[Request] Please add slaughter fish in Fungal Grotto 1/2 dungeon.

merpins

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

Please, no. You can explore that dungeon on your own if you want, don't deprive other people of a useful shortcut.

Those who want a shortcut can do it solo... don't deprive the rest of the group of dungeon content because you don't want to finish the rest of the dungeon.

Not if you add slaughterfish they can't. What content, anyway, fighting the same bosses for the 100th time?

Edit: If you don't want to skip, ask your groupmates not to skip. Run with guildies or other people who will agree to your request. What you're suggesting is a heavy handed approach that will only benefit the few.

I don't know if you're aware of this, but the game is being offered for free right now in epic games. the chances are that it's bringing new people into the game. When you do your random normals.. when you see low-level characters... perhaps one of them is new... don't have a guild and has never done fungal grotto before. Just because you did it 100 times doesn't mean that everyone else did it too.

Had a couple lowbies with me in Fungal Grotto the day before yesterday; no Arcanists either, and the way they played, they were definitely new to the game. I'm CP 2000+, and they were all level 15 or lower.

Was a ton of fun. Went slow for them, let them clean up the first wave of mobs, then I helped them for the second. Helped them with the first boss, and basically just supported for the second to get them used to it. No boss skipping needed.
Similar thing happened a week or two ago. Myself, CP 2000+. we had another CP 2000+, but the other two were under CP 300. We got Ruins of Mazatun. The CP 2000 ran ahead, skipping mobs while one guy said "brb" right away. Me and the other waited, the 2000 didnt, so we kicked him. I carried the two of them through the dungeon and it was also a ton of fun!

Course there are a ton of people that would just run ahead, whenever I get a base game dungeon I check the party and their levels, and play to them. I don't like the mentality of rushing through a dungeon. I don't mind doing it when I duo dungeons with my wife, it can be fun if that's what you're trying to do. But this is a game, not a race to finish all your dailies so you can then log out. If you're playing with other people, you should play to what they want. If everyone runs ahead, sure. but if there's even 1 that isn't, I won't run ahead. Had a couple occasions where I whispered the non-runner, and then quit the party, formed one with them, and then just queued again even after the queue cooldown. It just isn't great a lot of the time.

peacenote

While a creative suggestion, part of the fun of running dungeons multiple times (in some cases, many many times) to farm things is figuring out the little sneaky ways you can save time.

It isn't ok (good behavior) for a group of folks to give a newer player a hard time for, say, aggroing a skippable mob. But I also think it isn't ok to ruin dungeon secrets and tricks for experienced players in the name of new players, who will only need that new player experience once or twice.

Besides, I always assumed dungeons that have skips are working as designed, or at least are not considered problematic by the devs, as often the skipped content isn't needed for the dungeons pledge and/or some of its achievements.

We can all learn to share the game together without imposing rules that cater to one experience level while ruining the fun of another.

Rishikesa108

Boring you say... But if you're so end-game, why are you running Fungal Grotto I ? If you killed those bosses 1000 times, why do you still enter FG? Dedicate yourself to more difficult contents and leave these basic contents to new players who want/need to go through them without haste, killing all the mobs both to gain more experience and for simple fun. I would like ZOS to come up with a clever method to prevent serial skippers from being able to do what they want to the detriment of new players. Slaughterfish or other smarter methods... everything would be fine to favor those who would like to be able to play with less fury and rush

peacenote

ghastley wrote: »

The problem comes from having multiple objectives in the same content. Rewards for solo play and different ones for group play in the same dungeon are what makes this an issue. ZOS need to remove the incentives to treat dungeons as anything but group content. Transmutes, daily endeavors, don’t belong there.

No offense intended but we'll have to agree to disagree as I greatly disagree with this.

Many players are not ONE TYPE ONLY. Some PvP and PvE. Some play solo and like group content. A big part of ESO's model is to encourage this by mixing rewards into different content, but also, it is nice for players who like multiple things to be able to earn rewards that help them as they divide their time between different types of content. It's great that transmutes can be obtained in dungeons. And through Tales of Tribute. And through PvP.

