MornaBaine wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Asrien wrote: »

Unless they add some form of massive drawback, like anti-vamp weapons or something (more than just a flame enchant tho). I imagine they'd also have to pimp the werewolf out more if they did this so it's probably not super likely.

The problem is two-fold.

You can't take them out. Vampires and Werewolves are a part of the game, and being able to play as them has evolved from a novel distraction to a major series feature.

You need to make them more powerful than normal players, but that needs to be balanced against dealing with normal players without also making the entire experience unpleasant.

That's the problem with a lot of the solutions people push, especially people who want to have a game without Werewolves or Vampires as playable characters. They're far too punitive.

Vampire and Werewolves need to be a legitimate alternate playstyle, that is actually available to players who want access to that, without also being absurdly powerful to the point that players who don't want to engage in that playstyle are forced to, in order to be competitive.

Begging for the ability to one shot any vamp you meet is punitive. Begging for the lord transform would make vampires mandatory... or require completely devaluing that power into a joke. Without a lot of middle ground.

I could see the vampire Lord form as an alternate Ult...and have it act just like the werewolf Ult essentially AND have it cost a HUGE amount of skill points so that you'd actually have to CHOOSE to have it over other skills. Then it wouldn't be OP or "free."

I wouldn't have any problem with that from a gameplay perspective, but from a lore perspective it wouldn't work well. The vampire lord form is associated with an entirely different strain of vampirism than the strain that players have in ESO, so it wouldn't make a lot of sense to have it as an alternate ultimate.

Having said that, it would be interesting if there was a way to choose a different vampiric bloodline (maybe through a different quest than the current vampire quest), and that one had different passives and abilities, with the vampire lord as the ultimate.

Slightly off topic but still to do with vampires. One thing I would like in ESO is a custom title if you take the time to actually get bitten by a Bloodfiend, rather than another player. A "Pureblood" or something like that.

I like Xvorg's idea about the MW clans too.

Rosveen wrote: »

TheTwistedRune wrote: »

Slightly off topic but still to do with vampires. One thing I would like in ESO is a custom title if you take the time to actually get bitten by a Bloodfiend, rather than another player. A "Pureblood" or something like that.

I like Xvorg's idea about the MW clans too.

A pureblooded vampire is one who received vampirism directly from Molag Bal - or another pureblood, but the bloodline thins with each generation, so even the second isn't completely pure. In any case, it doesn't matter in ESO because regardless of who bites you, you undergo the Rite of the Scion, so we're all progeny of Lamae.

Fair enough. I still think there should be some kind of title/achievement if you are bitten by a bloodfiend though.

UrQuan wrote: »

MornaBaine wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Asrien wrote: »

Unless they add some form of massive drawback, like anti-vamp weapons or something (more than just a flame enchant tho). I imagine they'd also have to pimp the werewolf out more if they did this so it's probably not super likely.

The problem is two-fold.

You can't take them out. Vampires and Werewolves are a part of the game, and being able to play as them has evolved from a novel distraction to a major series feature.

You need to make them more powerful than normal players, but that needs to be balanced against dealing with normal players without also making the entire experience unpleasant.

That's the problem with a lot of the solutions people push, especially people who want to have a game without Werewolves or Vampires as playable characters. They're far too punitive.

Vampire and Werewolves need to be a legitimate alternate playstyle, that is actually available to players who want access to that, without also being absurdly powerful to the point that players who don't want to engage in that playstyle are forced to, in order to be competitive.

Begging for the ability to one shot any vamp you meet is punitive. Begging for the lord transform would make vampires mandatory... or require completely devaluing that power into a joke. Without a lot of middle ground.

I could see the vampire Lord form as an alternate Ult...and have it act just like the werewolf Ult essentially AND have it cost a HUGE amount of skill points so that you'd actually have to CHOOSE to have it over other skills. Then it wouldn't be OP or "free."

I wouldn't have any problem with that from a gameplay perspective, but from a lore perspective it wouldn't work well. The vampire lord form is associated with an entirely different strain of vampirism than the strain that players have in ESO, so it wouldn't make a lot of sense to have it as an alternate ultimate.

Having said that, it would be interesting if there was a way to choose a different vampiric bloodline (maybe through a different quest than the current vampire quest), and that one had different passives and abilities, with the vampire lord as the ultimate.

I agree with you here, believe me. But I don't see ZOS EVER going to the trouble to do something that cool. I'd die of shock if we ever started seeing quests FOR vampires. Or Werewolves. What MIGHT be possible though is what I have suggested, some different Ults to choose from. Then, basically, you'd pretty much be whatever "bloodline" best represented the Ult you chose. And it's not completely lore breaking to have Ults associated with bloodlines that are not necessarily associated with NS, the player strain which is currently all that is available. It is stated in lore that even within a single bloodline there can be a great deal of variation, probably dependent on the age of the vampire in question as their powers are suggested to grow over time.

Wow has this thread gone off track tho! LOL Anyway, I still feel the upcoming costumes are all wrong for the setting of this world and the art style used. I HOPE they will eventually do noble costumes based off those that are actually worm by the kings, queens and other nobles that are NPCs in the game. But give us better textures please!!!!!

Xvorg wrote: »

Why all discussions end up talking about Vampire lords?

That's only ONE feature from ONE TES game and not the most creative one.

If you want something interesting about Vamps, just look at Morrowind: 3 clans, everyone giving different features from the other and all of them enemies.

Now you have a lot to discuss about

As much as I love Morrowind. I... wouldn't really hold the clans up as a good moment for that game. Four different kinds of vampires? That's really cool. What's different between them? Well, one gets a 20 point boost to Strength and Endurance, one gets a 20 point boost to Agility and Speed, one gets a 20 point bonus to Willpower and Intelligence.

...oh. Okay. Yay? Anything else about them?

Yeah, each one gets four quests that are unique to them. They all involve going off and killing other vampires.

That's... um... that's great.

I can't speak for the different bloodlines in Daggerfall. I was never a vampire in that game. But, with Morrowind, the different vampire clans were kinda a weak point.

Sarcasm aside, I would love to see more stuff in the game with the different bloodlines represented. We have Lamae, we've got (probably) some Vulkelhar in Eastmarch. We probably have some of the High Rock and could have some of the Valenwood bloodlines in game.

It would be really neat to see some of the other vampire and werebeasts in game as separate skill lines, with completely separate infection chains.

That said, from a lore perspective... I'm not thrilled with Vampire Lord getting a front row seat in ESO. That's an ability that is incredibly rare in the setting, and opening that up to any player would make it's absence from the literature on vampires in the series... kinda hilarious.