Do you think classes need rebalanced?

StarOfElyon

Yes

Templar passives are so straight booty.

Wing

Yes

i say yes as a DK main hoping it would make the class more relevant.

that being said considering their track record they would probably just nerf DK. . .

so im conflicted.

Arkew

Yes

turn all class into warden/necromancer

1 tree for damage
1 tree for tanking
1 tree on healing

so all class being able to do what role he want.

High_Solar

Yes

DK needs some adjusting, it's lackluster in PVP especially stamDK. DK has nothing compared to the other classes, we are kitable, slow and lack any good healing and defenses.

Rhaegar75

Yes

JohnOfMarkarth wrote: »

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

Big throbbing No.
A NO so vast that Sahara couldn't contain 1% of it.
A "NO" so big that Pistol Star is a dwarf star compared to it.

Lets nerf something that has so little use in majority of end game content that its a joke... out of *pinkbunnies existence. These cyrodiil crocodile tears of pvp will just put an uninstall button as main button on the launcher, while to press play you gotta go to options, press play under repair. And the launcher asks you twice if you are even sure you want to proceed!


Classes need rework, but boy is Warden in need of positive reinforcements not nerfs... Classes need their identity back. Else its just ... Mass Effect 3 Endings according to fans all over again. Its all the same just pick your color.

I forgot to flag that I was referring to PvP only (I don't really PvE much).

try and fight some StamDens in Pvp and then let me know: super tanky and then doing a ton of damage...when a PC has as much power as a dungeon boss....I think there is something not 100% right

JinMori

I think the devs should focus more on making the classes fun rather than hyperbalance.

But they should try to make them as close as possible.

JohnOfMarkarth

Yes

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

JohnOfMarkarth wrote: »

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

Big throbbing No.
A NO so vast that Sahara couldn't contain 1% of it.
A "NO" so big that Pistol Star is a dwarf star compared to it.

Lets nerf something that has so little use in majority of end game content that its a joke... out of *pinkbunnies existence. These cyrodiil crocodile tears of pvp will just put an uninstall button as main button on the launcher, while to press play you gotta go to options, press play under repair. And the launcher asks you twice if you are even sure you want to proceed!


Classes need rework, but boy is Warden in need of positive reinforcements not nerfs... Classes need their identity back. Else its just ... Mass Effect 3 Endings according to fans all over again. Its all the same just pick your color.

I forgot to flag that I was referring to PvP only (I don't really PvE much).

try and fight some StamDens in Pvp and then let me know: super tanky and then doing a ton of damage...when a PC has as much power as a dungeon boss....I think there is something not 100% right

500k? I'd like to see that

Xebov

Yes

Yes, but not right now. The changes have to settle in to see how ppl adapt to it and how they impact the game. None of the changes are game breaking so everyone will still be fine.

Xebov

Yes

honey_badger82 wrote: »

^^^^ Your logic is infallible. The direction could of been taken well over a year ago. There are quite a few voices of reason on this forum. At this point it's a too little too late for some. I am tired of changing my builds every 3 months, tired of farming for gear and upgrade materials. My stamplar in full golded out gear is going to take several heavy blows with this new direction.

Then you realy shouldnt play MMOs at all. Thats usual buisness in MMOs i played so far.

Ragnaroek93

Yes

I'd actually love to see a class balance overhaul from PvP perspective. The classes got pruned down so much that there are only very few builds competitive and most classes don't work without proc sets (= borrowed power) anymore.

I've been playing my stamnb as my main since the game came out and it's just not enjoyable anymore. All what's left are max dmg stack "gank" builds with tonal or full proc set builds. So the class is either totally oppressive to play against (if the burst is high enough to burst somebody out of stealth) or useless because it has zero counters to block, dodge and healing and therefore can't create good pressure. I'd wish the class would have mobility and more dmg but less frontloaded burst while being squishy (like windwalker monk in WoW for example) instead being doomed to a stealth ganker.

