PTS Update 38 - Feedback Thread for Classes & Abilities

ZOS_GinaBruno

This is the official feedback thread for current class balance and abilities. After you have a chance to try out different combat scenarios, let us know what you think of the current balance.

Morvan

The vampire skill "Eviscerate" and it's morphs are in serious need of buffs or tweaks, as any class spammable is superior to it right now,
take the skill Concealed Weapon for example, it applies Off Balance, gives you 10% extra damage for just being slotted while in Major Expedition and also gives you 15% of movement speed!

Meanwhile all Eviscerate and it's morphs do is to increase damage based on lost HP, a cool mechanic but extremely niche and nearly useless specially on PvE where dps need to be constantly healed in most scenarios,
the Arterial Burst morph in special, which should be the group content friendly morph gives you guaranteed crit if you're under 50% of HP! That's nearly useless as you'll be getting healed for others or yourself and will likely never use it at 50%, meanwhile nightblade's "Surprise Attack" has guaranteed crit for just flanking.

Blood for Blood is even worse in comparison because, despite giving you a huge scaling based on your lost HP, it's not good enough to compete with other spammables and not strong enough to justify the "cannot be healed" status either, although the HP cost is cool and unique.

All class spammables has been receiving tweks and buffs in the last patches while Eviscerate has been left forgotten, it really needs some attention in order to bring vampirism back to the table and justify the cost increase weakness.

ItsNotLiving

Can we get a comment on why arctic blast was changed again?

Lancer1602

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

Can we get a comment on why arctic blast was changed again?

Or just why in PVE, Warden DPS is a total garbage since u35.

Jman100582

Can backlash stop being double hit by battle spirit please? I want to actually kill people in pvp not tickle them

TechMaybeHic

Im not sure Templar needed more defense, or a HOT. The problem is the burst ability under battle spirit does not hit as hard as others. Numerically; it could, but it just doesn't. And its really hard to fill up. Just not rewarding for the effort. Then classes are getting minor and major berserk, but Templar gets 5% on CLASS abilities?

PeacefulAnarchy

Empower change:
"While we're happy to see these builds being ran, we're seeing these builds inch a little too close to some of the high end builds with how much more simplified they are, "

Why nerf all heavy attack builds because of the one bar oakensoul HA build?
How about increasing the duration of empower from skills?
How about making bar swap cleaner on HA builds? H
How about removing the extra skill cast time on HA weaving so that using non-long DOT skills isn't a damage loss?
How about shortening the duration of HAs to a flat 2s so that it lines up better with skills?

All of the above would make 2 bar HA builds viable and encourage people to do more complex combat rotations while still using HA playstyle if that is what they enjoy.

Then you can have the simple one bar oakensoul setup at your new nerfed values,
A more complex HA build meaningfully above the current oakensorc.
And both still noticeably below high end LA builds (which they currently are).

Greek_Hellspawn

Necro deserves more offensive buffs:
Skeletal arcanist/archer give major sorc/brut
Single target dot
Cheaper ultimate
Reliable stun
Execute

Quethrosar

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: »

Empower change:
"While we're happy to see these builds being ran, we're seeing these builds inch a little too close to some of the high end builds with how much more simplified they are, "

Why nerf all heavy attack builds because of the one bar oakensoul HA build?
How about increasing the duration of empower from skills?
How about making bar swap cleaner on HA builds? H
How about removing the extra skill cast time on HA weaving so that using non-long DOT skills isn't a damage loss?
How about shortening the duration of HAs to a flat 2s so that it lines up better with skills?

All of the above would make 2 bar HA builds viable and encourage people to do more complex combat rotations while still using HA playstyle if that is what they enjoy.

Then you can have the simple one bar oakensoul setup at your new nerfed values,
A more complex HA build meaningfully above the current oakensorc.
And both still noticeably below high end LA builds (which they currently are).

i like the idea of 2 bar HA builds, but as you said, empower needs a good increase in time.

Melzo

Many players wrote that the necromancer has a lot of problems. You did a good job strengthening the skull, but it's really just a spit in the face that players will turn their backs on. You have broken the most important mechanics of the necromancer and now every necromancer should play like all other classes, only without the stun and adequate damage. In three patches you've nerfed the necromancer so badly that he's almost as bad as it gets. THE NECROMANCER IS ABSOLUTELY USELESS AS ONE AND IN A GROUP, SINCE HE GIVES NOTHING TO HIMSELF AND OTHER PLAYERS. There were many posts about the necromancer, and you only mentioned the sorcerer and the templar. Well damn thanks. Nine months I wrote and got 3 nerfs and a spit in the face from a pathetic unnecessary skull.


Are you specifically ignoring the necromancer?? The necromancer has too little community. Necromancers are much less played as the gameplay is crap. I wrote to increase the damage but you nerfed hot healing and dot damage. I wrote that the necromancer can do nothing but synergy, your answer is synergy nerf. We wrote that the necromancer is not viable. That he has almost nothing to stand out. Your Answer? Strengthening the skull Seriously??

