Ok OP, I understand your intent, but i think you went about it the wrong way.

I understand people are upset or worried about the future direction of the game now. Some of them express that emotion in anger, walking away, whatever. Others in different ways.

What your describing is no different then your cell phone. If your happy with your service 9 out of 10 people will never say a thing or give any feedback, the moment they are not, then you get feedback of the negative variety. Right or wrong, this is how things work, how the company manages to handle that reaction and turn it into something positive will be the deciding factor here.

We have to understand, people have a legitimate reason to be upset. Im showing understanding to their reasons why, once we understand their reasons why, we and ZOS can better handle those concerns without splitting the community apart at the seams.

Many of the MMO veterans/people who have been here from the start at beta have concerns about the future direction of the game. I always express my views in a respectful and hopefully constructive manner.

The cash shop is the big concern to this player base, because other games that have went this route eventually pushed into P2W ballpark. It will be up to ZOS now to regain that trust and prove they are not going to push that route in the future.

Now some folks may not express these concerns in the most constructive way, hey were human, we all have emotions, but the crux is they do not want end game gear, the best gear, and other end game things ending up in the cash shop for people to buy instead of earning. Its just like i don't want PVP rewards and gear ending up in the cash shop, if they want that gear, then they need to get out in Cyrodiil get in the thick of it, take their lumps, and earn those AP to get it.

The second big thing folks are worried and concerned about is the crowns. As of right now, people who have been subbed since launch will get 100 crowns per month they were subbed...thats less then 1month of sub of new people coming into the game.

Right or wrong, agree or disagree with the way this has been is articulated, I can see how this could be perceived as a slap in the face. Those who were here beta testing this game in the beginning, and those who have stuck around feel they are being shortchanged on this.

Things will calm down eventually, but ZOS could do a lot to build goodwill with this community by doing the following things:

1. No gear, end game gear, or shortcuts in that cash shop.Prove this over a period of time, things will be good.

2. 100 crowns isn't enough for longtime subscribers. I know that no one "is entitled or deserves anything". However this is not about being entitled or deserved, its about mending fences and showing goodwill. In politics, business deals, whatever, sometimes you have to throw in a little extra to "sweeten the pot". Its not going to be the end of the world for ZOS to give each subscriber 500-600 Crowns per month sub vs what they are giving now. This will help mend fences here BIG TIME. It will begin that healing process and regaining trust process all the much faster...sometimes you have to give a little to get a lot.

If ZOS does #1 and #2 above, things will calm down around here much sooner then they will as things are right now...

I think instead of pointing fingers and blaming this person and that person, we should simply work together to mend fences here and try our best to express to ZOS in a constructive and respectful manner ideas about how to make things right instead of trying to label people into groups such as "Vocal minority", or whatever else. Were all in this game together, one way or another, So lets all put a positive foot forward instead of two steps back.

DDuke wrote: »

e.chiesa73b16_ESO wrote: »

DDuke wrote: »

e.chiesa73b16_ESO wrote: »

Galathil923 wrote: »

I was a little upset with the announcement was because it was never brought to my attention in "Development Discussions" I had no idea they were even working on this.
We have been paying for a sub and not getting any new content,I think its been 3 months now? Officially we have been funding the new B2P model without any knowledge of them working on it.

We were not funding anything...we were paying for a service: to play the game.
That's all. The owner of the service (Zenimax) choose its price. You thought it was ok and you could afford it, so you pay it.

The fact that some of you post such things in this very thread show us how much the OP was right.

Not funding anything?

Where do you think they came up with the money to pay the developers & develop content?

People these days...

Soooo, if you come to my store and buy something you are funding me?
I really think you don't know what funding is.

"Sources of funding include credit, venture capital, donations, grants, savings, subsidies, and taxes."...I don't see subscription in this list.

If you pay a subscription you are just paying for a service.

If someone comes to your store and purchases a service from you, they are essentially funding your store's existence.

Without that money, your store wouldn't exist. Gone. Poof.


It's also funny how you come up with your own definitions for things.
You can fund a project with your money (e.g. Kickstarters), just like you can fund a project by subscribing to it.

But to put this to rest, what is subscription, if not a subsidy? You listed it yourself on your made-up list

It is not a finished product, and as subscriber one would expect that the money you spend on it (the money that keeps it alive) is used to benefit you and not to work against you.

Essentially, if ESO had been a finished product with no future plans/expectations, then I might be inclined to agree with you. It being MMO, this is obviously not the case.

English is not my main language, but you guys should know it better.
This is the definition of subsidy:
A subsidy is a form of financial or in kind support extended to an economic sector (or institution, business, or individual) generally with the aim of promoting economic and social policy.

It's NOT the same thing as subscription

We are paying to benefit of a service. We are not giving money to ZOS to finance them. They give us something in return for our money: THE *** GAME.

