Ri'Atahrashi.... is this suppose to be some kind of a sick joke?

spartaxoxo

Canned_Apples wrote: »

this is hardly "harder content," and it's a zone boss, not a dragon- so why should it not be challenging?

the problem is the larger community ignores the mechanics and treats every enemy like a punching bag. -it's why dlc dungeons are such a challenge for most players.

i don't fully understand this boss' mechanics, but i've done it with three other people that were standing around there. -it's doable- you just can treat it like your standard punching bag.

New and casual players already can't do most of the rewarding new content. I don't see why some zone boss most people will only kill once or twice needs to be some raid level difficulty as well. I can't play it yet but if it's jow people are describing that's seriously messed up.

Zone content should be soloable because Zones don't stay populated and it's the content aimed at casual players. At least they should be defeatable with just a couple of people.

Korah_Eaglecry

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Follow what mechanics?

Are you reading the same thread as the rest of us or do you just have a bunch of canned responses in your file cabinet you like to pull out in these types of discussions?


So far all you've done is passive aggressively tell people theyre bad at the game and in a drawn out way told people to L2P.

Davadin

Jhalin wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Brute forcing is by far the most effective and simplest strategy for this boss, which is the issue due to how stupidly unclear and unworkable any of the mechanics are.

And no one has explained the boss. We’ve heard “spam dodge roll” which is stupid. “Spam timestop” which is stupid AND requires a paid skill line. There’s been advice to interrupt the adds but if you do any damage to them you get one-shot no matter your health as we learned from the DK inhale attempt posted a ways back. If you’re melee you can’t participate at all hardly, god forbid someone tap an add and immediately get you slaughtered with no notice.

no. just... no........

brute force is the messiest strategy.

one guy aggro ALL the adds. do NOT AoE them, do not kill them, just taunt all, dodge roll the fireballs, and 2-3 DPS pull the boss away from the adds and melt him down.

notice the red circles on the adds? if they overlap, their damage multiplies. and they reflect AoE attack more because their "reflect area" seems to be the whole circle, not just themselves.

a melee of 3 people can do this boss. i tried with a guildie 3AM EST (coz i got a 2months old baby, go figure) last night PC NA and it's doable.

Arciris

The main issue is when they design fights that go against the basic combat principles of the game.

In this game, AOE attacks are not reflectable, only projectiles are. AOE is actually the counter to reflect

Design fights that go against basic fight mechanics does nothing to teach new players about the mechanics of the game,
It only serves to confuse people and creates bad PvP players that will come to the forum crying nerf! to stuff because they don't understand how the game works.

starkerealm

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Follow what mechanics?

Are you reading the same thread as the rest of us or do you just have a bunch of canned responses in your file cabinet you like to pull out in these types of discussions?


So far all you've done is passive aggressively tell people theyre bad at the game and in a drawn out way told people to L2P.

I'm reading the thread. There's two categories of responses. People saying, "yes, this can be done, these are the mechanics," and offering multiple potential solutions. And people crying because it's too hard, they don't want a challenge, and they should be able to "brute force" the boss.

Of the two groups, the latter are pushing some downright hilarious narratives about how impossible it is. Which, you know, I'd grant a lot more credence if I didn't know it was, in fact, possible to clear the boss.

ZOS_RogerJ

Greetings! We've removed some comments from this thread. Please keep the thread on-topic, constructive and civil.

Jhalin

Davadin wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Brute forcing is by far the most effective and simplest strategy for this boss, which is the issue due to how stupidly unclear and unworkable any of the mechanics are.

And no one has explained the boss. We’ve heard “spam dodge roll” which is stupid. “Spam timestop” which is stupid AND requires a paid skill line. There’s been advice to interrupt the adds but if you do any damage to them you get one-shot no matter your health as we learned from the DK inhale attempt posted a ways back. If you’re melee you can’t participate at all hardly, god forbid someone tap an add and immediately get you slaughtered with no notice.

no. just... no........

brute force is the messiest strategy.

one guy aggro ALL the adds. do NOT AoE them, do not kill them, just taunt all, dodge roll the fireballs, and 2-3 DPS pull the boss away from the adds and melt him down.

notice the red circles on the adds? if they overlap, their damage multiplies. and they reflect AoE attack more because their "reflect area" seems to be the whole circle, not just themselves.

a melee of 3 people can do this boss. i tried with a guildie 3AM EST (coz i got a 2months old baby, go figure) last night PC NA and it's doable.

