Yep, Another Achievement Poll: Please READ CAREFULLY!

shadyjane62

Other: Please describe.

I don't care about titles anymore. If a level 4 is going to have Master Angler, it then becomes worthless to me. I have decided to use pvp titles only.

I want motifs to be shared. Period.

Sylvermynx

I Don't Care: I honestly wouldn't notice if any of the 8 options were implemented. Achievements and titles don't influence how I play or add to my enjoyment of ESO in any way.

silvereyes wrote: »

Use some of your daily login XP scrolls to grind to level 10, then go unlock the Assault skill line in Cyrodiil for the Continuous Attack passive. You can also stick 100 CP into the Gifted Rider star. Between those two mount speed buffs, you can be at +40% mount speed within an hour.

Nah. I already don't use mounts because it's just way too fast. Don't like it, prefer just running.

tinythinker

BOTH (NO TITLE SHARING): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. I think it is wrong for hard-earned titles to be shared across characters. Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

I don't care about the titles so much and just picked one of the two that worked for me, but I can sympathize with those who want to chase titles on alts and voted on that side.

Rahuu

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

I was thinking of voting Character Only (Title sharing) seeing as I have no personal need for an account-wide achievement view while happily using the cosmetic rewards across all characters. However I can see how having account based achievements can be of use and would make a huge part of the player base happier but only as long as it doesn’t remove the current individual character progress and history.

I might as well throw my coin into the well of things that can’t be changed:

It seems a lot of the issues we are seeing come from the design perspective of the achievements themselves. We have some that are clearly character specific progression covering story and exploration, we have tallies and counters which feel like they would be account wide in any other game and we also have prestige badges designed to reward individual player skill. Your personal perspective on achievements can shift quickly and completely depending on how you approach the game, character autonomy vs player experience as an example, because they are all applied together as a unified list grouped by sub categories. It then comes down to a soft view created by the player, not designed or hard coded into the game. The individual perspective on the utility of each achievement shifts because it’s not defined by the game but by the player.

What happens when ZOS changes the way those achievements are tracked? On a surface discussion probably not much, but in practicality it confronts that soft view each player has created for themselves out of the poorly defined list.

The way it is currently implemented on PTS satisfies the need for player prestige achievements to be once off and representative of the player while at the same time preventing the character based achievements to clearly define individual character progression. Because they are all in the same list. Interestingly it also shows the inconsistent way that quest progression is tracked, some by character, some are hard linked to achievements which seems to be the primary cause of most bugs reported.

The calls to have two list, one account and one character, appears to solve this but it will still have the problem that prestige achievements would exist in multiple places (account and on each character) so therefore can’t be unique to the player making it functionally useless for those who need it to represent their individual skill, because they are all still in the same list, it’s just 2 lists now.

Would separating the achievements out into different lists based on utility solve this problem? I don’t know, perhaps for the specific example of individual prestige vs character progress achievements, however I’d say probably not overall because it’s too late, players have had years to create and invest into their own soft view and I can see no way for ZOS to hard code in the required separation without invalidating the investment of one of the player groups. Perhaps another way to think about it is that ZOS has made a decision, even if it’s by accident, and the have decided that the separation is 100% on the other side of the player vs character divide.

Either way, the discussion is moot, bar a major game breaking problem, the system as it is on PTS will go live, and with it goes individual character tracking and years of character history (according to my soft view anyway).

silvereyes

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

silvereyes wrote: »

Use some of your daily login XP scrolls to grind to level 10, then go unlock the Assault skill line in Cyrodiil for the Continuous Attack passive. You can also stick 100 CP into the Gifted Rider star. Between those two mount speed buffs, you can be at +40% mount speed within an hour.

Nah. I already don't use mounts because it's just way too fast. Don't like it, prefer just running.

I was replying to @drsalvation, but I wanted to include your correction about the time to level horse training. Sorry for the confusion.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Account ONLY: I want any notion of character-specific data obliterated wherever possible. Even if I can hide a character-specific view and all achievement-related rewards become account-bound, it's not enough. I WANT my per-character data overwritten/erased/rolled up into one view ONLY.

I don't want my main mocked by achievements he would never earn himself being forever incomplete in his achievement collections like the Werewolf achievements because he is a pure Vampire and has been one constantly since 2015 , before this change ZOS made I had no intention of every going after any achievements on any of my characters, now I actually have motivation to do them.

Don't ruin this for people like me.

