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Why ESO did not turn out to be what people wanted.
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KerinKor✭✭✭✭✭
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Was it ever explained why ZOS got the contract when they'd never done anything remotely similar to a 'AAA' MMO?Zenimax doesn't know how to make a decent multiplayer game, it's that simple. No idea why they even bothered making an mmo where all they want you to do endless solo quests.
I guess Bethesda themselves are more than happy producing excellent off-line games.
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Dolenz✭✭✭Or, stay with me now, it's a mediocre game.
Pretend otherwise all day, it's still true. The game's life cycle will reflect this, wait and see.
Your opinion.
It will not go down as one of my favorite games ever but I am enjoying it. I have already put more hours into it than I get out of the majority of games I pay $60 for.
But of course, you are right, your opinion is more valid than mine.
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zaria✭✭✭✭✭
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This mostly, was pretty funny reading in an general gaming forum, two guys was bashing ESO, basically one complained it was not Skyrim online, the other because it was not an wow clone. I tried to get them to argue with each other but failed"Why ESO did not turn out to be what people wanted?"
Because people had unrealistic expectations that had no basis in reality.
Because people bought the game without doing any homework or research first.
Because every person thinks they know what makes a perfect game, never realizing that their opinion of a perfect game is not everyone elses.
The list could go on.
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Gohlar✭✭✭✭
Was it ever explained why ZOS got the contract when they'd never done anything remotely similar to a 'AAA' MMO?Zenimax doesn't know how to make a decent multiplayer game, it's that simple. No idea why they even bothered making an mmo where all they want you to do endless solo quests.
I guess Bethesda themselves are more than happy producing excellent off-line games.
I want to say money, but they managed to spend 200m making this thing.
I have no idea what they were thinking really.0 -
aegis156✭✭
Was it ever explained why ZOS got the contract when they'd never done anything remotely similar to a 'AAA' MMO?Zenimax doesn't know how to make a decent multiplayer game, it's that simple. No idea why they even bothered making an mmo where all they want you to do endless solo quests.
I guess Bethesda themselves are more than happy producing excellent off-line games.
there is no awarded contract, they bought Bethesda, they own the IP lock stock and barrel. They can do what ever they wish with it1 -
Gohlar✭✭✭✭Or, stay with me now, it's a mediocre game.
Pretend otherwise all day, it's still true. The game's life cycle will reflect this, wait and see.
Your opinion.
It will not go down as one of my favorite games ever but I am enjoying it. I have already put more hours into it than I get out of the majority of games I pay $60 for.
But of course, you are right, your opinion is more valid than mine.
So after making a list of silly reasons why people who don't like the game are wrong and uninformed or whatever, now you say this?
That's cute.
Enjoy buying outfits on a store because that is the future of ESO. I'm sorry if the reality of the situation is unpalatable for you, but ESO is a bit of a dud.
Edited by Gohlar on April 28, 2014 12:42PM3 -
Knovah✭✭✭I went in aware that this game is not "Skyrim" online…it would be tes lore and probably similar art style.
So do not include me in that we. I do not like people talking for me or guessing what my opinion may be... Replace it with "Some people"
I have run into a few bugs, some very annoying and frustrating. Personally I take a deep breath and move on to something else in the game. My biggest problem is, I can't find a character and stick to it.
I want to try them all. I just cannot settle into one for some reason and it is hindering progression for me (my lizard brain thinks I need to find one and just settle down). I am not an altaholic. I usually find one or two at most, and play and progress them. I can't seem to do that atm and it is frustrating me a little. If it gets to the point where I am so frustrated I want to kick a puppy …well that is a huge clue to get up shut off the puter and go outside and that is just what I do.
If the game is not what you had hoped for or makes you so mad you are not having a good time. Then stop playing. That is not sarcasm that is not me being a troll that is 100 percent truth. I do not understand why someone would play a game they know they dislike and then run to forums to complain about it?
Before the "how else will the company know we are not happy if we don’t come here"…Let me ask you this...
What would make you happy... if it is the simple little requests like bugs and glitches…they (I have faith) will get to them. If it is nothing that this game could offer you any more or unrealistic goals…walk away, you will not be happy.
It is simple if this game is not for you and you just don't like it …leave… It is not a troll, it is not sarcasm it is what it is. Not everyone will like everything. Subs will come and go and people will troll and fans will protect, but in the end if something does not make you happy… walk away.
