Monetisation of New Systems

Tasear

Ah yes..I understand now. The balance is being shifted.

Might be nice to consider having some of these in dungeons and putting in crown store or crates.

I would also like more incentives to rerun dungeons. Like can I get some points or something for all no death clears. But honestly difference lack of leadboards.

I still have faith they do seem try there best to make it enjoyable world. It's what I admire most about the game.

adriant1978

Greevir wrote: »

You'll be able to buy them with gold. "Gifting Molag Kena Arms Pack for 1.5 million gold!"

At which point someone doesn't get their Kena pack, or doesn't get their gold, since the system has no safeguards in place to support this type of trading. Scammers will love it.

Turelus

Tasear wrote: »

I still have faith they do seem try there best to make it enjoyable world. It's what I admire most about the game.

I still love the gameplay and most of what ZOS do, I have very little to complain about normally.
It just worries me that every system they've introduced recently has then been monetised in some way. It would be nice to play some of the game without the Crown Store showing up.

Tasear

Yes.. this thread is light, but reward system needs work.


maybe the guild system reworks next patch after summerset will fix this

zaria

Phage wrote: »

Would've been great as rare drops in thise dungeons.

Yet again though, ZO$ misses the opportunity for interesting gameplay and ingame rewards by opting for a quick buck.

This, have it an pretty rare drop,

Turelus wrote: »

Greevir wrote: »

You'll be able to buy them with gold. "Gifting Molag Kena Arms Pack for 1.5 million gold!"

True. Although if they're a limited weekend only deal at 5000 Crowns I would expect it to be quote the sum of gold.

If they want more sales they should stop with the weekend only and gone forever sale model.
Instead sell it for current price or preferable cheaper, then move it to an back store there price is higher.

Turelus

zaria wrote: »

If they want more sales they should stop with the weekend only and gone forever sale model.
Instead sell it for current price or preferable cheaper, then move it to an back store there price is higher.

Marketing has proven fear of missing out (FOMO) works very well at making people buy things they don't really want/need.
If their current tactics were not profitable for them they wouldn't be using them.

Carbonised

I agree with Turelus. Every update we see an increase in the monetization schemes they deploy. Every update they go just a tad further, and every update they continue to try my patience in just how much bull I want to put up with before dropping th game to the floor and leaving for good.

When new stuff is added to the game, the main priority seems to be "how can we milk this for the most money" instead of "how can we make this most fun and engaging for the players". While there is nothing wrong with making money per se, there is definitely something wrong with making money at the expense of fun and engagement, and when you aim to earn as much money as possible, with no low being too low to stoop. EA loot boxes showed just how that will end.

As for those who always come with the same argument "it's only cosmetics, who cares", well, plenty of people care. Good for you you don't care how your character looks or how their house looks. Look at how many people throw oceans of dollars at homes, furnishings and costumes. All "only cosmetics". For many of us, cosmetics is the real end game for a game such as this.

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!). The monetisation conitnues to become more and more hostile, and I for one am starting to reach my limit to just how much psychological bull I want to put up with, before closing down my wallet for good.

inf.toniceb17_ESO

I don't really mind them selling cosmetic stuff in crown store, quite the opposite actually. It's supposed to be good for game. Their prices are outrageous however.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Most of what @Turelus wrote is both true and well written.

But... I look at it differently.

We're "oldtimers". I don't know ESO's demographics but I bet we're the minority of players by now. It's logical that we see the crown store popping up everywhere we look, because we look at NEW THINGS !
Are new players able to play the game for hours upon hours without stumbling onto the crown store and crown store exclusive items ? I believe so. ESO is still a game where you can safely and completely ignore the crown store. Unlike other F2P or B2P MMOs where you're reminded every two minutes that you cannot keep up unless you sub or spend.
Also, I'd like to emphasize that nothing in the Crown Store is even remotely P2W, and that's a big big point.

Another point is that "reviving interest for old zones" is something that matters to is oldtimers, not to newer players.

And finally, while I agree that every new feature is designed by ZOS with monetization in mind, they're also careful to give us enough to do in the game. There's Crown Store exclusive outfit stuff ? Sure. But there's soooo much we can play with already in the outfit system as it is. There are Crown Store exclusive furniture ? Sure. But there are hundreds and hundreds of very nice craftable furniture we can obtain ingame. There are Crown Store exclusive utilities such as Mundus Stones ? Yes there are. But everyone can use them at a friend's house. Or in the country side, it's not that hard.