Plus, endeavors aren't inherently solo content. I get most of my endeavors in group content. The loot chest endeavors, the kill a difficult boss, looting containers... it would really bum me out if endeavors were changed to be things that could ONLY be done solo and group play was somehow treated as "less than" when it comes to being in the mix for endeavor activities.

I can't emphasize enough how much I enjoy when solo play rewards help my group play, or vice versa. .

What I don't like to see is when folks are forced to repeatedly play a certain type of content because a reward is limited ONLY to one area and the reward is CLEARLY made for a different area of the game. For example - leads. A mythic that is BiS for raiding having a lead behind a fishing node? Just the worst. A lead for housing behind the final boss of a hard dungeon? Also pretty annoying. I think it would be nice if leads could have two potential drops mechanisms and they should be in different types of activity.

SilverBride

What does it matter if some players prefer to rush through a dungeon they have probably done a gazillion times before?

If someone doesn't like to play that way then they can form their own group and fill it with like minded players. But asking ZoS to force their play style on others is not reasonable.

Blood_again

Sorry, I will be a Devil's Advocate a bit. I have things to tell to esperienced players.

As an experienced one, I could agree with those nice ideas to make own group, running GD solo etc. BUT try to wear shoes of newcomer.
This week I spoken with lots of them, saw lots of situations in zones and groups. Today I'm convinced that all your nice ideas "how to act" are for you, not for them.
Because lots of 10-15 level newcomers I saw:

• don't know how to answer PM
• don't know how to write to "that orange chat"
• don't know how to invite people to group
• don't know how to leave group after that
• don't have friends
• don't have guild with dungeon ready mates
• don't know how to solo even delve
• can't find a way into dungeon although the whole zonechat helped them
• don't know how many people should be in group for that or another activity
• don't know which roles they should invite

It is just the begining of the list. And it is OK for newcomers to not have all these knowledge and skills.
Honestly, it is very lucky or pre-experienced (like from other mmo) newcomer if they know at least third of it.

Now what the grouping tool does? It helps with all that a lot. It hepls in first place to newcomers and unexperienced players, that usually don't have a chance to get to their first dungeons another way. It is damn newby school bus to a dungeon.
They met you in the dungeon group. What happen next? You have a choice, because you have skills, knowledge etc. You're in control because of that, while they often can't even write anything to you (they don't know how, just a reminder).
Let's be honest, many of us make a selfish choice in this situation. Thanks to those who don't. But remember, it is your choice to spoil their experience.
I don't blame. I am in your shoes too. I just insist on looking at it with their eyes and taking the responsibility that is really on you and me, not on the newcomers.
The greater the power, the more responcibility.

Now when we all had many rides on that school bus and someone says "Think about newcomers' experience". What happens next?
You tell them "Go get a taxi", "Adapt or leave", "Ride your bus on your own".
I understand you. But I will remind you. They usually can't ride a taxi. You can. You can ride a taxi very easy.
And actually you occupied their school bus.

So please, if you go random - remember about others' experience and abilities. Remember about your power.
If you really in a hurry and wanna rush, please plactice what you preach. Ride a taxy instead. Make your group, because you can. Otherwise please be a bit more responsible in PUG. Once more, remember about your power.

Sorry for sharpen a bit. Thank you for reading.

Rishikesa108

SilverBride wrote: »

What does it matter if some players prefer to rush through a dungeon they have probably done a gazillion times before?

If someone doesn't like to play that way then they can form their own group and fill it with like minded players. But asking ZoS to force their play style on others is not reasonable.