Video games ......The only legal place to kill stupid people.2 -
reggielee✭✭✭✭the only group phasing problems I had were invisible members who just relogged to fix it. took a min. we were waiting to restore majika and stamina anyway.
yes, it would be nice to be able to phase in non dungeon quests with others just so you can hang with your friends as they pve quest. maybe they will address that in the future
the rampant cheating from pvp players is however, mind boggling. i would assume most of the gold buying (for mounts and upgrade parts) is from that sector who are keeping the bots in action in pve areas. I wish there was more player repercussion for gold buying and exploitationMama always said the fastest way to a man's heart is through his chest.0 -
zaria✭✭✭✭✭
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How could you have mods? game was run from an server, it was not run on your local computer so you could not add new monsters, new items to drop and so on as the server did all that.R1ckyDaMan wrote: »
Now I understand, you was actually on your own or in group in the world?R1ckyDaMan wrote: »
GW1 was not an mmo but an online multiplayer game, once you left the hub you was either with your group or on your own free to explore the world...
It was not quite open world as typical ES games are, portals seperated zones but this is kind of in place now with es games anyway with the small load when you enter a new area.
For the record I am enjoying ESO for what it is, just wish Bethesda would make an ES game with online features.
still it would require that they removed lots of the TES features as moding, and I guess it felt more like an MMO than Skyrim did.
Still it might have been an option for ESO, at least for the quests.
Loading then entering cities in Oblivion and Skyrim was done because of console limitations. ESO uses loading to manage shards and megaserver.
Modding would be allowed, you would just get a message saying you require X addon to join X persons world etc.
Also it would have alot more TES features than an mmo ever could, less load, less going in player wise, pickpocketing would be ok, killing npc would be ok, infact I can not think of a single elder scroll feature that would not be ok... The world is the group leaders world, all what they have done in their world will be like that for any other players that join him.
Like I said just a wish, a dream, maybe one day
Grinding just make you go in circles.
Asking ZoS for nerfs is as stupid as asking for close air support from the death star.0 -
Gohlar✭✭✭✭
Was it ever explained why ZOS got the contract when they'd never done anything remotely similar to a 'AAA' MMO?Zenimax doesn't know how to make a decent multiplayer game, it's that simple. No idea why they even bothered making an mmo where all they want you to do endless solo quests.
I guess Bethesda themselves are more than happy producing excellent off-line games.
there is no awarded contract, they bought Bethesda, they own the IP lock stock and barrel. They can do what ever they wish with it
Oh, well that makes sense. ESO is an unsuccessful cash grab. They probably thought it was going to be easier and ended up sinking too much money into it.
They will aggressively attempt to recover this loss, that should be great for the game...Edited by Gohlar on April 28, 2014 12:49PM2 -
TwoScaleSkin✭✭
No, they didn't. Zenimax Media, created in 1999, owns both Zenimax Online Studios and Bethesda Game Studios (the parent of Bethesda Softworks). ZOS was created in 2007 as a separate branch to make games under, probably for risk control reasons.there is no awarded contract, they bought Bethesda, they own the IP lock stock and barrel. They can do what ever they wish with it
ZOS has exactly as much power over Bethesda as Bethesda has over ZOS, which is to say none at all.
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Knovah✭✭✭
Was it ever explained why ZOS got the contract when they'd never done anything remotely similar to a 'AAA' MMO?Zenimax doesn't know how to make a decent multiplayer game, it's that simple. No idea why they even bothered making an mmo where all they want you to do endless solo quests.
I guess Bethesda themselves are more than happy producing excellent off-line games.
there is no awarded contract, they bought Bethesda, they own the IP lock stock and barrel. They can do what ever they wish with it
Oh, well that makes sense. ESO is an unsuccessful cash grab. They probably thought it was going to be easier and ended up sinking too much money into it.
They will aggressively attempt to recover this loss, that should be great for the game...
How do you know it was a failed money grab? Considering zenimax is a private traded company and sales release can only be calculated for pc and not console versions so far… Unless you have some magic crystal ball that gives you quarterly reviews on what is selling and not selling in the future ECT ECT all anyone can do is guess.
