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Shuffle dodges rune cage
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Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »Yes, this is intended since Rune Cage can be dodged.
lol
Now it will be completely useless.
In PTS I thought it was about dodge roll only.
No, of course not. ZOS does nerfs thoroughly, even if they felt that a class needed buffs 3 months before.
There are countless threads on the PTS about it. Enjoy your stamNB buff.
Interesting, how the term "roll dodge" always implies stamina and/or Nightblades in most player's minds, even though every class/variant can do that...
Magicka can only do it a handful of times before they run dry
Exactly, even they can. Stamina classes run dry eventually too...Why this bias?
Because by the time they run dry, you're already porting back to the keep.Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake1 -
Kelces✭✭✭✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »Counterplay
Lol
Yes because major evasion doing the dodging for you is counterplay lol
As is having shields for ignoring % crit chance...
But shields take full, unmitigated damage. Crit or not, they take far more damage and require far more resources to keep up than dodge rolling. A 10K shield (halved from 20K in PVP) is done in one or two hits from most spammables in the game. Dodge roll can avoid those one to two spammables and then a few more, and even more if shuffle is up. Mag sorc is dead or nearly dead by the 3rd spammable unless they are spamming shields and doing zero offense.
1. More damage with 0% critical hits compared to, let's say 30% in critical hits, Seriously, aren't you confusing those two? Note, this effect is guaranteed!
2. If you get lucky with it, remember 25% chance. And that's the entire point, no guarantee.
So in the end quite fair, even though sometimes one gets lucky and that becomes the whole reason for some, that this has to be removed.Edited by Kelces on August 13, 2018 6:07PMYou reveal yourself best in how you play.
Kelces - Argonian Templar
Farel Donvu - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Navam Llervu - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Aniseth - Wood Elf Warden
Therediel - Wood Elf Templar
Nilonwy - Wood Elf Nightblade
Jurupari - Argonian Warden
Kú-Chulainn - Argonian Sorcerer
PC - EU
For the Pact!0 -
CyrusArya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭
Interesting, how the term "roll dodge" always implies stamina and/or Nightblades in most player's minds, even though every class/variant can do that...
A.) Stamblade is by far the strongest, most lethal, and easiest to play stam class in the game. As such it is the most popular.
B.) Stamblade can dodge roll the most of any stam class because they have by far the best sustain, with one passive giving 15% to all regens (basically a free set of willow path), an overloaded skill that gives a regen and damage buff on top of the strongest single target burst skill in the game, and another sustain skill in leeching strikes on top of all that...because point A.
C.) Stamblade can run medium better than any other class in game and hence can dodge roll more cus of point A.
D.) Stamblade is the only class that can get major evasion even in heavy cus of point A.
The only thing that’s interesting is how clueless all these people posting “why stamblade” are.5 -
visionality✭✭✭✭✭Get rid of the delayed proc of Mage's Fury, make Curse dodgeable blockable and instant, and I'll be cool with Rune Cage being undodgeable as long as the range is reduced to 8m or less.
I want to add: for proper class balance, also remove 2 out of 3 skilltrees from sorcerers and disable all passives. Well, and maybe remove 2 more skills from the last remaining skilltree ?
Also streak should be changed into a automated self-stun proccing every 15 seconds to make fighting more exciting for sorcerers!
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Kelces✭✭✭✭✭
Plenty of thought. Its a lame skill.
Think again, it is not a single ability only...
Ok, I'll help you a bit:
For example there is "Blur" (morphs - "Mirage"/"Double Take")
Then there is the set called "Hist bark" which gives you this buff while blocking
and probably others too, which I might have forgotten...
Alright now, tell me how you do balance there in a reasonable fashion, without screwing everyone...Edited by Kelces on August 13, 2018 6:26PMYou reveal yourself best in how you play.
