Respec Gold cost elimination/reduction

One-Winged

Instead of resetting your Skill Points you should focus on getting more of them. The price of this is totally ok. It's a gold sink. We need it. Otherwise the game would be too easy, economically speaking.

Therealshur

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

@Sirmati‌ I want to respec my character at level 37 not because my character is "broken", I want to respec because I have almost 2 days of gameplay with the same build and skills and it is already starting to get boring and repetitive. I want to try new things without having to sink hours into a new character, or having to spend the amount of gold on a respec

This

BalanceGaming

@One-Winged‌ I don't know how many skill points I have ATM but I can tell you I have gotten every sky shard so far, and I still don't have enough skill points to start a completely new build. I am still only level 42, but I should be able to use whatever build I want with the amount of skill points I have earned.

One-Winged

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

I still don't have enough skill points to start a completely new build.

That depends on how you chose to distribute your points my friend. You have the chance to try out lots and lots of builds though. Also, some skills that you choose in the beginning might start losing effect, which will make you consider if you should still have them. And that's where the respec comes. It's the price you have to pay to be the perfectionist kind of guy you seem to be.

Tolio

Chelo wrote: »

What the OP is saying is that he want to change his entire build/role without cost anytime he want. For example he can be Tank at this momment, 5 minutes later he is a Healer, 10 minutes later he is a DPS. That's what he want and thats totaly gamebreaking for an MMO...
...

If you dont know this, you havent play MMOs at all, dont you?

@ Chelo Actually you are wrong. Take a look at Rift- free flexible roles you can switch according to the situation.
Or take a look at even WoW, where you can now have two skillsets saved as well and the respec costs aren gamebreaking high.

ESO was promoted with play however you want aka flexible class system. If I want to play as a caster today and as a melee tomorrow- well right now that's impossible.
And yes, I have even played AD&D online, where you never could respec- but that game was designed that way and the theorycrafting before you even started playing was a part that was responsible for the small playerbase it attracted. And also a reason why it went f2p.
If you want a mainstream MMO you have to cater to the mainstream crowd. And those are the people who will NOT spend hours in advance to plan out their build and who feel punnished with absurd costs for errors they made in building their character.
Add to that the fact that the Solo PvE in this game is much harder than in the usual other candidates and you have a volatile combination. People with bad builds who can't correct their errors due to lack of coinage- what do you imagine those will do if they continuesly bite the bullet?
No, don't answer that you never had a problem with any solo PvE content- I am talking about the broad mass of average MMO players.

fantom

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

Also, eventually you will have people build the best character in game, and people will follow. Its a given, it will happen, it happens in almost every mmo. Making your character unique is completely up to the player, a respec will not change that.

Wrong, because different morphs will be optimal in different parts of the game. And the current system will force players to choose if they want to be optimal for X activity or Y activity.

There are also different ways to approach the same activity (AOE vs. single target, long range vs. close, etc) and depending on which playstyle you prefer you will create a different character.

Making your character unique is not completely up to the player, that's an absurd statement. The way a game is designed is the biggest factor in creating unique characters. The developer needs to create systems that promote different solutions and semi-permanent choices.

Grumwulf

Personally I wish they would allow us to respec the morphs only. I don´t care if it is expensive to reset all skills as you get lots of skillpoints anyway. But it is going to be hard to play a tank and a healer optimally, or even a tank and a dps, without spending a lot of gold on respecs. It makes me really reluctant to try morphs to be honest. Levelling up I want damage morphs, but maybe later I will want the tanking morph or the healing morph. Also it is a pain having to respend all your skillpoints just to change a morph. It's the morphs ultimately that are the centre of builds and the centre of the idea that you can play in many ways. Why even level a resto staff I sometimes wonder if I can't really be a tank and a healer? Well I guess there are still reasons but it does limit you. Take the nightblade skill strife. You can morph it for tanking or for healing. I suppose some people will say it is good to have a build, or an identity that you are sort of fixed to without spending a lot of gold. But it detracts from the other side of the game which is to collect skillpoints to have more options. I guess you can still have many different types of dps build, or healer build, or tanking build. But it is very hard to have both a tank and a healer build, at least in a min max way. I think they should fix this, perhaps a shrine just for resetting morphs, as we don't want reasons for there being less healers and tanks in the game.

