Auction house is a must!

jack_slayer

i don't mind the fact not having an AH but then again i would love to see it from other games I've played that's how i made my money but then again i try my best not to buy anything from other players but with AH if i had enough money and some one was selling a gear i wanted i would buy it then. but i have seen the AH crash the games economy also. via hackers I've also seen some games do control trade and have an AH from one post i red on here in other words the dev would set prices on item and lock it in on that so no 1 can would over bid on something. but then again ill just say it simple again i would like to see an AH but then again if its never added it doesn't bother me any either.

tylarthb16_ESO

Wish they'd hurry up and put in a proper AH.

Monkeyshoeslive

I like that atm the economy is manageable. I reckon if a global AH was implemented prices would sky rocket
Quoted from jack_slayer "the dev would set prices on item and lock it in on that so no 1 can would over bid on something"
This I would back

tylarthb16_ESO

Monkeyshoeslive wrote: »

I like that atm the economy is manageable. I reckon if a global AH was implemented prices would sky rocket
Quoted from jack_slayer "the dev would set prices on item and lock it in on that so no 1 can would over bid on something"
This I would back

The economy would behave like a normal one. Like in other MMOs which function pretty well with mass trade options. All the scaremongering is really just that.

Monkeyshoeslive

@tylarthb16_ESO‌

Every MMO economy is way overpriced. I agree that they function, but at a higher rate than they should

AlexDougherty

Monkeyshoeslive wrote: »

I like that atm the economy is manageable. I reckon if a global AH was implemented prices would sky rocket
Quoted from jack_slayer "the dev would set prices on item and lock it in on that so no 1 can would over bid on something"
This I would back

But prices don't skyrocket, on MMOs that have auction houses or the equivalent, the prices quite quickly settle down. People will only bid so much for an item, they might bid more for part of a set, or an iconic item, but not by as much as people keep saying.

People are not going to pay 1 million gold for a Bosmer Racial Motif (for example), not even if they became rare. My experience is with Swtor, some rare items go for ridiculous prices, but never for long, because people see the items and say "What the!!!!!". A piece of gear is only ever going to be worth so much, and all the hysteria in the world isn't going to change that.

You do get the occassional idiot who will pay that much, but thankfully the community will ridicule him/her when they find out how much they spent.

tordr86b16_ESO

For the people that complain about insanely priced motifs, you should be voting yes for an auction house as that would reduce the prices so you can actually afford them.

Knottypine

Monkeyshoeslive wrote: »

I like that atm the economy is manageable. I reckon if a global AH was implemented prices would sky rocket

Prices would fluctuate, pretty much like in real life... supply and demand. I do think you would be pleasantly surprised on how well this could work. And you would have a much more player driven economy which I think is what ESO needs right now.

And it would reduce, if not get rid of all together the WTB and WTS posts in the chat window. Any less unnecessary chat filling up the window is a plus. It would also reduce the amount of times people send money instead of clicking the C.O.D. button.

methjester

AlexDougherty wrote: »

NaciremaDiputs wrote: »

If the market never stabilizes though and manufacturers continue to produce the goods at the same rate and the surplus continues to exist for too long, eventually the bottom falls out of the market for that product and it becomes worthless/unsalable. In the real world, this doesn't happen though because the manufacturers sell the surplus products off to other distributors who can take the product to a different market where there isn't already a surplus. This allows both markets to reach an equilibrium, but it hinges upon the markets not having a large over-lap of consumers because if the same consumers exist in both markets, then they can't lessen the impact of the surplus and both markets will bottom-out and render the product worthless/unsalable.

That is why I'm opposed to global auction houses. Feel free to disagree.

It's a game, the devs can alter or even cancel the rate at which items drop.
Swtor has something like an Auction house (admittedly with smaller servers), it just adjusts the drop rates every fortnight or so. With a bigger server they would probably need to adjust every week (maintenance would be a good time), but the economy wouldn't collapse.

Besides one thing SWTOR showed is no matter how rare an item, two thirds of the playerbase won't pay above a certain price, and most of the other third will only pay if they are finishing off collections. People have an idea of what they want to pay, too high and they don't pay, too cheap and they buy it and bung it back on to sell themselves.

