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40k on a test dummy?

  • DoctorESO
    DoctorESO
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    f047ys3v3n wrote: »
    Shantu wrote: »
    God I'm sick of hearing game demi-gods claiming this is easy. I can trash mobs at 40-60k, kick dolmens and public dungeons solo, do some Craglorn group content solo (yeah, yeah, I know some of you can do this blindfolded), so I've got a few skills, but put be in front of a 3 ml test dummy and I can stand there buffing, de-buffing, laying down DoT's, and blasting with everything I've got while maintaining my resources and can still only manage about 10-12k at most. After 1700+ hours and a couple of DPS toons at 700+ CP, gold gear and staff, decent rotation skills, animation canceling (though I'm not really great at it) and I still comparably suck. Put me a vet dungeon where I'm running around trying to stay alive and my suckage meter goes up even further. As a result, I don't even try vet and any HM content as I'm tired of guys getting pissed and kicking me. Honestly, I'm doing the very best I can, but apparently there's something I'm missing? I have no clue how anyone can get even 20k out of a test dummy let alone maintain that level in a dungeon and/or trial. Am I forever doomed to an ESO life of suckage? :(

    So it sounds like from you later posts that you are now hitting more like 20k. That is not really all that far from what I do. I use one of the same gear sets Alcast talks about (julianos, infal, 1 kena) and very close cp allocation and such. I have tried the meta rotation and ended up leaving mercious on the back bar with twisting (casting and refreshing it each twisting cycle) and having the 8 second dots up front. The meta is just an unbelievable amount of bar swap and totally hits the wall if you run out of resources. The meta is unquestionably better but it is also very, very, difficult. Many have mentioned this as you are trying to time out swaps and casts for 8 second dots, a 13 second dot, a 5 light attack proc, the duration on mercilous for the recast, your siphoning buff timer, a 45 or so second pots cooldown, and all while monitoring resources for the potential need for a full heavy to slip in there at 2.2 seconds. Even on a test dummy it is a pretty superhuman thing to try to do. Doing it well with full raid mechanics to deal with would really be something.

    Be all this as it may, I don't actually think that many of the parses people talk about are legitimate. When I look at my results in up-times and such in this or that test and do some quick back of the envelope calculations, 30k looks like about what perfection in a rotation would hit on one of these meta specked mNB's. Many have talked about the phantom magica, health, regen, spell damage, and even stam and resistances that some youtube videos seem to have where when you spec your toon out just like them your numbers are lower. I think much of this whole 40k plus on a dummy business is just that, a very good, almost perfect 30k rotation + some numbers altering in memory using cheat engine. No doubt their rotations are cleaner than mine. One of these guys had 95% up time on is DOTs and mercilous and 100% on his pots. That is amazing, I'm closer to 80% and his rotation looked amazing, so much cleaner than I can do. All that said, when I add up my errors in duration and such on my DOTs, I still don't get very close the the numbers he did. I see more like 30k flat, not the well over 40k he showed.

    My advice to you is to keep practicing. Magblade is frankly hard no matter what set up you do as merciless is a *** to try to keep track of. You can certainly do all the trials on vet with what you will end up with if you have some talent and find a good group to roll with. As for the 40k+ dummy stuff and some hard modes on some content, I think you may have to, shall we say, look at other important parts of your build if you want to have a lot of success there. I have thought for some time that ZOS was inadvertently scaling their toughest content for the synthetically enhanced player. It is a by product of their decision to not deal with CE that folks who both use CE and have great skill will end up at the top. If you then scale stuff to be challenging to your top players (as opposed to challenging to an internal group of play testers as in times past) you will actually end up inadvertently requiring CE use.

    Anyhow, best of luck. It sounds like you have made a lot of improvement and are solidly into trials capable dps numbers.

    Wow...so you think everyone who self-parses above 30k are using Cheat Engine or cheating in some other way? :confounded:
  • Shantu
    Shantu
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    Well, I've made it to a stage where I can pretty consistently hit around 20k when throwing in ultimates, throwing in crystal frag when it procs, and using the spell power pot. I know to further progress I'll need to eventually improve my gear and staff, and of course, practice, practice, practice.

    One thing giving me absolute fits though, is sustain. I'm using Witchmother's (which adds 319 magicka recovery), spell power pot (which boosts recovery another 20%), I have spell damage enchantments on all jewelry (and I'd kinda like to keep it that way), but I still can't go through a single 4 cycle rotation without running into trouble. To adequately sustain, I need to throw in a HA every time I'm on the front bar. Some are saying they only have to use HA 3-4 times over an entire 3 mil. I read over and over that guys with a somewhat similar setup using a FP rotation don't have issues with sustain. I don't get it. Obviously, every time I start thinking and dealing with sustain, the bottom falls out of my performance.