Beside that, stamnb is still one of the better designed classes overall, so yes, a class rebalance is very needed imo (start by giving every stam class a proper spammable like stam whip for example) and then allow every class to have a softcounter to at least one of the three: Block, dodge and healing.

honey_badger82

Yes

Xebov wrote: »

honey_badger82 wrote: »

^^^^ Your logic is infallible. The direction could of been taken well over a year ago. There are quite a few voices of reason on this forum. At this point it's a too little too late for some. I am tired of changing my builds every 3 months, tired of farming for gear and upgrade materials. My stamplar in full golded out gear is going to take several heavy blows with this new direction.

Then you realy shouldnt play MMOs at all. Thats usual buisness in MMOs i played so far.

Let's get this straight... I play a MMO only because they made the Elder Scrolls one. If they would make a version of the game solo like Skyrim I would be all over it like white on rice. I don't like MMOs, I am FORCED to play one because the game is one. Sure I could play another game but there isn't one currently in the genre I like that I already haven't played and completed nearly 100% several times over.

The set recreation is a step in the right direction, keeps the farming down, also will greatly shut down the zone sellers "X spriggans thorns piece... divines... 50k!". If they could now more the double the rate of upgrade material dropping then the knee jerk changes every 3 months would be much more bearable.

kalunte

No

i voted no because it looks like the guys complaining here are skiping the major change coming to major/minor buffs with 6.2.X.

the highest overall performers where classes with easy access to multiple minor/major buffs of any kinds en some will get some 23% dmg nerfs to both mitigation and dmg on their brust phases which is huge.

any class adjusment will have to come after a decent oversight of how this all affects both pve and pvp. even if i dont mind too much about pve because buffs here are mostly shared so beside overall dps fall and harder times for tanks of all kinds (mostly offtanks tho) thgere should not be issues there.

Firstmep

Yes

kalunte wrote: »

i voted no because it looks like the guys complaining here are skiping the major change coming to major/minor buffs with 6.2.X.

the highest overall performers where classes with easy access to multiple minor/major buffs of any kinds en some will get some 23% dmg nerfs to both mitigation and dmg on their brust phases which is huge.

any class adjusment will have to come after a decent oversight of how this all affects both pve and pvp. even if i dont mind too much about pve because buffs here are mostly shared so beside overall dps fall and harder times for tanks of all kinds (mostly offtanks tho) thgere should not be issues there.

Im sure this is why theyre waiting with class adjustments, so they can see how the meta shapes up with the reworked major/minor buff system.
Too bad we are in the smack middle of a toxic(pun intended) proc meta to muddy the waters.

Jodynn

Yes

We have not done a full pass on class abilities since the SBE system is generally meant to be designed for non-abilities; that said, we will keep a close eye on class functionality in PvE and PvP due to these changes.

Poll is pretty clear it needs to happen.

So ask for parses for PvE in an official thread you'll listen to and I'm damn sure you'll get feedback for people to help their class. I know there is a feedback thread but a FOCUSED thread.

Have to look at best case and worst case, because saying sustain is fine with parse food or as a Breton isn't really speaking truthfully at what we all run or what is viable in actual content.

For PvP it's a bit more dynamic; on live lag is so terrible in cyrodil I meet people, we try to kill each other, we give up because it literally isn't working; so PvP balance is less important personally to me and it's not really easy to tell based from person to person because skill is measuring two ways instead of one.

Koubo

Yes

kalunte wrote: »

any class adjusment will have to come after a decent oversight of how this all affects both pve and pvp. even if i dont mind too much about pve because buffs here are mostly shared so beside overall dps fall and harder times for tanks of all kinds (mostly offtanks tho) thgere should not be issues there.

Some changes was done last patch, we all know now how bad it was, and it was confirmed after it went live. Now we have weeks of *testing* (testing wasent necessary this time tho)
If i agree that some test in real have to be made, some classe's changes are kinda needed NOW because they are the result of a precedent poor patch. . . (looking at BurningLight proc in PvP lul, or backLash poop damage)

katorga

No

I voted no, because there is no way to effectively "rebalance" the classes if ZOS keeps radically changing the game every 3 months. You can't balance against the conditions right now, because they will be totally different in 3 months.

