Power of the light/Purifying light should only stack your own damage

Brutusmax1mus

BohnT wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Yeah, because it's just a picnic having to deal with 3 stamblades with a ridiculously OP 75 cost ultimate, fear spams, and perma rooted because of Ambush. Please. I'd rather fight 3 templars. At least I could move. Yeah, I might not kill them, but if they are "BOL healbots" spamming this supposedly OP skill, they aren't going to kill me either.

All people ever do is ask to nerf Templar skills because they ruin their Xv1, which ZoS invariably does because of all the "OMG RD is OP! QQ" threads and, because these skills aren't that great at 1v1, it has turned the class into an awkward basketcase unless it's a healbot in a zerg.

Oh Joy just read the posts i made. I want a balanced game,i don't care about your bitterness you build up over the last few years.

Also i hope that Joy that always makes good posts can see that i want PotL to be better in solo play.

I play all classes i don't want to make the classes i play to be boring i want them to be good but i also don't want stupid things like PotL stacking all incoming damage.

The posts you made are what's stupid. Pretty soon you're going to tellme purifying and potl hot fot 18k. You keep increasing it.

BohnT

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

The skill doesn’t need to be touched, every little thing Templar gets people want it nerfed from Jesus beam, sweeps, ritual, pol, breath of life, shards, blazing shield, and blinding Flashes. Basically every skill Templars predominantly use has asked to be nerfed or already has been.

Any skill is an xv1 skill during an xv1 , that doesn’t mean we should nerf every skill because it becomes more obnoxious during that situation. With all the tanky people running around in open world this skill is needed. If you’re in a 4v12 then skills like this come in handy when you need to focus targets down. This would only help the people constantly xving not the small scalers.

That's just wrong.
Some skills / things perform just so much better in xv1 than the other way around.
Curse is no problem in 1v1 but if you get 4 sorcs to cast curse the exact same moment you can kill everything except for templars with no counterplay available.
Poisons are another one of those things. The cooldown is put on yourself and not on the target meaning you can be hit by every poison in the game while you can only apply 1 poison every 10 seconds.
Same with PotL in 1v1 you can get it to full damage hurt it's not easy and you have to deal all the damage in xv1 you can play with 0 damage and still get the full damage proc because others are carying you.

Single target abilities, most AoEs aren't a specific xv1 skill as they perform just as good in 1v1, 1vX or Xv1 they hurt you but they don't punish you further for being outnumbered

Did I not already say any skill become more obnoxious in a xv1, did you even get anything I said? Since you already have it figured out what actual pvp skill doesn’t become more obnoxious when you’re getting xv1ed? I’ll wait.

A Xv1 skill punishes you more for being outnumbered than other skills they increase their strength when used by multiple players or remove counterplay.
Frags casted when you 1v1 someone deal the same damage when they hit you while you are being Xv1ed.

1 curse deals damage with no counterplay for 4/5 classes but when you have 4 on you at the same time you die with no available counterplay.

See the difference?

4 players hitting you with curse or frags can 1 shot you. 4 players hitting you pol causes MAYBE 10k dmg, but you probably died before it exploded. See the difference

@BohnT? You have a 28k purifying light tooltip?

The skill is so balanced, that blocking, what it's meant to help templars with, COUNTERS IT! It's literally one ofthe most unique and balanced skills in the game. Dodge roll, mitigation sources, blocking, line of sight, soft and hard cc, purge all are counters.

Even going offensive is a counter. If the opponents aren't attacking, you countered it. The burst can be high, but there are many skills that are far more op than pol.

Do you complain that if you get feared, the opponents ally takes less damage from you?
Do you complain that weakness of elements buffs everyone dmg vs you for way longer, probably resulting in similar damage taken, and gives them more resources?
(Most relevant)Do you complain that someone attacking a blazing shield tank near you caused you to die bc they took damage from someone other than you?

Yes on one of my builds with hulking+ bone pirate.

