Shadowfen node farming wars

NettleCarrier

It's a culture change within games, not necessarily tied to a generation. I'm sick of this stereotyping. I played EQ for many years and there were far less people in highly contested areas so comparing it to Shadowfen is not really fair. On top of that if you were camping something in a dungeon people could call out camp checks and others would respond. Very rarely did you have people trying to come in and take over your spot. Shadowfen is a downright disaster right now. I'm trying to kind of casually farm the lead and each night I try around 2am eastern and I'm lucky if I can find a node to stand on (usually it is stealing it from someone who's camping two nodes closely together). I don't *love* being this kind of player but that's my only shot at the lead. As the night goes on I've got 30+ people running past me or over top of the node spawn every 5 minutes, people harassing with mementos, and people kiting enemies over so they hit me and I can't loot. It's downright ridiculous! Comparing it to old-fashioned EQ farming does a disservice to Everquest.

Snit

This could win a contest for bad gameplay:

- It is unengaging and presents no options or challenge, as you just Press E
- Most players are just standing in one spot, covering one to three nodes, waiting to Press E
- They will be there for hours and hours, hoping to Press E in time
- Other players become the enemy, unwelcome competition, in a game not designed around that (this isn't open world pvp or survival)

If you want us to grind an activity, make sure the grind itself has some gameplay value. Not this. Not like this.

SeaGtGruff

Nazarousb14_ESO wrote: »

Two days ago had a player stand on a node I had been at for sometime, and started dropping a memento with four fire pillars that also had an e interaction. I kept shifting around so he couldn't get an idea where the node actually spawned. For what ever reason this node took an extra long time to respawn, about 20 mins this time. I got it and it had the lead. Taunted the guy for a bit and zoned out.
I am not certain if the extra time to respawn is a indication that it will drop but I find it odd that it had been the normal 2 to 10 mins until he came over and started trying to steal the node, and it dropping.

I was camped by a node yesterday and had players badgering me, presumably to see if I was actually there or just AFK. Some of them would fire their weapons and skills at me to try to get a reaction, and one guy (who I'd seen earlier posting all-caps comments in zone chat asking people not to take the nodes so others could have a chance to check) came by twice and left some mystery meat at my feet. The second time he did it, I whispered "troll" to him. By the way, I was not looting the node-- I would check it but leave it unlooted-- but then like as not the first person to come along would take it and run off. Anyone who had wanted to stick around to see if I ever moved could have watched me loot the Runestone node when it appeared nearby, or kill the alligator by the node, or swim across the river to loot the ore node over there after I'd checked the water node I was camped by. Eventually I started activating my memento that calls up a little light that circles around me from head to foot so I can see in dark places, obtained in Deshaan from Almalexia, to show people that I wasn't some bot or whatever.

Elsonso

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Nazarousb14_ESO wrote: »

Two days ago had a player stand on a node I had been at for sometime, and started dropping a memento with four fire pillars that also had an e interaction. I kept shifting around so he couldn't get an idea where the node actually spawned. For what ever reason this node took an extra long time to respawn, about 20 mins this time. I got it and it had the lead. Taunted the guy for a bit and zoned out.
I am not certain if the extra time to respawn is a indication that it will drop but I find it odd that it had been the normal 2 to 10 mins until he came over and started trying to steal the node, and it dropping.

I was camped by a node yesterday and had players badgering me, presumably to see if I was actually there or just AFK. Some of them would fire their weapons and skills at me to try to get a reaction, and one guy (who I'd seen earlier posting all-caps comments in zone chat asking people not to take the nodes so others could have a chance to check) came by twice and left some mystery meat at my feet. The second time he did it, I whispered "troll" to him. By the way, I was not looting the node-- I would check it but leave it unlooted-- but then like as not the first person to come along would take it and run off. Anyone who had wanted to stick around to see if I ever moved could have watched me loot the Runestone node when it appeared nearby, or kill the alligator by the node, or swim across the river to loot the ore node over there after I'd checked the water node I was camped by. Eventually I started activating my memento that calls up a little light that circles around me from head to foot so I can see in dark places, obtained in Deshaan from Almalexia, to show people that I wasn't some bot or whatever.