At least you provide feedback that can be used. But having the primary strategy be “dodge roll until the big boss is dead” is expectedly idiotically bad design, could a magicka character dodge roll as much as they need to for the boss to die before they do? How do you pull adds away from overlapping and empowering each other if any damage results in a flash-bang of Fire?

starkerealm

Jhalin wrote: »

No one has provided mechanics

Literally, the second post in the thread started explaining mechanics.

Witar

Jeremy wrote: »

Witar wrote: »

Their kung fu is definitly strong. I actually like this boss wish there were more like him cause it's challenging at last.

Well he's all your's. You can have fun wiping over and over to him and enjoy your "challenge". I'll go fight bosses who don't just kill me out of the blue through no fault of my own and with no way to prevent it, short of carrying around enough players with me to serve as fodder to keep the fight from resetting while they die and get back up again.

Well it is your fault kinda. He don't like dots, don't use them and everything will be ok

Jeremy

Witar wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Witar wrote: »

Their kung fu is definitly strong. I actually like this boss wish there were more like him cause it's challenging at last.

Well he's all your's. You can have fun wiping over and over to him and enjoy your "challenge". I'll go fight bosses who don't just kill me out of the blue through no fault of my own and with no way to prevent it, short of carrying around enough players with me to serve as fodder to keep the fight from resetting while they die and get back up again.

Well it is your fault kinda. He don't like dots, don't use them and everything will be ok

So let's see..

First it was don't AoE the adds.

Then it was kill one add a time by one-shotting them.

Then we are suppose to keep dodge rolling around to avoid it, or keep them stunned using werewolf and Psijic abilities.

But yet wait, then it's suppose to be reflected damage.

Never mind, according to you it's our fault because we are using dots, they don't like dots. Or maybe it happens when we scratch our butts.

If the defenders of this boss have made anything clear in this thread, it's that they are just as confused as everyone else is when it comes to the so-called "mechanics" surrounding this stupid move. So thank you for proving (though accidentally) the point I made in my OP.

Jeremy wrote: »

If you are going to make moves that just instantly kill people - they need to be well-telegraphed and understood. Not instant moves that seem to come out of nowhere and flood my screen with debuffs and death.

And I stand by that statement and will continue to stand by it even after (or if) you and others do manage to finally figure out what causes this silly move to activate and obliterate people. Because it's bad design regardless.

Decimus

First world boss that can't be solo'd eyes closed on a naked character and... people want to nerf it. What a surprise /sigh

Jeremy

Decimus wrote: »

First world boss that can't be solo'd eyes closed on a naked character and... people want to nerf it. What a surprise /sigh

If you want to make a boss difficult to solo it can be done without giving them some cheap move that just instantly kills you.

As I already explained: other MMORPGs figured this out a long time ago. You make the boss do enough damage to where you need a defensive character (a tank) to take the brunt along with healing magic to recover from the damage (a healer). Then give them enough defense and health to where you actually need offensive characters (damage dealers) to reasonably kill it. And whala! you have a boss that can't be soloed, or at least not reasonably so.

Try to solo a dragon with your eyes closed and naked. It won't go well. And I'm not calling for Dragons to be nerfed now am I? Nope. In fact I have praised the design of dragons. So your argument that I am criticizing this boss simply because it can't be soloed blind and naked isn't an accurate characterization. It's their cheesy and moronic fire move of instant death I have a problem with.

Decimus

Jeremy wrote: »

Decimus wrote: »

First world boss that can't be solo'd eyes closed on a naked character and... people want to nerf it. What a surprise /sigh

If you want to make a boss difficult to solo it can be done without giving them some cheap move that just instantly kills you.

As I already explained: other MMORPGs figured this out a long time ago. You make the boss do enough damage to where you need a defensive character (a tank) to take the brunt along with healing magic to recover from the damage (a healer). Then give them enough defense and health to where you actually need offensive characters (damage dealers) to reasonably kill it. And whala! you have a boss that can't be soloed, or at least not reasonably so.

