"Not that expensive"

Recremen

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Considering the only (singular) time outfits do anything the current system can't is keeping style in combat with set gear efficiency, I don't personally see the problem. In fact, it's even easier to pair without the system if I'm RPing. Right now I wear 26 medium bosmer pants, 36 khajiit sabatons, and 16 medium bosmer top as my outfit. I can hide gloves, belt, shoulders and head since I'm not wearing them, and it cost me nothing to dye them.

Then again, I like bosmer medium at max level, so I'm really only changing shoulders head and weapons anyway...

You also have a single outfit that suits you. When you're trying to enjoy the incredible wealth of styles available it's a lot more difficult. You have to get the motifs, which is a HUGE process even when you're keeping up with the DLC schedule. Then you have to pay again every time you want to try a different combo? I haven't seen double-dipping that bad since that one schoolyard incident with a packet of Dunkaroos.

Hiero_Glyph

Recremen wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Considering the only (singular) time outfits do anything the current system can't is keeping style in combat with set gear efficiency, I don't personally see the problem. In fact, it's even easier to pair without the system if I'm RPing. Right now I wear 26 medium bosmer pants, 36 khajiit sabatons, and 16 medium bosmer top as my outfit. I can hide gloves, belt, shoulders and head since I'm not wearing them, and it cost me nothing to dye them.

Then again, I like bosmer medium at max level, so I'm really only changing shoulders head and weapons anyway...

You also have a single outfit that suits you. When you're trying to enjoy the incredible wealth of styles available it's a lot more difficult. You have to get the motifs, which is a HUGE process even when you're keeping up with the DLC schedule. Then you have to pay again every time you want to try a different combo? I haven't seen double-dipping that bad since that one schoolyard incident with a packet of Dunkaroos.

And the best part is that all those style materials you saved up become pointless unless you want to craft new gear in that specific style since you can't even use them to pay for the style change (unlike the Imperial style conversion).

The outfit system is designed so well in that it gives us almost everything we wanted while simultaneously screwing us over.

Recremen

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Considering the only (singular) time outfits do anything the current system can't is keeping style in combat with set gear efficiency, I don't personally see the problem. In fact, it's even easier to pair without the system if I'm RPing. Right now I wear 26 medium bosmer pants, 36 khajiit sabatons, and 16 medium bosmer top as my outfit. I can hide gloves, belt, shoulders and head since I'm not wearing them, and it cost me nothing to dye them.

Then again, I like bosmer medium at max level, so I'm really only changing shoulders head and weapons anyway...

You also have a single outfit that suits you. When you're trying to enjoy the incredible wealth of styles available it's a lot more difficult. You have to get the motifs, which is a HUGE process even when you're keeping up with the DLC schedule. Then you have to pay again every time you want to try a different combo? I haven't seen double-dipping that bad since that one schoolyard incident with a packet of Dunkaroos.

And the best part is that all those style materials you saved up become pointless unless you want to craft new gear in that specific style since you can't even use them to pay for the style change (unlike the Imperial style conversion).

The outfit system is designed so well in that it gives us almost everything we wanted while simultaneously screwing us over.

I would prefer the style mats stay in the realm of crafting, to be honest, and that they just expand the crafted furnishings to make up for it. I think, for example, they did a great job with this in Clockwork City. Every furnishing I found cost a single Tempered Brass, so those like myself who did a ton of dailies and deconned a ton of gear can really get a lot of mileage out of clockwork furniture crafting. I have a lot of style mats saved up, sure, but using them for the outfitting system doesn't address the fundamental problem with per-use cost. Maybe if you could permanently unlock styles by spending 100 style stones or some nonsense, then sure, but per-use costs have got to skedaddle.

NyassaV

Seeing as doing daily quests doesn't give you jack ***, yes it's a lot (Personally I can make more but in other games people would just to dailies and have a nice sum, in this game dailies seldom get you anything of desire)

Hiero_Glyph

Recremen wrote: »

Hiero_Glyph wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Considering the only (singular) time outfits do anything the current system can't is keeping style in combat with set gear efficiency, I don't personally see the problem. In fact, it's even easier to pair without the system if I'm RPing. Right now I wear 26 medium bosmer pants, 36 khajiit sabatons, and 16 medium bosmer top as my outfit. I can hide gloves, belt, shoulders and head since I'm not wearing them, and it cost me nothing to dye them.

