A Vocal Minority - And Welcome New Interested Players!

Grapdjan

A sad feature of MMOs is that forums are usually populated by a small fraction of players, and this minority are usually extremely vocal and contribute the largest part of a games forum community.

Usually there are within that group an even smaller fraction of prolific posters, gaining a small level of 'superstardom' among the rest. Attributed to these people is a sort of clairvoyance as they read situations that develop in the games unfolding story such as nerfs, content drops or changing game mechanics. This group also believes themselves to be more important and possibly having a special relationship with the games development team as obviously due to the size of their input they have most direct replies from development or customer service reps.

If there is a perceived threat or issue facing the game and it is something they do not like - i.e. content drops not happening fast enough, patch notes being delayed, changes in payment options or simply not feeling like they are being told what they want to know, this group will turn venomously and throw a tantrum until they either quit, or manage to reconcile the changes with their addiction and carry on playing until the next major upset.

When you have an announcement like this B2P one which, without any empirical evidence, is immediately denounced as 'the death of X game' then the forums usually erupt with the same 200 - 400 players spamming and filling said forums with Chicken Little like cries of impending doom. Along with spurious weighted polls and screenshots of 'X game has been uninstalled'.

This can be damaging to the game if you have any potential new players coming along to visit the forums in the wake of said new announcements, so I'd like to say to anyone reading -

DON'T PANIC! The people posting all the rage/betrayal/I quit threads on here, and voting in silly polls are the equivalent of the crazy white bearded hobo walking through your city with a board round his neck that says 'The End is Nigh'!

The other 95% of people are happily enjoying the game and are not even registered to post on the forums as they don't feel the need.

daktary2001

Thank you for saying what I've been thinking since the beginning of this great adventure.
The game always was F2P for me, and by that I mean Fun 2 Play !

Grapdjan

It's a pleasure! My friends and I have been having a ball in ESO for a few months now, and are looking forward to the cash shop to be honest. Give us more of a chance to put some cash into ZOS pockets to spend on more development.

A common misconception of cash shops is that it will it drain development time away from 'actual' content. Duh, they get people in to specifically develop cash shop stuff. And how long does it take to draw a fire breathing water dragon anyway?

ahstin2001nub18_ESO

this is why a lot of people are pissed:

Cogo wrote: »

AngryNord wrote: »

Psychobunni wrote: »

I'm watching the stream late, but really @ZOS_MattFiror lied right of the bat by saying going B2P was response of "listening to their community" so whatever promises made after or ways they say they won't let it become PTW, w/e .......are taken with a grain of salt. The community clearly had a majority wanting the game to remain sub.

But, in the end it doesn't matter. I'll play until it stops being fun (or) you can buy achievements, whichever comes first.

But it _is_ listening to the community.. The community of whining kids on Facebook that's been spamming every official ESO post there with "F2P NOW!!!" since day one...

He had no problem what so ever talking on the whole internet last year.

I'd like Mr Matt Firor to explain this.

ZeniMax General Manager Matt Firor confirmed TESO's subscription model in an interview with GameStar.

"Charging a flat monthly (or subscription) fee means that we will offer players the game we set out to make, and the one that fans want to play," Firor said. "Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make."

Firor was adamant that this was the right move for the game. "The Elder Scrolls Online was designed and developed to be a premium experience: hundreds of hours of gameplay, tons of depth and features, professional customer support -- and a commitment to have ongoing content at regular intervals after launch.

This type of experience is best paired with a one-time fee per month, as opposed to many smaller payments that would probably add up to more than $14.99/month any way."

Bethesda's Elder Scrolls Online argument

The case Bethesda (or ZeniMax) is trying to make goes like this: Free-to-play games have obnoxious paywalls and other limitations that create situations in which players who pay have better experiences than players who do not. Because of these design requirements, the only way to create an Elder Scrolls game that stays true to form is to build it as a subscription-only title.

When you're in an Elder Scrolls game, you're in a world. We don't want players to hit monetization fees when they're in the world. It's like, I go into a dungeon, if I don't have access to the dungeon is pops up a window: you don't have access to this, go buy 50 credits. We didn't want that experience. That's not an Elder Scrolls experience.

According to Firor, the studio has plans to release new content every four to six weeks, listing 15-hour Thieves Guild and Dark Brotherhood quest lines as examples of what players can expect to see.

Firor argues that only the forecastable revenue stream created by subscriptions will give the ZeniMax team the security it needs to create this type of high-quality content and keep it coming.

Source:
http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08/21/the-elder-scrolls-online-will-be-subscription-based-will-not-j/

http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/09/10/the-soapbox-the-case-against-the-elder-scrolls-onlines-subscri/

Grapdjan

And? They are a business exploring ways to make more revenue.

daktary2001

No mate not a lot of people. It's just you and a handfull of whiners. Use your energy for things that matters.

Grapdjan

doh cross referencing people, it's early!

kongkim

Yah all the better knowing whiners will leave and when they do we will still be here having fun playing what we like with alot of new people and still having fun

Grapdjan

Exactly Kong. They leave, forums go quiet, and just get full of people asking questions for a few days while they learn the game, brilliant!

