The ghosts that I calledMashmalloMan wrote: »Tbh I read it and meant to reply, but it was the longest of the bunch so I didn't have the time.. at the time. Apologies.
If you reply, maybe just @ me lol. This is too much to quote.
MashmalloMan wrote: »
- Lightning Splash:
- Enemies that take damage from this ability and morphs now take up to 6% extra shock damage for 3 seconds based on your weapon/spell damage.
I am all for buffing magsorc especially for PvP. But I don't like the suggested push towards all-shock-damage.
The Dark Magic tree should should not be about shock damage and neither should the daedric summoning tree. They have darker themes.
Of course, only f it supports the idea of the class and what they should be good at. Shock and Physical do that. They're the Electric/Wind mage of ESO. What doesn't support that is Magic damage, as you said, Summoning can do any damage type, so why can't Curses or rather Dark Magic deal Shock/Physical damage?Nothing wrong with a Sorcerer having more than 1 damage source - i.e. shock.
What matters though is consistency. If DK flames dealt frost damage that would ruin immersion.
Magic damage doesn't benefit any of the skills mentioned in terms of description or animation anymore than it would Shock. Crystal Weapon and Crystal Frags are both purple crystals, yet deal different damage types. Volatile Familiar scratches enemies, but deals shock damage and pulses purple, yet deals shock damage. There is no benefit or logic to existing skills already, but you're using it as a reason to justify not changing the damage types.I rather have the abilities deal the type of damage that befits their description and animation. Sure Sorcs have a lightning damage passive, but you can just increase the tooltip damage of the non-shock abilities - or change the passive.
Same goes for dark magic skills dealing shock damage when there are explicit shock skills with appropriate animations in the game. You feel like sorc is about lightning b/c you have lightning based animations, not b/c the tooltip says shock damage. And Dark Magic skills and Daedric Summoning skills are not lightning based animations / skills. Therefore they shouldn't deal shock damage primarily - summoning a pet and having that deal shock damage is still fits the animation and theme, so that is fine. But the skills you apply directly, shouldn't.
Fix shields. When you shield, you’re not doing damage. Now you’re not doing damage OR protecting yourself. Scaling is based on max mag, and most people just break it in one GCD.
Fix Crystal frags. The proc rate is almost as bad as the cast time. The projectile speed is terrible. Why doesn’t Sorc get major breach on this or something?
Fix our heals. Single bar matriarch pet, and give it health in line with other non-Sorc class pets. Right now people just one-shot it. What’s the point?
Rune cage is useless. Do something with this.
Magicka specs are pointless. Give us a class respec token at least. That way we can play “Gilliam’s Terrible Nightblade Sim” game like everyone else.
thechiefisback wrote: »Why not having a mag dps morph of bound armaments too, like the grim focus with nightblades?
thechiefisback wrote: »Why not having a mag dps morph of bound armaments too, like the grim focus with nightblades?
honestly i'm not sure what the purpose of bound armaments is now.
it was changed to be a stamina version of frags.
but now stam can use frags anyway so BA is now more like frags if you want to use crystal weapon. except it's not strong enough to bother with and the passives aren't enough to justify it.
MashmalloMan wrote: »Welp thats all folks. 2... very minor changes.
WrathOfInnos wrote: »MashmalloMan wrote: »Welp thats all folks. 2... very minor changes.
Good changes, but not enough. The Crystal Weapon buff is nice, and lands it in a decent spot overall, but it also makes Bound Armaments look worse in comparison. The 4s semi-spammable should not be weaker than the 2s semi-spammable. This lands us back at the same scenario we see on live, where the best move is to ignore Armaments procs and continue alternating between Crystal Weapon and DoTs. The problem now is that Armaments does not even give a light attack buff while active, so slotting it at all becomes questionable.
This affects execute as well, since the current meta is to alternate CW and Endless Fury, while ignoring Bound Armaments. I would like to see a cast of Armaments outperform both Crystal Weapon and Endless Fury, so that execute does not become one-button spam (EF>EF>EF>BA is more interesting than EF>EF>EF>EF on PTS or CW>EF>CW>EF on live). I don't think Crystal Weapon needs to be better than Endless Fury (or only 1/4 spammables in execute would be fury and it would not be worth a bar slot CW>BA>CW>EF).
Daedric Prey needed the increase since pet damage was nerfed, otherwise Haunting would be best even on pet builds. It also helps the Storm Atro a little, but I'd like to see a small duration increase.
WrathOfInnos wrote: »Good changes, but not enough. The Crystal Weapon buff is nice, and lands it in a decent spot overall, but it also makes Bound Armaments look worse in comparison. The 4s semi-spammable should not be weaker than the 2s semi-spammable. This lands us back at the same scenario we see on live, where the best move is to ignore Armaments procs and continue alternating between Crystal Weapon and DoTs. The problem now is that Armaments does not even give a light attack buff while active, so slotting it at all becomes questionable.
