Invulnerability exploit.

Ezareth · September 2014

Lionxoft wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Kind of surprised that people are just now catching this. It's been a known issue for quite a while. Harness magicka + veil of blades is a more common one though.

A lot of other games put safeguards in place for this kind of stacking.

This isn't a Harness Magicka exploit, or a stacking issue. If people are invulnerable to magick damage while in mistform with harness magicka up, or while under veil of blades no big deal.

This is an issue with players receiving absurd mitigation at all times.

It's not an exploit. If it's considered an exploit then stacking of all mitigation types and shield types is considered an exploit. In the end, it's really just bad game design. There should be a cap to max damage mitigation. It's just logical.

As another commenter stated. He could be clipping out of the mist form. If that's considered an exploit then all animation cancelling is as well.

@Lionxoft, I think you need to read through this entire thread before continuing to comment.

I'm not a big fan of "Creative use of game mechanics" but those aren't exploits. This player is permanently receiving an excessive amount of mitigation with no mitigation abilities active. No shields, no mistform visible yet he is taking 68.5% less damage.

Now I know through another of my threads that there's supposedly an actual *hack* that will give you maximum speed. It wouldn't surprise me if there is something similar to make the server client think you're in mistform, or undeath or something else.

I've fought the best players in the game who know this game inside out and have no problem using creative game mechanics and nothing they do even comes close to these players.

If you haven't check out my youtube channel linked in my signature.

Columba · September 2014

Lionxoft wrote: »

Columba wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Kind of surprised that people are just now catching this. It's been a known issue for quite a while. Harness magicka + veil of blades is a more common one though.

A lot of other games put safeguards in place for this kind of stacking.

This isn't a Harness Magicka exploit, or a stacking issue. If people are invulnerable to magick damage while in mistform with harness magicka up, or while under veil of blades no big deal.

This is an issue with players receiving absurd mitigation at all times.

It's not an exploit. If it's considered an exploit then stacking of all mitigation types and shield types is considered an exploit. In the end, it's really just bad game design. There should be a cap to max damage mitigation. It's just logical.

As another commenter stated. He could be clipping out of the mist form. If that's considered an exploit then all animation cancelling is as well.

yes it IS an exploit. Don't defend cheating. I don't think anyone believes that perma invulnarability god mode is intended.

Which would mean that it's poor game design. Do you believe that stacking harness magicka and veil of blades to solo parts of 12 man content (Other parts using different mechanics) is a good game design? Sure, if it's egregious then blame the players. This is ZOS' mistake though especially after it's been a known issue for months.

I won't defend exploits and I won't defend poor game design. I'd like to point out both because they harm the spirit of the game but at the same time it's not really our place to decide what is an exploit and what isn't. I have to remind myself of that constantly since I often fail at it.

wrong. it's proven that it's a deliberate mis use of the game to achieve something never intended. It's an exploit. those who do this deserve permabanning.

JLB · September 2014

Back to the video, I'm still wondering why whenever he uses Mist Form for the whole duration before getting killed (he uses it before, but clips out), he loses the all the mitigation he had before.
And also why he seems to have a higher mitigation when he's on full Health.The less Health he has (apparently) the more damage he takes.
But surely all his exploit goes to the gutter when he fully uses Mist Form.

Lionxoft · September 2014

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

Lionxoft wrote: »

Kind of surprised that people are just now catching this. It's been a known issue for quite a while. Harness magicka + veil of blades is a more common one though.

A lot of other games put safeguards in place for this kind of stacking.

This isn't a Harness Magicka exploit, or a stacking issue. If people are invulnerable to magick damage while in mistform with harness magicka up, or while under veil of blades no big deal.

This is an issue with players receiving absurd mitigation at all times.

It's not an exploit. If it's considered an exploit then stacking of all mitigation types and shield types is considered an exploit. In the end, it's really just bad game design. There should be a cap to max damage mitigation. It's just logical.

As another commenter stated. He could be clipping out of the mist form. If that's considered an exploit then all animation cancelling is as well.

@Lionxoft, I think you need to read through this entire thread before continuing to comment.