Customer service get more happy about posting on the forums as they are less worried about getting forums ambushed cos some 40 year old virgin thinks they owe him personally a copy of the patch notes for something they are still working on.

We get more people to play with who are actually fun, via B2P, and more people to sell stuff to, group with, kill in pop and so on.

We get fun stuff that we can spend cash on to show those guys who sit at home on the dole playing ESO 20 hours a day the benefits of getting a job and contributing to society! it's a win win!!

Grapdjan

Overall outcome? MMOs going F2P brings Western World out of global recession as people leave their bedrooms.

ahstin2001nub18_ESO

theres a poll on the B2P transition consisting of 754 votes, of which 72% are currently against the change. 95% of those that voted are probably happily playing the game, but 72% are still not happy with the transition. yes, some are quitting and saying so. its called an emotional reaction. they are emotionally invested in a game that fit a style they preferred. now that it doesn't, they are behaving like people do- anger.

correction.... 72% dislike the change. i didn't see the "dislike - other" vote.

Grapdjan

ahstin2001nub18_ESO wrote: »

theres a poll on the B2P transition consisting of 754 votes, of which 64% are currently against the change. 95% of those that voted are probably happily playing the game, but 64% are still not happy with the transition. yes, some are quitting and saying so. its called an emotional reaction. they are emotionally invested in a game that fit a style they preferred. now that it doesn't, they are behaving like people do- anger.

65% of a 754 people who bothered to vote, out of an extremely small segment of the ESO player base are behaving like children do - anger. The rest of the population are unaware of what is being posted on the forums as they are at work/school looking forward to playing for an hour or two later, or are happily playing away totally unconcerned about any pricing changes.

Brizz

Well said OP. Keep up the great work ZOS.

ahstin2001nub18_ESO

Grapdjan wrote: »

ahstin2001nub18_ESO wrote: »

theres a poll on the B2P transition consisting of 754 votes, of which 64% are currently against the change. 95% of those that voted are probably happily playing the game, but 64% are still not happy with the transition. yes, some are quitting and saying so. its called an emotional reaction. they are emotionally invested in a game that fit a style they preferred. now that it doesn't, they are behaving like people do- anger.

65% of a 754 people who bothered to vote, out of an extremely small segment of the ESO player base are behaving like children do - anger. The rest of the population are unaware of what is being posted on the forums as they are at work/school looking forward to playing for an hour or two later, or are happily playing away totally unconcerned about any pricing changes.

i would rather be angry than apathetic. but then your word usage doesnt really indicate you are NOT angry either.... so are you the pot or the kettle?

Mangybeard

Something I often wonder, but have never said, is whether or not these people making a fuss all the time see the developers as a parental figure.

It's the only thing that makes sense. Why else get mad at a company making decisions that they feel like they need to in order to make more money? It reminds me of when I was a teenager angry at my parents for not letting me on the computer for more than 2 hours a day.

There is never a good reason to waste time stressing over a game. This game exists for the sole purpose of making money and the developers depend on it for a steady paycheck. If you don't like that, or changes made, quit and leave everyone who is enjoying themselves alone. A screenshot or a silly poll made when tensions are high are not going to change anything.

Zenimax is hardly worthy of praise (tentatively), but they aren't trying to screw with you for the hell of it.

Fruity_Ninja

Grapdjan wrote: »

DON'T PANIC! The people posting all the rage/betrayal/I quit threads on here, and voting in silly polls are the equivalent of the crazy white bearded hobo walking through your city with a board round his neck that says 'The End is Nigh'!

I called out the same thing after the champion system drama.

ZOS come out and say "30 CP are received for all account with a VR1 character". THey then go on XMas break. The babies all over the interwebz begin to cry, and begin to 'unsub'.

ZOS come back from XMas break, they then come out and say "you know what, you guys are right- here is a good compromise to help distinguish players on the time spent in game".

As a company they listen to feedback and make changes. Sometimes being constructive and mature about a topic is going to go a long way to helping ZOS continually improve their game. There is always going to be things that each individual player either agrees with or disagrees with. YOu have a right to give feedback in a constructive way, and ZOS has to weigh up all options and make decisions based on this. You will never be 100% pleased with everything, but that is life. You won't always get your way. Deal with it.

The best bit about this, you don't even need a sub to play now. Go ahead and cancel it. Your threats of cancelling your sub are idle and carry no weight at all anymore, ZOS will still let you enjoy the wonderful world of Tamriel.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]

Mjollnir_NL

It is B2P :-)

Now i can get my gf to play it. She does not like the play a monthly fee. But she does like to Buy to play.

Exstazik

Mjollnir_NL wrote: »

It is B2P :-)

Now i can get my gf to play it. She does not like the play a monthly fee. But she does like to Buy to play.

So you will need to buy

• Imperial City
• House system
• Spellcrafting
• Each new zones
• Thief guild

each something like x2 monthly fee.....so don't take your gf to TESO
and also mimimi dresses *

Fruity_Ninja

Exstazik wrote: »

Mjollnir_NL wrote: »

It is B2P :-)

Now i can get my gf to play it. She does not like the play a monthly fee. But she does like to Buy to play.