    Here's a simple 4 cycle rotation and watch my magicka:
    https://youtu.be/tVI7mXa9qcU

    What the heck?!? What am I missing? Combat metrics show that FP is far and away the biggest culprit. What's the secret sustain sauce for this kind of rotation?

    I gotta laugh at myself. 2 weeks about I was complaining about being stuck at 10k. Now I'm complaining about being stuck at 20. That's progress! :smiley:
  • Vahrokh
    Vahrokh
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    In that parse you were using neither crystal frags proc nor ultimate...
    Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress

    Trials addict, soloer extraordinaire!

    Here are my Elder Scrolls Online videos
  • Lord-Otto
    Lord-Otto
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    @Shantu
    You're missing Elemental Drain. It's a very important skill in trials groups, so much that most guilds typically allow application in dps parses. You'll find that its Minor Magickasteal effect works wonders for your sustain. It also reduces enemy armor... What is your spell penetration?
  • f047ys3v3n
    f047ys3v3n
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    DoctorESO wrote: »
    Wow...so you think everyone who self-parses above 30k are using Cheat Engine or cheating in some other way? :confounded:

    On an mNb, yes. On other things, No. I think several stam load outs can do better and probably also mSorc. I'm not sure exactly what these things can do as I don't play them with enough proficiency to guess but I do think they can do more than 30k.
    Yes I am deeply embarrassed to still be playing this game. I know better.
  • Valdek
    Valdek
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    Shantu wrote: »
    Well, I've made it to a stage where I can pretty consistently hit around 20k when throwing in ultimates, throwing in crystal frag when it procs, and using the spell power pot. I know to further progress I'll need to eventually improve my gear and staff, and of course, practice, practice, practice.

    One thing giving me absolute fits though, is sustain. I'm using Witchmother's (which adds 319 magicka recovery), spell power pot (which boosts recovery another 20%), I have spell damage enchantments on all jewelry (and I'd kinda like to keep it that way), but I still can't go through a single 4 cycle rotation without running into trouble. To adequately sustain, I need to throw in a HA every time I'm on the front bar. Some are saying they only have to use HA 3-4 times over an entire 3 mil. I read over and over that guys with a somewhat similar setup using a FP rotation don't have issues with sustain. I don't get it. Obviously, every time I start thinking and dealing with sustain, the bottom falls out of my performance.

    Here's a simple 4 cycle rotation and watch my magicka:
    https://youtu.be/tVI7mXa9qcU

    What the heck?!? What am I missing? Combat metrics show that FP is far and away the biggest culprit. What's the secret sustain sauce for this kind of rotation?

    I gotta laugh at myself. 2 weeks about I was complaining about being stuck at 10k. Now I'm complaining about being stuck at 20. That's progress! :smiley:

    So I've just been playing around with builds on my sorcerer. One thing that MASSIVELY helped my sustain was putting the Drain Magicka enchant on my infused main staff. 450 magicka per proc which helps enormously. Having elemental drain on the target is also very important. In dungeons, this *should* usually be applied by a healer and so you shouldn't have to worry about it much except when using a dummy. =)

  • Shantu
    Shantu
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    Vahrokh wrote: »
    In that parse you were using neither crystal frags proc nor ultimate...
    The video was just to emphasize my sustain difficulties. I normally do include those in my rotation but they do nothing to help with sustain. Well, maybe crystal frags does a bit because it's relatively cheap. Still, that HA I have to execute every time I'm on the front bar is a big drag on dps.

    Lord-Otto wrote: »
    @Shantu
    You're missing Elemental Drain. It's a very important skill in trials groups, so much that most guilds typically allow application in dps parses. You'll find that its Minor Magickasteal effect works wonders for your sustain. It also reduces enemy armor... What is your spell penetration?
    I was using elemental drain, but took it out of the rotation for frags. I can't get all I want as it is (I could use a 3rd bar :)). Spell damage is 3353 when buffed with spell power or surge. Combat metrics says I'm running 3588 and maxing at 4055. Crit is at 53.2%. Feel like I have plenty of power. Not sure how to figure spell penetration. I know I have 32 CP in Spell Erosion that bumps it up 2838 + 4884 for the light armor passive (7722?).

