Class action lawsuit

Slash8915 · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Ah, but he is able to play the game. So he IS getting what he "paid for". He might not like it as much as he thought he would... But he's able to play a game, and that's what he technically paid for.

necrolineage · June 2014

Hey guys just unsubscribe in masses. When Zenimax loose all their players maybe they gonna do something right !

It's just a buton to push and you have still the time you already payed for but that give a good warning to those incompetents devs and game directors.

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Yes, but in those cases, they have to prove they didn't get the service they paid for, not that their werewolf isn't as fun to play as they had hoped.

See, US courts are big on things like material evidence. And you need to be able to attach a hard value to the services/goods.

onlinegamer1 · June 2014

Slash8915 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Ah, but he is able to play the game. So he IS getting what he "paid for". He might not like it as much as he thought he would... But he's able to play a game, and that's what he technically paid for.

Actually, that is also not true. "connection to the IP address/server" is not, in fact, what we pay for. We pay for "game play". This will (and has been) argued 100% successfully in court, and its why, if each of us calls customer support individually, and ask for our refund/credit, we'll be given it, no questions asked.

Marcaeus · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

ItsMeToo · June 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Why do you keep quoting bad posts without actually writing your own comments?

To get his post count up, maybe.

BrassRazoo · June 2014

Can everyone who read this thread sue for pain and suffering?

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Slash8915 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Ah, but he is able to play the game. So he IS getting what he "paid for". He might not like it as much as he thought he would... But he's able to play a game, and that's what he technically paid for.

Actually, that is also not true. "connection to the IP address/server" is not, in fact, what we pay for. We pay for "game play". This will (and has been) argued 100% successfully in court, and its why, if each of us calls customer support individually, and ask for our refund/credit, we'll be given it, no questions asked.

You know, funnily enough, I looked up "MMO lawsuits" online after some other poster claimed that they were regular things. Do you know what I found? Nothing. Zip. Nada.

There was a single case in China where the courts paid the plaintiff for devalued virtual goods.

And no, you are not given a refund/credit when you call customer support. You're well outside the time window for a refund, and the ToS are very clear about what you're entitled to when you pay your subscription fees. You are entitled to access to the servers. You are not entitled to be satisfied with the gameplay. That's a risk you take when you decide to buy a game.

onlinegamer1 · June 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Slash8915 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Ah, but he is able to play the game. So he IS getting what he "paid for". He might not like it as much as he thought he would... But he's able to play a game, and that's what he technically paid for.

Actually, that is also not true. "connection to the IP address/server" is not, in fact, what we pay for. We pay for "game play". This will (and has been) argued 100% successfully in court, and its why, if each of us calls customer support individually, and ask for our refund/credit, we'll be given it, no questions asked.

You know, funnily enough, I looked up "MMO lawsuits" online after some other poster claimed that they were regular things. Do you know what I found? Nothing. Zip. Nada.

There was a single case in China where the courts paid the plaintiff for devalued virtual goods.

And no, you are not given a refund/credit when you call customer support. You're well outside the time window for a refund, and the ToS are very clear about what you're entitled to when you pay your subscription fees. You are entitled to access to the servers. You are not entitled to be satisfied with the gameplay. That's a risk you take when you decide to buy a game.

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

UrQuan · June 2014

ItsMeToo wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Why do you keep quoting bad posts without actually writing your own comments?

To get his post count up, maybe.

Most likely. Either that or he just doesn't have any thoughts or opinions of his own, so he has to regurgitate those of others.

I'm pretty sure quoting a whole bunch of posts without adding anything is probably considered spam, though, so I wouldn't be surprised if he gets reported and banned for it.

ShedsHisTail · June 2014

Malpherian wrote: »

Actually Blizzard entertainment loses Class Action Lawsuits all the time, IN fact many of the ones they attempt to do on Private servers end up back firing on them, with the judge ruling they are to pay the defendant. They just have so much money they don't care.

There are several reasons why ESO "could" (and that's really the key word there), suffer a Class action lawsuit, one is False advertisement of the Product, this applies when the advertised product does not provide the promised service. Which ZOS has in droves currently.

You can also apply this to things such as the Daedric Armor, which is visually advertised in many of their Cinematic trailers, and while this normally would not be an issue that specific armor set is a huge part of the lore for TES games therefore the appearance of that set in the cinematic "Combined" with the ability to craft the set in game AND it's similarity to previous TES games looks, is an obvious advertisement of the armor set.

Yet in game it appears as the "Shredder Costume". (and it actually is 95% an exact copy of the Teenage Mutant ninja turtles Shredder outfit) Which can be viewed as copyright trademark infringement.