So you will need to buy

• Imperial City
• House system
• Spellcrafting
• Each new zones
• Thief guild

each something like x2 monthly fee.....so don't take your gf to TESO
and also mimimi dresses *

Or you can just stay subbed and then you get everything at all times, meaning it is no different to how it is now?

Pretty easy to understand.

Either way his GF gets access to a LOT of content.

WraithAzraiel

I R SUPRSTAR! YAY!

EQOAnostalgia

This pretty much nailed it lol. I've seen this DOZENS of times ranging all the way back to EVERQUEST!!!! Always there are a few vocal naysayers. Even on forums for games that don't even exist yet lol. It's pretty sad really, most of them are on constantly and are extremely toxic. I think this model will do well. B2P doesn't bother me F2P does.

Yasha

Grapdjan wrote: »

A sad feature of MMOs is that forums are usually populated by a small fraction of players, and this minority are usually extremely vocal and contribute the largest part of a games forum community.

Usually there are within that group an even smaller fraction of prolific posters, gaining a small level of 'superstardom' among the rest. Attributed to these people is a sort of clairvoyance as they read situations that develop in the games unfolding story such as nerfs, content drops or changing game mechanics. This group also believes themselves to be more important and possibly having a special relationship with the games development team as obviously due to the size of their input they have most direct replies from development or customer service reps.

If there is a perceived threat or issue facing the game and it is something they do not like - i.e. content drops not happening fast enough, patch notes being delayed, changes in payment options or simply not feeling like they are being told what they want to know, this group will turn venomously and throw a tantrum until they either quit, or manage to reconcile the changes with their addiction and carry on playing until the next major upset.

When you have an announcement like this B2P one which, without any empirical evidence, is immediately denounced as 'the death of X game' then the forums usually erupt with the same 200 - 400 players spamming and filling said forums with Chicken Little like cries of impending doom. Along with spurious weighted polls and screenshots of 'X game has been uninstalled'.

This can be damaging to the game if you have any potential new players coming along to visit the forums in the wake of said new announcements, so I'd like to say to anyone reading -

DON'T PANIC! The people posting all the rage/betrayal/I quit threads on here, and voting in silly polls are the equivalent of the crazy white bearded hobo walking through your city with a board round his neck that says 'The End is Nigh'!

The other 95% of people are happily enjoying the game and are not even registered to post on the forums as they don't feel the need.

That was one of the best posts I have ever read, kudos.

ESOLover

Bravo OP... I have found myself spending way too much time this morning reading posts rather then playing and am in complete agreement with you.... I am closing down the website and heading back to the game... where I have and will continue to love the game. Doubt I will come back here to forums for awhile, but you are correct... more ppl are excited about the changes then those who are here raging..... if you are leaving the game.....good bye. Best of luck to you.

Valencer

Brilliant post. Let's make fun of the people being genuinely concerned about the game's future.

We've got a similar thing going on with other MMOs like SWTOR and LOTRO and there's plenty of horror stories of those games. But no, this time it'll be different.

Nikolas

It was a vocal minority in German that were saying NO to ***, minority does not mean you are wrong...
It was a vocal minority that were saying NO the time people thought the earth was flat, minority does not mean you are wrong...

Actually, if there is one lesson that History teach us is that majority is usually wrong! Have fun on your Elder Store Online game. Happy Bargains on your crown store...

Grapdjan

Nikolas wrote: »

It was a vocal minority in German that were saying NO to ***, minority does not mean you are wrong...
It was a vocal minority that were saying NO the time people thought the earth was flat, minority does not mean you are wrong...

Actually, if there is one lesson that History teach us is that majority is usually wrong! Have fun on your Elder Store Online game. Happy Bargains on your crown store...

As if you really made this comparison.

Thank you you have illustrated my point brilliantly.

SantieClaws

If someone sticks a knife in your back it hurts and you scream. As a community we are hurting and being vocal about the knife that was stuck in our collective back yesterday.

Grapdjan

wenxue2222b16_ESO wrote: »

If someone sticks a knife in your back it hurts and you scream. As a community we are hurting and being vocal about the knife that was stuck in our collective back yesterday.

And thank you sir for beautifully adding validation to my OP.

If you really want to compare moving to a more sensible and workable price plan to being assaulted/murdered then you are over reacting.

Also, I like these changes, and am far from being alone.

SantieClaws

I think you misunderstand the well known phrase "backstabbing". The common use in these times is not one of having been literally murdered with a knife between the shoulder blades. It is generally understood to mean someone setting up something really bad you were unaware of that then affects you in a way that is far from positive.

It is in that sense I used the words "knife in the back".

Edit: Also I'm no sir!

KleanZlate

Thank you OP for managing to put into words what I've been thinking about the mentality of these forums. And to any new players, there are a lot of us who just want to enjoy a good game. Cheers.

*Edited to correct a typo

e.chiesa73b16_ESO

I'm looking forward to these changes: more people to play with can't be a bad thing.

I just don't want that eso's world becomes an extravagant mounts festival with packs lottery

sorry for my bad english