Icereach PC NA (Mulaamnir/Kyne/BWB NA PC - Final... Part 2)

Itsnotarealwar

Part 2?

Beaverton

vamp_emily wrote: »

A tank build where you just stand there would be best. Any other build would cause inflammation of the joints. I think the chances of getting Arthritis from playing eso has increased 1000%. Pushing a button 5 to 10 times for a single skill to go off has to be very painful to your body in the long term. Maybe their "combat" goal was to start selling ESO wristbands ( that prevents arthritis) in the Zenimax store. Maybe?

My years practicing spamming one button is really paying off now.

Stridig

So..... whats new? Lol

MincVinyl

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Anyone out here? Road to 500?

500 what?

vamp_emily

500 = total kills Lumsdenmi would like to get before he moves to vet. Not sure how many kills he has now but he has been trying for 5+ years.

Lumsdenml

Itsnotarealwar wrote: »

Part 2?

Yeah.... part 1 got the ban hammer after 520 or so pages...

Lumsdenml

MincVinyl wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Anyone out here? Road to 500?

500 what?

pages, like the previous thread

Lumsdenml

vamp_emily wrote: »

500 = total kills Lumsdenmi would like to get before he moves to vet. Not sure how many kills he has now but he has been trying for 5+ years.

I measure my kills in kpm... kills per month. I am averaging about 1.65 atm... so since I came into cyrodiil on 7/2015 I am closing in on my 100th kill. So I have a ways to go before I can move on...

MincVinyl

Lumsdenml wrote: »

MincVinyl wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Anyone out here? Road to 500?

500 what?

pages, like the previous thread

Too bad we can't just set up a waiver, enter this thread at your own risk. It really gets annoying when you see threads with a zos logo, you hope there was some contribution from zos to the thread, but it ends up being a mod.

Lumsdenml

MincVinyl wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

MincVinyl wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Anyone out here? Road to 500?

500 what?

pages, like the previous thread

Too bad we can't just set up a waiver, enter this thread at your own risk. It really gets annoying when you see threads with a zos logo, you hope there was some contribution from zos to the thread, but it ends up being a mod.

Well, to be fair, there were multiple times throughout that 500+ page thread where they could have shut it down, but chose to keep it open because of the community. I think the last time they didn't see the community present in the thread anymore and just killed it.

That being said, I am kinda surprised that a community thread that last that long and was that prolific didn't have one person from zos comment even once who wasn't slapping us on the wrist.

But, I suppose they are busy people.

MincVinyl

Seeing lowbie in the state that it is in now is kinda sad, I remember when it was as active as any other campaign. The pvp is so hit or miss now that I feel we are losing newer players too easily.

Lumsdenml

MincVinyl wrote: »

Seeing lowbie in the state that it is in now is kinda sad, I remember when it was as active as any other campaign. The pvp is so hit or miss now that I feel we are losing newer players too easily.

Were you in about 6 months ago? I think that was the low point. It feels like there are 3x more players in now comparied to then...

MincVinyl

Lumsdenml wrote: »

MincVinyl wrote: »

Seeing lowbie in the state that it is in now is kinda sad, I remember when it was as active as any other campaign. The pvp is so hit or miss now that I feel we are losing newer players too easily.

Were you in about 6 months ago? I think that was the low point. It feels like there are 3x more players in now comparied to then...

I come and go, but years ago lowbie used to be close to pop lock at all times. It has actually bothered me for the past 2 or so years the pop has dropped heavily. I believe we are losing player retention due to the scoreboard/scrolls/emp mechanics.

4-6 years ago the campaign used to be near pop locked most of the time. Having a balanced population most of the time let the map stay relatively balanced. At any given moment there would be two or three large guild groups running on each team.

Back 2-3 years ago the one thing that killed pvp for a few hours would be when one guild would run a multigroup raid through lowbie and just flip the map against pugs. Players on both sides would end up logging out for the night and almost instantly after the actual combat would slow down. Obviously this is unhealthy in the long run, where some nights where little to no pvp is happening.(by pvp i mean player versus player combat....not farming keeps)

More recently after this continued now we have reached the point where instead of the map being evened out within a few hours, now it is stretching to the next day or night. Pug retention is normally highest when the fighting is between emp ring keeps.

