Templar nerfs were huge on this patch

Stibbons

What a waste of time.

dazee

I read the notes didnt see any templar nerfs only a couple buffs.

SirMewser

Lol

Ashamray

Eclipse nerf is essential and not needed.

kojou

I came to this thread because I thought I missed something...

Can someone enlighten me on which game breaking nerfs Templars received?

I am really excited about the change to Biting Jabs. It was shortened to 1 seconds, and the .2 second cool-down was removed essentially making it .3 seconds faster in a rotation. I know it doesn't sound like much, but I think it will make the weaving of Jabs much smoother.

Cortimi

They took away Major Protection from Empowering Sweep, the main ultimate I use to tank with. Pretty salty about it.

Baconlad

These developers KNOW that templar has an extremely rough time staying offensive...so their answer is to nerf the damage of a morph that was rarely seen?...while they didn't apply the thought process to other skills on the same type. They keep stripping templar defense. Mainly the defense we use to GO offensive without nerfing the culprit of why they dont want to buff anything else.

I could swear they won't be satisfied until every templar in this *** game is a heal bot. And EVEN THEN. They are are going to start nerfing heal bots. We are by far the worst pvp class in this game and not ONE class can claim the amount of nerfs we've sustained. We need sweeping changes, a complete redesign of our class. Not nerfs to damage

brandonv516

Cortimi wrote: »

They took away Major Protection from Empowering Sweep, the main ultimate I use to tank with. Pretty salty about it.

They also took it away from Light's Champion, the main ultimate I use to defend my NB with. Very salty about it too.

Strider__Roshin

brandonv516 wrote: »

Cortimi wrote: »

They took away Major Protection from Empowering Sweep, the main ultimate I use to tank with. Pretty salty about it.

They also took it away from Light's Champion, the main ultimate I use to defend my NB with. Very salty about it too.

Lol I don't think you have to worry about Nightblades anymore.

Vapirko

The eclipse nerf is ok. That skill was way too punishing. It was one of those skills were its so good that you’ve just got people hanging back from range and dropping it on you, and only that, kinda like snipe. It just does so much, the damage, the heal the CC. And it hit hard too. It’s still a good skill now. It’s still going to be a good switch tool to let you go offensive and turn the fight, it just won’t be one skill destroys your opponent.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Cortimi wrote: »

They took away Major Protection from Empowering Sweep, the main ultimate I use to tank with. Pretty salty about it.

use remembrance? 10 seconds of major protection and can be block canceled if you need to move. and you really ought to be using warhorn most of the time as a tank anyways.

Rygonix

Stibbons wrote: »

What a waste of time.

The same thing was said when BoL lost its third heal and again when its secondary heal was cut by 33% during Summerset pts for..reasons. Yet you still see us sticking around.

Though if they were to lay a finger on our Purify synergy we might have issues. It is one of the only abilities that we have that completely trumps Warden healers.

Vapirko wrote: »

The eclipse nerf is ok. That skill was way too punishing. It was one of those skills were its so good that you’ve just got people hanging back from range and dropping it on you, and only that, kinda like snipe. It just does so much, the damage, the heal the CC. And it hit hard too. It’s still a good skill now. It’s still going to be a good switch tool to let you go offensive and turn the fight, it just won’t be one skill destroys your opponent.

I just wish they'd rework it so it does a little less, but works as a soft-CC like the new thing they are doing with immobilizes.

Cage_Lizardman

I have a build on my dd stamplar where I get a lot of ultimate and spam crescent sweep, not the best damage but fun and very tanky. I guess it will be a bit less survivable now and more damage. I'm sure I can adjust to that, and the range buff was badly needed. It's always been a kinda bad ultimate.

technohic

Yeah range buff on sweep ultimate will be nice but no real reason to use empowering now as it lost its niche utility and is just a light version of DBOS. Not worth using.

Glass

Ashamray wrote: »

Eclipse nerf is essential and not needed.

