The changes made in the PTR won't suddenly make Vampires viable. We need a complete rework, firstly the feel of being a vampire should be enhanced, right now you just maintain a certain stage and feed once every some hours, preferably there should be a 'blood spending' system for combat (with combat feeding?) but I can't see that happening. The vampire spammable, while boring, should have been ranged at least. Some kind of slight penalty while out in the sun, just for the hell of it. Like, you can remove the HP regen penalty from stages and make it be while under sunlight, that would help vampire survivability slightly, sometimes. Also, mesmerize COULD be useful, but it's too damn hard to hit anything with it. Vampire Drain is a joke ability, unless you buff it massively or change it altogether.
Ultimate doesn't only look bad but it's extremely underwhelming, the only thing nowadays that people use (in PvP at least) is that damnable passive 'undeath'. Vampirism, as it stands, is a free weakness in almost every other scenario.
@ZOS_GinaBruno Pretty please
I'd argue that WW's do require a rework, but perhaps not from the ground up.huskandhunger wrote: »while we are at it can we rework Werewolf too? Thank you.
Indeed, IIRC the model is still the one used since launch. There should be some way to customize WW's look. As for the rework, part of it should be the ability to turn into one at any time and make feeding work like this: you need to consume a humanoid heart from a corpse every X amount of time, otherwise you get a debuff that gradually gets stronger, nothing too major, mostly for the flavor. Anyway, just an idea, I'm sure the more dedicated WW players have better ones.Maybe a model update for the WW, dude's ugly as hell
Indeed, IIRC the model is still the one used since launch. There should be some way to customize WW's look. As for the rework, part of it should be the ability to turn into one at any time and make feeding work like this: you need to consume a humanoid heart from a corpse every X amount of time, otherwise you get a debuff that gradually gets stronger, nothing too major, mostly for the flavor. Anyway, just an idea, I'm sure the more dedicated WW players have better ones.Maybe a model update for the WW, dude's ugly as hell
Vampire -- an idea for an alternative blood system for combat would be an ability with a CD similar to Blast Bones, where you instead extract a portion of blood, store it (up to a certain number) and use it to power/empower certain abilities. Feeding out of combat (or even IN with mesmerize -- to finish off foes) could help with storing up blood for the next encounter. Blood magic makes sense. This feels more like a mod though, I really don't think they'll bother with a rework, since vampires had their expansion and are not a selling point.
Vampire lord look would be amazing, but it doesn't make sense lore wise.
Based on much of the initial feedback we saw over last update, we've decided to help this ability ramp up a little quicker to make it feel more aggressive and ravenous for the user, while slightly easing back on the risk of using it since the reward isn't nearly as high as before.
I'm sure that small buff will make soloing multiple mudcrabs even easier & faster now. And yeah, maybe one day vampirism will actually be good again. It has never been good in PvE and there was a time vampirism was extremely OP in cyro, that's it.I think the devs just don't know what to do with the line and maybe they are even afraid to try. It's tough to balance, but we deserve something thrown our way, it's been too long.Captain_OP wrote: »Somehow someone seems to having a blast playing with that skill. At least they did listend to the feedback that the high risk high reward playstyle isnt for everybody and did change this skill to be less risky and easier manage. The scaling change with the drain buff was good. At the moment i dont feel like that they ever rework it again, maybe if new developers rewatch vampire. But it is good that we still keep on pushing this topic, maybe one fine day they do us a favour. *Hopium*
If they're going to make us stay longer in that scion form -- then they better change the way it looks.I like how werewolf works now and that you can sort of maintain the form. I havent played it as I'm a vampire but thats roughly my interpretation of it..
I'd like to see something like that too for vampire rather than just being vampire and playing normally. Id like to be able to transform and maintain it longer or forever with serious killing or something. THAT would make the ult interesting imo
If they're going to make us stay longer in that scion form -- then they better change the way it looks.I like how werewolf works now and that you can sort of maintain the form. I havent played it as I'm a vampire but thats roughly my interpretation of it..
I'd like to see something like that too for vampire rather than just being vampire and playing normally. Id like to be able to transform and maintain it longer or forever with serious killing or something. THAT would make the ult interesting imo
Given the behavior of the developers, it seems clear that Vampirism is for overland RP only. When an active vampiric skill has been good enough for use in meaningful content, it has been nerfed.
