So Zenimax recognise the lack of an AH is a serious mistsake?

JessieColt

I like the way it is set up now with a Guild Store where you can buy and sell stuff to other Guildmates. However, the Guild Store needs major improvement. It is currently very difficulty to search for items. This makes it a huge hassle to use when trying to find stuff to buy. Tweaking and changing the Guild Store to be a fully functional system would do far more to promoting and encouraging good trade than implementing a system wide AH type of feature.

JLynn

I personally dislike the AH model, prefer straight selling w/out auction mechanic such as EQ2 broker (or even the old EQ2 way of selling from house only while logged on and in house which I would love to see implemented in ESO), but an argument I'm surprised I don't see more of is that I don't necessarily 'know' what I want. I want to browse the market and see what's available and what's in demand. I can join a guild for this, yes, but I shouldn't HAVE to.

liquid_wolf

I'd like to see some kind of public markets put into the game. I'm a fan of the current guild store, but feel there needs to be some kind of out-ward facing system.

Some kind of marketplace where items can get listed for sale with some kind of item limit on how many things can be sold at once, by a single person.

Perhaps a price control where the highest priced item gets bumped out if the same item gets put up for cheaper? Only 100 Dagger of Strength can get posted, and the highest-priced one is bumped out if someone puts one up for cheaper. Limit how many a person can put up.

Complicated... definitely some testing, tweaking, and work would need to be done.

Still something I'd like to see tried/tested.

ShinChuck

I saw this, and chuckled.

"We know a lot of you don't like the system, so here's a third party way of handling it!"

That's... not good, when you recognize the issue affects a big enough part of the population that you're advocating workarounds. As usual, people are finding ways to make it work: we now have Guild Store search addons that can search all your guilds at once (potentially 2500 people strong, with thousands of auctions).

Also, if you *need* the game to restrict your buying/selling and force you into social situations just to have "the best social interaction ever", well... that's a personal problem, with all due respect.

Hawtsauce

^ agree ... I am getting plenty of 'Socialism' in RL right now, I dont need that in my MMO

Yes I did mean socialism not socializing.

spammichtotb16_ESO

I rather have an auction house than the permanent and obnoxious trade spam on all channels. Not to mention, that an auction house is the easiest way to have a stable and flourishing economy. But hey, I only have a degree in economics I am sure everyone else here on the forum is much smarter than I.

Auction houses are a great feature and I am certain many players are missing one. And sorry, trade guilds don't cut it.

Drachenfier

Don't really understand the social argument either....never been in guilds where no one interacts, which is pretty much what's going on in this game, because people are in so many guilds just for the stores. There's almost zero commitment to the guilds people are in.

Hawtsauce

Drachenfier wrote: »

Don't really understand the social argument either....never been in guilds where no one interacts, which is pretty much what's going on in this game, because people are in so many guilds just for the stores. There's almost zero commitment to the guilds people are in.

True, if anything it may actually make people less likely to be social ... I an imagine if people were in 5 guilds they would most likely just mute them all otherwise the spam would be too much

Januk

Wow... A community resource turns into a flame fest about AH?

Seriously... You know why people don't use the guild stores? Because of fee's associated with them. Now if you want a world wide ah, then I say the fee's should be even more outrageous.

The only successful AH/Marketplace/TP I know is Eve Online. Why? Because people make a living paying their subscription in Eve by playing the marketplace, buying cheap in one system fly three systems over to sell it at a higher price. It's an actual market just like the guild stores. The kind of auction house y'all want is like a reverse auction house so instead of having one seller and multiple buyers bidding over an item you only have multiple sellers and a single buyer.

The current guild store mechanic allows you to play the market and make money on it by buying from one guild store n selling it for a higher price in the other. So please don't mention games like WoW, Rift, GW2, Tera or any other game like that cause in reality what happen? Well the games launched and people didn't have a lot of money, so they sold their wares on the AH for what they figured was a reasonable price to what they were making an hour questing. Now skip forward a month or two where everyone is max level and making thousands upon thousands an hour. Suddenly those same wares that cost 1k are now worth 10k, a few months later 100k as people make more n more money overall.

So if you want an auction house then I say not without restrictions. Currently Guild Stores mean trading guilds or imo zone specific auction houses. Basically an auction house in Glenumbra will ONLY sell items that are put into the auction house from Glenumbra n will not have any items that are being sold in Bankorai for instance cause those belong to the Bankorai auction house.

TLDR: Y'all want a consumer market not an actual auction house marketplace.

Hawtsauce

put them in Cyrodiil and make them campaign wide

Seraseth

Hawtsauce wrote: »

put them in Cyrodiil and make them campaign wide

Definitely not, no one should be forced to pvp just to have access to buy and sell items.

