Necromancer: class form feedback

IncultaWolf

Well, I tried

IncultaWolf

Since this thread seems to be the "official" class rep thread now, I have updated my original post with more feedback:

Another change I'd love to see is the skeletal minion getting buffed, as well as having major brutality/sorcery OR savagery/prophecy while slotted on either bar. Other classes have gotten these "while slotted on either bar" updates, but necromancer still has none. I feel like another good change would be to make the agony totem synergy, a self-synergy for the player, to further give necromancers class identity, of being able to self proc their own ability synergies. It would also solve an issue of not having enough sticky DoT abilites in their toolkit.

I don't think changing blastbones is a good idea, perhaps moving this unique sacrifice buff on an ability hardly used like empowering grasp would be a better move

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_Gilliam

brandsnipe

IncultaWolf wrote: »

Since this thread seems to be the "official" class rep thread now, I have updated my original post with more feedback:

Another change I'd love to see is the skeletal minion getting buffed, as well as having major brutality/sorcery OR savagery/prophecy while slotted on either bar. Other classes have gotten these "while slotted on either bar" updates, but necromancer still has none. I feel like another good change would be to make the agony totem synergy, a self-synergy for the player, to further give necromancers class identity, of being able to self proc their own ability synergies. It would also solve an issue of not having enough sticky DoT abilites in their toolkit.

I don't think changing blastbones is a good idea, perhaps moving this unique sacrifice buff on an ability hardly used like empowering grasp would be a better move

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_Gilliam

I like the slotted buff for skeletal mage, i also like the idea of having a morph that summons 2 mages/archers based on highest resource. You could have a morph or spirit guardian be an offensive summon like a ghost knight or something. How about a skill that allows you to turn undead enemies into allies for 16 sevconds? Id love to run around in open world turning zombies and such into my minions. So many things could be added, this class needs to be overhauled.

Alaztor91

IncultaWolf wrote: »

I don't think changing blastbones is a good idea, perhaps moving this unique sacrifice buff on an ability hardly used like empowering grasp would be a better move

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_Gilliam

Afaik ZOS main reason to change BB is to ''reduce the intense demand and complex rotation requirement of the class'' so I doubt that they will move the new buff to another skill since the BB-SKILL-SKILL-BB rotation wouldn't change if they do that.

Imo changing BB to a strong Ranged 10s AoE Sticky DoT that gives 2/3 Corpses over its duration provides the class an easier rotation, does not mess with ranged Corpse generation and fits with the DoT theme that ZOS wants for the class.

Then they could tweak other stuff like lack of named buffs, lack of on-demand stun, useless skills like Grave Grasp, etc.

IncultaWolf

Alaztor91 wrote: »

IncultaWolf wrote: »

I don't think changing blastbones is a good idea, perhaps moving this unique sacrifice buff on an ability hardly used like empowering grasp would be a better move

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin @ZOS_Gilliam

Afaik ZOS main reason to change BB is to ''reduce the intense demand and complex rotation requirement of the class'' so I doubt that they will move the new buff to another skill since the BB-SKILL-SKILL-BB rotation wouldn't change if they do that.

Imo changing BB to a strong Ranged 10s AoE Sticky DoT that gives 2/3 Corpses over its duration provides the class an easier rotation, does not mess with ranged Corpse generation and fits with the DoT theme that ZOS wants for the class.

Then they could tweak other stuff like lack of named buffs, lack of on-demand stun, useless skills like Grave Grasp, etc.

Grave grasp is definitely one of the worst abilities in the toolkit, and I wish it would get updated/reworked. As @CameraBeardThePirate and I have mentioned before, empowering grasp should passively buff your pets "while slotted" because actually trying to land and target this ability to hit your pets in actual combat is very tedious and difficult, and a lot of times it just straight up doesn't work even they get hit.

I do like the suggestion to make blastbones also apply a sticky DoT after detonation, that change alone would improve the class a lot, even something as simple as applying aoe diseased status effect on impact

Alaztor91

IncultaWolf wrote: »

I do like the suggestion to make blastbones also apply a sticky DoT after detonation, that change alone would improve the class a lot, even something as simple as applying aoe diseased status effect on impact

Just to clarify, my suggestion is to completely remove the direct damage part of BB and replace it with a STRONG 10s DoT.
Sure, you could put a bit of direct damage on the initial explosion, but it would have to be considerably lower or else players would still cast it every 3s.

