Grouping is the worst I've seen an any MMO in my lifetime
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Thunder✭✭✭Let us not forget the grouping problem the Megaserver solves!
In WoW to group with people goes something like this...
Player 1: "Oh you play WoW too? Killer, let's group up!"
Player 2: "OK man, I play on the server Cartoonland, let's do it."
Player 1: "Oh, darn, I play on the server Let'smakeanMMOwithCrayons. No amount of mouse clicking is ever going to allow us to play together."
Player 2: "You're absolutely right there. There's no way we will ever be able to ever play together ever because we are on completely different servers. Same thing happened with my buddy who plays on FisherPriceTown."
End Scene.
Sure, when you log in and join a party with your friend you'll most likely have to click teleport to player and wait 30 seconds, but if this were WoW you would have never even met that person in the first place.
This one time when I was playing WoW I was doing a random dungeon with these guys and the end boss bugged out and we couldn't complete. (Yep, contrary to popular belief, WoW has bugs too, and lots of 'em.) The boss had this flying unicorn that spinkled fairy dust down on you from above, or some such nonsense. We decided to try to kill the flying creature even though it had tons of health, was high up in the sky, and wasn't an objective of the dungeon. Partly for fun, partly because we thought killing it might reset the boss. So we spent the better part of an hour running around avoiding the spinkles of fair dust from the magic unicorn in the sky, and really had a lot of fun just goofing off. Eventually we got it down to no health, but it didn't even die. The moral of the story is everyone in the group got along really well together and had a lot of fun playing together so I would have liked to play with them in the future, yet every single one of us was from a different server and we never saw each other again.
True story.0 -
Tetujin✭✭✭These are fixable issues if they would prioritise them, at least in theory. They could prompt when you join a group to sync together. They could sync your quest objective completions if you are on the same quest stage, and they could give a way to let the group leader assign a member's quests to be active for the group, so that everyone stays in that person's phase and works for his/her objectives (like 'guesting'). Even better if your quests automatically sync once you catch up to a point where you are on the same objective.
I think it's important to facilitate group play as much as possible, even for what you might argue is 'solo' quest content.0 -
Kiash✭✭✭Drachenfier wrote: »Drachenfier wrote: »
You are using the group finder tool inappropriately. You can select which roles fill your group as the group leader. Getting 4 dps in a group is the group leader's fault, no one else's.
I guess so...usually I hit search, it throws me in a group and I'm never the leader. And the group, every single time, to this point, has been all dps.
Try this, set up your group (even if you are solo) as looking for more members, then select the roles you want to fill your group with. If you actually create the group, you'll have a lot more control over who gets put into your group. Should help you out quite a bit
Sometimes depending on the time of day it may take 4-5 minutes, but it will fill out, the same as any dungeon finder in other big name MMOs. Good luck out there!0 -
Drachenfier✭✭✭✭✭
✭Drachenfier wrote: »Drachenfier wrote: »
You are using the group finder tool inappropriately. You can select which roles fill your group as the group leader. Getting 4 dps in a group is the group leader's fault, no one else's.
I guess so...usually I hit search, it throws me in a group and I'm never the leader. And the group, every single time, to this point, has been all dps.
Try this, set up your group (even if you are solo) as looking for more members, then select the roles you want to fill your group with. If you actually create the group, you'll have a lot more control over who gets put into your group. Should help you out quite a bit
Sometimes depending on the time of day it may take 4-5 minutes, but it will fill out, the same as any dungeon finder in other big name MMOs. Good luck out there!
Alright, I'll try this tonight Thanks for the tip.
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As you can see Wombat, some people here will pretend glaring issues don't exist and that everything is fine. It's most ridiculous forum for any mmo ever. They make any kind of discussion impossible by pretending the game is flawless. It's totally disingenuous, obviously they are aware of the issues, they wouldn't be playing the game otherwise.
It's probably one of the reasons why the game turned out the way it did, the entire feedback process really got undermined by over zealous defenders.
But yeah, from a basic design standpoint, the game is a bit of a disaster. ESO does have the worst group pve play for any major mmo I'm aware of.
This is spot on. And not having a general forum for this kind of discussion is ridiculous.2 -
Voodoo✭✭✭✭the title of this thread is totally misleading ...obviously if you cant see players in your group there is something wrong with the one server phasing system. Not even a month old this game no doubt will have issues and hopefully once this system is fixed grouping should be back to normal.