    Valdek wrote: »
    So I've just been playing around with builds on my sorcerer. One thing that MASSIVELY helped my sustain was putting the Drain Magicka enchant on my infused main staff. 450 magicka per proc which helps enormously. Having elemental drain on the target is also very important. In dungeons, this *should* usually be applied by a healer and so you shouldn't have to worry about it much except when using a dummy. =)
    I had a Drain Magicka enchant on my staff and you guys said take it off. Lol! Just teasing :smiley:

    I know there's a happy medium here somewhere. I'll squeeze Elem Drain back in again and do some more testing. As always, thanks! :smile:
  • Merlin13KAGL
    Merlin13KAGL
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    Shantu wrote: »
    Vahrokh wrote: »
    In that parse you were using neither crystal frags proc nor ultimate...
    The video was just to emphasize my sustain difficulties. I normally do include those in my rotation but they do nothing to help with sustain. Well, maybe crystal frags does a bit because it's relatively cheap. Still, that HA I have to execute every time I'm on the front bar is a big drag on dps.

    Lord-Otto wrote: »
    @Shantu
    You're missing Elemental Drain. It's a very important skill in trials groups, so much that most guilds typically allow application in dps parses. You'll find that its Minor Magickasteal effect works wonders for your sustain. It also reduces enemy armor... What is your spell penetration?
    I was using elemental drain, but took it out of the rotation for frags. I can't get all I want as it is (I could use a 3rd bar :)). Spell damage is 3353 when buffed with spell power or surge. Combat metrics says I'm running 3588 and maxing at 4055. Crit is at 53.2%. Feel like I have plenty of power. Not sure how to figure spell penetration. I know I have 32 CP in Spell Erosion that bumps it up 2838 + 4884 for the light armor passive (7722?).

    Valdek wrote: »
    So I've just been playing around with builds on my sorcerer. One thing that MASSIVELY helped my sustain was putting the Drain Magicka enchant on my infused main staff. 450 magicka per proc which helps enormously. Having elemental drain on the target is also very important. In dungeons, this *should* usually be applied by a healer and so you shouldn't have to worry about it much except when using a dummy. =)
    I had a Drain Magicka enchant on my staff and you guys said take it off. Lol! Just teasing :smiley:

    I know there's a happy medium here somewhere. I'll squeeze Elem Drain back in again and do some more testing. As always, thanks! :smile:
    Harven's Extended Stats is an addon that will show you your spell pen baseline. It doesn't factor in the passive from the destro line, but it factors in LA passives and weapon traits, etc.

    Superstar will also show this value at the top, again, disregarding Destro passive and ED if you're using it.
    Shantu wrote: »
    I gotta laugh at myself. 2 weeks about I was complaining about being stuck at 10k. Now I'm complaining about being stuck at 20. That's progress! :smiley:
    And that's a step in the right direction.

    Before you know it, you'll be complaining about 25, then 30. ;)

    Excellent progress and kudos for being open to advice! Keep it up.

    Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...

    Earn it.

    IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.
    I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
    Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS
  • bardx86
    bardx86
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    Spamming heavy attacks is ~10K by itself, add 1 DoT and you are at 15K, add the 2nd and you'll break 20K
    Also TBS is utter garbage for ~1 year now[/quote]

    This isn't true.
    Edited by bardx86 on March 6, 2018 2:52AM
    Elured Fury PC_NA
  • bardx86
    bardx86
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    Shantu wrote: »
    Well, I've made it to a stage where I can pretty consistently hit around 20k when throwing in ultimates, throwing in crystal frag when it procs, and using the spell power pot. I know to further progress I'll need to eventually improve my gear and staff, and of course, practice, practice, practice.

    One thing giving me absolute fits though, is sustain. I'm using Witchmother's (which adds 319 magicka recovery), spell power pot (which boosts recovery another 20%), I have spell damage enchantments on all jewelry (and I'd kinda like to keep it that way), but I still can't go through a single 4 cycle rotation without running into trouble. To adequately sustain, I need to throw in a HA every time I'm on the front bar. Some are saying they only have to use HA 3-4 times over an entire 3 mil. I read over and over that guys with a somewhat similar setup using a FP rotation don't have issues with sustain. I don't get it. Obviously, every time I start thinking and dealing with sustain, the bottom falls out of my performance.

    Here's a simple 4 cycle rotation and watch my magicka:
    https://youtu.be/tVI7mXa9qcU

    What the heck?!? What am I missing? Combat metrics show that FP is far and away the biggest culprit. What's the secret sustain sauce for this kind of rotation?