IncultaWolf

Alaztor91 wrote: »

IncultaWolf wrote: »

I do like the suggestion to make blastbones also apply a sticky DoT after detonation, that change alone would improve the class a lot, even something as simple as applying aoe diseased status effect on impact

Just to clarify, my suggestion is to completely remove the direct damage part of BB and replace it with a STRONG 10s DoT.
Sure, you could put a bit of direct damage on the initial explosion, but it would have to be considerably lower or else players would still cast it every 3s.

I'd also be fine with this, as long as blastbones is still a damage ability. Great suggestion

Tyrant_Tim

Necromancer is my second most played character, and was my FIRST class in any fantasy game, as early as Diablo II back in 2000.

One of my biggest grievances with the class, has been that it has too mixed of an identity without establishing itself within the actual fantasy archetype that it’s named after.

What do you envision when you hear Necromancer?

For me, I see minion(s), plural, I see mindless skeletons and zombies fighting for them, and I see Lich themed skills, and magic, after all, becoming an undying Lich is the aspiration of most Necromancers.

What do we have?

One skeletal minion, one ghost that heals? An ugly transformation ultimate in Goliath, an ugly flesh colossus that disappears seconds after it comes out? Several skills for healing, are we talking about Necromancer still?

Now we have yet another Skeleton that instead of withering your opponents, as you would expect, now buffs your character?

Sorry, but the creative director for Necromancer should have been replaced the second they presented any of the art assets being used for their abilities, let alone how they function.

There are countless games to reference for inspiration and this is what we settled with? I regret that I was taking a break from ESO during that period, as I missed out on my opportunity to voice my opinion before it released, but it’s never too late.

Now that the technology is here, we’ve seen it with Arcanist, let’s go back and fix Necromancer.

Deimus

Alaztor91 wrote: »

Afaik ZOS main reason to change BB is to ''reduce the intense demand and complex rotation requirement of the class'' so I doubt that they will move the new buff to another skill since the BB-SKILL-SKILL-BB rotation wouldn't change if they do that.

Imo changing BB to a strong Ranged 10s AoE Sticky DoT that gives 2/3 Corpses over its duration provides the class an easier rotation, does not mess with ranged Corpse generation and fits with the DoT theme that ZOS wants for the class.

Then they could tweak other stuff like lack of named buffs, lack of on-demand stun, useless skills like Grave Grasp, etc.

I made a post with a couple of alternate suggestions for how they could rework blastbones to fit the DoT theme and only need to cast it every 10-13 seconds, but it didn't get much traction.

Essentially after the initial explosion blastbones will leave either a moderate AoE DoT (10.5 seconds) or higher damage single target DoT (12.5 seconds). The AoE will debuff the targets and buff the necro while the single target version will have two "blast" ticks one at the end and one randomly during the DoTs duration.

The magicka cost will be increased to compensate for the damage, but if the DoT fails to find a target the fragments of the blastbones returns to the caster restoring 1500 magicka.

StarOfElyon

If this is the main thread for feedback now, let me leave my super simple ideas here

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Here are some ideas that I have to add some more utility to the skills on the class.

As I have seen suggested on the forums, both morphs of the Necro scythe should get execute scaling. I agree that this would be a great and needed buff.

Hungry Scythe: also applies life steal to all enemies hit. (I think this still won't make the spammable very good for damage but at least it'll add to the use for survivability)

[Also, life steal should probably be tied to a status effect too]

Skeletal Arcanist/Archer: grants major sorcery/brutality when active.

Mystic/Detonating Syphon: grants major prophecy/savagery when slotted. Both morphs apply a damage over time to targets that stick to them after touching the tether.

Flame/Venom skull: applies burning/poisoned status effects. Does additional damage to targets afflicted with a status effect. No longer does increased damage on third cast but instead does increased damage on low health enemies.

Spirit Mender:
- Spirit Guardian: when active, applies major cowardice to attackers. (I just like the idea of the ghost scaring attackers.)
- Intensive Mender: increases the healing over a shorter period of time. (Buff the healing more please)

Bone Totem: summons an effigy of bones up to 28 meters away. After 1 second, the totem begins fearing nearby enemies every 2 seconds, causing them to cower in place for 4 seconds. (Changed to allow both morphs to be targeted)
- Warding Totem (Formerly Remote Totem): grants minor protection when standing in the area of effect.
- Agony Totem: afflicts enemies in the area of effect with minor vulnerability.


