What would make you like developers or Zos more as a player?

Tasear

It's common in game and out of game for people to talk poorly about delevopers or zos, be it right or wrong. So my question is for people what would increase your reception of game's product made by developers and Zos?

Dracan_Fontom

Listen to more feedback from players?

Sylvermynx

Mostly I think the devs in any game do fine. Occasionally I get my knickers in a twist over something, but by and large, not that often over the three MMOs I've played (WoW, RIFT, and ESO). Now, with WoW and RIFT, the devs eventually took both games in directions I didn't agree with. That's when I quit playing them. Never been back. Canceled 7 accounts in WoW; 5 in RIFT.

So far, the devs in this game haven't made me that angry yet, by a LONG shot. If/when they do, I'll be gone from here too.

Nifty2g

Change the way the PTS works, so we don't get unbalanced patches pushed to live

Tasear

Dracan_Fontom wrote: »

Listen to more feedback from players?

What kind of feedback? What kind of these make you feel unheard?

BigM

Developers will always get short end of stick. The one's on front lines that deal with the customer's day in and day out get the worse and I have always thought they are the ones underpaid.

No matter what they say or do they are screwed.

Yet we always come back and play. 😁😁😁

geonsocal

this one knows what would make khajit much happier with the eso gods of dev...

qbit

I think the ESO devs would do well to research what is called “the Balmer Peak” and not go below or above it. I feel they go above it a little too often during the lunch break.

idk

A consistent path/vision for this game.

Multiple times Zos devs have said changes were due to the vision they have for this game. However, with each year it becomes more obvious they really lack a vision and make it up as they go.

With the combat update post for U21 Rob Garret has said they are working hard at "codifying our vision and long-term strategy for combat" which is welcome new that this is finally happening after almost 5 years, plus more years in development.

While I suppose it is better late than never, we can hope they actually think things through as to how their new "vision" will actually play out. Thinking through changes is something Zos has demonstrated a blatant disregard for doing. Best example is how they launched the CP system was totally absurd.

starkerealm

Tasear wrote: »

It's common in game and out of game for people to talk poorly about delevopers, be it right or wrong. So my question is for people what would increase your reception to devs?

Are you kidding? I love those guys. They're fantastic. To be fair, while I'm saying that, I realize, I've had an unusual level of access to them this year. So, when it comes to the team at ZOS, I'm not saying, "oh, yeah, I know them through their work," I'm saying that from personal experience, they're really good people.

GreatGildersleeve

Communication. Both ways.

There was a time when we heard a tonne more about what was in the pipe. Annual updates, combat updates, year in review, tidbits on Live etc. Lately it’s been crickets. What has come out hasn’t been worth the screen time to read it. People are so starved for information they’re grateful for the ‘dev comments’ in nerf erm, patch notes which is sad.

And personally, it would be nice to think they’re listening to the players. I think the rep program has been a bust but I’ll reserve judgement for a patch or two now that they’re NDA’d. Mostly, I see people offering a slew of suggestions on the forums and they’re pretty much ignored in favour of changes that make many more upset (why do we have a pts again? It’s almost never mattered and what pops goes live). They’re the devs, and are entitled to design their game how they want, but so many negative changes recently can’t be good. But I’m guessing on that one... they have the metrics.

Edit: Why are YOU asking all these really good questions Tasear? Shouldn’t this be someone from ZoS? This is pretty much highlighting my point...

Tandor

The question pre-supposes a lot of players have a problem with the developers. I doubt very much that that is the case. I have no issues with them at all, I think they do a fantastic job. Of course, they can't keep everyone happy all of the time, but I'd far rather they stuck to their vision for the game together with their views on balancing etc given that they have all the data at their disposal, rather than turning the game on its head every 5 minutes because someone coughed on the forum.

Chaos2088

Over the years I have played this game, yeah there have been a few patches that landed with a thump and needed abit of resuscitation, but the direction of the game does show that the devs are wanting the players feedback to be put into the game, eg...2handed weapons to count as 2 piece set, jewelry crafting, outfit system...etc etc...

But what would make the devs appeal more if I needed to pin point one thing would be information to what they are working on/what is coming up, not just for the next patch., but a more of a long term hint of what they are tinkering on.

jainiadral

1. Increased transparency-- giving players a deeper insight into the design reasoning behind changes.

2. Increased interaction with players whether in a separate limited q&a subforum or here.

Anet does something like this on tbe GW2 forums with their dev chat. Even if there's some conflict in the limited forum, players seem to have a far more positive impression of the company than they seem to here. I've always found the design discussions interesting and enlightening, even when I wasn't crazy about what was being discussed.