    I gotta laugh at myself. 2 weeks about I was complaining about being stuck at 10k. Now I'm complaining about being stuck at 20. That's progress! :smiley:

    I'm with you, I've tried just about everything and i can't get over 23k. When i compare my parse with other from from this thread my AOE DPS and light weaves are on par in not higher than most. I honestly don't see where i could get another 7k dps easy. The rotation isn't rocket science so something is being lost in translation on this thread, i just can't for the life of me figure it out either.
    Elured Fury PC_NA
  • MakeMeUhSamich
    MakeMeUhSamich
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    FWIW Here’s a Crushing/Clench double lightning no-pet rotation I’ve been using that’s hitting 35k+. Gear is 5 Acuity, 3 Moondancer, 2 Illambris, AS (imperfect), & VMA. I’m still tweaking CP, but I’m on console so it’s slow and expensive lol. Apprentice Mundus and 32 in Erosion.

    http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/MakeMeUhSamich/video/45253134
  • Shantu
    Shantu
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    bardx86 wrote: »
    I'm with you, I've tried just about everything and i can't get over 23k. When i compare my parse with other from from this thread my AOE DPS and light weaves are on par in not higher than most. I honestly don't see where i could get another 7k dps easy. The rotation isn't rocket science so something is being lost in translation on this thread, i just can't for the life of me figure it out either.

    Welcome friend, to the "Brotherhood Of Relative Suckage". Lol! I think at best I could squeeze out with what I'm using with a sterling, spot-on rotation would be about 22k. Now my parse is definitely a labor mired in a mix of desire to master the skill and frustration. I get excited and my rotation neural connections start to misfire. :smile: Sometimes I do feel like we're not all wired the same way. :wink:

    A lot of little things can escape. For example, an effort to work spell power into my rotation and get rid of surge, made me complain about 8 seconds of non-activity between the time the effect ends and the end of the cooldown period. It was totally screwing with my timing. Lol! 8 seconds can feel like forever in a rotation! But that extra 20% of crit, damage, and magicka sure was beckoning me. Then it was pointed out that Alchemy passives can address that. I never paid attention to alchemy passives, but sure enough, with enough xp you can add 30% to the time of any potion.So I spent the entire last weekend hunting flowers (had people shooting at me at Coldhourbor for stealing their flowers Lol!) and water and mixing them together. Shot my Alchemy up to 50. So now my active spell time exceeds the cooldown and it runs 13 seconds LONGER than surge! An added benefit is that I now have a Solvent Proficiency of 8 and can make my own spell powers (those spells can pinch the gold from your bank).

    Still, I hear you. watching some these 40k videos, its not hard to see these guys are much better than me at their rotation, but certainly "seems" like they aren't doing double what I'm doing to double their score. But then again I continue to be surprised at things I learn. Without a solid rotation, I'd forever suck. Designing a combination of gear, enchants, and glyphs to optimize damage. My focus was more on having high magicka and health. I was using gold staff but they were enchanted with low damage and a dps drain. How important your Crit number is. Getting your Spell damage above 3000. Elemental Drain definitely has an impact on sustain. So do the spell power pots that now last the whole cool down time. I'm still trying to get my head around the evolving relationship amount crit, damage, penetration, and magicka. Lol!

    But I try to take it all in stride. It's not like I'm failing a prostate exam. It's a game. But one, for some reason, I'd like to get good at. Gonna kick me some vet dungeons yet!!...as opposed to having them kick me. :smile:
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    bardx86 wrote: »
    Shantu wrote: »
    Well, I've made it to a stage where I can pretty consistently hit around 20k when throwing in ultimates, throwing in crystal frag when it procs, and using the spell power pot. I know to further progress I'll need to eventually improve my gear and staff, and of course, practice, practice, practice.

    One thing giving me absolute fits though, is sustain. I'm using Witchmother's (which adds 319 magicka recovery), spell power pot (which boosts recovery another 20%), I have spell damage enchantments on all jewelry (and I'd kinda like to keep it that way), but I still can't go through a single 4 cycle rotation without running into trouble. To adequately sustain, I need to throw in a HA every time I'm on the front bar. Some are saying they only have to use HA 3-4 times over an entire 3 mil. I read over and over that guys with a somewhat similar setup using a FP rotation don't have issues with sustain. I don't get it. Obviously, every time I start thinking and dealing with sustain, the bottom falls out of my performance.

    Here's a simple 4 cycle rotation and watch my magicka:
    https://youtu.be/tVI7mXa9qcU

    What the heck?!? What am I missing? Combat metrics show that FP is far and away the biggest culprit. What's the secret sustain sauce for this kind of rotation?

    I gotta laugh at myself. 2 weeks about I was complaining about being stuck at 10k. Now I'm complaining about being stuck at 20. That's progress! :smiley:

    I'm with you, I've tried just about everything and i can't get over 23k. When i compare my parse with other from from this thread my AOE DPS and light weaves are on par in not higher than most. I honestly don't see where i could get another 7k dps easy. The rotation isn't rocket science so something is being lost in translation on this thread, i just can't for the life of me figure it out either.

    You need to remember quite a few things to ensure your dummy parses are the equivalent of everybody else's.

