Neverending story - fancy houses are missing furniture slots

deleted220614-000183

I'm talking primarily about notable houses with 350/700 ESO+ slots.

1. Guidhouses
You need 65 attunable sets (number increases with every new DLC zone), 13 mundus, merchant and banker assistants, outfit, transmute and new armory stations, couple of dummies and couple of other functioning furnitures like Basin of Loss and Aetherial Well
If I count properly, it is about 290 slots alone.
Now you need platforms and stairways (20-30) basic lighting (30-50) which means you already spent 350 slots on necessary items without starting decorating guildhall yet !
It is unsustainable situation, especially concidering the fact that guildhalls are attended by thousands of players and cant look like some garbage/scraps yard, degrading the impression from the game
2. New multiple area houses like Patherfang
Short thing short. You have a chappel a fort a crypt and outside area and upper part like towers and battle positions.
750 /5 = 150.
I'd like to see any ZOS DEV able to decorate a chappel, fort, outside area ,crypt and towers with 150 slots each.
It is impossible and it is a scam on house owners.
3. Custom project zones like Coldharbor, Grand Topal, Doomchar Plateau etc
We got a lot of good components/structure objects with Leyawiin theme.
It would be cool for example to build your own medieaval castle on Grand Topal BUT how you can do that with 700 ESO+ slots, not mentioning 350 basic ones ?
Impossible.

Proposed solution:

I suppose the problem is more or less technical.
Each custom object in a house has it's own record with the object ID and coordinates.
It is only few bytes of data but these few bytes of data must be available for any visitor of the house when teleporting in fraction of seconds which makes load on backend.
If a guidhouse is visited 1000 times per day, those couple bytes of data starts to be a significant performance problem.

1. We need optimalization of similar objects - attunable stations, lights and platforms typically
Example: In guild house is 65 attunable sets which are adressed like 260 unique furnitures. It is absolute waste of slots as these could be easily adressed like one array of 4 different furnitures in multiple (260) positions.
I don't see any reason why not to give us possibility to "lock" similar objects and "glue" them together to make one "component" which is taking some reasonable (50) amount of slots.
For example max number of different items = 5, max number of positions = 300, slots taken = 50.
I think if one object like attuned station, light, platform, wall, whatever is repeating 65 times in a house, it neednt to be loaded 65 times again and again and again, but it can be loaded one time with list of 65 positions, isn't it better ?

2. We need overall increase of performance for housing as people are paying a lot of crowns (Patherfang is a good example) and then getting frustrated because they are unable to decorate it at leas modest way.

TelvanniWizard

100% agree! I love the housing system, with all the liberty it gives for creativity, but the slots are too few. I would have bought many homes, but after seeing that Tel Galen was almost slot-depleted without it being complete,I decided not to buy any other home.

Maya_Nur

Saw a rumors yesterday, looks like a limit will be increased up to 500/1000 slots. No proofs, but mate said he have noticed it on the PTS server in one of the new houses.

Stanx

This is why I tend to block off who sections of my notable homes. The only way I can actually decorate and feel like I've used all my slots well is if I only use 50% or less of the house. And I'm ESO+ so god only knows what I'd have to do with half the slots.

Mayrael

I totally agree. This is one of the reasons why housing has stopped entertaining me. We definitely need new solutions. A separate cap on services, overall a bigger cap for everyone.

If ZOS is worried about resources, they could apply a limit per player and let players move it from house to house (within reasonable limits of course) but that way having more houses, we could use the slots from our unused residences. This way the total number of resources needed doesn't change, only where they are allocated.

Hallothiel

Could a possible way around this be to make the inside & outside of houses separate instances?

Sylvermynx

Hallothiel wrote: »

Could a possible way around this be to make the inside & outside of houses separate instances?

That's been suggested many times, with as far as I'm aware no reply from ZOS.

jedtb16_ESO

strange. i have access to a few dwellings that have all attuned crafting stations and mundus stones. the budget does not appear to be a problem in any of them.

are we talking about the same game?

SilverBride

I still don't understand how ESO+ use all their slots. I've decorated several houses from the smallest apartments to notable homes and the apartments are the only ones I've used all the slots in. I have 100+ slots unused in most of my homes and they look pretty filled in.

deleted220614-000183

SilverBride wrote: »

I still don't understand how ESO+ use all their slots. I've decorated several houses from the smallest apartments to notable homes and the apartments are the only ones I've used all the slots in. I have 100+ slots unused in most of my homes and they look pretty filled in.

Well, we live probably in a different game environment.
For example @Blobsky guildhouse in Coldharbor is full and I suppose he will need to remove some furniture because of the new DLC and new crafting stations.
It will affect not just this one nice and fancy guildhouse but many of them and possibly thousands of players who will not see their favorite statue, fountain or houseguest anymore because of lack of slots.