Crumpy

Just tried using a guild store and it's crap - can't search for stuff easily or compare prices. Or is that just me?

Seraseth

Crumpy wrote: »

Just tried using a guild store and it's crap - can't search for stuff easily or compare prices. Or is that just me?

Yeah, the guild stores are so terribly built as to be nearly useless.

Hawtsauce

Hawtsauce wrote: »
put them in Cyrodiil and make them campaign wide

(Seraseth) "Definitely not, no one should be forced to pvp just to have access to buy and sell items."

i.e - at Morrowwind N gate, its in the safe zone, no carebears will be harmed

the.dzeneralb16_ESO

The idea of guild stores is great, but the execution was poor. I love what they were going for, but hate how it ended up. It needs a lot of tweaks and turns imo. Like the proceeds youre 'taxed' in some way going to the guild for one.

dpayne83_ESO

I prefer the guild AH over an all-encompassing AH. It encourages player interaction . This is ZOS's game, the features are their ideas. Just because this game lacks something that your previous preferred mmo had doesn't mean this should have it. Guild AH are an intentional design feature.

I think the OP is just trying to start something in hopes the devs will change their minds which be more detrimental to the game than help. I mean, just look at the title. Even if people don't read the post; everything about the post is in the title whether it's true or not. ZOS supporting a third party app or site for the purpose of trading isn't necessarily grounds for any claims that they made a mistake by not putting in a central AH. What it means is they support the idea of players interacting for the purposes of trading.

Sorry for the rant but I'm tired of people wanting changes to a game to make their lives easier than intended by design. A game-wide AH allows for making an economy unstable because you'll have players with tons of gold holding monopolies over certain, high-value items. They also tend to give people a gross idea of the value of an item because one person will be trying a get rich quick approach with an item and then other people will see that and think that's it value so now you would have a ton of posts of an item being horribly overpriced. Guild AH allow the items to differ depending on guild culture which allows prices to vary more, almost like bouncing between regions in Eve Online trying to find the best price for something because they are different markets.

Kiwi

KerinKor wrote: »

Thanks for the well-reasoned argument against an AH, I do like intelligent, adult debates.

and we all love flogging dead horses

Seraseth

dpayne83_ESO wrote: »

I prefer the guild AH over an all-encompassing AH. It encourages player interaction.

Why do people keep saying it has player interaction? The guild store has absolutely 0 interaction. You walk up to an npc, post or buy, check your mail. Identical in every way to an AH.

Unless you're counting the 1 time message of 'invite me please' when joining the nameless faceless trade guild as 'player interaction'.

Thesiren

Zenimax needs to incorporate a separate server system to feature an auction house with. Eve Online developers CCP wound up putting Eve's main players-sales zone, star system Jita, onto its own cluster for similar reasons: Players refused to break up their sales all over the place and constantly clustered in Jita to sell their wares instead, crashing Eve's worldwide megaserver constantly. Everyone still sells from Jita to this day, too.

People love to have one-stop shopping with an organized, searchable market available to everyone. This nonsense of selling to 500 players max, and excluding those in small guilds who don't want to show their login credentials to strangers/join big guilds from selling altogether, has got to go.

Drachenfier

Seraseth wrote: »

dpayne83_ESO wrote: »

I prefer the guild AH over an all-encompassing AH. It encourages player interaction.

Why do people keep saying it has player interaction? The guild store has absolutely 0 interaction. You walk up to an npc, post or buy, check your mail. Identical in every way to an AH.

Unless you're counting the 1 time message of 'invite me please' when joining the nameless faceless trade guild as 'player interaction'.

Apparently these guys consider WTB/WTS/WTT zone chat spam as "social interaction". I've seen this come up a couple times, and can't for the life of me figure out how they figure small localized markets contribute to social/player interaction any more than an auction house does.

ShinChuck

jircris11 wrote: »

i honestly like the game with no AH, only people i have seen complain about the anti AH system are people who are to damned lazy to sell items via zone while exploring.

Worker smarter, not harder. Zenimax making you work harder for no reason does not equal challenge. It's pointless, arbitrarily created work.

Also, with guild store search addons out now that allow you to search five guilds at once, people are finding ways to work smarter, whether you like it or not.

k9mouse wrote: »

I really enjoy talk and trading with REAL people, not some some part of impersonal UI (aka AH). ESO does not need an AH.

And that's fine for you. Why not let those of us who want to use an AH use it, and you and your buddies can keep trading face to face? Perfect compromise, right? Everyone happy?

But let me guess your rebuttal: because everyone would use the AH if it was available, and nobody would want to trade directly with you.