Brewdie

This system punishes no one but those who just click away at things hoping for a good build. I have spent days with unspent points because the decisions were just that hard to make. Sometimes I'd save a point until my skill was sufficient enough, sometimes I felt that a crafting point was more beneficial to me at the moment than an ability or passive. This is not your standard MMO, things are expensive and once you hit vet level, money is not EXTREMELY difficult to come by. Take your time with your choices.

I will agree that being unable to respec say a full line as opposed to your entire build is a little frustrating, but that's the price to pay for not allocating the point appropriately.

Read your tooltips... THEN choose.

Novokaine

The fact that respec is that high is a bit troubling, I have found however that you can gather so many skill points that it eventually becomes a mute point.

I would love if the cost is reduced slightly, at LEAST for the first time and then it can escalate if you do it too soon / inside a specific time table, say once every month or so.

just my thoughts on this,

Skeletun

Brewdie wrote: »

This system punishes no one but those who just click away at things hoping for a good build. I have spent days with unspent points because the decisions were just that hard to make. Sometimes I'd save a point until my skill was sufficient enough, sometimes I felt that a crafting point was more beneficial to me at the moment than an ability or passive. This is not your standard MMO, things are expensive and once you hit vet level, money is not EXTREMELY difficult to come by. Take your time with your choices.

I will agree that being unable to respec say a full line as opposed to your entire build is a little frustrating, but that's the price to pay for not allocating the point appropriately.

Read your tooltips... THEN choose.

Well Said.

I rather like the system that is currently in place. One of the most frustrating things for me in other MMO's is the FOTM methodology.
Just take your time, then make your decision. Points do not need to be spent now. If I find I need more skill points I start hunting up shards. There are like 15 Skill points in Cyrodiil alone.
And you are sure that you will want to respec, then don't spend skillpoints. Save them until you are ready for your respec because each point spent is 100g you will have to spend later.

darkagejedi

SWTOR did next to nothing right, but in this one area, amazingly- they did. Their approach was that the first few were free up to a certain level cap and then it got more and more expensive, the more you did. I think allowing for an initial few respec's that are free or super dirt cheap is a must, as this is a very deep and complex game, when it comes to builds. It takes time to find the build that you enjoy playing and that is effective. Also, the respec's should not just happen in capital cities. Put these bots in entry level cities, too- when players are trying to figure a toon out.

I wrote a lengthy post in these forums (which included lots of compliments) about an MMO wide developer addiction to making day to day in game life super hard at launch, its like an addiction for developers around mechanics like death systems, economy, travel (which is not an issue in this game), money sinks, gold scarcity and respecs. Ive yet to see any of those games hold onto those initial mechanics but its usually not until accounts get cancelled and complaint levels get loud enough. I really hope that is not the case here, as this game has a TON going for it, so many positives, I would hate to see the developers unwilling to learn from other MMO's and just own, now- before accounts close and complaints get to a pitched volume, that some of their assumptions and mechanics were just wrong. No big, just change it now.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO

Free respecs would ruin the game completely, especially the absolutely fantastic crafting system. it would be too easy to master all crafts.
Almost no RPG that isnt garbage lets you respec at all, try appreciating that you have the option.
The early levels of this game are easy; by level 30 I already morphed all my class' and 2 weapon's tree's first three activated abilities, and almost the fourth of each. all while doing three crafts and taking a ton of passives. I have respeced twice to a grand total of only 11000 and know my character in and out. thats cheap, I know what all the skills do and am responsible to make good decisions so I dont have to respec when it gets really expensive. sure im broke in game, but that is still not even a quarter of the cost of a horse worth buying(at 47,000). calling for free respec is just boohooing, sorry no disrespect.

