defensive set beyond Pariah?

Biro123

Waffennacht wrote: »

fred4 wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Ok, I tested Trial By Fire, and it indeed works with status effects from martial attack. I crafted 5 pieces and lets a stamina NB hit me with surprise attack, and my resistance went up, that makes it a great defensive set, especially against a DK, a sniper or a stamblade.

What? I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Thank you! I know you have to test everything, but you just can't. Who has the time? When the description of the set implies it only works against one type of damage (magic), I automatically dismiss it for PvP. You don't know what you will be facing. You need to run skills and sets that have reasonably broad applicability. Good grief. Again, thank you!

Yeah, what would actually make the set good is if it triggered from status effects originating from yourself; I.e pirate skeleton, unfortunately it does not.

Edit: the set says elemental effects, thats all of em, not just magic ones

I was just about to craft some of this and read the wording. It looks like its only 'while affected'. Now I cleanse quite a lot and this set would suddenly make cleansing a bad thing? Or would it still be a good thing? Then my head started to hurt so I went back to hitting things to make it feel better.

vesselwiththepestle

Biro123 wrote: »

I was just about to craft some of this and read the wording. It looks like its only 'while affected'. Now I cleanse quite a lot and this set would suddenly make cleansing a bad thing? Or would it still be a good thing? Then my head started to hurt so I went back to hitting things to make it feel better.

The set is useless if you cleanse a lot. You get the buff only while you have a status effect on you.

Honestly compared to Pariah I felt kinda squishy.

Alucardo

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

I still think Reactive is worth looking into. When you get hit with a disabling effect, you take 33% less damage for 5 seconds. That's a lot of raw mitigation. It does have a 20 second cooldown, but if you've got decent healing on your build, lasting 15 seconds until it procs again shouldn't be too much of an issue.
If you're vamp, you'll have so much percentage based mitigation you'll heal more than you take damage. Still a worthy set imho.

Too much downtime IMHO.

For this update, yeah it probably is. Another solution to get similar mitigation with a higher uptime would be Ironblood. Then use Wild Hunt and accelerate to get around the movement speed penalty.

The problem is that snares are multiplicative whereas speed enhancements are additive. So however fast you're moving that 50% snare is still going to bite hard.

You could be at movement speed cap and still get slowed down to regular speed. That's better than nothing but I can't imagine playing where you need both Sprint and Major Expedition and 3x Swift just to get back to basic jogging speed.

Yeah you won't be quite as fast as normal, but for 30% damage reduction with a 5 sec downtime only, it's probably worth it. Not so much if you're not built for some speed though.

ExistingRug61

YandereGirlfriend wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Alucardo wrote: »

I still think Reactive is worth looking into. When you get hit with a disabling effect, you take 33% less damage for 5 seconds. That's a lot of raw mitigation. It does have a 20 second cooldown, but if you've got decent healing on your build, lasting 15 seconds until it procs again shouldn't be too much of an issue.
If you're vamp, you'll have so much percentage based mitigation you'll heal more than you take damage. Still a worthy set imho.

Too much downtime IMHO.

For this update, yeah it probably is. Another solution to get similar mitigation with a higher uptime would be Ironblood. Then use Wild Hunt and accelerate to get around the movement speed penalty.

The problem is that snares are multiplicative whereas speed enhancements are additive. So however fast you're moving that 50% snare is still going to bite hard.

You could be at movement speed cap and still get slowed down to regular speed. That's better than nothing but I can't imagine playing where you need both Sprint and Major Expedition and 3x Swift just to get back to basic jogging speed.

@YandereGirlfriend
FYI as of dragonhold some snares changed - from those patch notes it stated that all player sourced snares changed to be additive with speed boosts, whereas monsters sourced snares are still multiplicative.
That said I am not actually sure if Ironblood’s snare counts as “player sourced” or not as it doesn’t clearly fall into one of the two categories described, so it still could be multiplicative.

mikey_reach

On my magdk i am doing bloodspawn and gloom grace for defense and it works really well since they proc when you take damage.

Spurius_Lucilius

Waffennacht wrote: »

fred4 wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Ok, I tested Trial By Fire, and it indeed works with status effects from martial attack. I crafted 5 pieces and lets a stamina NB hit me with surprise attack, and my resistance went up, that makes it a great defensive set, especially against a DK, a sniper or a stamblade.

What? I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Thank you! I know you have to test everything, but you just can't. Who has the time? When the description of the set implies it only works against one type of damage (magic), I automatically dismiss it for PvP. You don't know what you will be facing. You need to run skills and sets that have reasonably broad applicability. Good grief. Again, thank you!

Yeah, what would actually make the set good is if it triggered from status effects originating from yourself; I.e pirate skeleton, unfortunately it does not.