In a lot of ways ESO is a lot like Star Wars. Buggy, no end game, bad PVP. At least they had an economy though. People left it in mass at the end of the first month... just like ESO. History is repeating.

The parallels are amazing if you really look, but there are more broken things here.

alanspurlock_ESO

Khandi wrote: »

Why is everyone so determined to say ESO is *not* a 'WoW clone'??

1. Questing/Progression
2. Crafting
3. Looting
4. Dungeons
5. Partys
6. Raids
7. Mounts
8. Factions
9. PvP
10. PvE
11. Lore

And the list goes on....except a trade broker of some sort....and we even have that, albeit a bad one, in my opinion. This is such a bad defense as to why people don't want a trade broker. People that do want a public trade broker are willing to compromise for a faction or zone based one but all the "fanbois" are just argumentative. It will not destroy the already nonexistent economy that we have now.

WoW was the fore runner in all this and is STILL the gold standard when it comes to MMOs otherwise no one would ever mention it.

So let's hear why this isn't a "reskined" WoW.

So.. by that logic..

EQ, UO, and DAOC... are all WoW reskins as well? Seems a little tough to believe that.

Wouldn't WoW be reskins of those, but with a few new features? xD

Gwarok

tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »

For the people that complain about insanely priced motifs, you should be voting yes for an auction house as that would reduce the prices so you can actually afford them.

#[FiddleSticks]!

If you can NOT find ANY of the motifs that are in game as of now and buy them from someone (like me, that is if I even charge you at all) for LESS than 20k gold then you're doing it WRONG!!!!
___________________________________________________
To quote a lorebook you can easily find ingame:

"Strive for balance of all things. When the scales tip to one side or the other, someone or somethings gets short-changed. When someone gets sort-changed, unpredictability and strife unbalance the world around us...To achieve freedom from greed, from want, and from strife, all parties in any exchange MUST find balance." -House Hlaalu's Philosophy of Trade

Having an AH implemented would, IMO, completely wreck the economical bartering system already put into play by the developers and would (at least to me) shatter part of my...


...wait for it...




....IMMERSION!

methjester

Gwarok wrote: »

tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »

For the people that complain about insanely priced motifs, you should be voting yes for an auction house as that would reduce the prices so you can actually afford them.

#[FiddleSticks]!
___________________________________________________

"Strive for balance of all things. When the scales tip to one side or the other, someone or somethings gets short-changed. When someone gets sort-changed, unpredictability and strife unbalance the world around us...To achieve freedom from greed, from want, and from strife, all parties in any exchange MUST find balance." -House Hlaalu's Philosophy of Trade

Having an AH implemented would, IMO, completely wreck the economical bartering system already put into play by the developers and would (at least to me) shatter part of my...


...wait for it...




....IMMERSION!

Immersion in an MMO? Are you sure Multi-players games are are the thing for that? Nothing says getting lost in a fantasy world like running trough a zone with 500 other people at a time and sharing a kill with a guy named "Rhubarb Pie".

LordNowe

alanspurlock_ESO wrote: »

Khandi wrote: »

Why is everyone so determined to say ESO is *not* a 'WoW clone'??

1. Questing/Progression
2. Crafting
3. Looting
4. Dungeons
5. Partys
6. Raids
7. Mounts
8. Factions
9. PvP
10. PvE
11. Lore

And the list goes on....except a trade broker of some sort....and we even have that, albeit a bad one, in my opinion. This is such a bad defense as to why people don't want a trade broker. People that do want a public trade broker are willing to compromise for a faction or zone based one but all the "fanbois" are just argumentative. It will not destroy the already nonexistent economy that we have now.

WoW was the fore runner in all this and is STILL the gold standard when it comes to MMOs otherwise no one would ever mention it.

So let's hear why this isn't a "reskined" WoW.

So.. by that logic..

EQ, UO, and DAOC... are all WoW reskins as well? Seems a little tough to believe that.

Wouldn't WoW be reskins of those, but with a few new features? xD

Pretty much. WoW became the standard for whatever reason it did (That's such a large argument, let's not even begin to go there), so now people expect that WoW's "Revolutionary" features be implemented everywhere. MMORPG = Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.

