape combo with Cloak. Let's wait, might not happen during pts, but as soon as it goes live.

ToRelax · August 2015

.

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

Looks like the SHIELD BREAKER set is working as intended.

How would you like a DODGE BREAKER, CLOAK BREAKER or BLOCK BREAKER set (I know, there is a bug that lets the shield breaker ignore blocks anyway at the moment)

Guess many people would complain and call these sets OP. But as long as you're not affected yourself, it's easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right ?

Undaunted Unweaver together with Heavy Lightning / Resto Attacks.
Undodgeable, strong heavy Attack which isn´t interruptable.
In case you don´t know, the Set increases your heavy Attack damage by 1k per tick.
In total its more than the new shield breaker set, why are you not running it?

Why sets for cloak and block if both already got hard counters.
Cloak: any AoE, Potions
Block: unblockable stun (no stamina recovery while blocking)
Dodgde: said set and penalty on dodge rolling

What about we shut down your recovery while your shields are up? Or we put in stuns which removes your shields? Or AoE which ignore shields?
Guess many people would complain and call these skills OP. But as long as you´re not affected yourself, it´s easy to make fun of others and say things are fine and should remain OP, right?

See what I did there?

Good jokes. Potions.... Are you talking about 10 second detection potions ? That's not a counter anymore, it's weakening myself to make it even easier for the Nightblade.

Undaunted Weaver might become a bit more attractive with the changes to lightning staff and restoration staff. But the way it works is silly. All the traits are trash for Mages and the requirement is not possible to maintain for me.
I would make it maintainable, but I have to sacrifise a lot of damage and magical sustain. So I could as well do heavy attacks without this set.

If this set was as strong as shieldbreaker, I would not hesitate to use it. I still have a set in my bank from 1.5 (when it was useful because resource management mattered so much more).
But what build is unable to fight that set? Everyone can Cloak, heal or shield through it (or a combination of them).
What abilities are harmful to use against this set, disabling a role or playstyle?

TheBonesXXX · August 2015

You know what I'm going to tell my guildies to do when we come across the one or two guys in the crowd being bubble busters?

Kill that MF'er first.

/end

Soulac · August 2015

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

bowmanz607 · August 2015

TheBonesXXX wrote: »

You know what I'm going to tell my guildies to do when we come across the one or two guys in the crowd being bubble busters?

Kill that MF'er first.

/end

LMAO!!! THIS!

just like on live right now when you tell them to take out the temp spamming jesus beam.

Dracane · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

I agree that there needs to be a counter and that this set should be worth using.

But you don't need to attempt to taunt me with useless sets to justify your opinion

bad cat ! BAD !

EDIT: BAD!

Soulac · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

I agree that there needs to be a counter and that this set should be worth using.

But you don't need to attempt to taunt me with useless sets to justify your opinion bad cat ! BAD !

taunt with what set? Undaunted Unweaver.. Yes the first bonus are total crap as magicka build, but the fifth bonus counters dodge.. :P

Dracane · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

I agree that there needs to be a counter and that this set should be worth using.

But you don't need to attempt to taunt me with useless sets to justify your opinion bad cat ! BAD !

taunt with what set? Undaunted Unweaver.. Yes the first bonus are total crap as magicka build, but the fifth bonus counters dodge.. :P

But I will loose over 6000 Magicka when I choose to use it, which is around 600 Spell damage. So a big sacrifise, that weakens me overall, for liddle reward (if at all)

Soulac · August 2015

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

I agree that there needs to be a counter and that this set should be worth using.

But you don't need to attempt to taunt me with useless sets to justify your opinion bad cat ! BAD !

taunt with what set? Undaunted Unweaver.. Yes the first bonus are total crap as magicka build, but the fifth bonus counters dodge.. :P

But I will loose over 6000 Magicka when I choose to use it, which is around 600 Spell damage. So a big sacrifise, that weakens me overall, for liddle reward (if at all)

Running Shieldbreaker would also cost me a lot since you only get the armor pieces, but nvm :P

Dracane · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

I agree that there needs to be a counter and that this set should be worth using.

But you don't need to attempt to taunt me with useless sets to justify your opinion bad cat ! BAD !

taunt with what set? Undaunted Unweaver.. Yes the first bonus are total crap as magicka build, but the fifth bonus counters dodge.. :P

But I will loose over 6000 Magicka when I choose to use it, which is around 600 Spell damage. So a big sacrifise, that weakens me overall, for liddle reward (if at all)

Running Shieldbreaker would also cost me a lot since you only get the armor pieces, but nvm :P

No. Shieldbreaker offers weapon damage, stamina recovery and max stamina. All 3 very valueable sets for a stamina DD. You have no big trade off when using this set. You have excellent 2-4 piece traits and can wreck shield users. This set is almost too good to not take it.

ToRelax · August 2015

Soulac wrote: »

Dracane wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Erondil wrote: »

Soulac wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

Alcast wrote: »

If you block the set, it shouldnt do OP dmg right? Or does it go trhough block?

I think the dmg is fine, but it has to be blockable lol.

Iya made a video. It completely ignores block. Atleast you can troll deftanks of your own faction by spamming healing ward on them.

Well it´s unresistable dmg, so it shouldn´t get mitigated by block.
If your Light Attacks ignore Harness or Bone Shield you shouldn´t get the Bonus though.
But 2k is quite fair considering that all non shield users also need to rely on other stuff once their standard defense mechanic gets countered.