---

Now what I would say causes one faction to hold the map for so long is either due to the veteran players who just don't care. Or Emps who just stay logged in for hours without giving up the opposite emp keeps. Also, the bonuses given to the faction for holding things like keeps/scrolls/emp. These bonuses make it so that after the vet players, who may be defending a fully flipped map, end up logging, but they left the map to their buffed pugs vs enemy pugs. On top of that their buffed pugs already have keeps, so all they need to do is defend. In general I would say it is much easier for random players to defend a location than to try to coordinate where to attack.

---

Self control is a hard thing, but ideally the vet guilds that still run in lowbie could set up a sort of "prime time" where in a certain time frame that is when they run their groups and push the map. In the off hours everything would be left up to the pugs, in this time the vet players would have to restrain themselves to only doing things like open field fights and resource/tower farms.

Having more players actively playing on all factions would also help. Even if a guild swapped to the losing faction every hour or two there would be a noticeable difference in newer player activity throughout a week. The goal would be to try to keep the fighting between the emp keeps artificially so newer players never think they are "losing" and log out because of it.

gabriebe

I mean, I told AD a long time ago that it was really unhealthy to have guilds (even small guilds of like 6-8 people) camping keeps in the mornings and that it would kill the campaign. And surprise! It did. Nobody likes to log in, ride from the gate to the first keep, and get oil immediately dumped on them when they finally managed to get a whole 3 people grouped to set up a ram. It was a problem repeatedly with AD, with multiple guilds.

Nightcap or emp farming isn't anything new in this campaign, but most organized groups on EP or DC would basically leave some time for the map refresh before hopping back. Usually when they were down to the last 2-3 emp keeps.

I've stopped playing in the campaign for a while now, but yeah those were the main issues. It was fine when I had the time and schedule to be able to organize pugs and have fun fights, but without patting myself too much on the back, it's not easy to do and it requires a lot of persistence, strategy and connections to pull it off successfully when you're outnumbered like that every single day.

The hard truth is there's just nobody left to care much. On top of the unsatisfying PvP in the campaign, I couldn't find it within me to find the motivation to do the very unsatisfying grind to get a character with all the tools I wanted, to only abandon it 20 levels or so later. It also felt like I'd holding back some potentially good players out of the rest of the game by making them stay in the lowbie campaign as their main pvp outlet. It's also an extremely demotivating thing for a newbie player to be told they'd need to grind Dawnbreaker/MagesGuild/Psijic and special arena or trial weapons to even start competing with some of the better players in the campaign. The reason why 'pug retention' is so low is they realize pretty quickly they're fodder for your amusement.

MincVinyl

What is worse is that lowbie is the only working campaign. Sure you can go to the main and run around at 900ms most of the night, but at that point it is more fun to hang out with people and wait for that one good fight per night in lowbie.

Beaverton

Played for three hours last night in a group of three. Had many great fights. Tried to avoid the giant EP zerg most of the night but even getting rolled by them was pretty fun cause I was with good friends.

Amazing that even fighting against 40+ players, the same two killed me almost every time last night.

Better to tell new players not to try to be "competitive" with the twinks. All that does is perpetuate the style. Get decent gear, play the game, learn the class, contribute to your team. If you really want to be "competitive" grind to 160 and jump in vet.

MincVinyl

I highly disagree that it takes vet dungeon gear to be competitive in lowbie. Unless you want to do some crazy theory crafted *** there isn't any reason to get a dungeon set. You actually get less stats from zone/dungeon sets due to how scaling works. The hardest thing that new players can't immediately compete with would be 5-6 years of knowledge and refined use of mechanics. At that point it is up to them to practice and find a good teacher if they want to advance.

gabriebe

Yeah, it doesn't take vet gear dungeon to be competitive in lowbie. Which is why you've farmed them all already lol. I may not play in lowbie anymore but know plenty who still do, and they can all recognize what a BRP resto or dual wield looks like.

Like... come on.