I'm not a big fan of "Creative use of game mechanics" but those aren't exploits. This player is permanently receiving an excessive amount of mitigation with no mitigation abilities active. No shields, no mistform visible yet he is taking 68.5% less damage.

Now I know through another of my threads that there's supposedly an actual *hack* that will give you maximum speed. It wouldn't surprise me if there is something similar to make the server client think you're in mistform, or undeath or something else.

I've fought the best players in the game who know this game inside out and have no problem using creative game mechanics and nothing they do even comes close to these players.

If you haven't check out my youtube channel linked in my signature.

Not having a cap on max mitigation is poor game design. I stated that before.

Send in a report and let ZOS condemn and sentence to the stocks. You have no power to change things and they obviously aren't acknowledging you here.

JLB · September 2014

@Lionxoft‌
As others have mentioned, this is not poor game design. This is an exploit. You can't achieve a permanent 70%-80% mitigation using any mechanic/set/skill combination in game.
You can only achieve a maximum of permanent 11% mitigation to players damage, coming from a Race passive and a PvP set bonus.
The permanent mitigation we are talking about is way above 11%.

Lionxoft · September 2014

JLB wrote: »

@Lionxoft‌
As others have mentioned, this is not poor game design. This is an exploit. You can't achieve a permanent 70%-80% mitigation using any mechanic/set/skill combination in game.
You can only achieve a maximum of permanent 11% mitigation to players damage, coming from a Race passive and a PvP set bonus.
The permanent mitigation we are talking about is way above 11%.

Well, it's possible to maintain over 11% (116% to be exact) at a sustained rate but innately (without abilities active or used) it's not possible afaik.

Cody · September 2014

it does not matter if its cheating or not. it ruins the spirit of the game, and is a cheap, and I dare say, lazy way to get to the top. If ZOS considers crap like this "very skilled" I don't know if I trust the current devs to be fixing PvP.

Rylana · September 2014

Blazing spear works really good on this [snip]. He cant use his exploit when he is permastunned.

Edit to add, we actually killed that whole squad of four of them about six times each (except the sorc that kept blinking away, but its okay, the exploit counter has been found. spam the living hell out of them with blazing spear and it breaks their rotation)

He seemed immortal up until i stunlocked his fail.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

Tintinabula · September 2014

Is that the same blazing spear exploit that keeps you perma knelt and stunned? lol

Rylana · September 2014

Tintinabula wrote: »

Is that the same blazing spear exploit that keeps you perma knelt and stunned? lol

if by exploit you mean just hitting it repeatedly on the same kneeling guy, sure?

1 left click 1 left click 1 left click, our friend either dies at my feet or he runs like a screaming coward. either way, he is not immortal by any stretch to my templar. if anything he would be an easy kill if he didnt run. he obviously is a straight magicka build as well, as he was only able to break free of the stunlock one time, and then he was down for good until he decided to give up and streak away (which is another can of worms, streaking while stunned, but i digress), it prevented his damage mitigation/shield hax. Good enough for me.

He got away with about 200 health, so much for being unkillable. Next time I see him he is probably dead, I discovered the counter with half magicka, imagine a full bar of that.

I should probably add that during this whole engagement he did a grand total of 250 damage to me which i healed through with one button press. He is nothing. Templars, you have your tool, go get this [snip] and show him what happens when you exploit in our game.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Naming & Shaming]

Cody · September 2014

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

I'm getting closer @ezareth_ESO‌!

Fresh off some testing and I just discovered that mistform damage mitigation stacks with Annulment and gives a total 125% spell dmg mitigation.

I stacked Annulement on top of Hardened Ward and then started spamming mistform in front of a hostile necromancer who was throwing these blue orbs at me. 0 damage registered on my shield by CLS and TFC.

Initially I tested it against a pyromancer and I was getting damage, so I was disheartened. However I realised that being a vampire I take 50% more damage from fire. That must be subtracted somehow from 125% as I was taking damage even though it was very small.

Tested against non-fire spells, mistform and annulment send the dmg to 0 value, which would explain why that Templar was taking no damage from Endless Fury or CF. Now I need to test how undeath stacks with that. Damn so many tests to do.

However, another important thing to mention, animation cancelling mistform does not have any effects on me. I tried cancelling it with block, double-alt and double-esc and while the TFC timer for the skill is still on, the dmg is on normal levels as if effect has expired on me.