It pains me to think about how many people are being reported as bots or macro users or cheaters and how much the ToS team is being distracted, or outright ignoring reports, because of this.

FinrodMacBeorn

Elsonso wrote: »

FinrodMacBeorn wrote: »

With a drop rate of 1% and an average respawn rate of 3 min (just educated guesses), the average time to get the lead would be 100x3 min = 5 h - if you just camp a single node and do something else while keeping an eye on your char to let the time not be a complete waste.

A drop rate of 1% has an average number of attempts (50-50 chance) of 70, not 100.

Nope. Geometric distribution. Mean value = 1/sucess probability. So 1%=1/100 --> 100.
(e.g.: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geometric_distribution)

Dojohoda

Dear Honorable Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes,

I would very much like to schedule an appointment with a water related node. If possible, I would like to schedule an hour with the node. Please respond at your earliest convenience.

Respectfully Yours,
Dojo

Elsonso

FinrodMacBeorn wrote: »

Elsonso wrote: »

FinrodMacBeorn wrote: »

With a drop rate of 1% and an average respawn rate of 3 min (just educated guesses), the average time to get the lead would be 100x3 min = 5 h - if you just camp a single node and do something else while keeping an eye on your char to let the time not be a complete waste.

A drop rate of 1% has an average number of attempts (50-50 chance) of 70, not 100.

Nope. Geometric distribution. Mean value = 1/sucess probability. So 1%=1/100 --> 100.
(e.g.: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geometric_distribution)

It's a Bernoulli trial where each attempt has two possible outcomes, success or failure, and where each attempt has exactly the same chance of success, independent of all prior attempts. This is used for coin tosses, Crown Crate rewards, and nodes coughing up leads.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernoulli_trial

Calculated with the goal to determine the number if attempts required to get a 50% chance of having obtained a successful outcome. That isn't, strictly, "average" or "mean" but I think it is a better representation of how long it will take.

xeNNNNN

Dojohoda wrote: »

Dear Honorable Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes,

I would very much like to schedule an appointment with a water related node. If possible, I would like to schedule an hour with the node. Please respond at your earliest convenience.

Respectfully Yours,
Dojo

ohhhh......oh my.

Elsonso

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Dojohoda wrote: »

Dear Honorable Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes,

I would very much like to schedule an appointment with a water related node. If possible, I would like to schedule an hour with the node. Please respond at your earliest convenience.

Respectfully Yours,
Dojo

ohhhh......oh my.

Don't worry. It takes at least a week for the Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes to respond to appointment requests.

kargen27

furiouslog wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

Saucy_Jack wrote: »

Wait, the lead comes from water plants, right? Isn't Shadowfen like...90% swamp? Wouldn't MOST of the plants in Shadowfen be water plants? What am I missing here?

There are, based on my HarvestMap, 85 water plant nodes, and 90 pure water nodes.

Based on prior data for the rarity of other lead drops coming from nodes collected through addons as well as times reported in the zone chat (and this is an assumption, granted), I'm estimating the lead drop rate to be 1 in 100.

Based on personal data collected and data posted in the zone chat, the average respawn time ranges from 2 to 10 minutes (some people reported higher, but I didn't see it and other people aggregating data did not report that, so those are probably outliers or bad reports). The average reported seemed to be about 4 minutes and 30 seconds.

Given those odds and timing, this is the probability that you'll get a drop after spending a certain amount of time harvesting:



The 50% break point is at about 5 hours. The proper way to figure this next bit out would be to simulate the results and behavior conditionally, but I really don't want to spend the time coding that when ZOS will not address it and others will just poke holes in the assumptions anyway, so I'm going to give a "back of the envelope" estimate of lead drop clear rates based on the quartiles.

ZOS has stated that there are 15 million accounts. Let's say that 40% are on PC-NA, and that only one percent of them play a lot, and a quarter of those guys actually care about the lead. That gives us a pool of 15000 players on PC-NA who would like to farm the lead for one reason or another. That kind of lines up with Steamcharts and ESOLogs data, assuming that people who upload logs and parses to ESOLogs are interested enough in playing well to farm this item, while others are just collectors.