As I stated before, Patherfang notable house with 5 different and big areas has 140 slots for each part.
If you put 10 big statues 8 stained windows 4 big lights 3 carpets 20 candles and 50 smaller pieces of furniture in patherfang chappel, it will feel pretty empty and abandoned but maybe OK. you will save 45 slots from 140 you got from ZOS.

But what about fortress ? I could easily allocate 300 pieces just there and it will feel still empty because it is 2 floors layout with many corners and separate rooms and each room and corner needs it's own light and furniture and paintings and all of that.

Now the outside area is huge and it would be fancy to place there for example 10 ships and construct a small harbor as we have furniture for it. This project is another 200 pieces alone. So we are roughly on 600 pieces now.

In crypts you probably want a prison with 20 skeletons, is it ? Torches, some undercroft decortations, spider webs etc. Another 100 slots and you reached limit now.

And it still counts and counts and doesnt end. You probably want some reinforcements and guards on the roof, maybe signal fires ? And if you make it your primary, you must have basic crafting stations, dummies and assistants.
What about kitchen , food, throne room, treasure, fountains, trees, garden, cemetry, collection of trophies, collection of antiquities, you want to show your achievements to your visitors, is it. With 700 slots.

It is a joke.

Not mentioning we have custom components like walls and towers, maybe somebody wants his own customized layout with new walls and entrances and stairways or decided to create big platform area outside and put all the basic 290 items needed for guildhouse there ?

I'm afraid this build can cost you 2000 slots easily and it will still not be enough.

Thecompton73

SilverBride wrote: »

I still don't understand how ESO+ use all their slots. I've decorated several houses from the smallest apartments to notable homes and the apartments are the only ones I've used all the slots in. I have 100+ slots unused in most of my homes and they look pretty filled in.

If looking "filled in" is your goal and in your opinion you achieved it, congratulations.

That however is a pretty subjective judgement. I think what satisfies you would probably seem bare bones and boring to most housing enthusiasts if you're leaving 100+ slots unused in the bigger homes.

I have a Hunding's I'm very happy with and while I was able to decorate nearly every area of the property in varying degrees I'd need at least another 400 slots beyond the 600 to fully realize what I can envision for it.

SilverBride

Thecompton73 wrote: »

If looking "filled in" is your goal and in your opinion you achieved it, congratulations.

That however is a pretty subjective judgement. I think what satisfies you would probably seem bare bones and boring to most housing enthusiasts if you're leaving 100+ slots unused in the bigger homes.

I have a Hunding's I'm very happy with and while I was able to decorate nearly every area of the property in varying degrees I'd need at least another 400 slots beyond the 600 to fully realize what I can envision for it.

What I mean by "filled in" is that all rooms and outdoor spaces are decorated, and there are no empty areas. It would look cluttered if I were to add more items to some of these spaces.

But I never made a decision to leave slots unused. I just don't need to add anything else to complete my designs.

That being said, I'm always making small changes, or sometimes changing entire rooms or floors of my homes as I find new items I think would compliment the space.

I'm not against the idea of adding more housing slots, but I just don't understand it. I would love to see some of the maxed out homes and hear what the player would like to add that they can't so I could better understand. And I would be happy to show some of my homes that aren't maxed for comparison.

VDoom1

I remember when we got the Grand Psijic Villa with Summerset. At first it was awesome! A free super big very beautiful grand house!

But then, wait a second....how the heck are we supposed to furnish the place completely when the cap is 700?

That property is enormous, you can do so much! But even after decorating it as much as possible some areas will still feel quite empty. Kinda sad really.

I've said it many times, as have others. We need more space for furniture, just an increase to 800 could help a lot.

Raideen

SilverBride wrote: »

Thecompton73 wrote: »

If looking "filled in" is your goal and in your opinion you achieved it, congratulations.

That however is a pretty subjective judgement. I think what satisfies you would probably seem bare bones and boring to most housing enthusiasts if you're leaving 100+ slots unused in the bigger homes.

I have a Hunding's I'm very happy with and while I was able to decorate nearly every area of the property in varying degrees I'd need at least another 400 slots beyond the 600 to fully realize what I can envision for it.

What I mean by "filled in" is that all rooms and outdoor spaces are decorated, and there are no empty areas. It would look cluttered if I were to add more items to some of these spaces.

But I never made a decision to leave slots unused. I just don't need to add anything else to complete my designs.

That being said, I'm always making small changes, or sometimes changing entire rooms or floors of my homes as I find new items I think would compliment the space.

I'm not against the idea of adding more housing slots, but I just don't understand it. I would love to see some of the maxed out homes and hear what the player would like to add that they can't so I could better understand. And I would be happy to show some of my homes that aren't maxed for comparison.