In life as in play, the weakest people are the ones who deserve the most protection. And it is assumed that the new players are weaker and therefore need more protection from ZOS. Those who feel bored and very experienced can avoid playing the basic contents, or can adjust the pace to beginners. Those who want to rush in the basic content can agree with other guilders to do so, but cannot impose their own fast pace on beginners. Let's learn respect, please.

thorwyn

Rishikesa108 wrote: »

Boring you say... But if you're so end-game, why are you running Fungal Grotto I ? If you killed those bosses 1000 times, why do you still enter FG? Dedicate yourself to more difficult contents and leave these basic contents to new players who want/need to go through them without haste, killing all the mobs both to gain more experience and for simple fun. I would like ZOS to come up with a clever method to prevent serial skippers from being able to do what they want to the detriment of new players. Slaughterfish or other smarter methods... everything would be fine to favor those who would like to be able to play with less fury and rush

People are not running FG1 for the fun of it. They are running it because it popped up as a random daily dungeon when they queued for their 10 transmute crystals. If ZOS would provide us with an alterntaive solution to this, the problem would not exist. Then again, the queue for dungeons would be 10 times longer.

Soarora

RaikaNA wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I hate this “you should have to kill everything” suggestion that keeps popping up as threads. It’s not going to happen. Removing the fg1 skip would be an extremely unpopular idea. People aren’t going to kill every single obsidian ghost thing in fg2. Ruins of mazzatun has its own achievement for killing the entire dungeon. March of sacrifices gets a lot longer when you have to hunt down all the spread out trash packs. Most DLC dungeons require killing everything for speedrun/no death. Farm runs would take longer, thus mask and motif pages would probably go up in price. Maybe the premade group thing will help people find what they’re looking for without advocating to rip how the majority plays away from us.

Yes because every single NPC inside dungeons drops XP when they die.. This helps low-level players to level up during a random normal. when you start skipping mobs you're losing out on XP, and you're not helping the team to level up their characters. Sometimes you gotta think about other people rather than yourself. Not everyone wants to level up their characters by dolmen farming in Alik'r desert.

Just because it drops EXP doesn't mean that it's reasonable to kill them for the EXP. You'd get more EXP out of doing half of fungal 1 as a random twice than doing it once because of the experience boost from doing a random dungeon and I would assume that bosses drop more EXP than trash does. I don't level up my characters by dolmen farming and indeed actually level them by doing random normals. After a couple levels you really start to appreciate fast runs... so no, I would actually be helping them level their characters. Especially because in my experience if I am queueing on a low-level, the other low-level players are also high CPs on alts (as I see from their behavior and styling). If I am queueing on my normal characters, I don't get thrown in with under level 50 players. The grouping system isn't completely random... so really, this is a non-issue.

prof-dracko wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I hate this “you should have to kill everything” suggestion that keeps popping up as threads. It’s not going to happen. Removing the fg1 skip would be an extremely unpopular idea. People aren’t going to kill every single obsidian ghost thing in fg2. Ruins of mazzatun has its own achievement for killing the entire dungeon. March of sacrifices gets a lot longer when you have to hunt down all the spread out trash packs. Most DLC dungeons require killing everything for speedrun/no death. Farm runs would take longer, thus mask and motif pages would probably go up in price. Maybe the premade group thing will help people find what they’re looking for without advocating to rip how the majority plays away from us.

Not every mob, but I think every boss should be required for pledges. Already is in the dungeons released between IC and I believe Waking Flame when they introduced the hidden puzzle bosses (which I think it's fair to skip as they require group co-ordination). Worst case it's a three minute detour and some extra loot. A group can almost trivially burn through them, so why not besides wanting to save an insignificant amount of time?

Requiring every boss for pledges is reasonable, requiring every boss for the dungeon to be considered cleared or even every enemy to die for the dungeon to be considered cleared would not be reasonable.

kargen27 wrote: »

Soarora wrote: »

I hate this “you should have to kill everything” suggestion that keeps popping up as threads. It’s not going to happen. Removing the fg1 skip would be an extremely unpopular idea. People aren’t going to kill every single obsidian ghost thing in fg2. Ruins of mazzatun has its own achievement for killing the entire dungeon. March of sacrifices gets a lot longer when you have to hunt down all the spread out trash packs. Most DLC dungeons require killing everything for speedrun/no death. Farm runs would take longer, thus mask and motif pages would probably go up in price. Maybe the premade group thing will help people find what they’re looking for without advocating to rip how the majority plays away from us.