Assuming that all nodes are being farmed 24/7, given the available nodes, interested players, one node per player, players leaving once lead is farmed, and the stated odds of a drop, that means that it will take that pool of players about 26 days to clear the zone before it's no longer saturated if they were persistently working at it perfectly and efficiently at all hours of the day. Once you introduce the inefficiencies, that time gets longer. And, of course, there are going to be some unfortunates who will potentially spend well over 20 hours sitting and staring at a plant before getting rewarded, some of whom I have seen in zone chat, and are quite clearly clinically depressed.

So that's kind of the beef with the design, I think. If anyone has issues with my assumptions, feel free to say so, these numbers are very hypothetical and heavily conditional on the odds of a drop.

So my guess that in about a month things will settle down seems about right. This really isn't anything new or different from past new content releases. There is always something a few players want right away. It is why the first few days after a new release there is a lot of gold to be made from motif and furniture plan drops. The price of wanting to be among the first to get this lead in Shadowfen is you have to compete with all the other players that want to be among the first to get the lead. I don't see any need to make adjustments to the game for a problem that is essentially player created. Those who decide to wait a few weeks before giving it a go will likely have a much easier time of it.

I could not disagree more. The node limits and toxicity are a symptom of player urgency, but making someone sit there for more than 20 hours mindlessly doing the most boring thing in the game is just straight up player punishment.

kargen27 wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

furiouslog wrote: »

Saucy_Jack wrote: »

Wait, the lead comes from water plants, right? Isn't Shadowfen like...90% swamp? Wouldn't MOST of the plants in Shadowfen be water plants? What am I missing here?

There are, based on my HarvestMap, 85 water plant nodes, and 90 pure water nodes.

Based on prior data for the rarity of other lead drops coming from nodes collected through addons as well as times reported in the zone chat (and this is an assumption, granted), I'm estimating the lead drop rate to be 1 in 100.

Based on personal data collected and data posted in the zone chat, the average respawn time ranges from 2 to 10 minutes (some people reported higher, but I didn't see it and other people aggregating data did not report that, so those are probably outliers or bad reports). The average reported seemed to be about 4 minutes and 30 seconds.

Given those odds and timing, this is the probability that you'll get a drop after spending a certain amount of time harvesting:



The 50% break point is at about 5 hours. The proper way to figure this next bit out would be to simulate the results and behavior conditionally, but I really don't want to spend the time coding that when ZOS will not address it and others will just poke holes in the assumptions anyway, so I'm going to give a "back of the envelope" estimate of lead drop clear rates based on the quartiles.

ZOS has stated that there are 15 million accounts. Let's say that 40% are on PC-NA, and that only one percent of them play a lot, and a quarter of those guys actually care about the lead. That gives us a pool of 15000 players on PC-NA who would like to farm the lead for one reason or another. That kind of lines up with Steamcharts and ESOLogs data, assuming that people who upload logs and parses to ESOLogs are interested enough in playing well to farm this item, while others are just collectors.

Assuming that all nodes are being farmed 24/7, given the available nodes, interested players, one node per player, players leaving once lead is farmed, and the stated odds of a drop, that means that it will take that pool of players about 26 days to clear the zone before it's no longer saturated if they were persistently working at it perfectly and efficiently at all hours of the day. Once you introduce the inefficiencies, that time gets longer. And, of course, there are going to be some unfortunates who will potentially spend well over 20 hours sitting and staring at a plant before getting rewarded, some of whom I have seen in zone chat, and are quite clearly clinically depressed.

So that's kind of the beef with the design, I think. If anyone has issues with my assumptions, feel free to say so, these numbers are very hypothetical and heavily conditional on the odds of a drop.

So my guess that in about a month things will settle down seems about right. This really isn't anything new or different from past new content releases. There is always something a few players want right away. It is why the first few days after a new release there is a lot of gold to be made from motif and furniture plan drops. The price of wanting to be among the first to get this lead in Shadowfen is you have to compete with all the other players that want to be among the first to get the lead. I don't see any need to make adjustments to the game for a problem that is essentially player created. Those who decide to wait a few weeks before giving it a go will likely have a much easier time of it.

