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DPS is too stressful and not fun

Ironside
Ironside
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Title^

After doing all the research, acquired the gear, practiced the rotation, downloaded all of the add-ons, and tried my darnedest to get the "acceptable" community numbers -- ESO is officially no longer fun. It is soooo freaking annoying to play what is "good" vs what you "enjoy". AND! What you enjoy may not even be good enough to really play questing to it's best possible outcome. Doable, yes 100%, but really good? Not always.

Most(all) DPS options should feel powerful, not just the 'insert' flavor of the month. I honestly think this is why most guild leaders and officers ** I ** (see that? I (meaning me and maybe not you)!!!!) have seen are tanks and healers. There is so much less stress to perform at an over tuned coffee fiend level. Know the content, lead, and not worry about numbers. How lovely that must be.
  • YetAnotherLinuxUser
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    well, the grass is always greener over the septic tank.... try doing overland content with a sword and board or a resto staff.. better still put a swoard and board on your front bar and a resto staff with defending trait on the back and watch the yawn fest commence! YOu will then realize why overland content is so easy...
  • CameraBeardThePirate
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    I think you might be getting too caught up in the numbers.

    Outside of the best of the best score pushers, you can absolutely play the build you want while still having plenty of DPS to get through 90% of the content in the game.

    For example, I mainly PvP. Even in scenarios where I need to farm a vet dungeon with some friends for the hot new monster set, I'm in my PvP gear and just slot a few more DoTs in place of PvP skills.

    If the guild you're in is being ornery or gatekeeping runs based on your gear, then I'd recommend finding a more casual guild. Everyone is entitled to playing how you want.
  • Ironside
    Ironside
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    well, the grass is always greener over the septic tank.... try doing overland content with a sword and board or a resto staff.. better still put a swoard and board on your front bar and a resto staff with defending trait on the back and watch the yawn fest commence! YOu will then realize why overland content is so easy...

    I may let you know, starting out as a healer to so how it goes. Right now I'd rather yawn, then getting up from the computer with a breathing problem trying to push the "almighty" numbers everyone cares so darn much about. Imho, ZOS needs to end Add-ons or just DPS meters for the decency of the community.
  • Araneae6537
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    If light attack weaving is too aggravating, a heavy attack build with Oakensoul is also viable, or Arcanist with Velothi Ur-Mage’s Amulet. There are probably others too, especially if we’re not talking about hard mode / trifecta score pushing where everyone needs to be optimized but you don’t do that unless you like the pressure.

    Hope you find a build and play style that you enjoy! :)
  • Kisakee
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    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.
    "I don't know who you are, but i will find you and i will rob you." - Liam Thiefsson
  • Billium813
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    Tank/Healer are usually the roles in lowest supply. You see many high level players playing those roles because of the confidence it takes a player to assume those roles mixed with the demand for those roles to fire content. That confidence comes from being high level and having the experience of the content and the build. I do think Tank/Healer is easier then it seems, but it takes confidence to step up and assume that role when the stakes are high (a bad Tank or Healer is gg, a bad DPS just takes longer)

    On the DPS side, it depends on what content you're talking about. Vet HM Trials, sure those groups will want you to be high DPS and can be really competitive. But there's a different between "competitive" DPS and "competent" DPS. If you are stressing about being competitive, then that's really on you and the group you're with. If you just want to be competent, the game really has tons of ways to do adequate damage. Find a group that doesn't stress it so much and turn off the DPS meter on your side.
    Edited by Billium813 on December 15, 2023 4:11PM
  • Amottica
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    The combat design is one of the things considered to set this game apart from other top MMORPGs. Considering the differences in the combat design when compared to MMORPGs like FF and WoW it is understandable some would not like it but a great many chalk it up to a big reason they like ESO.

    As others have suggested, do not worry about LA weaving. A slightly longer weave will suffice and is only a marginal drop in DPS. It is only the top players that need to be concerned with being perfect. For most of us, we are not interested in taking the time to perfect our rotations to that degree and it is not necessary to enjoy the game.