- Blood for blood - was useful as a sustainable DPS ability in group content - nerfed so that it can't generally be used in group content
- Blood mist - was useful for a magicka tank to survive significant damage bursts - nerfed out of pve entirely
- Simmering frenzy - was useful for lining up massive pvp bursts, or for specific parses in pve that had little incoming damage - nerfed so that it's not worth toggling in any content
And even with all of this, there are growing calls to nerf the vampiric passive undeath.
At this point, I would primarily like for them to fix the feeding lore to be in accord with the rest of Elder Scrolls. If vampirism is for RP, at least make it good RP. In Elder Scrolls, vampiric feeding keeps you from becoming a ravenous bloodfiend. A player's vampirism experience in ESO is completely backwards, where drinking blood makes them weaker (skills cost much more) and more rabid (claw swipes are promoted).
Furthermore, I would like to see vampiric drain actually have an effect on your vampiric stage timer, and give it the properties of an execute, where it does significant damage to enemies near death. Those kinds of things would help with the overland RP immersion, while still being useless for meaningful content.
Yes, it's inconsistent with the rest of the lore in all of the other games, and even the lore represented in the books inside of ESO. You are indeed unique. Very unique. Nonsensically unique. Unlike every other vampire... you are cursed to... not drink blood? Just chill, nothing bad happens. No thirst at all. No need to drink.TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Lamae Bal was the original Vampire, during the visions you see in the Vampirism quest she states the following:
Lamae Bal: "Arkay the Forsaker, we curse you! You left us to suffer in darkness."
Lamae Bal: "But we survived. And in darkness we grew."
Lamae Bal: "Now, we feed upon your followers. We will use their stolen strength to conquer and consume you."
It is clear she intended Vampires to feed to grow stronger from the very start and as the original Vampire should she not hold the right to decide what a true Vampire is? in that case the Blood Scions are the true Vampires, the rest by definition are not, they just contracted a disease and cannot even consume blood without it weakening them, they have Diet Vampirism.
Besides being a Blood Scion makes you unique.
It's basically a neutered Vampire Lord, it doesn't look fine, and the majority tend to agree, from polls and posts I've seen since its inception. To each their own, I guess.TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »The Blood Scion looks fine, it certainly looks more powerful then your meager mortal looking form.
TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Given the behavior of the developers, it seems clear that Vampirism is for overland RP only. When an active vampiric skill has been good enough for use in meaningful content, it has been nerfed.
- Blood for blood - was useful as a sustainable DPS ability in group content - nerfed so that it can't generally be used in group content
- Blood mist - was useful for a magicka tank to survive significant damage bursts - nerfed out of pve entirely
- Simmering frenzy - was useful for lining up massive pvp bursts, or for specific parses in pve that had little incoming damage - nerfed so that it's not worth toggling in any content
And even with all of this, there are growing calls to nerf the vampiric passive undeath.
At this point, I would primarily like for them to fix the feeding lore to be in accord with the rest of Elder Scrolls. If vampirism is for RP, at least make it good RP. In Elder Scrolls, vampiric feeding keeps you from becoming a ravenous bloodfiend. A player's vampirism experience in ESO is completely backwards, where drinking blood makes them weaker (skills cost much more) and more rabid (claw swipes are promoted).
Furthermore, I would like to see vampiric drain actually have an effect on your vampiric stage timer, and give it the properties of an execute, where it does significant damage to enemies near death. Those kinds of things would help with the overland RP immersion, while still being useless for meaningful content.
Lamae Bal was the original Vampire, during the visions you see in the Vampirism quest she states the following:
Lamae Bal: "Arkay the Forsaker, we curse you! You left us to suffer in darkness."
Lamae Bal: "But we survived. And in darkness we grew."
Lamae Bal: "Now, we feed upon your followers. We will use their stolen strength to conquer and consume you."
It is clear she intended Vampires to feed to grow stronger from the very start and as the original Vampire should she not hold the right to decide what a true Vampire is? in that case the Blood Scions are the true Vampires, the rest by definition are not, they just contracted a disease and cannot even consume blood without it weakening them, they have Diet Vampirism.