Kelces - Argonian Templar
Farel Donvu - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Navam Llervu - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Aniseth - Wood Elf Warden
Therediel - Wood Elf Templar
Nilonwy - Wood Elf Nightblade
Jurupari - Argonian Warden
Kú-Chulainn - Argonian Sorcerer
PC - EU
For the Pact!0 -
Kelces✭✭✭✭✭
Interesting, how the term "roll dodge" always implies stamina and/or Nightblades in most player's minds, even though every class/variant can do that...
A.) Stamblade is by far the strongest, most lethal, and easiest to play stam class in the game. As such it is the most popular.
B.) Stamblade can dodge roll the most of any stam class because they have by far the best sustain, with one passive giving 15% to all regens (basically a free set of willow path), an overloaded skill that gives a regen and damage buff on top of the strongest single target burst skill in the game, and another sustain skill in leeching strikes on top of all that...because point A.
C.) Stamblade can run medium better than any other class in game and hence can dodge roll more cus of point A.
D.) Stamblade is the only class that can get major evasion even in heavy cus of point A.
The only thing that’s interesting is how clueless all these people posting “why stamblade” are.
Which proves my suspicion about bias against Nightblades, just pure hatred and blind rage forces one to stare on any other advantage a NB has, which I never mentioned.
Shall we try again and just discuss "roll dodge", nothing else?You reveal yourself best in how you play.
Kelces - Argonian Templar
Farel Donvu - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Navam Llervu - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Aniseth - Wood Elf Warden
Therediel - Wood Elf Templar
Nilonwy - Wood Elf Nightblade
Jurupari - Argonian Warden
Kú-Chulainn - Argonian Sorcerer
PC - EU
For the Pact!0 -
RMerlin✭✭✭✭Hayden_Knight wrote: »Leased it cant be reflected. try playing a magden and using frost reach to CC.
They said new adjustments are coming to rune-cage..this might be the one.
When, in 3 more months? That will mean that ability will have been broken for 6 months then (3 months being completely OP, and 3 months being half-useless with nothing else to compensate).
Players are tired of feedback being ignored on PTS, then having to wait 3 months for a fix, and then half of the time that fix fails to properly address the complains, and we have to wait yet another 3 months until the next update for MAYBE a proper fix. The majority of players would be fine if they just brought Crystal Blast and Rune Cage back to what they were 6 months ago and left it there.. They nerfed the first one to justify boosting the second one, and now that the second one got nerfed without the first one being brought back to its original design (as to re-balance things), magsorcs are left with nothing.
ZOS recruited a team of class representative for feedback. They need to talk to them at the start of a PTS cycle, so things do get fixed DURING the test cycle. Too often things got completely out of balance or broken during PTS, and all user feedback during that test cycle got ignored or shelved until "the next update".
We could also add the complains about some of the set changes made with this update, which were never asked for, and never required either (I'm especially looking at the removal of the mount buff on a particular set). Nobody said it was a good change, yet ZOS was too stubborn to admit it was a bad idea and to just reverse their change. We're not talking about a major balancing issue here, we're talking about just a quality of life set that got destroyed. If you feel you needed a set with the new stats, then make it a NEW set. Do not change an existing set for something that's completely different in purpose. People bought that set for a specific purpose, don't make them trash that set just because you decided to give it a completely different purpose.
As I've said before, ESO development needs to uncouple itself from that 3 months dev cycle when it comes to gameplay/mechanics. We should not have to wait 3 months for recently broken things to be fixed.
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RMerlin✭✭✭✭
False. The master staff is good if you want to use clench as a spammable DPS. But you can simple replace runecage with clench, keep using force pulse as spammable DPS and take advatange of having 5+5+2. Depending on the build, you can benefit more of having 5+5+2 than having the master staff.
Fire Clench has been my primary CC for years on my magsorc, with defensive rune being my secondary CC to stop gankers. Thanks to that recent change, defensive rune is now useless against ganker, so I will once again be getting one-shotted by them. Another reason for me to spend more time on my stamblade than my magsorc...
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rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Is that intended? Because that is OP
It's still not going to happen *that* often.