Enkil

Under-50 is just not conducive to new players. There are too many vets/twinks that would rather farm them, than take the time to educate and gear them (only to have to them disappear a week or 2 later). It's bad game design. So many flaws (that might have been passable on other campaigns) exacerbated issues on lowbie. Why can't tutorial provide them a basic PvP set every few levels or something??? Winners get the buffs that affect combat making power imbalance worse. AvA is inherently flawed and this is the outcome. Just imagine if ESO had been a Guild v Guild game...

Sadly, even the community which was the redeeming grace seems to have shriveled up. The under-50 players are largely just @names with very few having strong loyalty to a certain faction at this point. Few guilds are welcoming and helping the influx of newbs that the game is seeing ironically. It was fun while it lasted. They should probably merge under-50 with no-CP. If they do, it will probably be months later than the time it should have occurred as with anything Zo$ does.

This might be the only campaign with no lag so it's very sad that it's not been playable anytime I've tried.

MincVinyl

gabriebe wrote: »

Yeah, it doesn't take vet gear dungeon to be competitive in lowbie. Which is why you've farmed them all already lol. I may not play in lowbie anymore but know plenty who still do, and they can all recognize what a BRP resto or dual wield looks like.

Like... come on.

Again you lose aspects of a build to even use those, for instance the brp resto means you cant run rapid regen due to how scaling works your spell damage is less than what it would be with a crafted set.

brpdw can easily be replaced with s&b which means you do not need to level that weapon skill line at all, allowing you to get passives from more of your class trees or your other weapon. If they wanted to go a step further they could just get potentates from vlas and the trade off is near identical, probably easier for new players anyways. Again if you run brpdw you are not able to have any damage or healing on that bar due to inefficiencies+ you would have to level dw instead of just going with class trees or your main weapon.

---

In terms of FG/mages/psijic there are plenty of replacements, none of these are needed unless you want something specific, like on stamsorc you have no ultimates so you either have to use 2h ult or dbos which are an equal trade off. 2h you have to level anyways so i suppose it is more efficient, but all up to if the person wants to do a 5.5hour farm. Meteor is unnecessary, it is nearly equivalent and actually easier to get destro ult(10 bookshelves) or a class ult. Psijic again is not necessary at all, Rat can be traded with other sources available to most classes.

Lumsdenml

Wow... Cyrodiil performance has been really bad lately. I haven't been in there since the most recent patch (Yesterday) but was on Friday and any encounter dropped my FPS to 10-15. I am usually in Cyrodiil on my laptop, which is not a gaming beast by any stretch of the imagination, but on high graphics I usually get around 30fps. Larger encounters sometimes pushes it down to 26 or 27, but rarely. But Friday, any combat tanked my FPS to between 10-15. I even dropped my graphics down to low and it made no difference.

MincVinyl

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Wow... Cyrodiil performance has been really bad lately. I haven't been in there since the most recent patch (Yesterday) but was on Friday and any encounter dropped my FPS to 10-15. I am usually in Cyrodiil on my laptop, which is not a gaming beast by any stretch of the imagination, but on high graphics I usually get around 30fps. Larger encounters sometimes pushes it down to 26 or 27, but rarely. But Friday, any combat tanked my FPS to between 10-15. I even dropped my graphics down to low and it made no difference.

Could be a memory leak, actually that is usually what it is. A lot of people have to restart their games regularly. You can looking up solutions, people will most likely recommend re downloading the game or reinstalling only the necessary addons. If you have the non steam version make sure steam is fully closed and not running on your computer. Also having a lot of extensions on your chrome browser can add to fps drops.

Alchimiste1

MincVinyl wrote: »

gabriebe wrote: »

Yeah, it doesn't take vet gear dungeon to be competitive in lowbie. Which is why you've farmed them all already lol. I may not play in lowbie anymore but know plenty who still do, and they can all recognize what a BRP resto or dual wield looks like.

Like... come on.