I am not defending the company or a fangurl (or whatever it is spelled) I simply want to know what you are basing your numbers and FACTS on? They will not release corporate numbers to public and you can only speculate at best. If going by pc alone then your point is still moot…they did not base profit margins off just pc sales alone… so to say it is a failed money grab is an opinion not a fact.
Not being sarcastic or trolling just want to know what information you are privy to that no one else is to base your claim. Opinions are different but people spout them like it is facts.
If I am wrong please show me I am always up to learn new things. I am interested in final sales numbers and end market value but I want to know truths not half truths and opinions cause we all have those. Educate me on it. I could be missing something and wrong myself.
**edit I know inflection is hard to type but this is not written in an accusatory tone or to be condescending … simple debate in a rational tone and curious as to how other arrive at the conclusions they do.Edited by Knovah on April 28, 2014 1:27PMVideo games ......The only legal place to kill stupid people.0 -
KerinKor✭✭✭✭✭
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Actually SW:TOR is a good precedent here, huge hype, massive pre-orders and a crashing player population once 'free time' expired.
Was it ever explained why ZOS got the contract when they'd never done anything remotely similar to a 'AAA' MMO?Zenimax doesn't know how to make a decent multiplayer game, it's that simple. No idea why they even bothered making an mmo where all they want you to do endless solo quests.
I guess Bethesda themselves are more than happy producing excellent off-line games.
there is no awarded contract, they bought Bethesda, they own the IP lock stock and barrel. They can do what ever they wish with it
Oh, well that makes sense. ESO is an unsuccessful cash grab. They probably thought it was going to be easier and ended up sinking too much money into it.
They will aggressively attempt to recover this loss, that should be great for the game...
The way they chose to "aggressively attempt to recover the loss" was to go F2P and much of the initial 'promise' the game had with its entirely voiced-acted, class-specific main story evaporated and stops at 50.
If that's the path you envisage for ESO that is NOT a great prospect IMO.
Edited by KerinKor on April 28, 2014 1:30PM2 -
Laura✭✭✭✭✭
✭Or, stay with me now, it's a mediocre game.
Pretend otherwise all day, it's still true. The game's life cycle will reflect this, wait and see.
Your opinion.
It will not go down as one of my favorite games ever but I am enjoying it. I have already put more hours into it than I get out of the majority of games I pay $60 for.
But of course, you are right, your opinion is more valid than mine.
So after making a list of silly reasons why people who don't like the game are wrong and uninformed or whatever, now you say this?
That's cute.
Enjoy buying outfits on a store because that is the future of ESO. I'm sorry if the reality of the situation is unpalatable for you, but ESO is a bit of a dud.
There are plenty of negative posts about this game I whole heartedly agree with and even a LOT of the things you say but its people like you spewing your toxicity that is turning gaming into what it is today.
Edited by Laura on April 28, 2014 1:43PM6 -
Gohlar✭✭✭✭I agree Kerin, I think the game will follow a very similar path as swtor. I was being sarcastic when I said it was going to be great for the game, if you took me seriously.I am not defending the company or a fangurl (or whatever it is spelled) I simply want to know what you are basing your numbers and FACTS on? They will not release corporate numbers to public and you can only speculate at best.
Yes, it's speculation. But they do release numbers when sales are strong and there is a very small forum presence for a newly released mmo. PvP population is also small. All indicators point to a small population. It's technically still speculation, but if this sold millions like swtor, we'd know.Edited by Gohlar on April 28, 2014 1:45PM2 -
Gohlar✭✭✭✭There are plenty of negative posts about this game I whole heartedly agree with and even a LOT of the things you say but its people like you spewing your toxicity that is turning gaming into what it is today.
I do get into stupid arguments on the internet. I admit it.
But, I disagree with it having anything to do with what gaming is today. If anything, we want things to improve, that's why we're here criticizing. Perhaps if people could talk about how the game could improve without getting upset (not you) things would be different?
I think overzealous defenders really handicapped the feedback process for this game and a lot of the problems could have been avoided.
Edited by Gohlar on April 28, 2014 1:54PM3 -
R1ckyDaMan✭✭✭✭
How could you have mods? game was run from an server, it was not run on your local computer so you could not add new monsters, new items to drop and so on as the server did all that.R1ckyDaMan wrote: »
Now I understand, you was actually on your own or in group in the world?R1ckyDaMan wrote: »
GW1 was not an mmo but an online multiplayer game, once you left the hub you was either with your group or on your own free to explore the world...