Then again, maybe if you all start complaining about the existence of people with inordinate dodge chance that can finally be dealt with.0 -
ManDraKE✭✭✭✭✭
✭
A.) Stamblade is by far the strongest, most lethal, and easiest to play stam class in the game. As such it is the most popular.
Stamblade has the highest skill ceiling of all stam classes. Yes, is really easy to get cheap kills on a stamblade, but being actually good at it? Not so much. Why? several reasons:
- utility skills, that are the key of their survivial, require reaction and are not prebuffed or passive like other classes
- Their playstyle have hard counters, you can't say the same for a heavy armor stamwarden for example, there are not really hard counters for them (amazing healing, amazing sustain, amazing utility, top noch burst...)
- you have to effectible manage both resources pools, while for most of the other stam classes magika abilities are just magika dump skills to get buffs.
- recovering from burst is hard given the innate low healing of the class
- Their entire combo, while powerful and effective, is dodgeable.
- etc....
etc
Being a ganker is easy, being a good stamblade is harder than any other stam class. How many GOOD nighblades you know? and by good i mean players that you know they will perform in any situation and being a pain in the ass to deal in any situation.... 2? 3? The vast majority of the nb's are just full damage gankers that will Xv1 or gank you out of your horse, in a normal scenario they will rekt in 5 seconds.
You can just use the same build for everystam class and as long as you learn the combo and how to manage resources with heavy attacks, you are good to go. A standard fury+bp+bs builds can be move from class to class and it works just fine and the playstyle is very similar, not the case if you switch to a stamblade.B.) Stamblade can dodge roll the most of any stam class because they have by far the best sustain, with one passive giving 15% to all regens (basically a free set of willow path), an overloaded skill that gives a regen and damage buff on top of the strongest single target burst skill in the game, and another sustain skill in leeching strikes on top of all that...because point A.
That's somewhat true. Stamblades have really good sustain, but stamdens too and for some reason people say that a making something dodgeable is a buff to stamblades.C.) Stamblade can run medium better than any other class in game and hence can dodge roll more cus of point A.
While stamblades go really well with medium, that argument is absurd. Every class will run what is best for his class, so if for example medium is the best option for stamplar, they will run medium, and that has nothing to do with how good stamblades are with medium. Every class that can effectible run medium armor, will be "buffed" by making rune cage dodgeable, there is no magic extra buff to stambladesD.) Stamblade is the only class that can get major evasion even in heavy cus of point A..
Major evasion, the most overrated buff in the game. Do the test yourself, use a friend and ask him to buff itselft with major evasion and cast 50 rune cages on him, then tell me how many dodges you get. For example on all my bg's builds i don't even use major evasion, both sources of that buff are expensive and the benefit in a fast paced combat like BGs is negible, if you are going to get killed, major evasion isn't going to change that. And in the current meta of bleeds and sloads and undogeble ultimates, major evasion is irrelevant.The only thing that’s interesting is how clueless all these people posting “why stamblade” are .
No, the interesting part is how most of the playerbase has no *** clue of how a stamblade works, and that is show by some of the absurd arguments you can read around here.Edited by ManDraKE on August 13, 2018 7:03PM5 -
Jhalin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭If stamblades are slaughtering you, maybe try playing their hard counter: magDK. Hell, any DK. Soft CC, resistance to upfront burst, melee range unblockable CC for a setup that has to play melee, two gap closers with hard CC to catch an elusive NB.
Maybe give something besides sheild stacking on a glass canon a try.1 -
antihero727✭✭✭✭✭
Interesting, how the term "roll dodge" always implies stamina and/or Nightblades in most player's minds, even though every class/variant can do that...
A.) Stamblade is by far the strongest, most lethal, and easiest to play stam class in the game. As such it is the most popular.
B.) Stamblade can dodge roll the most of any stam class because they have by far the best sustain, with one passive giving 15% to all regens (basically a free set of willow path), an overloaded skill that gives a regen and damage buff on top of the strongest single target burst skill in the game, and another sustain skill in leeching strikes on top of all that...because point A.