I could not disagree more. The node limits and toxicity are a symptom of player urgency, but making someone sit there for more than 20 hours mindlessly doing the most boring thing in the game is just straight up player punishment. That time requirement will not change much after the node limits settle down, not until the zone is just empty. Why even make it that way? It's madness.

Nobody is making players do twenty hours straight anything in the game. Players are doing that all on their own because they want to. They could be off doing trials, PvP, new quests or any number of things. Because they want to be among the first to get the drop they choose to sit on a node. That is their choice.

I've already explained why you're wrong, unless you're just taking the logically pointless stance of "well no one is making them play the game in the first place," which essentially negates the entire point of the discussion.

I assure you, no one "wants" to be doing this unbelievably boring and mindless task. They are choosing to do it because it's a condition of further participation in their in-game activities of interest given considerable sunk costs, which is not the same thing as wanting to do it. I don't understand why you can't seem to grasp that concept.

You didn't explain why I was wrong. You offered an opinion. Players want the lead right now. That is on them. They have made the choice to grind for something the first few days after the item dropped. They made the choice. Simple as that. This is a player created problem that will go away very soon.
Doesn't matter if it is a guild leader requiring players wear the item to participate on the Alpha team in trials or if it is just a completionist that always tries to get everything new quick. Either way it is a player created problem that will not last. Nothing wrong with the game on this one.

kargen27

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

Nazarousb14_ESO wrote: »

Two days ago had a player stand on a node I had been at for sometime, and started dropping a memento with four fire pillars that also had an e interaction. I kept shifting around so he couldn't get an idea where the node actually spawned. For what ever reason this node took an extra long time to respawn, about 20 mins this time. I got it and it had the lead. Taunted the guy for a bit and zoned out.
I am not certain if the extra time to respawn is a indication that it will drop but I find it odd that it had been the normal 2 to 10 mins until he came over and started trying to steal the node, and it dropping.

I was camped by a node yesterday and had players badgering me, presumably to see if I was actually there or just AFK. Some of them would fire their weapons and skills at me to try to get a reaction, and one guy (who I'd seen earlier posting all-caps comments in zone chat asking people not to take the nodes so others could have a chance to check) came by twice and left some mystery meat at my feet. The second time he did it, I whispered "troll" to him. By the way, I was not looting the node-- I would check it but leave it unlooted-- but then like as not the first person to come along would take it and run off. Anyone who had wanted to stick around to see if I ever moved could have watched me loot the Runestone node when it appeared nearby, or kill the alligator by the node, or swim across the river to loot the ore node over there after I'd checked the water node I was camped by. Eventually I started activating my memento that calls up a little light that circles around me from head to foot so I can see in dark places, obtained in Deshaan from Almalexia, to show people that I wasn't some bot or whatever.

Why were you not looting it? Soon as you see what is in it the contents are set. Any player coming along is going to see exactly what you see. Better to loot it so others don't have to waste time running over to take a peek.

hackdrag0n

Got lucky and only spent an hour to get that lead, one run of mazz, and got the lead from murkmire on the second fishing hole. Have to agree that shadowfen farm is terrible though - just a huge amount of toxicity in the zone - not what the community needs.

Elsonso

kargen27 wrote: »

Why were you not looting it? Soon as you see what is in it the contents are set. Any player coming along is going to see exactly what you see. Better to loot it so others don't have to waste time running over to take a peek.

The theory, untested, is that the lead is independent of the normal contents of the node. Thus, when the first player opens it, any other player that opens it will see what the first player saw, but might also see the lead they want. This is important, if true, because it eliminates the need to wait for the node to respawn before it can be checked by another players.

That is also assuming that people can be trained to not take everything from the node. Given the "worm wars" in here over stuff left in nodes, this might be quite the challenge.

If not true, then people are merely extending the time it takes to find the lead.

The community has a tendency to dream up all sorts of things about the game that are not true, so until tested, it is hard to know which way to go on this one.

xeNNNNN

Elsonso wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Why were you not looting it? Soon as you see what is in it the contents are set. Any player coming along is going to see exactly what you see. Better to loot it so others don't have to waste time running over to take a peek.

