Big nerf: damage shield of fatecarver…

AJTC5000

Kinda sounds to me that you are over-relying on Fatecarver alone. While the damage shield is good, as others have pointed out in this thread it will really depend on what you are trying to beat. Cloudrest has a lot of Oblivion damage - your shield will help against the non-Oblivion damage, sure, but maybe you'd be better off with a heal in this case?

Consider some of the other skills in an Arcanist's toolkit:

- Cephaliarch's Flail - not only generates crux for you to boost your Fatecarver, but also gives you a small chunk of burst heal
- Runeguard of Freedom - grants Armour and damage reduction, and consumes the damage reduction to give you a burst heal when you take damage under 50% of your health
- Cruxweaver Armor - more Armour whilst also generating Crux on damage taken

And even options in general:
- Ring of the Pale Order for your solo content - this will make your beam actually heal you, along with the damage shield, as you do damage.
- Blade Cloak - reduces the damage you take from AoEs - i.e. anything you might have stood in accidentally during a trial.
- Vigor - mostly the selfish Resolving morph is a ~4k/s HoT

A lot of content in ESO requires proper practice to beat, you're not gonna be able to stroll into a DLC Vet HM and expect to clear first time. What might work for pro players might not work for you, it's up to you to put the time in and play with different options to see what works best. Good luck though!

Soarora

Baertram wrote: »

arcs all like to stand behind for some reason!

It's not only Arcs! SO MANY players run behind the "front conal heal skill using" healers and if you move they run away again.
Or even step out of ultimates that help em.
So annoying if ppl do not know other classes/skills or where to position.

As if they fear they cannot see properly anymore if you move behind them

My only guess is people do that so they can see their own character animations.

subarctic

“ Show us the respective passages in ToS explaining, that access to eso's service is equal to "getting everything in the game" and I'll consider your argument.”

People don’t read the ToS for that, because everyone knows that MMORPGs are all about progression. But ESO stops vertical progression around 1500 cp. A player like me will then complain and whine in the forum, and get ignored or criticized, before concluding that it’s no point playing a game that’s beyond my skill level. Fine, one less customer for ESO. Will still play some content but will buy less. I used to be a “whale” in the crown store, not anymore.

sarahthes

Soarora wrote: »

Baertram wrote: »

arcs all like to stand behind for some reason!

It's not only Arcs! SO MANY players run behind the "front conal heal skill using" healers and if you move they run away again.
Or even step out of ultimates that help em.
So annoying if ppl do not know other classes/skills or where to position.

As if they fear they cannot see properly anymore if you move behind them

My only guess is people do that so they can see their own character animations.

This is why I use hide group.

Soarora

subarctic wrote: »

“ Show us the respective passages in ToS explaining, that access to eso's service is equal to "getting everything in the game" and I'll consider your argument.”

People don’t read the ToS for that, because everyone knows that MMORPGs are all about progression. But ESO stops vertical progression around 1500 cp. A player like me will then complain and whine in the forum, and get ignored or criticized, before concluding that it’s no point playing a game that’s beyond my skill level. Fine, one less customer for ESO.

You have to actually practice to get good. Parsing isn’t just to show off damage, it’s how you learn your rotation so it becomes easier to do in content. Training runs for vet and HM exist to teach people mechanics. I don’t think a single person is “talented” as an endgamer, they’ve just been practicing. It’s a noticeable curve over time, I find content easy now I found incredibly difficult before because I’ve done a lot of content now. Playtime doesn’t mean anything unless the playtime includes practicing, you can be a casual for 50 years and never be ready for a trial trifecta because you haven't learned that kind of content. At first, you will die, a lot. But then you learn why you died and you get better and better until you don’t die as much anymore.

sarahthes

subarctic wrote: »

“ Show us the respective passages in ToS explaining, that access to eso's service is equal to "getting everything in the game" and I'll consider your argument.”

People don’t read the ToS for that, because everyone knows that MMORPGs are all about progression. But ESO stops vertical progression around 1500 cp. A player like me will then complain and whine in the forum, and get ignored or criticized, before concluding that it’s no point playing a game that’s beyond my skill level. Fine, one less customer for ESO. Will still play some content but will buy less. I used to be a “whale” in the crown store, not anymore.

Wait long enough and the content will get nerfed or power crept. If you can't get a trifecta like IR, Dawnbringer, or TTT at this point then I don't know what to tell you. The only really hard content these days is PB, Swash, and MM.

Braffin

subarctic wrote: »

“ Show us the respective passages in ToS explaining, that access to eso's service is equal to "getting everything in the game" and I'll consider your argument.”

