It's Time to Turn Cyrodiil Into a PVE Only Zone

SeaGtGruff

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Cyrodiil would work if it wasn't a running simulator. Map needs to be smaller. Too much empty space.

I actually enjoy that about Cyrodiil, as it makes it easier for a PvE player to ride around without as much risk of running into a lot of PvP players. I find it rather relaxing to wander around Cyrodiil at certain times of the day, such as nighttime up north, as the ambient sounds can be quite peaceful.

Sylvermynx

I'm good with Cyro the way it is. I'm sad that pvp doesn't work the way those of you who really enjoy it wish it did, but I don't think we need pve Cyro.

WAY too much work for not so much benefit to turn it into "pve playground". There's not enough there now for pve. And dev time to "make it so".... well, I just don't see the point.

Zauk_soda

madrab73 wrote: »

Surely you can do PVE in no proc campaign? Probably won't see another player.

Went to Cyrodiil (no proc) a couple weeks ago to finish off master angler and do the dolmens, got myself all geared up in what I thought was semi-decent sets in case I ran into other players. Turns out I needn't have bothered as I only saw one other player the whole time I was there, and was there for several hours. Felt like I had entire zone to myself, was kinda eerie, but nice from my perspective I suppose as was able to get what I needed done without having to worry about the pvp side of it. That being said I was mildly disappointed I didn't get attacked as was kind of looking forward to my first pvp encounter.

But yeah, would be nice if something could be done to improve pvp in Cyrodiil for those that enjoy that kind of thing. I would like to do pvp myself at some point and had images of great battles taking place between the different factions, it sounded kinda fun. But apparently its nothing like that anymore and most pvp seems to be in battlegrounds rather than Cyrodiil. So yeah be nice if they could work on it. Is the poor performance to do with the size of the zone? Or can servers just not handle large amounts of players in same area at same time? If its latter then guess they would need to improve servers before they can manage to improve pvp experience.

Sun7dance

Beardimus wrote: »

Unsure on the motives of the thread.

[...]

Really?
He thinks up a few points just to finally be able quest there without having to deal with pvp.

That' the one and only reason!

When he's finished with questing and achievements, he doesn't care about Cyrodiil either!

Fun-Fact:
If Cyrodiil were really empty, he could do a wonderful quest tour now.

jedtb16_ESO

AzuraFan wrote: »

Keep Cyrodiil as is (or not, if the PvP community wants it changed), but do one of the following:

1. Have a PvE Cyrodiil campaign where PvP is disabled, for those of us who want to do the PvE stuff (quests, skyshards, etc.) but don't want to PvP.

2. Remove the Cyrodiil items from PvE achievements. I'm thinking about achievements that you can only get by completing a list of other achievements.

I just want to be able to complete some of the PvE content and achievements without having to worry about players attacking me. PvP and PvE should not be mixed in achievements.

i've completed 15 of the 18 pve delves in cyrodiil and have never encountered another player, either friendly or hostile, in the journey to and from the delve or in the delve itself

Folkb

Cyrodiil and bland and boring. The towns are tiny. The map is barren, the map is also huge and the keeps are all copy pasted in.

Just the whole rvrvr system needs to be scrapped and something else needs to be thought up.

Zauk_soda

AzuraFan wrote: »

Keep Cyrodiil as is (or not, if the PvP community wants it changed), but do one of the following:

1. Have a PvE Cyrodiil campaign where PvP is disabled, for those of us who want to do the PvE stuff (quests, skyshards, etc.) but don't want to PvP.

2. Remove the Cyrodiil items from PvE achievements. I'm thinking about achievements that you can only get by completing a list of other achievements.

I just want to be able to complete some of the PvE content and achievements without having to worry about players attacking me. PvP and PvE should not be mixed in achievements.

If you're able to you could maybe try going early-ish in the morning when most folk are probably in bed, that's what I did and only saw one other person. Also went in no-proc campaign, think remember someone saying it was less busy than others.

Hurbster

Map is too big and for both pvp and pve. I was a big fan of the battlegrounds in WoW, maps those size would be ideal.

EmperorIl

You can tell who is a PvP player and who is not in this thread.

[snip] This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them. If you want to PvP you WILL find players in Cyrodiil. You can also easily avoid them IF you want to because yes, it is big. And players will be where the action or objectives are. You not seeing anyone while trying to avoid these areas is not some revelation. [snip]

[edited for baiting]

Zauk_soda

EmperorIl wrote: »

You can tell who is a PvP player and who is not in this thread.

