[Class Rep] Dragonknight Feedback Thread

Xvorg

FoulSnowpaw wrote: »

1. Dragonknight is an attrition playstyle class. Remove Weapon and Spell Damage ramping perk from whips and make it a real damage passive to replace the fake passive that "increases the damage of Ardent Flame abilities by 10%", when that 10% should be the base of the ability. The old heavy armor perk where every time one took damage, their Weapon and Spell Damage is increased by 20 for 8 seconds, stacking up to 20 times. Gives enough time to make the kill and makes up for the weak sustain aspects of DK since it is an attrition style class that relies heavily on damage over time.

That would be amazing. Considering Fury and 7th legion were alread changed, a form of wrath on DKs could be a very good option for the class

Lokey0024

It would make more sense to me to make a Stone fist morph Stam spammable. Class Passives play into it and is rarely used based on the high cost/low reward. Remove the stun, lower to melee range and add an off balance to poisoned targets would be cool.

GeorgeBlack

Nobody reads this.
Make new topics. One feature at a time

Beffagorn

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Nobody reads this.
Make new topics. One feature at a time

This thread is basically the DKs private chat on the public forums, lol.

On topic: I think the stam spammable situation has been solved, at least in pvp. Dizzy swing works fine (Wrecking Blow is still garbage), bash now works as spammable, heroic slash still works fine, flurry and whirlwind are also viable alternatives.

I've always been against the "Poison Whip" or "Stonefist" spammables idea. Those ideas have always been an incredibly lazy and a poor solution to the problem. Most people advocating for those two think that just by recoloring a whip morph, that skill is going to be as good as the Jabs from a stamplar or Surprise Attack from Stamblades, when in reality both would hit like a wet noodle and be just bad in general due to lack of passives (And a general lack of synergy with the rest of the class) that enhance those skills.

Take Biting Jabs as an example. It has 3 passives that directly increase the skill's effectiveness and Balanced Warrior to top it off.

Now imagine a stamwhip. World in Ruin, Warmth, Combustion. A cheap poison noodle that slows the target and occasionally applies a status effect that restores some stamina. End result is Warmth getting nerfed or reworked cause ZoS doesn't want slows on spammables.

Stamfist would end up being stupidly overpowered due to Helping Hands and Mountain's Blessing or badly underpowered for fear of it being too strong due to the passives. It's even worse than the stamwhip idea.

Jodynn

Xvorg wrote: »

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

My thoughts on DK skills
Ardent Flame Skills

Lava whip – Seen the request for stamina poison whip to many times to not say people want it. I remember reading once someone gave a reason for no stamina whip and at that time I thought they had a good case for no stamina whip but for the life I cannot remember their reasoning.

Poison whip would just mirror mDK playing style having access to at least 9 melee skills available (weapon skills), leaving mDK with just one melee morph available, lash. That makes no sense.

It could be an option IF some of the S/B morphs is turned to magicka

Make stonefist a stam spam, it makes more sense and you won't break current builds.

Lokey0024

Beffagorn wrote: »

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Nobody reads this.
Make new topics. One feature at a time

This thread is basically the DKs private chat on the public forums, lol.

On topic: I think the stam spammable situation has been solved, at least in pvp. Dizzy swing works fine (Wrecking Blow is still garbage), bash now works as spammable, heroic slash still works fine, flurry and whirlwind are also viable alternatives.

I've always been against the "Poison Whip" or "Stonefist" spammables idea. Those ideas have always been an incredibly lazy and a poor solution to the problem. Most people advocating for those two think that just by recoloring a whip morph, that skill is going to be as good as the Jabs from a stamplar or Surprise Attack from Stamblades, when in reality both would hit like a wet noodle and be just bad in general due to lack of passives (And a general lack of synergy with the rest of the class) that enhance those skills.

Take Biting Jabs as an example. It has 3 passives that directly increase the skill's effectiveness and Balanced Warrior to top it off.

