Puncturing Strikes and Red CP in U17

Cinbri

So, continuation of PTS thread.
Red CP in U17 reduce damage of Strikes more than previously.
From PTS:

Cinbri wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

So:
1. Jabs and its 140% damage:

Tried closest to 1000 damage. As you can see its something like 140.XX%. So, tooltip state right amount of damage.

2. About actual damage to closest target:

It does deal same amount of damage as tooltip state. So, 140% seems works properly.

3. About raw damage: Live/PTS
a. Initial damage stay the same(not sure why 1 less damage), since nothing was changed here:


b. As Joy said minor berserk is additive, and nothing changed here too, damage is same:


c. But as first patchnotes said damage taken, like minor vulnerability, is no longer additive, and here is buff changes as on live it is suffer from being additive and as result less than 8%, but on pts it is boosting flat 8% damage increase that don't losing its % when combined with berserk:
without and with Slimecraw' berserk while enemy vulnerable:

---

In theory it look like it work as it intended, but NO, tested closest damage in pvp in exactly same gear/CP/skillbar against opponent with exact same gear/CP/skillbar and result is sad:

Whatever changed with calculation of CP damage taken it ended in monstrous damage nerf for pvp.
Will test tomorrow with no-cp rule and fully naked to decrease chance of error, maybe it fault of pvp debuff, might be my error but i rechecked 3 times as this damage nerf occured only in pvp.


@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

So, here is Part 2:

Did further researches and can confirm Elemental Defender and Thickskinned incorrectly working with only Puncturing Sweeps (Apparently as Hardy for Biting Jabs)

Short results:
Live/PTS
1. 10 points into Thickskinned:

already 8 less damage difference on pts. 13crit.

2. 10 points into Elemental Defender:

already 4 less damage difference on pts. 6crit.

3. 10 points into Ele Def+10 Thickskinned:

already 10 less damage difference on pts. 16crit.
______________________________________

I dont have time to compile and edit 20+ screenshots so here is my raw notes indicating that damage difference occure only for Jabs and only with Red CP costellation:



@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

P.S.: everything tested full-naked, so no mistake on my part.
P.S.S.: make me happy to be no-CPer

Checking Strikes damage pre-Update / right after Update:

And the more enemy stack in elemental/physic protection + dot protections CPs and the more damage-oriented build Templar use - the higher damage difference penalty.

We need any clarification regarding it @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

caeliusstarbreaker

Bump we need justice!

casparian

Just to clarify: this seems to be an issue in CP PVP but not PVE or no-CP PVP. Hence what Cinbri says at the end about CP placement exacerbating the problem.

Grimlok_S

Soo.. to be clear, our own red tree allocation is reducing our damage output?

My puncturing pitchforks are ready.

---E
---E
---E

Grimlok_S

...no, target's mitigation CP is double dippin, mitigating more jabs damage than intended?

Cinbri

Grimlok_S wrote: »

...no, target's mitigation CP is double dippin, mitigating more jabs damage than intended?

It definetly mitigate more damage. And this happened only with strikes after its damage formula was changed.

Cinbri

And I got rumors that it was fixed in latest incremental patch, so tested again, same races, no gear:
Initial damage without using nor Blue nor Red CP is stay same as previous Live/PTS: 373, BL 278, Backlash 529.

1. 10 points in Thickskinned:


2. 10 points into Elemental Defender:


3. 10 points into Ele Def+10 Thickskinned:


Simply compare to spreadsheet in initial post above and those numbers are exact reduced numbers from U17 pts.
So, it not work as it worked previously, and thus I consider it bugged.
It need official reply, not spreading rumors.

Minno

Bump for sweet Templar justice.
@ZOS_GinaBruno

caeliusstarbreaker

Seriously... fix it

Grimlok_S

what's the deal, @ZOS_GinaBruno ?

Wreuntzylla

Well, on the bright side, they fixed the issue where when you logged out of Cyrodiil you wouldn't log back into Cyrodiil!

(Cleverly disguised bump.)

DoctorESO

Cinbri wrote: »

So, continuation of PTS thread.
Red CP in U17 reduce damage of Strikes more than previously.
From PTS:

Cinbri wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

So:
1. Jabs and its 140% damage:

Tried closest to 1000 damage. As you can see its something like 140.XX%. So, tooltip state right amount of damage.

2. About actual damage to closest target:

It does deal same amount of damage as tooltip state. So, 140% seems works properly.

3. About raw damage: Live/PTS
a. Initial damage stay the same(not sure why 1 less damage), since nothing was changed here:


b. As Joy said minor berserk is additive, and nothing changed here too, damage is same:


c. But as first patchnotes said damage taken, like minor vulnerability, is no longer additive, and here is buff changes as on live it is suffer from being additive and as result less than 8%, but on pts it is boosting flat 8% damage increase that don't losing its % when combined with berserk:
without and with Slimecraw' berserk while enemy vulnerable:

---

In theory it look like it work as it intended, but NO, tested closest damage in pvp in exactly same gear/CP/skillbar against opponent with exact same gear/CP/skillbar and result is sad:

Whatever changed with calculation of CP damage taken it ended in monstrous damage nerf for pvp.
Will test tomorrow with no-cp rule and fully naked to decrease chance of error, maybe it fault of pvp debuff, might be my error but i rechecked 3 times as this damage nerf occured only in pvp.


@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

So, here is Part 2:

Did further researches and can confirm Elemental Defender and Thickskinned incorrectly working with only Puncturing Sweeps (Apparently as Hardy for Biting Jabs)

Short results:
Live/PTS
1. 10 points into Thickskinned:

already 8 less damage difference on pts. 13crit.

2. 10 points into Elemental Defender:

already 4 less damage difference on pts. 6crit.