    If I check my Templar on the dummy without ele drain, spell power pots and I don't start with any ulti then I'm going to be on something like 26k dps. Add in all that stuff and I'm now hitting 34k dps.
  • Asardes
    Asardes
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    bardx86 wrote: »
    Spamming heavy attacks is ~10K by itself, add 1 DoT and you are at 15K, add the 2nd and you'll break 20K
    Also TBS is utter garbage for ~1 year now

    This isn't true.[/quote]

    Which part of it isn't true?

    Just go to a 6M dummy, and don't do anything but spam heavy attacks at it, with major sorcery up and you'll see something like 8.5-11K DPS at the end, so the ~10K is pretty accurate. Now cast one DoT and keep it up without doing anything else. You'll see it parses between 3-5K by itself - on a Sorcerer Liquid Lightning and Blockade. So you should pull ~20K by doing nothing but keeping those 2 up and heavy attacking on top, basically a brain-dead simple rotation that will keep your resources full.

    TBS it has been indirectly nerfed a number of times. First by Homestead when Major Force became additive, instead of multiplicative with other critical damage multipliers like Elf Born CP, Minor Force and various class passives and halved from 30% to 15%. Second the mundi were changed in Horns of the Reach, with Apprentice buffed, Thief and Shadow nerfed; also the spell critical bonuses from sets were increased in compensation. Third, Clockwork City introduced Mechanical Acuity which in fact gives a better effective spell critical than Thief with full divines (between 17-12%, depending on how high your spell critical is), plus a spell damage bonus, so it's better with one mundus than Twice-Born Star was with two. So yes, TBS is pretty much garbage ATM, even though it hasn't been changed at all directly.
    Beta tester since February 2014, playing ESO-TU since October 2015
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  • bardx86
    bardx86
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    Shantu wrote: »
    bardx86 wrote: »
    I'm with you, I've tried just about everything and i can't get over 23k. When i compare my parse with other from from this thread my AOE DPS and light weaves are on par in not higher than most. I honestly don't see where i could get another 7k dps easy. The rotation isn't rocket science so something is being lost in translation on this thread, i just can't for the life of me figure it out either.

    Welcome friend, to the "Brotherhood Of Relative Suckage". Lol! I think at best I could squeeze out with what I'm using with a sterling, spot-on rotation would be about 22k. Now my parse is definitely a labor mired in a mix of desire to master the skill and frustration. I get excited and my rotation neural connections start to misfire. :smile: Sometimes I do feel like we're not all wired the same way. :wink:

    A lot of little things can escape. For example, an effort to work spell power into my rotation and get rid of surge, made me complain about 8 seconds of non-activity between the time the effect ends and the end of the cooldown period. It was totally screwing with my timing. Lol! 8 seconds can feel like forever in a rotation! But that extra 20% of crit, damage, and magicka sure was beckoning me. Then it was pointed out that Alchemy passives can address that. I never paid attention to alchemy passives, but sure enough, with enough xp you can add 30% to the time of any potion.So I spent the entire last weekend hunting flowers (had people shooting at me at Coldhourbor for stealing their flowers Lol!) and water and mixing them together. Shot my Alchemy up to 50. So now my active spell time exceeds the cooldown and it runs 13 seconds LONGER than surge! An added benefit is that I now have a Solvent Proficiency of 8 and can make my own spell powers (those spells can pinch the gold from your bank).

    Still, I hear you. watching some these 40k videos, its not hard to see these guys are much better than me at their rotation, but certainly "seems" like they aren't doing double what I'm doing to double their score. But then again I continue to be surprised at things I learn. Without a solid rotation, I'd forever suck. Designing a combination of gear, enchants, and glyphs to optimize damage. My focus was more on having high magicka and health. I was using gold staff but they were enchanted with low damage and a dps drain. How important your Crit number is. Getting your Spell damage above 3000. Elemental Drain definitely has an impact on sustain. So do the spell power pots that now last the whole cool down time. I'm still trying to get my head around the evolving relationship amount crit, damage, penetration, and magicka. Lol!

    But I try to take it all in stride. It's not like I'm failing a prostate exam. It's a game. But one, for some reason, I'd like to get good at. Gonna kick me some vet dungeons yet!!...as opposed to having them kick me. :smile:

    Well I hit 24k today. Comparing my parse to others it looks like their light/heavy attack damage is way higher than mine. Also their force pulse damage is higher. My AOE's are on par with theirs. Would those fancy pants staffs make up the 5k difference?
    Elured Fury PC_NA
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    bardx86 wrote: »
    Shantu wrote: »
    bardx86 wrote: »
    I'm with you, I've tried just about everything and i can't get over 23k. When i compare my parse with other from from this thread my AOE DPS and light weaves are on par in not higher than most. I honestly don't see where i could get another 7k dps easy. The rotation isn't rocket science so something is being lost in translation on this thread, i just can't for the life of me figure it out either.

