Class Change Tokens - Request Number 73,276

Tandor · March 3

Shagreth wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

If everything is maxed, what more skill points do you need, and can't get in other ways? You have all your class skills and CPs, what more do you need from e.g. non-class skill lines?

[Snip]

Adding new morphs to existing classes would be extending an existing system, I'd welcome that. What I don't welcome is changing existing systems entirely without very good cause. I see the reasons some argue for those changes, and I'm far from alone in seeing other reasons for not agreeing with those changes (or in some cases simply wanting them to be optional).

[Snip]

[Edited quote and edited for removed content]

FelisCatus · March 3

Tandor wrote: »

Shagreth wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

If everything is maxed, what more skill points do you need, and can't get in other ways? You have all your class skills and CPs, what more do you need from e.g. non-class skill lines?

[Snip]

Adding new morphs to existing classes would be extending an existing system, I'd welcome that. What I don't welcome is changing existing systems entirely without very good cause. I see the reasons some argue for those changes, and I'm far from alone in seeing other reasons for not agreeing with those changes (or in some cases simply wanting them to be optional).

[Snip]

There are very good reasons to change and overhaul existing systems.

[Edited quote]

Ugrak · March 13

Cooperharley wrote: »

The only reason we haven't seen it is because of what Gina says - it's due to technical limitations on their end. If they fix that stuff, I guarantee you we'll see it. They didn't say it's impossible, it's just not something they're looking at (or were looking at at that time) due to those limitations. But their technology and resources improve every year so who knows!

You may have noticed that leveling achievements for each class were added a while back.

So that an account could for example unlock a class in the crown store in the same way other skill lines and zone skyshards currently are.

I'm cautiously optimistic this is an indication something might be in the works.

Deimus · March 13

@ZOS_Volpe Any news from the Dev team on the future of the Necro? The other thread that was closed asking for a class change token due to the Necromancer class being gutted yet again received no official feedback on the intentions for the class. Could you inquire about that for us? Thanks!

Ugrak · March 13

Sarannah wrote: »

Class change should not happen for many reasons, and should come with heavy requirements if it is ever made: Having a level 50 of that class already, and only once per year. Otherwise players will keep chasing the meta classes and it would harm the game's diversity, due to everyone running around on the same class.

That does not seem to be a real issue. We already have functionality that allows this kind of meta chasing, in the form of easy alt leveling and account wide stuff.

i.e., Just want a different class for the performance? It can potentially just be hours away from battle readiness, and then you just log in to whatever everyone else is using.

For example I already have a meta-roster with one of each class leveled up and ready to roll; in position to chase the meta according to the flavor of the month. In fact they were made specifically to open the possibility of doing so. Class change won't affect that capability one way or the other.

The idea of a one year cooldown on a class change token in light of the above makes as much sense to me as a one year cooldown on logging in with any but one class per account, or what is to prevent players from just relogging to an alt? Is this even a real problem? I'd say no.

Class change tokens are for freshing up the highly developed specialty characters aside from the meta-roster, that I'd rather modify than remake from scratch.

FelisCatus · March 13

Ugrak wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

The only reason we haven't seen it is because of what Gina says - it's due to technical limitations on their end. If they fix that stuff, I guarantee you we'll see it. They didn't say it's impossible, it's just not something they're looking at (or were looking at at that time) due to those limitations. But their technology and resources improve every year so who knows!

You may have noticed that leveling achievements for each class were added a while back.

So that an account could for example unlock a class in the crown store in the same way other skill lines and zone skyshards currently are.

I'm cautiously optimistic this is an indication something might be in the works.

They'd be stupid not to add it many people want it and if they want to make more money they will cave to the demand of the market.

Tandor · March 14

FelisCatus wrote: »

Ugrak wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

The only reason we haven't seen it is because of what Gina says - it's due to technical limitations on their end. If they fix that stuff, I guarantee you we'll see it. They didn't say it's impossible, it's just not something they're looking at (or were looking at at that time) due to those limitations. But their technology and resources improve every year so who knows!

You may have noticed that leveling achievements for each class were added a while back.

So that an account could for example unlock a class in the crown store in the same way other skill lines and zone skyshards currently are.