..There is nothing wrong with grouping but there is something wrong with the phasing system.0 -
Shimond✭✭✭✭Had to laugh at "in my lifetime" considering MMOs as we know them have been around what, ~15 years? I mean that statement would have weight if you were under 20. Oh, I guess you might be.0 -
Had to laugh at "in my lifetime" considering MMOs as we know them have been around what, ~15 years? I mean that statement would have weight if you were under 20. Oh, I guess you might be.
Lol I'm glad this forum has you to play white knight in every thread. Do you ever get tired of defending this game??2 -
Elvent✭✭✭✭Agree man. Also what about forced solo dungeons/zones? Shouldn't they be optional so you can always play with your friends or should solo content continue to exist in Massively Multiplayer Online games? I think forced solo crap ruins grouping in MMOs, I don't think it should exist.
I think it should be optional, you can solo if you want or if you want to play with your friends, you can do that too, options are always a good thing.1 -
Shimond✭✭✭✭sivart400ex_ESO wrote: »Lol I'm glad this forum has you to play white knight in every thread. Do you ever get tired of defending this game??
How bizarre you took my comment to be me defending the game in some fashion.
Seeing what you want to see, I suppose.0 -
alienbongsSoul Shrivenalienbongs wrote: »I understand people like this game and want it to succeed (me too), but why are people so delusional on these forums? ESO does in fact have some major problems, and they do need to get fixed. It does have a broken grouping system currently. I refuse to believe we all haven't experienced it even once.
My first trip into a group dungeon was a confusing and frustrating rotation of players re-logging and re-entering the dungeon until we could finally all see each other, instead of floating arrows. Mind you, none of us had even started the quest at that point.
Someone posts their experience on the forums. If my experience is different, why can't I say that? I'm seeing some useful advice here and some sharing of issues. When someone complains the only acceptable response isn't just to nod your head. And if I'm having a problem someone who gives me a work-around is more helpful than someone who fist-bumps me.
You got lucky. What the hell do you want me to say? Some of us are hindered by flaws in this game, that happens to be entertaining an enthralling if you have the patience to listen to dialogue. They need to make it a consistent system. I'm a chef in real life. If people came to a restaurant and paid $100 every weekend for dishes that weren't right and didn't add up, we would be out of a job job man. They ask 15 a month and I'm happy to pay, even though I'm really busy. Fix obvious problems. All I'm saying.2 -
I've experienced an annoying bug where no one ends up being Group Leader and it's dropped by the system. This happens as the final fourth person is invited or it could happen as we progress through the group dungeon.
There are moments when we all have to leave group and reform to get the Group Leader back??0 -
Anastasia✭✭✭✭
Regarding grouping and using VOIPs - ;o/
This is actually why I have not looked for a guild yet. I have vent and ts on my computer from other mmo's. I've used it in endgame raiding in several other games. I see the value for coordination in certain groups and of course for endgame activity.
But personally I have a love-hate relationship with voice com.
Of course you cannot deny its value in PvP and also there is more of a need to communicate in groups in TESO. I personally type super fast, I know some others do not.
I grow weary very quickly of having voice com up all the time though:
1) It definitely ruins any immersion a player is interested in.
2) There just is no filter. No idjit filter is what I mean here. Sometime yes, it can be fun to joke around and laugh - thats the point aside from directions and tips on gameplay during gameplay. However, that is not primarily what its used for in many guilds. Its an audio version of pug's tbh. Many voices jumping in, talking over each other, sidetracking convo's main topics, discussing politics, sports scores, and the always so interesting, "Sec, gotta go change over my laundry" explanations.
3) I am a very efficient multi-tasker, I can do it fine. I find in mmo play, I do not enjoy doing it with added audio from other people's voices. I am very social and have an active friends list. I enjoy helping others and some conversation to go with it in my chat box, but I just don't want to hear the same things repeated over and over in my two to four hour block of play time as you always do when having a guild voice chat up/going.
4) I suppose I personally would most enjoy private voice come with only my friends in it, but that defeats the purpose of "guild" voice chat then. ;o/
5) Though I've only ever done very light r-p, maybe I can find a guild that is more textbox chat oriented as I've heard some r-p guilds usually have in-character and out-of-character chats usually. Not sure if that can be done in TESO.
Maybe in the current era of mmo's its unavoidable. But I will keep it low on my priority list.
Edited by Anastasia on April 30, 2014 10:59AM1 -
lichmeister✭✭✭DarkWombat wrote: »mstout7419b14_ESO wrote: »Hasnt happen to me ever..... I have no problem with grouping
This is a complete lie. So someone on your friends list. Right next to you but in a different phase. You are saying as soon as you group they suddenly appear next to you? I call 100% BS.