It's about one player hitting you with PotL that couldn't touch you with any other skill and can only hurt you because you get Xv1ed.


I hate CC bots but there is no solution to prevent a tank from spamming roots, CCs etc that's an acceptable disturbance.

I'm no running with people dumb enough to focus the blazeplar i wouldn't complain because it's my faul to be close to a blazeplar when attacking it (also blazeplar is dead to die to one you'd have to be afk for 5 mins )

BohnT

Joy_Division wrote: »

Yeah, because it's just a picnic having to deal with 3 stamblades with a ridiculously OP 75 cost ultimate, fear spams, and perma rooted because of Ambush. Please. I'd rather fight 3 templars. At least I could move. Yeah, I might not kill them, but if they are "BOL healbots" spamming this supposedly OP skill, they aren't going to kill me either.

All people ever do is ask to nerf Templar skills because they ruin their Xv1, which ZoS invariably does because of all the "OMG RD is OP! QQ" threads and, because these skills aren't that great at 1v1, it has turned the class into an awkward basketcase unless it's a healbot in a zerg.

Oh Joy just read the posts i made. I want a balanced game,i don't care about your

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Yeah, because it's just a picnic having to deal with 3 stamblades with a ridiculously OP 75 cost ultimate, fear spams, and perma rooted because of Ambush. Please. I'd rather fight 3 templars. At least I could move. Yeah, I might not kill them, but if they are "BOL healbots" spamming this supposedly OP skill, they aren't going to kill me either.

All people ever do is ask to nerf Templar skills because they ruin their Xv1, which ZoS invariably does because of all the "OMG RD is OP! QQ" threads and, because these skills aren't that great at 1v1, it has turned the class into an awkward basketcase unless it's a healbot in a zerg.

Oh Joy just read the posts i made. I want a balanced game,i don't care about your bitterness you build up over the last few years.

Also i hope that Joy that always makes good posts can see that i want PotL to be better in solo play.

I play all classes i don't want to make the classes i play to be boring i want them to be good but i also don't want stupid things like PotL stacking all incoming damage.

The posts you made are what's stupid. Pretty soon you're going to tellme purifying and potl hot fot 18k. You keep increasing it.

Yes i will just increase the number maybe wrobel will kill the class i play the most at the moment and that i really like.

BohnT

Checkmath wrote: »

oh you want to say i am not allowed to apply defile on enemies with a skill like every stamina character does?

No but it's just a cheesy playstyle to win every fight against stamchars.

Cage_Lizardman

I usually fight with large groups, and I have 129 killing blows from PotL, as opposed to 123 with light attacks.

So yeah, light attacks need nerfing too.

Joy_Division

BohnT wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Yeah, because it's just a picnic having to deal with 3 stamblades with a ridiculously OP 75 cost ultimate, fear spams, and perma rooted because of Ambush. Please. I'd rather fight 3 templars. At least I could move. Yeah, I might not kill them, but if they are "BOL healbots" spamming this supposedly OP skill, they aren't going to kill me either.

All people ever do is ask to nerf Templar skills because they ruin their Xv1, which ZoS invariably does because of all the "OMG RD is OP! QQ" threads and, because these skills aren't that great at 1v1, it has turned the class into an awkward basketcase unless it's a healbot in a zerg.

Oh Joy just read the posts i made. I want a balanced game,i don't care about your bitterness you build up over the last few years.

Also i hope that Joy that always makes good posts can see that i want PotL to be better in solo play.

I play all classes i don't want to make the classes i play to be boring i want them to be good but i also don't want stupid things like PotL stacking all incoming damage.

I didn't specifically reply to you.

I do read your posts. Not just in this thread. You can get just as bitter as I am when on a topic you are passionate about so let's not throw rocks, shall we.

And YOU may want a balanced game, but it's clear a lot of people are just interested in nerf this, nerf that, nerf what killed me, nerf what I don't play.