Cures

respeccing is actually too cheap imo - there are no real goldsinks in the game.

Darcula

Need a way to change morphs that doesn't require a full respec.

Pyatra

Full respect is fine. Even with 4 crafting SP sinks I have plenty of skill points at level 37. This system makes people smatter things around instead of play FotM builds. Once you get lots of SP you basically can unlock almost all your class and several weapons and even a couple crafting skills.

dylanjaygrobbelaarb16_ESO

Cures wrote: »

respeccing is actually too cheap imo - there are no real goldsinks in the game.

- Once your not changing gear every couple hours it is going to cost quite a bit to maintain your super stylin legendary sets. but I agree, if anything it should cost more, there are sooo many skillpoints out there.

Veshal

They've given us the oppertunity to use anything we want and create any build we want. You can't have your cake and eat it too. They've had this in place for a while, and I think its necessary to have the high cost. The fact that it is so expensive reflects how important it is to make the right decision when using your skill points.

crfurstenau

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

@tommipalub16 Well developers told us that we could be anything(on one character) and when we start new characters and new builds, we all take a complete stab in the dark. If we mess up, we want to try a new build and be the best we can be, and this can only be done if we can respec without this ridiculous gold sink

1)you dont need to "take a stab in the dark" go to a site like esohead, determine the exact skills you want to use, then stick with them.

this is easy.

2)resetting your skills didnt cost almost 12,000, you are level 37, that is 3700 gold, skyshards and quests may have put you into the 70s or 80s... so you spent 8k gold, big deal

3) go AOE grind/Farm some mobs for an hour and you will pay for this reset

Evergreen

Chelo wrote: »

They dont want you to be reseting your skill points everytime you try pvp, that make sense and punish bad decisions...

It would be lame if people just change build without cost everytime someone beat them at pvp...

The fact that some skills are broken highlights just one critical reason your logic is flawed. The Nightblade Assassin skills are so broken that a player unfortunate enough to spend points on them has basically lost those skill points or has to spend gold to respec. Sure broken skills will or should be fixed but who knows when that will be. It is an unfair burden on the player to have to research what skills are broken in order to avoid them.

I propose a reasonable solution which is we should be able at the very least freely re-specialize once a month or once every 15 days.

Dwumblord

I would have been fine with a gradually increasing cost. Far too expensive for a skill system that many are learning and are bound to make multiple mistakes they cant afford to fix

Lodestar

Chelo wrote: »

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

@tommipalup16 Its not just about mistakenly distributing skill points, i should be able to change my role around at any time and use whatever weapon i want effectively, and it will not be effective if I do not have skill points to send. And im sorry i highly doubt that there are enough skill points in the game to get every passive,crafting, and skill effects that I want.

Man, as I said the first time, you can do that in a single player RPG but that's GAMEBREAKING for an MMO and that's the reason why is never going to happend in this particular game...

Gamebreaking? What are you basing this on? Besides, melodrama and doom saying I mean.

crfurstenau wrote: »

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

@tommipalub16 Well developers told us that we could be anything(on one character) and when we start new characters and new builds, we all take a complete stab in the dark. If we mess up, we want to try a new build and be the best we can be, and this can only be done if we can respec without this ridiculous gold sink

1)you dont need to "take a stab in the dark" go to a site like esohead, determine the exact skills you want to use, then stick with them.

this is easy.

2)resetting your skills didnt cost almost 12,000, you are level 37, that is 3700 gold, skyshards and quests may have put you into the 70s or 80s... so you spent 8k gold, big deal

3) go AOE grind/Farm some mobs for an hour and you will pay for this reset

Actually, if you are new to MMOs, have a learning disability, or simply learn differently to others like I do as a Kinesthetic, these sites are little use at all.

And sadly, they are full of alienating comments such as yours, which just pass judgement on what they can not understand, and frankly come from the position of someone who is very insular.