C.) Stamblade can run medium better than any other class in game and hence can dodge roll more cus of point A.
D.) Stamblade is the only class that can get major evasion even in heavy cus of point A.
The only thing that’s interesting is how clueless all these people posting “why stamblade” are.
Which proves my suspicion about bias against Nightblades, just pure hatred and blind rage forces one to stare on any other advantage a NB has, which I never mentioned.
Shall we try again and just discuss "roll dodge", nothing else?
I don’t think it’s biased as much as ignorance on balance. I don’t believe ZOS employees sit around at meetings figuring out how to make one class better than the others (unless it’s a new class that requires a real money only chapter). It’s a lack of skill, care or knowledge that gets us in these tusslesVeldrn-AD Magica Sorc
Bizarro Veldrn-AD Stam Sorc
Antiherro-AD Stam DK
Antihero-AD Magplar
Aww Crit-AD Magblade
AD Since PC beta
On A lag free vacation
for the near and far future1 -
Didgerion✭✭✭✭✭
✭
Yes, sorcs needed this combo as they cannot burst while under pressure and I'm talking non-CP here. DKs can eat damage while at the same time doing damage. Sorcs do 0 damage while defending themselves. Sorcs need to find a window to apply that deadly combo. If there is no such combo then there is nothing sorcs can do as in many scenarios you get only one chance to apply your combo before you are getting DOT-ed down by a DK who also reflects, or bursted down by a NB in 3 shots.
Let me ask this, do they rely on them as much as Sorc does? Because if the burst is not locked into place via CC it's very easy to mitigate.
Plus, 3/5 classes had unblockable, undodgeable CCs to counter builds that dodge and block heavily...now 2. But that also means 2 still got to keep theirs.
And you have a skill in rune cage to do that. Let me ask you something, should a class Tha has the burst of a Sorc have a skill that always guarantees they will get that burst off. Where is the balance in that, but timed correctly you are still able to get that skill off and imo that requires skill and is fair.
Again i'm talking non-CP campaign here.....CP is a joke, its impossible to balance this game base on CPs.
Well DKs are officially more mobile than sorcs now. The range plays well for DKs too as you can reflect most of ranged attacks, and you can still use some ranged attacks while reflecting and you can leap into your deadly root trap combo. So don't tell that range hurts DKs.You can’t compare it to other classes because not all classes get the same things. What would DKs be without fossilize, we don’t have an execute, we don’t have an ounce of mobility and for fossilize we have to be within a reasonable range, unlike Sorcs.
NB's fear is as strong as rune-cage when dealing with block builds while for Light Armor or Medium Armor builds NB don't even need to use fear. Their Cloak + Surprise Attack + Incap combo is bringing most of the players in execute range....and if it doesn't then they keep spamming Surprise Attack, and if he still doesn't bring the target to execute range then NB cloaks and repeats, or cloaks and switches target.Now, I hate NBs so you can take away fear from them. Though I will say the length for fear has been reduced, and in a way it’s not holding someone in a stationary position though it doesn’t really matter to NBs because ZOS doesn’t know balance when it comes to them.0 -
Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭antihero727 wrote: »
Interesting, how the term "roll dodge" always implies stamina and/or Nightblades in most player's minds, even though every class/variant can do that...
A.) Stamblade is by far the strongest, most lethal, and easiest to play stam class in the game. As such it is the most popular.
B.) Stamblade can dodge roll the most of any stam class because they have by far the best sustain, with one passive giving 15% to all regens (basically a free set of willow path), an overloaded skill that gives a regen and damage buff on top of the strongest single target burst skill in the game, and another sustain skill in leeching strikes on top of all that...because point A.
C.) Stamblade can run medium better than any other class in game and hence can dodge roll more cus of point A.
D.) Stamblade is the only class that can get major evasion even in heavy cus of point A.
The only thing that’s interesting is how clueless all these people posting “why stamblade” are.