If we do what the OP wants, just that, it's a huge nerf with zero compensatory adjustments elsewhere. It also makes the skill pointless to run for PvE healers. It's just a freaking nerf on a class that is NOT OP. So, my statement applies and is relevant.

I'm tired of people making balance judgments to the class I play using groups or Xv1s as justification, while my class is the only one subjected to that criteria. It's crap. Every class is amped when others are around. You know how NBs always claim it's fine for them to have ridiculous offensive power because they are "squishy" and have "no class heals."? Well, those drawbacks go away when they are in a zerg and when they are Xv1ing me.

But let's get down to some actual facts. Read the nonsense in the OP. 6-10K free damage. That's a bunch of horsecrap.

Here'a an actual fight I had against 2 (and then later 4) players



That's not theoretical. That's actual recorded Cyrodiil PvP combat.

10 Purifying Lights cast - 10! - and the max damage is 3.5K. The average damage is 1852.

And before people tell me L2P, look at the total damage I outputted; over 300,000

Here's what they did against me: 170,000 damage.



And I'm on a freaking Nord not even built for damage. I was the aggressor in that fight. I set the tone. I was doing the damage. And I still lost. Because Purifying Light is nowhere near as strong as people who dont main templars think it is. That damage is NOT free. When you're breaking CCs, hitting honor the dead, missing cloaked and rolly polly NBs because Puncturing Sweeps is a terrible skill that is incapable of hitting a moving target then you are doing no damage to stack on the target and will never see a 10K tick.

I'd be less bitter if people didn't just call out for nerfs because they died in cyrodiil.

TheDoomsdayMonster

BohnT wrote: »

Checkmath wrote: »

potl one of the strongest singe target skills? that made me laugh....

It hits for 14k while being undodgeable and unblockable and delayed. That's more than most ults can hit for etc.

If PotL hits someone for 14k, then they withstood 70k damage in a 6 second span which undoubtably means that person was being hammered by several very hard hitting characters during that time span or a ton of zerglings...

PotL doing more damage than an Ulty under those circumstances is understandable as a result...


Backlash is an excellent support ability; one of the best in the game and is something unique to Templars...

Its powerful and should be as its class defining...

Us Templars have the worse Class Ults, arguably the worse Class passives, and lack the burst other Class's have by a significant degree; Backlash is something that somewhat balances the tables...


I firmly believe Backlash (and its morphs) should stay as is as a result...

Qbiken

I'm tired of people making balance judgments to the class I play using groups or Xv1s as justification,

Took the words out of my mouth. And this applies to so many things in this game....

ak_pvp

I agree with OP, but only for PvP. If you build for healing groups, and no damage, you should have no damage. No matter what. Playstyles that cannot survive solo IMO shouldn't survive at all.

Make it scale higher of your own damage, so a damage oriented templar deals the same, but a healtard doesn't. I'm betting many of the people complaining run a small group of 24 and the only contribution is BoL, backlash and beam, maybe the odd eclipse too. Because its mindless, and they don't have to build damage for themselves.

I am all for buffing templars, especially solo where they struggle, but Xv1 trash clutches need to die.

Checkmath

Its better to leave the skill be than amping its percentage and making it only copy you own damage. Why, because atm the skill is a nice tool for a burst combo, which needs a lot of preparation to hit hard in a 1v1. Actually to really make its damage good in this situation, you need to apply dots first and a combo time of 6 seconds. I want to see any templar doing that conistently without being stunned or forced to heal. And in that situation not a full combo is landing, then its damage is decent or not so good (depends on how much damage you did). Ok sounds like the skill is bad, right? But thats not the case. The skill is rewarding for making a good combo and i dont want to see its full damage because i applied it to an enemy together with eclypse. Or only backlash and soul assault. This would be just easy and soon would be stated as OP. Thats why its better to let it be, so that actually supporters also can do something not only healing in pve.

BohnT wrote: »

No but it's just a cheesy playstyle to win every fight against stamchars.

