Moon Hunter Keep Walkthrough and Guide (Spoilers)

WhitePawPrints

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

@WhitePawPrints

Very nice guide. I was just about to write one myself and you beat me to it ! Good work and I agree with almost all. Here's what I think is missing or can be better in the guide:

Mylene:

-The healer can stay near the tank but not with. In fact none of the 4 players can too close to one another. The reason is that the pounce not only pins the target down on the floor but also anyone close to him and before you know it there's no one left to interrupt. 4 meter range at all times between all party members

Archivist:

-The archivist has a ranged lightning (heavy) that effectivly 1-shots dps/healer unless interrupted. As tank as usually charge in to prevent the death

-There is a much safer positioning tactic. Instead of putting the healer completely at entrance and have him at times out of range from the dps who have sidestep behind wall or get killed by moving hulking werewolves, leave the entire entrance area up till the first 2 starting human adds to the tank and the tank only. No one else should ever enter this area. The tank stands in this area the whole fight facing the boss and causing all adds to face the entrance. He stands at maximum chainpull distance from the adds that spawn on the stairs (in front of boss but as far away as possible) ready to insta-pull them to center upon spawning. If they turn he can then easily take a few steps back inside his entrance rectangle area while staying in block if needed and forcing all adds to always face entrance. This way they never can get even near the enrage circle and never have any cone dmge (hulking werewolves) near any of the dps or healers. NO matter how the adds and big werewolf twist or turn they are never a danger to anyone but the tank and the healer can fit all 4 players in 1 healing spring circle the whole fight ! How awesome is that

Great additions!

I must've not included the lightning channeling ability that is placed on a random player.

This is basically similar to Sioria's Flare from Cloudrest. Basically the way to counter it is to have a player stand within the same circle that is expanding out from the player being targeted. That'll spread the damage to both players and they'll both survive.

I'll edit my tank recommendations on that part, since when I edited it, I kind of didn't proofread it and it doesn't make much sense xD

Edit: I updated the OP. Hopefully it'll explain the positioning of the tank better when it comes to the adds.

mocap

@WhitePawPrints
one thing i don't get it - do i need to taunt last boss adds? Or only one pet and boss itself?

profundidob16_ESO

mocap wrote: »

@WhitePawPrints
one thing i don't get it - do i need to taunt last boss adds? Or only one pet and boss itself?

just to avoid any possible confusion: with 'adds' I mean the werewolves that spawn throughout the fight, not the boss pet dogs ARY and ZEL

yes you run to and taunt the adds right after they spawn because even though a dps or healer can easily survive 1 or maybe 2 adds they keep stacking up to like 4+ in certain phases and they will kill the dps/healer at some point especially with the all the other collateral damage and totem fears going on. In any case they slow down your group dps for sure. Dps with adds on them should bring them to the tank so he can talons+taunt them

As tank watch the boss health and recognize the different phases it triggers. This will allow you to predict perfectly when the adds spawn and run to their position (to pick em up) even before they spawn. They always spawn in the same location so it's like run back to entrance and do your little circle to pick up em then finish all off in center after you drop a talons and then get ready to pick up the first dog again and move it to your default dog-tanking position which is either completely at entrance or completely at boss depending on which tactic you prefer.

TIP: if you keep your tank position around center while dogs are sleeping and your dps is on the boss you will clearly see when the boss switches from his "ranged mage on the spot" phase into his "running around doing melee phase" because this exact animation tells you that the adds are about to spawn right now behind you near entrance. Since you had the boss taunted he'll run straight to you in center the second he switches and you are already very close to the adds that are about to spawn so you can round up all with boss in a few seconds.

The pet dogs ARY and ZEL you need to taunt and focus fire down 1 by 1. So for instance first taunt and kill ARY, then taunt and kill ZEL immediately after and then go back to dpssing boss which triggers next phase (adds). If you taunt both dogs at the same time it's too much dmge and you'll die. However if you wait too long before pulling the second dog it will suddenly jump and instakill a group member. This means you waited beyond maximum time allowed to taunt it and typically happens when your dps is way too slow at killing the first dog. Even in groups with high group dps this can happen easily, for instance when 1 of the dps just died right before the dogs woke up again.

