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Should ZOS Finally Just Allow Us To Roll Max Level Characters?
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Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!I voted no because you can't get a feel for playing a new character just by getting them at max level. The whole point of leveling a character is to learn them, try out different builds. You have to grow with your character. There isn't a short cut to this really. You can't just get a max level character and expect to be effective with them anytime soon. It all takes time.
I am all for changing your Race if you want though. With changing your Race after hitting V14, there would be minimal differences between your starting and ending. Only the Racial passives would play into effect and wounld't change your character that much.
Actually, your initial argument should be held true for both of your statements. Otherwise, you're being logically inconsistent.
"because you can't get a feel for playing a new race just by getting them at max level. The whole point of leveling a new race is to learn them, try out different builds. You have to grow with your new race. There isn't a short cut to this really. You can't just get a new race and expect to be effective with them anytime soon. It all takes time."
Edited by Grim13 on March 27, 2015 3:48PM0 -
Xithian✭✭✭No - because reasons...When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
And I still don't support the idea, because it would just turn into a slippery slope.Edited by Xithian on March 27, 2015 3:45PM0 -
Thymos✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...There sure is a lot of support for this idea.The Older Gamers Recruitment Thread
Always accepting new members for NA and EU server. PvP PvE RP all welcome. Must be 25+ yo to join.
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Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!Emma_Eunjung wrote: »I said yes, because my time is actually valuable to me.
I spent MONTHS leveling my Sorc to VR14 and carefully theory-crafting builds capable of tackling the toughest content, then ZoS decides to NERF Sorcerers into the ground. Now I have to start over again with another class if I want to have a really strong build... either that, or spend ten years grinding my way to 3600 CP.
The LEAST ZoS could do after jacking up so many builds is give us an option in the Crown Store to buy a leveled character. They could charge $100, and it would STILL be cheaper than the time cost of leveling to VR14, even if you only make minimum wage!
It is not a time cost.
If this is how you feel then you should not play the game.
It absolutely is a time cost.
The only difference is the level to which one is ok with spending it.1 -
Necrelios✭✭✭✭✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!Naor_Sarethi wrote: »Why do you repeat quests then? This game is particularly made with the 1char = all the content formula.
That's why Cadwells exists.
It's one of the least alt friendly games i know.
So best to stick to one char and max him out.
IF you could buy v14's, it would destroy what's left of the game.
In my case, I had already leveled characters on each alliance long before VR ranks and Caldwell's were introduced. For players like me we found ourselves in the rather unfortunate position of wanting to experience the other alliances content, and doing so, before having to do it again... and again.... and again.
As for why people need more than one class... well at least for me I like not doing the same thing all the time, this way I don't have to pay to have my skills reset every time I decide to try doing something else, like a bow user or a duel wield class, or a two handed build, or a staff user. It's about adding diversity to the game and playing how you want because sometimes you get bored doing just one thing when there's so many different options to explore.
I also like the idea of having unique characters with their own specialties. I just don't really see how allowing any of my other characters to catch up with my main would destroy the game in any way. But they're doing away with veteran ranks anyways, or so they claim.Terms & Conditions ["We revoke permission to fictional legal constructs or private/public persons for selling of any private data, censorship, surveillance, personage or conversion as a trespass of law. We prohibit the practice of "procedural law" or corporate statues in place of divine law."]2 -
Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
So, than you chose the wrong option.1 -
Thymos✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...
Actually he wrote that he would be fine with it, not that he wants it or they should do it.When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
So, than you chose the wrong option.Edited by Thymos on March 27, 2015 3:41PMThe Older Gamers Recruitment Thread
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http://www.theoldergamers.com/0 -
bosmern_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭No - because reasons...No.
There are people out there (like myself) who took the time to get more than one V14 character. We took the time to reroll and do everything over again and with hard work we achieved it.
Just because you want to roll a DK doesn't mean ZoS should let everyone be max level for free, there would be no reason for the zones.~Thallen~0 -
MissBizz✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...I would be against buying a new max level character, but as a player who has 3 toons (all different factions) it's pretty boring to do the same quests over and over. If they change the silver/gold quests so you went to their zone but it was a different story and different quests, I would definitely say no to max level toons.
Although, I wouldn't be against there being "criteria" that you could meet in order to get a max level toon.