WrathOfInnos wrote: »This affects execute as well, since the current meta is to alternate CW and Endless Fury, while ignoring Bound Armaments. I would like to see a cast of Armaments outperform both Crystal Weapon and Endless Fury, so that execute does not become one-button spam (EF>EF>EF>BA is more interesting than EF>EF>EF>EF on PTS or CW>EF>CW>EF on live). I don't think Crystal Weapon needs to be better than Endless Fury (or only 1/4 spammables in execute would be fury and it would not be worth a bar slot CW>BA>CW>EF).
WrathOfInnos wrote: »Daedric Prey needed the increase since pet damage was nerfed, otherwise Haunting would be best even on pet builds. It also helps the Storm Atro a little, but I'd like to see a small duration increase.
WrathOfInnos wrote: »MashmalloMan wrote: »Welp thats all folks. 2... very minor changes.
Good changes, but not enough. The Crystal Weapon buff is nice, and lands it in a decent spot overall, but it also makes Bound Armaments look worse in comparison. The 4s semi-spammable should not be weaker than the 2s semi-spammable. This lands us back at the same scenario we see on live, where the best move is to ignore Armaments procs and continue alternating between Crystal Weapon and DoTs. The problem now is that Armaments does not even give a light attack buff while active, so slotting it at all becomes questionable.
This affects execute as well, since the current meta is to alternate CW and Endless Fury, while ignoring Bound Armaments. I would like to see a cast of Armaments outperform both Crystal Weapon and Endless Fury, so that execute does not become one-button spam (EF>EF>EF>BA is more interesting than EF>EF>EF>EF on PTS or CW>EF>CW>EF on live). I don't think Crystal Weapon needs to be better than Endless Fury (or only 1/4 spammables in execute would be fury and it would not be worth a bar slot CW>BA>CW>EF).
Daedric Prey needed the increase since pet damage was nerfed, otherwise Haunting would be best even on pet builds. It also helps the Storm Atro a little, but I'd like to see a small duration increase.
Duration increase for Prey would be useful. As it is, having to recast it every 6 seconds is a bit much.
Conjured Ward:
This ability and morphs now scale based on weapon/spell damage and max stamina/magicka instead of just max magicka, but still capped by your max HP.
MashmalloMan wrote: »WrathOfInnos wrote: »Good changes, but not enough. The Crystal Weapon buff is nice, and lands it in a decent spot overall, but it also makes Bound Armaments look worse in comparison. The 4s semi-spammable should not be weaker than the 2s semi-spammable. This lands us back at the same scenario we see on live, where the best move is to ignore Armaments procs and continue alternating between Crystal Weapon and DoTs. The problem now is that Armaments does not even give a light attack buff while active, so slotting it at all becomes questionable.
I already replied to your math in a previous comment. BA's problem isn't that it does less damage, it's that it functionally sucks because it's easy to dodge. Doesn't matter how much damage you give it, frankly the damage is in a good place and worth casting for damage/sustain alone.
Plus, your math is off which disproves your the argument you made. 145% total damage of CW is equivilant to 165% from BA. BA still does more damage.
This is moreso from the perspective of PVP where dodging matters. As I suggested, the stamina given should be active instead of passive to make up for the losses and to improve the quality of life. Long term, the buff should be hybridized to help it fit better with mag sorcs in a dynamic scaling context we have.WrathOfInnos wrote: »This affects execute as well, since the current meta is to alternate CW and Endless Fury, while ignoring Bound Armaments. I would like to see a cast of Armaments outperform both Crystal Weapon and Endless Fury, so that execute does not become one-button spam (EF>EF>EF>BA is more interesting than EF>EF>EF>EF on PTS or CW>EF>CW>EF on live). I don't think Crystal Weapon needs to be better than Endless Fury (or only 1/4 spammables in execute would be fury and it would not be worth a bar slot CW>BA>CW>EF).
Expecting a skill to be worth it in execute is a fever dream. Most builds abandon every other skill type in execute, besides maybe your weapon static dot for backbar enchant or ults. The fact that you use CW and EF together just shows how weak EF is as an execute skill, not how weak BA is.
If BA gave any more it would start approaching NB's Grim Focus level and I don't think it should be allowed to do that. Sorc has Curse, Crystal Frag/Weapon, BA and somewhat Fury for delayed burst. NB only has Grim Focus.
BA is more used as a buff skill for sustained damage for a cheaper cost and less stacks, rather than something like Grim Focus for burst which would be like our Frag or CW + Curse combo.WrathOfInnos wrote: »Daedric Prey needed the increase since pet damage was nerfed, otherwise Haunting would be best even on pet builds. It also helps the Storm Atro a little, but I'd like to see a small duration increase.
Excellent idea. Double the debuff duration to 12s, keep the 6s burst.
Edit Edit: Updated the comment instead of making another one to address your other points.
MashmalloMan wrote: »WrathOfInnos wrote: »MashmalloMan wrote: »Welp thats all folks. 2... very minor changes.