*** guys you are dense: when you pay for something is NOT funding and NOT subsidy.

We are paying for a service, how hard can it be to understand?

Yasha wrote: »

Alphashado wrote: »

All of you people that think a cash shop is going to generate enough revenue for new content are fools. The box sakes from consoles will get them a chunk of cash and that will be it. Profits will eventually peter off after that and you won't see much new content. This is all about consoles and getting a immediate chunk of cash in ZoS's pockets. Go ask anyone that plays GW2, arguably the most popular B2P game on the market and the biggest gripe they will have is an astonishing lack of new content only 2 years after launch.

I play GW2 and have no gripes with it. In fact I love how they have set up their business model, it is extremely fair for consumers and developers. It has had more new content added to it than most sub-based games. Look at WoW for example, they charge you a sub and then charge basically the price of a new game for expansions. Total ripoff.

I am elated that ESO is doing something similar to GW2, it is the best payment model for mmos.

gw2 was different you could buy cash shop currency with in game currency so you cuold grind out somthing if you really wanted.
wow has a sub, a cash shop, and expansions every 2 years. plus content updates sometimes inbetween expansions
eso is b2p, witha sub option, and micro transactions/cash shop

bottom line eso was making money with subs. just not enough to satisfy who ever calls the shots.

daktary2001 wrote: »

Thank you for saying what I've been thinking since the beginning of this great adventure.
The game always was F2P for me, and by that I mean Fun 2 Play !

I actually lol'd on that one. Too cute

And yeah, I was actually surprised yesterday to see in game chat so calm. Same amount of players running around, so that wasn't an issue. Awesome.

Really, I expect the influx to start next month what with the 30 days of game time included in purchase.

e.chiesa73b16_ESO wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

lol, question, what do you think sub money is spent on if not salaries, etc for future game development? Do they section off sub money and under no circumstances let it directly or indirectly be used for development of the game?

Paying a subscription don't qualify as funding, not in this case. Really is not that hard

No, sub money didn't fund salaries, development of the cash shop, hardware etc.

Please enlighten us where did the money go, maybe your personal collection of pink unicorns?

Exstazik wrote: »

Mjollnir_NL wrote: »

It is B2P :-)

Now i can get my gf to play it. She does not like the play a monthly fee. But she does like to Buy to play.

So you will need to buy

• Imperial City
• House system
• Spellcrafting
• Each new zones
• Thief guild

each something like x2 monthly fee.....so don't take your gf to TESO
and also mimimi dresses *

Where did you get the pricing information… and where did you get your information on what will actually be considered for paid DLC?

The only thing they confirmed in the 80 min video with Matt and Paul was that new ZONES like Wrothgar would be DLC.

Not saying Imperial City and other things won't be, but you are guessing and stating it as fact.

No price has been mentioned either… you are guessing again.

technohic wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

e.chiesa73b16_ESO wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

lol, question, what do you think sub money is spent on if not salaries, etc for future game development? Do they section off sub money and under no circumstances let it directly or indirectly be used for development of the game?

Paying a subscription don't qualify as funding, not in this case. Really is not that hard

His argument was that his sub money was used to develop the b2p model, to say that isn't true is saying that somehow the sub money is diverted away from game development. Is that what you think?

I'm sure it funds it, but it is not what we directly pay for. We pay for the service to log in every month. What they do with it at that point really is their business and its then their money.

I bought a frape at McDonalds the other day. They might have used that money for getting more chickent nuggets or working on their next McRib.

Thank you so much kind sir it's what I'm trying to tell everybody who is using the word "funding"

You think the forums are bad now... just wait. Oh just wait. I'll never go to them again. I just unsubbed so I might not see anything again actually. Have fun people.

DDuke wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

e.chiesa73b16_ESO wrote: »

pmn100b16_ESO wrote: »

lol, question, what do you think sub money is spent on if not salaries, etc for future game development? Do they section off sub money and under no circumstances let it directly or indirectly be used for development of the game?

Paying a subscription don't qualify as funding, not in this case. Really is not that hard

His argument was that his sub money was used to develop the b2p model, to say that isn't true is saying that somehow the sub money is diverted away from game development. Is that what you think?

I'm sure it funds it, but it is not what we directly pay for. We pay for the service to log in every month. What they do with it at that point really is their business and its then their money.

I bought a frape at McDonalds the other day. They might have used that money for getting more chickent nuggets or working on their next McRib.

Yes, and then you maybe consume that McRib (a finished product).

We are talking about a service that requires our money to keep running & getting better (not worse).

In french? And spanish maybe?


But I remember you now: you are the author of "Join me in boycotting Zenimax Media Inc" (actually I don't know you, I just browsed your old post . You are a bitter person, do you know that?)