Now imagine a stamwhip. World in Ruin, Warmth, Combustion. A cheap poison noodle that slows the target and occasionally applies a status effect that restores some stamina. End result is Warmth getting nerfed or reworked cause ZoS doesn't want slows on spammables.

Stamfist would end up being stupidly overpowered due to Helping Hands and Mountain's Blessing or badly underpowered for fear of it being too strong due to the passives. It's even worse than the stamwhip idea.

You would think they would have something, some kind of tool or resource, to test these kinds of changes. Give it some cool abbreviation and spot in forums for feedback. If only....

Sanguinor2

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

Make stonefist a stam spam, it makes more sense and you won't break current builds.

Stam dk class spammable would be nice but I cant help but feel like proccing helping Hands each time you use your spammable on a stamdk would be incredibly strong. It would essentially be a 1k cost reduction.

Noisivid

Does the fact that this thread was on page 8 of the Combat and Character Mechanics sub-form with no comments since August 27th imply something?

Have DK players mostly given up or moved on?

I've got two DKs that have basically been shelved since shortly after the Morrowind expansion dropped. Yes, I can make them "functional", but crutching on specific sets and non-class abilities to make them work is not acceptable to me and they still feel clunky/janky to play. They still did not feel good/fluid to me. Casting Stonefist 5 times to get a stun isn't really going to help this.

So I moved on to other classes...

Still, 2 of the first 3 characters I made were DKs. I love the IDEA of the class, just not the current reality.

I really don't think just working around the edges of the class will fix the issues for either Stam or Mag DKs. I've got one of each, they've both been respeced to Tank and DPS at various times. I've even changed races on them a few times in an attempt to make them work and that's not exactly cheap. I am slowly working on an Orc DK Tank to see if that gives me any new insights. I can always hope

At this point I think the class needs a ground up overhaul to bring it into alignment with the current state of ESO. The ESO that DKs were designed for has been changed repeatedly and DKs just have not kept pace with it. (soft caps, ultimate gain, sustain, etc...) This overhaul needs, in my opinion, to keep in mind the "power fantasy" of tanky, close quarters, flame/earth based brawlers with a Draconic flair/bent. Mag DKs need a way to sustain magicka while not weilding a staff and Stam DKs need real options not just the 3 morphs that I think are what are now available on the PTS.

No classses should have to lean heavily on specific sets, weapon types or or non-class skills to be fully functional. Those things should add variety, options and flavor. I'm pretty sure that's what was said in the Class Identity Developer Deep Dive that was posted a few days (?) ago.

Anywho, I just threw this together off the top of my head so I probably missed a few (or alot) of things... and am donning my flame-proof suit as I type this.

@ZOS_RichLambert , @ZOS_BrianWheeler, @ZOS_Gilliam

p.s. thanks for the info in the "Developer Deep Dive Class Identity, good info, good communication.

NBrookus

Noisivid wrote: »

Does the fact that this thread was on page 8 of the Combat and Character Mechanics sub-form with no comments since August 27th imply something?

Have DK players mostly given up or moved on?

From a PVP perspective? No. Still magDKS out there doing well. They have some group utility as well.

But if you want to play tanky attrition, stamDK does it far better.
If you want to be a fire mage, you are better off putting fire staff on a sorc.
If you really want melee magicka, magplar is much stronger this patch.
And if you want to feel more like the classic mDK, you play stamden.

The long term mains are still tearing it up on their magDKs.

Miloscpolski

Anti_Virus wrote: »

*edit sorry forgot to list the two points*
More stam morphs please. Here are some suggestions:

Top two pain points
1. Stamina Based AoE and single target
2. mag based class execute

below is some rework ideas

Ardent Flame:

(low priority change)
Molten Whip(Flame whip morph):
renamed to toxic lash and converts to a stam ability and deals poison damage.
*note - the added spell and weapon damage would be a base line effect across the morphs.*

a spammable would be very useful for the class this seems to make the most sense without harming pve melee magicka DKs.

World in Ruin(Ardent Flame passive)
increases your flame and poison damage by 5% instead of AoE damage.