But when you face undodgeable attacks, you can mitigate them with block and your spell resist/armour, so you can reduce almost 70% of the damages... you also got very solid hots and a strong self heal from time to time with rally. This only requires 2 slots when a sorc has to have healing springs, rapid regeneration and purge on his bar just to counter the shiedlbreaker set. Add to that that you're kinda forced to run healing ward, hardened ward and bolt escape (not even counting harness eventhough its a must). only 4 slots left for buffs, ccs and attacks. To compare with a stamblade, on your own build I can see 3 skills youre forced to run (vigor rally and cloak) which leave you with 7 slot for whatever you want. But I guess yeah, balanced.

To be honest I didn´t think of the set making non templar healers in group pointless if an enemy is running this set.

Anyway, there needs to be a counter and whatever it is - it needs to be effective.
Shield breaker might be too strong, we will see, but i can´t take a video about two player standing in front of each other serious.. sorry. You need to slot Heals to counter it as i need to slot other abilities to counter the counters (lol) of my defense abilities.
Well.. what isn´t *** up in this game anyway..

I agree that there needs to be a counter and that this set should be worth using.

But you don't need to attempt to taunt me with useless sets to justify your opinion bad cat ! BAD !

taunt with what set? Undaunted Unweaver.. Yes the first bonus are total crap as magicka build, but the fifth bonus counters dodge.. :P

That may be so, but it does neither counter heal nor cloak or shields.
Stamina DKs, Templars and NBs can all defend against that, shieldbreaker counters the magicka Sorcs and NBs burst heal and the Sorcs main defensive ability (or more...).

Domander · August 2015

Tankqull wrote: »

Derra wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

I found a good counter to this. Make a stam sorc with shield breaker set and don't use shields and spam overload on everyone while rolling everywhere.

I guess one way to make stam sorcs viable is it nerf the alternative (magicka shield stackers).

Well that´s what i will be doing when this set goes live in the current way. I won´t be able to play as magica grp support so i have to play my class as stam dps...

can be nice too...
300% + stealth modifier of dmg on focused aim thx to the new thundering presence^^

What?

Alcast · August 2015

well i guess weighted trait got its use finally then

Dracane · August 2015

Alcast wrote: »

well i guess weighted trait got its use finally then

Oh yes O.o

Sublime · August 2015

The Shieldbreaker set is OP and here's why:

First let's go through some HPS numbers of by char:

Combat Prayer: 2355 (3612)
Healing Springs: 3724 (5696)
Rapid Regeneration: 643 (983)
Healing Ward (Initial Heal): 1203 (1840)
Dark Deal: 1520 (doesn't crit)

Now since some abilities have extended durations it makes sense to look a possible combinations:

First off, Combat Prayer, Healing Ward, Dark Deal and Illustrous Healing are all very similar types of heals, meaning Dark Deal, Healing Ward and Combat Prayer get outclassed by Illustrous Healing, due to it's stacking mechanic.

Rapid Regeneration can be cast at the very beginning of the fight adding a 643 (983) HPS to the mix. Combining this with the stackable Illustrous Healing yields a total HPS of 4367 (6679). Deducting the constant DPS of the Shieldbreaker set yields a final HPS of 2217 (4529).

This means a player at 50% HP and a hit point pool of 20k would need about 10k/2911=3.5 seconds to get back to 100% (considering 30% spell crit).

During that time the enemy has the freedom to do whatever he/she wants. In addition to that, it has to be considered that this is neither a light/heavy attack nor a skill, meaning it comes along at the expense of a 5pc set bonus (with rather amazing 2-4pc boni) that doesn't hurt the caster's rotation at all.

Assuming I don't heal myself at all means I'd be dead within 20k/2150=9.3 seconds only considering the procs. Combining this with the fact that I need 7s to get from 0% HP to 100% means that if I fight a player using this set I have to spend 7.5 (0.5s for the Rapid Regeneration every 20s) out of 9.5s using Illustrous Healing and Rapid Regeneration if I at least want to survive. And this only includes the set bonus proc.

From this the following fact is rather easy to conclude:
A sorcerer getting attacked by three player using the Shieldbreaker set has, mathematically seen (2217-4300=-1389), no chance of surviving. Even if only the set bonus proc is taking into consideration.

Apart from that are other major problems with this set:

Since the damage of the proc deals the same damage no matter how high the shield is, it punishes small shields more than big ones. Meaning that Harness Magicka or Hardened Ward might still be used by sorcerers, since they benefit the most from them, lesser shields such as Igneous Shield, Shielded Assault or Blazing Shield will actually be rather a death sentence than a defensive ability. Ergo, while this set certainly hurts the sorcerer it also makes several other skills completely redundant up to a point where they could basically be removed from the game without the PvP community realizing that they are gone.
It is extremely unintuitive, i.e. I only realize that I got attacked by someone using this set once I see my death recap. Yes I will probably realize it during the fight once I see my HP dropping even though I got my shield up. The real problem will be console players, since they cannot see their HP due to the lack of addons. On top of that most won't even know what the Shieldbreaker set is and getting repeatably trashed by something you don't know feels extremely frustrating.

All those thoughts aside, I do think shields as they currently are do need a counter, and this set is also a decent approach to it, but I would suggest to following tweaks:

Let the set attack the shield directly, this makes it less frustrating for console players, since they see their shield going down.
(Given the first bullet point) Change the flat damage of 2150 to a percentage of the shield. I'd suggest 33% to start with, since it's not a skill but shouldn't be completely useless either. This would mean 33% of the total shield, meaning a sorc with a 12k Hardened Ward and a 10k Harness Magicka would take 7.25k damage distributed among both shields. On the next application when the shields are now 7.92k and 6.6k respectively 2.6k and 2.1k damage, and so on and so forth. As a nice side effect this would also become a strong set against Barrier stacking groups since they would take percent shield damage as well.

-My 2c.