It was not quite open world as typical ES games are, portals seperated zones but this is kind of in place now with es games anyway with the small load when you enter a new area.
For the record I am enjoying ESO for what it is, just wish Bethesda would make an ES game with online features.
still it would require that they removed lots of the TES features as moding, and I guess it felt more like an MMO than Skyrim did.
Still it might have been an option for ESO, at least for the quests.
Loading then entering cities in Oblivion and Skyrim was done because of console limitations. ESO uses loading to manage shards and megaserver.
Modding would be allowed, you would just get a message saying you require X addon to join X persons world etc.
Also it would have alot more TES features than an mmo ever could, less load, less going in player wise, pickpocketing would be ok, killing npc would be ok, infact I can not think of a single elder scroll feature that would not be ok... The world is the group leaders world, all what they have done in their world will be like that for any other players that join him.
Like I said just a wish, a dream, maybe one day
This is true, so there would be a limit on content mods.0 -
Knovah✭✭✭I agree Kerin, I think the game will follow a very similar path as swtor. I was being sarcastic when I said it was going to be great for the game, if you took me seriously.I am not defending the company or a fangurl (or whatever it is spelled) I simply want to know what you are basing your numbers and FACTS on? They will not release corporate numbers to public and you can only speculate at best.
Yes, it's speculation. But they do release numbers when sales are strong and there is a very small forum presence for a newly released mmo. PvP population is also small. All indicators point to a small population. It's technically still speculation, but if this sold millions like swtor, we'd know.
Kk much better..
Yes from a speculation stand point possibly and going by pc most likely ...but till it is released on the other two platforms , from a financial standpoint, not going to say it is failed myself just yet...
What they release in numbers in just publicity and I don't trust them ( no company is going to post the horrid side of business for them).I like to see the hard data sheets myself, but it is privately traded and I am not privy to that info sadly....
I guess time will tell.. I personally like the game from pve standpoint. That is just my taste now. I can safely say at the height of my raiding days and game playing marathons I would not enjoy it. I can see from both sides of the debate but for me atm this is good for the time I have to play and what my taste are now.
I just think (IMHO) if people in general don't like the game it is not making them happy the game must not be for them and move on...why would you stay and complain on a forums other than troll and make yourself look foolish?
**there is debate then there is just trolling and looking to incite trouble....most what I see is the later. I love a good debate but dislike the obvious trollers ..They know who they are
Edited by Knovah on April 28, 2014 2:03PMVideo games ......The only legal place to kill stupid people.1 -
Ohioastro✭✭✭✭It does appear as if the bulk of the hostile posts come from people who had beta accounts but are not playing the actual game. It also looks as if the complaints could have been written in advance because they represent philosophical approaches that are different from those chosen for the real game; this makes them pointless in my view. I think that the mods should shut down inactive accounts; there are plenty of places on the internet for people who are not playing the game to slag it.
I wouldn't have bought this if it was co-op Skyrim. I like the overall design choices a lot. The OP does not speak for me, and my first ES game was Arena.3 -
Imryll✭✭✭✭✭Interesting things to discover? Check.
Conflicting points of view with no one clearly in the right? Check.
In-game books that are interesting, as well as informative. Check.
Freeom to walk on the beach, pick flowers, or craft if I don't feel like questing at the moment. Check.
For me, it's TES. 3 -
Gix✭✭✭✭A more accurate way of saying it is: it did not turn out the way I expected. I expected crap and I was pleasantly surprised.2 -
mutharex✭✭✭✭✭A more accurate way of saying it is: it did not turn out the way I expected. I expected crap and I was pleasantly surprised.
Yeah before trying it in January (beta weekend) all I heard was:it's a crappy wowclone with a TES skin.