Why cheesy? I built to be able to maintain a stamina skill in my build. I use a skill, which is used by 70% of stamtoons in duels, so its cheesy for me to use while they can spam slam their shields on every enemy? Also on stamina enemies? Everyone is able to use that skill, but on a magplar its cheese to use reverb bash? Even if i have to run other sets to maintain it...i dont even have points in befoul....still cheesy while every stamtoon puts points into it. I also could use dark flare, that surely wouldnt be cheese, since its a class ability. And it surely wouldnt be cheese to run duroks bane like a lot people started to do recently. Tell me once more that its cheese to run a stamina skill on a magplar to get the defile debuff on the enemy after reading what i said.

Subversus

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

CatchMeTrolling wrote: »

The skill doesn’t need to be touched, every little thing Templar gets people want it nerfed from Jesus beam, sweeps, ritual, pol, breath of life, shards, blazing shield, and blinding Flashes. Basically every skill Templars predominantly use has asked to be nerfed or already has been.

Any skill is an xv1 skill during an xv1 , that doesn’t mean we should nerf every skill because it becomes more obnoxious during that situation. With all the tanky people running around in open world this skill is needed. If you’re in a 4v12 then skills like this come in handy when you need to focus targets down. This would only help the people constantly xving not the small scalers.

That's just wrong.
Some skills / things perform just so much better in xv1 than the other way around.
Curse is no problem in 1v1 but if you get 4 sorcs to cast curse the exact same moment you can kill everything except for templars with no counterplay available.
Poisons are another one of those things. The cooldown is put on yourself and not on the target meaning you can be hit by every poison in the game while you can only apply 1 poison every 10 seconds.
Same with PotL in 1v1 you can get it to full damage hurt it's not easy and you have to deal all the damage in xv1 you can play with 0 damage and still get the full damage proc because others are carying you.

Single target abilities, most AoEs aren't a specific xv1 skill as they perform just as good in 1v1, 1vX or Xv1 they hurt you but they don't punish you further for being outnumbered

Did I not already say any skill become more obnoxious in a xv1, did you even get anything I said? Since you already have it figured out what actual pvp skill doesn’t become more obnoxious when you’re getting xv1ed? I’ll wait.

A Xv1 skill punishes you more for being outnumbered than other skills they increase their strength when used by multiple players or remove counterplay.
Frags casted when you 1v1 someone deal the same damage when they hit you while you are being Xv1ed.

1 curse deals damage with no counterplay for 4/5 classes but when you have 4 on you at the same time you die with no available counterplay.

See the difference?

Yeah I get what you’re saying but I honestly would want to take two curses to the face than two frags to the face.

We can consider the mechanics and whether it’s single target or aoe. But when you have 5 guys on you and 3 are spamming dizzying swing it’s just as annoying as the power of the light, maybe more since cc mechanics aren’t great.

You can block 2 frags but you can’t block 2 curses at the same time. Hence why curse is a better Xv1 tool than frags.

I can’t believe you guys can’t understand what BohnT is saying, he makes perfect sense to me and he’s completely right.

Checkmath

Not completely, because his suggestion is very bad. And for his Xv1 situation...a backlash or not on the enemy will not nake a diffirence for the solo player anymore

Valencer

"Any skill is annoying when getting Xv1'd"

Aside from, you know, backlash scaling off how many people are hitting the same target and the damage other people are doing.

Every other skill hits for nothing on a 0-damage build

IZZEFlameLash

This skill really is a fine and there are a lot of counters to it too. Including just mitigating the damage by making them waste their resource trying to rack up the damage for minimal explosion. Of course, you will also die in outnumbered situation. You still would die to 2k dragonleaping tanks if there were enough of them. Skill is really just fine and its drawback and boon, racking up damage, in itself balances it out.