Then again, I like bosmer medium at max level, so I'm really only changing shoulders head and weapons anyway...

You also have a single outfit that suits you. When you're trying to enjoy the incredible wealth of styles available it's a lot more difficult. You have to get the motifs, which is a HUGE process even when you're keeping up with the DLC schedule. Then you have to pay again every time you want to try a different combo? I haven't seen double-dipping that bad since that one schoolyard incident with a packet of Dunkaroos.

And the best part is that all those style materials you saved up become pointless unless you want to craft new gear in that specific style since you can't even use them to pay for the style change (unlike the Imperial style conversion).

The outfit system is designed so well in that it gives us almost everything we wanted while simultaneously screwing us over.

I would prefer the style mats stay in the realm of crafting, to be honest, and that they just expand the crafted furnishings to make up for it. I think, for example, they did a great job with this in Clockwork City. Every furnishing I found cost a single Tempered Brass, so those like myself who did a ton of dailies and deconned a ton of gear can really get a lot of mileage out of clockwork furniture crafting. I have a lot of style mats saved up, sure, but using them for the outfitting system doesn't address the fundamental problem with per-use cost. Maybe if you could permanently unlock styles by spending 100 style stones or some nonsense, then sure, but per-use costs have got to skedaddle.

While I agree that a per use cost system is bad, at least having alternative options to pay for it would be nice. While some style mats are definitely more expensive than simply paying for the style change with gold, others are so abundant that they might as well give players the option to use them when changing to that style.

luen79rwb17_ESO

I'm broke now. Dang.

Linaleah

Sixty5 wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

so as i stands, aside for dyeing my weapons, I'm going to ignore the system and continue using the costumes. I'm not longer as hurting for gold as I used to, but I still cannot justify upwards of 25k per outfit per character that continues to cost me more gold to make any changes to.

and don't even get me started on change to "hide headslot"

I went from disappointed, to hopeful right back to disappointed. and to think I nearly considered buying crown exclusive motifs.... overall costs need to be reduced. and dye should be completely free.

I hate to point out, but 25k is the current upper limit on what an outfit costs. And that required finding the most expensive motifs in every slot with 3 dye slots and then skinning double weapons.

You can actually make really nice looking outfits for under 5k, without skipping on style.

Honestly Motifs cost a heck of a lot more than any outfit will, and from what I have heard, ZOS is looking at further lowering the costs.

this doesn't excuse the upper cost. those expensive to use motifs? were also VERY expensive to buy. some of them are even crown store exclusive. feels a bit like pouring salt on the wound.

prices need to be lower and they need to be the same regardless of the motif. dyes need to be free. and functionality of hide headslot MUST be brought back to the way it currently works on live.

Vapirko

Pay or style item for motif changes, dye should absolutely be free.

starkerealm

Recremen wrote: »

What cosmetic system in the game has discouraged people from changing things up on a regular basis?

Both Cryptic MMOs I played did that. STO and CO. Resource costs for CO, and EC costs for STO. CO could even get into costing Global Resources (which was a lot of money).

I've certainly seen a few other games that make swapping out your visuals on a regular basis somewhat pricy one way or another. To say nothing of games where your equipped gear determines your visuals with no alternate options. That's a thing as well.

Magdalina

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Why should I have to pay gold to use motifs I already know. Why did I bother saving up all these style materials. And now I'm being charged to use colors I already unlocked just to dye the outfit?
Nah man the fact that there is a cost is lame as hell. I already own the motifs why am I paying gold to use them??

Because crafting(especially crafting cp 160 legendary gear) is free?

I actually still can't believe they're really introducing this as a NOT crown store exclusive. This will directly undermine their crown store costumes sales so I wasn't expecting this. I guess they decided to throw us a bone for once and people are still complaining lol.

I'm not crafting gear? I already have all my gear crafted and I paid for it. In what world does your argument make sense? I'm not getting CP160 legendary gear im buying a "cover" for lack of a better term for a piece of gear I ALREADY crafted or already farmed and paid to upgrade.

I bought the motif.