Try to solo a dragon with your eyes closed and naked. It won't go well. And I'm not calling for Dragons to be nerfed now am I? Nope. In fact I have praised the design of dragons. So your argument that I am criticizing this boss simply because it can't be soloed blind and naked isn't an accurate characterization. It's their cheesy and moronic fire move of instant death I have a problem with.

Well, one could argue this boss does enough damage "where you need a defensive character to take the brunt", quoting your words. The main reason for that is the frequency of those add attacks, which makes it very, very difficult to sustain your stamina if you tried to dodge roll the mechanic each time (which is the main reason why pretty much everything in this game is soloable btw).

Still, I'm pretty convinced the boss is not impossible to solo & is a welcome step up from the usual world boss difficulty.


Giving bosses enough defense and health doesn't cut it, that just means it just takes longer to kill one (easy to achieve infinite sustain in this game). Giving them heal over time abilities that outheal damage from a single DD could work though.

On top of that, world bosses across the board need more undodgeable mechanics that require X health/mitigation to survive if ZOS ever wants them to pose sufficient challenge.


Dragons aren't even that difficult btw (hardest part is not having other people interfere in your solo attempts lol), you just need to tap block/dodge the mechanics. Not the easiest things out there but far from the more difficult things like vDLC hardmodes or even some non DLC hardmode solos (Sewers 1 for example is more difficult).


...and tbh it's not just world bosses - the lack of any kind of difficulty in 99% of the content in game has been one of the major complaints from a lot of the player base.

It's also a waste of money from ZOS's part. For example: why even record dialogue for your quest mobs and bosses if they're dead before they can deliver it?

Sorry, going off on a tangent a bit here - it just... disappoints me when people complain about something being difficult when vast, vast majority content is in fact way too easy

Jeremy

Decimus wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Decimus wrote: »

First world boss that can't be solo'd eyes closed on a naked character and... people want to nerf it. What a surprise /sigh

If you want to make a boss difficult to solo it can be done without giving them some cheap move that just instantly kills you.

As I already explained: other MMORPGs figured this out a long time ago. You make the boss do enough damage to where you need a defensive character (a tank) to take the brunt along with healing magic to recover from the damage (a healer). Then give them enough defense and health to where you actually need offensive characters (damage dealers) to reasonably kill it. And whala! you have a boss that can't be soloed, or at least not reasonably so.

Try to solo a dragon with your eyes closed and naked. It won't go well. And I'm not calling for Dragons to be nerfed now am I? Nope. In fact I have praised the design of dragons. So your argument that I am criticizing this boss simply because it can't be soloed blind and naked isn't an accurate characterization. It's their cheesy and moronic fire move of instant death I have a problem with.

Well, one could argue this boss does enough damage "where you need a defensive character to take the brunt", quoting your words. The main reason for that is the frequency of those add attacks, which makes it very, very difficult to sustain your stamina if you tried to dodge roll the mechanic each time (which is the main reason why pretty much everything in this game is soloable btw).

Still, I'm pretty convinced the boss is not impossible to solo & is a welcome step up from the usual world boss difficulty.


Giving bosses enough defense and health doesn't cut it, that just means it just takes longer to kill one (easy to achieve infinite sustain in this game). Giving them heal over time abilities that outheal damage from a single DD could work though.

On top of that, world bosses across the board need more undodgeable mechanics that require X health/mitigation to survive if ZOS ever wants them to pose sufficient challenge.


Dragons aren't even that difficult btw (hardest part is not having other people interfere in your solo attempts lol), you just need to tap block/dodge the mechanics. Not the easiest things out there but far from the more difficult things like vDLC hardmodes or even some non DLC hardmode solos (Sewers 1 for example is more difficult).

To your first point - no one couldn't argue that - at least not effectively, because the move burns down defensive characters just as well. It slaughters even my 50k health 30k resistance character in a blink of an eye.

As to your second point, and as I tried to explain in my response - whether or not it can be soloed is irrelevant to me. It's the cheesiness of it's instant death move that I am criticizing. I would think the same of this fight whether it was soloable or not.