Besides being a Blood Scion makes you unique.
My sentiments exactly. Honestly, it's as if someone in the company has a beef with vampires.Yes, it's inconsistent with the rest of the lore in all of the other games, and even the lore represented in the books inside of ESO. You are indeed unique. Very unique. Nonsensically unique. Unlike every other vampire... you are cursed to... not drink blood? Just chill, nothing bad happens. No thirst at all. No need to drink.
But if you do drink blood, you get weaker... More feral. You know, like all of the other vampires do if they don't drink blood? It really makes for an awkward time at vampire parties. While all of your friends are feasting and drinking blood for strength and beauty, you get to abstain, as you don't want to devolve into a bloodfiend looking thing and ruin the event.
Vampires were nerfed out of pve, nerfed out of roleplay, and right now the only thing left is undeath for pvp. The OP was asking that the 'feel' of vampire be reworked again. Making it fit back into Elder Scrolls vampiric lore would be a good start.
TBH ive givin this SOME thought but maybe not as much as other have... I think theres too many class skills. Im wondering if maybe it would be better going more like companions with 3 per tree so to be easier to make each class special and not reskins of the same abilities.
Id like to see EACH class unique and desired for groups NO QUESTION like other games like everquest and wow etc, but also have the openess of playing how you want as well.
I want more variety, more morphs and skill lines, otherwise the game will get stale fast. Also, looks like they don't like the fact that necros were the only thing that brings major vulnerability. A set can now replace a necro, higher uptime too. I don't agree with that design philosophy and the existence of that set, but whatever. We don't have much say.I think the larger issue is unique buffs, Something that makes Necro really valuable is access to Major Vuln, which is still only found on Necro. I think every class should have access to a unique Major Buff, Like Warden getting Major Brittle (Nudge Nudge Zos). I'm sure there can be things that other classes can provide as well, but that's an Idea.
Also, this thread is pointless, I keep thinking about it, the amount of time it would take to rework the whole experience, meanwhile they have deadlines, it won't become a selling point again (doubt we'll see anything major with the vampire theme before ESO runs its course) then they also have to go and edit out the vampire 'tutorial' etc. it's just not worth it for them. And this is not just the cynic talking, it just doesn't make sense for them to go and do that.
That is the single best suggestion I've seen for Vampiric Drain. It SHOULD be as good as the templar's execute, why not? Ah yes, because people might actually find some use for the vampire abilities and god forbit -- slot them. But in their eyes they are probably 'forcing' it on some that want nothing to do with vampirism and only care for numbers. And that is one of the reasons why we can't have good things. Anyway, if it's only 400% AND it extends Scion, then I could live with that, would transform the scion into an execute ult. Though I'll never stop hoping for a rework to enhance the vampiric experience. I want to feed and I want to have reasons to feed. @ZOS_GinaBruno I hope you guys are reading, some nice feedback in here.Personally, I think a very easy change would be to make vampiric drain's damage scale like an execute. It's an absolutely useless skill as it is. The heal is terrible. The damage is pathetic. The fact that it's channeled makes it even worse. If the damage were increased by 400% against targets under 50% (like two-handed executioner), the damage is still going to be significantly worse than any other execute in the game on account of it being a channel. It still would be nowhere near the damage of a Templar's Radiant Oppression.
It's basically a neutered Vampire Lord, it doesn't look fine, and the majority tend to agree, from polls and posts I've seen since its inception. To each their own, I guess.TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »The Blood Scion looks fine, it certainly looks more powerful then your meager mortal looking form.
Really don't want to turn this into a VL Vs. Scion thread, but I really can't see what you are describing. In any case, I still find the lord to be more 'complete' as a look.TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Except the Blood Scion has larger horns, a second set of upper fangs, proper hands that do not have stumps and is not hunched over like a Vampire Lord, also better to have no wings then ones that look like
they belong on a chicken.
Really don't want to turn this into a VL Vs. Scion thread, but I really can't see what you are describing. In any case, I still find the lord to be more 'complete' as a look.TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »Except the Blood Scion has larger horns, a second set of upper fangs, proper hands that do not have stumps and is not hunched over like a Vampire Lord, also better to have no wings then ones that look like
they belong on a chicken.