ULTIMATES:
Putrid Colossus (formerly Frozen Colossus): Unleash a decayed Flesh Colossus to pulverize enemies in the area. The Colossus smashes the ground three times over 3 seconds. Dealing damage applies Major Vulnerability to any enemy hit for 12 seconds.
- Frozen Colossus (formerly Glacial Colossus): does frost damage and freezes (stuns) enemies on the first hit instead of the third. (If a stun is too strong, the first hit can apply a strong snare instead)
- Pestilent Colossus: smashes the ground once and does disease damage. Afflicts enemies with a pestilence that does damage over time. (In PvP ultimates are all about burst and that's what necros lack so I tried to make the bursty part of these ultimates at the beginning of them)

Animate Blastbones: instead of resurrecting allies, this ultimate summons blastbones to attack the nearest opponent. It consumes corpses in the area to summon up to three more blastbones. Summoned Blastbones are immune to being crowd controlled (other than by another ultimate). Reduce the cost of this ultimate to 200, down from 320, to make it more usable.

Alaztor91

Deimus wrote: »

I made a post with a couple of alternate suggestions for how they could rework blastbones to fit the DoT theme and only need to cast it every 10-13 seconds, but it didn't get much traction.

Essentially after the initial explosion blastbones will leave either a moderate AoE DoT (10.5 seconds) or higher damage single target DoT (12.5 seconds). The AoE will debuff the targets and buff the necro while the single target version will have two "blast" ticks one at the end and one randomly during the DoTs duration.

The magicka cost will be increased to compensate for the damage, but if the DoT fails to find a target the fragments of the blastbones returns to the caster restoring 1500 magicka.

Yeah, there have been a lot of alternative suggestions to the BB change that ZOS wants to introduce. BB is the highest non-ult damage skill the Necro has, and you ideally want to cast it every 3s, so the only options imo that ZOS has to make the rotation ''easier'' is to rework the skill to a longer duration one that doesn't need to be casted so often and that compensates for the amount of damage lost from not having BB.

They decided to go with the ''buff'' choice for the skill, but that is imo the boring option. It also has other problems that players have mentioned like low corpse generation/lack of ranged corpse generation when compared to current BB, and the ''in-combat'' requirement is awful.

I would prefer if they instead went with an ''offensive'' choice, and since the goal is to have a skill that doesn't need to be casted so often, some sort of DoT seems like the logical choice, specially when you also consider that ZOS is pushing that theme on the class. Since the class has 0 sticky DoTs this also seems like the ideal place for one.

IncultaWolf

StarOfElyon wrote: »

If this is the main thread for feedback now, let me leave my super simple ideas here

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Here are some ideas that I have to add some more utility to the skills on the class.

As I have seen suggested on the forums, both morphs of the Necro scythe should get execute scaling. I agree that this would be a great and needed buff.

Hungry Scythe: also applies life steal to all enemies hit. (I think this still won't make the spammable very good for damage but at least it'll add to the use for survivability)

[Also, life steal should probably be tied to a status effect too]

Skeletal Arcanist/Archer: grants major sorcery/brutality when active.

Mystic/Detonating Syphon: grants major prophecy/savagery when slotted. Both morphs apply a damage over time to targets that stick to them after touching the tether.

Flame/Venom skull: applies burning/poisoned status effects. Does additional damage to targets afflicted with a status effect. No longer does increased damage on third cast but instead does increased damage on low health enemies.

Spirit Mender:
- Spirit Guardian: when active, applies major cowardice to attackers. (I just like the idea of the ghost scaring attackers.)
- Intensive Mender: increases the healing over a shorter period of time. (Buff the healing more please)

Bone Totem: summons an effigy of bones up to 28 meters away. After 1 second, the totem begins fearing nearby enemies every 2 seconds, causing them to cower in place for 4 seconds. (Changed to allow both morphs to be targeted)
- Warding Totem (Formerly Remote Totem): grants minor protection when standing in the area of effect.
- Agony Totem: afflicts enemies in the area of effect with minor vulnerability.