Why would farm runs take longer? With farm runs you aren't looking for dungeon completion. When I say I would like to see all critters and evil doers die for completion that means to get the daily random reward or the pledge reward you would need to kill everything. If all you want is gear drop then skip content all you want. Be considerate of others though and preform a farming group. Most times it is quick to fill the group, they will run multiple times saving time and are more likely to share gear they don't need.

Under the assumption that you'd have to kill previous enemies for the next ones to unlock as the end-of-dungeon rewards drop from the final boss... which is usually what is farmed. Otherwise, certain dungeons may or may not cultivate a culture of "I don't care if it's your random, I'm not killing everything, I'm going to leave once I get my things".

I don't know why multiple people seem to be telling me to be considerate. I don't support full-on speedrunning when pugs are involved... but that doesn't mean I'm going to kill every single enemy in every single dungeon. Only when people need an achievement and communicate that, otherwise its wasting people's time. I understand people may not know that they have to communicate but that is exactly why I say hello at the beginning of every dungeon: to establish communication. If someone doesn't want to play with random other people, they shouldn't pug. Most of the time I spend pugging is actually specifically for the benefit of others; to give them a tank that knows what they're doing and will stick with them even if group DPS isn't 100k. Even if I have to necro-res prog or slap on matriarch I'm getting people their clears. But just that: their clear. SR/ND/HM when reasonable, but never kill-every-single-thing just for the "fun" of it.
And if you really want everything dead, solo it or tank it yourself. The only time it's okay to run ahead of the tank is if the tank is fake.

SilverBride

Rishikesa108 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

What does it matter if some players prefer to rush through a dungeon they have probably done a gazillion times before?

If someone doesn't like to play that way then they can form their own group and fill it with like minded players. But asking ZoS to force their play style on others is not reasonable.

In life as in play, the weakest people are the ones who deserve the most protection. And it is assumed that the new players are weaker and therefore need more protection from ZOS. Those who feel bored and very experienced can avoid playing the basic contents, or can adjust the pace to beginners. Those who want to rush in the basic content can agree with other guilders to do so, but cannot impose their own fast pace on beginners. Let's learn respect, please.

Players are not responsible for anyone in the group but themselves.

If a player wants to do the quest and asks to complete all the bosses, all the groups I've been in so far have been agreeable. But groups should not be forced to play a certain way just because someone else thinks they should.

kargen27

SilverBride wrote: »

What does it matter if some players prefer to rush through a dungeon they have probably done a gazillion times before?

If someone doesn't like to play that way then they can form their own group and fill it with like minded players. But asking ZoS to force their play style on others is not reasonable.

This is one half of a never ending circle of let them form their own group. If you want to rush get a group that wants to rush. Announcing in zone chat that you want a group for speed run or farm run will get you a group much much faster than asking for a group for a story/quest run.

When doing a dungeon I ask if anyone has the quest. If someone says yes I stay with them.

When I started leveling my Arcanist I wanted to do the quest in the dungeons because I had an experience scroll and the XP for finishing a quest is a decent chunk. Two others were also low level and doing the quest. The 4th knowing we were on the quest and being asked twice to please slow down continued to sprint to the end past mobs that gave us some difficulty if they got stacked.
Thing is the only reason he got that low level dungeon that he could easily sprint through was because low level characters were in the queue. I've done the dungeon many many times so it wasn't a huge deal. I would hate to think that the experience was a first dungeon run ever for one of the other two. They would feel disappointed and underwhelmed.

Slow down and enjoy the game. If you find some content boring give it a rest for a while. Don't force others to rush through because you are bored.

spartaxoxo

No. There's nothing wrong with having optional bosses and mobs in a dungeon.

Galiferno

Rishikesa108 wrote: »

Boring you say... But if you're so end-game, why are you running Fungal Grotto I ? If you killed those bosses 1000 times, why do you still enter FG? Dedicate yourself to more difficult contents and leave these basic contents to new players who want/need to go through them without haste, killing all the mobs both to gain more experience and for simple fun. I would like ZOS to come up with a clever method to prevent serial skippers from being able to do what they want to the detriment of new players. Slaughterfish or other smarter methods... everything would be fine to favor those who would like to be able to play with less fury and rush

are you aware of what the word random in random normal means

Jamie_Aubrey

This is the reason this is the go to Dungeon

Hurbster

I would have to disagree with the initial suggestion.

svendf

merpins wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

Please, no. You can explore that dungeon on your own if you want, don't deprive other people of a useful shortcut.