-Have a current max level character
-Have X (maybe 200) skill points on above character
-Completed Caldwell gold and silver on above character
-Completed main Craglorn quests.
This I think would show you have went through the content with that toon. As well, I would add that when you go to create the "max level" character, you would only be granted the skill points given for levelling. You would be responsible to go grab skyshards/main story quests for the others.
Really, I'd prefer if they just made Silver/gold quests just completely different and therefore never offering a max level character option.Lone Wolf HelpFor the solo players who know, sometimes you just need a hand.PC | NA | AD-DC-EP | Discord0 -
Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!
Actually he wrote that he would be fine with it, not that he wants it or they should do it.When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
So, than you chose the wrong option.
Semantics.
The proper choice would have been "Yes, but only for PvP".0 -
ShadowViper✭✭✭No - because reasons...Saucy_Jack wrote: »When you say "finally", do you mean "barely a year after launch"?
Borderlands 2's been out for way longer than a year; it's online; it's multiplayer. Does Borderlands 2 allow you to just "roll a max level character"? No. Why? Because you get to earn it.
If having a max level character for pvp or endgame or whatever is so important to anyone, they'll put in the time and effort to get their toon there. If it's not that important, they won't.
So the question is...how important is having a max level toon to you?
No it doesn't, but you can download a character save and instantly have any class you want at the level you want. Want a level 72 Overpower Rank 8 toon? Go download the character save and play to your hearts content. And yes, they work for multiplayer and all too.... just sayin'.0 -
Xithian✭✭✭No - because reasons...Emma_Eunjung wrote: »I spent MONTHS leveling my Sorc to VR14 and carefully theory-crafting builds capable of tackling the toughest content, then ZoS decides to NERF Sorcerers into the ground. Now I have to start over again with another class if I want to have a really strong build...
And encouraging people with that kind of attitude is one of my primary reasons for not wanting things like this.
Leveling an alt is a grueling task for anyone that's already played through all three factions. The fix isn't to wave a magic wand and skip all that, it's to put in ways to make leveling alts fun and engaging. Anything else is just asking for yet another game focused only on endgame with devs unable to keep up the pace of new content. There's a reason most of the people I know that still "play WoW" only play for a month after an expansion release, then unsub again.0 -
wraith808✭✭✭✭Biased poll is biased.Quasim ibn-Muhammad - VR 12 Redguard Dragon Knight
Taladriel Vanima - VR 5 Altmer Nightblade
Ambalyo iyo Bogaadin - VR 1 Redguard Sorceror1 -
Thymos✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...
This is your poll and you want to bring it down to semantics? I'm sorry, but the question was if they "should" do it, not "would you be ok" if they did it. There is a pretty big difference, because the latter basically implies that a person would get over it and still play the game regardless of the outcome. I play the game for what I get out of it, whatever they change, no matter how much I like or don't like it, I'm going to continue to play this game. They have done nothing that would make me stop paying my subscription yet, and I am pretty confident that it would take a lot more than adding purchasable max level characters to make me stop playing this game.
Actually he wrote that he would be fine with it, not that he wants it or they should do it.When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
So, than you chose the wrong option.
Semantics.
The proper choice would have been "Yes, but only for PvP".
So no, I wont accept that you want to count his vote on your side, because you asked a specific question and got an answer you don't like.Edited by Thymos on March 27, 2015 3:47PMThe Older Gamers Recruitment Thread
Always accepting new members for NA and EU server. PvP PvE RP all welcome. Must be 25+ yo to join.
http://www.theoldergamers.com/1 -
lordxyrax_ESO✭✭✭No - because reasons...lordxyrax_ESO wrote: »Plenty of other options out their for the "I WANT IT NOW!!!" crowd. Leave this one as is. If anything, extend the time it takes to hit max lvl.
I just don't get it. People complain it takes too long to get to end game. Then they complain the game is too easy. Which is it? Pick one and stick with it.
Correct me when I'm wrong, but difficulty has nothing to do with time consumption.
[edit] To be precise:
The current insane amount of time needed to reach VR14 has nothing to do with difficulty. This thread is about people complaining it takes too long.
The other discussion - its too easy - has nothing to do with it. In fact, making things harder, will actually make the journey to VR14 *even longer*.