If so many people preferred not to use the AH, you could have both AH and face-to-face coexist just fine. But you need the game to force people to trade directly with you, because otherwise nobody would do it.

pysgod1978b14_ESO

Thesiren wrote: »

Zenimax needs to incorporate a separate server system to feature an auction house with. Eve Online developers CCP wound up putting Eve's main players-sales zone, star system Jita, onto its own cluster for similar reasons: Players refused to break up their sales all over the place and constantly clustered in Jita to sell their wares instead, crashing Eve's worldwide megaserver constantly. Everyone still sells from Jita to this day, too.


Actually, it was originally Yulai until they took out some gates. The reason was due to its proximity to the four nations regions. Jita sits in its place because there are still travel paths through to the other three nations that are usable.

Seraseth

ShinChuck wrote: »

But let me guess your rebuttal: because everyone would use the AH if it was available, and nobody would want to trade directly with you.

If so many people preferred not to use the AH, you could have both AH and face-to-face coexist just fine. But you need the game to force people to trade directly with you, because otherwise nobody would do it.

I see this in so many games. "I don't want to add option B in game, option A by itself is just fine" which usually translates to "I like option A, but if you gave people the choice of option B, no one would touch A with a 10 foot pole, so I want to force everyone do it my way by not having another option"

Monsoon

Auction house will be part of the game in less than a year

Kiash

Seraseth wrote: »

ShinChuck wrote: »

But let me guess your rebuttal: because everyone would use the AH if it was available, and nobody would want to trade directly with you.

If so many people preferred not to use the AH, you could have both AH and face-to-face coexist just fine. But you need the game to force people to trade directly with you, because otherwise nobody would do it.

I see this in so many games. "I don't want to add option B in game, option A by itself is just fine" which usually translates to "I like option A, but if you gave people the choice of option B, no one would touch A with a 10 foot pole, so I want to force everyone do it my way by not having another option"

Conversely, forcing option B on people who don't want option A to disappear is just as selfish. It's a two way street. People should just be happy they are playing an ES MMO and hail the game for it's good features rather nit picking small things that at the end of the day have no true affect on the game's longevity or success.

Ah, to live in a perfect world, where no one is a critic and people move on to other things rather than vocally stamping their feet if they are unhappy with their current set up because they feel life should conform to them rather than vice versa.

Monsoon

The thing is that all the people I know have turned OFF their guild chat because they have zero interest to listen to 15 year olds tantrums or other *** guild chats.

Hence the devs pushed people to create a community that the players themselves do not want. Now those players have to painfully search through 5 different guild stores to find the item they (may) want while ignoring the guild community AND paying a 25% premium for the privilege.

Why do you think that WTS Motif 4 1k PST in /zone is better? I wonder why?
/end sarcasm

Seraseth

Kiash wrote: »

Conversely, forcing option B on people who don't want option A to disappear is just as selfish.

I never once said guild stores should be removed. I'm perfectly happy with them either staying as they are now, a separate entity from the AH, or being a sub part of the AH where you can choose to post an item only to your guild instead of the whole AH.

Kiash

Seraseth wrote: »

Kiash wrote: »

Conversely, forcing option B on people who don't want option A to disappear is just as selfish.

I never once said guild stores should be removed. I'm perfectly happy with them either staying as they are now, a separate entity from the AH, or being a sub part of the AH where you can choose to post an item only to your guild instead of the whole AH.

A centralized AH would remove guild stores whether intentional or not. Path of least resistance.

Seraseth

Kiash wrote: »

A centralized AH would remove guild stores whether intentional or not. Path of least resistance.

There are any number of people who are very set in their ways and will not change even if a simpler alternative is given to them. I think there would still be quite a few guilds of actual like-minded people who wanted to stay with the 'community' approach. This would actually give you some closer knit guilds since they would all share that opinion

And if the current option is totally abandoned for the new option, then it probably wasn't a very good option in the first place.

dpayne83_ESO

Seraseth wrote: »

Unless you're counting the 1 time message of 'invite me please' when joining the nameless faceless trade guild as 'player interaction'.

Actually, paying attention to zone chat to buy and sell is the player interaction. Sure you can join a guild for trading (which I haven't) but not everybody can sell their stuff in the guild AH (because of a 30 listing limit across all your available AH's and not individual AH's. This limit still requires you to sell through other channels if you're moving a lot of wares. Plus it adds to the RP factor to where people can advertise what crafting they have a lot of SP in and the motifs they've collected.

TBH I wouldn't have them put in an all-encompassing AH but instead give the players a chance to set up a player shop. I would set up the UI where if someone set up shop they can set the prices for the item/style. Then someone could come along and put in an order, the money would go into a time limited account where the player wouldn't get it until he made the item which would then be mailed to the customer automatically. Heck, lets throw in a banner and flavor prop to give the players an idea of what the crafter is actually selling when they approach.

I will add that I do agree the guild store could use a little work, though.