I've seen something similar in other games when someone, whether community rep or higher-up interacts on an equal basis with players-- dialog immediately softens and players become more receptive to changes. Feeling like your being listened to rather than looked down upon is huge in fostering positive relations. Players don't like being treated like wallets with legs.

VaranisArano

The Devs aren't ever going to satisfy ALL of the players.

Ever.

As for satisfying myself, I would be pleased with timely responses when they have seen and noted bugs and exploits, and timely updates on progress with fixes. If something is unobtainable, like fixing lag in Cyrodiil apparently is, I would like acknowledgement of this even when it is detrimental to the bottom line.

witchdoctor

I'll be blunt: I don't need 'increased reception' of the developers. I just need to like their product. Which I do.

It would be *nice* to have a really rough sketch of their vision. To piggy-back off @idk 's comments above. Although, I can imagine their hesitation at that thought (and why I said really rough).

Hearing that they hear us, as their consumers is nice. I think its ridiculous (not to mention clingy and needy) to expect constant affirmation of 'we hear you.' Developer comments during PTS suffice, in my opinion. 'We are doing X because we heard your complaints about Y,' works perfect for me.

I guess I think of it like this: they are professionals doing work I cannot personally do, but whose fruit I enjoy. I won't tell them how to do their job, and if they ask, I am happy to give my opinion.

Bashev

Some of the combat balance changes comes too late and there is double or triple nerf on something which was OP.
What I mean is that the devs decide that something is too strong and should be adjusted but they cannot do it immediately which is normal. So they schedule it and then on the next meeting they schedule other things that should be adjusted but they forget that these changes are related. It works the same way for buffs.

Examples:
Black rose set nerf + then constitution nerf.
Rune cage undogable + damage buff
Shields critable + cast time
Crystal fragments remove stun + reduce damage
Immovable reduce duration, then make it available only for heavy (before the heavy armor meta)

I think there are more examples but I am sleepy now.

Tasear

Bashev wrote: »

Some of the combat balance changes comes too late and there is double or triple nerf on something which was OP.
What I mean is that the devs decide that something is too strong and should be adjusted but they cannot do it immediately which is normal. So they schedule it and then on the next meeting they schedule other things that should be adjusted but they forget that these changes are related. It works the same way for buffs.

Examples:
Black rose set nerf + then constitution nerf.
Rune cage undogable + damage buff
Shields critable + cast time
Crystal fragments remove stun + reduce damage
Immovable reduce duration, then make it available only for heavy (before the heavy armor meta)

I think there are more examples but I am sleepy now.

So lack of cohesion between balance changes and delay on some necessary ones?

SirAndy

Tasear wrote: »

It's common in game and out of game for people to talk poorly about delevopers, be it right or wrong. So my question is for people what would increase your reception to devs?

For starters, ZOS needs to invest in a solid QA team.

The rate at which bugs are introduced (some even re-introduced) outnumbers the rate at which things get fixed by at least 10/1. In short, the QA process is abysmal and has been since early beta.

That would go a long way for people to feel more comfortable with the developers ...

pzschrek

Fix cyrodiil.

Bashev

Tasear wrote: »

Bashev wrote: »

Some of the combat balance changes comes too late and there is double or triple nerf on something which was OP.
What I mean is that the devs decide that something is too strong and should be adjusted but they cannot do it immediately which is normal. So they schedule it and then on the next meeting they schedule other things that should be adjusted but they forget that these changes are related. It works the same way for buffs.

Examples:
Black rose set nerf + then constitution nerf.
Rune cage undogable + damage buff
Shields critable + cast time
Crystal fragments remove stun + reduce damage
Immovable reduce duration, then make it available only for heavy (before the heavy armor meta)

I think there are more examples but I am sleepy now.

So lack of cohesion between balance changes and delay on some necessary ones?

I dont know how it happens. My explanation is:
Skill A is OP and we complain - 1st January
Devs meet on 2nd of January and say: This skill is OP. Players are right. Lets nerf it.
On 20th of January the nerf is done (only devs can test it, we dont know nothing yet). The skill A is kind of balance, it needs testing.
On 21st of January, we complain even more cause this skill is the true meta.
On 26th of January we threaten that we will quit
On 30th of January the devs discuss: Players are super unhappy about this skill. Ok lets do something else.
On 10th of February the new patch comes and we see only the first change. We are kind of happy.
On 20th of March the devs implement the second nerf which was scheduled. But it is not anymore needed. But the change is already done.
On 5th of June we receive the new nerf.

starkerealm

Bashev wrote: »

I dont know how it happens.