If you time it well the dogs are always down when the adds spawn so you always run back to entrance to pick em all up and drag in center and always after that (or during this phase) the dogs will respawn. So taunt adds and dropping talons is enough to be ready to taunt and move the first dog again. Should for whatever reason you take too long killing adds and have them all up together with the dogs at some point then the dogs always have priority tanking wise (but not dps wise! dps finishes adds first then goes back to dogs). Regardless of how many adds are still alive and maybe not yet taunted you must immediately ranged taunt and move the first dog to the correct position because that is exactly what causes the other dog (they share 1 single chain) to be restrained preventing it from killing your other group members.

As tank no matter what happens you need 1 eye on the sleeping dogs all the time so that you are ready to range taunt the first one the second it wakes up again ! The reason is that the dps has a good chance to survive the remaining adds (and kill them easy with destro ulti or aoe) but not the dogs. Dogs kill your dps really fast so must be taken away asap. Dps finishes adds then comes to kill the dogs again 1 by 1

WhitePawPrints

On final boss the most effective way I’ve found is that the tank does NOT taunt in adds. This is to avoid cleaving the boss down too much that can run the risk of the break chain mechanic. Also so the tank can be positioning the AOEs away from the group and less risk of dying to missing heavy attacks from the werewolf adds.

The adds are deadly so the DPS need to kite them, utilizing snares like Caltrops, roots like Trap and Mines and Stuns.

At 30% is when 4 werewolves will drop into the arena making it more difficult. Consistent use of CC abilities is needed. Typically my group goes for a straight burn after 30%. To note that my 2 DPS pull over 100k DPS combined so not sure if a burn is advisable for all groups.

Tank only needs to taunt one pet. If done with magicka DPS both pets can be burned separately and go down around the same time. With two stamina though, DPS focuses the taunted pet first, then tank taunts the second pet so it can be focused down.

emilyhyoyeon

is it supposed to happen where (during final boss HM), there are only 3 available correct symbols to stand on, forcing one group member to die? it has happened to my group several times

Dymence

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

is it supposed to happen where (during final boss HM), there are only 3 available correct symbols to stand on, forcing one group member to die? it has happened to my group several times

It is not intentional, that would make the HM/speedrun/nodeath achievement impossible. I haven't encountered this with my group. Are you sure you aren't simply overlooking them in the chaos?

profundidob16_ESO

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

is it supposed to happen where (during final boss HM), there are only 3 available correct symbols to stand on, forcing one group member to die? it has happened to my group several times

that didn't happen for us so far. Everyone was able to hide.


note: on the Archivist however we've had this since PTS and I believe I reported it as a bug even

Apherius

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

is it supposed to happen where (during final boss HM), there are only 3 available correct symbols to stand on, forcing one group member to die? it has happened to my group several times

there is 4 available correct symboles to stand on.

Sometimes there is a bug and you can't see 1 of the 4 " symbole " above the tiny zone.

rotaugen454

Has anyone soloed this on normal mode? I've tried with a couple different characters to no avail yet.

profundidob16_ESO

WhitePawPrints wrote: »

On final boss the most effective way I’ve found is that the tank does NOT taunt in adds. This is to avoid cleaving the boss down too much that can run the risk of the break chain mechanic. Also so the tank can be positioning the AOEs away from the group and less risk of dying to missing heavy attacks from the werewolf adds.

The adds are deadly so the DPS need to kite them, utilizing snares like Caltrops, roots like Trap and Mines and Stuns.

At 30% is when 4 werewolves will drop into the arena making it more difficult. Consistent use of CC abilities is needed. Typically my group goes for a straight burn after 30%. To note that my 2 DPS pull over 100k DPS combined so not sure if a burn is advisable for all groups.

Tank only needs to taunt one pet. If done with magicka DPS both pets can be burned separately and go down around the same time. With two stamina though, DPS focuses the taunted pet first, then tank taunts the second pet so it can be focused down.

I believe this tactic may work for your exceptional group with 2 dps that are able to pull over 100k and/or drop cc's of all sorts taking up 2-3 slots per dps while kiting at the same time in order to keep themselves from being killed by the deadly adds which are clearly meant to be tanked by something tankier than dps If you pulleld that off I'm convinced that your group is truly awesome but in no way a representation for the average 'HM worthy' group. =P It's possible for your group yes but there really should be an extra achievement for that level of play After trying your position initially as well on release day until we eventually found a better option and now comparing both I now clearly see a few problems with your proposed tactic that will make it impossible to apply for such a typical avarage 'HM worthy' group even though your group might be able to pull it off. Please allow me to identify them and immediately present the solution to them as well:

-Dps dying because they are not masters of cc in the first place and even if they manage to pull off cc their effective dps goes down by so much that they cannot kill the adds fast enough before dying themselves.