I'm cautiously optimistic this is an indication something might be in the works.

They'd be stupid not to add it many people want it and if they want to make more money they will cave to the demand of the market.

That would depend on the cost of implementing it and dealing with any resulting problems, and the estimated loss in revenue from the reduced sale of existing levelling aids in the Crown Store.

LunaFlora · March 14

Tandor wrote: »

FelisCatus wrote: »

Ugrak wrote: »

Cooperharley wrote: »

The only reason we haven't seen it is because of what Gina says - it's due to technical limitations on their end. If they fix that stuff, I guarantee you we'll see it. They didn't say it's impossible, it's just not something they're looking at (or were looking at at that time) due to those limitations. But their technology and resources improve every year so who knows!

You may have noticed that leveling achievements for each class were added a while back.

So that an account could for example unlock a class in the crown store in the same way other skill lines and zone skyshards currently are.

I'm cautiously optimistic this is an indication something might be in the works.

They'd be stupid not to add it many people want it and if they want to make more money they will cave to the demand of the market.

That would depend on the cost of implementing it and dealing with any resulting problems, and the estimated loss in revenue from the reduced sale of existing levelling aids in the Crown Store.

people get levelling aids from the Crown Store for characters they do not want to spend all the extra time levelling skill lines for.

people would still do that.
maybe a few would not,
but most of the people that want a Class Change Token want it because they've done everything with their main character and want to not re-do thousands of quests.

edited: typos

Adremal · March 14

Necromancers should get one for free with this last salt in the wound.

heaven13 · March 14

I honestly would have preferred class change tokens to accountwide achievements. Both impact replayability. I can absolutely see the point of those who made their character X because that's what was available but when Y class comes out, it's more representative of the character the player had imagined all along.

ZoS also said they wouldn't do accountwide achievements and alliance change tokens, back in the day, so I honestly feel like the only reason they haven't done class change (yet) is because they technically can't figure out how to without breaking something else.

FelisCatus · March 14

heaven13 wrote: »

I honestly would have preferred class change tokens to accountwide achievements. Both impact replayability. I can absolutely see the point of those who made their character X because that's what was available but when Y class comes out, it's more representative of the character the player had imagined all along.

ZoS also said they wouldn't do accountwide achievements and alliance change tokens, back in the day, so I honestly feel like the only reason they haven't done class change (yet) is because they technically can't figure out how to without breaking something else.

It's just 3 skill lines shouldn't be difficult at all.

Malyore · March 18

@ZOS_Icy

Is there any data that can be shared on what the technical limitations are to class change tokens?

Ciotola · March 20

Malyore wrote: »

@ZOS_Icy

Is there any data that can be shared on what the technical limitations are to class change tokens?

It's not the first time this has been asked, they won't do it. zenimax needs to seriously reevaluate its approach towards us PAYING users.

Malyore · March 20

Ciotola wrote: »

Malyore wrote: »

@ZOS_Icy

Is there any data that can be shared on what the technical limitations are to class change tokens?

It's not the first time this has been asked, they won't do it. zenimax needs to seriously reevaluate its approach towards us PAYING users.

The reason I asked is because I had a different thread discussing a different topic about class change tokens. I was trying to discuss the technical limitations and ways that people were willing to try to work with zos on accepting some form of limited or altered class change token. But I guess zos thought it was too similar to this thread and mine got closed. Instead of retyping out all of my assumptions and questions, it just was easier to ask zos directly what was going on.

I knew @ZOS_Icy wouldn't respond. But when any action becomes a waste of effort, I might as well go for the minimal effort and most direct action and hope maybe some effort will be returned.

I'm not too distraught about it though. I'd say it's believable to say literally everybody on the forum has had some experience of being directly ignored by the forum moderators. I've seen it happen a lot to others, and I'm not gonna get upset just because it's my turn. It's just the nature of their company. How lucky are we that we can even afford to get frustrated by such things? We must have things going pretty good in life if this is what we have to get irked about.
It's a videogame. We choose if the fun of the game outweighs the frustration and we the customer choose to put our money into it. Despite frustrations existing in a lot of areas, when I take a step back from the forums and from zos and all of that, I instead can re-enter the world of tamriel and can just play the game and enjoy what I have without the fuss. If something new and requested gets added, it gets added. But I personally don't want to let my thoughts on what the game could/should be ruin my taste for it, or allow myself to get angry at being ignored by someone whose job it is to make sure the fans aren't fighting with each other on a website. There's plenty of other things to focus on in life.