The theory, untested, is that the lead is independent of the normal contents of the node. Thus, when the first player opens it, any other player that opens it will see what the first player saw, but might also see the lead they want. This is important, if true, because it eliminates the need to wait for the node to respawn before it can be checked by another players.

That is also assuming that people can be trained to not take everything from the node. Given the "worm wars" in here over stuff left in nodes, this might be quite the challenge.

If not true, then people are merely extending the time it takes to find the lead.

The community has a tendency to dream up all sorts of things about the game that are not true, so until tested, it is hard to know which way to go on this one.

Yes, this was the point of me putting a "disclaimer" in one of my comments as well, mostly because I cannot outright prove it, I can only go on what has been reported and while I dont normally bow to conjecture I figure that if there enough people doing it and enough people reporting it working then there maybe some credence to it.

The other reason for bringing up such things (which wasn't really the intent of the thread) is that if it is how it actually works, then the more important question crops up; "Why?" as it seems needless tedious for the devs to do such a thing in the first place.

xeNNNNN

Elsonso wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Dojohoda wrote: »

Dear Honorable Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes,

I would very much like to schedule an appointment with a water related node. If possible, I would like to schedule an hour with the node. Please respond at your earliest convenience.

Respectfully Yours,
Dojo

ohhhh......oh my.

Don't worry. It takes at least a week for the Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes to respond to appointment requests.

Well if nodes were alive, all these requests would be needlessly traumatic haha

Shantu

It took me about 4 hours to get the lead, running in 1 hour blocks of time (that's all I could stand), over a big circular route. I just kept running it non-stop while there, doing a little resource farming of other mats to break up the monotony. Camping on a node sounds torturous. Keeping on the move you don't have to deal with people being idiots.

When I finally got the lead I just said swore at ZOS and got out of there. I don't think I'll ever look at a water node or hyacinth flower the same again.

furiouslog

Elsonso wrote: »

kargen27 wrote: »

Why were you not looting it? Soon as you see what is in it the contents are set. Any player coming along is going to see exactly what you see. Better to loot it so others don't have to waste time running over to take a peek.

The theory, untested, is that the lead is independent of the normal contents of the node. Thus, when the first player opens it, any other player that opens it will see what the first player saw, but might also see the lead they want. This is important, if true, because it eliminates the need to wait for the node to respawn before it can be checked by another players.

That is also assuming that people can be trained to not take everything from the node. Given the "worm wars" in here over stuff left in nodes, this might be quite the challenge.

If not true, then people are merely extending the time it takes to find the lead.

The community has a tendency to dream up all sorts of things about the game that are not true, so until tested, it is hard to know which way to go on this one.

I got my lead on a secondhand node someone had already peeked in.

kargen27 wrote: »

You didn't explain why I was wrong. You offered an opinion. Players want the lead right now. That is on them. They have made the choice to grind for something the first few days after the item dropped. They made the choice. Simple as that. This is a player created problem that will go away very soon.
Doesn't matter if it is a guild leader requiring players wear the item to participate on the Alpha team in trials or if it is just a completionist that always tries to get everything new quick. Either way it is a player created problem that will not last. Nothing wrong with the game on this one.

Making someone click on a plant every 2-10 minutes for more than 20 hours to get a part of a piece of gear is insane and terrible and not at all fun. That's what's wrong with it. Of course, I'm sure it's an upgrade compared to sitting on your porch and lecturing spoiled rotten teenagers walking by in the street all day as they try to slip M80s into your mailbox.

I know that you don't think it's fair that you wasted all of that time in Everquest farming gear that now means nothing to you, and that everyone else in the world should have to go through the same unrelenting and pointless garbage as you did. Despite the human ability to learn from mistakes, improve, and move forward, I'm sure that the very worst thing that could happen is that any big whiney whiners actually benefit from that continual and unstoppable process, as it would potentially unravel the warm and comforting security blanket of your perfectly ordered tough-as-nails bootstraps meritocracy.

Zenzuki

Elsonso wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Dojohoda wrote: »

Dear Honorable Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes,

I would very much like to schedule an appointment with a water related node. If possible, I would like to schedule an hour with the node. Please respond at your earliest convenience.