That said, expect the classes to get hammered soon. If Major Berserk is only 10%, expect classes to get their % damage passives hammered below that line. If Major Mending is 10%, expect classes with % healing modifiers to be hammer below that line, and so on.

ManDraKE

Firstmep wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

The changes to minor/major buffs will balance classes a lot. Warden and Necro that have access to pretty much all the buffs in the game will take a hit.

Most of the unbalance come from the meta itself, it benefits some classes to much, and some broken stuff like malacath and such benefit some classes more than others. Imo if you take most of the broken/unbalanced stuff, and the inderect nerfs with the changes to minor/major, classes are not THAT unbalanced

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

This kind of post is precisely why Warden keeps seeing bad, poorly thought out, short-sighted changes that continue to dumpster them in PVE. We get it. You PVPers all hate Wardens. I dig it. Wipe your eyes and chill out for 10 seconds so we can stop sucking in PVE. Please. We're begging.

not really. The thing with wardens in PvP is that they have incredible high healing and mitigation built in to the class, is not about damage. What people complain about wardens in PvP has nothing to do with your PvE parsing, PvP balance is far more complex than just parsing a dummy and checking what class got more damage.

Erm, wardens do have high damage, sub assault does as much dmg as most peoples dawnbreaker, and the class has multiple stacking % dmg increases built in.
If wardens had no damage you couldnt pull off 40k hp builds with like 3.5k weapon damage and still cut people in half.
And yes malacath is a big contributing factor but its not the only thing.

you can say the same for blastbones, spectral bow, power of the light, etc. Subassault combo is fine, warden damage without malacath is fine. The builds your complain are result of malacath basically.

Jodynn

Yes

I know you're probably busy but can we get some clarification on this @ZOS_GinaBruno ?

Any and all news on the situation would help considering some frustrating experiences currently.

MentalxHammer

No

Tbh after major defile gets nerfed, stamcro will be much more balanced, that's the only class that is oppressively strong right now.

To be honest class balance in PvP is the best its ever been.

Firstmep

Yes

ManDraKE wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

The changes to minor/major buffs will balance classes a lot. Warden and Necro that have access to pretty much all the buffs in the game will take a hit.

Most of the unbalance come from the meta itself, it benefits some classes to much, and some broken stuff like malacath and such benefit some classes more than others. Imo if you take most of the broken/unbalanced stuff, and the inderect nerfs with the changes to minor/major, classes are not THAT unbalanced

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

This kind of post is precisely why Warden keeps seeing bad, poorly thought out, short-sighted changes that continue to dumpster them in PVE. We get it. You PVPers all hate Wardens. I dig it. Wipe your eyes and chill out for 10 seconds so we can stop sucking in PVE. Please. We're begging.

not really. The thing with wardens in PvP is that they have incredible high healing and mitigation built in to the class, is not about damage. What people complain about wardens in PvP has nothing to do with your PvE parsing, PvP balance is far more complex than just parsing a dummy and checking what class got more damage.

Erm, wardens do have high damage, sub assault does as much dmg as most peoples dawnbreaker, and the class has multiple stacking % dmg increases built in.
If wardens had no damage you couldnt pull off 40k hp builds with like 3.5k weapon damage and still cut people in half.
And yes malacath is a big contributing factor but its not the only thing.

you can say the same for blastbones, spectral bow, power of the light, etc. Subassault combo is fine, warden damage without malacath is fine. The builds your complain are result of malacath basically.