ULTIMATES:
Putrid Colossus (formerly Frozen Colossus): Unleash a decayed Flesh Colossus to pulverize enemies in the area. The Colossus smashes the ground three times over 3 seconds. Dealing damage applies Major Vulnerability to any enemy hit for 12 seconds.
- Frozen Colossus (formerly Glacial Colossus): does frost damage and freezes (stuns) enemies on the first hit instead of the third. (If a stun is too strong, the first hit can apply a strong snare instead)
- Pestilent Colossus: smashes the ground once and does disease damage. Afflicts enemies with a pestilence that does damage over time. (In PvP ultimates are all about burst and that's what necros lack so I tried to make the bursty part of these ultimates at the beginning of them)

Animate Blastbones: instead of resurrecting allies, this ultimate summons blastbones to attack the nearest opponent. It consumes corpses in the area to summon up to three more blastbones. Summoned Blastbones are immune to being crowd controlled (other than by another ultimate). Reduce the cost of this ultimate to 200, down from 320, to make it more usable.

These are all great changes that could easily be implemented. I would love to see the agony totem synergy turned into a self-usable synergy the player can proc themselves, as it would help with the lack of sticky DoT abilities

Alaztor91

Here are a few suggestions for Necro skills other than BB, some will also need a name change:

Flame Skull: Reduce the projectile travel time, make it less annoying to weave. Also applied to both morphs.

Unnerving Boneyard*: Make each tick apply Major Breach for 4s, similar to Razor Caltrops.

Skeletal Mage: Make it grant Major Sorcery/Major Brutality while slotted on either bar, similar to Tome-Bearer's Inspiration. Make their attacks prioritize your current target and allow them to Proc Sets. Also applied to both morphs.

Shocking Siphon: Target: Enemy, Cost: X Magicka. Tether to your enemy for 20s. While the tether persists, enemies touching it take Y Shock damage every second. Consumes a Corpse on cast to refund the cost and create a necrotic aura around your target that deals Y Shock damage every second.
Keep the same duration, range, damage per second and radius. Basically switching targeting from ''Corpse'' to ''Enemy'' and giving you a worse skill (no AoE around target and not free to cast) if you don't consume a Corpse, instead of no skill at all. This is imo a QoL change, but some people could prefer the ''ground'' target and disagree.

Detonating Siphon*: Ability now deals Disease Damage. If you consume a Corpse, it also explodes dealing X damage to nearby enemies. (in addition to the unmorphed skill bonuses for consuming a Corpse)

Mystic Siphon*: If you consume a Corpse, you also gain X Stamina/Magicka/Health recovery while the tether persists. (in addition to the unmorphed skill bonuses for consuming a Corpse)

Death Scythe: Make it generate 1 Corpse when you hit a target, can only happen every X seconds (This is straight from Diablo, but I don't see how it could make the skill worse lol). Add execute scaling. Also applied to both morphs.

Remote Totem*: Change it to a damage morph: Summon a ''Lich Crystal''(see Nerien'eth) that pulses for 10 seconds, dealing X damage to nearby enemies every second and applying Minor Cowardice. No longer gives Minor Protection and no longer Fears nearby enemies.

Grave Grasp: Target: Area, Range: 15m, Radius: 8m. Call forth skeletal claws from the ground at the target location, dealing X damage and snaring enemies by Y% for Z seconds. Could also work as a frontal cone skill instead.

Ghostly Embrace*: Target: Enemy, Range: 15m?. Summon a ''Ghostly Hand''(see Kjalnar's Nightmare) to imprison an enemy after a X seconds delay, stunning them for Y seconds. Applies Minor Maim and a Z% Snare for N seconds after the effect ends. This ability cannot be dodged.

Empowering Grasp*: Same functionality as the unmorphed skill. Enemies are also affected with Major Maim for X seconds.

Blood Sacrifice*: Generates 1 Corpse after healing a target, can only happen every X seconds. No longer consumes a Corpse to heal a second target.

Spirit Mender: Change the morphs duration to 10s and 20s respectively, buff HPS. Fix AI so it doesn't stay there just floating when there is a valid target to heal. Make them Proc Sets.

Restoring Tether: Target: Ally, Cost: X Magicka. Tether to your ally for 10s. While the tether persists, you and allies touching it are healed for Y every second. Consumes a Corpse on cast to refund the cost and increase the healing to Z per second.
Z would be the ''normal'' healing amount.

Braided Tether*: Same functionality as the unmorphed skill and heals for an even higher amount. Magicka cost and no AoE heal around you if you don't consume a Corpse. Cost refunded and AoE heal around you if you do consume one.

Mortal Coil*: Target: Enemy, Cost: X Magicka. Tether to your enemy for 10s. While the tether persists, you deal Y Magic damage every second to the enemy, healing you for the damage caused. Consumes a Corpse on cast to refund the cost and restore Z Magicka and Stamina every second while the tether persists.