If you are on PC NA I can invite you to my moonsugar meadow and stillwaters retreat to see how fast 700 slots goes.

SilverIce58

Thecompton73 wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

I still don't understand how ESO+ use all their slots. I've decorated several houses from the smallest apartments to notable homes and the apartments are the only ones I've used all the slots in. I have 100+ slots unused in most of my homes and they look pretty filled in.

If looking "filled in" is your goal and in your opinion you achieved it, congratulations.

That however is a pretty subjective judgement. I think what satisfies you would probably seem bare bones and boring to most housing enthusiasts if you're leaving 100+ slots unused in the bigger homes.

I have a Hunding's I'm very happy with and while I was able to decorate nearly every area of the property in varying degrees I'd need at least another 400 slots beyond the 600 to fully realize what I can envision for it.

I'm inclined to agree with this. My Lakemire Xanmeer is complete for now, but that's only because I ran out of slots, and the whole right side the the xanmeer is basically empty.

Adremal

SilverBride wrote: »

I still don't understand how ESO+ use all their slots. I've decorated several houses from the smallest apartments to notable homes and the apartments are the only ones I've used all the slots in. I have 100+ slots unused in most of my homes and they look pretty filled in.

I invite you to a friendly wager. 42.000 crowns if you manage to make one of the biggest houses "pretty filled in" - by community standards, housing discords/guilds and EHT hub should provide plenty of examples - if I were to name a famous creator who manages to make houses "filled in" - albeit by closing off portions of them or using smaller houses, that'd be Lovathy - and that is the catch: you'd have to do so without blocking off significant portions of them. Pull it off on a 700 house and win 42.000 crowns, live-streamed if need be, with the whole forum as a witness to my wager.

SilverBride

Raideen wrote: »

If you are on PC NA I can invite you to my moonsugar meadow and stillwaters retreat to see how fast 700 slots goes.

I am and that explains a lot. Those are basically empty plots, so any buildings would have to be constructed piece by piece. I can see how that would use up the slots rather quickly.

I only have properties that already have the houses present so I have never run into that situation.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

People always say we need to balance PVE and PVP separately. Perhaps it is time we start balancing Console and PC separately...

SilverBride

Adremal wrote: »

I invite you to a friendly wager. 42.000 crowns if you manage to make one of the biggest houses "pretty filled in" - by community standards, housing discords/guilds and EHT hub should provide plenty of examples - if I were to name a famous creator who manages to make houses "filled in" - albeit by closing off portions of them or using smaller houses, that'd be Lovathy - and that is the catch: you'd have to do so without blocking off significant portions of them. Pull it off on a 700 house and win 42.000 crowns, live-streamed if need be, with the whole forum as a witness to my wager.

That is very compelling but first of all, I don't belong to any housing discords and I don't use EHT. I used to belong to a housing guild but left due to non housing related issues.

Also, I have never closed off any part of any house I own.

Then, more importantly, which houses qualify as one of the biggest houses? Just saw the 700 slot requirement. I have already decorated some large homes, such as Serenity Falls Estate (my very first house, decorated as a country estate and one character's private home, with a guest house), Antiquarian's Alpine Gallery (decorated as a mountain guest lodge) and Hall of the Lunar Champion (decorated as a museum with a Curator's office and a garden with a tea room). I have also decorated Alinor Crest Townhouse and Proudspire Manor which are decent sized (decorated as my character's private homes). And I consider all of these "filled in", yet no house is ever 100% complete as long as new items are added to the game that I may want to add to my decor.

If any of these qualify and you would like a tour then I'll accept the challenge.

Raideen

SilverBride wrote: »

Raideen wrote: »

If you are on PC NA I can invite you to my moonsugar meadow and stillwaters retreat to see how fast 700 slots goes.

I am and that explains a lot. Those are basically empty plots, so any buildings would have to be constructed piece by piece. I can see how that would use up the slots rather quickly.

I only have properties that already have the houses present so I have never run into that situation.

True, but in still waters I made most of the home on the inside part, and had to start stripping the inside to make the cave in the back yard.

Adremal

SilverBride wrote: »

Adremal wrote: »

I invite you to a friendly wager. 42.000 crowns if you manage to make one of the biggest houses "pretty filled in" - by community standards, housing discords/guilds and EHT hub should provide plenty of examples - if I were to name a famous creator who manages to make houses "filled in" - albeit by closing off portions of them or using smaller houses, that'd be Lovathy - and that is the catch: you'd have to do so without blocking off significant portions of them. Pull it off on a 700 house and win 42.000 crowns, live-streamed if need be, with the whole forum as a witness to my wager.