[snip] This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them. If you want to PvP you WILL find players in Cyrodiil. You can also easily avoid them IF you want to because yes, it is big. And players will be where the action or objectives are. You not seeing anyone while trying to avoid these areas is not some revelation. [snip]

Um, there's pve-related achievements in cyrodiil, if you want them pve-ers have no choice but go there to finish them.

[edited to remove quote]

Alarde

I would like to see the lag fixed before a single rock is added to that map.

We are close to a decade. That's embarassing.

SimonThesis

They do need to fix the lag and performance issues bad but the fights are still happening. This hour long battle happened 4 days ago in cyrodiil: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1211478225?t=01h04m20s

You don't see us starting threads saying you need to turn trials into PVP zones.

Elsonso

EmperorIl wrote: »

This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them.

There are probably more people who PVP on a regular basis than do Trials on a regular basis. Even with that, I am not sure _why_ people PVP in this game, as the OP does have somewhat of a point. ZOS seems to spend a lot of time on Cyrodiil, and they have not a lot to show for it. Yeah, some performance problems are fixed, but the big ones still remain.

The question isn't whether ZOS should turn Cyrodiil into a PVE zone, as I doubt they will ever do that. The question is whether this priority work they are doing in the background to revive Cyrodiil will be too little, too late to save it.

AuraStorm43

Elsonso wrote: »

EmperorIl wrote: »

This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them.

There are probably more people who PVP on a regular basis than do Trials on a regular basis. Even with that, I am not sure _why_ people PVP in this game, as the OP does have somewhat of a point. ZOS seems to spend a lot of time on Cyrodiil, and they have not a lot to show for it. Yeah, some performance problems are fixed, but the big ones still remain.

The question isn't whether ZOS should turn Cyrodiil into a PVE zone, as I doubt they will ever do that. The question is whether this priority work they are doing in the background to revive Cyrodiil will be too little, too late to save it.

Its because they’re trying everything to avoid addressing the issue, which is they’ve downgraded their servers and it’d cost money to upgrade them

Just look at midyear mayhem and how much better performance is during that event, its a huge difference cuz they rent better servers

Drammanoth

Not gonna happen. Too much effort on ZOS's part. Would be great, but Cyro is the only place where PvP is enabled. It is where you can expect to kill other players - or be killed. The keyword - expect.

In WoW all zones were contested - you could be killed by some teenage nerd - but in ESO you can expect to be killed ONLY in Cyro.

Alinhbo_Tyaka

I'm a strictly PvE player and see no reason to change Cyrodiil from what it is now. I will go in during Midyear Mayhem to run the PvE content and to date the only thing I have not finished are the other faction skyshards behind the gates. Yes I get killed occasionally but for the most part as a PvE player running around solo I'm pretty much left alone to do my thing.

Frankly I don't find Cyrodiil's PvE content very compelling. Unlike the other PvE content in the game that is designed to tell a story the quests and delves in Cyrodiil seem to be there for no other reason than it seemed like a good idea at the time. They don't build on lore and other than the mission boards could go away tomorrow with little notice.

_adhyffbjjjf12

There's something like 36 zones + Cyrodill + imperial City. We really don't need to have Cyrodill turned into another PVE zone at the cost of our single open world PVP area.

Vaoh

Honestly everything you said is true no matter how much it sucks to admit. I’d rather they didn’t do this though.

Cyrodiil is essentially already a PvE zone because there‘s almost no one there anymore. If they removed PvP from Cyrodiil and tweaked it to be an “real” PvE zone (added new quests, put fake NPC lead sieges, etc) then it would legit see more use than it does rn.

Stamicka

Sun7dance wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Unsure on the motives of the thread.

[...]

Really?
He thinks up a few points just to finally be able quest there without having to deal with pvp.

That' the one and only reason!

When he's finished with questing and achievements, he doesn't care about Cyrodiil either!

Fun-Fact:
If Cyrodiil were really empty, he could do a wonderful quest tour now.

I have never done a single quest in Cyrodiil and I’ve been PvPing there since 2015. You have completely misunderstood my intentions. This is a pro-PvP post and Cyrodiil is really not suited for PvP. That’s the point, it’s so badly suited for PvP at this point that it needs to be turned into a PVE zone and replaced.