Each player will agree that the necromancer is much worse than the templar and the sorcerer. Many posts about the sorcerer and templar? And there were no posts about necromancers?? What kind of prejudice is this?

At least bring back the synergy. Now nobody enjoys harmony. And the cemetery became useless.

On the last patch, the administrators responded to all classes and ignored absolutely all messages about the necromancer ??


Why??

LukosCreyden

Templar, no-pet sorc and necromancer are continuing their long stay in the rubbish bin, I see.
HOWEVER, if there is one question I'd love to have answered it is this, why oh why is the Templar jabs animation change not being addressed?

Stx

For Templar-

-I want jabs reverted to pre update 35, including the animation.
-I don’t want major protection added to a charge, I would rather major protection be added to another ability like Ritual that is useful in all areas of the game. Charge skills aren’t really useful in PvE unless it deals damage like stampede.
-5% class damage is very low. DKs get major berserk, nightblades get 10% flat damage to everything. If you want to make solar barrage more useful, just buff the damage, or make the class skills buff better; like 15%.
-Rune focus change is fine.

Estin

The Necromancer's Death Scythe needs to be an execute, or at least have 1 morph that lets it be an execute.

TechMaybeHic

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

The Necromancer's Death Scythe needs to be an execute, or at least have 1 morph that lets it be an execute.

I'd rather have them make that more spammable. Skulls and blast bones are both SLOWWWW avoidable ranged . Damage numbers get nice there, but its not deliverable. I wish scythe hit a bit harder. Maybe even have a reaper effect where it goes up based on corpses in the area

Either way; I wouldn't argue. Pointless to debate amongst ourselves what the classes really need. Only to say they need something.

acastanza_ESO

Going to quote my sorc feedback here

acastanza_ESO wrote: »

Title. You gave DK's - the straight up strongest class in the game - access to Major Berserk on a class skill, and you gave Nightblades an unnamed 10% damage buff that they can stack freely with Major Berserk. But Sorcerers only get Minor Berserk?!?! Hello fairness? Equitable access?! If Sorcerers are supposed to be one of the pure damage with minimal defense classes (which is a joke considering DKs tbh) they should at at least also get access to Major Berserk if not BOTH.
Sorcerer's access is stuck on an interruptible channeled ability, WAY worse than DKs getting it on an actual useful offensive ability. It needs to be actually good and worth that massive risk.This isn't it.

Minor Force is also redundant with both Race Against Time (PVP) and Barbed Trap (PVE). I'm not convinced this gives any extra value except in extremely niche cases.
The Atro giving Major Berserk isn't a justification since someone else has to grab the synergy from the Ult an ult that is pretty bad in PVP since you can just walk away from it. If that is why you didn't do Major, then the answer is simple - give us equitable treatment to Nightblade (the other glass cannon class) and give us an Unnamed 10% damage buff just like they get already. If its fair for them, it is just as fair for Sorc.

Again, you gave DKs Major Berserk on a useful offensive skill with no cooldowns that has literally downsides.

That said, thank you for at least starting to look seriously into improving sorcerer. This still isn't the change we need, but it is at least a step in the right direction.. Please reconsider Major/+Minor Breserk and I think we might actually have a useful sorc again.

SkaiFaith

Thank you Devs, genuinely, for not nerfing Lightning staves Heavy Attacks, Trifocus splash damage, CPs and Oakensoul.
10% nerf to Empower is something I will gladly take if it serves to "cement in stone" the state of these type of builds.

I know some will complain still, and sure I'm not arguing against them, but since people were willing to destroy and bury into the ground this play style, I enforce this: THANK YOU for being reasonable

(Edited to add CPs to the list of nicely untouched things)

noblecron

Been having fun on Arcanist but the skills look a little too bright and seem a little too quick and clunky. The portal especially feels clunky

x99KungFuTacosx

The sorcerer changes are a joke. Sorcerer doesn't need minor berserk (one of the easiest buffs to access in the game), it needs a burst heal that doesn't require a 1 second cast time (dark deal/conversion) OR two bar slots and a killable pet (matriarch).

Every other class in the game has an instant cast class burst heal: necro (resistant flesh), warden (Arctic blast), DK (dragon blood/coag), nightblade (healthy offering), templar (honor the dead).

I'm fine with tweaks to the amount of health/resources restored, and removing the berserk buff. But please take away the cast time for dark exchange and its morphs. The cast time makes bar swapping unnecessarily complicated and limits sorcs survivability, especially since sorc survival is so heavily reliant on shields which have to be recast frequently.

x99KungFuTacosx

I like the templar changes allowing them mobility with slightly less tankiness vs standing still. However, 33% increase to the passive heal when they're standing in the rune is unnecessary and counter-productive if you're trying to make templars more mobile.