=> A better way imho is that the tank picks up and holds agro of all adds. After all a tank above all group members is equipped with aoe cc skills like talons or psijic equivalent (besides chainpull/ranged taunt) to allow everyone to escape their deadly damage and can easily survive some blows from them on top of the boss. In addition timewise (every second matters) he is the perfect group member to kite adds/boss/dogs and continuously (re)position himself and all mobs optimally as needed so that the dps can focus on unleashing their best dps including aoe without having to worry about killing themself or accidentily pushing boss.

-Tank dying due to unintended cleave damage on the boss which triggers more mechanics than wanted/bearable and to excessive aoe's dropping on top of boss+all adds. This is common when you try to tank the dog pets and everything else at the boss position since the adds do require some aoe dps and it's almost impossible not to hit the boss with unintended dps as everything is stacked in 1 spot. In addition since totems are being dropped on a player they will arrive in the middle of everything (dogs+adds+aoe+boss+totem drop...) causing deaths in no time as the totem fear causes tank to instadrop block mode (sometimes split second before heavy attack...) and send group members into red aoe and adds.

=> a better way imho is to tank the pet dogs in the 2 left/right corners at entrance. With regards to the 2dogs-1chain-mechanic the effect its exactly the same as tanking around the boss position but now the dps has alot of safe space to move around freely without having to worry about boss aoe or the boss himself, totems dropping with no safe space to move to and most of all no damage at all on the dps. They can work down the dogs, then boss, then adds all separately and control exactly when to push the boss health into next phase and when not to. There's never a risk for accidental cleave/aoe damage on the boss since he stands there alone with his aoe doing ranged attacks.

sidenote: Not 100% sure but I believe the totem to drop on furthest group member because every time I tank dogs there as tank in the left/right entrance corner the totem drops alot exactly on top of me (the tank) in the very corner and I can simply sidestep/roll to the other corner since both corners are only 2m apart. This makes it all alot more controlled and accessible to lower dps groups since using this tactic they can now work down each phase separately 1 by 1 instead of getting multiple mechanics together. When I tank at boss position the totem drops in al sorts of random locations, probably because I'm not longer the guaranteed furthest person away from boss.

-Killing both pets at once with split dps while 1 pet is taunted and the other chained is very risky business for obvious reasons and as you said it yourself, not even an option for all builds. The chained pet that is not taunted can still insta-kill a melee dps with it's cleave and if the other dps doesn't kill the taunted dog fast enough the chained one will insta-kill him with a timer triggered jump mechanic that cannot be interrupted. In other words dog 1 must be down within a specific timer window or some dps dies because the second dog was not taunted fast enough. The only alternative is that the tank taunts both dogs to him at some point and we all know where that leads...

=> a better way imho would be that the tank safely (for himself) tanks only 1 dog at a time and keeps that dog facing the entrance so its cleave dmge can never hit the dps while the other dog is safely chained away to its wall. As soon as the first dog dies the tank pulls the next dog to him and both dps keep standing in place doing the same shared dps including aoe on the second dog now (maximizing total dps uptime on the dogs). No need for 1 dps to move to the other dog and restart dps cycle to help finish off. Also both dps always have a safe zone to stand in on 1 side of the room. In addition during the phase where the boss goes melee and comes to the center with adds popping up in center as well and the dps kills them exactly there the dogs will respawn. The tank can then safely pull the first dog back to the entrance while the boss teleports back to the other side of the room and the dps has time to clear up last adds in the center and then come kill the dogs again. This way the damage is controlled and separated in 3 different parts of the room instead of all on top of eachother


I hope this detailed explanation helps clarify

WhitePawPrints

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

WhitePawPrints wrote: »

On final boss the most effective way I’ve found is that the tank does NOT taunt in adds. This is to avoid cleaving the boss down too much that can run the risk of the break chain mechanic. Also so the tank can be positioning the AOEs away from the group and less risk of dying to missing heavy attacks from the werewolf adds.

The adds are deadly so the DPS need to kite them, utilizing snares like Caltrops, roots like Trap and Mines and Stuns.

At 30% is when 4 werewolves will drop into the arena making it more difficult. Consistent use of CC abilities is needed. Typically my group goes for a straight burn after 30%. To note that my 2 DPS pull over 100k DPS combined so not sure if a burn is advisable for all groups.