Massively Multiplayer doesn't mean "I only have to interact with an auction board to get the item(s) I want". It means other people are playing the same damned game you are, and by no means should you not be interacting with them.

jack_slayer

well one good thing about AH is that you can set an item you want to sell in there for any giving time. and it would reduce the amount of zone chat on trying to sell stuff on there. and also if your not see on what a price may be for an item you are trying to sell you can see what others are selling it for also. but AH do help with trying to sell stuff because the item i may be trying to sell a buyer i'm looking for may not be on at the time and if i leave an item to sell in an AH for so many days it gives it time for other people to see what is all being sold. and more so it could help out crafters on many different levels also. 1. selling/buying the mats 2. selling and buying gear that you worked so hard to make. and want to sell it for a good amount of money. again i still stand on my opion of if they do put an AH in the game awesome if not thats fine by me also.

Arsvita

Kiwi wrote: »

Khandi wrote: »

I was just commenting on the fact that a handful of the biggest guilds will control the market price on things in the open 'world'/'faction'

they have zero effect on anything outside their own guild

thats why this works but you naive greedy little piggys will never understand that

I can say one word, while allowing a GUILD MEMBER of 5 guilds state clearly that the statement Kiwi made, is WRONG!

Malediktus wrote:

Its simple tell them you will only sell per pick up and your prices arent negotiable. Most people will cave in, because thats still better than spending time finding another seller. I can pretty much buy up a lot of stuff from the 5 guild stores have access to and sell it for at least 50-100% more without having to pay any taxes.

Guilds messing with General Economies Outside Of Their Guilds.
You can be in 5 Guilds. That's 2,500 guild members/accounts.
You, I can tell, personally know each and every one of them. That is why you know that membersHave ZERO Effect Outside of Their Own Guild.
So of those 2,500 personally known guild members how many are gold seller accounts? And how many per guild? 1, 2, 500? Or maybe just 499?

Guilds directly affect the market and economy outside of their domains.

Moon-and-Star

Trade chat channel would be ok. but please please no auction house.

andrantos

I can understand the want for a central AH - it would simply make selling stuff easier. Coin is great and we all want coin for various wants/needs.

However, there are problems with an AH, especially in a megaserver context. The biggest issue is that any activity that involves things like duping, exploits, farming, etc... would have impact our "mega" economy far quicker than smaller, localized economies. Yes, these activities will still impact our guild stores, but the impacts are lessened in scope (effectively slowing down or even stopping these impacts in their tracks). All these bots everyone is in uproar about? They would've killed the economy weeks ago if we had a central AH!!

When it is very easy to sell stuff - whether because there is a global AH or you can post stuff to an AH from anywhere in the game (I'm pointing at you GW2) bad things happen...
1) Prices drop dramatically, typically finished goods and any subjectively useful items (potions, enchants, consumables, etc...)
2) Prices on crafting mats typically go up, especially if everyone can gather them (Joe Schmoe wants to make some $$ so he gathers stuff to sell at a ridiculous price).
3) For "true" crafters who want a place in the economy, they will find that is more profitable to sell materials than it is actually to craft and sell finished items (even if it is with self harvested materials).
4) In the case of GW2 where you can post to AH from anywhere... many players would use it as a way to empty their inventory packs. Rather than travel all the way back to vendor, they would post stuff as cheap as possible (avoiding higher fees and increasing their odds of selling stuff).

So, then you say, rather than have a global AH, have local AHs to certain areas/zones/cities/etc... The problem here is that players will naturally gravitate towards selling items in one AH. This happened in FF14 eventually as less and less players sold stuff in Limsa and Grid in order to sell stuff in Ul'Dah which had more player foot traffic.

The Guild Store works... but then it doesn't. There are a few problems, and I believe with a few tweaks, it could provide for a reasonably healthy economy...
1) Fix search... period. I shouldn't have to rely on a mod in order to make search work. Search is broken... fix it!
2) Fees in general for both the store and COD should be revisited. They are just... "high". I would argue each guild should have some control over fee's. This would create some fun, healthy competition amongst trade guilds.
3) Trading chat channels
4) 24-48h Expiration on COD mails (don't know if this exists, but it should)

Right now it is painful to both buy and sell stuff. It can be hard to gauge how much items may be worth in your guild stores when you can't even find them! Buying is equally problematic because you simply can't find stuff.