I'm guessing you don't play Stamplar but power of the light is getting double mitigated again, once the copied damage, once the explosion.
Also look at Templar passives we barely have any good damage passives, they just nerfed burning light to be about half as good as it was in pvp.
Also power of the lights damage is not affected by malacath.
Yes mala is strong Beacuse it enables some stupid tanky specs to do insane dmg, guess what pierce armor will take that to the next level next patch.
And warden just works so well with that sort of setup Beacuse Arctic blast, try playing warden without it and you'll feel the difference.
Templars don't have that choice to build for 40k hp and still dish out high damage, we just don't have the tools.
Also again, power of the light, the copied dmg scales with max stamina only, no dmg modifiers or wpd affect it, unlike sub assault for example.

High_Solar

Yes

Firstmep wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

The changes to minor/major buffs will balance classes a lot. Warden and Necro that have access to pretty much all the buffs in the game will take a hit.

Most of the unbalance come from the meta itself, it benefits some classes to much, and some broken stuff like malacath and such benefit some classes more than others. Imo if you take most of the broken/unbalanced stuff, and the inderect nerfs with the changes to minor/major, classes are not THAT unbalanced

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

This kind of post is precisely why Warden keeps seeing bad, poorly thought out, short-sighted changes that continue to dumpster them in PVE. We get it. You PVPers all hate Wardens. I dig it. Wipe your eyes and chill out for 10 seconds so we can stop sucking in PVE. Please. We're begging.

not really. The thing with wardens in PvP is that they have incredible high healing and mitigation built in to the class, is not about damage. What people complain about wardens in PvP has nothing to do with your PvE parsing, PvP balance is far more complex than just parsing a dummy and checking what class got more damage.

Erm, wardens do have high damage, sub assault does as much dmg as most peoples dawnbreaker, and the class has multiple stacking % dmg increases built in.
If wardens had no damage you couldnt pull off 40k hp builds with like 3.5k weapon damage and still cut people in half.
And yes malacath is a big contributing factor but its not the only thing.

you can say the same for blastbones, spectral bow, power of the light, etc. Subassault combo is fine, warden damage without malacath is fine. The builds your complain are result of malacath basically.

I'm guessing you don't play Stamplar but power of the light is getting double mitigated again, once the copied damage, once the explosion.
Also look at Templar passives we barely have any good damage passives, they just nerfed burning light to be about half as good as it was in pvp.
Also power of the lights damage is not affected by malacath.
Yes mala is strong Beacuse it enables some stupid tanky specs to do insane dmg, guess what pierce armor will take that to the next level next patch.
And warden just works so well with that sort of setup Beacuse Arctic blast, try playing warden without it and you'll feel the difference.
Templars don't have that choice to build for 40k hp and still dish out high damage, we just don't have the tools.
Also again, power of the light, the copied dmg scales with max stamina only, no dmg modifiers or wpd affect it, unlike sub assault for example.

*smiles in stamDK*

ManDraKE

Firstmep wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

ManDraKE wrote: »

The changes to minor/major buffs will balance classes a lot. Warden and Necro that have access to pretty much all the buffs in the game will take a hit.

Most of the unbalance come from the meta itself, it benefits some classes to much, and some broken stuff like malacath and such benefit some classes more than others. Imo if you take most of the broken/unbalanced stuff, and the inderect nerfs with the changes to minor/major, classes are not THAT unbalanced

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

This kind of post is precisely why Warden keeps seeing bad, poorly thought out, short-sighted changes that continue to dumpster them in PVE. We get it. You PVPers all hate Wardens. I dig it. Wipe your eyes and chill out for 10 seconds so we can stop sucking in PVE. Please. We're begging.

not really. The thing with wardens in PvP is that they have incredible high healing and mitigation built in to the class, is not about damage. What people complain about wardens in PvP has nothing to do with your PvE parsing, PvP balance is far more complex than just parsing a dummy and checking what class got more damage.

Erm, wardens do have high damage, sub assault does as much dmg as most peoples dawnbreaker, and the class has multiple stacking % dmg increases built in.
If wardens had no damage you couldnt pull off 40k hp builds with like 3.5k weapon damage and still cut people in half.
And yes malacath is a big contributing factor but its not the only thing.

you can say the same for blastbones, spectral bow, power of the light, etc. Subassault combo is fine, warden damage without malacath is fine. The builds your complain are result of malacath basically.