I earned the dye.

Why am I paying again?

Why can't I use a style mat instead as a substitute if I have it?

They just made style mats completely useless.

Your argument was "why should I have to pay gold to use motifs I already know". Well you always have to pay gold to use motifs you know - you need resource mats and style mats and then tempers to craft gear in a style you know, and all of that costs gold(of course you can also farm it - but you can also farm gold, just by selling those mats if nothing else).

Nothing is changing except now you'll be able to pay gold to use motifs you already know in order to get a look you actually like without losing set bonuses. I'm really shocked people are complaining about this tbh XD You guys really should stop saying it "shouldn't cost gold" in before ZOS makes it cost crowns only for all the slots(and thus technically addresses your issue).

I wasn't expecting the system to begin with and I definitely wasn't expecting it for not crowns so I think it sounds awesome. I'd also expect gold prices of like 10k a piece at least in order to make it a gold sink, this way it's pretty much free....and yet people are still unhappy. Smh.

Baracuta

I honestly can't fathom how people can possibly defend this. So far, most that I've seen saying "The gold cost is fine" either aren't planning to use and change their outfits daily, or were just so desperate for this system that they're willing to take what they can get. Both are equally bad, as it's just going to punish people who are going to be using the system to it's fullest and would appreciate it the most. I am hoping, PRAYING, that there would be enough outcry to make ZoS realize that nobody is going to buy their stupid tokens, and that they're just hurting the players would have been LONGING for this. I have been dreaming of a system exactly like this, but was only ever expecting transmogrification. For something so good to be held back by something as unnecessary and hindering as a gold cost is excruciating. The only way they could make it worse is by making it free for ESO+ members, which would be a big middle finger to all of us non ESO+ members who don't want/can't afford the subscription.

If you are any of the three types of people I talked about, I don't expect to change your mind. But maybe this can put it into perspective:

What if every time you wanted to add/remove/move furniture in your house, you had to pay gold?

sudaki_eso

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

Baracuta

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

It's not about that one "Dream outfit". It's about the five to six outfits people who want this system are going to also be changing each day. I can say that on the PTS, I have spent more than half of the 100,000 template gold on 5 outfits, not all of which I'm 100% happy with. And when new motifs come out, then you have to pour more gold or time into those, if they catch your fancy. And if there's a particular chest piece you like on a new motif, and think it'll look good on some of your outfits, then that's more gold poured into it.

The fact still stands that any cost at all for editing an outfit is ridiculous and only exists to pressure people into spending real money on tokens.

Apache_Kid

Magdalina wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Magdalina wrote: »

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Why should I have to pay gold to use motifs I already know. Why did I bother saving up all these style materials. And now I'm being charged to use colors I already unlocked just to dye the outfit?
Nah man the fact that there is a cost is lame as hell. I already own the motifs why am I paying gold to use them??

Because crafting(especially crafting cp 160 legendary gear) is free?

I actually still can't believe they're really introducing this as a NOT crown store exclusive. This will directly undermine their crown store costumes sales so I wasn't expecting this. I guess they decided to throw us a bone for once and people are still complaining lol.

I'm not crafting gear? I already have all my gear crafted and I paid for it. In what world does your argument make sense? I'm not getting CP160 legendary gear im buying a "cover" for lack of a better term for a piece of gear I ALREADY crafted or already farmed and paid to upgrade.

I bought the motif.

I earned the dye.

Why am I paying again?

Why can't I use a style mat instead as a substitute if I have it?

They just made style mats completely useless.

Your argument was "why should I have to pay gold to use motifs I already know". Well you always have to pay gold to use motifs you know - you need resource mats and style mats and then tempers to craft gear in a style you know, and all of that costs gold(of course you can also farm it - but you can also farm gold, just by selling those mats if nothing else).

Nothing is changing except now you'll be able to pay gold to use motifs you already know in order to get a look you actually like without losing set bonuses. I'm really shocked people are complaining about this tbh XD You guys really should stop saying it "shouldn't cost gold" in before ZOS makes it cost crowns only for all the slots(and thus technically addresses your issue).