Tank only needs to taunt one pet. If done with magicka DPS both pets can be burned separately and go down around the same time. With two stamina though, DPS focuses the taunted pet first, then tank taunts the second pet so it can be focused down.

I believe this tactic may work for your exceptional group with 2 dps that are able to pull over 100k and/or drop cc's of all sorts taking up 2-3 slots per dps while kiting at the same time in order to keep themselves from being killed by the deadly adds which are clearly meant to be tanked by something tankier than dps If you pulleld that off I'm convinced that your group is truly awesome but in no way a representation for the average 'HM worthy' group. =P It's possible for your group yes but there really should be an extra achievement for that level of play After trying your position initially as well on release day until we eventually found a better option and now comparing both I now clearly see a few problems with your proposed tactic that will make it impossible to apply for such a typical avarage 'HM worthy' group even though your group might be able to pull it off. Please allow me to identify them and immediately present the solution to them as well:

-Dps dying because they are not masters of cc in the first place and even if they manage to pull off cc their effective dps goes down by so much that they cannot kill the adds fast enough before dying themselves.

=> A better way imho is that the tank picks up and holds agro of all adds. After all a tank above all group members is equipped with aoe cc skills like talons or psijic equivalent (besides chainpull/ranged taunt) to allow everyone to escape their deadly damage and can easily survive some blows from them on top of the boss. In addition timewise (every second matters) he is the perfect group member to kite adds/boss/dogs and continuously (re)position himself and all mobs optimally as needed so that the dps can focus on unleashing their best dps including aoe without having to worry about killing themself or accidentily pushing boss.

-Tank dying due to unintended cleave damage on the boss which triggers more mechanics than wanted/bearable and to excessive aoe's dropping on top of boss+all adds. This is common when you try to tank the dog pets and everything else at the boss position since the adds do require some aoe dps and it's almost impossible not to hit the boss with unintended dps as everything is stacked in 1 spot. In addition since totems are being dropped on a player they will arrive in the middle of everything (dogs+adds+aoe+boss+totem drop...) causing deaths in no time as the totem fear causes tank to instadrop block mode (sometimes split second before heavy attack...) and send group members into red aoe and adds.

=> a better way imho is to tank the pet dogs in the 2 left/right corners at entrance. With regards to the 2dogs-1chain-mechanic the effect its exactly the same as tanking around the boss position but now the dps has alot of safe space to move around freely without having to worry about boss aoe or the boss himself, totems dropping with no safe space to move to and most of all no damage at all on the dps. They can work down the dogs, then boss, then adds all separately and control exactly when to push the boss health into next phase and when not to. There's never a risk for accidental cleave/aoe damage on the boss since he stands there alone with his aoe doing ranged attacks.

sidenote: Not 100% sure but I believe the totem to drop on furthest group member because every time I tank dogs there as tank in the left/right entrance corner the totem drops alot exactly on top of me (the tank) in the very corner and I can simply sidestep/roll to the other corner since both corners are only 2m apart. This makes it all alot more controlled and accessible to lower dps groups since using this tactic they can now work down each phase separately 1 by 1 instead of getting multiple mechanics together. When I tank at boss position the totem drops in al sorts of random locations, probably because I'm not longer the guaranteed furthest person away from boss.

-Killing both pets at once with split dps while 1 pet is taunted and the other chained is very risky business for obvious reasons and as you said it yourself, not even an option for all builds. The chained pet that is not taunted can still insta-kill a melee dps with it's cleave and if the other dps doesn't kill the taunted dog fast enough the chained one will insta-kill him with a timer triggered jump mechanic that cannot be interrupted. In other words dog 1 must be down within a specific timer window or some dps dies because the second dog was not taunted fast enough. The only alternative is that the tank taunts both dogs to him at some point and we all know where that leads...