...or he simply has no friends to group with
this was a huge hassle for the only RL friend i could convince to try this game. This and many other bugs chased him away before his first month was up. granted, he has never been a very patient person
it is one of many functions of the game that helps make it the most anti-social online game ever made. i really hope that ZOS gets a chance to fix this and other problems before you and your son take the path of my impatient pal!
Edited by lichmeister on April 30, 2014 11:06AM0 -
DarkWombat wrote: »Okay saying he lied might be harsh. I just find it hard to believe that there is someone out there who has done a significant amount of grouping and finds no issues whatsoever. But hey, that's me I guess!
I have no issue with grouping as well. I group up with random people when I see them in area so they surely won't disappear... In dungeons (instanced) you won't have issue as well. Phasinf is bad, but ESO wanted to have single player experience as well, so phasing is not possible to avoid...
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JJDrakken✭✭✭How about when you group up, try invite someone, says YOUR ARE NOT THE GROUP LEADER. You are like what? Cuz for some F'd reason it removes group leadership from you & doesn't give it to no one else.
So you gotta disband, send invite to people, have them all wait all invites are out, then accept them.0 -
JJDrakken✭✭✭Also, how about when you trying searching for a dungeon as group leader, You can't SELECT DUNGEONS LOWER LVL THEN YOU, to Que up for. Even if you are above it by 1 level. How about when you do finally que up. You que'd up with 3 other DPS classes.0
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Srugzal✭✭✭✭✭As you can see Wombat, some people here will pretend glaring issues don't exist and that everything is fine.
I believe that this conclusion is unwarranted. There are a lot of people playing the game, and not all of them have had the same experience. I've had both experiences. My most recent grouping experience went off without a hitch. It was even a PUG in the middle of a quest, the worst possible situation. Others have been complete non-starters, floating chevrons, bodiless group members, with no solution in sight, for public dungeons with no quest involved.
I don't believe that having a different experience means that deliberate misrepresentation is going on. It just means that some problems don't happen 100% of the time.
And as for positivity spoiling the game, blinding the devs to the problems... well, that's pretty far fetched in my opinion.
Edited by Srugzal on April 30, 2014 12:14PM0 -
Gohlar✭✭✭✭
I don't see how anyone could spend time on the forums and say this...
And as for positivity spoiling the game, blinding the devs to the problems... well, that's pretty far fetched in my opinion.
There is nothing positive about what I'm talking about. I can understand if you like the game, but that's no excuse to be obtuse like this. If they were being positive, we wouldn't be having this discussion.
Also, imagine the kind of feedback some of these people gave during beta. They are the type who want to police how everyone plays. I think the restrictive design of ESO, even for a theme park, shows how short sighted feedback can affect a game. In the end, they are easily the most harmful presence in the game. I only wonder if they will realize what they're doing. They are like a guy on the deck of the Titanic shouting "everything is fine!" as people flee around them.
Edited by Gohlar on April 30, 2014 12:26PM1 -
antspantsSoul ShrivenThis problem happened to me too. The first time I went into a dungeon and for about fifteen minutes we were all trying to merely see each other instead of floating chevrons.0 -
Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭grouping in ESO feels unnatural.
by that i mean that when you group up with someone, outside of group content, that the game suddenly becomes clunky. You have to make sure are at the same point in a quest, make the same decisions and often, each player will have to perform quest objectives as if the other person hadn't already done exactly that.
ESO does indeed feel like a single player game, with multiplayer content tacked on but still having the bugs worked out if it.
At least let us share quests and quest objectives so it doesnt feel like some sort of episodic flash game.2 -
DarkWombat wrote: »How did this game make it to launch when each and every time you form a group the players in your group are invisible?
I tried to run a dungeon the other day, of course, it didn't put us in the same phase at all, so we entered the dungeon. I could see the healer and no one else. The healer could only see me. I had the two other people log off and back on again. I did the same. Then I could not see anybody. We tried "teleport to player", and got a message saying it could not be done. With various combination things got worse. Some people appeared offline resulting in the leader booting them mistakenly.
After more work I saw two other party members but the 4th could not see any of us. Finally he logged off and back on and then saw us.
This is not good. Especially weeks after launch.
This past week I have been playing with my son. As soon as we join a group we have to teleport to player even if we are standing a foot away from each other. Sometimes this does not work and we are forced to log off and back on again.