Dragonic Power:

Hardened Armor(Spiked Armor morph)
now deals physical damage on damage returns

nice small change for stam DK wouldn't hurt anyone and is an all around buff, another nice change also would be to make this morph green/ poisonous looking as opposed to the fire look it has now.

(low priority change)
Choking Talons(Dark Talons morph)
renamed to poison talons and deals a physical damage on initial hit and applies a poison dot.
*note - minor maim would be a baseline effect for all morphs*

this will help stam dks in group play, giving them some damage for rooting enemies for allies, also lines up with the poison theme of the class

Deep Breath(Inhale morph)
now deals physical damage on initial hit and poison damage after 2.5 secs and leaves a small posion dot to all enemies afterwards.
*note - the interrupt would be a base line effect across the morphs*

Stam Dk could really use some AoE like how stam sorc and stam blade, this change would absolutely fix that.

Scaled Armor(Dragonic Power passive)
now adds 3300 physical resistance in addition to spell resistance.

Elder Dragon(Dragonic Power passive)
now increases health magicka and stamina recovery per dragonic ability slotted.


Earthen Heart:

Igneous Weapons(Molten Weapons Morph)
renamed to Corrosive Weapons now has a chance to apply the poisoned status effect from damage by %10
*note - major brutality and major sorcery would be a baseline effect across all morphs*

makes this morph more interesting for stam Dks, by increasing poison status proc chance it improves sustain and damage

this change might be radical and questionable change but if anyone has a better idea i would love to read it.

COMPLETE NONSENSE!!! you just remodel the whole fire class to stamdk.

Miloscpolski

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

The purpose of this thread is to give you a place to post your current top two pain points with the Dragonknight. Our new Class Representatives will be keeping a close eye on this thread, and will utilize it to gather additional feedback for the notes they’re currently compiling for their first meeting with the Dev Team next week. Please be sure and keep your post clear and succinct, and focus more on what is currently frustrating you rather than potential solutions. Thanks!

PLEASE listen to me! I was on pts. As main mag dk i can say that no need to add value engulfing flame and burning embers. And what about burning embers - heal on this ability depends on damage, damage is very small, its mean that and heal very small. And we have - expensive skill that deal small dmg and small heal. Its awfull. Also very important information for zos - "Engulfing Flames (morph): This morph’s bonus Flame Damage taken now scales off your Spell Damage; 1% for every 333 Spell Damage you have, up to a maximum of the original 10%". You said that we can play as we want - but at the same time you force play only through SPELL DMG. I always played through penetration - and showed high DMG, but my spell dmg was maximum 2200-2300. Also many players play through MAX magicka - about 50k magicka pull. I’m saying this all about that people playing through penetration and maximum magic pool will not receive the maximum bonus from engulfing flame, so you will force players to play through only spell dmg

GeorgeBlack

GeorgeBlack wrote: »

Nobody reads this.
Make new topics. One feature at a time

Banana

What will the dynamic duo come up with monday. A small mercy or 2

Davadin

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Hotdog_23 wrote: »

My thoughts on DK skills
Ardent Flame Skills

Lava whip – Seen the request for stamina poison whip to many times to not say people want it. I remember reading once someone gave a reason for no stamina whip and at that time I thought they had a good case for no stamina whip but for the life I cannot remember their reasoning.

Poison whip would just mirror mDK playing style having access to at least 9 melee skills available (weapon skills), leaving mDK with just one melee morph available, lash. That makes no sense.

It could be an option IF some of the S/B morphs is turned to magicka

Make stonefist a stam spam, it makes more sense and you won't break current builds.

u need to check PTS.

IF the new stonefist spammable goes live, i'm retiring my stamDK.

Davadin

Noisivid wrote: »

Does the fact that this thread was on page 8 of the Combat and Character Mechanics sub-form with no comments since August 27th imply something?

Have DK players mostly given up or moved on?

I've got two DKs that have basically been shelved since shortly after the Morrowind expansion dropped. Yes, I can make them "functional", but crutching on specific sets and non-class abilities to make them work is not acceptable to me and they still feel clunky/janky to play. They still did not feel good/fluid to me. Casting Stonefist 5 times to get a stun isn't really going to help this.