Difficulty and time spent are directly linked. The harder the content, the longer it typically takes to get through it.
I've gone from lvl 7 to level 40 in just over a week. That's playing 2-3 hours per weeknight and large chunk of 2 weekends. That's insanely fast for an MMORPG (anyone remember EQ?).
Reaching max level SHOULD take a long time. If building a character over time doesn't appeal to you and you'd prefer to have max level character ASAP then perhaps MMORPG's are not the genre you should be playing. May I suggest looking into RTS or FPS type games?
Asking for instant max level characters is a direct insult to the people who put time and effort into building a story line (which is the core to any real RPG).0 -
BlackEar✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...
You don't make any sense. Sorry. Please be more clear.
I think that if you consider the game design and philosophy you will find that a) your suggestion is bad b) it is an irrational suggestion.Bjorn Blackbear - Master Angler - Collector - Black Market Mogul - Ebonheart Pact - Exterminatus - EU.
Achievement hunter:
Visit my profile page to find out about which achievement I am currently hunting.
Check out Anemonean's thieving guide!0 -
Gidorick✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...Lol @ the word 'finally' being used.What ESO really needs is an Auction Horse.
That's right... Horse.
Click HERE to discuss.
Want more crazy ideas? Check out my Concept Repository!3 -
golfer.dub17_ESO✭✭✭✭Bloodystab wrote: »I grew on games where bad decisions at beginning was leading to waste of months of game time just to reroll new character. In current times there's no games like this - You can easy change skills, attributes (in other games even Race) etc. And You know what? I miss that days!
So much pretentious nonsense in this thread.
Why would you miss such a flawed design? Why would you miss having any of your time wasted?How about if you only got to roll fresh v14 characters if you've levelled one already?
I think that's fair. If you're at V14 it means you've already experienced everything as far as questing goes and now just want to try out different classes and playstyles.Edited by golfer.dub17_ESO on March 27, 2015 3:51PM0 -
DaniAngione✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...I don't get these people that want to skip the role point of a role-playing game and go straight to max skill PVP....
Why not just go and play Chivalry or War of the Roses? Both great games!0 -
Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!
This is your poll and you want to bring it down to semantics? I'm sorry, but the question was if they "should" do it, not "would you be ok" if they did it. There is a pretty big difference, because the latter basically implies that a person would get over it and still play the game regardless of the outcome. I play the game for what I get out of it, whatever they change, no matter how much I like or don't like it, I'm going to continue to play this game. They have done nothing that would make me stop paying my subscription yet, and I am pretty confident that it would take a lot more than adding purchasable max level characters to make me stop playing this game.
Actually he wrote that he would be fine with it, not that he wants it or they should do it.When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
So, than you chose the wrong option.
Semantics.
The proper choice would have been "Yes, but only for PvP".
So no, I wont accept that you want to count his vote on your side, because you asked a specific question and got an answer you don't like.
lol
I'm not counting his vote on my side. You'll note my choice above. ^
I'd count his reponse in the column his response most closely resembles.0 -
Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!lordxyrax_ESO wrote: »lordxyrax_ESO wrote: »Plenty of other options out their for the "I WANT IT NOW!!!" crowd. Leave this one as is. If anything, extend the time it takes to hit max lvl.
I just don't get it. People complain it takes too long to get to end game. Then they complain the game is too easy. Which is it? Pick one and stick with it.
Correct me when I'm wrong, but difficulty has nothing to do with time consumption.
[edit] To be precise:
The current insane amount of time needed to reach VR14 has nothing to do with difficulty. This thread is about people complaining it takes too long.
The other discussion - its too easy - has nothing to do with it. In fact, making things harder, will actually make the journey to VR14 *even longer*.
Difficulty and time spent are directly linked. The harder the content, the longer it typically takes to get through it.
I've gone from lvl 7 to level 40 in just over a week. That's playing 2-3 hours per weeknight and large chunk of 2 weekends. That's insanely fast for an MMORPG (anyone remember EQ?).
Reaching max level SHOULD take a long time. If building a character over time doesn't appeal to you and you'd prefer to have max level character ASAP then perhaps MMORPG's are not the genre you should be playing. May I suggest looking into RTS or FPS type games?
Asking for instant max level characters is a direct insult to the people who put time and effort into building a story line (which is the core to any real RPG).