Which proves my suspicion about bias against Nightblades, just pure hatred and blind rage forces one to stare on any other advantage a NB has, which I never mentioned.
Shall we try again and just discuss "roll dodge", nothing else?
I don’t think it’s biased as much as ignorance on balance. I don’t believe ZOS employees sit around at meetings figuring out how to make one class better than the others (unless it’s a new class that requires a real money only chapter). It’s a lack of skill, care or knowledge that gets us in these tussles
I don't think they did that for Warden considering how awful it is.
But if they DON'T think about it then that makes it even worse because they should consider the implications of their actions before implementing these changes.Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake0 -
Didgerion✭✭✭✭✭
✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »Counterplay
Lol
Yes because major evasion doing the dodging for you is counterplay lol
As is having shields for ignoring % crit chance...
But shields take full, unmitigated damage. Crit or not, they take far more damage and require far more resources to keep up than dodge rolling. A 10K shield (halved from 20K in PVP) is done in one or two hits from most spammables in the game. Dodge roll can avoid those one to two spammables and then a few more, and even more if shuffle is up. Mag sorc is dead or nearly dead by the 3rd spammable unless they are spamming shields and doing zero offense.
1. More damage with 0% critical hits compared to, let's say 30% in critical hits, Seriously, aren't you confusing those two? Note, this effect is guaranteed!
30% critical bonus? Did you hear about critical resistance? Most PVP players wear full impen armor, even shield stacking sorcs run some impenetrable armor pieces.2. If you get lucky with it, remember 25% chance. And that's the entire point, no guarantee.
So in the end quite fair, even though sometimes one gets lucky and that becomes the whole reason for some, that this has to be removed.
Well we talk a sustained fight here and not an 1shot gank build, and 25% chance means that quarter of the hits will miss in a prolonged fight while on top of that you get a nice snare and root immunity with it.
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antihero727✭✭✭✭✭antihero727 wrote: »
Interesting, how the term "roll dodge" always implies stamina and/or Nightblades in most player's minds, even though every class/variant can do that...
A.) Stamblade is by far the strongest, most lethal, and easiest to play stam class in the game. As such it is the most popular.
B.) Stamblade can dodge roll the most of any stam class because they have by far the best sustain, with one passive giving 15% to all regens (basically a free set of willow path), an overloaded skill that gives a regen and damage buff on top of the strongest single target burst skill in the game, and another sustain skill in leeching strikes on top of all that...because point A.
C.) Stamblade can run medium better than any other class in game and hence can dodge roll more cus of point A.
D.) Stamblade is the only class that can get major evasion even in heavy cus of point A.
The only thing that’s interesting is how clueless all these people posting “why stamblade” are.
Which proves my suspicion about bias against Nightblades, just pure hatred and blind rage forces one to stare on any other advantage a NB has, which I never mentioned.
Shall we try again and just discuss "roll dodge", nothing else?
I don’t think it’s biased as much as ignorance on balance. I don’t believe ZOS employees sit around at meetings figuring out how to make one class better than the others (unless it’s a new class that requires a real money only chapter). It’s a lack of skill, care or knowledge that gets us in these tussles
I don't think they did that for Warden considering how awful it is.
But if they DON'T think about it then that makes it even worse because they should consider the implications of their actions before implementing these changes.
Stam warden was a OP class for pvp when it was released. They have since slowly giving it the mag sorc treatmentVeldrn-AD Magica Sorc
Bizarro Veldrn-AD Stam Sorc
Antiherro-AD Stam DK
Antihero-AD Magplar
Aww Crit-AD Magblade
AD Since PC beta
On A lag free vacation
for the near and far future0 -
Kelces✭✭✭✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »Counterplay
Lol
Yes because major evasion doing the dodging for you is counterplay lol
As is having shields for ignoring % crit chance...