  • Soarora
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    Not every role is for everyone. That said, spending time in a trial trying to get the highest parse shown in Hodors or spending hours trying to get 120k isn’t a great idea. If you can do like 95k parse on trial dummy you’re fine. If you don’t like the meta classes, use a different one. People definitely prefer I bring my stamarc but no one’s kicked me out for using my frost warden.
    PC/NA Dungeoneer (Tank/DPS/Heal), Trialist (DPS/Tank/Heal), and amateur Battlegrounder (DPS) with a passion for The Elder Scrolls lore
  • Ironside
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    Kisakee wrote: »
    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.

    [snip] My point is most, if not all, DPS options should perform good enough with high enough yields for all content without trying to have a heart attack doing it. The current stat is not fun. [snip]

    [edited for baiting]
    Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 15, 2023 4:20PM
  • Billium813
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    Ironside wrote: »
    Kisakee wrote: »
    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.

    My point is most, if not all, DPS options should perform good enough with high enough yields for all content without trying to have a heart attack doing it. The current stat is not fun. [snip]

    So, you want everyone to just be able to put on any random sets they find and random Skills they unlock and do the same DPS? What are you advocating for here?

    This really sounds like just another "What DPS is adequate per content" discussion. If you're score pushing, you should know what you're getting yourself into. If you aren't, it's really not that hard to meet the bare minimum DPS to participate. If it matters to you that you're still not #1, thats kind of on you.

    [edited to remove quote]
    Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 15, 2023 4:21PM
  • Kisakee
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    Ironside wrote: »
    Kisakee wrote: »
    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.

    [snip] My point is most, if not all, DPS options should perform good enough with high enough yields for all content without trying to have a heart attack doing it. The current stat is not fun. [snip]

    I don't care if you're dealing 60k or 90k in a real boss fight but 9k just isn't cutting it. It takes way too long to get anything done and there are soft / hard enrages on a lot of fights so you can't sit there forever. [snip]

    [edited for flaming & to remove quote]
    Edited by ZOS_Icy on December 15, 2023 4:26PM
    "I don't know who you are, but i will find you and i will rob you." - Liam Thiefsson
  • Reverb
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    This is not my experience. I’ve always mained support roles in MMOs and from day 1 in ESO I had a Healer and a Tank. I’ve also have a handful of end-game ready dps toons.

    Gearing for and completing difficult group content as a tank is tense, having a deep understanding of all mechanics, priority targets, hold and position baddies appropriately while vigilantly managing aggro, buffs, and debuffs.

    Healing difficult group content is tense and requires constant awareness of all group member positioning, status, and all mechanics.

    Playing DPS for difficult group content is only slightly more stressful than farming mats. I get to be inherently selfish and just watch my timers, focus on my rotation and weaving by rote, and follow mechanics. If I suck at managing my timers I see a 10k dps loss but that’s not a deal breaker. The group doesn’t wipe if I’m out of position on a dps. Nobody dies if I’m delayed on recasting my dots.
    Edited by Reverb on December 15, 2023 6:02PM
    Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you. ~Friedrich Nietzsche
  • spartaxoxo
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    I do agree that the gap for vet content is too high. There's also actually very little content for middle of the road dps. Normal Mode stuff is a joke doable by a level 45 with no cp wearing random garbage. Many of the people who say that you can do 90% of the game without caring about DPS are the same people who say they can't do overland because it's too dull. Well, guess what. That applies to the dude doing 45k damage too.

    Infinite Archive is a big step forward in addressing this issue.
    Edited by spartaxoxo on December 15, 2023 4:40PM
  • boi_anachronism_
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    Ironside wrote: »
    Kisakee wrote: »
    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.

    [snip] My point is most, if not all, DPS options should perform good enough with high enough yields for all content without trying to have a heart attack doing it. The current stat is not fun. [snip]

    [edited for baiting]

    Depends on what you mean by options. Are we talking builds or classes? Cause im in xs with a guy who mains a stamcro. Not support mind you. Cro is the lowest performing parse dps but he is good enough in content that he outshines most of the "meta" builds. Lead has zero issue with it. If we are talking sword and board dps well thats something else entirely.