I've already experienced the storyline, twice over... not sure how wanting to avoid a 3rd time is an insult to the writers.
Kind of a wild stretch there.Edited by Grim13 on March 27, 2015 4:02PM0 -
Chuggernaut✭✭✭No - because reasons...Getting from 1 to 50 takes no time and veteran ranks are supposedly being removed. For these reasons alone I vote no.My comrades have returned. I erect the spine of gratitude. You are a hero today. - Bura-Natoo2 -
Kallipsoe✭✭✭No - because reasons...I would much rather them add a payed for Race/class change than just let you roll a V14 character.0 -
Grim13✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes - Questing/Grinding Be Damned!I would be against buying a new max level character, but as a player who has 3 toons (all different factions) it's pretty boring to do the same quests over and over. If they change the silver/gold quests so you went to their zone but it was a different story and different quests, I would definitely say no to max level toons.
Although, I wouldn't be against there being "criteria" that you could meet in order to get a max level toon.
-Have a current max level character
-Have X (maybe 200) skill points on above character
-Completed Caldwell gold and silver on above character
-Completed main Craglorn quests.
This I think would show you have went through the content with that toon. As well, I would add that when you go to create the "max level" character, you would only be granted the skill points given for levelling. You would be responsible to go grab skyshards/main story quests for the others.
Really, I'd prefer if they just made Silver/gold quests just completely different and therefore never offering a max level character option.
Thank you for the legitimate response.
I appreciate it.0 -
gard✭✭✭✭✭Yes, but only for PvPWhen the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
And I still don't support the idea, because it would just turn into a slippery slope.
You went and made me take away my "agree" =P
I'm gonna have ot go check out GW2 now though based on what you said.
How does the option of having an insta-max level char for Cyrodil only turn into a slippery slope?
Already we're leveled to VR14, but without the skills. Why not go all the way?
Seems as if it would create a truly level playing field in pvp.
Though I can imagine that people who have spent hours grinding for a pvp edge wouldn't like it.1 -
Sacadon✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...Generally and mostly speaking, just no.
Maybe allow the swapping of one-for-one. For example, if you've leveled 1 char to max and want to change to another, then match all non-class skills and VR level immediately. But still require the leveling of the class skills just at an accelerated rate, just like what happens today when you unlock a skill for the first time, at VR14. And class skill leveling that remained would have to be done against the same repeatable content that exists, or lack thereof depending upon your perspective. In other words, not allow Cadwell's gold reset.
Whether players like to admit it or not, most of them do need at least some time using class skills progressively in order to L2P (the positive version). You can jump in a crazy fast car and drive reasonably fast, but it doesn't make you a good driver. Most people need to start with a slow car and learn how to drive that fast first. Then they really know how to use the fast car or in this bad example, a max-level char. Exceptions always apply of course.1 -
Obscure✭✭✭✭✭No - because reasons...When the entire focus of the game moves to endgame, efforts to improve anything prior to that point in the game drop to half-arsed levels. The only game to ever have insta-max levels and not lose my complete respect was Guild Wars, and that was for PvP only characters. I would be fine with the equivalent here, and that's the only way. Want a max level char instantly? Ok, poof...that character can never leave Cyrodil. Anything else? Nope. Go play a different game.
And I still don't support the idea, because it would just turn into a slippery slope.
You went and made me take away my "agree" =P
I'm gonna have ot go check out GW2 now though based on what you said.
How does the option of having an insta-max level char for Cyrodil only turn into a slippery slope?
Already we're leveled to VR14, but without the skills. Why not go all the way?
Seems as if it would create a truly level playing field in pvp.
Though I can imagine that people who have spent hours grinding for a pvp edge wouldn't like it.
Perspective: Levelling in Guild Wars (Not Guild Wars 2) takes less than 8 hours to reach max level (which was 20).
PvP only characters were Max, but required the player to play PvP to earn points to unlock literately hundreds of skills and equipment options exclusively for PvP. It's actually a design that GW2 did poorly and is no where near as good as the original.
Incessant vertical progression is not the focus in that game, it is entirely skill driven, kinda like an 8 card CCG. It barely counts as an MMO. It's almost entirely horizontal progression, and achievement (titles) based content.
VERY different animal to ESO. Judge them not equally.1