I wasn't expecting the system to begin with and I definitely wasn't expecting it for not crowns so I think it sounds awesome. I'd also expect gold prices of like 10k a piece at least in order to make it a gold sink, this way it's pretty much free....and yet people are still unhappy. Smh.

Yes but when I am crafting an actual piece of gear I am getting something tangible that has stats and quality and I can pass it between characters.

This shouldn't cost any gold. I'm not just going to sit here and be thankful just because they didn't make it cost more because it shouldn't cost anything at all. This mentality of just sitting back and accepting what scraps and bones they throw to us is why this game is still in such a **** state 4 years after release.

bellatrixed

To be perfectly honest I've already resigned myself to simply not using the outfit system.

I am a RPer, and get crafter friends to make me neat outfits that I wear when not PVEing. So I already have tons of rare motifs as clothing/armor just for appearance's sake.

I have absolutely no desire to go waste millions learning rare motifs just so I can pay a huge amount of gold to equip something for appearance when I can just toss on a crown costume and go like I have been for years.

I am not normally critical of ESO but this system is a big thumbs down from me. Should have just made it an appearance tab where we can equip any existing piece of armor in its place. Fail

Baracuta

bellatrixed wrote: »

To be perfectly honest I've already resigned myself to simply not using the outfit system.

I am a RPer, and get crafter friends to make me neat outfits that I wear when not PVEing. So I already have tons of rare motifs as clothing/armor just for appearance's sake.

I have absolutely no desire to go waste millions learning rare motifs just so I can pay a huge amount of gold to equip something for appearance when I can just toss on a crown costume and go like I have been for years.

I am not normally critical of ESO but this system is a big thumbs down from me. Should have just made it an appearance tab where we can equip any existing piece of armor in its place. Fail

I think it's a good system that is otherwise ruined by the gold cost to use it.

Bevik

They really should have just sell the Outfit system as an expansion for 40 dollars/euros/pounds. Tokens for crowns like it will be and then everyone will be happy. Can't believe people are actually complaining about a gold cost when you are able to make millions in a week with a very little effort. It's nothing but pure laziness to do nothing for things you want. But well some people are never happy with anything they get. I'm really happy that they are going to add something what you can actually buy with in-game currency instead of gambling on Crown Crates. Would rather spend gold on things than real money to be honest.

You can actually preview things before buying. This system is not designed for people who want to change outfits day by day. The majority of people will be doing 1 or 2 outfits / char or just using Costumes as it was before. You have the PTS now, try the outfits, take notes then make them on live and live happily ever after.

The whole system is to get something what you should work for, to make you do things so you can achieve something.

Tannus15

Dyes should be free.

I don't mind paying gold to change the style.

Yolokin_Swagonborn

Should be a flat cost to change your outfit.

Imagine if the champion system charged you gold based on what tree's you put your points into? Stacking 100CP into mighty? that's 3k..


When you are done setting up your CP, there is one flat cost. This system should be the same, one cost for changing your outfit. Not per piece, not depending on what you pick. Flat cost. Done.

Magdalina

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Should be a flat cost to change your outfit.

Imagine if the champion system charged you gold based on what tree's you put your points into? Stacking 100CP into mighty? that's 3k..


When you are done setting up your CP, there is one flat cost. This system should be the same, one cost for changing your outfit. Not per piece, not depending on what you pick. Flat cost. Done.

That would make the cost higher for when you just want to change one piece/one dye though? I do wish CP system let us change just one-two stars for LESS than full reset cost as well.

This system is not "scraps and bones", imo it's a very good system. Not free=/=bad, if anything it gives you incentive to play more, acquire resources needed for getting what you want and get a sense of achievement upon reaching it. In case of gold it's also a gold sink which is good for economy, we need more of those(although tbh it's not really much of a gold sink with those prices).

Recremen

Magdalina wrote: »

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Should be a flat cost to change your outfit.

Imagine if the champion system charged you gold based on what tree's you put your points into? Stacking 100CP into mighty? that's 3k..


When you are done setting up your CP, there is one flat cost. This system should be the same, one cost for changing your outfit. Not per piece, not depending on what you pick. Flat cost. Done.

That would make the cost higher for when you just want to change one piece/one dye though? I do wish CP system let us change just one-two stars for LESS than full reset cost as well.