TL/DR : yes but we can look at what we have rather than at what we don't have, because there's plenty of it.

anitajoneb17_ESO

Carbonised wrote: »

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!).

?? Would you please explain what you're referring to ? I haven't seen any motif being included in crates... is that new on PTS ?

Seraphayel

mikejezz wrote: »

Seraphayel wrote: »

They just want to squeeze out money of every possible aspect of the game.

I really really really don't like this. Why is the nice stuff Crown Store related? They don't add any new mounts or nice things to the base game that you can unlock or achieve, everything goes straight to the Crown Store. Why even ESO+? It already feels like a F2P game with all the stuff you can buy in the shop. And it won't get any better, it will get worse.

I really don't like this massive monetizing aspect of the game. It's just lame and disappointing for every loyal player.

To be fair regarding mounts, this game nails it better than WoW. There you pay to play and also have to pay for mounts on the store (I know they put a little bit of mounts in each expansion that can be obtained in raids.)

Here you actually can pay for mounts with the monthly crowns you get.

Yeah except most of the stuff is in the Crown Crates and you have to play this awful rng game. In WoW you still can get amazing mounts with reputation, in dungeons, in raids or just somehow unlock them. The amount of mounts they put in their store is minimal. When did we get the last "usual" mount in game you can unlock without $$$ (and that looks decent)? Can't remember.

Too much time is dedicated for Crown Crate stuff. That's monetization at cost of the (loyal) players.

dan958

I don't like the idea of 'crown store only' items. Everyone should have the chance at purchasing all items from the store, be it through crowns or through a large amount of gold.

Not everyone will want to/be able to purchase crowns, but the option will still be there for the people that do not want to spend time getting the gold.

Carbonised

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!).

?? Would you please explain what you're referring to ? I haven't seen any motif being included in crates... is that new on PTS ?

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Just another step down the slippery slope of [snip] business practises that this company is infamous for now.

[Edited to remove profanity]

anitajoneb17_ESO

Carbonised wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!).

?? Would you please explain what you're referring to ? I haven't seen any motif being included in crates... is that new on PTS ?

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Just another step down the slippery slope of [snip] business practises that this company is infamous for now.

MMMhhhhh... thanks for the explanation. I agree it's not an elegant move from ZOS... not at all.

Still, as long as it doesn't interfere with the gameplay (i.e. Will not be required for master writs) I'll still be happy to play around with the 60+ motifs we already have...

[Edited for quote]

Turelus

Carbonised wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!).

?? Would you please explain what you're referring to ? I haven't seen any motif being included in crates... is that new on PTS ?

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Just another step down the slippery slope of [snip] business practises that this company is infamous for now.

W T F . . .
That's pretty damn low. I'm not angry, just very very disappointed.

[Edited for quote]

myskyrim26

Turelus wrote: »

List of Monetised Systems.

Housing
Crown only decorations.
Crown Crate only decorations.
Housing slots locked behind subscription.

Transmutation
Additional token slots locked behind subscription.

Outfit System
Outfit slots per character and sold for insane amounts ($14.99 each!)
Crown Store only outfit items (Summerset pre-order, Summerset Crown Store)

Ok, these all are luxury items. Can I play without them? Sure.

Luxury is always something expensive and something completely unnesessary. Can I buy a Lexus car? Or maybe Patek Philippe watch? A villa on Florida beach? No. Can I live without this luxury? Sure.

So are all monetized items: unnessessary luxury. Some can affrod them. Others are whining for the reason unknown to me. Why not go to Patek Philippe facebook group and whine about their prices than?

Carbonised

Turelus wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!).

?? Would you please explain what you're referring to ? I haven't seen any motif being included in crates... is that new on PTS ?

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Just another step down the slippery slope of [snip] business practises that this company is infamous for now.

W T F . . .
That's pretty damn low. I'm not angry, just very very disappointed.

Yep. I'm disappointed too. Every update I think we've reached the all time low for how much we can bleed customers of their money, and every update ZOS shows that we've seen nothing yet.

If I wanted to get fleeced and scammed, I would have played some free to play mobile games. I don't expect this kind of behaviour on a triple A title from a large game developer. Though looking at EA, Bungie/Activision and Bethesda's "Creation Club", I guess I should expect this behaviour after all ..