    Welcome friend, to the "Brotherhood Of Relative Suckage". Lol! I think at best I could squeeze out with what I'm using with a sterling, spot-on rotation would be about 22k. Now my parse is definitely a labor mired in a mix of desire to master the skill and frustration. I get excited and my rotation neural connections start to misfire. :smile: Sometimes I do feel like we're not all wired the same way. :wink:

    A lot of little things can escape. For example, an effort to work spell power into my rotation and get rid of surge, made me complain about 8 seconds of non-activity between the time the effect ends and the end of the cooldown period. It was totally screwing with my timing. Lol! 8 seconds can feel like forever in a rotation! But that extra 20% of crit, damage, and magicka sure was beckoning me. Then it was pointed out that Alchemy passives can address that. I never paid attention to alchemy passives, but sure enough, with enough xp you can add 30% to the time of any potion.So I spent the entire last weekend hunting flowers (had people shooting at me at Coldhourbor for stealing their flowers Lol!) and water and mixing them together. Shot my Alchemy up to 50. So now my active spell time exceeds the cooldown and it runs 13 seconds LONGER than surge! An added benefit is that I now have a Solvent Proficiency of 8 and can make my own spell powers (those spells can pinch the gold from your bank).

    Still, I hear you. watching some these 40k videos, its not hard to see these guys are much better than me at their rotation, but certainly "seems" like they aren't doing double what I'm doing to double their score. But then again I continue to be surprised at things I learn. Without a solid rotation, I'd forever suck. Designing a combination of gear, enchants, and glyphs to optimize damage. My focus was more on having high magicka and health. I was using gold staff but they were enchanted with low damage and a dps drain. How important your Crit number is. Getting your Spell damage above 3000. Elemental Drain definitely has an impact on sustain. So do the spell power pots that now last the whole cool down time. I'm still trying to get my head around the evolving relationship amount crit, damage, penetration, and magicka. Lol!

    But I try to take it all in stride. It's not like I'm failing a prostate exam. It's a game. But one, for some reason, I'd like to get good at. Gonna kick me some vet dungeons yet!!...as opposed to having them kick me. :smile:

    Well I hit 24k today. Comparing my parse to others it looks like their light/heavy attack damage is way higher than mine. Also their force pulse damage is higher. My AOE's are on par with theirs. Would those fancy pants staffs make up the 5k difference?

    A vMA staff is ~3k dps improvement from my understanding and without it your light/heavy attacks will have much lower dps. You also have to hit your weaves perfectly, if you miss light attacks its a big dps loss. But you also have to do the weaving quickly or its also a dps loss.

    If you're on PC take screenshots of your parse; one with buffs in, another with debuffs out and one with regen.
  • bardx86
    bardx86
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    Asardes wrote: »
    bardx86 wrote: »
    Spamming heavy attacks is ~10K by itself, add 1 DoT and you are at 15K, add the 2nd and you'll break 20K
    Also TBS is utter garbage for ~1 year now

    This isn't true.

    Which part of it isn't true?

    Just go to a 6M dummy, and don't do anything but spam heavy attacks at it, with major sorcery up and you'll see something like 8.5-11K DPS at the end, so the ~10K is pretty accurate. Now cast one DoT and keep it up without doing anything else. You'll see it parses between 3-5K by itself - on a Sorcerer Liquid Lightning and Blockade. So you should pull ~20K by doing nothing but keeping those 2 up and heavy attacking on top, basically a brain-dead simple rotation that will keep your resources full.

    TBS it has been indirectly nerfed a number of times. First by Homestead when Major Force became additive, instead of multiplicative with other critical damage multipliers like Elf Born CP, Minor Force and various class passives and halved from 30% to 15%. Second the mundi were changed in Horns of the Reach, with Apprentice buffed, Thief and Shadow nerfed; also the spell critical bonuses from sets were increased in compensation. Third, Clockwork City introduced Mechanical Acuity which in fact gives a better effective spell critical than Thief with full divines (between 17-12%, depending on how high your spell critical is), plus a spell damage bonus, so it's better with one mundus than Twice-Born Star was with two. So yes, TBS is pretty much garbage ATM, even though it hasn't been changed at all directly.[/quote]

    AOE's and heavy attack are 12k dps no where near 20k dps
    Elured Fury PC_NA
  • Shantu
    Shantu
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    [quote="bardx86;c-4923581Well I hit 24k today. Comparing my parse to others it looks like their light/heavy attack damage is way higher than mine. Also their force pulse damage is higher. My AOE's are on par with theirs. Would those fancy pants staffs make up the 5k difference?[/quote]

    Congrats! 23k is my new goal :smile:

    For me, once gear, staff, attributes, etc. have been optimized for dps, I've found a smooth, tight, consistent rotation, being proficient at LA weaving, keeping AOE's up, dropping ultimates when they're ready, keeping spell power active (much easier with the Alchemy passives!) make a big difference. I still have difficulties in sustaining without throwing a HA every time I'm on the front bar (keeping Elemental Drain up helps). While I'm much better than when I started, I'm as likely to reach 30-40k as getting a first class ticket to the moon. I've watched the videos of it being done, but for the life of me can't figure out how the difference between what they're doing and what I'm doing is resulting in so much more damage. But like you, I also noticed the bigger damage numbers being thrown up, so not sure where that's coming from...even with a fancy pants staff. :smile:
    bardx86 wrote: »
    Just go to a 6M dummy, and don't do anything but spam heavy attacks at it, with major sorcery up and you'll see something like 8.5-11K DPS at the end, so the ~10K is pretty accurate. Now cast one DoT and keep it up without doing anything else. You'll see it parses between 3-5K by itself - on a Sorcerer Liquid Lightning and Blockade. So you should pull ~20K by doing nothing but keeping those 2 up and heavy attacking on top, basically a brain-dead simple rotation that will keep your resources full.

    This stuff drives me crazy. I must be deader than brain-dead because I do this (keeping major sorcery, blockade, and LL up at all times, spamming 2 HA's on every rotation) on a 3 mil dummy and I get about 14k :smile:
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Shantu wrote: »
    [quote="bardx86;c-4923581Well I hit 24k today. Comparing my parse to others it looks like their light/heavy attack damage is way higher than mine. Also their force pulse damage is higher. My AOE's are on par with theirs. Would those fancy pants staffs make up the 5k difference?

    Congrats! 23k is my new goal :smile:

    For me, once gear, staff, attributes, etc. have been optimized for dps, I've found a smooth, tight, consistent rotation, being proficient at LA weaving, keeping AOE's up, dropping ultimates when they're ready, keeping spell power active (much easier with the Alchemy passives!) make a big difference. I still have difficulties in sustaining without throwing a HA every time I'm on the front bar (keeping Elemental Drain up helps). While I'm much better than when I started, I'm as likely to reach 30-40k as getting a first class ticket to the moon. I've watched the videos of it being done, but for the life of me can't figure out how the difference between what they're doing and what I'm doing is resulting in so much more damage. But like you, I also noticed the bigger damage numbers being thrown up, so not sure where that's coming from...even with a fancy pants staff. :smile:
    bardx86 wrote: »
    Just go to a 6M dummy, and don't do anything but spam heavy attacks at it, with major sorcery up and you'll see something like 8.5-11K DPS at the end, so the ~10K is pretty accurate. Now cast one DoT and keep it up without doing anything else. You'll see it parses between 3-5K by itself - on a Sorcerer Liquid Lightning and Blockade. So you should pull ~20K by doing nothing but keeping those 2 up and heavy attacking on top, basically a brain-dead simple rotation that will keep your resources full.

    This stuff drives me crazy. I must be deader than brain-dead because I do this (keeping major sorcery, blockade, and LL up at all times, spamming 2 HA's on every rotation) on a 3 mil dummy and I get about 14k :smile: [/quote]

    Every part of a build contributes a little dps here and there. Each gold spell damage glyph, gold max magicka glyph, that 4th set piece staff on the front bar etc. High dps is the sum of a lot of little things that you need to do along with a good rotation.

    Download combat metrics and superstar. Do some parses and take screenshots from both add-ons.
  • SugaComa
    SugaComa
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    I know own how you feel, I can max 20k on a dummy, and I'm happy with that, my problem is early onset arthritis which makes rotations hard , I get fingers that lock so play a more reactionary way rather than just hitting a rotation.

    Means I'm better suited for PvP than pve and getting through pve content is very hard due to more n more groups focussing on DPS rather than slow methodical approach taking on the actual mechanics of the challenge
  • LiquidPony
    LiquidPony
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    f047ys3v3n wrote: »
    DoctorESO wrote: »
    Wow...so you think everyone who self-parses above 30k are using Cheat Engine or cheating in some other way? :confounded:

    On an mNb, yes. On other things, No. I think several stam load outs can do better and probably also mSorc. I'm not sure exactly what these things can do as I don't play them with enough proficiency to guess but I do think they can do more than 30k.

    @f047ys3v3n lol

    You're just making excuses.

    In your prior post, you listed out a non-meta build, where you've moved skills around to different bars, and use a sub-optimal rotation, and sub-optimal CP ... and here you admit to not actually being proficient on the build ... but it can't possibly be any of that keeping you from hitting 40k, no, it must be that the people hitting 40k on their magblades are cheating, according to your "back of a napkin" math.