Sylvermynx

I Don't Care: I honestly wouldn't notice if any of the 8 options were implemented. Achievements and titles don't influence how I play or add to my enjoyment of ESO in any way.

silvereyes wrote: »

Sylvermynx wrote: »

silvereyes wrote: »

Use some of your daily login XP scrolls to grind to level 10, then go unlock the Assault skill line in Cyrodiil for the Continuous Attack passive. You can also stick 100 CP into the Gifted Rider star. Between those two mount speed buffs, you can be at +40% mount speed within an hour.

Nah. I already don't use mounts because it's just way too fast. Don't like it, prefer just running.

I was replying to @drsalvation, but I wanted to include your correction about the time to level horse training. Sorry for the confusion.

Ah - sorry!

SerafinaWaterstar

Character ONLY (TITLE SHARING): I want complete separation for my characters and I have no use for an account-wide view. However I think titles are cosmetic and should be like dyes and collectibles; account-wide if you unlock them once. Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I don't want my main mocked by achievements he would never earn himself being forever incomplete in his achievement collections like the Werewolf achievements because he is a pure Vampire and has been one constantly since 2015 , before this change ZOS made I had no intention of every going after any achievements on any of my characters, now I actually have motivation to do them.

Don't ruin this for people like me.

See, this makes me curious - if you have been a vampire since 2015, and you had no interest in him being a Werewolf, why does it matter now? Why are the achievements he would never earn ‘mocking’ him?

Gelmir

Character ONLY (NO TITLE SHARING): I want complete separation for my characters as much as possible and I have no use for an account-wide view. Heck, I was disappointed when gear became account-bound. I actively am against an account-wide view even if titles stay tied to characters and I can still view character specific data. Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

And how does one change their vote here?

Consider my vote as "BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward."

and only because of this sentence in it: "Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward."

Bethgael

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

Interesting that the highest vote (not even the highest combined) is the wow-style "everyone wins" version, despite the people on the feedback thread who seem to think that account-wide achievements only are wanted by the "majority" of players.

Hm.

silvereyes

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

Bethgael wrote: »

Interesting that the highest vote (not even the highest combined) is the wow-style "everyone wins" version, despite the people on the feedback thread who seem to think that account-wide achievements only are wanted by the "majority" of players.

Hm.

I wouldn't try to read anything into the percentages. The "everyone wins" option explicitly says to pick that option as a compromise, even if the player only cares about one side or the other. Those people could just as easily have gone into another column, if they were led that way with different wording.

Lucozade85

tl;dr

An icon next to the achievement to show that you have not completed that particular achievement or obtained that title with that particular character should work.

It will obvious is some cases, for example a level 6 Grand Overlord or Godslayer but as soon as they hit CP is can be difficult to tell.

Tandor

Sylvermynx wrote: »

It's not something I care about personally - I don't pay attention to achievements and I don't use titles. I would like to see ZOS do something to make everyone happy about this though.

Does it concern you that as the new system is currently on the PTS, once one character has completed an achievement such as completing a delve or catching a rare fish, your other characters will be unable to receive any acknowledgement for doing so, and that some achievement-based quests simply won't be able to be done by more than one character? Also, if one character has completed a zone both the map and zone guide will be largely completed when another character enters the zone for the first time. For me a lot of the fun of playing multiple characters is exploring, unlocking and completing content more than once. These things are seriously compromised on the PTS.

Eliran

BOTH (NO TITLE SHARING): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. I think it is wrong for hard-earned titles to be shared across characters. Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

I think this post is entirely pointless ... ZoS are very unlikely to change what they have already done ...

But yea you have my wish.

Sylvermynx

I Don't Care: I honestly wouldn't notice if any of the 8 options were implemented. Achievements and titles don't influence how I play or add to my enjoyment of ESO in any way.

Tandor wrote: »

Sylvermynx wrote: »

It's not something I care about personally - I don't pay attention to achievements and I don't use titles. I would like to see ZOS do something to make everyone happy about this though.

Does it concern you that as the new system is currently on the PTS, once one character has completed an achievement such as completing a delve or catching a rare fish, your other characters will be unable to receive any acknowledgement for doing so, and that some achievement-based quests simply won't be able to be done by more than one character? Also, if one character has completed a zone both the map and zone guide will be largely completed when another character enters the zone for the first time. For me a lot of the fun of playing multiple characters is exploring, unlocking and completing content more than once. These things are seriously compromised on the PTS.

Right now, I don't do achievement-based quests generally anyway, and no I just do not care that all characters will get no acknowledgement when repeating something. I haven't completed any zone on any character ever so I don't see that it will matter to me. I'm not a completionist at all.