Subversus

Checkmath wrote: »

Not completely, because his suggestion is very bad. And for his Xv1 situation...a backlash or not on the enemy will not nake a diffirence for the solo player anymore

Sure, I agree. That, however, doesn’t make potl any less of an Xv1 skill. “Xv1 skill” means the skill stength is amplified when you’re in the X as opposed to in the 1.

Look at curse: decent in 1v1, crazy in Xv1 when stacked with other curses. Frags? Not so much, you can deal with it in plenty of ways.

Poisons? Meh 1v1, crazy when stacked.

Potl? Meh 1v1, very potent in X.

Point is that certain skills become far more potent when stacked, while others are just average. Sure it sucks taking 4 frags to the face, but 4 curses to the face is even worse since they have no counterplay safe from purge.

I don’t want potl to get nerfed though, I have 0 problems with it.

Checkmath

And i stated, that it has a lot of drawbacks in a Xv1, like doing no damage at all when the target dies before hand. And somebody why survived the damage from the zerg will also deal with the backlash damage.

arkansas_ESO

Checkmath wrote: »

And i stated, that it has a lot of drawbacks in a Xv1, like doing no damage at all when the target dies before hand. And somebody why survived the damage from the zerg will also deal with the backlash damage.

Unless they've recently changed it POTL (and I assume Purifying Light) both do small amounts of damage to the target when initially cast, on top of the copied damage after six seconds. There's no drawback to Backlash in a Xv1.

Checkmath

The initial damage from backlash is so small, that nobody feels it actually. Its around 800 damage in pve when i remember it correctly, while you are better of with a vamps bane, when you want some free AP from the zerged solo player.

BohnT

Joy_Division wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Yeah, because it's just a picnic having to deal with 3 stamblades with a ridiculously OP 75 cost ultimate, fear spams, and perma rooted because of Ambush. Please. I'd rather fight 3 templars. At least I could move. Yeah, I might not kill them, but if they are "BOL healbots" spamming this supposedly OP skill, they aren't going to kill me either.

All people ever do is ask to nerf Templar skills because they ruin their Xv1, which ZoS invariably does because of all the "OMG RD is OP! QQ" threads and, because these skills aren't that great at 1v1, it has turned the class into an awkward basketcase unless it's a healbot in a zerg.

Oh Joy just read the posts i made. I want a balanced game,i don't care about your bitterness you build up over the last few years.

Also i hope that Joy that always makes good posts can see that i want PotL to be better in solo play.

I play all classes i don't want to make the classes i play to be boring i want them to be good but i also don't want stupid things like PotL stacking all incoming damage.

I didn't specifically reply to you.

I do read your posts. Not just in this thread. You can get just as bitter as I am when on a topic you are passionate about so let's not throw rocks, shall we.

And YOU may want a balanced game, but it's clear a lot of people are just interested in nerf this, nerf that, nerf what killed me, nerf what I don't play.

If we do what the OP wants, just that, it's a huge nerf with zero compensatory adjustments elsewhere. It also makes the skill pointless to run for PvE healers. It's just a freaking nerf on a class that is NOT OP. So, my statement applies and is relevant.

I'm tired of people making balance judgments to the class I play using groups or Xv1s as justification, while my class is the only one subjected to that criteria. It's crap. Every class is amped when others are around. You know how NBs always claim it's fine for them to have ridiculous offensive power because they are "squishy" and have "no class heals."? Well, those drawbacks go away when they are in a zerg and when they are Xv1ing me.

But let's get down to some actual facts. Read the nonsense in the OP. 6-10K free damage. That's a bunch of horsecrap.

Here'a an actual fight I had against 2 (and then later 4) players



That's not theoretical. That's actual recorded Cyrodiil PvP combat.

10 Purifying Lights cast - 10! - and the max damage is 3.5K. The average damage is 1852.

And before people tell me L2P, look at the total damage I outputted; over 300,000

Here's what they did against me: 170,000 damage.