I can guess. The patches need to be certified by Sony and Microsoft, before they can be pushed live. This costs money for each patch, so fine tuned balance changes are nearly impossible without creating multiple code bases. So we get all of the balance changes for 3 months in a burst.

That it works at all is a testament to the team. Though finer tuned balance changes would be nice.

Dracan_Fontom

Tasear wrote: »

Dracan_Fontom wrote: »

Listen to more feedback from players?

What kind of feedback? What kind of these make you feel unheard?

I don't necessarily believe that myself. I'm just saying this cause what I'd think would lead people to dislike developers. Personally i don't like the idea of only nerfing playstyles/abilities/classes/etc will bring about balance. And whoever makes made that dismounting damage set.

jainiadral

GreatGildersleeve wrote: »

Communication. Both ways.

There was a time when we heard a tonne more about what was in the pipe. Annual updates, combat updates, year in review, tidbits on Live etc. Lately it’s been crickets. What has come out hasn’t been worth the screen time to read it. People are so starved for information they’re grateful for the ‘dev comments’ in nerf erm, patch notes which is sad.

And personally, it would be nice to think they’re listening to the players. I think the rep program has been a bust but I’ll reserve judgement for a patch or two now that they’re NDA’d. Mostly, I see people offering a slew of suggestions on the forums and they’re pretty much ignored in favour of changes that make many more upset (why do we have a pts again? It’s almost never mattered and what pops goes live). They’re the devs, and are entitled to design their game how they want, but so many negative changes recently can’t be good. But I’m guessing on that one... they have the metrics.

Edit: Why are YOU asking all these really good questions Tasear? Shouldn’t this be someone from ZoS? This is pretty much highlighting my point...

You're hitting on something here that's been bugging me a bit about the forums. People have direct questions about events, for example, that don't get answered and that lead to the impression of disconnection and lack of dev involvement. Ex: was there ever an official response to, "Can you complete New Life Charity Writs after the event ends?"

This is basic stuff that only ZoS can really answer, and yet the only official staff responses you see on some of these threads are mod warnings.

Even giving out some basic, simple and official information would help a lot.

ccmedaddy

They could start by doing a much better job than they're doing right now.

Let me start off by saying I show my appreciation to the devs by paying a monthly subscription fee. I like the game, obviously.

But there are so many ways the devs have failed maintaining this game that I don't even know where to begin. The group finder for dungeons and BGs is still a buggy mess, which is shocking for an MMO that's almost 5 years old. Guild traders are still lacking the most basic functionalities on console, and Cyrodil has been virtually unplayable during prime time for... how many patches now?

And it's really hard to appreciate the work they put into creating new content with the DLCs and expansions when every patch brings its set of bugs (sometimes game-breaking), OP cheese sets and poor balancing decisions.

I do think that some people on the forums go too far---they need to realize the devs are people too and there are boundaries you have to respect--but I think for the most part people here have legitimate gripes with ZOS, and this dynamic won't change unless ZOS really gets its act together and make a polished product out of ESO.

Shadow-Fighter

Devs must do their own work and not giving their job to players/reps. I dont like the idea of reps.

kypranb14_ESO

Tasear wrote: »

It's common in game and out of game for people to talk poorly about delevopers, be it right or wrong. So my question is for people what would increase your reception to devs?

For me, I don't judge the developers based on their work ethic.. After all, I'm not their employer. For me to like the developers more, I would need to talk to them 1 on 1, or in a small group. I have a couple developers/designers/coders from other games I play on my discord friends list, and I enjoy talking to them. Seeing what they think about the game their designing, what they personally change or improve upon given the chance, and even playing the game with them.

Delsanab14_ESO

- Not exploit players.
- Recognize when they are exploiting players.
- Not implement grindy pointless RNG mechanics for repetitive holiday events that just drive people to craziness.
- Be good stewards of the community and their game.
- Not listen to shareholders but instead stakeholders.
- Improve their customer service so it's not outsourced.

Greystag

Much better communication, or at least some interaction with the community (both here and on reddit), because most of the time it feels like TESO fans are just trying to communicate with a brick wall.

Also, better quality dyeing instead of supershiny shite.

And a better balance team with a set vision and a proper plan. Balancing small stuff every patch without real reasons besides (it's op on pvp) makes it look like they spend the weeks drinking and having fun and then apply balance changes on the last day.

Loves_guars

I like them a lot now, I guess I'd love them more if they focus on adding more fun stuff like new weapons and fixing buggy elements.

ArchMikem

I don't talk down about the Devs so I don't have a reply to this. I'm grateful the game exists and is playable, what more do I rightfully expect?