Those who want a shortcut can do it solo... don't deprive the rest of the group of dungeon content because you don't want to finish the rest of the dungeon.

Not if you add slaughterfish they can't. What content, anyway, fighting the same bosses for the 100th time?

Edit: If you don't want to skip, ask your groupmates not to skip. Run with guildies or other people who will agree to your request. What you're suggesting is a heavy handed approach that will only benefit the few.

I don't know if you're aware of this, but the game is being offered for free right now in epic games. the chances are that it's bringing new people into the game. When you do your random normals.. when you see low-level characters... perhaps one of them is new... don't have a guild and has never done fungal grotto before. Just because you did it 100 times doesn't mean that everyone else did it too.

Had a couple lowbies with me in Fungal Grotto the day before yesterday; no Arcanists either, and the way they played, they were definitely new to the game. I'm CP 2000+, and they were all level 15 or lower.

Was a ton of fun. Went slow for them, let them clean up the first wave of mobs, then I helped them for the second. Helped them with the first boss, and basically just supported for the second to get them used to it. No boss skipping needed.
Similar thing happened a week or two ago. Myself, CP 2000+. we had another CP 2000+, but the other two were under CP 300. We got Ruins of Mazatun. The CP 2000 ran ahead, skipping mobs while one guy said "brb" right away. Me and the other waited, the 2000 didnt, so we kicked him. I carried the two of them through the dungeon and it was also a ton of fun!

Course there are a ton of people that would just run ahead, whenever I get a base game dungeon I check the party and their levels, and play to them. I don't like the mentality of rushing through a dungeon. I don't mind doing it when I duo dungeons with my wife, it can be fun if that's what you're trying to do. But this is a game, not a race to finish all your dailies so you can then log out. If you're playing with other people, you should play to what they want. If everyone runs ahead, sure. but if there's even 1 that isn't, I won't run ahead. Had a couple occasions where I whispered the non-runner, and then quit the party, formed one with them, and then just queued again even after the queue cooldown. It just isn't great a lot of the time.

I like these post because somewhere outthere, there are player´s, who care and can see the, bigger picture .

Ten new player´s in the game (just a number). How many of those new player´s will stay with ESO after encounting these unhelpful player´s ? I dare to say not many as it´s a very unpleasant experience for those I have been intouch with.

I have/had the same attitude as you and find/found it very satisfying helping those new player´s getting their quest done and in general getting a positive experience out of their first or 2nd dungeon run.

Where are Zos in all of this ? Don´t they know, they loose player´s ? It´s a very odd way they approach this despite all the post through out the years, where it´s getting worse for every year passing by. Same goes for people, who wants to duel and gets a duel denial and mudballs you because they didn´t get, what they want. Why can´t Zos see that ? Or do they just ignor it ?

The more player´s you have in a game like this, who stands up for new and weaker player´s a more balanced the community will be. Why do these player´s use DF ? Aren´t they in a guild ? Many of these player´s have a strong build and can do all of this as a pair or to three/four. Why do other player´s have to be part of all this ?

All that said. It should be possible to get into a open dialogue with people from Zos. Gettin asolution, which is harmless to all parties. What´s less harmless ? Getting overrun by stronger player´s, who find it boring clearing a dungeon and didn´t get the quest done. And add to that repeatedly time after time. Or is it more harnful to ask for a dungeon clear, with mech inplace, which make it impossible to skip or leave people behind.

Lets just getting it out there. ESO have become a game, where player´s with strong chars can dictate weaker player´s how a dungeon is run. So! To get all of this out of the way. Lets find a way, which is less harmful for all player´s and get the community together.

Thank You

Lapin_Logic

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

Please, no. You can explore that dungeon on your own if you want, don't deprive other people of a useful shortcut.