Nic727 · April 2

heaven13 wrote: »

I honestly feel like the only reason they haven't done class change (yet) is because they technically can't figure out how to without breaking something else.

We’ve discussed about multiple ways to do it and one is just to give us back the skills points we had in one class skill line and start from lvl 0 in that class.

I mean, it’s technically possible, but I guess the problem is that they just don’t care about working on that.

DigiAngel · April 2

Unlikely to see....ZOS sells more character slots without the token.

Foxxal · April 3

I'd very happily spend 4000 crowns on a class change token, it's so much less annoying than grinding alt character skills. I'm never going to spend crowns skill line skips because I like my main character too much, but being able to swap classes without the extra fuss would be something I'd buy. I have a lot of acquaintances that feel the same way.

kojou · April 3

нет

FelisCatus · April 4

We need it.

Sakiri · April 4

They'd probably make it incredibly expensive to deter it rather than encourage it.

TDVM · May 19

There is no need to add a class change chip, if you want to play a different class, create a new character. The fact that you can't change class is normal for MMOs, there are many MMOs where you can't change classes.

Malyore · May 19

TDVM wrote: »

There is no need to add a class change chip, if you want to play a different class, create a new character. The fact that you can't change class is normal for MMOs, there are many MMOs where you can't change classes.

There is a need to add class change tokens for the players who want to make their main a new class. Between all of the skill lines, quests, map locations, character-bound achievement dyes, and mount upgrades, it takes a long time to bring an alt up to par with your main.

Malyore · May 19

Sakiri wrote: »

They'd probably make it incredibly expensive to deter it rather than encourage it.

True, but I think still having the option for those who want to buy one is the way to go. Same way houses in ESO already work. An ESO house costs the same irl money as two new videogames/dlcs. A motif book or a reskin of a banker costs more than an entire new ESO chapter. I don't doubt they'd charge a ridiculous amount of money for a change token, and I may not agree with it, but at the same time I want it badly enough so I'd be willing to pay for it. But others are in every right to say "I ain't paying for that" lol

TDVM · May 19

Malyore wrote: »

TDVM wrote: »

There is no need to add a class change chip, if you want to play a different class, create a new character. The fact that you can't change class is normal for MMOs, there are many MMOs where you can't change classes.

There is a need to add class change tokens for the players who want to make their main a new class. Between all of the skill lines, quests, map locations, character-bound achievement dyes, and mount upgrades, it takes a long time to bring an alt up to par with your main.

The fact that you want to play all classes on one character does not argue for adding a token to change class. Most of the achievements, colors, etc apply to the whole account, and those achievements that are per character they are very easy to get.
This is part of the essence in MMOs, in the pumping of characters if it is not an MMO where there is one character without creating an additional one.

There are no arguments or reasons to add such a token. There are so many more important problems in the game that need to be solved. And the idea of adding such a token is clearly not a priority

FelisCatus · May 19

TDVM wrote: »

Malyore wrote: »

TDVM wrote: »

There is no need to add a class change chip, if you want to play a different class, create a new character. The fact that you can't change class is normal for MMOs, there are many MMOs where you can't change classes.

There is a need to add class change tokens for the players who want to make their main a new class. Between all of the skill lines, quests, map locations, character-bound achievement dyes, and mount upgrades, it takes a long time to bring an alt up to par with your main.

The fact that you want to play all classes on one character does not argue for adding a token to change class. Most of the achievements, colors, etc apply to the whole account, and those achievements that are per character they are very easy to get.
This is part of the essence in MMOs, in the pumping of characters if it is not an MMO where there is one character without creating an additional one.