Why is it badly suited for PvP? It’s too big to find constant action with the low populations. Most players are interested in taking keeps rather than killing other players, and it lags. You fail to understand that I love to kill other players and find fights. Cyrodiil isn’t the place for that anymore.

jerj6925

Stamicka wrote: »

As the title says, I think it's time to shut down the PvP aspect of Cyrodiil. Below are 5 reasons that support this change.

1. The Population Is Constantly Reduced
Cyrodiil is a huge map that was originally made to hold over 1000 players. The current population cap is unknown, but even at 2-3 bars of population there is very little action on the map. The map is too large to support Cyrodiil's low capacity. At most you will see 2 or 3 fights doing on at once. It is not uncommon to go 10+ minutes without seeing another enemy player in areas where you would expect to them. This problem seems to be at it's worst in the current patch.

2. The Performance Is Bad No Matter What
Almost anyone would agree that the game works very poorly in Cyrodiil. We have seen tests for No-CP, AOE cooldowns, and No Procs. In all cases, Cyrodiil always lags. Even today, Gray Host lagged with red at 3 bars, Blue at 1 bar, and yellow at 2 bars. Even below maximum capacity, Cyrodiil has poor performance. Playing a fast paced game with skill delay ruins the most enjoyable aspect of the game.

3. The Player Base Has Changed
The ESO player base has shifted towards a casual crowd that has no interest in PvP. Out of the 3 Veteran Campaigns during prime time, typically only one will be filled, one will have a few bars, and one will be completely empty. This reflects a very small PvP community, especially considering that the population cap is likely the lowest it has ever been. On top of this, many people in Cyrodiil are only interested in transmute crystals. There's also a fairly large portion of Cyrodiil players that prefer to play the map rather than have any contact with enemy players. Only the smallest portion of an already tiny group of players actually goes to Cyrodiil to fight other players. Lastly, the under 50 campaign seems to remain empty which suggests that there's not an influx of newer players that want to get into PvP.

4. There Are Other PvP Options
The removal of Cyrodiil as a PvP zone may bring more players into BGs, or Imperial City. It also gives Zenimax a chance to make something completely new. The emptiness and poor performance of Cyrodiil may turn away potential PvPers. Maybe the PvP community could grow if people had a better first experience in PvP.

5. Cyrodiil is Old
Cyrodiil has been in the game since 2014 yet it has seen very few changes. PvPers could use something new and exciting.

I say all of this as someone who has great memories in Cyrodiil. Unfortunately time has not been kind to this zone and its time for something new.

I agree with all of this 100%, its time for ZOS to just cut their losses, I always wanted a PVE version of imperial city would still like one along with a PVP version that would feel more right with the limited number of players now, Cyrodiil is simply just too big for the small numbers now days and if people do come back it only takes a few sessions of Cyrodiil to remind them why they left and I think Cyrodiil in its current state does more to hurt the company than help.
I honestly think what’s killing the server performance are the cheating options (its more hardware now days) used by players, cheating is a multibillion-dollar industry worldwide and for people to deny it’s happening in ESO are just fooling themselves. ESO is old and they have limited resources to combat something on such a massive scale. The devices used for cheating are getting ever more complex and sophisticated to the point they are running AI to analyze game play and make moves or use abilities for you in milliseconds (this AI is very new or just I have recently learned about it over the last year). I don’t think ESO is fighting server performance issues but rather trying to fight off the cheating being used that does destroy server performance and I think the whole server desync is mostly smoke and mirrors because how does ZOS say its not our program or our servers its these devices… it would just bring more attention to something they can’t currently combat and if you read reviews on these devices left by people who bought them they believe they are enhancing there game play and its completely acceptable. Kind of depressing the mind set of newer gaming generations.

No don’t ask me to point you in the direction of these devices they are easy enough to find and learn about and I don’t want to get band.

AuraStorm43

This idea that “performance can’t be fixed

jerj6925 wrote: »

Stamicka wrote: »

As the title says, I think it's time to shut down the PvP aspect of Cyrodiil. Below are 5 reasons that support this change.

1. The Population Is Constantly Reduced
Cyrodiil is a huge map that was originally made to hold over 1000 players. The current population cap is unknown, but even at 2-3 bars of population there is very little action on the map. The map is too large to support Cyrodiil's low capacity. At most you will see 2 or 3 fights doing on at once. It is not uncommon to go 10+ minutes without seeing another enemy player in areas where you would expect to them. This problem seems to be at it's worst in the current patch.