To think that once upon a time, people balked at horse armor DLCs and shamed the company for it, while today we eat this kind of bull completely raw, and still ask for seconds.

[Edited for quote]

Raraaku

I'm a big fan of balancing such cosmetic stuff between ease of access (crown store) and grindfest, but still possible to obtain (low % drop). In fact, I think such a system would actually result in more crown store purchases from players tired of farming with no success.

Oh, and $15 for outfit slot is just ridiculous, should halved. Hopefully the price drops as the system becomes less shiny (aka new).

Aeslief

Carbonised wrote: »

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Wait, WHAT? Wow... That’s...pretty low tbh.

I’ve got no problem with most of this game’s monetization schemes, but this change makes me a little uncomfortable. I suppose the pages are bound like every other crate consumable. So if you get nothing but axe after axe after axe all you can do is redeem it for 5 gems and buy the next page you need for 40....(I don’t know that for sure, just guessing). I really dislike the sound of this. None of the data mined mounts look appealing to me, so I wasn’t planning to hit the crates next season at all. Any idea how many gems the full book would cost? Past books have been 200 gems for the full book. I guess I can check it out myself this afternoon.

Carbonised

Aeslief wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Wait, WHAT? Wow... That’s...pretty low tbh.

I’ve got no problem with most of this game’s monetization schemes, but this change makes me a little uncomfortable. I suppose the pages are bound like every other crate consumable. So if you get nothing but axe after axe after axe all you can do is redeem it for 5 gems and buy the next page you need for 40....(I don’t know that for sure, just guessing). I really dislike the sound of this. None of the data mined mounts look appealing to me, so I wasn’t planning to hit the crates next season at all. Any idea how many gems the full book would cost? Past books have been 200 gems for the full book. I guess I can check it out myself this afternoon.

Nope, we don't know if there will be a full book, or only the individual pages, if they will even be buyable with gems, or perhaps be called "apex radiant motifs" and not be buyable, or how many gems they will cost if they are even buyable etc etc.

All we do know is they split up the motif in pages, and it seems to be crate exclusive. I guess they're gauging just how outraged we will be initially reacting to this, and pricing the motif pages according to that ...

Turelus

Aeslief wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Wait, WHAT? Wow... That’s...pretty low tbh.

I’ve got no problem with most of this game’s monetization schemes, but this change makes me a little uncomfortable. I suppose the pages are bound like every other crate consumable. So if you get nothing but axe after axe after axe all you can do is redeem it for 5 gems and buy the next page you need for 40....(I don’t know that for sure, just guessing). I really dislike the sound of this. None of the data mined mounts look appealing to me, so I wasn’t planning to hit the crates next season at all. Any idea how many gems the full book would cost? Past books have been 200 gems for the full book. I guess I can check it out myself this afternoon.

Full BA book was 400 gems. I doubt this would be any cheaper.

Turelus

Carbonised wrote: »

Aeslief wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Wait, WHAT? Wow... That’s...pretty low tbh.

I’ve got no problem with most of this game’s monetization schemes, but this change makes me a little uncomfortable. I suppose the pages are bound like every other crate consumable. So if you get nothing but axe after axe after axe all you can do is redeem it for 5 gems and buy the next page you need for 40....(I don’t know that for sure, just guessing). I really dislike the sound of this. None of the data mined mounts look appealing to me, so I wasn’t planning to hit the crates next season at all. Any idea how many gems the full book would cost? Past books have been 200 gems for the full book. I guess I can check it out myself this afternoon.

Nope, we don't know if there will be a full book, or only the individual pages, if they will even be buyable with gems, or perhaps be called "apex radiant motifs" and not be buyable, or how many gems they will cost if they are even buyable etc etc.

All we do know is they split up the motif in pages, and it seems to be crate exclusive. I guess they're gauging just how outraged we will be initially reacting to this, and pricing the motif pages according to that ...

The outrage will never be enough for them to stop, not until it's P2W (literally not this fake P2W people keep claiming).

xenowarrior92eb17_ESO

great this is another thing to say !@#$ YOU all crafters and your motifs and hardwork.

Shadowstale

As long as it's just cosmetic items, I'm fine with it. Slightly annoyed, but fine.
I do understand that from business perspective they need to make money to support development and other costs but they could adjust the pricing to be little more buyer friendly, and cover costs with more sales.

Just my two cents.

Carbonised

Turelus wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Aeslief wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Wait, WHAT? Wow... That’s...pretty low tbh.

