The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Is shield breaker balanced?
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bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭NoThe_Protagonist wrote: »For heavens sake GiT GuD scrub!
It only procs on active shields, unlike sloads that procs on anything.
That’s like saying “just stop healing” to someone who thinks defile is too strong.
Best post of the day!1 -
bardx86✭✭✭✭✭
✭NoLuckily we don't need such folly, as there are plenty of examples of sorcerer killing speed. Take this one: first point of damage taken at 0:07, dead at 0:08:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=4s
Well, the same as at interval 0:05-0:06, right?
Yep. I never claimed sorcs are the only ones capable of killing fast.
You will notice however how that 0:05-0:06 killing power comes at the price of extreme squishiness. Unlike the sorc princesses here who complain even if it takes over 7 seconds to kill them.
killing someone with Light attacks only in 7 sec is balanced little nightblade princess ?
Yes, it absolutely is. If you let someone light attack you for 7 seconds without doing something about it, that's 12(!) light attacks by the way, each with a very obvious audio clue, then you deserved it.
Then create a sorc and show me how you'll do that.
Here you have the chance to prove us wrong but you won't be able to.
I have shown you a video of a sorc killing his target in one second.
A duel to prove it can be done in seven is thus completely pointless.
A sorc can not kill someone in 1 sec. Sorcs don't have a 20k+ skill0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
1 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Yeah, I’ll get right on the heavy armor thing, it synergizes so well with Magicka regen, cost, and spell penetration.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
To deal with pressure, you either increase your healing or mitigation or avoidance.
There is very little that can be done by sorcs to handle high oblivion damage. Mitigation does nothing, leaving only avoidance (which is limited on a mag class, especially when it's spammed every 0.6 seconds) and healing.. and yes, it is impossible to outheal on a sorc' for longer than the duration of a resto ultimate.
So if you think adding more health on a sorc' is the solution to shieldbreaker, you're wrong.Edited by Biro123 on July 30, 2018 9:26PMMinalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
rfennell_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Yes
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
No one that is using shieldbreaker is likely doing nothing but light attack (and if they are, they won't be very successful).
As for the whole dps drops to a shocking 2.2k, the way shield breaker is used (properly, not a spam scenario) is as an execute. 2.2k dps>0 dps versus shield stack.
The actual value of shield breaker is to stop a shield stacker you got low (or just happens to be low) from stacking shields over their healing ward and getting back to full health while you are attacking them. In many situations the brand new shield stack is nearly impossible to get through, A good sorc that stacks shields while dodge rolling or streaking when they get low makes it really difficult to focus enough damage on them to get through to even touch the healing ward.1 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭Norfennell_ESO wrote: »
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
No one that is using shieldbreaker is likely doing nothing but light attack (and if they are, they won't be very successful).
As for the whole dps drops to a shocking 2.2k, the way shield breaker is used (properly, not a spam scenario) is as an execute. 2.2k dps>0 dps versus shield stack.
The actual value of shield breaker is to stop a shield stacker you got low (or just happens to be low) from stacking shields over their healing ward and getting back to full health while you are attacking them. In many situations the brand new shield stack is nearly impossible to get through, A good sorc that stacks shields while dodge rolling or streaking when they get low makes it really difficult to focus enough damage on them to get through to even touch the healing ward.
So just l2p and time your burst better.
Also, you don't need shieldbreaker to kill a low HP sorc. Infused + damage health glyph with execute will kill the sorc easely.
There is actually 70 noobs that don't know how to play, why they loose their time of forum instead of l2p ?0 -
Grimhallow✭✭✭NoNo, it isn't balanced. Its's way too hard a counter, and whats worse is that it is completely braindead. Spamming light attacks from a zerg isn't fun for the player taking or dealing the damage. It needs to be a mechanic that assists in the fight against shield users, instead of completely bypassing them on light attacks. It should be a cleanable dot that lasts 10 seconds, causing more along the lines of 1/4 of your damage to go through shields (and the other 3/4 of your damage to be applied to the shield) when the shield breaker dot is active. That way at least you have to do something to make it useful besides left click.0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭NoThe issue is that shield breaker is usually worn with sloads, and there’s more than one genius hiding in the Zerg using that gem.
So what, 4K per second, plus 2-3 stacked sload DOTS. Lol.0 -
brandonv516✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭YesGet rid of Oblivion damage.
Then implement any or all of the following:
A Minor/Major Shield system
Status effects go through shields
Shields can be hit with critical damage1 -
Amdar_Godkiller✭✭✭✭✭YesThe issue is that shield breaker is usually worn with sloads, and there’s more than one genius hiding in the Zerg using that gem.
So what, 4K per second, plus 2-3 stacked sload DOTS. Lol.
No it's not. The two don't synergize well at all.
Sload's synergizes with skoria and then you need a sustain set or you will just die the first time someone CCs you.
Shieldbreaker works best on a bow or WW build, which presents its own challenges.1 -
Gnozo✭✭✭✭✭
✭NoJust saying that someone on PC EU is using Shieldbreaker +Torugs with infused Restostaff on his stamblade in medium armor.