I also agree with other posts here that templars could use a berserk or unnamed damage buff instead of the 5% class abilities buff. Since the jabs nerf, templars have been using non-class skills and this damage buff should reflect that reality.

Estin

TechMaybeHic wrote: »

sh4d0wh4z3 wrote: »

The Necromancer's Death Scythe needs to be an execute, or at least have 1 morph that lets it be an execute.

I'd rather have them make that more spammable. Skulls and blast bones are both SLOWWWW avoidable ranged . Damage numbers get nice there, but its not deliverable. I wish scythe hit a bit harder. Maybe even have a reaper effect where it goes up based on corpses in the area

Either way; I wouldn't argue. Pointless to debate amongst ourselves what the classes really need. Only to say they need something.

I was originally going to say to make it the preferred spammable and have it be an execute, but that would've made it too strong imo.

I am with you that Scythe is the preferred spammable. It weaves very well with LAs unlike Skull where it feels like you can miss light attacks because it feels so slow. Scythe is better in every other way, but it also makes sense for it to be an execute instead considering a scythe has always been a symbol for reaping souls, but all it does it just heals you. The whole skill seems to be inspired by the farming aspect of the scythe rather than reaping aspect.

x99KungFuTacosx

Fixed an issue where sources of Invisibility from things such as Shadow Cloak or potions could still allow you to be detected by other players in some cases, such as when you were wearing too many pieces of Heavy Armor, or when player targets had increases to Stealth Detection.

Can we get some clarification on this? Does this mean that nightblades using shadow cloak (or other players with invisibility) will no longer be visible to someone who has used a detect potion? Detect potions function by increasing stealth detection range.

propertyOfUndefined

Is this really all necromancers can expect? I feel pathetic for coming here every PTS cycle to cry about the sad state the class is in when it comes to PVP. Oh well...

RandomKodiak

Sorc not getting 15% passive for ulti, Atro will not cast until the basic 200 tooltip

acastanza_ESO

RandomKodiak wrote: »

Sorc not getting 15% passive for ulti, Atro will not cast until the basic 200 tooltip

Bug Reports thread here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/631614/
Hopefully they get it fixed!

Glantir

I would like to see the stun of the Volatile Familiar completly removed. In Trials it is a reason to not slot the Volatile Familiar.
And i guess in PvP the stun is irrelevant...

DeathStalker

Buff Jabs

TechMaybeHic

x99KungFuTacosx wrote: »

Fixed an issue where sources of Invisibility from things such as Shadow Cloak or potions could still allow you to be detected by other players in some cases, such as when you were wearing too many pieces of Heavy Armor, or when player targets had increases to Stealth Detection.

Can we get some clarification on this? Does this mean that nightblades using shadow cloak (or other players with invisibility) will no longer be visible to someone who has used a detect potion? Detect potions function by increasing stealth detection range.

Uhh....yeah. Clarification please @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Kevin

x99KungFuTacosx

propertyOfUndefined wrote: »

Is this really all necromancers can expect? I feel pathetic for coming here every PTS cycle to cry about the sad state the class is in when it comes to PVP. Oh well...

Totally agree, necros have been screwed over lately. Yes, the harmony bombing was overpowered. But the rest of their toolkit is not good (except for resistant flesh, great survivability skill!).

Specific improvements:
- Class-based major brutality/sorcery skill
- Nobody uses skulls in PvP. The third cast improvement won't change that. Make them hit harder and move faster every cast or that skill will continue to go unused. Other spammables are much more reliable, hit harder, and are easier to weave.
- Add a unique, passive class buff that scales based on how many corpses are in the area.
- Make bashcro strong again. We got one decent patch for bashcro before the bash damage got nerfed

YandereGirlfriend

Lancer1602 wrote: »

ItsNotLiving wrote: »

Can we get a comment on why arctic blast was changed again?

Or just why in PVE, Warden DPS is a total garbage since u35.

Because they had to nerf Shalks for FOUR consecutive patch cycles because... "reasons."

That is a class where it certainly feels as though nobody is driving the bus any longer.

Starlight_Knight

Vampire Undeath Passive is still over tuned making vampire meta in pvp.

ghost_bg_ESO

necromacer (i was sad for its "notable" changes)

my opinion about animation (nothing about damage as overland class can hit like noodle)
flame skull - make it same as force shock/puls - short timed and straight
blastbones 70% of the time looks like confused John Travolta in that pulp fiction giff...


arcanist - it was first thing that bothered me

may by Fatecarver should be interruptable by caster and ot go for full duration also with light attack not only with block...
And may be something with ticks timing, but all animations on multiple skills casted together kind of came too much and immersive breaking to stay long time - too much bright green. About animations may be little bit muffled down skills and only crux triangles more visible?

tome bearer looks good on staff