Guild stores are flooded and no one is buying

Slurg · May 2015

nikolaj.lemcheb16_ESO wrote: »

Everything.worth getting is BoP or crafted or cost APs.

If you want to sell stuff then sell crafting materials or consumables.

The economy is not tanking OP. The stuff you want to sell is just worthless to the average customer in the game.

I agree. The economy has changed since the TU relaunch and people want different things now. Take note of what sells now (mats and some consumables) and sell that. Or don't worry about it because everything new that's cool is going straight to the crown store and you don't need gold for that.

Emma_Overload · May 2015

This is silly. I make a few thousand a day just from selling the glyphs I pick up while grinding, which I usually then spend on crafting mats. ALL my purple recipes sell within a week, too. People are definitely buying stuff they need to level up various crafting skills, especially with all the new and retuning players thanks to B2P.

If you're not selling anything, you're either selling the wrong stuff or setting your prices too high.

Amsel_McKay · May 2015

Master Merchant is to blame... If your item is red people dont buy... and even by a little I test this all the time making the same item sometimes 1g more and it will never sell where as the other item will sell in less than an hour.

Kupoking · May 2015

Seems there are more sellers then buyers Or that the new players dont have enough money to buy the stuff they need to level their crafting or get new motifs.

Jaxsun · May 2015

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Master Merchant is to blame... If your item is red people dont buy... and even by a little I test this all the time making the same item sometimes 1g more and it will never sell where as the other item will sell in less than an hour.

If it's red you've overpriced it...

Thymos · May 2015

I think stuff wont move until we get new content to move it with.

Right now the stuff that does move is all crafting related, extra xp from deconstruct, materials, recipes, ingredients, tempers, motifs, etc.

No one really goes to the stores to buy a whole set of craftable sets. They do look for some of the dropped sets.

I believe once they create more craftable sets that are only craftable at 8 traits or more, then you'll start seeing those fly off shelves. Even more traits would do the game some good. Rarer traits like nirnhoned are nice, add some more rare ones. Add a bunch more rare motifs, and possibly a way to learn motifs through reverse engineering, much like learning traits.

Elsonso · May 2015

Turelus wrote: »

I do feel that ZOS should add more demand on the gemstones for traits so their value goes up.

This is the first game I have played where precious gems have no value, including prior TES titles.

Jaxsun wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Master Merchant is to blame... If your item is red people dont buy... and even by a little I test this all the time making the same item sometimes 1g more and it will never sell where as the other item will sell in less than an hour.

If it's red you've overpriced it...

Not necessarily true.

MM is not an absolute. There is considerable variation and what is high for you might be higher or lower for someone else.

I sell stuff over my MM average price all the time.

Psychobunni · May 2015

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

daemonios · May 2015

Psychobunni wrote: »

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

So much this...

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · May 2015

Its nice outside people are doing other things. Combine that with the lack of any content for a long time and you get noone playing. Or if they are playing they got bored made their own crafter or gathered their own mats etc.

Faulgor · May 2015

Robotmafia wrote: »

maryriv wrote: »

Rook_Master wrote: »

At this point I vend all equipment that isn't purple, or a v12 or higher piece from a decent set.

I just can't bother with trying to sell some crap piece for 20g higher than I can vend it for.

The game gives out way to much loot. We need more legitimate gold sinks.

they could raise repair costs

That would make things worse. During leveling, it's already cheaper to replace your gear with new one than to repair it.

joshisanonymous · May 2015

It's funny because this is exactly what the situation would be if a global auction house was introduced, only there'd be no recourse. In this case, ZoS probably just has to limit the API so that things like Master Merchant are no longer possible.

I'm not sure there actually is a problem, though. I sell crappy VR6 dropped set pieces for like 400g without issue. If I vendored those, I'd get considerably less, and the materials I'm likely to get from breaking them down are not really worth it. I can also sell small stacks of provisioning ingredients for enough that I regularly log in to find I've earned a few hundred gold from the crap that I accidentally picked up the day before.