Corpse Consumption Passive: When you consume a corpse, you generate X Ultimate. This effect can occur once every 16 seconds. (text change)

Aeltharion

Necromancer

Please give the class major brutality and sorcery on the spirit mender.

For dps give the class a couple of sticky dots, the candidates are blastbones, boneyard, shocking siphon, skeletal mage (it refreshes its dot everytime it hits the same target). Basically keep the skills as they’re but give them damage over time that sticks on enemies on contact. Make death scythe an execute skill, it’s even on the name lol

For tanking it’s lacking a shield, for this you can use the deaden pain effect that looks like a shield. For this shield maybe scrap totem? Or one of its morphs or expunge since they already have cleans on renewing undeath. Maybe give them 10% block mitigation similar to Templar and dragon knight. A reliable crowd control maybe? Make grave grasp just immobilise targets on the whole area (maybe a little damage over time), have ghostly embrace immobilise and stun and keep the extra effects of empowering grasp the same

For healing maybe you can increase the radius for life amid death, leave the morphs as they are but remove the requirement for a corps on its initial healing over time but still be able to extend the duration with corps via the morphs. Make restoring tether’s heal stick to allies on contact. Spirit mender should heal every 1 second instead of 2 this will help it be more reliable when group healing especially on trials where there is more people

These changes would drastically improve the necromancer on both PvE and PvP

Twohothardware

At the very least Necromancer needs more Major Buffs built into the class skills to free up a couple of skill slots that are right now being wasted on otherwise useless skills. Necro is the only class that has no access to Major Sorcery/Brutality and most other classes also now have skills that passively give them Major Prophecy/Savagery.

Michaelkeir

I’m very passionate about necromancers. It’s my favorite class to play in any game. When the necromancer class was announced I was hyped. Until I saw the skills. 😭

When I think necromancer, I think undead minions (both melee and ranged)and (both skeletons and zombies), curses and poisons (dots), and cold fire blasts, and buffing minions. What we got was a pale imitation of what a necromancer is.

My biggest pain points with this class:
- Let us summon 2 minions at the same time instead of one.
- Up the damage of them or add major brutality/sorcery OR savagery/prophecy to the summons.
- Melee pets.
- Higher pet summon up times or longer lasting pets.
- Lastly, in class sticky dots. We have a class that has a dot passives but no way to actually take advantage of that within the class it self other than some awkward beam.
[img][/img]

Skoomah

What about necromancer strengths?

- Major vulnerability remains only reliably obtained from class ultimate skill that has cost reduced to levels easily obtained 10%
- Unique class passive DoT damage increase 10%
- Unique class skill DoT damage increase 15%

That’s a whopping 45% increase to damage of stacked up that is unique to one class.

-Necros have the best ult gen in the game and can suck up souls on the battle field after kills and from pets and skills once they fall to the ground. With some minor heroism or major heroism, ultimates that dish out damage as part of combos is a big differentiator, Necros can do the ult dump combos more often

-For defenses. A Necro with ghost and the burst heal are perfect for teams for the passive healing and ability to burst heal yourself or a teammate from a class skill. The Necro burst heal that heals and gives lots of armor is the best burst heal in the game for saving teammates and is on par with other classes self burst heals like DK coag blood or Wardem polar wind


-the forums are full of complaints about the master DW and appetite and relequen and draugrkin meta, doesn’t the damage boosts for Necros make them the best class for this kind of setup?

StarOfElyon

Skoomah wrote: »

What about necromancer strengths?

- Major vulnerability remains only reliably obtained from class ultimate skill that has cost reduced to levels easily obtained 10%
- Unique class passive DoT damage increase 10%
- Unique class skill DoT damage increase 15%

That’s a whopping 45% increase to damage of stacked up that is unique to one class.

-Necros have the best ult gen in the game and can suck up souls on the battle field after kills and from pets and skills once they fall to the ground. With some minor heroism or major heroism, ultimates that dish out damage as part of combos is a big differentiator, Necros can do the ult dump combos more often

-For defenses. A Necro with ghost and the burst heal are perfect for teams for the passive healing and ability to burst heal yourself or a teammate from a class skill. The Necro burst heal that heals and gives lots of armor is the best burst heal in the game for saving teammates and is on par with other classes self burst heals like DK coag blood or Wardem polar wind


-the forums are full of complaints about the master DW and appetite and relequen and draugrkin meta, doesn’t the damage boosts for Necros make them the best class for this kind of setup?