Spamming undodgeable light attacks, using Speed options and also surviving the so called holy sorc burst combination.
While he is still doing 6k incaps and 3-4k surprise attacks on his 2h bar.
And as a sorc you have 0 chance against 4k dps that you cant even dodge. In addition he is not weak against non shield user.....
Where are your arguments now?0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
2 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NoTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YesTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.3 -
Aedaryl✭✭✭✭✭
✭NoTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.
not a true net loss, the 1-4 bonus are good.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YesTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.
not a true net loss, the 1-4 bonus are good.
There are other sets whose 1-4 bonuses are just as good, and the 5-piece bonus works everytime.
So yes, its a true net loss.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭NoTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.
not a true net loss, the 1-4 bonus are good.
There are other sets whose 1-4 bonuses are just as good, and the 5-piece bonus works everytime.
So yes, its a true net loss.
And that net loss is maybe 3-4% damage.. hardly makes you useless, unless you were useless to begin with..
Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.1 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NoTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.
Dressing Room or Alpha Gear.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭YesTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.
Dressing Room or Alpha Gear.
Because you always have the luxury of choosing your gear before the combat starts.1 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' . It won't help at all if your opponent is semi-competent, yet gimps you Vs all others.
I guess we just have to leave it here. The only way you're ever going to understand how completely broken this is, is to be on the receiving end of it yourself as a sorc'. Which you won't, despite the offers. Keep your head in the sand, stay ignorant. But I don't know how you can look at yourself in the mirror while willfully staying ignorant yet continuing to argue with those who play both sorcs and stam classes...
Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
NupidStoob✭✭✭✭✭NoAny ability that completely bypasses defenses is simply bad design. It's the same issue with sloads and I am glad non sorcs got to experience how fun it is. Yet it seems too difficult for non sorcs to relate how dumb shieldbreaker is. Just imagine the outcry if there was a set that would read like: "When you deal damage with a Light or Heavy Attack against a INSERT CLASS, you deal an additional 2150 Oblivion Damage to them".
It's also why runecage/petrify are dumb.
Abilities and sets should have clear counterplay that doesn't involve changing your build completely just to deal with them.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' .
It gives you more time to react, regardless of how skilled the other player is.Edited by Sharee on July 31, 2018 8:22AM1 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭NoTo answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
What it also does is lower your offensive capabilities and your shield strength, so it’s a net loss.
Its a net loss against someone who does not use shieldbreaker.
Kinda like shieldbreaker is a net loss when fighting someone without shields.
Dressing Room or Alpha Gear.
Because you always have the luxury of choosing your gear before the combat starts.
It’s not uncommon. You can either do that or outright run in a group/zerg where the 5pc difference on stamina chars doesn’t matter.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 46 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1700+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' .
It gives you more time to react, regardless of how skilled the other player is.
Time to react means nothing when its sustained pressure... Jeez I already explained this...Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yes
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' .
It gives you more time to react, regardless of how skilled the other player is.
Time to react means nothing when its sustained pressure... Jeez I already explained this...
And as i already explained, a competent sorc needs less time to kill his target using all his skills than the shieldbreaker needs to kill just with light attacks.
How much time does curse-fury-cage-frag need? How much damage will shieldbreaker do in the same time period? Do the math. 2150(hell even 3500) sustained pressure is nothing compared to the damage output of a fully committed sorc. See the video i posted earlier. 19K HP blown up in a second.
I really did not want to write this because it goes against my principles but... if you can not kill a light attacking shieldbreaker before he can go through your full HP bar, you need to work on your burst.3 -
NupidStoob✭✭✭✭✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' .
It gives you more time to react, regardless of how skilled the other player is.
Time to react means nothing when its sustained pressure... Jeez I already explained this...
And as i already explained, a competent sorc needs less time to kill his target using all his skills than the shieldbreaker needs to kill just with light attacks.
How much time does curse-fury-cage-frag need? How much damage will shieldbreaker do in the same time period? Do the math. 2150(hell even 3500) sustained pressure is nothing compared to the damage output of a fully committed sorc. See the video i posted earlier. 19K HP blown up in a second.
I really did not want to write this because it goes against my principles but... if you can not kill a light attacking shieldbreaker before he can go through your full HP bar, you need to work on your burst.
Can you stop with the completely unrelevant stuff. Who cares if someone only light attacking can win or not. Alone the presumption that everytime a magsorc uses combo it's a sure kill lol.
In a duel between higher skilled players stamclasses already have the edge on magsorcs, now you add shieldbreaker and the fight wouldn't last 15 seconds.0 -
Gnozo✭✭✭✭✭
✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' .
It gives you more time to react, regardless of how skilled the other player is.
Time to react means nothing when its sustained pressure... Jeez I already explained this...
And as i already explained, a competent sorc needs less time to kill his target using all his skills than the shieldbreaker needs to kill just with light attacks.
How much time does curse-fury-cage-frag need? How much damage will shieldbreaker do in the same time period? Do the math. 2150(hell even 3500) sustained pressure is nothing compared to the damage output of a fully committed sorc. See the video i posted earlier. 19K HP blown up in a second.