Overall though, the great thing about this setup is that if you truly want to be active in the player economy - you have to have your wits about you (moreso now than necessary do to searching issues). This isn't going to be like other games where you can simply dump your inventory into an AH and "make money".

Like in real-life, you will need to understand what is in demand, what isn't, where supply is needed, etc... (which is more difficult than it should be because of the searching issues).

So stop the AH crap and start begging Zenimax for better Guild Store searching. That is what we really need.

Elirienne

Auction house is not *needed* by any means. wE've all been playing the game fantastically without it. I hope there won't be one.This game should stay different. Everything that is different from other mmos, I welcome.

Blackwidow

andrantos wrote: »

I can understand the want for a central AH - it would simply make selling stuff easier. Coin is great and we all want coin for various wants/needs.

However, there are problems with an AH, especially in a megaserver context. The biggest issue is that any activity that involves things like duping, exploits, farming, etc...

Good thing we don't have that now!

Elirienne

Actually, another real reason for not needing AH is that gold is extremely easy to come by, and not that easy to spend. The only really expensive things are bag space and bank space, but not everyone needs the upgrades. So really, the only thing you ever spend REAL gold on, is motifs, but that only once, and possibly some yellow mats. A horse, as a one-off investment, possibly. Nothing else really costs money, even at v5 I am only paying like 2k gold for full repairs. So basically it's easy to earn, hard to spend. At V levels, you get about 30k per hour/two hours without even breaking a sweat, just questing and vendoring loot you find.. If you are specifically "farming for gold", I am sure you can get more. i have never seen the need to trade so far, and i am v5.

Utildai

Well, supposedly they are going to open up a server wide auction house to the ''highest bidding guild''. I'm assuming this means everyone will be able to buy/sell on this specific guild's store once that happens.

Jeremy

Elirienne wrote: »

Actually, another real reason for not needing AH is that gold is extremely easy to come by, and not that easy to spend. The only really expensive things are bag space and bank space, but not everyone needs the upgrades. So really, the only thing you ever spend REAL gold on, is motifs, but that only once, and possibly some yellow mats. A horse, as a one-off investment, possibly. Nothing else really costs money, even at v5 I am only paying like 2k gold for full repairs. So basically it's easy to earn, hard to spend. At V levels, you get about 30k per hour/two hours without even breaking a sweat, just questing and vendoring loot you find.. If you are specifically "farming for gold", I am sure you can get more. i have never seen the need to trade so far, and i am v5.

Oh I disagree with this. Just repair bills alone are insane enough that gold is valuable. So we must be playing different games if you think gold on this game is hard to spend. Cause I have no problems making my gold go away. And that's not even counting when I decide to spend small fortunes on crafting materials like dwarf oil on the rare occasion I can find it for sale. Or when I decide to pay thousands to re-spec my character.

But if you have endless amounts of gold with no where to spend it, by all means mail it to me. I will be more than happy to take it off your hands.

Jeremy

andrantos wrote: »

So stop the AH crap and start begging Zenimax for better Guild Store searching. That is what we really need.

It's not crap. What's really crap is these Guild Stores.

The interface is terrible. So I do agree with you on that. But that is just a lack of convenience and the problem with Guild Stores goes much deeper than that.

You cannot have an effective economy with only 500 people. Especially on an MMORPG where the activity of players is so random and unpredictable. So to say the current system is fine it just needs a better search options is missing the real issue.

Jeremy

Utildai wrote: »

Well, supposedly they are going to open up a server wide auction house to the ''highest bidding guild''. I'm assuming this means everyone will be able to buy/sell on this specific guild's store once that happens.

It's a start. Though I am dubious as to rather it will actually help. Because this is a system that could be easily abused and basically gives one guild the opportunity to *** everyone economically - since they will be the only supplier everyone can access and can pretty much charge what ever they want.
-
As I have said in an earlier post - they should just put up a sign that says gold buyers welcome because this kiosk has the potential to become just that.