I'm guessing you don't play Stamplar but power of the light is getting double mitigated again, once the copied damage, once the explosion.
Also look at Templar passives we barely have any good damage passives, they just nerfed burning light to be about half as good as it was in pvp.
Also power of the lights damage is not affected by malacath.
Yes mala is strong Beacuse it enables some stupid tanky specs to do insane dmg, guess what pierce armor will take that to the next level next patch.
And warden just works so well with that sort of setup Beacuse Arctic blast, try playing warden without it and you'll feel the difference.
Templars don't have that choice to build for 40k hp and still dish out high damage, we just don't have the tools.
Also again, power of the light, the copied dmg scales with max stamina only, no dmg modifiers or wpd affect it, unlike sub assault for example.

And how is that related to what i said about subassult not being broken? Seems like you just wanted to rant about templars to someone lol.

idk

This thread would be better placed into a relevant sub-forum as it is not addressing anything on the PTS. I expect Zos weeds through the PTS threads for ones that are relevant. Just a guess.

Berchelous

Yes

Yes. We, dragonknights, need some love please...

llBlack_Heartll

Yes

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

Yes:

• StamDens are too often close to God Mode;

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same build

• no builds should be unbillable and some classes can obtain that - Necros and Wardens

You could only be talking about PvP here.
Warden's in PvE are the worst class, both Stam and mag, although Stam is worse. Necro's i don't have an issue with they play their part. IF anything, buff others classes to Necro.

WreckfulAbandon

Polar Wind Arctic Blast is a little weak, in fact why can't we get some extra buffs thrown on it like Evasion and Expedition?

Burst heal, HoT, PBAoE, stun that goes thru block, increased chance to cause chill, extra resists on bar, and that's all? You call that a skill? I have higher expectations that that, let's make Polar Wind Arctic Blast great again ZOS.

BalticBlues

Yes

Rhaegar75 wrote: »

• MagSorcs are still too powerful as they are able to defend/deal damage/be mobile in the same uild

This is not the topic of the thread, and by your criteria, StamNBs would need the most nerfs.
[If you lose against the "too powerful defense and mobility" of a MagSorc,
try to CC them so their Stam runs out within secs and you can kill them.]

This thread is about the SBE changes affecting some classes more than others.
IMHO it is not a good idea to release such massive changes without attendant class changes.
Not everybody plays all 6 classes to pick the "flavor of the month" with each patch.

x48rph

No

Voting no cause it really doesn't matter. Balance is a myth that will never happen unless all classes are generic. You can't make classes feel unique, have unique playstyles, and still somehow make them all perfectly equal. Not to mention ZOS will never let the game reach a point where all things are balanced anyway. They will keep tweaking, changing, and moving the bar so you got to keep grinding. I'm sure they will continue to release OP pay to win classes every other year as well and then slowly nerf them until it's time for the next one.

AWinterWolf

Yes

MagDK needs either a skill cost reduction, or mag/stam recovery in PASSIVES, at the moment it is just too brutal, I end up choosing 14k health (using witch mother's for the sustain) or 17k+ on pickled fish, but with seriously awful sustain.

I can't comment on stamDK, I don't have one.

KingShocker

Yes

AWinterWolf wrote: »

MagDK needs either a skill cost reduction, or mag/stam recovery in PASSIVES, at the moment it is just too brutal, I end up choosing 14k health (using witch mother's for the sustain) or 17k+ on pickled fish, but with seriously awful sustain.

I can't comment on stamDK, I don't have one.

they have that rss on ult passive from earthen heart tree (forgot the name) but it feels like half of the time that's wasted. If they buffed that passive and instead made it give resources over a short duration I think it would be better.

For example, if your stam/mag was full when you cast an ult you get nothing but if its over a few seconds it would at least help with the cost of the next few skills you cast.