=> a better way imho would be that the tank safely (for himself) tanks only 1 dog at a time and keeps that dog facing the entrance so its cleave dmge can never hit the dps while the other dog is safely chained away to its wall. As soon as the first dog dies the tank pulls the next dog to him and both dps keep standing in place doing the same shared dps including aoe on the second dog now (maximizing total dps uptime on the dogs). No need for 1 dps to move to the other dog and restart dps cycle to help finish off. Also both dps always have a safe zone to stand in on 1 side of the room. In addition during the phase where the boss goes melee and comes to the center with adds popping up in center as well and the dps kills them exactly there the dogs will respawn. The tank can then safely pull the first dog back to the entrance while the boss teleports back to the other side of the room and the dps has time to clear up last adds in the center and then come kill the dogs again. This way the damage is controlled and separated in 3 different parts of the room instead of all on top of eachother


I hope this detailed explanation helps clarify

It's a good strategy. There are definitely strategies for all types of players. My guide is only based off of the groups I've run with, but it's meant only as a guide. Each strategy has it's pros and cons, and I know mine probably isn't the best way to do this out there.

Mureel

@WhitePawPrints
On execute HM, after final rune/adds phases, can I just taunt her (I'll use wings for her LAs), then taunt the unchained pets away, and let team burn boss? She will remain stationary there yes?

Just double checking before run in the AM!
(My team has big DPS and I can self sustain pretty well)

Thank you!

emilyhyoyeon

Apherius wrote: »

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

is it supposed to happen where (during final boss HM), there are only 3 available correct symbols to stand on, forcing one group member to die? it has happened to my group several times

there is 4 available correct symboles to stand on.

Sometimes there is a bug and you can't see 1 of the 4 " symbole " above the tiny zone.

so, there sometimes IS only 3 symbols

profundidob16_ESO

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

Apherius wrote: »

emilyhyoyeon wrote: »

is it supposed to happen where (during final boss HM), there are only 3 available correct symbols to stand on, forcing one group member to die? it has happened to my group several times

there is 4 available correct symboles to stand on.

Sometimes there is a bug and you can't see 1 of the 4 " symbole " above the tiny zone.

so, there sometimes IS only 3 symbols

confirmed once more last night when completing HM. On at least 2 occasions we noticed only 3 symbols were available for us to hide in. I'm sure this is not intended and will be fixed by the devs in future updates.

@ZOS_Finn @ZOS_GinaBruno

BuddyAces

Not sure if mentioned, probably has been, but negate and time stop are OP in this entire dungeon. On dogs we usually get tank to grab Zel while we just burn Ary (whatever her name is) and then burn Zel right after that. Just dodge roll their red aoe cone and you'll be fine.

And HA! I knew that sometimes you would only get 3 symbols. Had it happen a couple times and my group thought I was just being blind and/or derpy. I feel vindicated!

Left4Daud

Can also confirm that the glyph mechanic in some of my hard mode pulls resulted in only 3 available spaces.

Leogon

abigfishy wrote: »

I tried to do this with a PUG last night and it was a disaster. I was the tank and no matter how many times I asked people to watch and interrupt the first and third bosses they never would and I died countless times. This is a great mechanic for a Vet dungeon but a mechanic that you can't dodge or avoid in any way and will 100% of the time kill you unless other players actually are aware and react really fast seems a bit rough for a normal difficulty. This is the reason FGII is such a PUG killer.

This. I don't really mind all the one-shot mechanics, it's lazy design but there's always a way for you to survive those one-shot attacks if you're careful but being killed when it's out of your control is just stupid design and the dev obviously didn't think about PUGs when he put that mechanic in the dungeons.

WhitePawPrints

Finally got all the screenshots attached to the guide.

Mureel wrote: »

@WhitePawPrints
On execute HM, after final rune/adds phases, can I just taunt her (I'll use wings for her LAs), then taunt the unchained pets away, and let team burn boss? She will remain stationary there yes?

Just double checking before run in the AM!
(My team has big DPS and I can self sustain pretty well)

Thank you!

I haven't been on forums for a while, but I haven't had consistent clears of HM to really offer my preferred strategies on it.

coplannb16_ESO

Leogon wrote: »

abigfishy wrote: »

I tried to do this with a PUG last night and it was a disaster. I was the tank and no matter how many times I asked people to watch and interrupt the first and third bosses they never would and I died countless times. This is a great mechanic for a Vet dungeon but a mechanic that you can't dodge or avoid in any way and will 100% of the time kill you unless other players actually are aware and react really fast seems a bit rough for a normal difficulty. This is the reason FGII is such a PUG killer.

This. I don't really mind all the one-shot mechanics, it's lazy design but there's always a way for you to survive those one-shot attacks if you're careful but being killed when it's out of your control is just stupid design and the dev obviously didn't think about PUGs when he put that mechanic in the dungeons.

