Defensive rune change wasn't neccesary (our defence against nbs)

Aliyavana · August 2018

It's meant to give breathing room against ganks and bursts and it already has a drawback in that it can be used on a player it wasn't intended to be used on or even a npc. By making it dodgable it wont be effective against the players it is intended for, gankers, who run shuffle. Zos please consider not nerfing defensive rune when rune cage is the in demand version and is more problematic. Defensive rune won't even be worth slotting when rune cage you actually can choose your target.

Kikke · August 2018

We no longer have any defence against NBs anymore, I'm sorry =(

Aliyavana · August 2018

kikkehs wrote: »

We no longer have any defence against NBs anymore, I'm sorry =(

u tested it? The entire point of it was to prevent ganks

Kikke · August 2018

They can even land an ability and AC into dodgeroll, or so I've heard. But Evasion gives them a 15% chance too neglect the rune yes.

Aliyavana · August 2018

kikkehs wrote: »

They can even land an ability and AC into dodgeroll, or so I've heard. But Evasion gives them a 15% chance too neglect the rune yes.

Dissappointing that our anti gank tool was removed, thank you for your info

Didgerion · August 2018

Dark days begin for sorcs and magica builds in general. Vigor into Roll Dodge into Sprint into Los... That's the future of pvp.

Feanor · August 2018

It’s not surprising.

Mayrael · August 2018

Oh come on... Before summerset 90% of sorcs didn't even slot rune cage or defensive rune and they've managed perfectly, stop acting like suddenly end of the world. No more ez kills, that's all.

Feanor · August 2018

Mayrael wrote: »

Oh come on... Before summerset 90% of sorcs didn't even slot rune cage or defensive rune and they've managed perfectly, stop acting like suddenly end of the world. No more ez kills, that's all.

Before Summerset Sorcs also said that all they are capable of killing is bad players and that some build diversity finally would be nice also. The class is worse than in CWC now if you just look at class skills. And as for diversity, go farm vDSA for that staff again if you haven’t already.

White wabbit · August 2018

Question and this isn't a troll question ! Say a sorc is running defensive prison and another sorc is running rune cage and attacks the first sorc with that skill do both end up in a cage

Aliyavana · August 2018

White wabbit wrote: »

Question and this isn't a troll question ! Say a sorc is running defensive prison and another sorc is running rune cage and attacks the first sorc with that skill do both end up in a cage

yes, I ran def rune to counter rune cages

Beardimus · August 2018

It's a crap change. Zero need for it. I'm losing faith totally if I'm honest.

White wabbit · August 2018

Aliyavana wrote: »

White wabbit wrote: »

Question and this isn't a troll question ! Say a sorc is running defensive prison and another sorc is running rune cage and attacks the first sorc with that skill do both end up in a cage

yes, I ran def rune to counter rune cages

Cheers I might use it on my stam sorc

gepe87 · August 2018

Stand strong fellow sorcerers. These are dark days. I think they will revert defensive rune. No one cry about that.

Qbiken · August 2018

Personally rune-cage could´ve stayed the way it is, with a few changes:

* Give it a small cast-time (similar to Dark Deal/Converison) and make it interruptible
* Add a visual mark to the skill on the target so they know they´re about to get hit by rune-cage.
* Reduce the range

Regarding defensive rune, I think it should only apply for direct damage.

Feanor · August 2018

I think the best solution would have been to make it dodgeable, blockable, and only apply if you have hit the opponent with 10 consecutive light attacks before and he is concussed, burning, and chilled and not lower than 80% HP. Counterplay, you know.

Mayrael · August 2018

Feanor wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

Oh come on... Before summerset 90% of sorcs didn't even slot rune cage or defensive rune and they've managed perfectly, stop acting like suddenly end of the world. No more ez kills, that's all.

Before Summerset Sorcs also said that all they are capable of killing is bad players and that some build diversity finally would be nice also. The class is worse than in CWC now if you just look at class skills. And as for diversity, go farm vDSA for that staff again if you haven’t already.

Diversity? Like 100% sorcs switched from flame reach to rune cage, is this your diversity? Nope, that's just cheese. And now thanks to cage sorcs were able to kill even easier bad players while the tanky ones are still unkillable, not to mention that other classes struggles to kill as you call it "good players", without undodgeable-unblockable nuke, combined with delayed execute and unavoidable stun that deals damage,which is also delayed (which allows to land skill before target has any chances to react). Yeah, sorcs are in terribad position. Poor mag sorcs, #BuffMagSorcs2018...

Feanor · August 2018

Buff? Not necessarily. Overhaul? Definitely.

Mayrael · August 2018

Feanor wrote: »

Buff? Not necessarily. Overhaul? Definitely.

Agree on that 100%. Also about the diversity. It's the only class that is build almost always the same. That's why I switched from it again. It's simply boring. But defending broken skill is not the right way to fix the class, sorry but no.