Edit: the set says elemental effects, thats all of em, not just magic ones

There is no set or skill in the game that give yourself a status effect. Pirate Skeleton gives yourself Minor Defile, which is a debuff, not the diseased status effect.
However, there are quite a lot of skills that put a guaranteed status effect on your enemies (full list: both morph of DK's Searing Strike, Elemental Weapon, Surprise Attack, Debilitate, Permafrost, Lethal Arrow, WW claws )
Besides those guaranteed ones, any damage dealt (except light and heavy attack) has a chance to proc their corresponding status effects.
There are also sets that put status effect on your enemies (Burning Spellweave, Unleashed Terror, AS Destro, etc.)

StarOfElyon

I've avoided the Pariah meta since it was meta a few years ago. Right now I'm trying out Adept Rider on my Necromancer Hybrid. It's only been a day so we'll see how it performs over a few days.

vesselwiththepestle

Hey, I can confirm that Trial by Fire is active when you've got one of those 47000 days Status effect on you. In my case I had Poisoned on me forever and Trial by Fire was active all the time. Maybe not so bad after all, although I got lucky to get the Status effect the first 5 minutes in Cyrodiil .

taugrim

ThePianist wrote: »

I didn’t say Pariah was bad, I said it was mediocre. Something tells me you guys have been reading too much YT comment sections or zone chats on how Pariah will be meta. Traders who have Pariah sets to sell you? Yeah they will tell you all the things you want to hear. They are salesmen, and you guys bought the agenda lol. SMH

I form my own conclusions about sets by trying them out, or talking with other avid PVP players.

Waffennacht

I actually like ascension

divnyi

Waffennacht wrote: »

I actually like ascension

Yup, lets you go armor cap in one item. As I said previously, you can combo with Snow Treaders to negate the biggest issue, even making it net-positive (if you don't block).

gariondavey

divnyi wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

I actually like ascension

Yup, lets you go armor cap in one item. As I said previously, you can combo with Snow Treaders to negate the biggest issue, even making it net-positive (if you don't block).

That's actually super hilarious. Awesome job

Rhaegar75

Any thoughts on using a defensive set on the back bar only?

I’m thinking about Trickery back bar only but I’m doubting it will be at its best. I know trickery is not exactly a defensive set but it provides enough options for a defensive build

Elo106

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Any thoughts on using a defensive set on the back bar only?

I’m thinking about Trickery back bar only but I’m doubting it will be at its best. I know trickery is not exactly a defensive set but it provides enough options for a defensive build

You could also try Armor Master backbar, you would have to run 5 in one armor weight and use that skill though.

Abyssmol

If you talking about PVP, no new set is needed. Magicka or stamina. Get yourself any good damage set in 5 medium, then get Evasion. Done! You'll be tankier than any set out there. I use 5 medium on my Magicka Templar and Evasion skill. I promise you. You'll be tankier and have major expedition all the time. That's it. The secrete is Evasion!

moo_2021

universal_wrath wrote: »

Iron blood on other hand works even when you are at full health, it provides a 50% flat damage reduction to everything for a messly 70% snare. Snare looks very bad on paper, but when you are running around a wall for kiting or even just standing still, you will see how the snare is negligable to the damage reduction of the this set..

Is this latest information? eso-sets.com says 10% chance to get iron blood, damage reduction by 30% and movement speed by 50%.

10% chance seems bad? Without DoT it'd take 3-4 hits (with effects) before it's activated and then a 5 second gap.

EDIT: checked it, yep 10% chance. Sucks and back to pariah...

Rhaegar75

I'm really interested in running a defensive set on the back bar so I can have another 5 piece a MS and a Mythic.....however I'm not really that convinced. I see quite a few people using IronBlood or Trickery on the back bar but I don't think it would be as effective as having set with 100% uptime.

Ironblood.....I agree with @moo_2021: maybe i'm missing something but it doesn't feel that powerful

Foto1

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Any thoughts on using a defensive set on the back bar only?

I’m thinking about Trickery back bar only but I’m doubting it will be at its best. I know trickery is not exactly a defensive set but it provides enough options for a defensive build

trickery works great only on the back bar

moo_2021

I'd be afraid to put anything crucial on backbar now because bar swapping fails more and more often compared to a few months ago, on PC EU. Bar swapping delays, bar swapping UI delays, abilities from different bars mixed up, got confused then swapped back, ...

etchedpixels

Orgnums scales is the obvious craftable one but with the health recovery changes it's less useful in PVP but still a great baby tank set.

milllaurie

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Any thoughts on using a defensive set on the back bar only?

I’m thinking about Trickery back bar only but I’m doubting it will be at its best. I know trickery is not exactly a defensive set but it provides enough options for a defensive build

Trickery is one of the most powerful sets in the game. Trickery looks funny on paper but is absolutely amazing irl. Wait, no, don't run trickery on second thought. The fewer people know, the better.

gamma71

milllaurie wrote: »

Spurius_Lucilius wrote: »

Any thoughts on using a defensive set on the back bar only?