Now, I know those are not the best things in the world to sell, but I'm not in a position to sell good VR14 sets, stacks of VR14 mats, and nirnhorn items, otherwise I would only list those and so not have a problem if more readily available items are not worth the slots. The point is, I still make enough money from crappy items compared to what I'd get by vendoring them that it's hard to see where this complaint is coming from.

Ourorboros · May 2015

Jaxsun wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Master Merchant is to blame... If your item is red people dont buy... and even by a little I test this all the time making the same item sometimes 1g more and it will never sell where as the other item will sell in less than an hour.

If it's red you've overpriced it...

In addition to Lord RIchter's comment above, I posted earlier about issues with Master Merchant and other add-ons. I NEVER set my starting price above what is recommended by MM. However, the market is so volatile, I often see my items become overpriced within a matter of days. If my guild missed getting a vendor, I can just about forget selling most items listed that week. By the time we get the vendor my once reasonable prices are higher than the market. I am actually taking this in consideration when I buy things now. If an item is red, and just listed, the seller is gouging, But if the item has been listed for more than a few days, it may have been fairly priced. I'll buy it if there is not a cheaper one listed.

driosketch · May 2015

Psychobunni wrote: »

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

I don't understand your argument. Are you saying ZOS should add price comparison to the base store UI, because it sounds like that's what's causing the problem to begin with. I guess ZOS could trim back API access for such add-ons. They've done it before.

daemonios · May 2015

driosketch wrote: »

Psychobunni wrote: »

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

I don't understand your argument. Are you saying ZOS should add price comparison to the base store UI, because it sounds like that's what's causing the problem to begin with. I guess ZOS could trim back API access for such add-ons. They've done it before.

I don't think that's what he means. Since players couldn't get stuff like actual decent filters or text search through the default UI, everybody turned to add-ons, and one of the best is Master Merchant, which goes above and beyond what the average player required. Now everyone has an advanced market analysis tool. ZOS have been completely deaf to legitimate concerns about the lack of some features in the default UI, and this is one of the consequences.

By the way, Minion reports that Awesome Guild Store has 88k+ downloads and Master Merchant has 66k+. That's at least 66 THOUSAND players (maybe a little less, discounting repeated downloads) who felt ZOS' UI was insufficient.

Hagbard_OM · May 2015

I am a huge fan of MM, and I have a tremendous amount of respect for the work that Philgo puts into it. The biggest problem that people are having with MM isn't actually an issue with the addon at all - it falls under the category of "user error."

MM is a tool, and, as is the case with all tools, the utility you gain from it is dependent upon your understanding of how to properly use it.

Does MM sometimes list items as "red" that are fairly prices (or even underpriced)? Yes, it does. But it fall on the user to recognize what is happening. Since MM uses sales data to calculate its price index, it is, by its very nature, reactive to the market. When demand for an item starts increasing, and prices start rising, MM will naturally lag behind the trend a bit due to data from older sales. Exactly how long, and to what extent, it lags behind depends on how many days of sales data you have stored. Resetting your data back to 10 days gives you a more accurate picture of the current market, but doing so (resetting) comes at the cost of possibly completely losing sales data for rare items.

In the end, the best way to deal with this is to just pay attention to the market. Personally, (when evaluating item value) I find the graph feature on MM to be far more useful than the price index. Check the graph and look for trends in the price. You should also pay a lot more attention to the recent sale values than the average. The market is ever-changing, and good merchants need to adapt if they want to succeed. Also... ALWAYS be leery of items with limited sales data, particularly if the prices recorded seem bizarrely high. There are some folks in our midst who try to game the system as far as MM is concerned. Caveat Emptor.

Finally, to directly address the issue of items not selling, I would like to say that in my experience, the color of the item on MM is less of a factor than the items relative price in comparison to the other vendors in the area. Most people who don't want to travel around obsessively searching for the lowest price (this is most players imo), will still comparison shop between all of the vendors in a particular location. If one of the other kiosks in the area has the item for a lower price than you do... it will probably sell before yours. In short, know your market.

QuadroTony · May 2015

maryriv wrote: »

and no one is buying

you sure?

WillhelmBlack · May 2015

Prices are too high because of the price check addons. Most people have finished questing, the source of gold.