Those who want a shortcut can do it solo... don't deprive the rest of the group of dungeon content because you don't want to finish the rest of the dungeon.

If you want to fight every boss and trash, solo it with Isobel on easy, You could probably sleep and she would complete it for you.

If you want to trifecta it, ask Guild.

90% of players do this for the "complete 1 dungeon" endeavour as quick as possible for the pittiful amount of endeavour points we get.

kyatos_binarini

nope, thanks

svendf

Lapin_Logic wrote: »

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

Please, no. You can explore that dungeon on your own if you want, don't deprive other people of a useful shortcut.

Those who want a shortcut can do it solo... don't deprive the rest of the group of dungeon content because you don't want to finish the rest of the dungeon.

If you want to fight every boss and trash, solo it with Isobel on easy, You could probably sleep and she would complete it for you.

If you want to trifecta it, ask Guild.

90% of players do this for the "complete 1 dungeon" endeavour as quick as possible for the pittiful amount of endeavour points we get.

Are you in a guild use your guild mates. You only need two of you. Sometimes three or four doesn´t matter. Are you not in a guild find one, who runs dungeons the way you want.

You can also use your compagnion to help you out. I have done that in some cases and useful in the right hands. It could take some time to get your compagnion up and running (read trial and error).

Don´t ask people to jump from a plane if you aren´t ready yourself. The 90% of player´s you mention only goes for those you have around you.

jaws343

The change with DLC dungeons to only require the final boss kill to get completion for a pledge was the right direction to take pledge requirements and really should be implemented across all dungeons.

The problem with everyone's suggestion of needing to kill every boss for completion, including the absurd idea that side bosses should somehow become required bosses, means that no one will use the random dungeon finder for risk of getting dumped into a dungeon after bosses have been killed, and subsequently being forced to run the dungeons again. It's bad enough that this happens already for base game dungeons. No one is going to want to run Lair of Marselok twice because they got queued into the dungeon to replace a group member after the first boss died.

Requiring side bosses also basically breaks functionality of a number of dungeons if a group is unlucky enough to not get a replacement in the queue but are capable of completing the dungeon with only 3 players. For example, any side boss that requires all 4 players to trigger.

Your suggestions would actually harm the game. Far more than players skipping bosses in literally the easiest and quickest dungeon in the game.

SerafinaWaterstar

Oh gods no.

It’s useful to have one dungeon to solo quickly for endeavours. And people can also fall into the water accidentally so that would be such fun if died whilst doing ‘properly’.

Stop ruining others fun.

svendf

jaws343 wrote: »

The change with DLC dungeons to only require the final boss kill to get completion for a pledge was the right direction to take pledge requirements and really should be implemented across all dungeons.

The problem with everyone's suggestion of needing to kill every boss for completion, including the absurd idea that side bosses should somehow become required bosses, means that no one will use the random dungeon finder for risk of getting dumped into a dungeon after bosses have been killed, and subsequently being forced to run the dungeons again. It's bad enough that this happens already for base game dungeons. No one is going to want to run Lair of Marselok twice because they got queued into the dungeon to replace a group member after the first boss died.

Requiring side bosses also basically breaks functionality of a number of dungeons if a group is unlucky enough to not get a replacement in the queue but are capable of completing the dungeon with only 3 players. For example, any side boss that requires all 4 players to trigger.

Your suggestions would actually harm the game. Far more than players skipping bosses in literally the easiest and quickest dungeon in the game.

Wouldn´t it be more logical to fix it so no one are able to join a run in progress ? Unless someone gets a direct invite and lenting a helping hand.

Also being a nice fella should not bring anyone in a situation, where no credit is given, if someone will join a run in progress give them full credit.

Why do full clear work in other Mmo´s and not ESO ? It´s not a question aimed at you. It´s aimed a Zos.

What´s going on in dungeons now is right out harmful. Powerful player´s dictating new and less powerful player´s on how a dungeons is run.

No we dont´have time for your questing find a guild or like minded

jaws343

svendf wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The change with DLC dungeons to only require the final boss kill to get completion for a pledge was the right direction to take pledge requirements and really should be implemented across all dungeons.