People don’t read the ToS for that, because everyone knows that MMORPGs are all about progression. But ESO stops vertical progression around 1500 cp. A player like me will then complain and whine in the forum, and get ignored or criticized, before concluding that it’s no point playing a game that’s beyond my skill level. Fine, one less customer for ESO.

May I ask then how many online-games you have completed 100% already?

Because I never managed to do so regardless of not having problems with harder content in eso.

You are right tho, MMOs are about progression, eso not being an exception to that rule. Build progression is only a part of combat mastery in action-oriented rpgs like eso, the other being player skill (everything from correct movement, reflexes and muscle memory to situational awareness and group behaviour belongs here).

To do well in harder content you have to progress both parts, not solely your build. The latter will never fully bypass the need of practicing movement etc. nor should it.

thorwyn

If you can't get a trifecta like IR, Dawnbringer, or TTT at this point then I don't know what to tell you.

So do you have any of those trifectas? If not, why?

sarahthes

thorwyn wrote: »

If you can't get a trifecta like IR, Dawnbringer, or TTT at this point then I don't know what to tell you.

So do you have any of those trifectas? If not, why?

Me? Yes. I have all of them except Swash and MM. Currently progging Swash.

thorwyn

Me? Yes. I have all of them except Swash and MM. Currently progging Swash.

Oh! I'm sorry, I confused you with OP. Your names are pretty similar at first glance.

AlterBlika

subarctic wrote: »

“With all due respect if someone is less skilled they shouldn't be doing hard content.”

With all due respect, I’m a long-term subscriber to ESO and have invested a lot of time and money on this game, so I will express my discontent when devs make changes that excludes me and other less talented gamers from hard content that I have paid for.

This could have been solved easily if ESO had not stopped vertical progression at around 1500 cp. If it was possible to get skins and personalities from the hardest content if one had 36,000 cp (10 x more than what the best gamers have today), then I would have played a 110 years + 53 hours to get all those cp, but today I’m blocked from doing hard content because the latter depends on talent and gaming skills that I simply don’t have.

You can access hard content. You do actually pay for access to the game. But it doesn't mean that every achievement should be given to you, you can't buy them in crown store after all.

doabhi

if you're worried about your damage shield consider trying Hexos ward set if you can work it in to your build some how. That set makes for a decent solo build item since it grants you a damage shield every 6 seconds when you do crit damage (Which is basically all the time if you run it with Khajiit)

Reginald_leBlem

subarctic wrote: »

“meeting the requirements”

My subscription is the requirement. When you pay for an MMORPG, you expect a gameplay of progression that eventually makes it possible to get everything the game has to offer.

If you read what I wrote above, you will notice that I’m willing to spend many years on farming cp, so that I, in a distant future, can do content that once was very hard in the past. At that point, in a distant future, elite players have already moved on to even harder content. ESO, in other words, lacks a good system for progression.

What you need to be willing to do is learn mechanics. More CP is meaningless. If you are relying so heavily on a shield, you are not avoiding damage the game is counting on you to avoid.

People didn't like pve content just being stack and burn, they wanted dps to be forced to move around, do mechanics, and in general more than dummy parse on bosses.

Zos has delivered! So, don't expect to be able to just stand and parse. Learn the mechanics.

subarctic

“You can access hard content. You do actually pay for access to the game. But it doesn't mean that every achievement should be given to you”

If you spend 2-10 years on grinding cp to do hard content, then a reward is not given to you freely.

[Snip] it’s capped at 1500. This excludes many less talented customers from playing endgame content. Ok, as I said in the OP:

“Guess my days in vet trials are over. Damn.

Have fun the rest of you who are not unskilled like me (with 1500+ cp…)“

[Edited for bashing]

sarahthes

subarctic wrote: »

“You can access hard content. You do actually pay for access to the game. But it doesn't mean that every achievement should be given to you”

If you spend 2-10 years on grinding cp to do hard content, then a reward is not given to you freely.

[Snip] it’s capped at 1500. This excludes many less talented customers from playing endgame content. Ok, as I said in the OP:

“Guess my days in vet trials are over. Damn.

Have fun the rest of you who are not unskilled like me (with 1500+ cp…)“

I only have one last question for you - have you even TRIED with the smaller shield? Like I have, and it's not that bad.

[Edited quote]

Ph1p

subarctic wrote: »

[Snip] it’s capped at 1500. This excludes many less talented customers from playing endgame content. Ok, as I said in the OP:

“Guess my days in vet trials are over. Damn.

Have fun the rest of you who are not unskilled like me (with 1500+ cp…)“

Every single RPG caps character/build progression at some point. Improving beyond this requires either skill progression, power creep, or content nerf.

Besides, if ESO kept giving players more power until CP3600, it would only increase the damage output of endgamers as well as the power gap between them and beginners. Guess which way endgame content difficulty would move in this situation?