Vahrokh · May 2015

Ourorboros wrote: »

As much as I love it, I blame Master Merchant. I have listed multiple recipes below the current price, only to have them be flagged in red as above average in a matter of days. Whether people are just skipping past red items or actively filtering them out, my sales have taken a big hit since MM arrived on the scene. As a buyer, I'm thrilled by this, but as a seller, it is making that aspect of the game frustrating.

Several of my guilds that usually have a vendor have also been outbid by deeper pockets that have no goods to sell. That is also frustrating.

However, certain items will sell very quickly for a good price. So part of this is knowing the market and putting the right items up for sale.

Actually, this is awesome.
You are watching the markets in action. Markets have built in mechanisms to optimize prices over time.

I have posted a farily detailed article about online games and economy on my blog that explains everything.

driosketch · May 2015

daemonios wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

Psychobunni wrote: »

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

I don't understand your argument. Are you saying ZOS should add price comparison to the base store UI, because it sounds like that's what's causing the problem to begin with. I guess ZOS could trim back API access for such add-ons. They've done it before.

I don't think that's what he means. Since players couldn't get stuff like actual decent filters or text search through the default UI, everybody turned to add-ons, and one of the best is Master Merchant, which goes above and beyond what the average player required. Now everyone has an advanced market analysis tool. ZOS have been completely deaf to legitimate concerns about the lack of some features in the default UI, and this is one of the consequences.

By the way, Minion reports that Awesome Guild Store has 88k+ downloads and Master Merchant has 66k+. That's at least 66 THOUSAND players (maybe a little less, discounting repeated downloads) who felt ZOS' UI was insufficient.

It's piggybacking one argument on top of a separate one then. Even if ZOS's UI was everything you dreamed, someone could still have come out with a market analysis add-on.

KrisButtar · May 2015

Lower your prices. I stop at those kiosks, those prices I see on somethings, I think those greedy *****. I'm looking to buy things but with some of the going rates I going to buy stuff via the crown shop and hope ZOS continues to add more of what I'm looking for to the crown shop. In game I'm close to broke between feeding my horse, repairs and buying space.

daemonios · May 2015

driosketch wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

Psychobunni wrote: »

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

I don't understand your argument. Are you saying ZOS should add price comparison to the base store UI, because it sounds like that's what's causing the problem to begin with. I guess ZOS could trim back API access for such add-ons. They've done it before.

I don't think that's what he means. Since players couldn't get stuff like actual decent filters or text search through the default UI, everybody turned to add-ons, and one of the best is Master Merchant, which goes above and beyond what the average player required. Now everyone has an advanced market analysis tool. ZOS have been completely deaf to legitimate concerns about the lack of some features in the default UI, and this is one of the consequences.

By the way, Minion reports that Awesome Guild Store has 88k+ downloads and Master Merchant has 66k+. That's at least 66 THOUSAND players (maybe a little less, discounting repeated downloads) who felt ZOS' UI was insufficient.

It's piggybacking one argument on top of a separate one then. Even if ZOS's UI was everything you dreamed, someone could still have come out with a market analysis add-on.

True, but how many people would install it? I know I probably wouldn't. At the beginning I was fiercely anti-addons and tried to give examples here of areas where the UI could be improved. I gave up as I leveled and those addons became an absolute necessity rather than a luxury. Still, I try to have as few addons as possible.

vovus69 · May 2015

pvp gear always should be bound on pickup otherwise you will have an agreement play - when two or three parties will agreed upon giving up keeps and castles to each other in order to get the emperor buffs and pvp stuff like master weapon etc. Only pve content could be sold - this way zos can handle the way those items will be obtained from the bosses. Just make boss powerful enough and no agreement play will help

pecheckler · May 2015

The problem is that many of the major gold sinks are now available to be purchased with crowns and the disproportionate increasing value of VR14 set gear compared to other levels. I expressed concern about this the day the crown store had the first consumable and utility items added to it. Now that some time has passed we're experiencing the pain.

Skill re-specialization, soul gems, and especially repair kits are harming the economy. The recent addition of all the motifs was a major blow as well.