/agree

I dont really understand how even high CP players seem not to know how/when/why to interrupt mobs (or to dodge a charged heavy attack). How hard is it to use Crushing Shock or LB/RB?

profundidob16_ESO

coplannb16_ESO wrote: »

Leogon wrote: »

abigfishy wrote: »

I tried to do this with a PUG last night and it was a disaster. I was the tank and no matter how many times I asked people to watch and interrupt the first and third bosses they never would and I died countless times. This is a great mechanic for a Vet dungeon but a mechanic that you can't dodge or avoid in any way and will 100% of the time kill you unless other players actually are aware and react really fast seems a bit rough for a normal difficulty. This is the reason FGII is such a PUG killer.

This. I don't really mind all the one-shot mechanics, it's lazy design but there's always a way for you to survive those one-shot attacks if you're careful but being killed when it's out of your control is just stupid design and the dev obviously didn't think about PUGs when he put that mechanic in the dungeons.

/agree

I dont really understand how even high CP players seem not to know how/when/why to interrupt mobs (or to dodge a charged heavy attack). How hard is it to use Crushing Shock or LB/RB?

You're right it's mindboggling but this subject has in fact been beating to death in numerous threads already. The easier dungeons on normal and even vet have been completely trivialized mechanics-wise long ago so new players just blaze through with simple dps. No need for tanks, healers , interrupting or respecting any other intended mechanics.

This sort of mindless playstyle gets people all the way to 800cp+ no problem and then we are surprised they never learned to interrupt ?? Where exactly is the low cp content that teaches players: not interrupting equals death of a group member ?

profundidob16_ESO

Mureel wrote: »

@WhitePawPrints
On execute HM, after final rune/adds phases, can I just taunt her (I'll use wings for her LAs), then taunt the unchained pets away, and let team burn boss? She will remain stationary there yes?

Just double checking before run in the AM!
(My team has big DPS and I can self sustain pretty well)

Thank you!

You can pull it off but all the load will be on the tank if you do it. In fact I did exactly that 2 days ago but you better have something like magma shell up for this phase. You'll have adds on you that you have to taunt, 2 dogs in the mix and the boss to deal with. The 2 dogs alone are enough to kill you real fast but aoe cc (talons,timestop) and kiting is your friend here. Keep a damage shield up (igneous) in this phase all the timeand when you can't avoid damage anymore pop magma shell to recover. The Healer can make this phase alot easier by showering the area in a constant heal spam (healing springs + rapid regen + bogdan) and popping warhorn

A bit safer and more common is that the dps first kills 1 (and only 1!) dog before burning the boss so the tank has a solid chance at survival. There is a maximum enrage timer that causes the boss to do a room-wide BOOM which insta-kills everyone but with proper dps you should have more than enough time to kill at least 1 of the 2 dogs that break free of their chain in this phase which makes it tankable.

Since as a tank there is so much deadly damage to deal with in this phase white kiting I can't remember honestly if the taunted boss was following me (melee mode) or just standing there and shooting at me (ranged mode). I do remember you have to cc and taunt dogs+adds incredibly fast every time to save your dps from getting 1-shot.

jerrodbuffington

Questions regarding hm boss

During the fight with Zel and Ary, our tanks taunts zel and goes to the boss.. problem zel will run off from the tank and start attacking one of the other players.. first thought is the tank cant keep taunt.. but when the dog comes out I see the animation for jnner fire, then within a couple seconds zel will be out attacking the other players.. tanks taunts again and zel takes two step toward him then turns around again..

Anyone else have issues with zel not obeying taunt. 2 different tanks I know have had the same issue.


When the shock wardens come out the boss will one shot our tank.. is she enraged when the wardens are out? We have been putting her in the circle where the warden dies but it seems she enrages and murders our tank within 5 seconds of a shock warden spawn. Are we missing something?

I'm on ps4.. if that helps

profundidob16_ESO

jerrodbuffington wrote: »

Questions regarding hm boss

During the fight with Zel and Ary, our tanks taunts zel and goes to the boss.. problem zel will run off from the tank and start attacking one of the other players.. first thought is the tank cant keep taunt.. but when the dog comes out I see the animation for jnner fire, then within a couple seconds zel will be out attacking the other players.. tanks taunts again and zel takes two step toward him then turns around again..

Anyone else have issues with zel not obeying taunt. 2 different tanks I know have had the same issue.