And I'm on a freaking Nord not even built for damage. I was the aggressor in that fight. I set the tone. I was doing the damage. And I still lost. Because Purifying Light is nowhere near as strong as people who dont main templars think it is. That damage is NOT free. When you're breaking CCs, hitting honor the dead, missing cloaked and rolly polly NBs because Puncturing Sweeps is a terrible skill that is incapable of hitting a moving target then you are doing no damage to stack on the target and will never see a 10K tick.

I'd be less bitter if people didn't just call out for nerfs because they died in cyrodiil.

Yeah i think we share those characteristics to be a bit too passionate in some discussions.

I won't tell you L2P when you show damage numbers of PotL i know how hard it is to get it to decent damage numbers especially in outnumbered situations.
That's why i want to change the effectiveness cueve right now it looks like an normal exponential function exp(x) when you set the y axis as effectiveness in battle and the X axis as the sum of friendly players - enemy players.

The more people you face the worse it get and the more people you have fighting with you it gets so mich better.

I want this changed into this: -x^2/16+1
So it's most effective in 1v1 and loses effectiveness the more enemies you are facing and the more players are chasing the enemy already.
In 1vX it's easy to see that the more enemies are around it gets harder to use for most people 5 players at the same time are the end if the enemies aren't some rolelayers. However the more players hit on the target you want to kill the harder it gets for you to do damage to it because they will do their best to avoid as much damage as possible and as only your own damage is stored the overall effectiveness is reduced (which is a good thing, the guy you are attacking will still die probably but he has better chances to survive than with the current version of the skill)

That's why I'm for 2 changes to the skill. Only your own damage is stored but the % stored gets increased

BohnT

Checkmath wrote: »

The initial damage from backlash is so small, that nobody feels it actually. Its around 800 damage in pve when i remember it correctly, while you are better of with a vamps bane, when you want some free AP from the zerged solo player.

On PotL it's actually around 2-4k on players + it's undodgeable.
No one stops you from using other abilities but a healbot will deal more damage with Purifying light than 40 ticks of his vampires bane together.
Also for 1Xv1 vamp bane can be dodged etc, Purifying is just fire and forget you hit the enemy and even if he LoS you and your zerg follows him he'll eat massive amounts of damage

Qbiken

There´s still another issue (Joy or Cinbri will have to correct me if I´m wrong or not properly updated): If a stamplar and a magplar use PoL and PL on the same target, one of their "beams" will be removed/not doing any damage. Same thing if two stamplars use PoL on the same target, only one of the "beams" will go off. I´m not sure if this is still the case.

If only the damage from my own PoL or PL will count towards the endburst (as suggested), it should be possible to stack multiple of them (as with curse-stack) on the same target. Why should my PoL get removed just because another stamplar decided to use his PoL on the same target?

BohnT

Qbiken wrote: »

There´s still another issue (Joy or Cinbri will have to correct me if I´m wrong or not properly updated): If a stamplar and a magplar use PoL and PL on the same target, one of their "beams" will be removed/not doing any damage. Same thing if two stamplars use PoL on the same target, only one of the "beams" will go off. I´m not sure if this is still the case.

If only the damage from my own PoL or PL will count towards the endburst (as suggested), it should be possible to stack multiple of them (as with curse-stack) on the same target. Why should my PoL get removed just because another stamplar decided to use his PoL on the same target?

The explosion is bugged like every other templar ability
They said they fixed it and it's actually working but more often than not the explosion won't do any damage to the enemy which is really annoying in both PvE and PvP.