Lastly, I said to give bosses enough defense/health as well as enough damage to where it requires a defensive character to take the brunt of the damage so that tanks and healers would be required (or at least preferred). I also never said Dragons were the hardest content in the game. I was just using them as examples of World Bosses who were not easy to solo (and they aren't). You do not need to give World Bosses cheesy instant death moves to make them difficult to solo. And if you don't think Dragons are hard to solo, then let's meet up and you can show me how it's done. I want to watch. I would also question whether or not Wayrest Sewers 1 is more difficult than a Dragon. The last boss on Wayrest Veteran Sewers 1 (even on hardmode) can barely even get through my tank's magic shield. Dragons and their add phases are far more of a threat to him than she ever is.

The only reason Dragons appear so easy is that people overwhelm them with numbers (which is what they do to this World Boss too btw). So I'll never understand why people keep suggesting dragons are too easy while saying this boss is somehow so much harder. Because he's really not. A small group of players can burn him down in seconds (much faster than they could a Dragon). The only difference is some of them are more likely to die during the process due to some cheesy OP move. Just killing players out of the blue with some silly mechanic doesn't make a fight more challenging. I would argue it just makes it more dumb.

Davadin

Jhalin wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Brute forcing is by far the most effective and simplest strategy for this boss, which is the issue due to how stupidly unclear and unworkable any of the mechanics are.

And no one has explained the boss. We’ve heard “spam dodge roll” which is stupid. “Spam timestop” which is stupid AND requires a paid skill line. There’s been advice to interrupt the adds but if you do any damage to them you get one-shot no matter your health as we learned from the DK inhale attempt posted a ways back. If you’re melee you can’t participate at all hardly, god forbid someone tap an add and immediately get you slaughtered with no notice.

no. just... no........

brute force is the messiest strategy.

one guy aggro ALL the adds. do NOT AoE them, do not kill them, just taunt all, dodge roll the fireballs, and 2-3 DPS pull the boss away from the adds and melt him down.

notice the red circles on the adds? if they overlap, their damage multiplies. and they reflect AoE attack more because their "reflect area" seems to be the whole circle, not just themselves.

a melee of 3 people can do this boss. i tried with a guildie 3AM EST (coz i got a 2months old baby, go figure) last night PC NA and it's doable.

At least you provide feedback that can be used. But having the primary strategy be “dodge roll until the big boss is dead” is expectedly idiotically bad design, could a magicka character dodge roll as much as they need to for the boss to die before they do? How do you pull adds away from overlapping and empowering each other if any damage results in a flash-bang of Fire?

they're world bosses. they're not meant to be solo'd.

magcika players should bring a beefy stamina player (S). The easiest is to bring a couple player, assigned with pulling 1 add to separate directions.

i pulled all the adds and it's super tough because they overlap and start nuking me... that's when SnB ultimate and being a tank DK helps.... fossilize 1 or 2, and at least they won't quadru-overlap....

Davadin

Jeremy wrote: »

Just killing players out of the blue with some silly mechanic doesn't make a fight more challenging. I would argue it just makes it more dumb.

a.k.a. this mechanic is too hard for me.


are u ignoring my posts now? I told u the mechanics already. its not about dodge-rolling, but dodging will help, yes.

PS: even dragons don't have instant 1-shot, so given enough time, if u stay away from the red circles and adds, u will burn it down eventually. dragons are disappointing.

PPS: have u tried vMA?

Jeremy

Davadin wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Just killing players out of the blue with some silly mechanic doesn't make a fight more challenging. I would argue it just makes it more dumb.

a.k.a. this mechanic is too hard for me.


are u ignoring my posts now? I told u the mechanics already. its not about dodge-rolling, but dodging will help, yes.

PS: even dragons don't have instant 1-shot, so given enough time, if u stay away from the red circles and adds, u will burn it down eventually. dragons are disappointing.

PPS: have u tried vMA?

Are you ignoring the posts would be the better question.

Because so far this so-called "mechanic" has involved not AoEing the adds, one-shotting the adds, dodge rolling or stunning the adds, not doing lots of damage to them because it is reflected damage, not to use DoTs... then there was my personal favorite, which is to have more than 12k health...