It's a cheesy cut & paste set up that any class can use and it doesn't fit MY power fantasy of being a summoner. Making Necros into DKs with no burst ability or on-demand stun will kill the class.

The only Necro burst came from what they took away. Not only did defile get nerfed, but Blighted Blastbones won't even proc burning which was a useful added bit of pressure.

Michaelkeir

Skoomah wrote: »

What about necromancer strengths?

- Major vulnerability remains only reliably obtained from class ultimate skill that has cost reduced to levels easily obtained 10%
- Unique class passive DoT damage increase 10%
- Unique class skill DoT damage increase 15%

That’s a whopping 45% increase to damage of stacked up that is unique to one class.

-Necros have the best ult gen in the game and can suck up souls on the battle field after kills and from pets and skills once they fall to the ground. With some minor heroism or major heroism, ultimates that dish out damage as part of combos is a big differentiator, Necros can do the ult dump combos more often

-For defenses. A Necro with ghost and the burst heal are perfect for teams for the passive healing and ability to burst heal yourself or a teammate from a class skill. The Necro burst heal that heals and gives lots of armor is the best burst heal in the game for saving teammates and is on par with other classes self burst heals like DK coag blood or Wardem polar wind


-the forums are full of complaints about the master DW and appetite and relequen and draugrkin meta, doesn’t the damage boosts for Necros make them the best class for this kind of setup?

- Major Vulnerability is not a rare debuff as much as it use to be. Several sets have it now and it easy to come by with any class.
- Dot passive on a class with no true sticky dot. And with the new morph to BB. Most of the bodies it creates will be near the caster and not near the mobs. Nullifying the beam or making it awkward to position those negating their in class dot.

Necros are in a bad spot especially if you want to actually power fantasy as one. I’m not saying they aren’t functional. But even a pile of fertilizer has its uses and benefits, but at the end of the day it’s still fertilizer.

Skoomah

StarOfElyon wrote: »

Skoomah wrote: »

What about necromancer strengths?

- Major vulnerability remains only reliably obtained from class ultimate skill that has cost reduced to levels easily obtained 10%
- Unique class passive DoT damage increase 10%
- Unique class skill DoT damage increase 15%

That’s a whopping 45% increase to damage of stacked up that is unique to one class.

-Necros have the best ult gen in the game and can suck up souls on the battle field after kills and from pets and skills once they fall to the ground. With some minor heroism or major heroism, ultimates that dish out damage as part of combos is a big differentiator, Necros can do the ult dump combos more often

-For defenses. A Necro with ghost and the burst heal are perfect for teams for the passive healing and ability to burst heal yourself or a teammate from a class skill. The Necro burst heal that heals and gives lots of armor is the best burst heal in the game for saving teammates and is on par with other classes self burst heals like DK coag blood or Wardem polar wind


-the forums are full of complaints about the master DW and appetite and relequen and draugrkin meta, doesn’t the damage boosts for Necros make them the best class for this kind of setup?

It's a cheesy cut & paste set up that any class can use and it doesn't fit MY power fantasy of being a summoner. Making Necros into DKs with no burst ability or on-demand stun will kill the class.

The only Necro burst came from what they took away. Not only did defile get nerfed, but Blighted Blastbones won't even proc burning which was a useful added bit of pressure.

I get it and I hear you, about the RP factor. Then you should submit a perspective around playstyle vs power levels. Because based on how ZoS is responding, even silence is a response…

Basically what is being communicated is “hey guys, we’ve slowly changed up your class so it plays differently, it’s time to catch up the bread crumbs we’ve left for you and theorycraft another way to play your class. Please get more creative.”

Aeltharion

Skoomah wrote: »

What about necromancer strengths?

- Major vulnerability remains only reliably obtained from class ultimate skill that has cost reduced to levels easily obtained 10%
- Unique class passive DoT damage increase 10%
- Unique class skill DoT damage increase 15%

That’s a whopping 45% increase to damage of stacked up that is unique to one class.

-Necros have the best ult gen in the game and can suck up souls on the battle field after kills and from pets and skills once they fall to the ground. With some minor heroism or major heroism, ultimates that dish out damage as part of combos is a big differentiator, Necros can do the ult dump combos more often

-For defenses. A Necro with ghost and the burst heal are perfect for teams for the passive healing and ability to burst heal yourself or a teammate from a class skill. The Necro burst heal that heals and gives lots of armor is the best burst heal in the game for saving teammates and is on par with other classes self burst heals like DK coag blood or Wardem polar wind


-the forums are full of complaints about the master DW and appetite and relequen and draugrkin meta, doesn’t the damage boosts for Necros make them the best class for this kind of setup?