Again you lose aspects of a build to even use those, for instance the brp resto means you cant run rapid regen due to how scaling works your spell damage is less than what it would be with a crafted set.

brpdw can easily be replaced with s&b which means you do not need to level that weapon skill line at all, allowing you to get passives from more of your class trees or your other weapon. If they wanted to go a step further they could just get potentates from vlas and the trade off is near identical, probably easier for new players anyways. Again if you run brpdw you are not able to have any damage or healing on that bar due to inefficiencies+ you would have to level dw instead of just going with class trees or your main weapon.

---

In terms of FG/mages/psijic there are plenty of replacements, none of these are needed unless you want something specific, like on stamsorc you have no ultimates so you either have to use 2h ult or dbos which are an equal trade off. 2h you have to level anyways so i suppose it is more efficient, but all up to if the person wants to do a 5.5hour farm. Meteor is unnecessary, it is nearly equivalent and actually easier to get destro ult(10 bookshelves) or a class ult. Psijic again is not necessary at all, Rat can be traded with other sources available to most classes.

I think you got it backwards, in order for snb to be good you actually need to have it leveled quite high, and it’s best ability is it’s ultimate which you won’t get in u50. In comparison if you are using brp dual wield you only need like what lvl 14 or something for quick cloak. Plus heavy works great in u50 so it gives you evasion too. No crafted set is going to compete with brp dual wield or resto with ward ally(on a healer build).


not the most new player friendly campaign imo. Except maybe on mayhem events

Lumsdenml

MincVinyl wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Wow... Cyrodiil performance has been really bad lately. I haven't been in there since the most recent patch (Yesterday) but was on Friday and any encounter dropped my FPS to 10-15. I am usually in Cyrodiil on my laptop, which is not a gaming beast by any stretch of the imagination, but on high graphics I usually get around 30fps. Larger encounters sometimes pushes it down to 26 or 27, but rarely. But Friday, any combat tanked my FPS to between 10-15. I even dropped my graphics down to low and it made no difference.

Could be a memory leak, actually that is usually what it is. A lot of people have to restart their games regularly. You can looking up solutions, people will most likely recommend re downloading the game or reinstalling only the necessary addons. If you have the non steam version make sure steam is fully closed and not running on your computer. Also having a lot of extensions on your chrome browser can add to fps drops.

Good advice, thanks. I've already removed most add-ons from those in Cyrodiil, also shut down other programs from launching at boot.... maybe a full wipe of the game is necessary... heck, might just wipe the whole drive and fresh install it all!

Beaverton

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Wow... Cyrodiil performance has been really bad lately. I haven't been in there since the most recent patch (Yesterday) but was on Friday and any encounter dropped my FPS to 10-15. I am usually in Cyrodiil on my laptop, which is not a gaming beast by any stretch of the imagination, but on high graphics I usually get around 30fps. Larger encounters sometimes pushes it down to 26 or 27, but rarely. But Friday, any combat tanked my FPS to between 10-15. I even dropped my graphics down to low and it made no difference.

It was horrible last night. Not Greyhost horrible but almost. 5-10 second position and health desyncs, bad lag in big fights. Ironically it seemed to help my survivability in big fights as I was rarely where people thought I was.

Lumsdenml

Beaverton wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Wow... Cyrodiil performance has been really bad lately. I haven't been in there since the most recent patch (Yesterday) but was on Friday and any encounter dropped my FPS to 10-15. I am usually in Cyrodiil on my laptop, which is not a gaming beast by any stretch of the imagination, but on high graphics I usually get around 30fps. Larger encounters sometimes pushes it down to 26 or 27, but rarely. But Friday, any combat tanked my FPS to between 10-15. I even dropped my graphics down to low and it made no difference.

It was horrible last night. Not Greyhost horrible but almost. 5-10 second position and health desyncs, bad lag in big fights. Ironically it seemed to help my survivability in big fights as I was rarely where people thought I was.

Ha ha.. yeah, suddenly I'm now a good player!

MincVinyl

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

MincVinyl wrote: »

gabriebe wrote: »

Yeah, it doesn't take vet gear dungeon to be competitive in lowbie. Which is why you've farmed them all already lol. I may not play in lowbie anymore but know plenty who still do, and they can all recognize what a BRP resto or dual wield looks like.