So I moved on to other classes...

Still, 2 of the first 3 characters I made were DKs. I love the IDEA of the class, just not the current reality.

I really don't think just working around the edges of the class will fix the issues for either Stam or Mag DKs. I've got one of each, they've both been respeced to Tank and DPS at various times. I've even changed races on them a few times in an attempt to make them work and that's not exactly cheap. I am slowly working on an Orc DK Tank to see if that gives me any new insights. I can always hope

At this point I think the class needs a ground up overhaul to bring it into alignment with the current state of ESO. The ESO that DKs were designed for has been changed repeatedly and DKs just have not kept pace with it. (soft caps, ultimate gain, sustain, etc...) This overhaul needs, in my opinion, to keep in mind the "power fantasy" of tanky, close quarters, flame/earth based brawlers with a Draconic flair/bent. Mag DKs need a way to sustain magicka while not weilding a staff and Stam DKs need real options not just the 3 morphs that I think are what are now available on the PTS.

No classses should have to lean heavily on specific sets, weapon types or or non-class skills to be fully functional. Those things should add variety, options and flavor. I'm pretty sure that's what was said in the Class Identity Developer Deep Dive that was posted a few days (?) ago.

Anywho, I just threw this together off the top of my head so I probably missed a few (or alot) of things... and am donning my flame-proof suit as I type this.

@ZOS_RichLambert , @ZOS_BrianWheeler, @ZOS_Gilliam

p.s. thanks for the info in the "Developer Deep Dive Class Identity, good info, good communication.

honestly, up to live server, DK are doing fine. not great, but the fact it's on page 8 honestly because, yes, (1) no Dev reads this anymore, but (2), the class is fine...

Actually, with the DoT buff on Elswyr, i've been melting people left and right. stamDK is really good in Cyro (even on med build) and MagDK seems pretty strong even after wings are nerfed.



But next patch tho.... lol.... Dizzying goes bye bye, DoT gots nerfed to worse than pre-Elswyr, and we get a stone-slinging skill that costs 3k stamina as *spammable*

Anti_Virus

Miloscpolski wrote: »

Anti_Virus wrote: »

*edit sorry forgot to list the two points*
More stam morphs please. Here are some suggestions:

Top two pain points
1. Stamina Based AoE and single target
2. mag based class execute

below is some rework ideas

Ardent Flame:

(low priority change)
Molten Whip(Flame whip morph):
renamed to toxic lash and converts to a stam ability and deals poison damage.
*note - the added spell and weapon damage would be a base line effect across the morphs.*

a spammable would be very useful for the class this seems to make the most sense without harming pve melee magicka DKs.

World in Ruin(Ardent Flame passive)
increases your flame and poison damage by 5% instead of AoE damage.


Dragonic Power:

Hardened Armor(Spiked Armor morph)
now deals physical damage on damage returns

nice small change for stam DK wouldn't hurt anyone and is an all around buff, another nice change also would be to make this morph green/ poisonous looking as opposed to the fire look it has now.

(low priority change)
Choking Talons(Dark Talons morph)
renamed to poison talons and deals a physical damage on initial hit and applies a poison dot.
*note - minor maim would be a baseline effect for all morphs*

this will help stam dks in group play, giving them some damage for rooting enemies for allies, also lines up with the poison theme of the class

Deep Breath(Inhale morph)
now deals physical damage on initial hit and poison damage after 2.5 secs and leaves a small posion dot to all enemies afterwards.
*note - the interrupt would be a base line effect across the morphs*

Stam Dk could really use some AoE like how stam sorc and stam blade, this change would absolutely fix that.

Scaled Armor(Dragonic Power passive)
now adds 3300 physical resistance in addition to spell resistance.

Elder Dragon(Dragonic Power passive)
now increases health magicka and stamina recovery per dragonic ability slotted.