This system is not "scraps and bones", imo it's a very good system. Not free=/=bad, if anything it gives you incentive to play more, acquire resources needed for getting what you want and get a sense of achievement upon reaching it. In case of gold it's also a gold sink which is good for economy, we need more of those(although tbh it's not really much of a gold sink with those prices).

I mean first of all, we don't need any more gold sinks. The economy isn't suffering, there's no inflation, if anything prices are dropping overall just because there are so many people doing the content and selling the things. Moreover, though, this is also a terrible place to put a gold sink. The price per outfit varies but is usually only going to be a few thousand gold. That is a meaningless amount of money for the one-and-done type of people who will hardly ever change up their outfit. You know who's really going to be racking up the expenses, though? The people who are already spending all their gold getting all the motifs you need to actually use the system. They're the ones more likely to be changing their outfits regularly. These people generally are not sitting on piles of gold, so how does the economy benefit?

I'm 100% with you that this isn't a a "scraps and bones" system (not sure where you got that quote from, but let's be honest, it's a very feature-rich system). The per-use cost, however, is definitely bad by every metric. People with enough motifs to be worried about the expense are already playing more. All it does is encourage you to grind gold more, or as another user pointed out, buy gold from a gold seller. I'd say it encourages you to use the BS microtransaction token they're coming out with but honestly who tf would spend money on that? Ridiculous.

We already bought the cash-shop exclusive motifs. We already subscribed or bought the DLC to do the dailies and get all the new motifs. We already hit Grand Overlord to get the AP to buy the PvP motifs and get the beautiful colors. We've been on top of the content this whole time. We have our sense of accomplishment already, except for the fact that until now motifs have been undervalued due to crafted sets making up such a small part of end-game builds. The whole point of us asking for an outfit-type system for so long was to bring value to these cool motifs we earned. We have the system now, so why are they suddenly asking to pay twice for it? And not just twice, but infinitely, since it's a per-use cost? It is nonsense.

Baracuta

I really, REALLY want to be able to be excited for this, and to an extent, I am, but no, they HAD to try and pull a fast one. They finally give us an outfit system and weapon dying, and it's bittersweet because of the gold cost. It's such a shame, because it'd be more work for them at this point to remove the gold cost (Not that they'd do it anyways), meaning that it'll probably be put on live, and people will spend their gold, and then it'll be stuck in the game.

There is this vicious cycle of: Releasing broken/Bad thing on PTS, players get mad, ZOS ignores outcry, broken/bad thing goes to live, complaints still ignored but start to die down, ZOS moves on.
At the end of the day, it's their game, and they don't have to do ANYTHING not in their best interests, because people will play the game anyways.

Who knew the question: "Should there be more pointless microtransactions" could be this polarizing for the community. I was working off of hope that there would be enough backlash on this that someone who had an actual say in the matter at ZOS might hear tell of it, and that MAYBE their conscience would hop-to and they'd allow for the removal of costs associated with editing outfits.
Such is not the case, and since I have VERY little faith in them changing it, I'm going to go ahead and say that those who think it's alright have doomed us all. At the end of the day, the gold cost isn't going to hurt you: Who will only ever use one outfit. It's going to hurt us: The people who will be using it the most.

DocFrost72

Baracuta wrote: »

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

Log in on one character a day and do writs, that is 6k gold (minimum) and takes all of ten minutes.

Grind for one (1) hour and sell all the trash you picked up = 40k gold.

Farm mats for 30 minutes, make anywhere from 10k-20k (luck depending).

This system is not expensive for those of us who have a system of making gold. I'm not saying you cannot disagree or be upset, but the argument you laid out is definitely not the strongest given how quickly gold flows in game.

Baracuta

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

Log in on one character a day and do writs, that is 6k gold (minimum) and takes all of ten minutes.

Grind for one (1) hour and sell all the trash you picked up = 40k gold.

Farm mats for 30 minutes, make anywhere from 10k-20k (luck depending).

This system is not expensive for those of us who have a system of making gold. I'm not saying you cannot disagree or be upset, but the argument you laid out is definitely not the strongest given how quickly gold flows in game.