[Edited quote]

Aldoss

subarctic wrote: »

“ Show us the respective passages in ToS explaining, that access to eso's service is equal to "getting everything in the game" and I'll consider your argument.”

People don’t read the ToS for that, because everyone knows that MMORPGs are all about progression. But ESO stops vertical progression around 1500 cp. A player like me will then complain and whine in the forum, and get ignored or criticized, before concluding that it’s no point playing a game that’s beyond my skill level. Fine, one less customer for ESO. Will still play some content but will buy less. I used to be a “whale” in the crown store, not anymore.

This comment is pretty dangerous. The argument is almost word for word, "I pay a lot of money for this game so I should have access to everything, even things that are locked behind skill caps".

The poster is asking that ESO become p2w.

No thanks!

subarctic

“it's not that bad”

The nerf seems like more than 12%. Even died twice in a non-dlc dungeon today, but done those since 2014, so not exciting even if I now have to pay a tiny bit attention to what I’m doing in a non-dlc dungeon. I’m glad I at least got the beast personality before they nerfed the shield. Anyway, no point discussing this anymore. ESO will not change this. Now I’m waiting for another MMORPG I can play.

Soarora

sarahthes wrote: »

subarctic wrote: »

“ Show us the respective passages in ToS explaining, that access to eso's service is equal to "getting everything in the game" and I'll consider your argument.”

People don’t read the ToS for that, because everyone knows that MMORPGs are all about progression. But ESO stops vertical progression around 1500 cp. A player like me will then complain and whine in the forum, and get ignored or criticized, before concluding that it’s no point playing a game that’s beyond my skill level. Fine, one less customer for ESO. Will still play some content but will buy less. I used to be a “whale” in the crown store, not anymore.

Wait long enough and the content will get nerfed or power crept. If you can't get a trifecta like IR, Dawnbringer, or TTT at this point then I don't know what to tell you. The only really hard content these days is PB, Swash, and MM.

I want to add in here that my TTT actually had an older person who struggled a lot with reflex times… they still got the TTT, well deserved and earned. But goes to show, TTT really is not far out of reach even if it seems like it is.

ZOS_Icy

Greetings,

We have recently removed some unnecessary back and forth from this thread. This is a reminder to keep the discussion civil and constructive. Please keep our Community Rules in mind moving forward.

Thank you for your understanding.

Soarora

subarctic wrote: »

“it's not that bad”

The nerf seems like more than 12%. Even died twice in a non-dlc dungeon today, but done those since 2014, so not exciting even if I now have to pay a tiny bit attention to what I’m doing in a non-dlc dungeon. I’m glad I at least got the beast personality before they nerfed the shield. Anyway, no point discussing this anymore. ESO will not change this. Now I’m waiting for another MMORPG I can play.

ESO is considered casual-friendly and one of the easier MMORPGs, I don’t think you’re ever going to find a MMORPG where all content in the game is ESO overland level of difficulty.

I still have to pay attention to what I’m doing in a non-DLC dungeon, they still have mechanics. If you don’t want to do mechanics, do normal content. If you want to do vet content, learn mechanics.

kojou

Well I was taking advantage of Pragmatic, but I knew this nerf was coming. The shield was just too good. That said, I'm probably not going to switch morphs for the small amount of additional DPS the other morph does.

subarctic

“The poster is asking that ESO become p2w”

No, I’m not.

subarctic

“I don’t think you’re ever going to find a MMORPG where all content in the game is ESO overland level of difficulty.”

It’s funny that in another thread I have argued that ESO overland is too easy, and then many disagreed with that too.Now I’m saying that it was more inclusive when we had the old pragmatic shield in endgame content, and many now disagree

If a game has too easy overland and too difficult endgame content, then one just has to move on, or play less by enjoying other content in the game, like housing or ToT. There are some furnishing rewards in PvP that I like, so will focus on that and do less PvE while waiting for a new MMORPG that got a better progression system hopefully.

Rkindaleft

sarahthes wrote: »

Ph1p wrote: »

subarctic wrote: »

“understand that it had to go.”

Why? Talented gamers don’t use pragmatic fatecarver anyway. Now we get more wipes in PUGs, more toxicity incoming in chat…

Literally every Arcanist is (and most likely will be) using Pragmatic Fatecarver in group PVE, including beginner, intermediate, experienced, and score-pushing players.

You already called the shield a "placebo effect" that's just "in your head", so I have every confidence that you can actually do vet trials and other content. You probably already considered it, but I would also recommend finding a beginner-friendly guild to run trials instead of PUGs, if you are learning.

LOL you are wrong about endgamers using pragmatic. Only time we use it is in 4 man content with 3 DDs and no healer. In trials we use exhausting.