The problem with everyone's suggestion of needing to kill every boss for completion, including the absurd idea that side bosses should somehow become required bosses, means that no one will use the random dungeon finder for risk of getting dumped into a dungeon after bosses have been killed, and subsequently being forced to run the dungeons again. It's bad enough that this happens already for base game dungeons. No one is going to want to run Lair of Marselok twice because they got queued into the dungeon to replace a group member after the first boss died.

Requiring side bosses also basically breaks functionality of a number of dungeons if a group is unlucky enough to not get a replacement in the queue but are capable of completing the dungeon with only 3 players. For example, any side boss that requires all 4 players to trigger.

Your suggestions would actually harm the game. Far more than players skipping bosses in literally the easiest and quickest dungeon in the game.

Wouldn´t it be more logical to fix it so no one are able to join a run in progress ? Unless someone gets a direct invite and lenting a helping hand.

Also being a nice fella should not bring anyone in a situation, where no credit is given, if someone will join a run in progress give them full credit.

Why do full clear work in other Mmo´s and not ESO ? It´s not a question aimed at you. It´s aimed a Zos.

What´s going on in dungeons now is right out harmful. Powerful player´s dictating new and less powerful player´s on how a dungeons is run.

No we dont´have time for your questing find a guild or like minded

So, break dungeon finder then. Guess if you get paired with a tank who literally cannot do their job in the dungeon, you have to start over from the beginning, rather than just kicking the tank and getting a new one from the queue.

Too bad for the groups that have players who start harrassing their teammates. If you kick them you gotta start the dungeon over again.

Somehow, you think this will be a better experience for new players. Just absolutely delusional and defeats the actual purpose of the dungeon finder.

Jierdanit

Blood_again wrote: »

Sorry, I will be a Devil's Advocate a bit. I have things to tell to esperienced players.

As an experienced one, I could agree with those nice ideas to make own group, running GD solo etc. BUT try to wear shoes of newcomer.
This week I spoken with lots of them, saw lots of situations in zones and groups. Today I'm convinced that all your nice ideas "how to act" are for you, not for them.
Because lots of 10-15 level newcomers I saw:

• don't know how to answer PM
• don't know how to write to "that orange chat"
• don't know how to invite people to group
• don't know how to leave group after that
• don't have friends
• don't have guild with dungeon ready mates
• don't know how to solo even delve
• can't find a way into dungeon although the whole zonechat helped them
• don't know how many people should be in group for that or another activity
• don't know which roles they should invite

It is just the begining of the list. And it is OK for newcomers to not have all these knowledge and skills.
Honestly, it is very lucky or pre-experienced (like from other mmo) newcomer if they know at least third of it.

Almost all of that is something that every player in the game should know.
The problem is that ZOS is absolutely trash at teaching new players how to play their game.
It should be absolutely basic knowledge how to use the chat, the grouping tool and what composition is needed for what, but it just isn't taught anywhere in the game.

Also barely anyone would have a problem doing something like a delve solo if they actually needed to use any form of build in overland and questing content instead of being able to do everything with light attacks and white gear.
Obviously they're gonna have problems in content that isn't brain dead easy.

Ragged_Claw

I think we can have one dungeon we can skip through as a little treat. I rarely pug, but when I do I always ask if anyone wants quests/optional bosses first (I know there are plenty of rude-rushers tho). It's great for Undaunted Events which benefits all players and once you've done the quest and killed all the bosses that's it, no point to doing the whole thing over and over. If you need to farm set gear it's pretty easily soloed or you can get guildies to help out. Some of us have been playing for nearly ten years now and would cry a lot if we were faced with having to do every single boss in FG every single time. Think of us oldies!

Plus I fall off that +/@*& bridge every.single.time.

svendf

jaws343 wrote: »

svendf wrote: »

jaws343 wrote: »

The change with DLC dungeons to only require the final boss kill to get completion for a pledge was the right direction to take pledge requirements and really should be implemented across all dungeons.