Jeremy

Blackwidow wrote: »

andrantos wrote: »

I can understand the want for a central AH - it would simply make selling stuff easier. Coin is great and we all want coin for various wants/needs.

However, there are problems with an AH, especially in a megaserver context. The biggest issue is that any activity that involves things like duping, exploits, farming, etc...

Good thing we don't have that now!

Right. Because clearly the absence of an auction house has preventing duping, exploits, and bot farming. Oh wait, no it hasn't.

An argument is not very persuasive when the things you are claiming they prevent is still going on.

andrantos

Jeremy wrote: »

andrantos wrote: »

So stop the AH crap and start begging Zenimax for better Guild Store searching. That is what we really need.

It's not crap. What's really crap is these Guild Stores.

The interface is terrible. So I do agree with you on that. But that is just a lack of convenience and the problem with Guild Stores goes much deeper than that.

You cannot have an effective economy with only 500 people. Especially on an MMORPG where the activity of players is so random and unpredictable. So to say the current system is fine it just needs a better search option is missing the real issue.

No it is not missing the real issue. I understand the issue loud and clear. The issue isn't the concept of a Guild Store or a lack of a AH. That isn't the issue.

The issue is, as you put it, the lack of convenience of buying and selling goods to other players. It isn't the presence of a guild store. It isn't the lack of an auction house. If the guild store had a fairly standard search and filtering interface, we wouldn't be having this thread.... Why?

You would be able to find stuff to buy. You would be able to find stuff to price check against. You would be able to quickly and efficiently compare prices amongst your trade guilds (and do what many people do in real life.... buy goods in one market and resell for a profit in another market).

I LOVE the fact that zone chat is filled with players looking to buy, looking to sell and looking to trade (I just wish there was an official zone-based trade channel).

One of the reasons we have multiple guilds is so you can belong to multiple communities (the communities you join up to you!). You don't have to join a trade guild, but if you wish to partake in the economy, it may be more efficient to do so. Belonging to multiple trade guilds also expands your potential buying and selling market. It provides ample trading opportunities. Those opportunities would be best found with a better searching interface.

The problem with MMO players in general, is they want something new until they can't wrap their minds around those new ideas. Yes, an AH would make selling/buying more convenient only because you'd have the entire megaserver at your disposal.... but at a cost of an interesting economy. At that point, as we saw with GW2, you'd be better off vendoring your "junk".

When Zenimax puts in a better searching interface, many things will happen. Players will be able to find things they want easier... making it easier and more efficient to sell stuff. It will expose "substandard" trading guilds. Maybe your trading guild is more social than it is trading (more players are posting stuff to sell then they are actually buying anything).

Lastly, MMO economies have become relatively thoughtless. It's just a tad bit too easy to put something up in an AH and let it sell. Here you have to put in the effort to understand the economy in order to partake.

pknecron

Dumbledalf wrote: »

Also until you get a trade channel just ignore the people that spam the most, it isnt difficult and wont ruin the games economy.

[/quote]

I'm already doing this to the extremely repetitive sellers and also gold spammers.

I wonder how many people I can actually ignore is there a limit?

But I don't like to ignore too many people what if I'm selling something personally and cant here the person who wants to buy it because I have him/her on ignore?

[/quote]

Get the http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info211-X4DLibAntiSpam.html add-on. Not only does it block gold sellers it auto blocks zone chat spammers, and uses it's on library for ignores so you don't fill up the game one.

Elirienne

Jeremy wrote: »

Elirienne wrote: »

Actually, another real reason for not needing AH is that gold is extremely easy to come by, and not that easy to spend. The only really expensive things are bag space and bank space, but not everyone needs the upgrades. So really, the only thing you ever spend REAL gold on, is motifs, but that only once, and possibly some yellow mats. A horse, as a one-off investment, possibly. Nothing else really costs money, even at v5 I am only paying like 2k gold for full repairs. So basically it's easy to earn, hard to spend. At V levels, you get about 30k per hour/two hours without even breaking a sweat, just questing and vendoring loot you find.. If you are specifically "farming for gold", I am sure you can get more. i have never seen the need to trade so far, and i am v5.