So if this thread has made anything clear it's that people are more confused about this fight's so-called "mechanics" then they are quantum mechanics. The point was and still is moves that instantly kill you should be well-telegraphed and understood - not cryptic devices that come out of no where with the force of a nuclear bomb to kill you. That is a lazy and inept approach to so-called "challenge".

And yes, I have done VMA and I'm not a big fan of that either. Trial and error gimmicks that instantly kill you are not good boss design. And dragons are a million times better than this moronic boss.

Jeremy

Davadin wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Brute forcing is by far the most effective and simplest strategy for this boss, which is the issue due to how stupidly unclear and unworkable any of the mechanics are.

And no one has explained the boss. We’ve heard “spam dodge roll” which is stupid. “Spam timestop” which is stupid AND requires a paid skill line. There’s been advice to interrupt the adds but if you do any damage to them you get one-shot no matter your health as we learned from the DK inhale attempt posted a ways back. If you’re melee you can’t participate at all hardly, god forbid someone tap an add and immediately get you slaughtered with no notice.

no. just... no........

brute force is the messiest strategy.

one guy aggro ALL the adds. do NOT AoE them, do not kill them, just taunt all, dodge roll the fireballs, and 2-3 DPS pull the boss away from the adds and melt him down.

notice the red circles on the adds? if they overlap, their damage multiplies. and they reflect AoE attack more because their "reflect area" seems to be the whole circle, not just themselves.

a melee of 3 people can do this boss. i tried with a guildie 3AM EST (coz i got a 2months old baby, go figure) last night PC NA and it's doable.

At least you provide feedback that can be used. But having the primary strategy be “dodge roll until the big boss is dead” is expectedly idiotically bad design, could a magicka character dodge roll as much as they need to for the boss to die before they do? How do you pull adds away from overlapping and empowering each other if any damage results in a flash-bang of Fire?

they're world bosses. they're not meant to be solo'd.

magcika players should bring a beefy stamina player (S). The easiest is to bring a couple player, assigned with pulling 1 add to separate directions.

i pulled all the adds and it's super tough because they overlap and start nuking me... that's when SnB ultimate and being a tank DK helps.... fossilize 1 or 2, and at least they won't quadru-overlap....

So in order to avoid being instantly burned to a crisp players have to bring several stamina-based characters to pull each add separately and into different directions and then roll around the room with them.

Sorry, but that is easily one of the dumbest "mechanics" I've encountered on this game. God forbid players are using any gear that automatically triggers AoE effects or attacks that might hit the adds by mistake. Expecting players to jump through so many silly hoops to avoid being one shotted for a random piece of crappy gear or daily is just absurd.

starkerealm

Davadin wrote: »

PS: even dragons don't have instant 1-shot, so given enough time, if u stay away from the red circles and adds, u will burn it down eventually. dragons are disappointing.

Northern Dragons do seem to have some abilities that scale their damage based on the number of people present. Though, at that point, getting one shot is just kinda funny.

Aznarb

Davadin wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Jhalin wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Brute forcing is by far the most effective and simplest strategy for this boss, which is the issue due to how stupidly unclear and unworkable any of the mechanics are.

And no one has explained the boss. We’ve heard “spam dodge roll” which is stupid. “Spam timestop” which is stupid AND requires a paid skill line. There’s been advice to interrupt the adds but if you do any damage to them you get one-shot no matter your health as we learned from the DK inhale attempt posted a ways back. If you’re melee you can’t participate at all hardly, god forbid someone tap an add and immediately get you slaughtered with no notice.

no. just... no........

brute force is the messiest strategy.

one guy aggro ALL the adds. do NOT AoE them, do not kill them, just taunt all, dodge roll the fireballs, and 2-3 DPS pull the boss away from the adds and melt him down.

notice the red circles on the adds? if they overlap, their damage multiplies. and they reflect AoE attack more because their "reflect area" seems to be the whole circle, not just themselves.

a melee of 3 people can do this boss. i tried with a guildie 3AM EST (coz i got a 2months old baby, go figure) last night PC NA and it's doable.