You may well find this easy, especially after so many experiences and from your particular learning style. But, do not assume it works for everyone. Having said that there are some pretty good videos in increasing numbers that have good tutorials. Some good crafting ones for instance on TESO

But, still they can be in pretty short supply, and do not often cover such things as character builds. Which is sad as they would do well if there was more of them. And can take your gaming into realms of study rather than fun. I know I myself feel I can spend too much time watching them, than actually playing.

The respec system as it is, just discourages the likes of me from experimenting at all. And as has been pointed out, is counter productive to the maxim, play anything you want. I am not opposed to costs of some kind.

I agree, that people should not be able to respec over and again. Time lockouts should factor, with or without gold costs really. And what is more, I would not think many people would wish to change out their entire build. Just parts of it. There is no need to charge for every skill point, when you wish to change a few.

Me, I feel the costs should be halved, and have lockouts of a period of time. Though having increasing costs each time you respec is a good compromise. Right now, it looks like it has been used as a one size fits all solution to slot in a money sink. And a massive one at that.

BalanceGaming

@‌crfurstenau

1) You DO need to take a stab in the dark because text description only goes so far on a website like esohead, you really only know how effective the skill is untill you use it.

2) Just did the math 9.7k to respec skills and 4.1k to respec attributes at level 42, that is insane. Attributes are part of the entire respec if you want to have an effective build.

3)I should not have to aoe grind just to earn gold enough to respec my character!

Lodestar

Accidental double post. Please mods delete.

Quash

Seriously none of you are making gobs of gold on the daily? I have 3 crafting skills Im devoting my time to and I still end up with 10k in my bags most of the time. Able to buy full bag and bank upgrades too. I respecced with 69 skillpoints so 6900 gold was spent. Whooptie do.... Even at 120 skillpoints a whopping 12k is really not that big of deal. You could grind for about an hour, gain a level or two, and get 2-4k depending on what you sell to a vendor and what another player buys. You seriously dont have an hour to grind on your way to 50? The rest of the game IS grinding in some shape or form at the end like every other MMORPG I'm sure.

Honestly I'm glad this is in the game because it makes it more of a big deal. Compairing it to WoW or Rift or GW... I mean, didn't you leave those games for this one? The game isn't even 2 weeks old if you didnt have early access.

1) Unless you have a 50 and are working on veteran ranks, how do you know how much money you will make leveling? (TLDR Just jumped into thread)

2) How many times are you planning to respec? I mean, does it even matter until 50 really?

3) If anything, they should keep this in and make the donations to the shrine go toward some global event or party where we get cool unique loot. Kind of RP (y) for my taste, but would still be neat.

4) Lets say you reach 50. The next step for you is to get on with the veteran ranks right? After that, then what? Just going to show up day after day to "grind" pvp points or raid with some friends? Hmmm? Thats what you pay for right? It's the repetitivness of these games that has you in the first place. If you aren't into any of that, your spec is irrelivant because you just need to complete all the quests in the game and quit playing until they add new content.

All in all a pretty good topic to get people riled. My opinion is inserted and people will read some of it if they want. I for one will continue to enjoy the game how I want to play, and you will either stay or go depending on what it has to offer you. For me the money I pay is worth the time I get between RL responsibilites.

Good day sir

BalanceGaming

@Quash‌ This isn't a issue for level 50s I thought i have made that clear, I have had to respec at lvl 18 on one of my alts because my build was weak. I tried using a dragonknight with a bow, and those abilities did not synergize. So for trying new things, I was punished by this respec fee. At level 50 I bet I will have no problem paying that amount of money for a respec. But at level 18, 4k was alot of my character's money, and trying something new that failed for me left a really bad taste, and this respec fee was just the *** sauce on the sandwich.

Quash

@mmeisenheimerub17_ESO

Pick a longer name jeeze... Anyways, so you are fully aware that the amount of skillpoints you receive at the level you are at is really irrelivant to you progressing through the game in any way... Right?