Is essential or not needed? "insert confused emote"

xAk_MoRRoWiNdx

Baconlad wrote: »

These developers KNOW that templar has an extremely rough time staying offensive...so their answer is to nerf the damage of a morph that was rarely seen?...while they didn't apply the thought process to other skills on the same type. They keep stripping templar defense. Mainly the defense we use to GO offensive without nerfing the culprit of why they dont want to buff anything else.

I could swear they won't be satisfied until every templar in this *** game is a heal bot. And EVEN THEN. They are are going to start nerfing heal bots. We are by far the worst pvp class in this game and not ONE class can claim the amount of nerfs we've sustained. We need sweeping changes, a complete redesign of our class. Not nerfs to damage

Heh. I think you've forgotten about one of the 4 base game classes. They're called Nightblades and they'd like to have a few words with you

jbjondeaueb17_ESO

It wasn't used a lot but 37% damage reduction for Dark Flare seems to be a lot.
Sun Fire and it's morphs losing the initial hit to be pure dots is also a nerf imo.
The "fix" to BoL make its cost too high for what it's doing, especially compared to HtD.
I don't see the changes to Sun Shield making it more interesting than it's at the moment.
The changes to Eclipse didn't seem necessary.
There's been some adjustments here and there, but nothing enough to compensate the changes above.

Spizzie

Anyone who says "the changes to Eclipse weren't necessary" never had it placed on them while running as a DK with Hardened/Volatile Armor up. Not only was it wildly punishing, but there was no counter to it as a DK other than to break free instantaneously, even though the visual effect is often delayed. It made it so that Templars could return to full health and take a DK to half health just by bubbling them and light attack weaving with any spammable.

However, I'll concede that the nerf to damage is unnecessary. You're giving up the ability to stun your target for 5 seconds, it should be highly punishing to any enemy that continues to attack with it applied. But the change to the buggy interaction with DK armor is long overdue.

Brrrofski

Gonna miss empowering sweep on my stamplar for sure. Nice to hit people with it under pressure for the protection and they don't really realise they're taking damage.

Gonna have to block cancel remeberance instead I guess.

How is the heal from purifying ritual on a stamplar - anyone tested? It's currently 600 on live for me...

jbjondeaueb17_ESO

Spizzie wrote: »

Anyone who says "the changes to Eclipse weren't necessary" never had it placed on them while running as a DK with Hardened/Volatile Armor up. Not only was it wildly punishing, but there was no counter to it as a DK other than to break free instantaneously, even though the visual effect is often delayed. It made it so that Templars could return to full health and take a DK to half health just by bubbling them and light attack weaving with any spammable.

However, I'll concede that the nerf to damage is unnecessary. You're giving up the ability to stun your target for 5 seconds, it should be highly punishing to any enemy that continues to attack with it applied. But the change to the buggy interaction with DK armor is long overdue.

You perfectly summarised the reason it shouldn't be changed, a bug in a functionality shouldn't be the cause of the nerf of another skill.
If the break free issue is solved, do you really think they're gonna reverse the change ? I don't think so.
Eclipse is already a shadow of what it was once, and mostly useless in PvE because a lot of adds/bosses are immune to it.

Sanguinor2

Vapirko wrote: »

The eclipse nerf is ok. That skill was way too punishing. It was one of those skills were its so good that you’ve just got people hanging back from range and dropping it on you, and only that, kinda like snipe. It just does so much, the damage, the heal the CC. And it hit hard too. It’s still a good skill now. It’s still going to be a good switch tool to let you go offensive and turn the fight, it just won’t be one skill destroys your opponent.

How is it punishing too hard tho when you can just instantly cc break it and its gone? It just destroys your Opponent if he doesnt break free and keeps killing himself on it. Any other hard cc with a Long Duration kills you just as much when you decide you are too lazy for using break free or are out of stam.