Oh I disagree with this. Just repair bills alone are insane enough that gold is valuable. So we must be playing different games if you think gold on this game is hard to spend. Cause I have no problems making my gold go away. And that's not even counting when I decide to spend small fortunes on crafting materials like dwarf oil on the rare occasion I can find it for sale. Or when I decide to pay thousands to re-spec my character.

But if you have endless amounts of gold with no where to spend it, by all means mail it to me. I will be more than happy to take it off your hands.

Haha, I didn't say I had endless amounts. I just have much more than what I actually need. I never buy gear, I use whatever drops. Repair, as I said, is about 2-3k per full repair, whch is needed about 3-4 times a week. Repair bills ARe insane as you say, but gold is flowing in steadily. What are you doing with your endless amount of drops? Vendoring a full 100/100 inventory down to about 10/100 yields you about 5k if not more! and about 3-4 quests fill up your inventory to may with drops and whatnot. I genuinely don't get how people can be out of gold in the game.

Blackwidow

Jeremy wrote: »

Blackwidow wrote: »

andrantos wrote: »

I can understand the want for a central AH - it would simply make selling stuff easier. Coin is great and we all want coin for various wants/needs.

However, there are problems with an AH, especially in a megaserver context. The biggest issue is that any activity that involves things like duping, exploits, farming, etc...

Good thing we don't have that now!

Right. Because clearly the absence of an auction house has preventing duping, exploits, and bot farming. Oh wait, no it hasn't.

An argument is not very persuasive when the things you are claiming they prevent is still going on.

Exactly.

Jeremy

alanspurlock_ESO wrote: »

Khandi wrote: »

Why is everyone so determined to say ESO is *not* a 'WoW clone'??

1. Questing/Progression
2. Crafting
3. Looting
4. Dungeons
5. Partys
6. Raids
7. Mounts
8. Factions
9. PvP
10. PvE
11. Lore

And the list goes on....except a trade broker of some sort....and we even have that, albeit a bad one, in my opinion. This is such a bad defense as to why people don't want a trade broker. People that do want a public trade broker are willing to compromise for a faction or zone based one but all the "fanbois" are just argumentative. It will not destroy the already nonexistent economy that we have now.

WoW was the fore runner in all this and is STILL the gold standard when it comes to MMOs otherwise no one would ever mention it.

So let's hear why this isn't a "reskined" WoW.

So.. by that logic..

EQ, UO, and DAOC... are all WoW reskins as well? Seems a little tough to believe that.

Wouldn't WoW be reskins of those, but with a few new features? xD

Her post was meant to be sarcastic. So I think you see her point if you take it into that context ^^

andrantos wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

andrantos wrote: »

So stop the AH crap and start begging Zenimax for better Guild Store searching. That is what we really need.

It's not crap. What's really crap is these Guild Stores.

The interface is terrible. So I do agree with you on that. But that is just a lack of convenience and the problem with Guild Stores goes much deeper than that.

You cannot have an effective economy with only 500 people. Especially on an MMORPG where the activity of players is so random and unpredictable. So to say the current system is fine it just needs a better search option is missing the real issue.

No it is not missing the real issue. I understand the issue loud and clear. The issue isn't the concept of a Guild Store or a lack of a AH. That isn't the issue.

Yes, you are missing the real issue. As I said, the problem is the system itself. Guild Stores isolate the economy into tiny ineffective pools and that is the real problem. It would be the same as walking into a ghost town cut off from the rest of the world where hardly any people live and expecting it to have a thriving economy. Just not going to happen.

Lack of an auction horse or at least some kind of broader-based marketing system that gives more people access is the problem here. It's not the lack of a search feature, which I'll admit is annoying as all get out. But as I said, the real problem here goes much much deeper than a flawed interface.

andrantos wrote: »

I LOVE the fact that zone chat is filled with players looking to buy, looking to sell and looking to trade (I just wish there was an official zone-based trade channel).

Just curious, but do you also love watching commercials on your television too? Because I turn the channel. But if you LOVE watching people try to sell you stuff over and over more power to you. But I'm guessing a lot of us do not.