I'm certain now it's mistform that's the root of the problem. I haven't figured out how they bug it yet, but I will test all possibilities and I will find it.

EDIT : MORE RESULTS
Undeath stacks with mistform mitigation and pushes total mitigation to 108%. It's very very flaky in PvP probably due to lag and the fact the damage is calculated on the attackers client rather than the server.

I dropped my health to ~10% via spell symmetry and in mistform I was taking no physical or magical damage (except fire) from anything around me. When I activated annulement and went into mistform (still at 10% hp) I also stopped taking fire damage. Seems the numbers are simply added together
-75% (mist) - 50% (annul) - 33% (undeath) + 50% (fire) = - 108% = 0 dmg from fire!

Basically if you manage to bug mist form somehow and you stack your shields, you turn into an immortal, motheflipping tyrannosaurus rex with gorilla hands.

shouldn't ZOS be doing all this testing?

Ezareth · September 2014

Cody wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

I'm getting closer @ezareth_ESO‌!

Fresh off some testing and I just discovered that mistform damage mitigation stacks with Annulment and gives a total 125% spell dmg mitigation.

I stacked Annulement on top of Hardened Ward and then started spamming mistform in front of a hostile necromancer who was throwing these blue orbs at me. 0 damage registered on my shield by CLS and TFC.

Initially I tested it against a pyromancer and I was getting damage, so I was disheartened. However I realised that being a vampire I take 50% more damage from fire. That must be subtracted somehow from 125% as I was taking damage even though it was very small.

Tested against non-fire spells, mistform and annulment send the dmg to 0 value, which would explain why that Templar was taking no damage from Endless Fury or CF. Now I need to test how undeath stacks with that. Damn so many tests to do.

However, another important thing to mention, animation cancelling mistform does not have any effects on me. I tried cancelling it with block, double-alt and double-esc and while the TFC timer for the skill is still on, the dmg is on normal levels as if effect has expired on me.

I'm certain now it's mistform that's the root of the problem. I haven't figured out how they bug it yet, but I will test all possibilities and I will find it.

EDIT : MORE RESULTS
Undeath stacks with mistform mitigation and pushes total mitigation to 108%. It's very very flaky in PvP probably due to lag and the fact the damage is calculated on the attackers client rather than the server.

I dropped my health to ~10% via spell symmetry and in mistform I was taking no physical or magical damage (except fire) from anything around me. When I activated annulement and went into mistform (still at 10% hp) I also stopped taking fire damage. Seems the numbers are simply added together
-75% (mist) - 50% (annul) - 33% (undeath) + 50% (fire) = - 108% = 0 dmg from fire!

Basically if you manage to bug mist form somehow and you stack your shields, you turn into an immortal, motheflipping tyrannosaurus rex with gorilla hands.

shouldn't ZOS be doing all this testing?

They should, but instead the person using this exploit is mocking us in this very thread because he knows that ZoS is useless and he can get away with whatever he wants.

JLB · September 2014

Cody wrote: »

shouldn't ZOS be doing all this testing?

I think it's fun and entertaining nonetheless.

Erock25 · September 2014

I saw a lot of this crap from people mentioned multiple times in this thread yesterday. ZOS really has to do something soon.

Maulkin · September 2014

I've tried many things but I've failed to replicate the 60%-70% constant mitigation so far.

Are all the exploiters you've come across from the EP faction? I'm only asking because there's another source of mitigation which I did not consider and that is 6% damage reduction from Nord passive. Could it be that something bugs out with that?

I'm running out of ideas

dcincali · September 2014

Erock25 wrote: »

I saw a lot of this crap from people mentioned multiple times in this thread yesterday. ZOS really has to do something soon.

The more a person is reported, the higher they are on the "threat system" so to speak. So, every time the exploiters encounter your group, I would have every group member stop after the fight and report them. If the exploiter gets 50 reports in a day, something is more likely to be done instead of 50 in a week.

Jaxom · September 2014

These exploits has seriously pulled the winds out of my sails. I'm coming across this more and more over the weekend. It's gotten to the point where I am now unsubbed. I have 27 days left of subscription. I'll continue playing for the time being, but unless ZOS can prove to the playerbase, they are serious about exploits and punishment, I can no longer support them. It's sad as the game for the most part has been enjoyable.