That is very compelling but first of all, I don't belong to any housing discords and I don't use EHT. I used to belong to a housing guild but left due to non housing related issues.

Also, I have never closed off any part of any house I own.

Then, more importantly, which houses qualify as one of the biggest houses? Just saw the 700 slot requirement. I have already decorated some large homes, such as Serenity Falls Estate (my very first house, decorated as a country estate and one character's private home, with a guest house), Antiquarian's Alpine Gallery (decorated as a mountain guest lodge) and Hall of the Lunar Champion (decorated as a museum with a Curator's office and a garden with a tea room). I have also decorated Alinor Crest Townhouse and Proudspire Manor which are decent sized (decorated as my character's private homes). And I consider all of these "filled in", yet no house is ever 100% complete as long as new items are added to the game that I may want to add to my decor.

If any of these qualify and you would like a tour then I'll accept the challenge.

Any 700 slots (manor) house will do, and I'd be willing to wait weeks, however since you'd also have to invest several weeks (in an endeavour which I believe to be mathematically impossible), I'll provide some very clear guidelines:
1) The house must have a furnishing limit of 700;
2) The house must be equally furnished and detailed in all of the main sections (inside, outside, towers, cellars and so on when applicable; in extreme cases such as the Grand Topal Hideaway, I wouldn't expect you to go all around the island/volcano for instance as that'd require hundreds of furnishing as platforms/bridges alone, however the beach/Argonian Town/lava-meets-waterfall areas would be considered "main sections" - we could agree on these cases should you decide to take on the challenge based on the house of your choice)
3) The level of detail must be on par with the major decorators', this is perhaps the most important point to consider before deciding to take on such a time-consuming and, to reiterate, what I believe to be a mathematically impossible endeavour. One such example is Lovathy, whose creations (not even all of them) are previewed here and accessible through EHT which I highly recommend to get an idea. Screenshots and videos alone don't make such houses justice.
Examples such as @Gandalf2675 Stillwaters Retreat or @seecodenotgames Wraithome (both amazing, I'd recommend checking them out, contest or not) are proof of why I'm positive that this endeavour is, in fact, mathematically impossible - both houses, despite being fantastic, had to sacrifice detail and/or close off areas in order to attain what they did. Oh, not to mention the mind-boggling @DJfriede 's Hermaeus Planetarium (a heavily modify - and closed off - Hall of the Lunar Champion). I am of course leaving out dozens of outstanding, amazing examples, which is why I strongly recommend having a tour through EHT, the examples I mentioned are merely... examples. If I were to compile a list of all the amazing stuff I've seen I'd be here for hours - there's one thing all of those have in common however: in order to achieve such fantastic results, compromises had to be made, because the 700 limit is simply not enough.

TL;DR: I genuinely believe that the challenge I propose has mathematically impossible requirements. It was more of a way to prove that it's impossible to utilise a manor to its full potential with a limit of 700, and that space and/or detail must thus be sacrificed. Which is not the case with smaller houses, because again, they're smaller. Furthermore, it was a way to bring to attention the fact that some bigger houses (think Frostvault Chasm) have a much lower furnishing limit than much smaller houses (Water's Edge has a limit of 600 against Frostvault Chasm's 400).

That being said, the challenge stands. I sincerely believe that it's mathematically impossible to beat, but I'm not always right. I'm 99% sure you'd be wasting your time, however.

VaranisArano

Mayrael wrote: »

I totally agree. This is one of the reasons why housing has stopped entertaining me. We definitely need new solutions. A separate cap on services, overall a bigger cap for everyone.

If ZOS is worried about resources, they could apply a limit per player and let players move it from house to house (within reasonable limits of course) but that way having more houses, we could use the slots from our unused residences. This way the total number of resources needed doesn't change, only where they are allocated.

It's not their server resources they are concerned about. It's the client's resources.

Unless they've figured out a way to reduce the load for players loading into a house, they still have to contend with the limits of consoles and supported PCs when visitors load into large houses with lots of effects.

Nor is it as simple as "Enter at your own risk" when Support is going to be the ones getting characters out of houses if their system can't handle it and they crash as they load in.

I hope ZOS figures out a way to reduce load on the clients. But I also keep in mind that they have to deal with some weird edge cases, like what would happen if I stacked a ton of candles right on the spawn spot hoping to overwhelm someone's system.

SilverBride

Adremal wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Adremal wrote: »

I invite you to a friendly wager. 42.000 crowns if you manage to make one of the biggest houses "pretty filled in" - by community standards, housing discords/guilds and EHT hub should provide plenty of examples - if I were to name a famous creator who manages to make houses "filled in" - albeit by closing off portions of them or using smaller houses, that'd be Lovathy - and that is the catch: you'd have to do so without blocking off significant portions of them. Pull it off on a 700 house and win 42.000 crowns, live-streamed if need be, with the whole forum as a witness to my wager.