There are no arguments or reasons to add such a token. There are so many more important problems in the game that need to be solved. And the idea of adding such a token is clearly not a priority

Utter nonsense. I have all my alts lvl 50 + every class. I never use them. I only enjoy playing as my main. I have a connection to my character not my alts. I have 5000+ hours in this game and I don't like alts. I like my one character, but I find dragonknight extremely boring. I would happily pay real money to change my class. They need to add it, it's only 3 skill lines. I have done nearly everything on my main. Changing your class makes more sense than changing your race or gender in Elder Scrolls. A class is 3 skill lines it would not be hard. You can lose and gain vampire/werewolf so I don't see why you can't lose and gain 3 other skill lines.

They said they'd never add alliance change tokens, and yet they did. People asked for years for companions and finally we got them. People for years asked for a necromancer class and for spell crafting, at times we were told there were no plans or it wouldn't happen. People asked for the subscription to be optional, people asked for one tamriel. People ask for specific new zones, classes or even nerfs/reworks. It may take time and pressure but eventually you do get somewhere even with compromise. I'm sure ZOS will implement it eventually especially considering a lot of people would pay real money for it. I know because I've read the threads and there are hundreds of posts on these threads and they appear quite often.

Sakiri · May 20

They're not likely to do it.

And there's a pretty good reason why. It's not financially in their best interests.

You can buy skill lines and skyshards for crowns. Why the heck would they let you swap class and keep what you have for anything less than total cost of all those shards and skill lines?

I play my main because I enjoy the class. I picked my main class before committing to all those things.

Elsonso · May 20

FelisCatus wrote: »

They said they'd never add alliance change tokens, and yet they did.

Alliance Change tokens. Back in 2015, they said Alliance Change, Appearance Change, Race Change, and Name Change tokens were being looked at. NO mention of class change. Today, we have all of the ones they said they were looking into.

(https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/147743/ask-us-anything-all-the-q-amp-as/p1)

xylena_lazarow · May 20

Sakiri wrote: »

It's not financially in their best interests... Why the heck would they let you swap class and keep what you have for anything less than total cost of all those shards and skill lines?

Same reason they introduced alliance change tokens. It's not spending 2500 Crowns on a token vs 100000 Crowns grinding up a new toon, it's spending 2500 Crowns vs losing interest and spending nothing.

Other_Name · May 20

CoolBlast3 wrote: »

Sarannah wrote: »

No class change token... just play the game! Enjoy the journey, instead of rushing to the end.

There are many reasons for why not, but these are already mentioned here. Add to that, I like to know that those who are on a class, spend the time to level it. Especially now with a new class coming out.

I've already spent my time! My main has been a cro since cro came out. I've done the entirety of ESO in chronological order. Have done every dungeon on vet, every trial on vet besides the High Isle one.
A class change token whenever a class is added, even if a single one, would be healthy for the game, allowing older (as in time played, not irl age) or casual players to feel not left out of new content if they don't want or have the time to grind a new char..
This is a hot topic, so I understand why a class change could be divisive. I'd just rather a flat YES or NO from ZOS.
And yes, I know Rich said he didn't want them, but they said the same about Alliance change tokens. So I'd like an update on that info really.

----

This is especially needed for Necromancers. I highly resent the goofball developer (forgot which it was) that said it should be a "cast it and forget it" class. That doesn't make sense at all when you look at necromancers in the lore and even enemy necromancers.

The other developers got steamrolled by this one buffoon who decided imposing his specific vision mattered more than the integrity of the game.

Sakiri · May 20

xylena_lazarow wrote: »

Sakiri wrote: »

It's not financially in their best interests... Why the heck would they let you swap class and keep what you have for anything less than total cost of all those shards and skill lines?

Same reason they introduced alliance change tokens. It's not spending 2500 Crowns on a token vs 100000 Crowns grinding up a new toon, it's spending 2500 Crowns vs losing interest and spending nothing.

If you think a class change token would be 2500 crowns you're insane.

And I still don't think they're going to add one. Ever.

We'll just agree to disagree on this one. I don't believe they're necessary, I don't believe anyone *need* them, even necromancers. All it'll lead to is people changing class constantly to follow FOTM. That's not good for the community. It's already bad enough that the only parse dps that gets taken to trials is arcanist in any content worth a darn. People would be pressured into changing.