At least you provide feedback that can be used. But having the primary strategy be “dodge roll until the big boss is dead” is expectedly idiotically bad design, could a magicka character dodge roll as much as they need to for the boss to die before they do? How do you pull adds away from overlapping and empowering each other if any damage results in a flash-bang of Fire?

they're world bosses. they're not meant to be solo'd.

magcika players should bring a beefy stamina player (S). The easiest is to bring a couple player, assigned with pulling 1 add to separate directions.

i pulled all the adds and it's super tough because they overlap and start nuking me... that's when SnB ultimate and being a tank DK helps.... fossilize 1 or 2, and at least they won't quadru-overlap....

In fact it's not that hard.
Stay in move, always, kite them (no need to sprint), boss and add.
Don't use aoe, ever.
Ignore add, they will come back anyway, just focus boss (or put 1 or 2 good mono target dps if you're not alone).
Tri-stat pot help alot.

If you don't aoe add, they just gonna cast time to time 1b1, nothing to worry about.

We're few to have soloing him, it's fun and challenging, but definitively doable.
Their is no OS if you respect mechanic (except if you go with 16k or less hp obviously).

Try the morning when their is no one around, it's really fun

starkerealm

Jeremy wrote: »

Sorry, but that is easily one of the dumbest "mechanics" I've encountered on this game.

*Looks at the Twins*

You don't get into much endgame content, do you?

*Is vaporized by a confused teammate*

Kel

V
I
D
E
O


PLEASE

D0PAMINE

Kel wrote: »

V
I
D
E
O


PLEASE

I still need to do the boss again. I've done it 3 times and never experienced the damage mechanic everyone else is. I've tried tanking the boss on a dps and trying to aggro the adds. The first 2 times the boss melted, the third time we had 5 or 6 people there and it took about 40-50 seconds iirc. I'll try taking my Tank and taunting everything. I've been getting random crashes which im assuming is from a memory leak. I'll try to get a video but I need to find easy software to do so.

Jeremy

starkerealm wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Sorry, but that is easily one of the dumbest "mechanics" I've encountered on this game.

*Looks at the Twins*

You don't get into much endgame content, do you?

*Is vaporized by a confused teammate*

I guess it depends on what you call "endgame". But if that is an example of the kind of mechanics in the endgame then no, I don't get into it and I'm glad I don't. Because having some silly move that annihilates you just because your monster set triggers an AoE attack is just idiotic (which is what I was talking about in that post you quoted).

One shot abilities that just instantly burn you up should be well-telegraphed or understood... or at the very least hinted at in your death recap. They shouldn't be mysterious nuclear bombs contingent on some stray AoE occurring on some adds, which happens so frequently on this game is just ludicrous to design a fight that punishes you so severely for that. This assumes that is even what is even causing it. I and most of the rest of Tamriel aren't exactly sure.

Mr_Walker

albesca wrote: »

Mr_Walker wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

they are. so sad. Bring enough players and u can just throw 1 skill and get credit for the whole fight.

As someone who enjoys tanking, we get shafted a lot when it comes to boss loots, so I think it's great.

Like you show up to, say, Graveld, take agrro, taunt a good chunk of all the adds, clawing away, often self healing because everyone's a DPS, and you often get... nothing. It's not like I need or want any of the sets, but it's a bit deflating when everyone gathers around the corpse that, for you, is not marked.

I think that a solution for this would be that to be tagged for the kill you either have to do a minimum amount of damage to the mob/boss or have received a minimum amount of damage from them or have healed other players involved for a minimum amount: that way the tanks get credited for keeping the boss focused on them, healers get credited for healing other people (possibly ignoring overhealing) while the others get credited for damage done

It should be something like that, but sadly, zos seem to take an enormous dump on tanks every chance they get.

Mr_Walker

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Korah_Eaglecry wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

FierceSam wrote: »

Woeler wrote: »

Dusk_Coven wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

I"m not against moves that kill you instantly. But they should be telegraphed and avoidable (like the dragon fire for example where people need to run out of its path). Not instant moves that come out of nowhere simply because someone used an AoE on adds.... or what ever it is that supposedly triggers that b.s.

IRONY ALERT!

PvE adds kill player in 1 second with no telegraph -- it's broken!
PvP player kills another player in 1 second with no telegraph -- L2P!

Why isn't everyone wearing Defending trait in this boss fight?