Our group got planesbreaker with the shield morph recently so we wouldn't have as many random deaths on Oax and add pulls. I think you'd be surprised how many teams use it if they already have the damage. Maybe it's just a console thing, idk.

I do agree that OP just needs to try it out. I tried it on PTS and the nerf simply isn't as big of a deal as people are making it out to be.

Vulkunne

Sorry don't have any of them Trifectos. They sound kind of expensive...

I live in a dirty stone cave, ride a grizzly bear (instead of a high-horse or camel) and carry a big stick. So yeah that's what I got... what more could anyone possibly want?

Pixiepumpkin

The OP is correct. The insane nerf/bug fix to the shield is completely unwarranted when you consider how long the channel is and how slow the character moves while channeling, meaning you are going to take damage.

"getting out of the red" is going to result in a DPS loss so that is not the solution, unless we buff fatecarver....ohh wait, it took a DPS nerf as well.

The damage shield should be strong enough to face tank anything in game for the duration of that 3 crux channel, that is how it used to work, that is how it should work now.

Soarora

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

The OP is correct. The insane nerf/bug fix to the shield is completely unwarranted when you consider how long the channel is and how slow the character moves while channeling, meaning you are going to take damage.

"getting out of the red" is going to result in a DPS loss so that is not the solution, unless we buff fatecarver....ohh wait, it took a DPS nerf as well.

The damage shield should be strong enough to face tank anything in game for the duration of that 3 crux channel, that is how it used to work, that is how it should work now.

Arcanist is the strongest content DPS in the game for more than one reason. It has more cleave damage, less actions per minute, and more tankiness. You should not be able to “face tank anything in the game” because that is the job of the tank. DPS are supposed to be a bit squishy so the healers and tanks have to do their jobs. I didn’t really care about the shield strength, but it did become a strat to just “beam through” damage/mechanics.

Pixiepumpkin

Soarora wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

The OP is correct. The insane nerf/bug fix to the shield is completely unwarranted when you consider how long the channel is and how slow the character moves while channeling, meaning you are going to take damage.

"getting out of the red" is going to result in a DPS loss so that is not the solution, unless we buff fatecarver....ohh wait, it took a DPS nerf as well.

The damage shield should be strong enough to face tank anything in game for the duration of that 3 crux channel, that is how it used to work, that is how it should work now.

Arcanist is the strongest content DPS in the game for more than one reason. It has more cleave damage, less actions per minute, and more tankiness. You should not be able to “face tank anything in the game” because that is the job of the tank. DPS are supposed to be a bit squishy so the healers and tanks have to do their jobs. I didn’t really care about the shield strength, but it did become a strat to just “beam through” damage/mechanics.

[Snip]

But to your point, that is the issue. The shield does not hold long enoguh now to ensure you wont die inside of the channel..AND no, arcanist is NOT the strongest DPS, STAMINA arcainst is ONE of the strongest DPS, magicka lies literally about smack dab in the middle. Except the fatecarver nerf affected magicka and stamina equally.

[Edited for baiting]

Soarora

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

Pixiepumpkin wrote: »

The OP is correct. The insane nerf/bug fix to the shield is completely unwarranted when you consider how long the channel is and how slow the character moves while channeling, meaning you are going to take damage.

"getting out of the red" is going to result in a DPS loss so that is not the solution, unless we buff fatecarver....ohh wait, it took a DPS nerf as well.

The damage shield should be strong enough to face tank anything in game for the duration of that 3 crux channel, that is how it used to work, that is how it should work now.

Arcanist is the strongest content DPS in the game for more than one reason. It has more cleave damage, less actions per minute, and more tankiness. You should not be able to “face tank anything in the game” because that is the job of the tank. DPS are supposed to be a bit squishy so the healers and tanks have to do their jobs. I didn’t really care about the shield strength, but it did become a strat to just “beam through” damage/mechanics.

[Snip]

But to your point, that is the issue. The shield does not hold long enoguh now to ensure you wont die inside of the channel..AND no, arcanist is NOT the strongest DPS, STAMINA arcainst is ONE of the strongest DPS, magicka lies literally about smack dab in the middle. Except the fatecarver nerf affected magicka and stamina equally.

I mean, a little add isn't going to hurt a healer or a DPS very much, but a big add definitely would and if a tank doesn't prioritize taunting those that's on them. You shouldn't be ensured to not die while channeling, being able to go invincible (let alone do mass amounts of damage while doing so) is incredibly unbalanced. Not to say one was invincible before, but wording does matter.

And yeah, magarc is really bad. I tell people magarc is stamarc but objectively worse because it basically is. There's potential to make magarc decent by buffing them so that they use runeblades and mag flail but it'd still be more complicated than stamarc without the benefit of coral riptide.

[Edited quote]