Skoomah I don’t get your point, are u trying to say necromancer does not need any changes? If u don’t play necromancer I don’t think u should be commenting on anything necromancer related, cause anyone that plays the class will tell you it’s lacking in every way wether it’s healing, damage or survivability. Simply put all the other classes do it better. There’s no class it’s close to or better than it’s literally the worst class and everyone that plays it are forcing it.

CameraBeardThePirate

Skoomah wrote: »

What about necromancer strengths?

- Major vulnerability remains only reliably obtained from class ultimate skill that has cost reduced to levels easily obtained 10%
- Unique class passive DoT damage increase 10%
- Unique class skill DoT damage increase 15%

That’s a whopping 45% increase to damage of stacked up that is unique to one class.

-Necros have the best ult gen in the game and can suck up souls on the battle field after kills and from pets and skills once they fall to the ground. With some minor heroism or major heroism, ultimates that dish out damage as part of combos is a big differentiator, Necros can do the ult dump combos more often

-For defenses. A Necro with ghost and the burst heal are perfect for teams for the passive healing and ability to burst heal yourself or a teammate from a class skill. The Necro burst heal that heals and gives lots of armor is the best burst heal in the game for saving teammates and is on par with other classes self burst heals like DK coag blood or Wardem polar wind


-the forums are full of complaints about the master DW and appetite and relequen and draugrkin meta, doesn’t the damage boosts for Necros make them the best class for this kind of setup?

10% + 10% + 15% =/= 45%...

The DoT buff doesn't do a whole lot when the skill is literally just a buff and Necros already struggle with bar space. Good luck slotting a bunch of different DoTs when you're not given any of the necessary skills for a build in Necro's kit.

Aldoss

@CameraBeardThePirate beat me to it on the math.

I don't have PTS, but I have been playing around with the beautiful corpse buff provided by nobility in decay this patch. On a high dmg necro build, siphon ticks for an avg of 2-300 and crits for a whopping 500, and you have to be in the thick of everything for it to land because the radius is so small. The burst of detonating siphon crits for a whopping 2k.

"It's a free skill and gives you a unique 3% dmg increase"

It's a free skill that is 100% outshined by any non-necro dot. It's a waste of a skill slot.

Graveyard is also a weak dot, covers a small area, and the breach debuff is weaker than caltrops because it doesn't stick on enemies after they leave the obvious, and small, aoe.

The dot passives don't buff the summons because they are pets.

Next patch, necro has to choose between the weaker of the BBs or a buff that forces them to use none of their class tool kit dmg skills.

I get what you're trying to do @Skoomah , but we're here pointing out the negatives because ZOS clearly needs direction to save the class. If they didn't need direction, they wouldn't have proposed deleting the one skill that every necro uses.

FoJul

I don't know much about necro but I will state the reason why I don't play it.

1.) When trying to keep up with most major buffs, it's such a struggle to juggle a bunch of 10-15 second timers, by the time i get done going thru them all i have 2 GCD's for Offense before I have to return to buffing up. Even using shortcut sets like Daedrick Trickery only goes so far.

2.) No major sorcery. Meaning I had to run Spell power pots over sustain pots. Big no no in the meta we are in currently in.

3.) Last but not least, Necros have a passive for Dots, and another passive added along with the new blastbones change to dots. Why are we focusing on buffing an aspect of a class that doesn't even exist? Necro has maybe 2 dots that have already been gutted to prior patches.

As Someone who bought the class, when it was in such a bad state. I wish I could get my money back for Necro. I really want to enjoy Necro, but its impossible.

C_Inside

My oldest and most played character is a necro DPS.

I haven't read every single reply on here so you'll have to forgive me if it has already been brought up, but the main use of a necro DPS at the moment is Elemental Catalyst. Looking past the absurdity of a whole class' usefulness as a DPS being good uptime on one single 5 piece set, I wonder how this will change with spell scribing when every single class will be able to create long lasting fire, frost, and shock DOTs that can just as easily keep up EC.

If we will indeed be able to craft those kinds of DOTs then I ask myself why would you even bring a support necro in your group when a support DK/Arcanist/Whatever can offer the same utility while doing more damage?