It's the weakest of my arguments, I'll give you that. I myself am not a poor individual in ESO, having a gold-making routine that brings me in a comfortable amount each day for my interests. I, however, have people in my guild who A. Don't have any crafters, B. Aren't seriously invested into a trading guild, C. Only get on for RP, and D. Have very little time to be on the game anyways. They will not be able to use this in any large extent, having to save all of their gold for motifs as they struggle to farm the mats they need to up their crafting level to the point where they'll be able to learn the motifs they bought.

DocFrost72

Baracuta wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

Log in on one character a day and do writs, that is 6k gold (minimum) and takes all of ten minutes.

Grind for one (1) hour and sell all the trash you picked up = 40k gold.

Farm mats for 30 minutes, make anywhere from 10k-20k (luck depending).

This system is not expensive for those of us who have a system of making gold. I'm not saying you cannot disagree or be upset, but the argument you laid out is definitely not the strongest given how quickly gold flows in game.

It's the weakest of my arguments, I'll give you that. I myself am not a poor individual in ESO, having a gold-making routine that brings me in a comfortable amount each day for my interests. I, however, have people in my guild who A. Don't have any crafters, B. Aren't seriously invested into a trading guild, C. Only get on for RP, and D. Have very little time to be on the game anyways. They will not be able to use this in any large extent, having to save all of their gold for motifs as they struggle to farm the mats they need to up their crafting level to the point where they'll be able to learn the motifs they bought.

A will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

B can do as mentioned above and farm gold.

C This system is made for pve and pvp, RP you can wear anything already. In fact I'd go so far to assert that if all you do is rp, the new system offers nothing new at the expense of hide helm.

D will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

However, making the system less gold won't help A, since they know no motifs. Along the same vein, it won't help D for likely the same reasons. C Loses when this system goes live regardless, but it very well could help B.

I'm all for making this accessible to everyone, but the proposal won't help nearly as much as you think. The way to make it work for everyone would be something akin to how terraria does it: a "cosmetic" slot for every equipped item that displays regardless of what is worn underneath. We kinda got that, half baked.

Zinaroth

Recremen wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Considering the only (singular) time outfits do anything the current system can't is keeping style in combat with set gear efficiency, I don't personally see the problem. In fact, it's even easier to pair without the system if I'm RPing. Right now I wear 26 medium bosmer pants, 36 khajiit sabatons, and 16 medium bosmer top as my outfit. I can hide gloves, belt, shoulders and head since I'm not wearing them, and it cost me nothing to dye them.

Then again, I like bosmer medium at max level, so I'm really only changing shoulders head and weapons anyway...

You also have a single outfit that suits you. When you're trying to enjoy the incredible wealth of styles available it's a lot more difficult. You have to get the motifs, which is a HUGE process even when you're keeping up with the DLC schedule. Then you have to pay again every time you want to try a different combo? I haven't seen double-dipping that bad since that one schoolyard incident with a packet of Dunkaroos.

I don't know what Dunkaroos are but other than that you're making a lot of sense.

Baracuta

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

Log in on one character a day and do writs, that is 6k gold (minimum) and takes all of ten minutes.

Grind for one (1) hour and sell all the trash you picked up = 40k gold.

Farm mats for 30 minutes, make anywhere from 10k-20k (luck depending).

This system is not expensive for those of us who have a system of making gold. I'm not saying you cannot disagree or be upset, but the argument you laid out is definitely not the strongest given how quickly gold flows in game.

It's the weakest of my arguments, I'll give you that. I myself am not a poor individual in ESO, having a gold-making routine that brings me in a comfortable amount each day for my interests. I, however, have people in my guild who A. Don't have any crafters, B. Aren't seriously invested into a trading guild, C. Only get on for RP, and D. Have very little time to be on the game anyways. They will not be able to use this in any large extent, having to save all of their gold for motifs as they struggle to farm the mats they need to up their crafting level to the point where they'll be able to learn the motifs they bought.

A will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

B can do as mentioned above and farm gold.

C This system is made for pve and pvp, RP you can wear anything already. In fact I'd go so far to assert that if all you do is rp, the new system offers nothing new at the expense of hide helm.

D will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

However, making the system less gold won't help A, since they know no motifs. Along the same vein, it won't help D for likely the same reasons. C Loses when this system goes live regardless, but it very well could help B.