When the shock wardens come out the boss will one shot our tank.. is she enraged when the wardens are out? We have been putting her in the circle where the warden dies but it seems she enrages and murders our tank within 5 seconds of a shock warden spawn. Are we missing something?

I'm on ps4.. if that helps

yes, Zel and Ary's response to taunt is slightly delayed and off with the graphics in most cases. Every HM run I did so far same issues with some random factor but definately never clean. This delay may actually feel to the tank that they are not responding at all. I often taunt twice. Here are the practical things you need to know:

1. Yes the Shockwardens enrage the boss just like in the Mylene fight and the tank will have to use their lightning circle (dropped when they die) in order to de-enrage. If they oneshot the tank however it means he's not up to the task in the first place. Have the tank aim for 40k+ health (food buffed) with 30k+ resistance and enough sustain to stay in block mode during most of this phase. Obviously nuking the wardens asap has total top priority in this phase


2. Since the dogs will come back to life based on boss health % during the phase with the werewolf adds and boss in melee mode it is best if your dps singletargets those adds in order to minimize collateral dmge on the boss in order not to have Ary and Zel revive too fast. This is especially important in the parts where shock wardens are up as well. I've tanked a HM recently with 2 awesome dps that just aoe nuked the adds phase and as a result the dogs already awoke 5 seconds after the werewolf adds started appearing ! =P Delay it to make it controlled and survivable

3. The best way to handle the awaking of dogs safety wise is first be on voice to call it out. Second have everyone aware and looking for their animation of waking up. Lastly dps needs to sidestep or shield/block as soon as the first pet dog (I recommend always picking the same one first) is being taunted by the tank until the dog has reached it's final position where it is being tanked (either next to boss or better even at entrance on opposite sides). You will notice that only after reaching it's final position the other dog's chain pulls him back and dps is safe from harm. Then and only then should they start nuking first dog and same goes for next dog. Don't switch dps immediately to next dog after the first one dies. Wait until you see the second dog effectively respond to the taunt and get behind it always

4. The first dog always needs to die fast enough. As soon as first dog dies you are safe and can take it easy to finish the other one. If you take too long killing first dog the other dog sets free and 1-shot jumps dps/healer. As soon as it's "nose down and prepping to charge" animation appears nothing can be done anymore to prevent and even taunts no longer work. Only dodgeroll by dps can save their own lives then. For this reason even when dps is a bit late on first dog or slow the tank MUST taunt the other dog in time, even when it means tanking both dogs for a few overlapping seconds! Have the healer keep multiple healing springs on tank in this phase to avoid unexpected 1 shots.

Good luck !

Note for Code and other pc users reading this: @code65536 has made an awesome addon called "code's combat alerts" that warns you when to switch and taunt the other dog in time. I tested it extensively last week and unfortunately the warning comes just a bit too late. Often right upon seeing the message I would ranged taunt and the dog still ignores and jumps anyway indicating we're 1-2 seconds too late. Perhaps Code will shorten the warning timer a little bit in next update. Then it will be perfect. Until then it definately gives you an idea of when you are too late with taunting

code65536

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

Note for Code and other pc users reading this: @code65536 has made an awesome addon called "code's combat alerts" that warns you when to switch and taunt the other dog in time. I tested it extensively last week and unfortunately the warning comes just a bit too late. Often right upon seeing the message I would ranged taunt and the dog still ignores and jumps anyway indicating we're 1-2 seconds too late. Perhaps Code will shorten the warning timer a little bit in next update. Then it will be perfect. Until then it definately gives you an idea of when you are too late with taunting

By time the switch mechanic triggers (and no, there isn't an earlier cue that I can detect), they will do the pounce unless one of them cowers (i.e., the only way to prevent the pounce at that point is if one of them was already at low health and just a hit away from cowering).

The alert is not there to prevent the pounce. It's there to let the tank know that they should taunt the other wolf because the wolf that they're holding will become untauntable, and it's there to serve as a pre-warning for everyone else that a pounce will happen soon.

profundidob16_ESO

code65536 wrote: »

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

Note for Code and other pc users reading this: @code65536 has made an awesome addon called "code's combat alerts" that warns you when to switch and taunt the other dog in time. I tested it extensively last week and unfortunately the warning comes just a bit too late. Often right upon seeing the message I would ranged taunt and the dog still ignores and jumps anyway indicating we're 1-2 seconds too late. Perhaps Code will shorten the warning timer a little bit in next update. Then it will be perfect. Until then it definately gives you an idea of when you are too late with taunting

By time the switch mechanic triggers, they will do the pounce unless one of them cowers (i.e., the only way to prevent the pounce at that point is if one of them was already at low health and just a hit away from cowering).