I'd like to see the same solution to PotL stacking i proposed to curse stacking.
Every enemy gets an "Curse/ PotL limit" meaning
a player can only be affected by one curse at the same time
Group dungeon mobs can be affected by 4 PotL/ curse
Trial enemies limit set to 12 PotL / curse
But i only want this change made to PotL if it doesn't get changed into only storing your own damage

Kadoin

Something that posters here that are complaining about backlash simply don't understand is that you need a large amount of magicka/stamina to be able to deal damage a large amount of damage with that skill. If someone hit you with an extremely powerful backlash, then they have enough mag/stam in their build to destroy you with any other templar class skill because increasing your mag/stam to that extent would have a noticeable effect on all of your skill damage. Changing backlash will do nothing but make them jab you and add to the damage you are taking. You know what? Go ahead and change it, it sounds like you want to take more damage in Xv1

Someone deciding not to unload on you doesn't make them a "healbot;" every single build should have at least one heal on. My vigor tooltip is past 20K, guess that makes me a heal bot if I spam it on my teammates and I don't go all out on a guy someone else will finish off anyway, right? Or can only templars be healbots when my hybrid NB has over 7K HP/s in healing 24/7 and can put 5K+ HP/s HoTs on all my allies 24/7 without running out of mag (CP PvP, its closer to 11K HPS on me alone, 7K on allies. ZOS logic!). Please enlighten me.

If they are...What then, do we then, call the sorcs stacking shields in Xv1 only using frag when it procs as an instant cast, and making sure mages wrath/fury is always on you and praying for implosion when your health is low? The NBs cloaking and light attacking, then heavy attacking before launching grim focus in Xv1? The DKs hiding in the back spamming petrify or stonefist that you will never reach because someone in your face is spamming dizzying swing and/or talons? The wardens spamming dive and blocking with a shield + using subterranean assault when you come close in Xv1? That heavy attack DK or sorc wearing gladiator and flanking that light attacks you from behind ? Reverse slice spam? Multiple dawnbreaker... All of that seems like its "overperforming" far worse in Xv1 than backlash to me! In fact, if you encounter that, you will wish you had backlash on you because you'd be dead very soon. Where's the whining about all of those skills? I missed it.

What's funny is that you're attacking a skill, when the underlying issue is that I can stack mag or stam, keep all regen glyphs on my weapons, use absorb enchants or poisons, and still sustain and do good damage. My damage won't be the maximum, but the damage loss is so low that I won't notice it when using class skills. This is possible in Sotha to an extent, but possible to a gross extent in the CP campaigns. "We need to nerf this now!" Uh oh! Careful now, if you nerf this you'd be nerfing everyone! Why don't we get to the real problem?

Coincidentally, complaints about balance always seems to lead to CP one way or another. Last I checked, Backlash and PotL were both affected by the direct damage CP star. If anything, maybe ZOS should start nerfing there before touching the skill. Every skill I mentioned in the second paragraph just so happens to be affected by the direct damage CP. What another coincidence, right? But wait! That would make you cry about how you can't hit 12K+ uppercuts and 14K+ executioners in pvp, right? Those two skills, definitely are less of an "Xv1 tool" than a skill that can at least be cleansed and you can ALWAYS see. Get real.

TL; DR Blame CP and specifically that direct damage star instead of whining about one skill. Every Xv1 skill that you can complain about has a direct damage component.

Kadoin

BohnT wrote: »

The more people you face the worse it get and the more people you have fighting with you it gets so mich better.

I want this changed into this: -x^2/16+1

Not sure if serious or trolling. Worst balance suggestion I have ever seen on the forum. Have you even done the math or are you pulling that out of thin air? And I'm sure the servers need to compute more floating point when they are already slow. Guess we will have extreme lag when enough lights are placed, right?

Checkmath

fun fact is, that all complain about the damage and even mentioned, that a tank can hit with hard. the skill doesnt scale well with spelldamage, but with max magicka. i havent seen a templar tank with much magicka in years in pvp. maybe he refers to pretty tanky magplars, but mostly has not considered, that they also can dish out damage solo. in every situation, the damage is not the problem. as said, when the damage is amped up by some other dudes, then not the backlash is the problem, but the other dudes. i bet they pressure somebody more than one single skill. still all complain about it and havent even thought about, why this skill is strong in a Xv1 situation. and since nobody thought about it, i cant consider you being very serious about, that the damage part is a problem, just because the caster doesnt have to do anything else. there are dots and bleeds out there dealing mostly more damage than this skill over its duration and they all just need to be applied once.

now to reveal why its strong: the light pillar on the target is visual for your friends and makes them target that enemy, because all know, that this guy already is some kind of focused and will get hurt more, when we also smash some skills into his face. this skill works a bit like mark and cries for "pls all focus this one under the light". and in the, the damage again reaches is maximum, but its not the problem at all. when the target survived to focused damage, then he survives backlash with no problem, because its not as much damage as he just ate by far.