DisgracefulMind

Spizzie wrote: »

Anyone who says "the changes to Eclipse weren't necessary" never had it placed on them while running as a DK with Hardened/Volatile Armor up. Not only was it wildly punishing, but there was no counter to it as a DK other than to break free instantaneously, even though the visual effect is often delayed. It made it so that Templars could return to full health and take a DK to half health just by bubbling them and light attack weaving with any spammable.

However, I'll concede that the nerf to damage is unnecessary. You're giving up the ability to stun your target for 5 seconds, it should be highly punishing to any enemy that continues to attack with it applied. But the change to the buggy interaction with DK armor is long overdue.

Oh, yes, let's nerf everything a DK has a problem with. Sounds legit.

No, what they should have done was fix the buggy issues with it, and left it alone. Because it can be broken immediately, there is no need for any changes on it.

technohic

Brrrofski wrote: »

Gonna miss empowering sweep on my stamplar for sure. Nice to hit people with it under pressure for the protection and they don't really realise they're taking damage.

Gonna have to block cancel remeberance instead I guess.

How is the heal from purifying ritual on a stamplar - anyone tested? It's currently 600 on live for me...

That's about where mine was and its about double. Ticks just a hair more than the HOT on rally.

Outside of empowering sweeps, eclipse, and dark flare, we feel a lot more responsive. I think all of jabs is being considered a melee attack now but need more testing, but at very least; I recommend people try it out. Remembrance nerf is a big hit for me personally but I know from weaving on my NB having to be on point to get the LAs for procs, that as templar, it now feels like we are not at a LA weave disadvantage anymore

Spizzie

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Oh, yes, let's nerf everything a DK has a problem with. Sounds legit.

No, what they should have done was fix the buggy issues with it, and left it alone. Because it can be broken immediately, there is no need for any changes on it.

Who said nerf everything that DK's struggle with? I literally just said that the thing that needed to be changed was the buggy interaction with volatile armor but that the damage return nerf was excessive, which you apparently agree with? Don't get angry for no reason, it's not worth the energy.

PS I have both a DK and a Templar. I'm not pro-DK or anti-Templar. I'm pro-good game.

DisgracefulMind

Spizzie wrote: »

DisgracefulMind wrote: »

Oh, yes, let's nerf everything a DK has a problem with. Sounds legit.

No, what they should have done was fix the buggy issues with it, and left it alone. Because it can be broken immediately, there is no need for any changes on it.

Who said nerf everything that DK's struggle with? I literally just said that the thing that needed to be changed was the buggy interaction with volatile armor but that the damage return nerf was excessive, which you apparently agree with? Don't get angry for no reason, it's not worth the energy.

PS I have both a DK and a Templar. I'm not pro-DK or anti-Templar. I'm pro-good game.

I read your agreeance that the damage nerf was excessive. You said that the changes weren't unnecessary to the skill, I'm disagreeing. Fix the bugs, sure, we agree with that, but the skill shouldn't have been touched. I think this is just misunderstanding (:

Fix bugs, don't nerf >.<

Ashamray

Spizzie wrote: »

Anyone who says "the changes to Eclipse weren't necessary" never had it placed on them while running as a DK with Hardened/Volatile Armor up. Not only was it wildly punishing, but there was no counter to it as a DK other than to break free instantaneously, even though the visual effect is often delayed. It made it so that Templars could return to full health and take a DK to half health just by bubbling them and light attack weaving with any spammable.

However, I'll concede that the nerf to damage is unnecessary. You're giving up the ability to stun your target for 5 seconds, it should be highly punishing to any enemy that continues to attack with it applied. But the change to the buggy interaction with DK armor is long overdue.

Change about Volatile is adequate, because it is a fix. Meanwhile they didn't fix CP bug with Backlash that reduces its damage. And gut Eclipse in addition. I see no healthy reason behind this.
Hopefully, new Toppling off balance looks nicely and I probably will be another annoying gap closer spammer.

JWillCHS

So here is my opinion on Total Dark as a magicka Templar. If you're relying on it to damage your opponents I personally feel you're doing something wrong.