Good changes, but not enough. The Crystal Weapon buff is nice, and lands it in a decent spot overall, but it also makes Bound Armaments look worse in comparison. The 4s semi-spammable should not be weaker than the 2s semi-spammable. This lands us back at the same scenario we see on live, where the best move is to ignore Armaments procs and continue alternating between Crystal Weapon and DoTs. The problem now is that Armaments does not even give a light attack buff while active, so slotting it at all becomes questionable.
This affects execute as well, since the current meta is to alternate CW and Endless Fury, while ignoring Bound Armaments. I would like to see a cast of Armaments outperform both Crystal Weapon and Endless Fury, so that execute does not become one-button spam (EF>EF>EF>BA is more interesting than EF>EF>EF>EF on PTS or CW>EF>CW>EF on live). I don't think Crystal Weapon needs to be better than Endless Fury (or only 1/4 spammables in execute would be fury and it would not be worth a bar slot CW>BA>CW>EF).
Daedric Prey needed the increase since pet damage was nerfed, otherwise Haunting would be best even on pet builds. It also helps the Storm Atro a little, but I'd like to see a small duration increase.
Duration increase for Prey would be useful. As it is, having to recast it every 6 seconds is a bit much.
That would be fantastic. Remembering that one if I ever make another thread for live, but honestly.. looks like I'm taking a break from ESO. This isn't worth the headache. We should be excited for patches, not dreading them. The fact that we feel the need to fight for our classes before a PTS ends is sad. A game is meant to be fun, they should improve and tweak, not nuke classes.
LukosCreyden wrote: »So, question from a genuinely oblivious person who was tempted to try sorc for solo pve and pvp:
Is magsorc worth playing if you hate daedra summons? I kinda wanted to play with lightning magic and the other, non summon stuff. It looked like fun. Kind of stuck between classes after retiring my necro.
So, should I look at sorc for the future? Or look elsewhere for my magey desires?
WrathOfInnos wrote: »PTS is back up and it seems I'm wrong. Armaments is in fact doing 1.65X Crystal Weapon's first hit, or best case 1.5 per cast. And Crystal Weapon's 2nd hit is not getting the advertised 45%, it seems to be 40% of the first hit for 1.40 per cast. This is balanced much better than I believed, not sure if I missed a patch note or if something was stealth buffed, but glad you pointed it out @MashmalloMan. I'd rather be happy than correct, and this results in much better skill priorities. It would still be nice if Armaments dealt more damage than Endless Fury, but that one is more subjective.MashmalloMan wrote: »WrathOfInnos wrote: »Good changes, but not enough. The Crystal Weapon buff is nice, and lands it in a decent spot overall, but it also makes Bound Armaments look worse in comparison. The 4s semi-spammable should not be weaker than the 2s semi-spammable. This lands us back at the same scenario we see on live, where the best move is to ignore Armaments procs and continue alternating between Crystal Weapon and DoTs. The problem now is that Armaments does not even give a light attack buff while active, so slotting it at all becomes questionable.
I already replied to your math in a previous comment. BA's problem isn't that it does less damage, it's that it functionally sucks because it's easy to dodge. Doesn't matter how much damage you give it, frankly the damage is in a good place and worth casting for damage/sustain alone.
Plus, your math is off which disproves your the argument you made. 145% total damage of CW is equivilant to 165% from BA. BA still does more damage.
This is moreso from the perspective of PVP where dodging matters. As I suggested, the stamina given should be active instead of passive to make up for the losses and to improve the quality of life. Long term, the buff should be hybridized to help it fit better with mag sorcs in a dynamic scaling context we have.WrathOfInnos wrote: »This affects execute as well, since the current meta is to alternate CW and Endless Fury, while ignoring Bound Armaments. I would like to see a cast of Armaments outperform both Crystal Weapon and Endless Fury, so that execute does not become one-button spam (EF>EF>EF>BA is more interesting than EF>EF>EF>EF on PTS or CW>EF>CW>EF on live). I don't think Crystal Weapon needs to be better than Endless Fury (or only 1/4 spammables in execute would be fury and it would not be worth a bar slot CW>BA>CW>EF).
Expecting a skill to be worth it in execute is a fever dream. Most builds abandon every other skill type in execute, besides maybe your weapon static dot for backbar enchant or ults. The fact that you use CW and EF together just shows how weak EF is as an execute skill, not how weak BA is.
If BA gave any more it would start approaching NB's Grim Focus level and I don't think it should be allowed to do that. Sorc has Curse, Crystal Frag/Weapon, BA and somewhat Fury for delayed burst. NB only has Grim Focus.
BA is more used as a buff skill for sustained damage for a cheaper cost and less stacks, rather than something like Grim Focus for burst which would be like our Frag or CW + Curse combo.WrathOfInnos wrote: »Daedric Prey needed the increase since pet damage was nerfed, otherwise Haunting would be best even on pet builds. It also helps the Storm Atro a little, but I'd like to see a small duration increase.
Excellent idea. Double the debuff duration to 12s, keep the 6s burst.
Edit Edit: Updated the comment instead of making another one to address your other points.