Earthen Heart:

Igneous Weapons(Molten Weapons Morph)
renamed to Corrosive Weapons now has a chance to apply the poisoned status effect from damage by %10
*note - major brutality and major sorcery would be a baseline effect across all morphs*

makes this morph more interesting for stam Dks, by increasing poison status proc chance it improves sustain and damage

this change might be radical and questionable change but if anyone has a better idea i would love to read it.

COMPLETE NONSENSE!!! you just remodel the whole fire class to stamdk.

lol what?

Onefrkncrzypope

Davadin wrote: »

Noisivid wrote: »

Does the fact that this thread was on page 8 of the Combat and Character Mechanics sub-form with no comments since August 27th imply something?

Have DK players mostly given up or moved on?

I've got two DKs that have basically been shelved since shortly after the Morrowind expansion dropped. Yes, I can make them "functional", but crutching on specific sets and non-class abilities to make them work is not acceptable to me and they still feel clunky/janky to play. They still did not feel good/fluid to me. Casting Stonefist 5 times to get a stun isn't really going to help this.

So I moved on to other classes...

Still, 2 of the first 3 characters I made were DKs. I love the IDEA of the class, just not the current reality.

I really don't think just working around the edges of the class will fix the issues for either Stam or Mag DKs. I've got one of each, they've both been respeced to Tank and DPS at various times. I've even changed races on them a few times in an attempt to make them work and that's not exactly cheap. I am slowly working on an Orc DK Tank to see if that gives me any new insights. I can always hope

At this point I think the class needs a ground up overhaul to bring it into alignment with the current state of ESO. The ESO that DKs were designed for has been changed repeatedly and DKs just have not kept pace with it. (soft caps, ultimate gain, sustain, etc...) This overhaul needs, in my opinion, to keep in mind the "power fantasy" of tanky, close quarters, flame/earth based brawlers with a Draconic flair/bent. Mag DKs need a way to sustain magicka while not weilding a staff and Stam DKs need real options not just the 3 morphs that I think are what are now available on the PTS.

No classses should have to lean heavily on specific sets, weapon types or or non-class skills to be fully functional. Those things should add variety, options and flavor. I'm pretty sure that's what was said in the Class Identity Developer Deep Dive that was posted a few days (?) ago.

Anywho, I just threw this together off the top of my head so I probably missed a few (or alot) of things... and am donning my flame-proof suit as I type this.

@ZOS_RichLambert , @ZOS_BrianWheeler, @ZOS_Gilliam

p.s. thanks for the info in the "Developer Deep Dive Class Identity, good info, good communication.

honestly, up to live server, DK are doing fine. not great, but the fact it's on page 8 honestly because, yes, (1) no Dev reads this anymore, but (2), the class is fine...

Actually, with the DoT buff on Elswyr, i've been melting people left and right. stamDK is really good in Cyro (even on med build) and MagDK seems pretty strong even after wings are nerfed.



But next patch tho.... lol.... Dizzying goes bye bye, DoT gots nerfed to worse than pre-Elswyr, and we get a stone-slinging skill that costs 3k stamina as *spammable*

Don't forget that is a ranged spammable on a melee only class... Monkey poop throw. I wished it did disease damage just to laugh about it.

juhislihis19

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Noisivid wrote: »

Does the fact that this thread was on page 8 of the Combat and Character Mechanics sub-form with no comments since August 27th imply something?

Have DK players mostly given up or moved on?

I've got two DKs that have basically been shelved since shortly after the Morrowind expansion dropped. Yes, I can make them "functional", but crutching on specific sets and non-class abilities to make them work is not acceptable to me and they still feel clunky/janky to play. They still did not feel good/fluid to me. Casting Stonefist 5 times to get a stun isn't really going to help this.

So I moved on to other classes...

Still, 2 of the first 3 characters I made were DKs. I love the IDEA of the class, just not the current reality.