Chilly-McFreeze · August 2018

Mayrael wrote: »

Oh come on... Before summerset 90% of sorcs didn't even slot rune cage or defensive rune and they've managed perfectly, stop acting like suddenly end of the world. No more ez kills, that's all.

Many had defensive rune on their overload bar since bar space is tight on that class. The overbuff to the offensive morph simply made them remorph and put it on their main bars. I had defensive rune on my OL since forever and more than enough times I got caught in it as well. We are on the same server, so it's interesting how out perception differs.

However, with that attitude alone it would be okay to nerf every less used skill to the point where is even less incentive to use them. Sounds wrong, right?

Mayrael · August 2018

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Mayrael wrote: »

Oh come on... Before summerset 90% of sorcs didn't even slot rune cage or defensive rune and they've managed perfectly, stop acting like suddenly end of the world. No more ez kills, that's all.

Many had defensive rune on their overload bar since bar space is tight on that class. The overbuff to the offensive morph simply made them remorph and put it on their main bars. I had defensive rune on my OL since forever and more than enough times I got caught in it as well. We are on the same server, so it's interesting how out perception differs.

However, with that attitude alone it would be okay to nerf every less used skill to the point where is even less incentive to use them. Sounds wrong, right?

Well, sorry because I could be unclear on the case. Rune Cage needed the change, but Defensive Rune should stay undodgeable.

Derra · August 2018

Mayrael wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

Buff? Not necessarily. Overhaul? Definitely.

Agree on that 100%. Also about the diversity. It's the only class that is build almost always the same. That's why I switched from it again. It's simply boring. But defending broken skill is not the right way to fix the class, sorry but no.

I feel people mistake sorcs being angry about the cage change as defending the skill.

People aren´t defending cage. Cage was broken.

But sorc in CWC was broken too. That´s why cage got changed and then buffed. There was a reason for this - that reason is the removal of frags cc destroying sorc build diversity.
Now the tool to make builds without masterstaff work is gone again (nerfed to a worse state than before).

Sorc is back to square one. Where we started before runecage got added. Makes you think what they´ll overbuff and overnerf next - without understanding the underlying issues of the class.

Galarthor · August 2018

Aliyavana wrote: »

kikkehs wrote: »

They can even land an ability and AC into dodgeroll, or so I've heard. But Evasion gives them a 15% chance too neglect the rune yes.

Dissappointing that our anti gank tool was removed, thank you for your info

Well NBs weren't satisfied with the successful ganks ratio, so ZOS helped them out.

Many NBs probably went mad b/c there were a few sorcs that they couldn't one shot from stealth.

Waffennacht · August 2018

Smh. Just smh.

Waiting for the days of DKs and Templars being good again

Also waiting for mag warden to be better than average

NordSwordnBoard · August 2018

What did defensive rune ever do to anybody they didn't deserve?

Exodium · August 2018

Guys keep this page as close to the top as possible so ZoS don't allow defensive rune change to go live.

If used correctly, Defensive rune has always been a counterplay skill to ganks and high bursts, allowing us a second to heal and readjust ourselves before going offensive again. With this change, ZoS is basically removing another skill that offers counterplay.

ZoS, please regard the things said in this thread as no one complained about defensive rune to begin with. It's not like rune prison where that was used to compliment a 20k burst offensive rotation, rendering the opponent useless. This is a purely defensive tool, hence the name, so kindly allow it to continue doing so!

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

Vapirko · August 2018

If this affects defensive rune that sucks for Stam sorcs.

Aliyavana · August 2018

Vapirko wrote: »

If this affects defensive rune that sucks for Stam sorcs.

Indeed, this change along with sloads not affecting cloak is a buff for nbs. The offensive rune cage was a problem but defensive rune is used for defense against burst and it's drawback is that even guards and pets can eat it.

Mayrael · August 2018

Aliyavana wrote: »

Vapirko wrote: »

If this affects defensive rune that sucks for Stam sorcs.

Indeed, this change along with sloads not affecting cloak is a buff for nbs. The offensive rune cage was a problem but defensive rune is used for defense against burst and it's drawback is that even guards and pets can eat it.

Yup. Defensive rune needs to stay undodgeable and unblockable.

Didaco · August 2018

Guys I don't want so sound like the troll of the situation, but it's not like everyone is going to roll cancel their skills.

A ganker would still have to roll cancel it's opener if they don't want to get caught in the stun, effectively delaying the gank time and giving you the necessary time to recover.
The change will skew good players from bad ones, imo.

Feanor · August 2018

Didaco wrote: »

Guys I don't want so sound like the troll of the situation, but it's not like everyone is going to roll cancel their skills.

A ganker would still have to roll cancel it's opener if they don't want to get caught in the stun, effectively delaying the gank time and giving you the necessary time to recover.
The change will skew good players from bad ones, imo.

It just doesn’t make any sense. The Sorc is sacrificing a bar slot for a defensive option that has its only purpose to avoid getting ganged up. And now that only purpose is made conditional?