That is very compelling but first of all, I don't belong to any housing discords and I don't use EHT. I used to belong to a housing guild but left due to non housing related issues.

Also, I have never closed off any part of any house I own.

Then, more importantly, which houses qualify as one of the biggest houses? Just saw the 700 slot requirement. I have already decorated some large homes, such as Serenity Falls Estate (my very first house, decorated as a country estate and one character's private home, with a guest house), Antiquarian's Alpine Gallery (decorated as a mountain guest lodge) and Hall of the Lunar Champion (decorated as a museum with a Curator's office and a garden with a tea room). I have also decorated Alinor Crest Townhouse and Proudspire Manor which are decent sized (decorated as my character's private homes). And I consider all of these "filled in", yet no house is ever 100% complete as long as new items are added to the game that I may want to add to my decor.

If any of these qualify and you would like a tour then I'll accept the challenge.

Any 700 slots (manor) house will do, and I'd be willing to wait weeks, however since you'd also have to invest several weeks (in an endeavour which I believe to be mathematically impossible), I'll provide some very clear guidelines:
1) The house must have a furnishing limit of 700;
2) The house must be equally furnished and detailed in all of the main sections (inside, outside, towers, cellars and so on when applicable; in extreme cases such as the Grand Topal Hideaway, I wouldn't expect you to go all around the island/volcano for instance as that'd require hundreds of furnishing as platforms/bridges alone, however the beach/Argonian Town/lava-meets-waterfall areas would be considered "main sections" - we could agree on these cases should you decide to take on the challenge based on the house of your choice)
3) The level of detail must be on par with the major decorators', this is perhaps the most important point to consider before deciding to take on such a time-consuming and, to reiterate, what I believe to be a mathematically impossible endeavour. One such example is Lovathy, whose creations (not even all of them) are previewed here and accessible through EHT which I highly recommend to get an idea. Screenshots and videos alone don't make such houses justice.
Examples such as @Gandalf2675 Stillwaters Retreat or @seecodenotgames Wraithome (both amazing, I'd recommend checking them out, contest or not) are proof of why I'm positive that this endeavour is, in fact, mathematically impossible - both houses, despite being fantastic, had to sacrifice detail and/or close off areas in order to attain what they did. Oh, not to mention the mind-boggling @DJfriede 's Hermaeus Planetarium (a heavily modify - and closed off - Hall of the Lunar Champion). I am of course leaving out dozens of outstanding, amazing examples, which is why I strongly recommend having a tour through EHT, the examples I mentioned are merely... examples. If I were to compile a list of all the amazing stuff I've seen I'd be here for hours - there's one thing all of those have in common however: in order to achieve such fantastic results, compromises had to be made, because the 700 limit is simply not enough.

TL;DR: I genuinely believe that the challenge I propose has mathematically impossible requirements. It was more of a way to prove that it's impossible to utilise a manor to its full potential with a limit of 700, and that space and/or detail must thus be sacrificed. Which is not the case with smaller houses, because again, they're smaller. Furthermore, it was a way to bring to attention the fact that some bigger houses (think Frostvault Chasm) have a much lower furnishing limit than much smaller houses (Water's Edge has a limit of 600 against Frostvault Chasm's 400).

That being said, the challenge stands. I sincerely believe that it's mathematically impossible to beat, but I'm not always right. I'm 99% sure you'd be wasting your time, however.

The examples you provided for me to aspire to are exteme decorating, which is not the kind of decorating I, and many others, do.

I am not going to look at Stillwater Retreat or any of the open areas that do not start with buildings already in place, because as I already stated to another poster, I can see how those places would use more slots than one with an existing building. Nor am I going to take into consideration places like the Planetarium you mentioned, because it would take a tremendous amount of conservatory plants and flowers to pull off a masterpiece like that.

I have completely filled in 3 large 700 slot homes without coming close to maxing my slots, and every room and outdoor area have been decorated, as I claimed. I do add more items here and there as I find new things, and will continue to do so, but they are for all intents and purposes complete. You can come tour them if you wish.

wolfie1.0.

I hope that we get actual guildhouses or the ability to merge set stations in the future. Incorporating a full set of attuned stations into a home and have it not look like an furniture factory is annoying.

Adremal

SilverBride wrote: »

Adremal wrote: »

SilverBride wrote: »

Adremal wrote: »

I invite you to a friendly wager. 42.000 crowns if you manage to make one of the biggest houses "pretty filled in" - by community standards, housing discords/guilds and EHT hub should provide plenty of examples - if I were to name a famous creator who manages to make houses "filled in" - albeit by closing off portions of them or using smaller houses, that'd be Lovathy - and that is the catch: you'd have to do so without blocking off significant portions of them. Pull it off on a 700 house and win 42.000 crowns, live-streamed if need be, with the whole forum as a witness to my wager.