Just to name a few.

There are about 30 reasons I can name off the top of my head for why a legitimate class action suit against ZOS could be made, most would not be won of course, but a few would.

I want all 30.

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Slash8915 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Ah, but he is able to play the game. So he IS getting what he "paid for". He might not like it as much as he thought he would... But he's able to play a game, and that's what he technically paid for.

Actually, that is also not true. "connection to the IP address/server" is not, in fact, what we pay for. We pay for "game play". This will (and has been) argued 100% successfully in court, and its why, if each of us calls customer support individually, and ask for our refund/credit, we'll be given it, no questions asked.

You know, funnily enough, I looked up "MMO lawsuits" online after some other poster claimed that they were regular things. Do you know what I found? Nothing. Zip. Nada.

There was a single case in China where the courts paid the plaintiff for devalued virtual goods.

And no, you are not given a refund/credit when you call customer support. You're well outside the time window for a refund, and the ToS are very clear about what you're entitled to when you pay your subscription fees. You are entitled to access to the servers. You are not entitled to be satisfied with the gameplay. That's a risk you take when you decide to buy a game.

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

Feel free to show me where Connecticut state law says that if you don't like a game that you paid for, you're entitled to your money back months after the fact. Especially a game that carries warnings about changing content over time.

Slash8915 · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

Let's assume you are correct. In that case, unless everyone lives in Connecticut, they can't sue. Hence why a CLASS ACTION LAWSUIT is pointless.

DenverRalphy · June 2014

Laughable at best. You may not be enjoying your game play, you may not like the design. But you can't claim that the game is unplayable. Only that you don't care for it. Good luck in filing a suit.

It always amazes me how often the term "class action" is tossed around. Especially given that very few are ever filed, and out of those that are, very few actually get anywhere (in the gaming industry anyway).

Any thread that has "class action" in the title is usually just as ignorant as threads with "open letter".

MonkeyAssassin24 · June 2014

Marcaeus wrote: »

Lots of forum posts. Perhaps players can't play the game, so they're on here white knighting it. I don't know about everyone else, but I don't see how they can charge you money to watch a slow motion slideshow where you spend more time restarting your launcher than actually being able to do anything functional in a game.

I've never had to restart my launcher, in fact, earlier today I was able to log on during lunch and knock out a few quests, kill a world boss, AND found the AE Motif! Not exactly what I would call "unplayable". Seems to me that the people with serious technical difficulties need to figure out what is wrong with their pc and how to fix it. If CS isn't helping you much, well many companies have terrible CS which is why when it's good it's a selling point.

If you want to make the news though, please bring this to an attorney. It will look good on a montage of other great lawsuits like the "McDonald's made my kid fat", and "Hot shower water burned my genitalia" cases.

UrQuan · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

So in Connecticut if you buy a game and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund? If you pay to see a movie and you don't like it you're entitled to a refund? If you buy a book and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund?

LrdRahvin · June 2014

MonkeyAssassin24 wrote: »

Marcaeus wrote: »

Lots of forum posts. Perhaps players can't play the game, so they're on here white knighting it. I don't know about everyone else, but I don't see how they can charge you money to watch a slow motion slideshow where you spend more time restarting your launcher than actually being able to do anything functional in a game.

I've never had to restart my launcher, in fact, earlier today I was able to log on during lunch and knock out a few quests, kill a world boss, AND found the AE Motif! Not exactly what I would call "unplayable". Seems to me that the people with serious technical difficulties need to figure out what is wrong with their pc and how to fix it. If CS isn't helping you much, well many companies have terrible CS which is why when it's good it's a selling point.

If you want to make the news though, please bring this to an attorney. It will look good on a montage of other great lawsuits like the "McDonald's made my kid fat", and "Hot shower water burned my genitalia" cases.

or my personal fave- McDonalds burned my genitalia"

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

Ur-Quan wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

So in Connecticut if you buy a game and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund? If you pay to see a movie and you don't like it you're entitled to a refund? If you buy a book and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund?

No. He's just misreading the law in a way that makes it sound like he's entitled to free money.

necrolineage · June 2014

Hey guys just unsubscribe in masses. When Zenimax loose all their players maybe they gonna do something right !

It's just a buton to push and you have still the time you already payed for but that give a good warning to those incompetents devs and game directors.

Malpherian · June 2014

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Malpherian wrote: »

Actually Blizzard entertainment loses Class Action Lawsuits all the time, IN fact many of the ones they attempt to do on Private servers end up back firing on them, with the judge ruling they are to pay the defendant. They just have so much money they don't care.