Like... come on.

Again you lose aspects of a build to even use those, for instance the brp resto means you cant run rapid regen due to how scaling works your spell damage is less than what it would be with a crafted set.

brpdw can easily be replaced with s&b which means you do not need to level that weapon skill line at all, allowing you to get passives from more of your class trees or your other weapon. If they wanted to go a step further they could just get potentates from vlas and the trade off is near identical, probably easier for new players anyways. Again if you run brpdw you are not able to have any damage or healing on that bar due to inefficiencies+ you would have to level dw instead of just going with class trees or your main weapon.

---

In terms of FG/mages/psijic there are plenty of replacements, none of these are needed unless you want something specific, like on stamsorc you have no ultimates so you either have to use 2h ult or dbos which are an equal trade off. 2h you have to level anyways so i suppose it is more efficient, but all up to if the person wants to do a 5.5hour farm. Meteor is unnecessary, it is nearly equivalent and actually easier to get destro ult(10 bookshelves) or a class ult. Psijic again is not necessary at all, Rat can be traded with other sources available to most classes.

I think you got it backwards, in order for snb to be good you actually need to have it leveled quite high, and it’s best ability is it’s ultimate which you won’t get in u50. In comparison if you are using brp dual wield you only need like what lvl 14 or something for quick cloak. Plus heavy works great in u50 so it gives you evasion too. No crafted set is going to compete with brp dual wield or resto with ward ally(on a healer build).


not the most new player friendly campaign imo. Except maybe on mayhem events

Idk without really putting any xp into it you have access to major fracture(8%damage) and minor prot(8%mit) 100% uptime on a 1k cost. That alone compares to next patches brpdw. Then getting the block cost reduction and mit passives is really all you need for a simple defensive bar especially in lowbie with no cp to help you. Yes someone who is much better at the game can do more things with brpdw, but for newer players id say simply going s&b is a very viable option.

Beaverton wrote: »

Lumsdenml wrote: »

Wow... Cyrodiil performance has been really bad lately. I haven't been in there since the most recent patch (Yesterday) but was on Friday and any encounter dropped my FPS to 10-15. I am usually in Cyrodiil on my laptop, which is not a gaming beast by any stretch of the imagination, but on high graphics I usually get around 30fps. Larger encounters sometimes pushes it down to 26 or 27, but rarely. But Friday, any combat tanked my FPS to between 10-15. I even dropped my graphics down to low and it made no difference.

It was horrible last night. Not Greyhost horrible but almost. 5-10 second position and health desyncs, bad lag in big fights. Ironically it seemed to help my survivability in big fights as I was rarely where people thought I was.

I think this might be on your end, server played fine. I'm in new england btw

Alchimiste1

@MincVinyl you're comparing 8% damage mit to 30 percent damage mit on brp dual wield on top of a potential 25% from evasion. It might be comparable if you had high lvl snb so you could block more but , that's unlikely to be the case. On top of it you can get major expedition. major fracture is good but some classes already have access to it and even then I don't think it provides more than brp.

MincVinyl

Alchimiste1 wrote: »

@MincVinyl you're comparing 8% damage mit to 30 percent damage mit on brp dual wield on top of a potential 25% from evasion. It might be comparable if you had high lvl snb so you could block more but , that's unlikely to be the case. On top of it you can get major expedition. major fracture is good but some classes already have access to it and even then I don't think it provides more than brp.

right, but for a newer player the constant uptime will be better along with the low cost and simple block to stay alive. Is it bis on a player that has played the game for 6 years sure, but on a newer player no. Once brpdw gets put down to a 10% mit there will be little difference.

Enkil

This back and forth above is PRECISELY WHY game is not inviting to new players..... i'm sure new players are gonna get into all this nonsense bout leveling a skill to 50 and ***? GET REAL!!! They need BASICS like gear that is close their level and a matching set. You are both WAY OUT OF TOUCH! Is this the mindset you think they have while u both farm them relentlessly day in and out? Players on under-50 nowadays just serve as cattle to be farmed by twinks. PATHETIC!!! Even no-CP is WAY MORE INVITING! SMH