    And btw I dps mainly but also tank and i can tell you that tanking is generally speaking far more stressful then dps. The success of the run rides on your performance and knowledge of the mechanics. Forget about the gazillion mandatory support sets you need to keep on hand at all times.
    Edited by boi_anachronism_ on December 15, 2023 5:24PM
  • El_Borracho
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    @Ironside it would help to know what class you are playing. Some classes are much harder to get 100K+ DPS while others can reach 75-90K without much effort.

    Not being mean or elitist, but I think there should be grades of difficulty which require players to separate themselves from others; or in other words, require players to be able to pump out more DPS than the average player. I think most PVP and PVE group content players would agree. If ESO turned into a game where someone wearing mismatched gear and did not have a rotation could crank out the same, or even near the same DPS as someone who has the correct gear and a decent rotation, most players would leave. Especially in PVP.
  • Lykeion
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    And btw I dps mainly but also tank and i can tell you that tanking is generally speaking far more stressful then dps. The success of the run rides on your performance and knowledge of the mechanics. Forget about the gazillion mandatory support sets you need to keep on hand at all times.

    reminds me of this XD

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5gTEsQippE&ab_channel=Hyperioxes
  • manukartofanu
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    Lykeion wrote: »
    reminds me of this XD
    And this is even before the release of the Arcanist.
  • wolfie1.0.
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    Some of it is really just finding that build or set of builds that work for you.

    Understanding that there are, and should be different builds for different activities. And finding that balance for yourself.

    That said, players keep going back to the same sets because they work
  • Necrotech_Master
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    i would have to say that tanking or healing is way more stress than a dps

    if your the tank and you die, its very high chance of wiping for the group depending on the encounter

    if your a healer and not doing your job, it could very easily lead to the tank dying or the group wiping

    as a dps it might take slightly more time to kill a boss, but as long as you can meet the dps requirements of the mechanics and stay alive usually its not a huge deal
    plays PC/NA
    handle @Necrotech_Master
    active player since april 2014
  • AlterBlika
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    DPSing was never fun in ESO. It's always just parsing on a dummy, with occasional mechanics that are, let's be honest, too easy, because they're designed with squishy dds who have nearly zero healing in mind. I'm fine with rotations and weaving though, although someone might find it annoying too.
  • boi_anachronism_
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    Lykeion wrote: »
    And btw I dps mainly but also tank and i can tell you that tanking is generally speaking far more stressful then dps. The success of the run rides on your performance and knowledge of the mechanics. Forget about the gazillion mandatory support sets you need to keep on hand at all times.

    reminds me of this XD

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5gTEsQippE&ab_channel=Hyperioxes

    Dude that plays in my head constantly when I tank 😆🤣 Its quite possibly the most relatable tanking gif of all time.
  • ArchMikem
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    well, the grass is always greener over the septic tank.... try doing overland content with a sword and board or a resto staff.. better still put a swoard and board on your front bar and a resto staff with defending trait on the back and watch the yawn fest commence! YOu will then realize why overland content is so easy...

    My StamDK is a 1H&S Off Tank DD.

    She wears Knight Errant, Hundings Rage, and Oakensoul. Very simple playstyle and I can two to three hit any basic Mob with Pierce Armor and Flame Lash. What makes this really fun is when you off balance your target, Flame Lash gets cheaper, hits harder, and you heal all while doing a sick acrobatics flip.

    The best part is I can take this same build into Normal, and even some Veteran Dungeons and Tank pretty well. I just need a decent Healer since block reduction isn't as high as it could be.
    CP1,900+ Master Explorer - AvA One Star General - Console Peasant - The Clan
    Quest Objective: OMG Go Talk To That Kitty!
  • DMuehlhausen
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    LOL, you make it stressful because so many DD thinkg sparce bar hopping and sspinning while fightning and standing in big red dumb is how you do more damage. Stand still and stop standing in big obvious circles. and you have the easiest job.
  • CameraBeardThePirate
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    Lykeion wrote: »
    And btw I dps mainly but also tank and i can tell you that tanking is generally speaking far more stressful then dps. The success of the run rides on your performance and knowledge of the mechanics. Forget about the gazillion mandatory support sets you need to keep on hand at all times.

    reminds me of this XD

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5gTEsQippE&ab_channel=Hyperioxes

    Holy sweet Jesus how have I never seen this before bahaha
  • Twohothardware
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    They should take the Arcanist approach with all the other classes and simplify the rotation around three or four class skills and buff their damage enough that you can hit 100k dps with just them alone. All of these low damage DoTs are not fun to use or easy to maintain in a rotation.