There are several reasons why ESO could and thats really the key word there, suffer a Class action lawsuit, one is False advertisement of the Product, this applies when the advertised product does not provide the promised service. Which ZOS has in droves currently.

You can also apply this to things such as the Daedric Armor, which is visually advertised in all of their Cinematic trailers, and while this normally would not be an issue that specific armor set is a huge part of the lore for TES games therefore the appearance of that set in the cinematic, is an obvious advertisement of the armor set.

Yet in game it appears as the "Shredder Costume". (and it actually is 95% an exact copy of the Teenage Mutant ninja turtles Shredder outfit) Which can be viewed as copyright trademark infringement.

Just to name a few.

There are about 30 reasons I can name off the top of my head for why a legitimate class action suit against ZOS could be made, most would not be won of course, but a few would.

I have no idea why you would feel the need to lie about class action suits with Blizzard, but just to educate any poor saps who might believe you:

Blizzard sued a bot-developer and won. They won $7,000,000. That's the only suit regarding WoW that Blizzard has ever been involved in.

Wrong I used to Own and Admin a private server Blizzard tried to sue us 5 times, they lost every single suit.

In addition I was a Coadmin of another Server which sued Blizzard for stealing their custom UI addons in Wrath. Guess what? Blizzard Lost, but an agreement was reached between the servers owners and blizzard that blizzard would keep the addons (since they were already released with he expansion, and the server would get (Money) in return, Basically blizzard lost the suit and was ordered to buy the code from the Private server developers.

So yea. One of the things you may not realize is that blizzard does not develop their own game improvements or bug fixes for the most part, they steal them, and then settle out of court for ownership of them, or flat out buy them from private server developers, or flat out steal them and then attempt to sue the private servers they stole them from, for using them.

They also attempted to sue a guy selling a WoW leveling guide on Ebay. They lost it had to pay him, and he set up his own website with which to sell his guides from with the suit money.

Activission/Blizzard is a very very nasty cut throat company.

Cudda · June 2014

As you can see, the United States of America is full of dumb asses. This is why all other countries would like to spit in your face and tell you to stfu. You think you have common sense to have a lawsuit, yet you lack the common sense to quit playing a game. BF4 had issues for much longer than ESO. It was ACTUALLY unplayable. I believe there was a "Class action lawsuit" attempted there too. I think EA said something along the lines of "lol dumb ***" then continued accepting money in the masses as people still bought the game.

Dayel · June 2014

I did get a J.D. and yes I am laughing.

onlinegamer1 · June 2014

Ur-Quan wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

So in Connecticut if you buy a game and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund? If you pay to see a movie and you don't like it you're entitled to a refund? If you buy a book and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund?

Nope, none of that.

In the state of Connecticut, if you pay for a service, and the service is not delivered, you are entitled to a refund. If partial service is delivered, you are entitled to a partial refund.

The law also states that I get to file what I consider "the service" and the company has to send a lawyer (at $200/hr) to defend their position in court.

Or, you know, they can credit my account $7.50.... up to them.

Slash8915 · June 2014

necrolineage wrote: »

Hey guys just unsubscribe in masses. When Zenimax loose all their players maybe they gonna do something right !

It's just a buton to push and you have still the time you already payed for but that give a good warning to those incompetents devs and game directors.

Why are you repeating what you already said?

nerevarine1138 · June 2014

Malpherian wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

Malpherian wrote: »

Actually Blizzard entertainment loses Class Action Lawsuits all the time, IN fact many of the ones they attempt to do on Private servers end up back firing on them, with the judge ruling they are to pay the defendant. They just have so much money they don't care.

There are several reasons why ESO could and thats really the key word there, suffer a Class action lawsuit, one is False advertisement of the Product, this applies when the advertised product does not provide the promised service. Which ZOS has in droves currently.

You can also apply this to things such as the Daedric Armor, which is visually advertised in all of their Cinematic trailers, and while this normally would not be an issue that specific armor set is a huge part of the lore for TES games therefore the appearance of that set in the cinematic, is an obvious advertisement of the armor set.

Yet in game it appears as the "Shredder Costume". (and it actually is 95% an exact copy of the Teenage Mutant ninja turtles Shredder outfit) Which can be viewed as copyright trademark infringement.

Just to name a few.

There are about 30 reasons I can name off the top of my head for why a legitimate class action suit against ZOS could be made, most would not be won of course, but a few would.

I have no idea why you would feel the need to lie about class action suits with Blizzard, but just to educate any poor saps who might believe you:

Blizzard sued a bot-developer and won. They won $7,000,000. That's the only suit regarding WoW that Blizzard has ever been involved in.