That is very compelling but first of all, I don't belong to any housing discords and I don't use EHT. I used to belong to a housing guild but left due to non housing related issues.

Also, I have never closed off any part of any house I own.

Then, more importantly, which houses qualify as one of the biggest houses? Just saw the 700 slot requirement. I have already decorated some large homes, such as Serenity Falls Estate (my very first house, decorated as a country estate and one character's private home, with a guest house), Antiquarian's Alpine Gallery (decorated as a mountain guest lodge) and Hall of the Lunar Champion (decorated as a museum with a Curator's office and a garden with a tea room). I have also decorated Alinor Crest Townhouse and Proudspire Manor which are decent sized (decorated as my character's private homes). And I consider all of these "filled in", yet no house is ever 100% complete as long as new items are added to the game that I may want to add to my decor.

If any of these qualify and you would like a tour then I'll accept the challenge.

Any 700 slots (manor) house will do, and I'd be willing to wait weeks, however since you'd also have to invest several weeks (in an endeavour which I believe to be mathematically impossible), I'll provide some very clear guidelines:
1) The house must have a furnishing limit of 700;
2) The house must be equally furnished and detailed in all of the main sections (inside, outside, towers, cellars and so on when applicable; in extreme cases such as the Grand Topal Hideaway, I wouldn't expect you to go all around the island/volcano for instance as that'd require hundreds of furnishing as platforms/bridges alone, however the beach/Argonian Town/lava-meets-waterfall areas would be considered "main sections" - we could agree on these cases should you decide to take on the challenge based on the house of your choice)
3) The level of detail must be on par with the major decorators', this is perhaps the most important point to consider before deciding to take on such a time-consuming and, to reiterate, what I believe to be a mathematically impossible endeavour. One such example is Lovathy, whose creations (not even all of them) are previewed here and accessible through EHT which I highly recommend to get an idea. Screenshots and videos alone don't make such houses justice.
Examples such as @Gandalf2675 Stillwaters Retreat or @seecodenotgames Wraithome (both amazing, I'd recommend checking them out, contest or not) are proof of why I'm positive that this endeavour is, in fact, mathematically impossible - both houses, despite being fantastic, had to sacrifice detail and/or close off areas in order to attain what they did. Oh, not to mention the mind-boggling @DJfriede 's Hermaeus Planetarium (a heavily modify - and closed off - Hall of the Lunar Champion). I am of course leaving out dozens of outstanding, amazing examples, which is why I strongly recommend having a tour through EHT, the examples I mentioned are merely... examples. If I were to compile a list of all the amazing stuff I've seen I'd be here for hours - there's one thing all of those have in common however: in order to achieve such fantastic results, compromises had to be made, because the 700 limit is simply not enough.

TL;DR: I genuinely believe that the challenge I propose has mathematically impossible requirements. It was more of a way to prove that it's impossible to utilise a manor to its full potential with a limit of 700, and that space and/or detail must thus be sacrificed. Which is not the case with smaller houses, because again, they're smaller. Furthermore, it was a way to bring to attention the fact that some bigger houses (think Frostvault Chasm) have a much lower furnishing limit than much smaller houses (Water's Edge has a limit of 600 against Frostvault Chasm's 400).

That being said, the challenge stands. I sincerely believe that it's mathematically impossible to beat, but I'm not always right. I'm 99% sure you'd be wasting your time, however.

The examples you provided for me to aspire to are exteme decorating, which is not the kind of decorating I, and many others, do.

I am not going to look at Stillwater Retreat or any of the open areas that do not start with buildings already in place, because as I already stated to another poster, I can see how those places would use more slots than one with an existing building. Nor am I going to take into consideration places like the Planetarium you mentioned, because it would take a tremendous amount of conservatory plants and flowers to pull off a masterpiece like that.

I have completely filled in 3 large 700 slot homes without coming close to maxing my slots, and every room and outdoor area have been decorated, as I claimed. I do add more items here and there as I find new things, and will continue to do so, but they are for all intents and purposes complete. You can come tour them if you wish.

It may be extreme for you, but it's the norm for many (if not the majority of) those into "endgame housing". My contest idea stemmed from your question:

SilverBride wrote: »

I still don't understand how ESO+ use all their slots. I've decorated several houses from the smallest apartments to notable homes and the apartments are the only ones I've used all the slots in. I have 100+ slots unused in most of my homes and they look pretty filled in.