I really don't think just working around the edges of the class will fix the issues for either Stam or Mag DKs. I've got one of each, they've both been respeced to Tank and DPS at various times. I've even changed races on them a few times in an attempt to make them work and that's not exactly cheap. I am slowly working on an Orc DK Tank to see if that gives me any new insights. I can always hope

At this point I think the class needs a ground up overhaul to bring it into alignment with the current state of ESO. The ESO that DKs were designed for has been changed repeatedly and DKs just have not kept pace with it. (soft caps, ultimate gain, sustain, etc...) This overhaul needs, in my opinion, to keep in mind the "power fantasy" of tanky, close quarters, flame/earth based brawlers with a Draconic flair/bent. Mag DKs need a way to sustain magicka while not weilding a staff and Stam DKs need real options not just the 3 morphs that I think are what are now available on the PTS.

No classses should have to lean heavily on specific sets, weapon types or or non-class skills to be fully functional. Those things should add variety, options and flavor. I'm pretty sure that's what was said in the Class Identity Developer Deep Dive that was posted a few days (?) ago.

Anywho, I just threw this together off the top of my head so I probably missed a few (or alot) of things... and am donning my flame-proof suit as I type this.

@ZOS_RichLambert , @ZOS_BrianWheeler, @ZOS_Gilliam

p.s. thanks for the info in the "Developer Deep Dive Class Identity, good info, good communication.

honestly, up to live server, DK are doing fine. not great, but the fact it's on page 8 honestly because, yes, (1) no Dev reads this anymore, but (2), the class is fine...

Actually, with the DoT buff on Elswyr, i've been melting people left and right. stamDK is really good in Cyro (even on med build) and MagDK seems pretty strong even after wings are nerfed.



But next patch tho.... lol.... Dizzying goes bye bye, DoT gots nerfed to worse than pre-Elswyr, and we get a stone-slinging skill that costs 3k stamina as *spammable*

Don't forget that is a ranged spammable on a melee only class... Monkey poop throw. I wished it did disease damage just to laugh about it.

So now we have Monkey Poop Throw as spammable and Obnoxious Breath as a debuff. StamDK definitely the filthiest class out there.

Onefrkncrzypope

juhislihis19 wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

Davadin wrote: »

Noisivid wrote: »

Does the fact that this thread was on page 8 of the Combat and Character Mechanics sub-form with no comments since August 27th imply something?

Have DK players mostly given up or moved on?

I've got two DKs that have basically been shelved since shortly after the Morrowind expansion dropped. Yes, I can make them "functional", but crutching on specific sets and non-class abilities to make them work is not acceptable to me and they still feel clunky/janky to play. They still did not feel good/fluid to me. Casting Stonefist 5 times to get a stun isn't really going to help this.

So I moved on to other classes...

Still, 2 of the first 3 characters I made were DKs. I love the IDEA of the class, just not the current reality.

I really don't think just working around the edges of the class will fix the issues for either Stam or Mag DKs. I've got one of each, they've both been respeced to Tank and DPS at various times. I've even changed races on them a few times in an attempt to make them work and that's not exactly cheap. I am slowly working on an Orc DK Tank to see if that gives me any new insights. I can always hope

At this point I think the class needs a ground up overhaul to bring it into alignment with the current state of ESO. The ESO that DKs were designed for has been changed repeatedly and DKs just have not kept pace with it. (soft caps, ultimate gain, sustain, etc...) This overhaul needs, in my opinion, to keep in mind the "power fantasy" of tanky, close quarters, flame/earth based brawlers with a Draconic flair/bent. Mag DKs need a way to sustain magicka while not weilding a staff and Stam DKs need real options not just the 3 morphs that I think are what are now available on the PTS.

No classses should have to lean heavily on specific sets, weapon types or or non-class skills to be fully functional. Those things should add variety, options and flavor. I'm pretty sure that's what was said in the Class Identity Developer Deep Dive that was posted a few days (?) ago.

Anywho, I just threw this together off the top of my head so I probably missed a few (or alot) of things... and am donning my flame-proof suit as I type this.