I’ve got no problem with most of this game’s monetization schemes, but this change makes me a little uncomfortable. I suppose the pages are bound like every other crate consumable. So if you get nothing but axe after axe after axe all you can do is redeem it for 5 gems and buy the next page you need for 40....(I don’t know that for sure, just guessing). I really dislike the sound of this. None of the data mined mounts look appealing to me, so I wasn’t planning to hit the crates next season at all. Any idea how many gems the full book would cost? Past books have been 200 gems for the full book. I guess I can check it out myself this afternoon.

Nope, we don't know if there will be a full book, or only the individual pages, if they will even be buyable with gems, or perhaps be called "apex radiant motifs" and not be buyable, or how many gems they will cost if they are even buyable etc etc.

All we do know is they split up the motif in pages, and it seems to be crate exclusive. I guess they're gauging just how outraged we will be initially reacting to this, and pricing the motif pages according to that ...

The outrage will never be enough for them to stop, not until it's P2W (literally not this fake P2W people keep claiming).

Well no, but if we seem royally p*ssed off, they might price it "fairly", while if the reaction isn't all that great, they can price it higher.

ZOS seems to probe us with feelers like these all the time, they are rather neutral towards datamining the updates, they give us all the Crown Store content on the PTS every update, and they release the montly Crown Store showcases - all of this without any actual prices. You'd be a fool not to believe someone from their marketing dept. isn't skimming the forums for reactions, and pricing next month's content according to that. That, and of course their internal business data.

I don't care for the P2W discussion anyway. This is a social RPG based MMO, no a competitive PvP environment like 1st person shooter games or battle arena games. The cosmetics are just as much "competitive endgame" as anything else in this game, and in that department, it is clear that we are very, very far into the "P2W" territory already, and farther every update.

heaven13

It's absolute crap. ZOS has long forgotten the definition of 'micro' because these transactions are anything but.

As a crafter who loves to collect motifs, this new "locked single pages as crown crate exclusive" is a HUGE slap in the face.

Sorry ZOS, I'm still not buying your scummy crates.

I'm not even sure why ZOS wants me to play the game anymore. Just log in and buy stuff, no need to quest or enjoy the world. Everything is centered around how many crowns ZOS can squeeze out of players. I can't even login without the Crown Store ad coming up to tell me all the wonderful things I don't have yet! -_-

Blackbird_V

Carbonised wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

anitajoneb17_ESO wrote: »

Carbonised wrote: »

Also, Turelus you forgot to mention that they have now also gone from selling Crown Store exclusive motifs, to Crown Crate exclusive motifs cut up in pieces and sold to us in parts via the gambling system (good luck trying to catch them all!).

?? Would you please explain what you're referring to ? I haven't seen any motif being included in crates... is that new on PTS ?

Yes it's on the PTS. The new crates will drop the Maomar motif, which looks pretty dang awesome, but only from crates, and only single pages of the motif. So you're going to have to spend a huge amount of dollars and battle RNG hidden inside RNG if you want the entire motif ...

Just another step down the slippery slope of [snip] business practises that this company is infamous for now.

W T F . . .
That's pretty damn low. I'm not angry, just very very disappointed.

Yep. I'm disappointed too. Every update I think we've reached the all time low for how much we can bleed customers of their money, and every update ZOS shows that we've seen nothing yet.

Patch 5.0.0

You can now purchase additional ability effects, texture packs, and unlock addons from crown store!

[Edited for quote]

Turelus

Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »

Patch 5.0.0

You can now purchase additional ability effects, texture packs, and unlock addons from crown store!

I'm honestly expecting that if they ever do the spell crafting system now.

Carbonised

Turelus wrote: »

Valkyn_Eltrys wrote: »

Patch 5.0.0

You can now purchase additional ability effects, texture packs, and unlock addons from crown store!

I'm honestly expecting that if they ever do the spell crafting system now.

They haven't added a single new system in a long time that wasn't tied heavily into the crown store.

Even jewelrycrafting is tied to the store, as many people will pay good money for those research scrolls simply to be the first ones to bypass the trait research time and do jewelrycrafting (inb4 "first ring & necklace all traits researched" forum post pops up)

heaven13

How long have people been asking for Maormer stuff? Slapped behind crown crates.

How long have people been begging for a boat house? Crown exclusive (probably at least $100).

We're just walking wallets.