I have reviewed my regular number of sales on all 5 guild stores which always have great kiosk locations and over the last 45 days noticed a nearly 75% drop in sales of items. That's not even factoring in the price decreases which keep falling across the board.

A new mechanic which would help resolve this issue is adding a gold sink that allows lower level items to be upgrade to higher level versions.

*** ain't selling.

Sylvyr · May 2015

daemonios wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I do feel that ZOS should add more demand on the gemstones for traits so their value goes up.

Demand isn't very flexible. You craft 1 or 2 end-game sets and you're done. That's a couple dozen trait stones tops. ZOS has to act on supply instead if it's going to do anything, i.e. make trait stones rare drops.

Why even bother to craft end game gear, most dropped gear is better than crafted at end game now.

newtinmpls · May 2015

I can't log on every day to sell, so I tend to price my stuff higher than any of the addon "recommended" prices.

On the other hand, since I hate selling crap that I don't think anyone will need/want/use, I mostly list:

1-Low level foods needed to fulfill writs (and for less than I was charged for them - 'cause I remember how frustrating that was.

2-Set pieces from craftable sets - which on the one hand tend to go - on the other I used to always boost them to green, but now with the justice system and slightly reduced "drops" from deconstructing, I'm occasionally listing them white since I'm really really low on hemming any more.

3-Dropped items that are part of sets - again, I know how frustrating they can be at some levels.

I do NOT list

Dropped or quest reward weapons/jewelry/armor that are NOT sets (generally) as they are never as good as crafted set items (or the occasionally coolo dropped set items).

refined materials - 'cause I know any crafter worth his or her salt would prefer to do the refining and get the "drops" (and the occasional gold temper.

daemonios · May 2015

Sylvyr wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

I do feel that ZOS should add more demand on the gemstones for traits so their value goes up.

Demand isn't very flexible. You craft 1 or 2 end-game sets and you're done. That's a couple dozen trait stones tops. ZOS has to act on supply instead if it's going to do anything, i.e. make trait stones rare drops.

Why even bother to craft end game gear, most dropped gear is better than crafted at end game now.

True for the most part, but I still top off my dropped gear with some crafted pieces. But yes, crafted gear is lagging way behind, and has been for months. The most useful sets are 3 to 4-traits required, i.e. any half-decent crafter can make them.

Jaxsun · May 2015

Ourorboros wrote: »

Jaxsun wrote: »

Amsel_McKay wrote: »

Master Merchant is to blame... If your item is red people dont buy... and even by a little I test this all the time making the same item sometimes 1g more and it will never sell where as the other item will sell in less than an hour.

If it's red you've overpriced it...

In addition to Lord RIchter's comment above, I posted earlier about issues with Master Merchant and other add-ons. I NEVER set my starting price above what is recommended by MM. However, the market is so volatile, I often see my items become overpriced within a matter of days. If my guild missed getting a vendor, I can just about forget selling most items listed that week. By the time we get the vendor my once reasonable prices are higher than the market. I am actually taking this in consideration when I buy things now. If an item is red, and just listed, the seller is gouging, But if the item has been listed for more than a few days, it may have been fairly priced. I'll buy it if there is not a cheaper one listed.

This is why we need a global auction house.

Jaxsun · May 2015

daemonios wrote: »

Psychobunni wrote: »

I do believe Master Merchant plays a big part in whats happening....but the blame falls on ZOS, not the addon creator.

Why? Players begged and begged for a better UI for the kiosk system, if they had only listened then MM would never have came to be. It's creation was to fill a player need ZOS ignored and continues to ignore to this day.

So much this...

This!

Sylvyr · May 2015

maryriv wrote: »

Everyone is selling stuff @ cost (to be nice?) and still markets flooded with things like recipes etc.

Meanwhile "precious" gems remain @ zero cost.

Everything is way to easy to get in this game, the economy is tanking.

Any plans to fix this?

A big factor in this could be....

1) Not enough new players. Lowers demand for goods. Fix: ZoS make the game better.
2) Old players leaving. Lowers demand for goods. Fix: ZoS fix the game.