I’m thinking about Trickery back bar only but I’m doubting it will be at its best. I know trickery is not exactly a defensive set but it provides enough options for a defensive build

Trickery is one of the most powerful sets in the game. Trickery looks funny on paper but is absolutely amazing irl. Wait, no, don't run trickery on second thought. The fewer people know, the better.

I made a trickery set yesterday and while the buffs are nice there random and don't really help getting bursted down. I went back to pariah and swift it does seem I still survive more with pariah more so than any other defensive set including swift.

In bgs I'm in a hated guild from cyrodil and literally will have both opposing teams focus me non stop so I've been goin heavy defense with stage 3 vamp sithis blinding flare for major protection and pariah or buffer of the swift for defense set and shackle breaker for sustain add mist form into it I'm hard to kill.

moo_2021

I tried buffer of the swift and it's much weaker on execution range. Pariah works better for that and with undeath I usually ignore low HP since execution doesn't hurt more than normal skills.

Soris

Swift set, Potentates, Major Protection, Minor Protection, 33k armor 2k crit resist. Templar.

I was boring so I went out and tested this a little bit in battlegrounds to see how tanky you'll be if you stack all these. I knew percentages are multiplicative but i didnt know how useless they'll be when you stack all.

The result was horrible. I was still getting hit hard and had to actively defend myself and burn all my resources to survive. I didnt feel any tankiness.

I think just major and minor protection from skills are enough nowadays. + Shuffle if you want.. 2 damage sets, or 1 sustain 1 damage set feels much smoother.

Hescrow

In solo PvP mode I use warrior poet as defensive set for armor and max health on stamsorc.
Otherwise for armor health and heal almalexia's mercy on stam DK is great.

SkaraMinoc

Ironblood, Aetherial Ascension, and Pariah are the 3 sets I would consider taking into a battleground.

Compromises:

• Ironblood: -50% movespeed
• Aetherial Ascension: +20% cost for block, dodge roll, sprint
• Pariah: Weak above ~70% health

The only build I've ever felt tanky on is Ironblood + AA/Pariah with Vampire Stage 3 and block healing.

Vizirith

Urzigurumash wrote: »

ThePianist wrote: »

Also this set doesn’t reduce damage taken from crits ie the bombers running around Cyrodiil. You also don’t gain reduced damage from executes.

Source?

It does reduce all damage the same way all resists do.

SkaraMinoc wrote: »

Ironblood, Aetherial Ascension, and Pariah are the 3 sets I would consider taking into a battleground.

Compromises:

• Ironblood: -50% movespeed
• Aetherial Ascension: +20% cost for block, dodge roll, sprint
• Pariah: Weak above ~70% health

The only build I've ever felt tanky on is Ironblood + AA/Pariah with Vampire Stage 3 and block healing.

Ironblood is great on magdk, fits the tanky block playstyle. But weaker on everything else though.

MEBengalsFan2001

Soris wrote: »

Swift set, Potentates, Major Protection, Minor Protection, 33k armor 2k crit resist. Templar.

I was boring so I went out and tested this a little bit in battlegrounds to see how tanky you'll be if you stack all these. I knew percentages are multiplicative but i didnt know how useless they'll be when you stack all.

The result was horrible. I was still getting hit hard and had to actively defend myself and burn all my resources to survive. I didnt feel any tankiness.

I think just major and minor protection from skills are enough nowadays. + Shuffle if you want.. 2 damage sets, or 1 sustain 1 damage set feels much smoother.

Minor and Major protection with major resolve in all medium gear I tend to do well in all types of PVP matches with my Warden. Using a knockback ability as well helps when you need to replenish health or magika/stamina.

I did try 33K resist with and without major/minor protection I also notice little to no variance in survivability. What you lose in damage doesn't justify the higher resistance. If a player is able to get high resistance with higher stats for damage than that maybe feasible but I have yet to see such a build. Many go with resistance with lower damage or higher damage with lower resistance.

I agree that going with 2 damage sets or 1 sustain + 1 damage in 5 medium with 1 light and 1 heavy is the way to go for DPS builds including magika builds. The added bonus to damage is just to good. With many sets now having stats that apply to both stamina and magika builds it is worth grinding out to get medium gear.

MentalxHammer

Buffer of the swift > pariah > armor master

Rhaegar75

MentalxHammer wrote: »

Buffer of the swift > pariah > armor master

I’m interested in your opinion on pariah vs swift: these are the main defensive sets I’m considering at the moment.

I also use trickery but can’t really consider it a full on defensive set: love it in CP cyro but not as happy with it in BGs hence shifting towards pariah or swift