I think it was an appropriate answer to show you how ESO+ use all their slots and, despite that, have to come to compromises by closing off large areas, tuning down the level of detail, or both. Among those examples, and in EHT, there are plenty of houses that do start with pre-built places and run have to compromise nonetheless due to the 700 limit not being enough.
That being said, I'd be happy to visit your houses. Chances are I won't find them complete, if you consider those examples "extreme" and I sank hundreds of hours trying to fully decorate manors to my standards without coming to compromises only to give up and submit to the praxis of closing places off, decorate smaller houses and such - and that's natural, tastes differ.

spartaxoxo

Adremal wrote: »

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That being said, the challenge stands. I sincerely believe that it's mathematically impossible to beat, but I'm not always right. I'm 99% sure you'd be wasting your time, however.

@Adremal
What's actually going to happen is you'll use rule 3 to disqualify anything she does because it's such an extremely subjective standard. I have a 700 slot home on console that is not only completely filled in but has additional detailed spaces added on. But you'd probably disqualify it merely because I used the tower section to put my crafting stations and nothing else, despite the add-ons taking up more slots then I could ever use to decorate that space.

You are basically stating that something that requires a lot of cobbling can be too difficult with the current slots, and that's true you cannot make cobbles for literally everywhere. This is not necessary to make a home filled in. More sparse decoration is also a valid design choice that would still be considered filled in by many.

Sylvermynx

It's kind of a dichotomy between @SilverBride and @Adremal it seems to me. From what SilverBride says, her system for decorating would be more like mine - where every area is furnished but not "Elianora-style" jam-packed with clutter and knick-knacks (Elianora makes house mods for Skyrim), where Adremal and some others mentioned have a more "stuffed" look they prefer.

I'm a "negative space" person - I like rooms where you can move around the furniture, and the clutter is limited. I look at a room to see if it was IRL would I have to dust stuff every time I walked through it? If not, then it's about right for me when it comes to clutter. I don't find that every piece of furniture needs a statue, some books, a mirror, a birdcage on top of it....

It's a pretty individual choice. I enjoy seeing the more densely decorated houses, but they actually come across as tightly packed movie sets sometimes. I just prefer more openness myself.

SilverBride

Adremal wrote: »

I think it was an appropriate answer to show you how ESO+ use all their slots and, despite that, have to come to compromises by closing off large areas, tuning down the level of detail, or both. Among those examples, and in EHT, there are plenty of houses that do start with pre-built places and run have to compromise nonetheless due to the 700 limit not being enough.
That being said, I'd be happy to visit your houses. Chances are I won't find them complete, if you consider those examples "extreme" and I sank hundreds of hours trying to fully decorate manors to my standards without coming to compromises only to give up and submit to the praxis of closing places off, decorate smaller houses and such - and that's natural, tastes differ.

I decorated all my homes, from my tiny one room apartments to my larger houses, and I did them to my standards without cutting corners or closing off any areas. I still have a lot of slots available which I love because I can add new interesting pieces as I find them. And I can easily redo rooms as new ideas come to me.

I recently completely redecorated one room in Proudspire Manor because I found a piece I thought was more fitting for who my character is, and decorated the room to conform to that new style.

I don't give up anything due to a lack of slots, and my houses look pretty good.

NotaDaedraWorshipper

Adremal wrote: »

2) The house must be equally furnished and detailed in all of the main sections (inside, outside, towers, cellars and so on when applicable; in extreme cases such as the Grand Topal Hideaway, I wouldn't expect you to go all around the island/volcano for instance as that'd require hundreds of furnishing as platforms/bridges alone, however the beach/Argonian Town/lava-meets-waterfall areas would be considered "main sections" - we could agree on these cases should you decide to take on the challenge based on the house of your choice)

What kind of rule is that? I'm agreeing with Spartaxoxo here, you could disqualify Silverbride for anything you don't deem enough. Grand Topal Hideway doesn't require you go all around. It's a tropical island. A lot of the spaces can be left untouched and they look nice.

A lot of houses can be decorated just fine with the slots we have. Would it be nice to have more slots, yes, but they don't require more.

spartaxoxo

Sylvermynx wrote: »

It's kind of a dichotomy between @SilverBride and @Adremal it seems to me. From what SilverBride says, her system for decorating would be more like mine - where every area is furnished but not "Elianora-style" jam-packed with clutter and knick-knacks (Elianora makes house mods for Skyrim), where Adremal and some others mentioned have a more "stuffed" look they prefer.

I'm a "negative space" person - I like rooms where you can move around the furniture, and the clutter is limited. I look at a room to see if it was IRL would I have to dust stuff every time I walked through it? If not, then it's about right for me when it comes to clutter. I don't find that every piece of furniture needs a statue, some books, a mirror, a birdcage on top of it....