You will find what.. at least 12 or so skyshards between the starting zone and the first zone you get into if you go that rout. Thats 4 points. Then there will be a few quest skill points you get etc etc. My point I was trying to make is: The game is fine as is. To be so nit-picky about where points are spent at level 18 is just not practical and its probably ruining your experiance. Just put points all over the place. You will get money over time questing and progressing. You will get the skills you will eventually want to high level by the end too.

I hit 36 last night. Time to respecc cause I didnt like what was going on and some skills were buggy. I had 13 points I didnt know I had to play with on different morphs or skills. Seriously, if you didn't get the 5 day early access I would be more agitated a horse costs 17k right out of the gate.

DraconX

7788b14_ESO wrote: »

Chelo wrote: »

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

I should be able to say,"well I am getting sick of this destruction staff and I want to switch to one hand and shield."

Also, you can do that in a single player RPG but that's totaly gamebreaking for an MMO...

I heard GW2 implemented free respects, most other MMO's I've played give you a free respect after so many levels.

Devs can buff and nerf skills at will or you may find a skill you put a lot of points towards is broken or has been recently broken by an update which may or may not be corrected.

The two MMO's I can think of off hand where you're stuck with what you got is EVE and TSW and both aren't at the top of the list of most successful MMO's.

Gw2 is not a pvp game, gw1 was pvp! Also unlocking option to spend skills cost around 20 000 eso gold coins ....

BalanceGaming

@Quash haha its weird is your forum name supposed to be the same as your account name? cause mine isn't. Anyways you do need skill points to progress, because you don't get passives, abilities, or crafting abilities without them. Without any skills, you are just getting attribute points, and leveling up your different skill lines for no reason. And it wasn't about me being "nit-picky", its about me making a *** build and wanting to fix my mistake. This should be cost free! It was bad enough I wasted my time progressing through the bow skill line, but i also have to spend all my gold to become more effective. That is BS.

chrisub17_ESO104

I think the cost is reasonable. I just hit V2 and have 75k gold. I did 4 respecs while leveling up. Three for skills and one for attributes.

And my only source of gold has just been whatever I vendor from drops. And I leveled blacksmithing also which means I deconstructed all of those items instead of selling them.

So I did nothing outside of normal play to get gold, and at this rate I could easily respec once a week and it wouldn't kill me, I would still have gold to spare.

Those that respec without enough gold to respec back if their decision ended up badly. That's just poor planning. The fix for that is don't do that. Take it as a lesson learned, but don't blame the game for it.

Also, respeccing at low levels, is just ignorance of the game. I did this myself. I wish I hadn't. It was absolutely not necessary as I later found out. What I didn't realize at the time is that later on, you want to get pretty much everything you can maxed, and the earlier you do it, the easier it is. If you think it's hard leveling up a new weapon at level 18, try it at V2. At V2 you will be wishing you had done it at 18.

Skeletun

mmeisenheimerub17_ESO wrote: »

@Quash‌ This isn't a issue for level 50s I thought i have made that clear, I have had to respec at lvl 18 on one of my alts because my build was weak. I tried using a dragonknight with a bow, and those abilities did not synergize. So for trying new things, I was punished by this respec fee. At level 50 I bet I will have no problem paying that amount of money for a respec. But at level 18, 4k was alot of my character's money, and trying something new that failed for me left a really bad taste, and this respec fee was just the *** sauce on the sandwich.

Why didn't you just pick up a Sword, Shield or Staff and keep on going. At lvl 25 I decided I didn't want to use Dual Wield anymore. So I just picked up a Two-Hander and started training it. Respec wasn't even a thought and I still have plenty of skill points.
Lvl 18 is barely touching the game and is a good time to experiment with the different weapons to find what you like.
I like the system the way it is. I believe that if people can forget what they have learned in other MMO's and give this one a chance they will see it's not as bad as they think.