@ZOS_RichLambert , @ZOS_BrianWheeler, @ZOS_Gilliam

p.s. thanks for the info in the "Developer Deep Dive Class Identity, good info, good communication.

honestly, up to live server, DK are doing fine. not great, but the fact it's on page 8 honestly because, yes, (1) no Dev reads this anymore, but (2), the class is fine...

Actually, with the DoT buff on Elswyr, i've been melting people left and right. stamDK is really good in Cyro (even on med build) and MagDK seems pretty strong even after wings are nerfed.



But next patch tho.... lol.... Dizzying goes bye bye, DoT gots nerfed to worse than pre-Elswyr, and we get a stone-slinging skill that costs 3k stamina as *spammable*

Don't forget that is a ranged spammable on a melee only class... Monkey poop throw. I wished it did disease damage just to laugh about it.

So now we have Monkey Poop Throw as spammable and Obnoxious Breath as a debuff. StamDK definitely the filthiest class out there.

Change FoO to a fly and give volatile the old bound armaments smoke in green form and then change the name to dumpsterfire knight.. We could still keep the DK acronym too

GDOFWR420

Couldnt they seperate pve from pvp and tailor each without one affecting the other? You know different servers or somthing, then maybe we can finally see an end to the endless nerfing of the DK not to mention the other changes to classes that no one wants.
Looking at you @ZOS

TrinityBreaker

GDOFWR420 wrote: »

Couldnt they seperate pve from pvp and tailor each without one affecting the other? You know different servers or somthing, then maybe we can finally see an end to the endless nerfing of the DK not to mention the other changes to classes that no one wants.
Looking at you @ZOS

They kinda did this in the beginning. A perfect example would be NightBlade's gap closer. If it's used against a player, it snared them(depending on morph). If it's used against a NPC, it stunned them.

FlatLine12

GDOFWR420 wrote: »

Couldnt they seperate pve from pvp and tailor each without one affecting the other? You know different servers or somthing, then maybe we can finally see an end to the endless nerfing of the DK not to mention the other changes to classes that no one wants.
Looking at you @ZOS

I like the idea of this but it would honestly take so much programming for every ability, for each class that's why they do a flat Nerf to Heals, Damage and Shields...which makes sense.

However, I agree that Elder Dragon Passives need to be reworked...heavy armour already less effective and granted ZOS may want DK to be identified as a tanking class, there are plenty of sets that are more than able to assist in that regards as well as group support so I agree Elder Dragon should be reworked.

Next recommendation is for there to be both a base Mag and Stam option for Whip. I recommend the Whip to do Posion damage to keep it in line with Combustion Passive and to rank up same way as Mag morphs

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

Lokey0024

I hate to be that guy but..my idea

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/496421/molten-whip-change-idea

GDOFWR420

FlatLine12 wrote: »

GDOFWR420 wrote: »

Couldnt they seperate pve from pvp and tailor each without one affecting the other? You know different servers or somthing, then maybe we can finally see an end to the endless nerfing of the DK not to mention the other changes to classes that no one wants.
Looking at you @ZOS

I like the idea of this but it would honestly take so much programming for every ability, for each class that's why they do a flat Nerf to Heals, Damage and Shields...which makes sense.

However, I agree that Elder Dragon Passives need to be reworked...heavy armour already less effective and granted ZOS may want DK to be identified as a tanking class, there are plenty of sets that are more than able to assist in that regards as well as group support so I agree Elder Dragon should be reworked.

Next recommendation is for there to be both a base Mag and Stam option for Whip. I recommend the Whip to do Posion damage to keep it in line with Combustion Passive and to rank up same way as Mag morphs

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

I agree the cast time is an issue. We could definitly use a rework on most animations as you say they take longer than the press of a button to cast.

I think they need to add buffs and debuffs to the scrolls in pvp were if say your side has certain scrolls your side gains say 10% damage bonus to aoe or dots as were the other two sides would experience a 5% reduction in aoe or dot damage. This would give incentive to recapture scrolls and avoid the endless tweaking of our toons. There are many other ways balance can be implemented but its up to zos.