Wrong I used to Own and Admin a private server Blizzard tried to sue us 5 times, they lost every single suit.

In addition I was a Coadmin of another Server which sued Blizzard for stealing their custom UI addons in Wrath. Guess what? Blizzard Lost, but an agreement was reached between the servers owners and blizzard that blizzard would keep the addons (since they were already released with he expansion, and the server would get (Money) in return, Basically blizzard lost the suit and was ordered to buy the code from the Private server developers.

So yea. One of the things you may not realize is that blizzard does not develop their own game improvements or bug fixes for the most part, they steal them, and then settle out of court for ownership of them, or flat out buy them from private server developers, or flat out steal them and then attempt to sue the private servers they stole them from, for using them.

They also attempted to sue a guy selling a WoW leveling guide on Ebay. They lost it had to pay him, and he set up his own website with which to sell his guides from with the suit money.

Activission/Blizzard is a very very nasty cut throat company.

And the newspapers just missed out on this story about a gaming behemoth repeatedly losing a lawsuit?

You've just told us all that you ran a private server. That makes you a cheater, hacker, liar, etc. But by all means, we should totally believe you about these non-existent lawsuits where you got all kinds of money from Blizzard. That totally happened.

DenverRalphy · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

nerevarine1138 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Slash8915 wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

christopher.pesapaneub17_ESO wrote: »

As someone who actually graduated law school this thread is pretty laughable. I won't go into all the small details but most importantly you need to show damages that a lawsuit of any kind is supposed to remedy. I don't see how your unhappiness with a product you purchased constitutes damages.

Perhaps you should go back to law school and study up on "consumer protection law" a bit more. When people do not get a service they paid for, they get a refund or sue in small claims court for one.

Ah, but he is able to play the game. So he IS getting what he "paid for". He might not like it as much as he thought he would... But he's able to play a game, and that's what he technically paid for.

Actually, that is also not true. "connection to the IP address/server" is not, in fact, what we pay for. We pay for "game play". This will (and has been) argued 100% successfully in court, and its why, if each of us calls customer support individually, and ask for our refund/credit, we'll be given it, no questions asked.

You know, funnily enough, I looked up "MMO lawsuits" online after some other poster claimed that they were regular things. Do you know what I found? Nothing. Zip. Nada.

There was a single case in China where the courts paid the plaintiff for devalued virtual goods.

And no, you are not given a refund/credit when you call customer support. You're well outside the time window for a refund, and the ToS are very clear about what you're entitled to when you pay your subscription fees. You are entitled to access to the servers. You are not entitled to be satisfied with the gameplay. That's a risk you take when you decide to buy a game.

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

Please enlighten us and quote a specific Connecticut statute pertinent.

Cudda · June 2014

Also, if you actually bought the game from ZeniMax and asked for a refund (before your free 30 days ended) they would give it back. If you wanted 2/3 months to ask for your money back, then too bad for you, thats your problem bro.

Slash8915 · June 2014

Malpherian wrote: »

Wrong I used to Own and Admin a private server Blizzard tried to sue us 5 times, they lost every single suit.

In addition I was a Coadmin of another Server which sued Blizzard for stealing their custom UI addons in Wrath. Guess what? Blizzard Lost, but an agreement was reached between the servers owners and blizzard that blizzard would keep the addons (since they were already released with he expansion, and the server would get (Money) in return, Basically blizzard lost the suit and was ordered to buy the code from the Private server developers.

Do you have any proof of this? I would be very interested in reading the case notes.

ItsMeToo · June 2014

Ur-Quan wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

So in Connecticut if you buy a game and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund? If you pay to see a movie and you don't like it you're entitled to a refund? If you buy a book and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund?

I'm moving to Connecticut.

Armianlee · June 2014

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Ur-Quan wrote: »

onlinegamer1 wrote: »

Again, false here in the state of Connecticut, your state/country's consumer protection laws may vary.

So in Connecticut if you buy a game and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund? If you pay to see a movie and you don't like it you're entitled to a refund? If you buy a book and don't enjoy it you're entitled to a refund?

Nope, none of that.

In the state of Connecticut, if you pay for a service, and the service is not delivered, you are entitled to a refund. If partial service is delivered, you are entitled to a partial refund.

The law also states that I get to file what I consider "the service" and the company has to send a lawyer (at $200/hr) to defend their position in court.

Or, you know, they can credit my account $7.50.... up to them.

You're getting the service as it is laid out to you in the ToS. TERMS OF SERVICE. You have nothing.