Respectfully Yours,
Dojo

ohhhh......oh my.

Don't worry. It takes at least a week for the Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes to respond to appointment requests.

Prolly gonna be a bit longer though... heard the Secretary of Shadowfen Nodes is in quarantine!

Elsonso

xeNNNNN wrote: »

I can only go on what has been reported and while I dont normally bow to conjecture I figure that if there enough people doing it and enough people reporting it working then there maybe some credence to it.

The other reason for bringing up such things (which wasn't really the intent of the thread) is that if it is how it actually works, then the more important question crops up; "Why?" as it seems needless tedious for the devs to do such a thing in the first place.

Crowds are frequently inaccurate, as people will believe and repeat all sorts of trash just because it sounds good.

As for why... the obvious reason is so that the developers can generate loot that is specific to the player, rather than general to the container. This allows them to give Player A something, but not have it available to Player B if Player A decides not to take it. It could be useful when distributing special rewards or in places where quests require a particular loot drop.

Shantu wrote: »

It took me about 4 hours to get the lead, running in 1 hour blocks of time (that's all I could stand), over a big circular route. I just kept running it non-stop while there, doing a little resource farming of other mats to break up the monotony. Camping on a node sounds torturous. Keeping on the move you don't have to deal with people being idiots.

4 hours actually does not sound too bad. I think the average amount of time required to get a Cipher or Dust is longer than the dinosaurs roamed the Earth.

renne

Somehow ZoS has mnaged to take the most awful region in the game and make it even worse with this absolute rubbish.

LadyNalcarya

NettleCarrier wrote: »

It's a culture change within games, not necessarily tied to a generation. I'm sick of this stereotyping. I played EQ for many years and there were far less people in highly contested areas so comparing it to Shadowfen is not really fair. On top of that if you were camping something in a dungeon people could call out camp checks and others would respond. Very rarely did you have people trying to come in and take over your spot. Shadowfen is a downright disaster right now. I'm trying to kind of casually farm the lead and each night I try around 2am eastern and I'm lucky if I can find a node to stand on (usually it is stealing it from someone who's camping two nodes closely together). I don't *love* being this kind of player but that's my only shot at the lead. As the night goes on I've got 30+ people running past me or over top of the node spawn every 5 minutes, people harassing with mementos, and people kiting enemies over so they hit me and I can't loot. It's downright ridiculous! Comparing it to old-fashioned EQ farming does a disservice to Everquest.

There's one thing about generations: the kids who grinded in Everquest are now adults with jobs, families and other responsibilities and won't be able to grind like they used to, and younger generations are more into shooters/mobas/battle royales. Mmos are mostly popular with adult demographic, so I don't really understand the "kids these days" argument.

Elsonso

LadyNalcarya wrote: »

NettleCarrier wrote: »

It's a culture change within games, not necessarily tied to a generation. I'm sick of this stereotyping. I played EQ for many years and there were far less people in highly contested areas so comparing it to Shadowfen is not really fair. On top of that if you were camping something in a dungeon people could call out camp checks and others would respond. Very rarely did you have people trying to come in and take over your spot. Shadowfen is a downright disaster right now. I'm trying to kind of casually farm the lead and each night I try around 2am eastern and I'm lucky if I can find a node to stand on (usually it is stealing it from someone who's camping two nodes closely together). I don't *love* being this kind of player but that's my only shot at the lead. As the night goes on I've got 30+ people running past me or over top of the node spawn every 5 minutes, people harassing with mementos, and people kiting enemies over so they hit me and I can't loot. It's downright ridiculous! Comparing it to old-fashioned EQ farming does a disservice to Everquest.

There's one thing about generations: the kids who grinded in Everquest are now adults with jobs, families and other responsibilities and won't be able to grind like they used to, and younger generations are more into shooters/mobas/battle royales. Mmos are mostly popular with adult demographic, so I don't really understand the "kids these days" argument.

It sort of makes you worry about what they are teaching their kids about getting along with others, doesn't it?

In retrospect, I am now thinking that what ZOS should do is tie leads like this to one (and only one) of the standard daily quests with a 1 to 10% drop rate. Give everyone one chance to get it every day, and be done with it. Each additional lead that they might tie to some in-world resource would be added to a different daily quest.