But shields take full, unmitigated damage. Crit or not, they take far more damage and require far more resources to keep up than dodge rolling. A 10K shield (halved from 20K in PVP) is done in one or two hits from most spammables in the game. Dodge roll can avoid those one to two spammables and then a few more, and even more if shuffle is up. Mag sorc is dead or nearly dead by the 3rd spammable unless they are spamming shields and doing zero offense.
1. More damage with 0% critical hits compared to, let's say 30% in critical hits, Seriously, aren't you confusing those two? Note, this effect is guaranteed!
30% critical bonus? Did you hear about critical resistance? Most PVP players wear full impen armor, even shield stacking sorcs run some impenetrable armor pieces.2. If you get lucky with it, remember 25% chance. And that's the entire point, no guarantee.
So in the end quite fair, even though sometimes one gets lucky and that becomes the whole reason for some, that this has to be removed.
Well we talk a sustained fight here and not an 1shot gank build, and 25% chance means that quarter of the hits will miss in a prolonged fight while on top of that you get a nice snare and root immunity with it.
Sorcerers don't have to wear any impenetrable pieces necessarely, exactly because of the shields, as long as they manage that part well. It has been that way since the game started and it's fine. People take a certain risk in that - be more powerful in exchange for using other traits - perfectly fine.
Same goes for medium armor, as this always becomes a topic: No magic resistance at all, but they can use an ability which comes with a risk too. Sometimes you get lucky, other times not and things hit you.
If you have problems with missing too many attacks, maybe you'll have more success using another ability here and there or builds. Sticking to a particular set of abilities, style and build is fine. But when anger yourself about not being able to beat one other combination of those, you might need to change something on your end to get the upper hand back.You reveal yourself best in how you play.
Kelces - Argonian Templar
Farel Donvu - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Navam Llervu - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Aniseth - Wood Elf Warden
Therediel - Wood Elf Templar
Nilonwy - Wood Elf Nightblade
Jurupari - Argonian Warden
Kú-Chulainn - Argonian Sorcerer
PC - EU
For the Pact!1 -
jaws343✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Malamar1229 wrote: »Counterplay
Lol
Yes because major evasion doing the dodging for you is counterplay lol
As is having shields for ignoring % crit chance...
But shields take full, unmitigated damage. Crit or not, they take far more damage and require far more resources to keep up than dodge rolling. A 10K shield (halved from 20K in PVP) is done in one or two hits from most spammables in the game. Dodge roll can avoid those one to two spammables and then a few more, and even more if shuffle is up. Mag sorc is dead or nearly dead by the 3rd spammable unless they are spamming shields and doing zero offense.
1. More damage with 0% critical hits compared to, let's say 30% in critical hits, Seriously, aren't you confusing those two? Note, this effect is guaranteed!
2. If you get lucky with it, remember 25% chance. And that's the entire point, no guarantee.
So in the end quite fair, even though sometimes one gets lucky and that becomes the whole reason for some, that this has to be removed.
You really don't understand how shields work. Let's say I have a skill with a tooltip of 10K outside of Cyrodil. In Cyrodil that skill is halved to 5K. If I hit someone with a shield, that shield takes all 5K damage. If I hit someone without a shield, they take the mitigated damage, probably closer to 3K damage depending on resistance and cps. If that attack is a crit, that player is maybe taking 1.7x (70% crit damage) the damage if they aren't running any impen (this is also dependent cps and other variables but 1.7x is pretty reasonable and 1.5x is base). So maybe they take 5.1K damage, but it isn't with every hit. The shield is going to take that 5k damage every single hit. If you allowed shields to crit they would literally be useless; that same 5K hit would hit for 8.5K, on a 10K shield. The only way you could allow shields to crit is if you in turn allowed casting a shield to crit or allowed damage to shields to be mitigated by resistance, impen and cps.
And dodge roll causes every dodgeable incoming attack to miss. Not % based, every attack.0 -
Olen_Mikko✭✭✭✭✭
✭Olen_Mikko wrote: »OMG i love the salty tears of bad sorcs. Now you actually need to know even a little, how to play.