The problem with everyone's suggestion of needing to kill every boss for completion, including the absurd idea that side bosses should somehow become required bosses, means that no one will use the random dungeon finder for risk of getting dumped into a dungeon after bosses have been killed, and subsequently being forced to run the dungeons again. It's bad enough that this happens already for base game dungeons. No one is going to want to run Lair of Marselok twice because they got queued into the dungeon to replace a group member after the first boss died.

Requiring side bosses also basically breaks functionality of a number of dungeons if a group is unlucky enough to not get a replacement in the queue but are capable of completing the dungeon with only 3 players. For example, any side boss that requires all 4 players to trigger.

Your suggestions would actually harm the game. Far more than players skipping bosses in literally the easiest and quickest dungeon in the game.

Wouldn´t it be more logical to fix it so no one are able to join a run in progress ? Unless someone gets a direct invite and lenting a helping hand.

Also being a nice fella should not bring anyone in a situation, where no credit is given, if someone will join a run in progress give them full credit.

Why do full clear work in other Mmo´s and not ESO ? It´s not a question aimed at you. It´s aimed a Zos.

What´s going on in dungeons now is right out harmful. Powerful player´s dictating new and less powerful player´s on how a dungeons is run.

No we dont´have time for your questing find a guild or like minded

So, break dungeon finder then. Guess if you get paired with a tank who literally cannot do their job in the dungeon, you have to start over from the beginning, rather than just kicking the tank and getting a new one from the queue.

Too bad for the groups that have players who start harrassing their teammates. If you kick them you gotta start the dungeon over again.

Somehow, you think this will be a better experience for new players. Just absolutely delusional and defeats the actual purpose of the dungeon finder.

I joined just right after One Tamriel. Some tanks left few got kicked. After a tank left others went through the door. "Hey what happen here, need a helping hand". At that time mostly normal dungeons. Where are those times now.

Harrasment comes from people, who can´t turn things around. I have never seen harrasment in 14. Kick allmost never happens.

What went wrong with ESO and it´s community ?

SilverBride

svendf wrote: »

Ten new player´s in the game (just a number). How many of those new player´s will stay with ESO after encounting these unhelpful player´s ?

These new players may find learning a way to do this dungeon faster very helpful.

Blood_again

Jierdanit wrote: »

Almost all of that is something that every player in the game should know.
The problem is that ZOS is absolutely trash at teaching new players how to play their game.
It should be absolutely basic knowledge how to use the chat, the grouping tool and what composition is needed for what, but it just isn't taught anywhere in the game.

Also barely anyone would have a problem doing something like a delve solo if they actually needed to use any form of build in overland and questing content instead of being able to do everything with light attacks and white gear.
Obviously they're gonna have problems in content that isn't brain dead easy.

Claiming ZoS don't teach players well won't change the fact. Newcomers you meet in Fungal are often don't have essential knowledge and skills for group play.
We can't just put on them the whole responsibility for toxic behaviour of experienced players.
Oh, really, he didn't write about having quest for 3 seconds he had before I cut the first stack. So surely he doesn't need it. Hallooo, he tried to realize where he is totally and had no chance, you know.

Talking about "any form of build" of newcomer while questing... What's wrong with you?
Nobody was born with ESO building skills. Sure, you or me deside if a new character run mana or stam while chosing his name. Newcomers don't. Is it a rocket sciense?
Getting back to the point. You know they probably have these problems. What do you do meeting them in Fungal or Spindle?

FeedbackOnly

Most game have skippeble areas if you explore.

It is a poor idea to remove it. They previously tried in dark shade and people were extremely mad

FeedbackOnly

RaikaNA wrote: »

amig186 wrote: »

Please, no. You can explore that dungeon on your own if you want, don't deprive other people of a useful shortcut.

Those who want a shortcut can do it solo... don't deprive the rest of the group of dungeon content because you don't want to finish the rest of the dungeon.

Most people don't want shortcuts removed. There's even one in fang lair or so I heard.

Not all bosses are required in other dungeons either. Most people skip crypt of hearts one by bookcases

Find another group if you are one of the very very rare people who wants it