It really seems to me that if necro isn't buffed come spell scribing then it will be a completely pointless class outside of tanking as it will literally offer nothing of worth to any group, besides maybe the res ult (assuming spell scribing doesn't add insta-res skills). And if you're specifically going for no death/trifecta runs then even that will obviously be useless.

Skoomah

Aldoss wrote: »

@CameraBeardThePirate beat me to it on the math.

I don't have PTS, but I have been playing around with the beautiful corpse buff provided by nobility in decay this patch. On a high dmg necro build, siphon ticks for an avg of 2-300 and crits for a whopping 500, and you have to be in the thick of everything for it to land because the radius is so small. The burst of detonating siphon crits for a whopping 2k.

"It's a free skill and gives you a unique 3% dmg increase"

It's a free skill that is 100% outshined by any non-necro dot. It's a waste of a skill slot.

Graveyard is also a weak dot, covers a small area, and the breach debuff is weaker than caltrops because it doesn't stick on enemies after they leave the obvious, and small, aoe.

The dot passives don't buff the summons because they are pets.

Next patch, necro has to choose between the weaker of the BBs or a buff that forces them to use none of their class tool kit dmg skills.

I get what you're trying to do @Skoomah , but we're here pointing out the negatives because ZOS clearly needs direction to save the class. If they didn't need direction, they wouldn't have proposed deleting the one skill that every necro uses.

I think the percentage damage buffs are strong and the defensive kit is strong too. In terms of offense, I prefer a faster paced playstyle so Necro really isn’t for me, in terms of class skill selection. But I wouldn’t call it all doom and gloom.

Aeltharion

Is that you or the skooma talking? Lol

Seriously tho why are on on this thread? U don’t play the class or like it, as u’ve already said and u’ve given no feedback whatsoever

The class looks good on paper yes, that’s why I bought it, in practice it’s horrible

Buy the class try it out in PvP and then see if u will still be saying it has a strong defensive toolkit. Get on classes that actually have a strong defensive toolkit/survivability nb, arcanist, templar, warden, dk, sorcerer (in that order) and then tell me how the necro feels compared to those classes

Aldoss

Skoomah wrote: »

Aldoss wrote: »

@CameraBeardThePirate beat me to it on the math.

I don't have PTS, but I have been playing around with the beautiful corpse buff provided by nobility in decay this patch. On a high dmg necro build, siphon ticks for an avg of 2-300 and crits for a whopping 500, and you have to be in the thick of everything for it to land because the radius is so small. The burst of detonating siphon crits for a whopping 2k.

"It's a free skill and gives you a unique 3% dmg increase"

It's a free skill that is 100% outshined by any non-necro dot. It's a waste of a skill slot.

Graveyard is also a weak dot, covers a small area, and the breach debuff is weaker than caltrops because it doesn't stick on enemies after they leave the obvious, and small, aoe.

The dot passives don't buff the summons because they are pets.

Next patch, necro has to choose between the weaker of the BBs or a buff that forces them to use none of their class tool kit dmg skills.

I get what you're trying to do @Skoomah , but we're here pointing out the negatives because ZOS clearly needs direction to save the class. If they didn't need direction, they wouldn't have proposed deleting the one skill that every necro uses.

I think the percentage damage buffs are strong and the defensive kit is strong too. In terms of offense, I prefer a faster paced playstyle so Necro really isn’t for me, in terms of class skill selection. But I wouldn’t call it all doom and gloom.

It's not all doom and gloom, but that's not the point of this forum is it?

We're here pointing out the flaws of the class in hopes that we can enact some sort of change.

Imagine ZOS were to nerf ww's dot in one patch, take away your speed in another, maybe they decide to change your burst heal from an hp based burst to a weak hot in another, and then decide that your ability to stay infinitely in ww form is suddenly no good and makes it a timed ult and when it's gone, you transform back and have to start over with 0 ult.

Would you be in that thread saying "Now, now everyone. Let's not lose sight of the fact that WW still has great access to a great leap skill and major defile and they still decent access to major buffs and are still pretty tanky"?

I'm guessing you'd be the one starting the thread saying "Dude, ZOS... What the hell?! We're not even that good!"

Skoomah

You're right, the people that complain the hardest on the forums get what they want. I hope you get the changes you are requesting.

Tyrant_Tim

Is it not enjoyable to have unusable corpses lit up all around you leading to broken buttons/keys, or having to drop two anchors to the ground to sustain while having pitiful damage because the class has no weapon/spell damage modifiers built into?