Shame on you ZOS. We have all dealt with the myriad of problems from patch to patch but the consistent incompetency on them breaking their game, not fixing their game for long periods of time, and letting cheaters run rampant has effectively killed my desire to play. They don't deserve my money.

Bezilar · September 2014

ZOS,

Please inspect my account, monitor my routines, look at my combinations and especially my emergency low health tactics and confirm to these players I am not using any tricks, macros, exploits, misting, or whatever else pops in their heads. I am being accused of exploiting, fast hacking, seeing people in stealth, going through walls, and probably being the leader of ISIS next.

Blinxey is my 4th vet toon and I thought it would be fun to try and level in pvp only. I did very few quests except collecting shards, the rest in Cyrodill. Rank 10 to vet 10 in pvp is a long road. I have some very common abilities and some neat tricks utilizing pure game mechanics for survivability. Other than that I don’t know what else to tell you, except you better keep the forward camp up.

Blinx---->ey

Braidas · September 2014

c.gregoryb14_ESO wrote: »

ZOS,

Please inspect my account, monitor my routines, look at my combinations and especially my emergency low health tactics and confirm to these players I am not using any tricks, macros, exploits, misting, or whatever else pops in their heads. I am being accused of exploiting, fast hacking, seeing people in stealth, going through walls, and probably being the leader of ISIS next.

Blinxey is my 4th vet toon and I thought it would be fun to try and level in pvp only. I did very few quests except collecting shards, the rest in Cyrodill. Rank 10 to vet 10 in pvp is a long road. I have some very common abilities and some neat tricks utilizing pure game mechanics for survivability. Other than that I don’t know what else to tell you, except you better keep the forward camp up.

Blinx---->ey

well if tht's it then who givs a ***, guy couldnt kill a lvl 10 w/ 100 hp so who cares if it takes a team of 5 to kill him

æxæ · September 2014

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

[
This is an issue with players receiving absurd mitigation at all times.

Watching your video with that guy it seems to me you're very butthurt following him for minutes! (kinda psycho) and you getting killed in the end by 3 attacks.

The guy was just trying to escape and didn't even attack you, i reckon he must have thought " i need all my magicka/stamina" to escape.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]

Dleatherus · September 2014

c.gregoryb14_ESO wrote: »

ZOS,

Please inspect my account, monitor my routines, look at my combinations and especially my emergency low health tactics and confirm to these players I am not using any tricks, macros, exploits, misting, or whatever else pops in their heads. I am being accused of exploiting, fast hacking, seeing people in stealth, going through walls, and probably being the leader of ISIS next.

Blinxey is my 4th vet toon and I thought it would be fun to try and level in pvp only. I did very few quests except collecting shards, the rest in Cyrodill. Rank 10 to vet 10 in pvp is a long road. I have some very common abilities and some neat tricks utilizing pure game mechanics for survivability. Other than that I don’t know what else to tell you, except you better keep the forward camp up.

Blinx---->ey

emperor farming, dk chain pulling 'friendly' enemies up onto keep walls to ninja cap keeps, siege weapon limit 'tactics', ninja capping scrolls with gates closed etc etc all used 'common abilities and some neat tricks utilizing pure game mechanics'

make of that what you want - the lack of response from ZOS leaves the rest of us guessing as to whether when you are down to 2% health, stunned and helpless on the ground, and hit by eight people for a combined 4k 'original' damage, and you regain health to 20%-30% is intended or not

never seen anybody accuse you of fast hacking, seeing people in stealth, going through walls, or belonging to any terrorist organization - perhaps those are in other threads since i don't read them all

D.

Harnesh · September 2014

æxæ wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

[
This is an issue with players receiving absurd mitigation at all times.

Watching your video with that guy it seems to me you're very butthurt following him for minutes! (kinda psycho) and you getting killed in the end by 3 attacks.

The guy was just trying to escape and didn't even attack you, i reckon he must have thought " i need all my magicka/stamina" to escape.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

You should probably get up to speed on a thread before you post. He followed him to do nothing more than document what was going on, this players name had already come up in other post, threads and videos . Zenimax kindly removed most of those due to their name and shame policy.