3. 10 points into Ele Def+10 Thickskinned:

already 10 less damage difference on pts. 16crit.
______________________________________

I dont have time to compile and edit 20+ screenshots so here is my raw notes indicating that damage difference occure only for Jabs and only with Red CP costellation:



@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

P.S.: everything tested full-naked, so no mistake on my part.
P.S.S.: make me happy to be no-CPer

Checking Strikes damage pre-Update / right after Update:

And the more enemy stack in elemental/physic protection + dot protections CPs and the more damage-oriented build Templar use - the higher damage difference penalty.

We need any clarification regarding it @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_Wrobel

I'm just impressed that you took notes on graph paper!

React

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom @ZOS_RichLambert

Can we please get a confirmation that this has been acknowledged by the dev team, or whether or not a fix is in the work? This was SUPPOSED TO be the patch where templars damage got fixed after being bugged for about 6 months, and in doing so youve managed to break another scaling aspect of it.

Gigasax

BTW, did you test it with both morph´s or just the base skill? just wondering

Cinbri

Gigasax wrote: »

BTW, did you test it with both morph´s or just the base skill? just wondering

Both morphs are affected.

Grimlok_S

Bump

casparian

@ZOS_GinaBruno are you still going to let us know if this is being worked on?

Templars provided by far the most patient, constructive, documented feedback during this PTS cycle. It's profoundly frustrating to see that being rewarded with no fix to Sweeps' damage and complete silence from ZOS.

WreckfulAbandon

@ZOS_Wrobel

I don't think I've ever tagged the devs in a forum post. This is a serious issue and deserves at least an acknowledgement or response please.

React

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert @ZOS_Wrobel

Can we can some acknowledgement of this issue?

Neoauspex

I heard there was an issue with Templars... Came running to this thread like it was the bat signal

Minno

Neoauspex wrote: »

I heard there was an issue with Templars... Came running to this thread like it was the bat signal

There's another bug too that we are testing out in another thread by Cinbri. Head over there if you want to see the snare from jabs being dodgable lol

casparian

So there are three issues that I know of:
- For some reason, Elemental Defender and Thick-Skinned are reducing the damage of Puncturing Sweeps more than they did in the CWC patch. @Cinbri reported this during the PTS, and Gina said she had passed on the testing info for someone "to dig into".
- The snare applied by Sweeps'/Jabs' final hit is dodgeable (though this may be intentional, as noted in the dedicated thread about this issue)
- Sweeps is reliably locking characters out of using any abilities for about 1 second roughly every three or four casts of the ability. This is very easy to reproduce. Dedicated thread here.

@ZOS_GinaBruno can you let us know whether this is still being looked into? Even if it's just "we haven't forgotten about this, we're digging into it but no ETA", any update would make us nervous templars feel a lot better!

Scrub_Potato

Cinbri wrote: »

Gigasax wrote: »

BTW, did you test it with both morph´s or just the base skill? just wondering

Both morphs are affected.

So Bitting Jabs is being affected by this, too?

Cinbri

Scrub_Potato wrote: »

Cinbri wrote: »

Gigasax wrote: »

BTW, did you test it with both morph´s or just the base skill? just wondering

Both morphs are affected.

So Bitting Jabs is being affected by this, too?

Yes.

casparian wrote: »

So there are three issues that I know of:
- For some reason, Elemental Defender and Thick-Skinned are reducing the damage of Puncturing Sweeps more than they did in the CWC patch. @Cinbri reported this during the PTS, and

Back on pts when I tested it Hardy was also reducing damage of Biting Jabs for higher numbers, so it Hardy, Elemental Defender and Thick-Skinned; and it was initial skill and both morphs, not only magicka morph.
If only EU was first transfered I could check if it happened before or after change of damage formula initiated by @Joy_Division reports of bugged damage output. Now can only guess.

Ariades_swe

Bump for Templar justice.

caeliusstarbreaker

I’m pretty sure all stamina dot’s are being mitigated the same way.

caeliusstarbreaker

I’ve noticed weirdly low values on my jabs, similar to OP’s testing. As well as on my rending slashes, and cleave applications.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_RichLambert your forum mods work over time coming through salt, could someone give an acknowledgement.

Xeven

Bruh, Jabs double dips damage CP, so too should Jabs mitigation be double dippin'.

GTFO with this nonsense. Are you *** serious right now?

caeliusstarbreaker

Xeven wrote: »

Bruh, Jabs double dips damage CP, so too should Jabs mitigation double dip.

GTFO with this nonsense.

I would try to explain the premise of what is being asked here, but you would just streak away 5 times.

Xeven

caeliusstarbreaker wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Bruh, Jabs double dips damage CP, so too should Jabs mitigation double dip.

GTFO with this nonsense.

I would try to explain the premise of what is being asked here, but you would just streak away 5 times.

Nah, you would rather pop immov speed and LOS rocks/bridge/trees with ritual. You're *** joking right? Please keep telling your faction that. My AP loves it.

This dude won't even get off his horse to fight me. He'd rather die to a meteor and respawn.

Must. Get. To. Alessia. Bridge... *BOOM*

caeliusstarbreaker

Xeven wrote: »

caeliusstarbreaker wrote: »

Xeven wrote: »

Bruh, Jabs double dips damage CP, so too should Jabs mitigation double dip.

GTFO with this nonsense.

I would try to explain the premise of what is being asked here, but you would just streak away 5 times.

Nah, you would rather pop immov speed and LOS rocks/bridge/trees with ritual. You're *** joking right? Please keep telling your faction that. My AP loves it.

This dude won't even get off his horse to fight me. He'd rather die to a meteor and respawn.

Must. Get. To. Alessia. Bridge... *BOOM*

Whatever you say bud.