Zer0_CooL

FlatLine12 wrote: »

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

Especially the whip and ingulfing flames. It shouldn't be possible to cancel a skill with a cast time, only it's animation. Yet ingulfing flames can be canceled completely.

JumpmanLane

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

FlatLine12 wrote: »

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

Especially the whip and ingulfing flames. It shouldn't be possible to cancel a skill with a cast time, only it's animation. Yet ingulfing flames can be canceled completely.

If animation canceled, Engulfing isn’t completely cancelled...you probably just missed.

MagDk has some of the best animations in the game, many of which can be animation canceled. Do not encourage ZOS to fiddle with these animations. Geeze...it can only end up bad.

Incidentally, I wonder what people ...never mind...

robpr

On PTS mDK sustain is worse now, even with Breton and no cd on Combustion. It reaaaaly hurts the gameplay. Nobody should rely on rng to gain resources.

Zer0_CooL

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

FlatLine12 wrote: »

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

Especially the whip and ingulfing flames. It shouldn't be possible to cancel a skill with a cast time, only it's animation. Yet ingulfing flames can be canceled completely.

If animation canceled, Engulfing isn’t completely cancelled...you probably just missed.

MagDk has some of the best animations in the game, many of which can be animation canceled. Do not encourage ZOS to fiddle with these animations. Geeze...it can only end up bad.

Incidentally, I wonder what people ...never mind...

I had it multiple times that the skill got canceled multiple times, and the whip sometimes even if not canceled stops mid animation and doesn't deal any damage. I'll check if i can make some clips, and post them here.

BlackMadara

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

FlatLine12 wrote: »

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

Especially the whip and ingulfing flames. It shouldn't be possible to cancel a skill with a cast time, only it's animation. Yet ingulfing flames can be canceled completely.

If animation canceled, Engulfing isn’t completely cancelled...you probably just missed.

MagDk has some of the best animations in the game, many of which can be animation canceled. Do not encourage ZOS to fiddle with these animations. Geeze...it can only end up bad.

Incidentally, I wonder what people ...never mind...

I had it multiple times that the skill got canceled multiple times, and the whip sometimes even if not canceled stops mid animation and doesn't deal any damage. I'll check if i can make some clips, and post them here.

That is due to lag. You'll get the start of the animation and a stutter, and nothing actually happens.

JumpmanLane

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

JumpmanLane wrote: »

Zer0_CooL wrote: »

FlatLine12 wrote: »

Finally, I recommend certain DK abilities and animations to be reworked with reduced cast times. These abilities include; Engulfing Flames/Fiery Breath, Whip, Flames of Oblivion. Note: I used Names of the abilities I use (but obviously you know which abilities I'm talking about, that's my point). Theses abilities say they are "instant" cast but their actual animations have a cast time and cannot effectively be action cancelled compared to other classes and their abilities, as well these abilities are limited to a 7m distance so it puts that even more of a disadvantage. For example, a person can weave cast 2 Crushing Shocks to 1 Whip. So, this is a major concern because it makes casting DK abilities clunky and not fun to cast and or go through a rotation...for PVE and PVP.

Please let me know if you think any of these recommendations might be an improvement.

Especially the whip and ingulfing flames. It shouldn't be possible to cancel a skill with a cast time, only it's animation. Yet ingulfing flames can be canceled completely.

If animation canceled, Engulfing isn’t completely cancelled...you probably just missed.

MagDk has some of the best animations in the game, many of which can be animation canceled. Do not encourage ZOS to fiddle with these animations. Geeze...it can only end up bad.

Incidentally, I wonder what people ...never mind...

I had it multiple times that the skill got canceled multiple times, and the whip sometimes even if not canceled stops mid animation and doesn't deal any damage. I'll check if i can make some clips, and post them here.

Whips can be canceled to the point where it seemingly doesn’t fire AT ALL. But it still does damage. Just a little noise like “poof”. Easier to do in PvE with good FPS and low ping. In Cyro, good luck. Lol.

Engulfing’s easy to miss. If it fires just a bit though. It does damage.