I really did not want to write this because it goes against my principles but... if you can not kill a light attacking shieldbreaker before he can go through your full HP bar, you need to work on your burst.
Come pts and how me pls
Curse an enemy with a destructive rune, dealing 5437 Magic Damage to the target and 2504 Magic Damage to all other nearby enemies after 6 seconds
So from curse cast to the actual damage from it together with rune cage, meteor, frag and fury it takes about 6 seconds. Ofc when it goes off its only 1 sec of all incoming damage but you need to build it up first wich takes time. Time where you get hit by shieldbreaker for at least 6 seconds. 3.5k dps by JUST doing light attacks. Its the easiest proc condition in game. No effort needed besides left click.
If you still think thats fine, my and @BohnT offer stands to proove your point on pts.0 -
Biro123✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭No
Against a magsorc? On my medium armor stam toon? Curse-fury-runecage-frag, and i have other things to worry about than spamming you with light attacks.
He will know how to defend himself, not die to the first sorc burst that comes in, then not come crying to the to the forums.
If he defends himself, he is no longer just spamming light attacks. To get the mystical 3500 DPS, he must do nothing but a light attack every 0.6 seconds. If he uses skills(which have a 1s GCD), their animation will interfere with the light attack spam, and his shieldbreaker DPS will fall considerably.
Yeah, dps drops to a shocking 2.2k..
Which is a ~40% decrease, and will take almost 12 seconds to chew through a 25K hitpoint bar.
Which is a typical stam hp bar size, not a sorc' hp bar.
Are you telling me that you are incapable of surviving in pvp for 12 seconds?
Sure i can survive for 12 seconds. But not while maintaining 2150 shieldbreaker DPS (much less 3500 DPS).
A magsorc is not the kind of opponent who gives you the luxury of uninterrupted 12 second light attack spam:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=6s
Well, I'd say you just need to change your build to survive the current meta.
I could give the same advice to you. Starting with "25K HP is not a typical sorc HP bar".
Don't you understand anything about how this game works?
It's not about how big your health pool is. That is only needed to survive burst.
It's about healing per second (or shielding per second) Vs damage per second - with a whole bunch of other stuff to affect that difference, mitigation, avoidance, buffs, cc bursts etc.
You don't add 5k health to try to handle high pressure damage.. you add it to handle burst.
"I only need health to survive burst, and since all the enemy burst is stopped by my shields, i don't need health" - says the sorc in the meta of shieldbreaker.
And then you wonder why shieldbreaker kills you before you can do something about it. This is a perfect example of time when, as you put it, "you just need to change your build to survive the current meta."
To answer the unasked question "what good will extra 5K HP do to me": It extends the window you have to react to the shieldbreaker, allowing you more time to either kill the enemy or get yourself to safety.
And we're back to 'only if the SB user is a complete and utter potato' .
It gives you more time to react, regardless of how skilled the other player is.
Time to react means nothing when its sustained pressure... Jeez I already explained this...
And as i already explained, a competent sorc needs less time to kill his target using all his skills than the shieldbreaker needs to kill just with light attacks.
How much time does curse-fury-cage-frag need? How much damage will shieldbreaker do in the same time period? Do the math. 2150(hell even 3500) sustained pressure is nothing compared to the damage output of a fully committed sorc. See the video i posted earlier. 19K HP blown up in a second.
I really did not want to write this because it goes against my principles but... if you can not kill a light attacking shieldbreaker before he can go through your full HP bar, you need to work on your burst.
If you're dying to a single, well put-together sorc burst - you need to both learn to counter it AND you're build needs adjusting.
If you think simply spamming light attacks should defeat a well-timed, interruptable burst that takes several seconds to set up, involving multiple abilities, good timing and can only be done every 7 seconds (when your tatget is cc-immune) - then you really have no respect for the game..
May as well play cod if you want a game where tapping the left button is all that's needed to score kills.Minalan owes me a beer.
PC EU Megaserver
Minie Mo - Stam/Magblade - DC
Woody Ron - Stamplar - DC
Aidee - Magsorc - DC
Notadorf - Stamsorc - DC
Khattman Doo - Stamblade - Relegated to Crafter, cos AD.1 -
pieratsos✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NoLuckily we don't need such folly, as there are plenty of examples of sorcerer killing speed. Take this one: first point of damage taken at 0:07, dead at 0:08:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEzSDS5yWqI&feature=youtu.be&t=4s
Well, the same as at interval 0:05-0:06, right?
Yep. I never claimed sorcs are the only ones capable of killing fast.
You will notice however how that 0:05-0:06 killing power comes at the price of extreme squishiness. Unlike the sorc princesses here who complain even if it takes over 7 seconds to kill them.
killing someone with Light attacks only in 7 sec is balanced little nightblade princess ?
Yes, it absolutely is. If you let someone light attack you for 7 seconds without doing something about it, that's 12(!) light attacks by the way, each with a very obvious audio clue, then you deserved it.
Then create a sorc and show me how you'll do that.
Here you have the chance to prove us wrong but you won't be able to.
I have shown you a video of a sorc killing his target in one second.
A duel to prove it can be done in seven is thus completely pointless.
You are not really familiar with the terms DPS and burst dmg are you?0