The alert is not there to prevent the pounce. It's there to let the tank know that they should taunt the other wolf because the wolf that they're holding will become untauntable, and it's there to serve as a pre-warning for everyone else that a pounce will happen soon.

I know, I wrote this to let you know that exactly that warning comes too late

code65536

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

Note for Code and other pc users reading this: @code65536 has made an awesome addon called "code's combat alerts" that warns you when to switch and taunt the other dog in time. I tested it extensively last week and unfortunately the warning comes just a bit too late. Often right upon seeing the message I would ranged taunt and the dog still ignores and jumps anyway indicating we're 1-2 seconds too late. Perhaps Code will shorten the warning timer a little bit in next update. Then it will be perfect. Until then it definately gives you an idea of when you are too late with taunting

By time the switch mechanic triggers, they will do the pounce unless one of them cowers (i.e., the only way to prevent the pounce at that point is if one of them was already at low health and just a hit away from cowering).

The alert is not there to prevent the pounce. It's there to let the tank know that they should taunt the other wolf because the wolf that they're holding will become untauntable, and it's there to serve as a pre-warning for everyone else that a pounce will happen soon.

I know, I wrote this to let you know that exactly that warning comes too late

My point is that there is no earlier cue to detect/alert. It can't be earlier. The alert was never intended to prevent the pounce.

profundidob16_ESO

code65536 wrote: »

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

code65536 wrote: »

profundidob16_ESO wrote: »

Note for Code and other pc users reading this: @code65536 has made an awesome addon called "code's combat alerts" that warns you when to switch and taunt the other dog in time. I tested it extensively last week and unfortunately the warning comes just a bit too late. Often right upon seeing the message I would ranged taunt and the dog still ignores and jumps anyway indicating we're 1-2 seconds too late. Perhaps Code will shorten the warning timer a little bit in next update. Then it will be perfect. Until then it definately gives you an idea of when you are too late with taunting

By time the switch mechanic triggers, they will do the pounce unless one of them cowers (i.e., the only way to prevent the pounce at that point is if one of them was already at low health and just a hit away from cowering).

The alert is not there to prevent the pounce. It's there to let the tank know that they should taunt the other wolf because the wolf that they're holding will become untauntable, and it's there to serve as a pre-warning for everyone else that a pounce will happen soon.

I know, I wrote this to let you know that exactly that warning comes too late

My point is that there is no earlier cue to detect/alert. It can't be earlier. The alert was never intended to prevent the pounce.

I see. I assumed the warning was purely timer based. Didn't know it was a cue you picked up. Then it makes sense why the other dog always just jumps anyway at that point as it's part of the very mechanic your warning picks up and displays. It would have been ideal if your addon could run a timer of x seconds from the point where first dog is picked up and then show the warning the preventive to switch target in time. I wrongly assumed it worked this way and the timer was just a bit late. My bad

So I guess there is no way then to have us warned up front but at least when the message appears (and the unavoidable jump is about the happen) we are informed that we are too late already and the dps can get ready to dodgeroll the dog jump in order to save themselves.

jerrodbuffington

I got the 3 symbol bug on video.. I would link it but there is some very foul language. How would I send it to zos? It seems they dont know about it.. or maybe they dont believe us. Lol

There was only 3 circles squares and triangles.

GreenhaloX

mocap wrote: »

so i hit vet version too (no HM). With PUG

All bosses killed from the first try. Though i hardly can name this group as PUG, i clearly sure that was a premade one, 900+ CP, insane dps, 100% know mechanics. Just lucky.

Seriously.. ha ha. I just did this dungeon the first time yesterday for the Undaunted. I did this on "normal" and I am maxed CP (well over 1000 CP, mind you..) and this surely feels like a vet instead of normal. I came in PUG and seems I was a replacement, went through the portal and came into the third Alpha werewolf boss. We were all 780 and I was on my tank. Crap! We were getting knocked out left and right. I am on my tank that I typically roll with throughout other vet dungeons with just fine; however, here, I was getting knocked out by his enraged attack and registering anywhere from 38k shot to 122K. 122K kill shot.. wtf! Ha ha. So folks are doing this run on vet and HM.. Yeah, definitely have to figure out the mechanics for this crazy ass dungeon!