You can imagine my surprise when I managed to see for myself: I preordered it 2 seconds after it was available and till now the only letdown is the poor forum moderation that leaves all these trolls free to post constructive stuff on the lines of "delusional fanbois this game will go f2p is inevitable ahahahahah how I love your tears" and other nonsenseEdited by mutharex on April 28, 2014 2:45PM3 -
Evanis✭✭✭R1ckyDaMan wrote: »GW1 does instanced group content that can be played alone perfectly fine
As I have maintained from beta, if ZOS wanted to truly replicate the TES experience in a multiplayer format, ESO should have been designed around a group instance framework rather than a persistent world. Instead, they went for the format that would net them the largest profits. Even if ZOS shuts down the ESO servers and walks away a year from now, they will have made their money back many times over. This is why MMOs continue to disappoint me time and again. Their monetized design is based on keeping people hooked into the system for as long as possible. The resulting game is often rife with horrible loot drops and time/gear gates, just to name a couple of things.Edited by Evanis on April 28, 2014 3:11PM0 -
Or, stay with me now, it's a mediocre game.
Pretend otherwise all day, it's still true. The game's life cycle will reflect this, wait and see.
Your opinion.
It will not go down as one of my favorite games ever but I am enjoying it. I have already put more hours into it than I get out of the majority of games I pay $60 for.
But of course, you are right, your opinion is more valid than mine.
So after making a list of silly reasons why people who don't like the game are wrong and uninformed or whatever, now you say this?
That's cute.
Enjoy buying outfits on a store because that is the future of ESO. I'm sorry if the reality of the situation is unpalatable for you, but ESO is a bit of a dud.
The Game is a dud to YOU. There are several lists of why TESO is enjoyable to some people. There are several lists of why TESO is not enjoyable to some people. I enjoy TESO , I enjoyed that at level 15 I went to the rift and was able to through careful game play,skill usage, and resource management kill sabrecats ( granted only one at a time.) Other MMO's I would not have even made a scratch while they would have smushed me.
I enjoy that if I am having a tough time fighting a certain type of opponent I can step back change my skills completely and then go at it in a different way. And I usually do well when I adjust my tactics.
I enjoy that I have done several group dungeons with no defined tank or healer with my guild. Beacuse we are all capable of contributing to healing, and grabbing aggro.
I enjoy that only once across 4 characters at various levels and factions have I ever encountered a progression blocking bug. or for that matter a bug period. I may just be lucky I dont know.
This game may loose subscribers but I doubt Zeni will ever send it to F2P, maybe B2P like TSW.
Also I wouldnt mind spending 5$ on cosmetic outfits in the store.0 -
vyndral13preub18_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭R1ckyDaMan wrote: »GW1 does instanced group content that can be played alone perfectly fine
As I have maintained from beta, if ZOS wanted to truly replicate the TES experience in a multiplayer format, ESO should have been designed around a group instance framework rather than a persistent world. Instead, they went for the format that would net them the largest profits. Even if ZOS shuts down the ESO servers and walks away a year from now, they will have made their money back many times over. This is why MMOs continue to disappoint me time and again. Their monetized design is based on keeping people hooked into the system for as long as possible. The resulting game is often rife with horrible loot drops and time/gear gates, just to name a couple of things.
Just to point out, this was one of the huge criticism of Swtor at launch. Everything was instanced. There were small sections of free areas which connected large sections of instanced areas around the player/group. The boards were flooded with, this isn't an mmo. To many instances. I never see anyone.
But honestly I don't think there is a wrong or a right answer to this. Some people like it, some don't. I don't mind so much. Didn't really mind the way swtor did it either. Only part i don't like is the forced solo play. If it werent for the forced solo quest i would not have a whole bunch to complain about.1 -
"Why ESO did not turn out to be what people wanted?"
Because people had unrealistic expectations that had no basis in reality.
Because people bought the game without doing any homework or research first.
Because every person thinks they know what makes a perfect game, never realizing that their opinion of a perfect game is not everyone elses.
The list could go on.
Or, stay with me now, it's a mediocre game. There is a long list of reasons as to why I say this. I could repeat them, but they are all over the forum/reviews/internet already. It's a very weak mmo and a dull single player game. Only beginners will be entertained by this and even then not for very long.
Pretend otherwise all day, it's still true. The game's life cycle will reflect this, wait and see.
And this is an OPINION! Believe it or not, but your OPINION is not fact!
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Wow, you must have a time travel machine to state what is so obviously your opinion as fact... yet again. Sorry if not everyone follows in step behind your grandiose leadership.0 -
SadisticSavior✭✭✭
LOL! Mods are not the game. You like what you were able to hack the game into, not the game itself.rawne1980b16_ESO wrote: »SadisticSavior wrote: »
You haven't played with mods.
My Vampire guide - http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/99101/my-vampire-experience2