2. The Performance Is Bad No Matter What
Almost anyone would agree that the game works very poorly in Cyrodiil. We have seen tests for No-CP, AOE cooldowns, and No Procs. In all cases, Cyrodiil always lags. Even today, Gray Host lagged with red at 3 bars, Blue at 1 bar, and yellow at 2 bars. Even below maximum capacity, Cyrodiil has poor performance. Playing a fast paced game with skill delay ruins the most enjoyable aspect of the game.

3. The Player Base Has Changed
The ESO player base has shifted towards a casual crowd that has no interest in PvP. Out of the 3 Veteran Campaigns during prime time, typically only one will be filled, one will have a few bars, and one will be completely empty. This reflects a very small PvP community, especially considering that the population cap is likely the lowest it has ever been. On top of this, many people in Cyrodiil are only interested in transmute crystals. There's also a fairly large portion of Cyrodiil players that prefer to play the map rather than have any contact with enemy players. Only the smallest portion of an already tiny group of players actually goes to Cyrodiil to fight other players. Lastly, the under 50 campaign seems to remain empty which suggests that there's not an influx of newer players that want to get into PvP.

4. There Are Other PvP Options
The removal of Cyrodiil as a PvP zone may bring more players into BGs, or Imperial City. It also gives Zenimax a chance to make something completely new. The emptiness and poor performance of Cyrodiil may turn away potential PvPers. Maybe the PvP community could grow if people had a better first experience in PvP.

5. Cyrodiil is Old
Cyrodiil has been in the game since 2014 yet it has seen very few changes. PvPers could use something new and exciting.

I say all of this as someone who has great memories in Cyrodiil. Unfortunately time has not been kind to this zone and its time for something new.

I agree with all of this 100%, its time for ZOS to just cut their losses, I always wanted a PVE version of imperial city would still like one along with a PVP version that would feel more right with the limited number of players now, Cyrodiil is simply just too big for the small numbers now days and if people do come back it only takes a few sessions of Cyrodiil to remind them why they left and I think Cyrodiil in its current state does more to hurt the company than help.
I honestly think what’s killing the server performance are the cheating options (its more hardware now days) used by players, cheating is a multibillion-dollar industry worldwide and for people to deny it’s happening in ESO are just fooling themselves. ESO is old and they have limited resources to combat something on such a massive scale. The devices used for cheating are getting ever more complex and sophisticated to the point they are running AI to analyze game play and make moves or use abilities for you in milliseconds (this AI is very new or just I have recently learned about it over the last year). I don’t think ESO is fighting server performance issues but rather trying to fight off the cheating being used that does destroy server performance and I think the whole server desync is mostly smoke and mirrors because how does ZOS say its not our program or our servers its these devices… it would just bring more attention to something they can’t currently combat and if you read reviews on these devices left by people who bought them they believe they are enhancing there game play and its completely acceptable. Kind of depressing the mind set of newer gaming generations.

No don’t ask me to point you in the direction of these devices they are easy enough to find and learn about and I don’t want to get band.

The idea “it can’t be fixed so why bother” is pretty stupid

kargen27

LizzyBee wrote: »

EmperorIl wrote: »

You can tell who is a PvP player and who is not in this thread.

Stick to your PVE, Cyrodiil is of no concern to you. This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them. If you want to PvP you WILL find players in Cyrodiil. You can also easily avoid them IF you want to because yes, it is big. And players will be where the action or objectives are. You not seeing anyone while trying to avoid these areas is not some revelation. Go back to PvE.

Um, there's pve-related achievements in cyrodiil, if you want them pve-ers have no choice but go there to finish them.

No those are either PvP achievements or hybrid achievements. The achievements take place in a PvP setting. Avoiding other players to reach your objective is sometimes a part of PvP.

kargen27

Stamicka wrote: »

Sun7dance wrote: »

Beardimus wrote: »

Unsure on the motives of the thread.

[...]

Really?
He thinks up a few points just to finally be able quest there without having to deal with pvp.

That' the one and only reason!

When he's finished with questing and achievements, he doesn't care about Cyrodiil either!

Fun-Fact:
If Cyrodiil were really empty, he could do a wonderful quest tour now.

I have never done a single quest in Cyrodiil and I’ve been PvPing there since 2015. You have completely misunderstood my intentions. This is a pro-PvP post and Cyrodiil is really not suited for PvP. That’s the point, it’s so badly suited for PvP at this point that it needs to be turned into a PVE zone and replaced.