"Buuhuu, i can't cheeseburst people. I want my OP Rune Cage back!"
Nice signature there, buck-o
Least we can see who was and wasn't affected by this patch.
I've had my fair share of nerfs. I'm okay with this patch and changes.NB enthusiastic:- Woodhippie stamblade - DW hard-hitter / PvE
- Know-it-all elf Magblade - Healer / PvE & PvP
- Hate-them-all elf Magblade - Destrostaff AoE monster / PvE
- Cyrodiil-Refugee stamblade - Stamina Tank / PvE
Go dominion or go home
Nightblade-Hipster. I played Nightblade before it was cool - from 1.5 onwards.0 -
Kelces✭✭✭✭✭You really don't understand how shields work. Let's say I have a skill with a tooltip of 10K outside of Cyrodil. In Cyrodil that skill is halved to 5K. If I hit someone with a shield, that shield takes all 5K damage. If I hit someone without a shield, they take the mitigated damage, probably closer to 3K damage depending on resistance and cps. If that attack is a crit, that player is maybe taking 1.7x (70% crit damage) the damage if they aren't running any impen (this is also dependent cps and other variables but 1.7x is pretty reasonable and 1.5x is base). So maybe they take 5.1K damage, but it isn't with every hit. The shield is going to take that 5k damage every single hit. If you allowed shields to crit they would literally be useless; that same 5K hit would hit for 8.5K, on a 10K shield. The only way you could allow shields to crit is if you in turn allowed casting a shield to crit or allowed damage to shields to be mitigated by resistance, impen and cps.
And dodge roll causes every dodgeable incoming attack to miss. Not % based, every attack.
I actually understand how this works and I never mentioned anything different to what you are saying essentially about how damage is taken. You however failed to mention, that a sorcerer, even though damage isn't mitigated, which I don't like either BTW, can't be hit by a critical damage.
You make it seem, as if magicka sorcerers would run out of magicka much faster, but what are dodging medium armor wearers doing to you exactly and what were you doing? Somethng wrong I guess, trying to attack someone when you can see them obviously rolling.
But that's again a totally different story to shuffle...You reveal yourself best in how you play.
Kelces - Argonian Templar
Farel Donvu - Dark Elf Sorcerer
Navam Llervu - Dark Elf Dragonknight
Aniseth - Wood Elf Warden
Therediel - Wood Elf Templar
Nilonwy - Wood Elf Nightblade
Jurupari - Argonian Warden
Kú-Chulainn - Argonian Sorcerer
PC - EU
For the Pact!1 -
Ragnarock41✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Apache_Kid wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Can we please have the dogeable, blockable, clearly telegraphed frag stun back?
sorcs have stuns apart from runecage. Two actually. Thats not the issue in my opinion. The problem is counter to sloads and runecage being given exclusively to stamNB's. If you dont have shuffle, youre still screwed. Why not make a counter to it ALL classes have easy access to? explain that...
When you aren't aware that shuffle is a skill under the medium armor skill line.
How embarrassing.
Well, considering populations it is. But maybe it’s a stamDK buff as well, and ZOS finally heard these. What do you think @Ragnarock41 ?
I would honestly say It doesn't mean too much for stamDks, we synergize terribly with medium armor, not because there are undodgeable-unreflectable abilities, but because our kit just doesn't make sense and outdated in general.
(my prototype medium Dk build runs 2 sustain sets plus jewels of misrule just to be able to sustain in medium and have some uptime on wings, and fyi I don't run shuffle. I think shuffle is too expensive for what it does and just for that reason wings have a place for medium Dks.).
Though in general c.frags is an ability that requires some timing for the user, so I would really prefer the stun on c.frags instead of dealing with rune cage.
Edited by Ragnarock41 on August 13, 2018 8:26PM0 -
Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Olen_Mikko wrote: »Olen_Mikko wrote: »OMG i love the salty tears of bad sorcs. Now you actually need to know even a little, how to play.
"Buuhuu, i can't cheeseburst people. I want my OP Rune Cage back!"