This is also just a pve l2p issue

I’m not sure how I ‘learn’ if all that happens is everyone dies instantly without any warnings or indications and there is no sensible death recap to explain how the boss works.

‘Just go there with a bunch of other players and dodgeroll while they kill everything’ doesn’t sound like an effective strategy to me. Compare him to the caravan guar WB in Deshaan, which is hard but actually has recognisable mechanics which you can counter, not this idiotic instakill.

This guy is like the v1 dragons, badly designed and half finished, released early into the wild because they had to put something there. Sure he’s doable now, but he’ll be a vacant lot in a few days when the initial Dragonhold hit is over. Maybe, if they can be bothered, they’ll put in the work to finish him in 6 months time.

Here's a wild thought. Maybe the game respects your intellegence, and lets you work out what's going on for yourself rather than forcing a solution down your throat and then asking you to play a slightly more murderous game of Simon Says to complete.

The biggest complaint about this boss is that there is no way to work out what exactly is going on mechanics wise and your response is "pay attention and work it out!".

Or, you know, listen to the people who are explaining how to do it. It's not an impossible challenge, but it does require you pay attention. Trying to brute force it isn't working, so maybe it's time to try following the mechanics.

Follow what mechanics?

Are you reading the same thread as the rest of us or do you just have a bunch of canned responses in your file cabinet you like to pull out in these types of discussions?

You need to follow mechanices.

L2P issue.

People are just entitled these days

.

.

I don't know why some of you bother talking to these folk, they are wearing the "Fora Magnifica" set, where all in-game achievements are automatically 700% more awesome when posting them on the interent.

precambria

I think it is awesome, I love watch people dying, just don't hit the adds when they have elemental shield, also BLOCK block is a thing plus if you are blocking you can't be hitting them

eovogtb16_ESO

I wish they would design more bosses like this and even overland content. Things that are just brain dead like every overland boss fight in the game now is keeping a lot of people from playing the actual game. It is insanely easy.

starkerealm

Jeremy wrote: »

starkerealm wrote: »

Jeremy wrote: »

Sorry, but that is easily one of the dumbest "mechanics" I've encountered on this game.

*Looks at the Twins*

You don't get into much endgame content, do you?

*Is vaporized by a confused teammate*

I guess it depends on what you call "endgame". But if that is an example of the kind of mechanics in the endgame then no, I don't get into it and I'm glad I don't. Because having some silly move that annihilates you just because your monster set triggers an AoE attack is just idiotic (which is what I was talking about in that post you quoted).

One shot abilities that just instantly burn you up should be well-telegraphed or understood... or at the very least hinted at in your death recap. They shouldn't be mysterious nuclear bombs contingent on some stray AoE occurring on some adds, which happens so frequently on this game is just ludicrous to design a fight that punishes you so severely for that. This assumes that is even what is even causing it. I and most of the rest of Tamriel aren't exactly sure.

*Looks at Rele*

"HEY *******! SWAP BARS!"

"Huh? No, I like my bow, and it glows blue now!"

*Vaporizes party.*

Here's the thing, if you can soak and recover from a mechanic, you can brute force it. This means things like the wipe mechanic on CoA2... doesn't really matter anymore. You can just heal through it, and power through.

The only enforced mechanics are the ones that will, straight up, kill you if you don't respect them, or completely immunize the boss. So, you'll do mechanics on St. Olms, because if you don't, he'll murder you. You do mechanics on Assembly General because otherwise the reflect will wipe your group. You do mechanics on the twins, because you're turning players into ambulatory bombs. You do mechanics on Zaan because her statues can't hold their liquor. You do mechanics on Domihaus because he's really angry and wants to yell at your manager. You do mechanics on Lord Warden because you just want him to shut the **** up.

Endgame difficulty is all about managing mechanics. It's why you see such a hard divide on the dragons, between players who are like, "this is fine, I've seen so much worse," and players going, "OMGWTFBBQ!?"

Mechanics that cannot nuke you don't matter. They don't. And players who spend any serious amount of time in endgame know it.

So, for all the people saying, "overland is too easy," as an endgame player, welcome to our world. Everything's a little more murderous here.

dagrdagaz_5912

There has not been a video posted/linked yet showing how this boss is doable/easy.

Until that happens its just words from those claiming it is.