It's a pretty individual choice. I enjoy seeing the more densely decorated houses, but they actually come across as tightly packed movie sets sometimes. I just prefer more openness myself.

For me, it depends on the space. I have a pretty good example in my ultimate library home. It is the Daggerfall manor.

The outside of the home is an intentionally sparsely decorated statue garden, the crafting stations (were currently empty) in the little tower spot. I liked that spot for my stations because it is somewhat hidden.

Part of the statue garden is a large well with a secret. You can jump through it to get to a mini theives den and trophy collection. The thieves guild is pretending to be scholars in that home while ripping off valuables inside and the nearby town of Daggerfall.

Go inside and you'll see a fancy library complete with two other cobbled new areas. One is a small bathroom, the other is a secret shrine behind the bookshelves that will someday host an elderscroll but for now host Khunzari's coffin.

Almost every bookshelf has readable books, the ones that don't I couldn't make them readable inside but they were too nice not to use. Most of the bookshelves therefore have multiple readable books.

There are so many readable books that it has the ENTIRE mage's guild collection. Every single last one of them. Alongside this all of Vivec and Sotha Sil's sermons are available and some other achievement books.

I also have a fully furnished mini-cafe where scholars can enjoy some pastries, coffee, and tea. Sotha Sil's tech even provides an expresso machine.

I could dismantle the shrine, bathroom, and theives den (which are not natural major areas of the home. The den is even in an area with slaughter fish and is not remotely a natural part of the house) in order to make the statue garden more dense and cluttered. All of it together represents more space than I would need to do that. But I don't want to do that because I like the sparse design of the statue garden, and highly value my cobbles in the cohesion of the home.

Jeremy

trpajzla wrote: »

I'm talking primarily about notable houses with 350/700 ESO+ slots.

1. Guidhouses
You need 65 attunable sets (number increases with every new DLC zone), 13 mundus, merchant and banker assistants, outfit, transmute and new armory stations, couple of dummies and couple of other functioning furnitures like Basin of Loss and Aetherial Well
If I count properly, it is about 290 slots alone.
Now you need platforms and stairways (20-30) basic lighting (30-50) which means you already spent 350 slots on necessary items without starting decorating guildhall yet !
It is unsustainable situation, especially concidering the fact that guildhalls are attended by thousands of players and cant look like some garbage/scraps yard, degrading the impression from the game
2. New multiple area houses like Patherfang
Short thing short. You have a chappel a fort a crypt and outside area and upper part like towers and battle positions.
750 /5 = 150.
I'd like to see any ZOS DEV able to decorate a chappel, fort, outside area ,crypt and towers with 150 slots each.
It is impossible and it is a scam on house owners.
3. Custom project zones like Coldharbor, Grand Topal, Doomchar Plateau etc
We got a lot of good components/structure objects with Leyawiin theme.
It would be cool for example to build your own medieaval castle on Grand Topal BUT how you can do that with 700 ESO+ slots, not mentioning 350 basic ones ?
Impossible.

Proposed solution:

I suppose the problem is more or less technical.
Each custom object in a house has it's own record with the object ID and coordinates.
It is only few bytes of data but these few bytes of data must be available for any visitor of the house when teleporting in fraction of seconds which makes load on backend.
If a guidhouse is visited 1000 times per day, those couple bytes of data starts to be a significant performance problem.

1. We need optimalization of similar objects - attunable stations, lights and platforms typically
Example: In guild house is 65 attunable sets which are adressed like 260 unique furnitures. It is absolute waste of slots as these could be easily adressed like one array of 4 different furnitures in multiple (260) positions.
I don't see any reason why not to give us possibility to "lock" similar objects and "glue" them together to make one "component" which is taking some reasonable (50) amount of slots.
For example max number of different items = 5, max number of positions = 300, slots taken = 50.
I think if one object like attuned station, light, platform, wall, whatever is repeating 65 times in a house, it neednt to be loaded 65 times again and again and again, but it can be loaded one time with list of 65 positions, isn't it better ?

2. We need overall increase of performance for housing as people are paying a lot of crowns (Patherfang is a good example) and then getting frustrated because they are unable to decorate it at leas modest way.

Yeah, I don't know why they don't allow more furniture slots. They say it's a technical limitation, but I find that very hard to believe, especially since they introduced pathing after they supposedly reached their max limit, proving they have the capacity to load more data.

And for sake of argument, even if we assume it's correct and 700 is their max limit of objects they can move around, they ought to be able to allow us to convert multiple objects into a single large object so the system can cut down the amount of processing it has to do. At the very least they could give us the option to split larger homes into different sections with separate loading screens for each so we can multiple limits of 700 throughout the home. Considering how much money they charge for them, they ought to do something to address it.