    There's a reason heavy attack builds are so popular and it's because that's where a large percentage of the player base is at in terms of what they are capable of doing as well as what is enjoyable for them to play.
    Edited by Twohothardware on December 15, 2023 8:30PM
  • Sakiri
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    Kisakee wrote: »
    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.

    Who's doing 9k overland? I'm running an oakensorc HA build and do like four times that and I'm not even good...
  • Necrotech_Master
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    Sakiri wrote: »
    Kisakee wrote: »
    So what content are we talking about - Dungeons? Trials? Normal or veteran? If you want to participate in vet trials or even hardmodes you absolutely need to play what's useful, there's no space for your 9k Overland DPS. And don't even try on complaining about difficulty and asking for nerfs if you want everything washed down to casual standards, people like their challenges.

    Who's doing 9k overland? I'm running an oakensorc HA build and do like four times that and I'm not even good...

    the only characters i have that do 9k dps are tanks lol
    plays PC/NA
    handle @Necrotech_Master
    active player since april 2014
  • DrNukenstein
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    Let me tell you something about DPS. Just don't queue it. Just fake tank normals on a fun build, and when you want some gear that takes hard work, just fake tank vets. You will get the gear you want so much faster and have more fun getting it.

    DPS is insane right now. It only takes one parse monkey to clear a vet dungeon without dealing with a single mech. They want to sweat about it? let them sweat about it and bring you your gear.

    Trial gear? That gear only matters in trials. Trials that have 11 other people. If the trial is falling apart it is not your fault, regardless of what they say.

    If anyone has a problem with having a fake tank, just ask the group if they want to wait for a real tank.
  • Billium813
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    Let me tell you something about DPS. Just don't queue it. Just fake tank normals on a fun build, and when you want some gear that takes hard work, just fake tank vets. You will get the gear you want so much faster and have more fun getting it.

    DPS is insane right now. It only takes one parse monkey to clear a vet dungeon without dealing with a single mech. They want to sweat about it? let them sweat about it and bring you your gear.

    Trial gear? That gear only matters in trials. Trials that have 11 other people. If the trial is falling apart it is not your fault, regardless of what they say.

    If anyone has a problem with having a fake tank, just ask the group if they want to wait for a real tank.

    Yeah, don't do this.
  • Soarora
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    Let me tell you something about DPS. Just don't queue it. Just fake tank normals on a fun build, and when you want some gear that takes hard work, just fake tank vets. You will get the gear you want so much faster and have more fun getting it.

    DPS is insane right now. It only takes one parse monkey to clear a vet dungeon without dealing with a single mech. They want to sweat about it? let them sweat about it and bring you your gear.

    Trial gear? That gear only matters in trials. Trials that have 11 other people. If the trial is falling apart it is not your fault, regardless of what they say.

    If anyone has a problem with having a fake tank, just ask the group if they want to wait for a real tank.

    Strong disagree. People hate fake tanks who taunt, more people hate fake tanks who don’t taunt, people hate fake tanks who do damage, most people hate fake tanks who are just there for a carry. It’s not fair to the group members and if you’re fake tanking a vet dlc on a poor dps build you’re wasting everyones time because its not like you’re going to burn the boss before you inevitably die to not being a tank.

    Trial gear matters in dungeons and arenas as well. It even matters in PvP! Also, yes a trial can fall apart and it be your fault. Like killing everyone with deluge in DSR.
    PC/NA Dungeoneer (Tank/DPS/Heal), Trialist (DPS/Tank/Heal), and amateur Battlegrounder (DPS) with a passion for The Elder Scrolls lore
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