æxæ · September 2014

Which seems to be a good policy since you guys have nothing better to do than "document" what YOU personally consider a cheater. This is not your responsibility buddy. Thanks, I am already disgusted reading one thread related to this matter.

Ezareth · September 2014

æxæ wrote: »

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

[
This is an issue with players receiving absurd mitigation at all times.

Watching your video with that guy it seems to me you're very butthurt following him for minutes! (kinda psycho) and you getting killed in the end by 3 attacks.

The guy was just trying to escape and didn't even attack you, i reckon he must have thought " i need all my magicka/stamina" to escape.

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

I was following him to record the damage done to him, do you think I cared that I died in the end? I've killed him plenty of times, it's not a big deal but the effort required to kill him isn't worth the payoff and more importantly since he has been sharing this exploit more and more players he runs with have been abusing it.

Did you watch the video of the V4 templar that he taught this trick to? Did you notice the VR3 sorc who isn't even aware of me in the first clip of the first video who also is using the exploit and took reduced damage? I know of a fourth player who knows the exploit and has used it as well.

Yet despite what the player says he is exploiting game mechanics in a fashion that is obviously unintended. A virtually permanent -68+% mitigation ability that gives you invulnerability to spells with harness magicka and no other drawbacks is obviously exploiting game mechanics, no different than using Caltrops to mitigate siege damage and player AOE was an exploit.

I lost half of my guild to that exploit so you can sit here and try to defend something you have zero knowledge about, but it is things like these that have slowly but surely been killing this game.

So yes I'll do everything in my power to get this exploit and any other exploit I see fixed through any means necessary.

Srugzal · September 2014

ezareth_ESO wrote: »

There is a Vampire Mistform exploit that many people are using. I have video of 4 people (all on EP on Thornblade) who are definitely exploiting it. One is a VR4 Templar, A VR8 Sorc, A VR3 Sorc, and a VR12 Sorc.

It's only going to get worse and instead of acknowledging this exploit and saying they're aware of an working on it they closed the thread for "Naming and shaming".

Why are you claiming a right to name and shame, something that is clearly against the TOS you accepted? If you have a grievance against some players whom you allege are using exploits, this is not the place. Open a help ticket, and send them your video. Use /report in-game, even better.

Don't drag ZOS in the mud because you have to follow the same rules everyone else does. And by the way, complaining about how moderation is treating you is a great way to get your posts deleted.

æxæ · September 2014

Yea, I have zero knowledge of wasting my time shaming people in a public forum or even youtube. Don't you get it that this might be your imagination of the truth? I'd die laughing if he didn't have a clue half the time what he was doing and it turns out to be his routine causing that exploit. You'd look like an [snip]. What you're saying he is purposely using that exploit which you cannot prove even with that neat documented video of yours.
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Flaming]

Harnesh · September 2014

æxæ wrote: »

Which seems to be a good policy since you guys have nothing better to do than "document" what YOU personally consider a cheater. This is not your responsibility buddy. Thanks, I am already disgusted reading one thread related to this matter.

Ahh so the players shouldn't try to document any abilities that may be broken with game....err ok guess I got confused with the whole player feedback thing PTS and all that but now I know you've defiantly set me straight thank you.

Of course now that were" buddies" I expect more love from you cause to be real honest i just wasn't feeling it in that last post so come on over and give me a hug.

Erock25 · September 2014

Haha looks like someone sent his friends in here to try and stick up for him. Pathetic.

æxæ · September 2014

You're welcome, buddy. Now ask ZOS nicely to remove this thread and use the in-game feature to report players you feel are cheating and I might consider a hug.

æxæ · September 2014

Erock25 wrote: »

Haha looks like someone sent his friends in here to try and stick up for him. Pathetic.

No, I'm sticking up for him w/o knowing who he is because you guys are shaming him in a public thread. I didn't even know who he was until i saw that video. For your info, Mr. Erock, I play on Thornblade EU, before that Thornblade EU, before that 2 times Auriel's Bow EU. I own 2 Chars that both play in the same faction on the same EU server.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Flaming]