This would take the rage and bad behavior out of the game and into social media, where it could be ignored.

Everest_Lionheart

I’m a little more disappointed than anything. They nerfed crit to slow down endgame DPS and then turn around and introduce a mythic item that just gives it back if you are willing to put in hours doing the most menial task in the game.

I don’t like it one bit. Nerf the add ons instead. Console endgame is hard enough with the constant desynchs and disconnects.

SeaGtGruff

furiouslog wrote: »

I got my lead on a secondhand node someone had already peeked in.

I'm happy to hear that. I'd been thinking of starting a poll to see if anyone had found the lead that way, so we can all know one way or the other and put that question to rest.

Alurria

I played EQ from they day it launched and believe me as many find memories as I have I also have nightmares. People purposely training mobs on you to make you move from a camping spot, yes bad behavior was happening then too. So so while this situation was created by ZOS you would think gaming company's would have learned by now if you put people in these types of situations bad behavior will follow. So what I am saying is gaming company's do have a responsibility to look at all aspects of their game and players have a responsibility to check their behavior.

KalyanLazair

Snit wrote: »

This could win a contest for bad gameplay:

- It is unengaging and presents no options or challenge, as you just Press E
- Most players are just standing in one spot, covering one to three nodes, waiting to Press E
- They will be there for hours and hours, hoping to Press E in time
- Other players become the enemy, unwelcome competition, in a game not designed around that (this isn't open world pvp or survival)

If you want us to grind an activity, make sure the grind itself has some gameplay value. Not this. Not like this.

I can't agree more with this comment. Devs, THIS, totally THIS.

I want to play the game, not sit for hours at a spot pressing E in the hopes of getting the node and perhaps the lead. For the record, I am not playing right now. I'm letting the hype die down before I tackle the zone's story, and I'm not even going to bother with the lead other than if I have nothing else to do. I'm a full time computer programmer and I'm developing something for a client, and in my spare time I'm writing another book (I'm also a published writer) and playing other games that are actually, you know, proactive (thinking of giving Dark Souls a try). Any free time I actually have to play I want to actually play the game. This is an enormous waste of time.

I'm not talking for myself, I'm by no means not such an endgame player that I need to have the ultimate special weapon or ring, but I do take pride in being able to solo almost every world boss (including plenty of DLC worldbosses) and plenty of group dungeons in both normal and vet. I can do that because I've trained, I've played and tested my limits. Yes, that special ultimate set piece might give me a boost in dmg but I'm just not willing to sacrifice who knows how many hours in such a boring task when I can be doing something else. If the lead dropped from WB, dragons, geysers or whatever, at least there would be some challenge in that.,

Right now it drops from nodes that spawn with a timer, causing a vicious competition between players who have fallen to harassing, trolling and pulling mobs towards other players in order to keep them from being able to harvest the node. This is, by far, one of the least intelligent decisions they could have done. I've just been to Shadowfen out of curiosity to see what was going on, and all I've seen is people on the verge of desperation because of this. The launch of a new DLC should be cause for joy and excitement, not this.

khyrkat

I asked in zone what was that all about, some dude attacked me in chat for "stealing his node" like it was signed so I asked wtf, why theyre camping on weed and what did I get in response? "go away if you dont care about the lead" like... c'mon O_O Absolutely terrible design now I know what it is all about (but I'm not farming these mythics, never did, always stumble upon leads and stuff by pure accident), making the worst of people come out. Whose idea it was? Where is the social component of ESO? The community gets so toxic, damn... I remember back in the day when I started playing people were more... civilized. Now it's just savagery. Major savagery

SeaGtGruff

I want ZOS to program a lead to drop from Fleshflies, because I'm pretty sure I'm the only player in the game who ever loots those.

SeaGtGruff

Sorry, quoted when I meant to edit.

renne

SeaGtGruff wrote: »

I want ZOS to program a lead to drop from Fleshflies, because I'm pretty sure I'm the only player in the game who ever loots those.

Nah, I loot fleshflies, because like butterflies and torchbugs, they're the quickest to loot haha.