None of that will have any effect on the way I play, sorry; that's just the way it is for me. I have a general "run" of quests I do on every character over time, that's not going to change and none of them are achievement based. This isn't going to prevent me running every character around to explore....

FrancisCrawford

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

There's a lot of character-specific tracking I want to keep. Destroying it would increase grind.

I like having grind be reduced.

Jack-0

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

I naively thought when this was announced that there’s no way zos would be stupid enough to actually lose the dates that individual characters accomplished achievements, I imagined we’d end up with both account-wide stuff but still preserving the existing individual character data and continuing to record it in future. That is what I’d like to see, for the same reason that others have given - it’s helpful to track progression on each character.

I remain astonished that zos thought the current pts offering was adequate.

Delgent

Account ONLY: I want any notion of character-specific data obliterated wherever possible. Even if I can hide a character-specific view and all achievement-related rewards become account-bound, it's not enough. I WANT my per-character data overwritten/erased/rolled up into one view ONLY.

I chose Account ONLY, but if you give me a class change token, I'd be perfectly happy with leaving it the way it is.

As soon as the server opened, I rolled up my Templar. Now, almost 8 years later, I'm so sick of the Templar, but I play it chasing achievements. Then I'll play an alt for a bit, find some Motifs, have to put them in the bank so my Templar can see if he knows them...think about the fact that I'm wasting time on my alt and should be playing the Templar since there's so much he hasn't done yet...get frustrated, log off and play something else.

I still love ESO, but I don't like Templar play anymore. I guess if I can't have a class change token, then just lump everything together under Account, and I can play my alts to my hearts content without feeling like I'm wasting my time at some level. That's my frustration, I know many don't have this hangup...I do.

Dalsinthus

silvereyes wrote: »

Bethgael wrote: »

Interesting that the highest vote (not even the highest combined) is the wow-style "everyone wins" version, despite the people on the feedback thread who seem to think that account-wide achievements only are wanted by the "majority" of players.

Hm.

I wouldn't try to read anything into the percentages. The "everyone wins" option explicitly says to pick that option as a compromise, even if the player only cares about one side or the other. Those people could just as easily have gone into another column, if they were led that way with different wording.

Yeah I agree. The options are way too convoluted and confusing, there is no question that the poll options address, and there’s loaded language in the options like having achievements “obliterated”. All of this makes it hard to infer much from this poll. It’s still interesting information but I sat this one out because the poll is not well constructed. Sorry op, I appreciate what you are trying to do here, I just disagree with the approach.

LadyLethalla

Share Titles and More ONLY: Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) I have zero opinion on achievement tracking if I can have this; I'll be happy with any version of it.

As someone who mostly plays her first character "because she has the most achievements, so she's the one that I will continue trying to earn all possible achievements on" this change opens up for me that I can then use any of my characters in any content. Yes please!

bmnoble

I Don't Care: I honestly wouldn't notice if any of the 8 options were implemented. Achievements and titles don't influence how I play or add to my enjoyment of ESO in any way.

So long as they don't screw everyone's accounts when implementing the changes I have no problem with it. Would like account wide motifs and recipes though.

Sylvermynx

I Don't Care: I honestly wouldn't notice if any of the 8 options were implemented. Achievements and titles don't influence how I play or add to my enjoyment of ESO in any way.

bmnoble wrote: »

So long as they don't screw everyone's accounts when implementing the changes I have no problem with it. Would like account wide motifs and recipes though.

This is the one thing I am concerned about, yes.

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Account ONLY: I want any notion of character-specific data obliterated wherever possible. Even if I can hide a character-specific view and all achievement-related rewards become account-bound, it's not enough. I WANT my per-character data overwritten/erased/rolled up into one view ONLY.

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

I don't want my main mocked by achievements he would never earn himself being forever incomplete in his achievement collections like the Werewolf achievements because he is a pure Vampire and has been one constantly since 2015 , before this change ZOS made I had no intention of every going after any achievements on any of my characters, now I actually have motivation to do them.

Don't ruin this for people like me.

See, this makes me curious - if you have been a vampire since 2015, and you had no interest in him being a Werewolf, why does it matter now? Why are the achievements he would never earn ‘mocking’ him?

It has been forever annoying me since the achievements were put there.

Cerilon

Account ONLY: I want any notion of character-specific data obliterated wherever possible. Even if I can hide a character-specific view and all achievement-related rewards become account-bound, it's not enough. I WANT my per-character data overwritten/erased/rolled up into one view ONLY.