Why is it badly suited for PvP? It’s too big to find constant action with the low populations. Most players are interested in taking keeps rather than killing other players, and it lags. You fail to understand that I love to kill other players and find fights. Cyrodiil isn’t the place for that anymore.

See this is the problem. You want something changed because you do not like doing it. You have dueling and battleground for killing other players. Also have Imperial City and Sewers if they find a way to get population back in those areas. People have suggested ideas for getting Imperial City populated again.
You don't like the controlling the map aspect of PvP and that is the very nature of Cyrodiil. Keeps and chokepoints between the keeps is where the fights take place. The open areas are used to try and flank the enemy and cut them off. It isn't the kind of PvP you enjoy but many people do. They like the big battles that contribute to a cause.
We could argue get rid of battlegrounds so Cyrodiil would be more popular. It is the same argument you are making simply in reverse.

StevieKingslayer

If the devs removed open world PVP in Cyro, It would be the final nail in the coffin for me and I would leave. Its a laggy, buggy mess, but it's the only place I can go to enjoy some player vs player conflict that isnt ALL nightblades stealthing in the dark (said as a nightblade pvp main) or you can actually run away from the perma blocking tanks holding a ball that does 10000000 dmg so you cant complete an objective anyway.

Cyro needs more content added, not taken away, and the pvp department is seperate from the pve department for a reason. That department needs to however, in my mind, put in as much effort as the pve department.

Fact is; I hate BG's, boring game design made for people that want a quick fix of pvp with a quick reward.

Where are all of you at oceanic prime when Greyhost is being stomped down by enemy factions? I know what Im doing, taking advantage of "the empty map" to go stealth siege something and take it right from under the enemies nose. Taking content out is not a solution. Adding more in, and fixing what they have, is the solution. End of story.

Nemeliom

Stamicka wrote: »

[snip]

Or... hear me out, just hear me out... or we could make open world pvp.
Yeap.

[edited to remove quote]

Nemeliom

EmperorIl wrote: »

You can tell who is a PvP player and who is not in this thread.

[snip] This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them. If you want to PvP you WILL find players in Cyrodiil. You can also easily avoid them IF you want to because yes, it is big. And players will be where the action or objectives are. You not seeing anyone while trying to avoid these areas is not some revelation. [snip]

This

[edited to remove quote]

martinhpb16_ESO

Ok fine make Cyrodil pve.......but only if the rest of the game switches over to pvp.

Don't like that?

EmperorIl

LizzyBee wrote: »

EmperorIl wrote: »

You can tell who is a PvP player and who is not in this thread.

Stick to your PVE, Cyrodiil is of no concern to you. This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them. If you want to PvP you WILL find players in Cyrodiil. You can also easily avoid them IF you want to because yes, it is big. And players will be where the action or objectives are. You not seeing anyone while trying to avoid these areas is not some revelation. Go back to PvE.

Um, there's pve-related achievements in cyrodiil, if you want them pve-ers have no choice but go there to finish them.

And if I want a good set I have to PvE to get it......but you don't see me crying to remove PvE from the game.

StevieKingslayer

LizzyBee wrote: »

EmperorIl wrote: »

You can tell who is a PvP player and who is not in this thread.

Stick to your PVE, Cyrodiil is of no concern to you. This is like me saying we need to get rid of raids because I don't do them. If you want to PvP you WILL find players in Cyrodiil. You can also easily avoid them IF you want to because yes, it is big. And players will be where the action or objectives are. You not seeing anyone while trying to avoid these areas is not some revelation. Go back to PvE.

Um, there's pve-related achievements in cyrodiil, if you want them pve-ers have no choice but go there to finish them.

PVP'ers are only in those quest area's if there is an event on or their zerg is rolling through there to go siege a keep. The chances of you running into a pvp'er in those areas (unless your meaning a capture town like bruma/vlast/crops) is basically zero as they are too far out from PVP objectives for us to bother going near them unless we ourselves are doing those quests - in which case, 90% of the time people wont bother you. If you're wanting to do quests in a capture town, go to a cyro zone that your faction has majority control of. Problem solved.

Other issue here is, PVE'rs like to do this thing where they see an enemy player, panic and spam their heavy attacks, light attacks on the PVPer passing through. That is a fast way to make me turn around to gank you. I dont appreciate it, I left you alone, therefore leave me alone. Its seen as a sign of aggression and I take it that you wish to fight. Stop doing that pve'rs and you wont get a stampede to the face.

SimonThesis

Yea we need Open World Pvp like New world!!!