BohnT

Kadoin wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

The more people you face the worse it get and the more people you have fighting with you it gets so mich better.

I want this changed into this: -x^2/16+1

Not sure if serious or trolling. Worst balance suggestion I have ever seen on the forum. Have you even done the math or are you pulling that out of thin air? And I'm sure the servers need to compute more floating point when they are already slow. Guess we will have extreme lag when enough lights are placed, right?

Look at the graph of exp(x) and -x^2/16 +1 with the x and y axis i described in my post.
There's not much math involved in this also it has nothing to do with the server because that's just the skill performance vs different amounts of enemies and that can be done for every skill in this game.

BohnT

Checkmath wrote: »

fun fact is, that all complain about the damage and even mentioned, that a tank can hit with hard. the skill doesnt scale well with spelldamage, but with max magicka. i havent seen a templar tank with much magicka in years in pvp. maybe he refers to pretty tanky magplars, but mostly has not considered, that they also can dish out damage solo. in every situation, the damage is not the problem. as said, when the damage is amped up by some other dudes, then not the backlash is the problem, but the other dudes. i bet they pressure somebody more than one single skill. still all complain about it and havent even thought about, why this skill is strong in a Xv1 situation. and since nobody thought about it, i cant consider you being very serious about, that the damage part is a problem, just because the caster doesnt have to do anything else. there are dots and bleeds out there dealing mostly more damage than this skill over its duration and they all just need to be applied once.

now to reveal why its strong: the light pillar on the target is visual for your friends and makes them target that enemy, because all know, that this guy already is some kind of focused and will get hurt more, when we also smash some skills into his face. this skill works a bit like mark and cries for "pls all focus this one under the light". and in the, the damage again reaches is maximum, but its not the problem at all. when the target survived to focused damage, then he survives backlash with no problem, because its not as much damage as he just ate by far.

The damage part is the problem because it's unblockable, undodgeable burst.
When i'm at 10k health and someone applies a bleed with a tank build i laugh at the 800 dmg ticks. If i get hit for 9k damage while I'm at 9k health I'm dead.
That's the difference burst and dots and burst is always more deadly than dots.
Ofc Dots will kill you especially when mixed with defiles. At one point they will outdps your HPS and your live is set on a timer but that takes much longer than burst.
The best way to kill a healbot isn't stacking dots (even if he doesn't purge) you want to instagib him. 8 dots might deal 50k damage over 6 seconds but a 25k burst will kill the templar

The visual cue doesn't mean anything in Xv1 you are already eating all damage because you are the only target anyway.

Checkmath

you do something wrong, when you call it "burst", since its not. it needs 6 seconds to charge up, so you have plenty of the anticipating and prepare. if you are low health and you see backlash nearly going off, then you did something wrong, because everyone knows this stupid pillar of light is dangerous. similar to meteor, everyone who doesnt block it either is not experienced or has extreme lags. but experienced players like you should be aware of the fact, that you are dead when low health with a backlash running out. you should have prepared, healed up before hand. same with curse, simply because its there dont mean, you cant do anything.
you have whole 6 seconds, shield up and it will barely take off your shield, heal up so you survive and cast rally just after it, so you wont get executed, go mistform and the skill scratches for 2k like an obilvion enchant. its ridiculous, otherwise you should think about skills like unstable core or the distant detonation morph too.

Subversus

@Checkmath mate you really need to start using quotes in your posts

Checkmath

i do sometimes subversus, but mostly its not necessary.