It's me who did the achievements not my characters... And the achievements that really mean something to me I will ofc exactly remember with which character I did them on and when/how. If I don't remember on which character I did which achievement, it obviously did not mean anything to me and never felt like an achievement at all...

Bethgael

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

silvereyes wrote: »

Bethgael wrote: »

Interesting that the highest vote (not even the highest combined) is the wow-style "everyone wins" version, despite the people on the feedback thread who seem to think that account-wide achievements only are wanted by the "majority" of players.

Hm.

I wouldn't try to read anything into the percentages. The "everyone wins" option explicitly says to pick that option as a compromise, even if the player only cares about one side or the other. Those people could just as easily have gone into another column, if they were led that way with different wording.

I will read in. This is the fairest option that is the best for everyone concerned. It is also how it is done in other MMOs. Seems to me that even if others would prefer one or the other, the least selfish are also okay with everyone being happy.

silvereyes

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

Bethgael wrote: »

silvereyes wrote: »

Bethgael wrote: »

Interesting that the highest vote (not even the highest combined) is the wow-style "everyone wins" version, despite the people on the feedback thread who seem to think that account-wide achievements only are wanted by the "majority" of players.

Hm.

I wouldn't try to read anything into the percentages. The "everyone wins" option explicitly says to pick that option as a compromise, even if the player only cares about one side or the other. Those people could just as easily have gone into another column, if they were led that way with different wording.

I will read in. This is the fairest option that is the best for everyone concerned. It is also how it is done in other MMOs. Seems to me that even if others would prefer one or the other, the least selfish are also okay with everyone being happy.

First of all, it's not selflessness - or at least not primarily selflessness - that leads people to put themselves in the compromise camp. It's a lack of strong feelings about the other option, or perhaps a sense of fatalism that ZOS probably won't change course significantly, so a compromise is what they're left with.

Secondly, if by "fairest" you mean the way to please the most people, there is no possible way to know that from the data.

The folks who want to keep character-specific stuff but don't care about the account-wide stuff one way or another would need to be counted separately for us to know. Same thing with the folks who want to go account-wide but don't care if character-specific stuff is lost or kept.

The poll is biased in the sense that it pushes both of those sub-groups to form a coalition with a specific group, those who specifically want both options.

Those who want character-specific stuff any way they can get it would be just as happy to form a coalition with those who want ONLY character-specific tracking. Likewise, those who only care about getting account-wide features would be just as happy to form a coalition with those who actively oppose character-specific tracking and want ONLY account-wide tracking.

Without any data on how large these sub-groups are, we have no idea if they could form a larger coalition that way, making for a "fairer" option. I'm not saying they could, I'm just saying that we don't know.

Finally, calling the option of both account-wide and character-specific tracking "everyone wins" discounts the fact that the poll clearly demonstrates there are people that option would NOT be a win for.

Silverfaerie

BOTH (Share Titles and More): I want an account-wide view and per-character achievement tracking. Reduce grind by having everything tied to achievements be account-wide (titles, furnishing shopping, etc.) Please don't erase any per-character data and please allow it to still be tracked going forward.

I wanted account achievements. but the way its implemented in pts is absolutely bonkers. you should be able to do quests and individually complete achievements on characters even with overall accountwide tracking data. the fact that delves autocomplete on alts if you finished them on at least one character, the fact that you cannot pick up collection quests on alts, because QUEST AVAILABILITY???? is tied to an achievement? is absolutely insane.

given current implementation I'd rather they didn't implement it at all then add it in its current form.

karekiz

Other: Please describe.

ALL content needs to be character specific. WHY is my level 1 running around as a worm wizard when he can't even ENTER the dungeon in the first place?

This would fix rewards.

Kthx.

spartaxoxo

Other: Please describe.

Silverfaerie wrote: »

I wanted account achievements. but the way its implemented in pts is absolutely bonkers. you should be able to do quests and individually complete achievements on characters even with overall accountwide tracking data. the fact that delves autocomplete on alts if you finished them on at least one character, the fact that you cannot pick up collection quests on alts, because QUEST AVAILABILITY???? is tied to an achievement? is absolutely insane.

given current implementation I'd rather they didn't implement it at all then add it in its current form.

The fact that there are quests and events you would never get to see on alt is kinda bonkers to me. Like I can't think of any game where account acheivements meant that. It just usually means you don't have to do them if you don't want to if you want to hunt down all of the achievements, not you literally can't hunt that achievement on that character.

rbfrgsp

That's a lot of words to read carefully. Never read anyone's titles in this game; don't care. Was there an option to vote for that? If so, that's what I'd have put.