Nice signature there, buck-o
Least we can see who was and wasn't affected by this patch.
I've had my fair share of nerfs. I'm okay with this patch and changes.
I'm sure you are. It's always okay as long as you're not the one getting gutted.Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake0 -
Priyasekarssk✭✭✭✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »Is that intended? Because that is OP
Of course it is intended. No need to ask. With cloak always can dodge the CC.Edited by Priyasekarssk on August 13, 2018 8:27PM0 -
TheUndeadAmulet✭✭✭✭✭All I hear are sorcs crying that they cant pull off their busted op combo 100% of the time anymore
/s
No but seriously did you think that when they said rune cage was going to be dodgeable that it only meant dodge rolls? Also stamNB's arent the only class that is using shuffle.
We'll how this works out in a week or so.XBOX NA 1000+ CP
nerf ping please2 -
Dreyloch✭✭✭✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Micah_Bayer wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Can we please have the dogeable, blockable, clearly telegraphed frag stun back?
sorcs have stuns apart from runecage. Two actually. Thats not the issue in my opinion. The problem is counter to sloads and runecage being given exclusively to stamNB's. If you dont have shuffle, youre still screwed. Why not make a counter to it ALL classes have easy access to? explain that...
We only have one, if you're talking about flame reach, it is only viable if you have a master's staff
yes Im talking about flame reach, and it still stuns (knockback) your target. At least it did for me yesterday. And shock works too. If you want the 5 sec runecage lock, it HAD to go. It was not healthy at all, and it still isnt, because if youre not set up to rely on dodge, you will still be locked down. So gg nightblades and wtf devs were you thinking about giving ONE class this huge buff?
Yeah but you're not counting fear and fossilize which act same as rune cage. Through block and roll dodge and have no counter at all.
Fossilize and fear have ranges of like 6 meters I think? Rune cage has like 40? Flame reach and the lightning version both have a CC of sorts, but don't call that a Sorc only thing. That's from destro staff."The fear of Death, is often worse than death itself"0 -
Valrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Micah_Bayer wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Micah_Bayer wrote: »killimandrosb16_ESO wrote: »Can we please have the dogeable, blockable, clearly telegraphed frag stun back?
sorcs have stuns apart from runecage. Two actually. Thats not the issue in my opinion. The problem is counter to sloads and runecage being given exclusively to stamNB's. If you dont have shuffle, youre still screwed. Why not make a counter to it ALL classes have easy access to? explain that...
We only have one, if you're talking about flame reach, it is only viable if you have a master's staff
yes Im talking about flame reach, and it still stuns (knockback) your target. At least it did for me yesterday. And shock works too. If you want the 5 sec runecage lock, it HAD to go. It was not healthy at all, and it still isnt, because if youre not set up to rely on dodge, you will still be locked down. So gg nightblades and wtf devs were you thinking about giving ONE class this huge buff?
Yeah but you're not counting fear and fossilize which act same as rune cage. Through block and roll dodge and have no counter at all.
Fossilize and fear have ranges of like 6 meters I think? Rune cage has like 40? Flame reach and the lightning version both have a CC of sorts, but don't call that a Sorc only thing. That's from destro staff.
The range doesnt really matter since NB and DK stick to you like glue. In fact nearly all PVP is in close quarters combat since gap closers exist.Valrien Dravic -- Level 50 Dunmeri Sorcerer (EP)
Garahel Dravic -- Level 50 Bosmeri Nightblade (EP)Tamriel Unlimited was a mistake. One Tamriel was a bigger mistake0 -
Shardaxx✭✭✭✭✭ooh nice info thanks!
PS4 - Europe - Shardaxx - Wood Elf Nightblade - Aldmeri Dominion0 -
technohic✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I feel like this has hurt solo/independent sorcs who timed their burst properly but has some nothing to the ones in a large group who just spam it until it eventually lands.
We now have people spamming this and RD from a buddy and the usual spin to win0