When they first made the changes to Total Dark, I used it as my main CC(if you can call it that) and it was critical in my rotation for doing damage. As those changes began to age the skill became less effective. Why? It almost useless against experience players. I use TD just for the heal to increase survivability when I'm out numbered or face a harder hitting enemy.

I wish they would get rid of the damage or the heal(keep 1 of the 2); and take away the break free option so it last for the full duration.

Javelin and Elemental Blockade with an Ice Staff are way more effective options at higher levels of play. But if you're going up against scrubs, Total Dark will "ALWAYS" be a good option because they're too stupid to figure it out. Even the reduce damage against scrubs is not going to change their fate.


Now if they could fix the reliability of our class gap closer...

technohic

JWillCHS wrote: »

So here is my opinion on Total Dark as a magicka Templar. If you're relying on it to damage your opponents I personally feel you're doing something wrong.

When they first made the changes to Total Dark, I used it as my main CC(if you can call it that) and it was critical in my rotation for doing damage. As those changes began to age the skill became less effective. Why? It almost useless against experience players. I use TD just for the heal to increase survivability when I'm out numbered or face a harder hitting enemy.

I wish they would get rid of the damage or the heal(keep 1 of the 2); and take away the break free option so it last for the full duration.

Javelin and Elemental Blockade with an Ice Staff are way more effective options at higher levels of play. But if you're going up against scrubs, Total Dark will "ALWAYS" be a good option because they're too stupid to figure it out. Even the reduce damage against scrubs is not going to change their fate.


Now if they could fix the reliability of our class gap closer...

The damage is the deterrent for the target to stop attacking not for templar DPS. If it is not noteworthy, it becomes free CC immunity even more so than now. As it is, I already love it when someone puts it on me while I'm trying to get away. Prevents a hard CC which stops me from healing, and stops the zerg from pulling me in. So in a way, yes; it's already mediocre at best.

Tasear

Brrrofski wrote: »

Gonna miss empowering sweep on my stamplar for sure. Nice to hit people with it under pressure for the protection and they don't really realise they're taking damage.

Gonna have to block cancel remeberance instead I guess.

How is the heal from purifying ritual on a stamplar - anyone tested? It's currently 600 on live for me...

Actually stamina templar got a buff with

This ability and its morphs will now grant healing and/or damage based on the users' highest offensive stats, rather than just Max Magicka and Spell Damage.

JWillCHS

technohic wrote: »

JWillCHS wrote: »

So here is my opinion on Total Dark as a magicka Templar. If you're relying on it to damage your opponents I personally feel you're doing something wrong.

When they first made the changes to Total Dark, I used it as my main CC(if you can call it that) and it was critical in my rotation for doing damage. As those changes began to age the skill became less effective. Why? It almost useless against experience players. I use TD just for the heal to increase survivability when I'm out numbered or face a harder hitting enemy.

I wish they would get rid of the damage or the heal(keep 1 of the 2); and take away the break free option so it last for the full duration.

Javelin and Elemental Blockade with an Ice Staff are way more effective options at higher levels of play. But if you're going up against scrubs, Total Dark will "ALWAYS" be a good option because they're too stupid to figure it out. Even the reduce damage against scrubs is not going to change their fate.


Now if they could fix the reliability of our class gap closer...

The damage is the deterrent for the target to stop attacking not for templar DPS. If it is not noteworthy, it becomes free CC immunity even more so than now. As it is, I already love it when someone puts it on me while I'm trying to get away. Prevents a hard CC which stops me from healing, and stops the zerg from pulling me in. So in a way, yes; it's already mediocre at best.

You put it in better words than myself. I agree. That's how I've used Total Dark today. I'll use it to stop someone from hitting me. Even more skilled players might not break from it immediately but you won't see them "not" do something about it.

Even when another magplar opens with total dark on me I can cleanse it immediately with extended ritual.

BreakingBats

The Dark Flare nerf will hurt but as long as it has that aoe major defile then it's staying on my bar.