    Ha!

    What a load of malarkey.

    You'll find people on console hitting similar numbers. You think they're using "Cheat Engine" on XBox now?

    I've almost exclusively played stam for the past 6+ months, and I can go log onto a magblade right now and hit 40k on a 3mil skeleton.

    Study, practice, practice, and then practice some more, and you can do it too. Get this misinformation outta here.
  • Merlin13KAGL
    Merlin13KAGL
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    LiquidPony wrote: »
    You'll find people on console hitting similar numbers. You think they're using "Cheat Engine" on XBox now?
    Shorter controller cords...their signals get there .00000001 seconds sooner, giving a clear and distinct advantage. :|

    Just because you don't like the way something is doesn't necessarily make it wrong...

    Earn it.

    IRL'ing for a while for assorted reasons, in forum, and in game.
    I am neither warm, nor fuzzy...
    Probably has checkbox on Customer Service profile that say High Aggro, 99% immunity to BS
  • Mister_DMC
    Mister_DMC
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    Lol console cheat engine... Ok.

    Lots of practice+skill+brain power=40k+ DPS.

    And of course no physical handicaps, that's unfortunate but such is life. I'm a mechanic and have carpal tunnel in both my hands and still hit 40k+ on Stam toons.
    Edited by Mister_DMC on March 14, 2018 3:59PM
  • Dubhliam
    Dubhliam
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    I wanna see someone without any trial gear or support using only trash pots get 30k dps.

    And then I'd be happy to see it (say a sorc) with only 1 toggle

    And I want to see Ronaldo play with only his left foot.
    Let's see if he can match the goao score of Messi using both feet.
    >>>Detailed Justice System Concept thread<<<
  • Gprime31
    Gprime31
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    These “solo parse gods” have people off screen buffing them and debuffing the dummy, only way to pull 90k+ “solo”
    They are all liars, I’ve tested it.
  • nomikkh
    nomikkh
    Just wanted to share some things that really helped me - breaking up your rotation and practicing it in pieces of 2 skills at a time to make sure you understand how to get the weave in for each skill. Because all skills are different, there's different timings for when you need to start the light (or heavy, but I personally only LA weave currently) attack to get the full benefit.

    I main stam, so for example (before caltrops nerf) you stand in front of a dummy and practice Endless Hail -> LA -> Caltrops over and over again until you run out of stam. Rinse and repeat until full comfy. Then maybe Caltrops -> LA -> Trap. Then you start adding skills in so you're practicing 3 at a time and getting the light attacks between.

    If this has been said before I fully apologize, I admit I didn't go through all 7 pages of posts. But before I learned this I heard people saying 'practice practice practice' and I was like 'uhhhh ok HOW PLEASE'.

    Took me a while but I've gone from sub-10k dps to 40k on my stamden with no one giving Major Fracture. Working on magblade. It can be done.
  • SirLeeMinion
    SirLeeMinion
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    Gprime31 wrote: »
    These “solo parse gods” have people off screen buffing them and debuffing the dummy, only way to pull 90k+ “solo”
    They are all liars, I’ve tested it.

    So, why necro this?
  • Juhasow
    Juhasow
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    Gprime31 wrote: »
    These “solo parse gods” have people off screen buffing them and debuffing the dummy, only way to pull 90k+ “solo”
    They are all liars, I’ve tested it.

    So You are reviving this thread just to tell everyone about Your delusion and lack of knowledge that 21M dummy have all debuffs already applied plus gives You all group buffs ? Or You're just poorly trolling ? Either way kinda stupid to dust off the thread from the beggining of last year.
  • MartiniDaniels
    MartiniDaniels
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    40k self-buffed is real for everyone, but it is not that easy. This is like 90% dot/buff uptimes given that you drop good half of them at execute and like 80% light attacks per second.
    Even more difficult to provide similar when you may be one-shot anytime. So far best training is VMA as for me. Imagine you need to do it 50 times and you become really angry. Higher dps is only thing which can make those runs faster so you will naturally press buttons faster and with better rhythm.
    Restart your router
  • Vapirko
    Vapirko
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    35-40k is totally doable self buffed/debuffed with bear BiS gear. Especially with the new dots available. Follow a build/rotation guide like the ones Alcast has up and if you can get the gear you should be there in no time. Rotation alone will probably add another 10k just with low level gear. I do have near BiS gear but I just went and tried the new stam sorc rotation, completely *** it up, ran out of stam, and still hit 35k. People who say others are lying or cheating are just sour and sad, don’t let them hold you back. Do your research and practice. All the info and vids are readily available.
    Edited by Vapirko on August 25, 2019 7:47AM
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