This process is painful, and my tin foil hat might just make it out of the closet. I think a lot of these "megaserver systems" just plain don't work, and Zenimax is trying to figure it out on the fly. I think everyone at Zenimax knew it, and I think that the Imperial Edition, etc were ways that were invented in the last hour to get as much money upfront as they could for a game that has several systems like this that do not work.
You make a great point! There are many things the Devs did not think about when making or testing this game. It feels more like a shell of a good game than an actual game, there is so much missing and broken. It saddens me to have to cancel my sub. I never received my preorder items, sent a ticket about that, its too late now. Never contacted about it either. I tried to give it a fair chance but its just not even enjoyable to play, inventory, bugs, broken quest, cost of things in game like mount, mail, and so on. Guild system and store, its all broken. Enjoy, I wish I could have!
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Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭Had to laugh at "in my lifetime" considering MMOs as we know them have been around what, ~15 years? I mean that statement would have weight if you were under 20. Oh, I guess you might be.
hate to pop your youth hatin' hate bubble, but 15 years is still a large chunk of time regards the human life cycle....
your statement is ludicrous0 -
mips_winnt wrote: »alienbongs wrote: »I understand people like this game and want it to succeed (me too), but why are people so delusional on these forums? ESO does in fact have some major problems, and they do need to get fixed.
Well said, the OP states his/her issues with grouping and inevitably gets a bunch of responses to the effect that it's all in his/her head, pretty ridiculous as well as counterproductive. The grouping system/tools does need a lot of work since it's neither convenient nor effective. This is where ZOS needs to steal some plays from WoW since the grouping tools & system there are mature and pretty well designed, putting together groups in WoW (whether it be LFG/LFR on the fly groups, 5/10/25 man runs or just grouping up to quest or PvP) is a snap and you have all the basic tools at your fingertips, ESO should have the same if it really wants to promote group play (as any MMO should want to do).
I understand what ZOS was attempting to do, however it's not working out very well since having to jump through a whole bunch of hoops just to get a functional group and then not having half way decent group tools (e.g. target markers, configurable group member status icons, etc..,) isn't fun it's annoying.
Sorry but they need to steal some plays from DAOC, I feel this game wants to be more like DAOC than WOW for sure. Grouping, open world combat in DAOC was much better than WOW.1 -
Shimond✭✭✭✭HarryWolfe wrote: »hate to pop your youth hatin' hate bubble, but 15 years is still a large chunk of time regards the human life cycle....
your statement is ludicrous
It's less than half my lifetime and I'm not even all that old (considering the geezers thread on this forum). I mean, I get that it is to some (perhaps you?) but I just find it funny. A bit too melodramatic for my tastes.1 -
it feels little bit like sp if you ignore othet players and go solo. My biggest problem with ESO is their annoucment: salvation can not comefrom one here alone, but from many. Did you get this feeling when the town is invaded by pirates kr deadra? I certainly did not
This was supposed to be instance for at least 12 player raid with really hard difficulty. Alert system for guards etc. Like it should be in elder scrolls... They lean way too much towards MMO instead of Elder Scrolls game.
Grouping have some slight issues but nothing game breaking imho.0 -
I have to agree with the OP in saying that this game does have the worst group mechanics of any MMO that I have played ( I have experience with: lotro, eq2, swotr, and runescape, but mostly lotro). It's not only the phasing issues; there is no way to: mark targets, give different markings to group members, see what quests (or what steps of a quest) a member is on, or see what quest choice a group member makes. Also, it's really hard, or downright impossible to help a friend or guildie on a quest you have already completed. I understand that if you have a leveling partner then you are probably in lockstep with them and some of these issues may not be as big a deal for you. But if you pug or just occasionally work with a friend or guildie then I believe that these issues cause a lot of frustration. I really hope that these grouping issues are ironed out by the time Craglorn hits. I like this game in so many ways but grouping is a PITA which is shameful for an MMO.1
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Cry_Wolfe✭✭✭HarryWolfe wrote: »hate to pop your youth hatin' hate bubble, but 15 years is still a large chunk of time regards the human life cycle....
your statement is ludicrous
It's less than half my lifetime and I'm not even all that old (considering the geezers thread on this forum). I mean, I get that it is to some (perhaps you?) but I just find it funny. A bit too melodramatic for my tastes.
oh shush with the passive aggressive crap
ill be forty next year, and age is not a prerequisite for stupidity. 0