I'm all for making this accessible to everyone, but the proposal won't help nearly as much as you think. The way to make it work for everyone would be something akin to how terraria does it: a "cosmetic" slot for every equipped item that displays regardless of what is worn underneath. We kinda got that, half baked.

You'll have to forgive my bad counterpoints. I'm, ah, not very good at explaining my thoughts on things that I don't know inside and out.
Also, I'm not so certain it's different from Terraria at all. It sounds like the exact same thing, but you can have multiple outfits you can switch between.

But can you see where I'm coming from in that the gold cost is entirely unnecessary? That's probably my main gripe with it.

EDIT: Also, the point I was trying to make with D is that they don't have enough time to farm the extra gold for editing the outfits. If they only get around 2 hours a day (And that's if they're lucky) they'll want to spend it doing something they actually get enjoyment out of.

Bevik

Baracuta wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

Log in on one character a day and do writs, that is 6k gold (minimum) and takes all of ten minutes.

Grind for one (1) hour and sell all the trash you picked up = 40k gold.

Farm mats for 30 minutes, make anywhere from 10k-20k (luck depending).

This system is not expensive for those of us who have a system of making gold. I'm not saying you cannot disagree or be upset, but the argument you laid out is definitely not the strongest given how quickly gold flows in game.

It's the weakest of my arguments, I'll give you that. I myself am not a poor individual in ESO, having a gold-making routine that brings me in a comfortable amount each day for my interests. I, however, have people in my guild who A. Don't have any crafters, B. Aren't seriously invested into a trading guild, C. Only get on for RP, and D. Have very little time to be on the game anyways. They will not be able to use this in any large extent, having to save all of their gold for motifs as they struggle to farm the mats they need to up their crafting level to the point where they'll be able to learn the motifs they bought.

A will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

B can do as mentioned above and farm gold.

C This system is made for pve and pvp, RP you can wear anything already. In fact I'd go so far to assert that if all you do is rp, the new system offers nothing new at the expense of hide helm.

D will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

However, making the system less gold won't help A, since they know no motifs. Along the same vein, it won't help D for likely the same reasons. C Loses when this system goes live regardless, but it very well could help B.

I'm all for making this accessible to everyone, but the proposal won't help nearly as much as you think. The way to make it work for everyone would be something akin to how terraria does it: a "cosmetic" slot for every equipped item that displays regardless of what is worn underneath. We kinda got that, half baked.

You'll have to forgive my bad counterpoints. I'm, ah, not very good at explaining my thoughts on things that I don't know inside and out.
Also, I'm not so certain it's different from Terraria at all. It sounds like the exact same thing, but you can have multiple outfits you can switch between.

But can you see where I'm coming from in that the gold cost is entirely unnecessary? That's probably my main gripe with it.

EDIT: Also, the point I was trying to make with D is that they don't have enough time to farm the extra gold for editing the outfits. If they only get around 2 hours a day (And that's if they're lucky) they'll want to spend it doing something they actually get enjoyment out of.

While I do agree people with limited playtime want to spend that time with things they enjoy, sometimes we have to sacrifice a day or two for our needs. In this life we are all making sacrifices to be honest and while I do like having fun doing Trials for example sometimes I need to stop and let's say do some Skyshard hunting, Lorebook, some Delves and even Public Dungeons or whatever people want to do to relax.

Happened yesterday I have a char which really needs some serious amount of skill points being a PvP StamDK / PVE Stam DK Tank / PVE StamDK DD (Dual Wield, Bow), so I decided to do some Public Dungeons which I missed previously. Went to Bangkorai and got a Spriggan Axe (around 90k MasterMerchant price), along the way I got drops from mobs also, cleaned some other dungeons aswell, opened chests and I think if I have to count all the gold I made yesterday it will be like 150-200k gold if not more.

A - Yes you need some luck also but you have to do something to get something
B - Yes you need a Trading Guild to be able to sell even craps
C - I do understand why some people want this system for free, RP etc but
D - It is still a game meant to be played
E - I myself really lack of time these days so all I have time to do is to do my daily writs on 4 chars, only 1 is a crafter with maxed skills and maybe have and extra 1 hour tops to do something else. This way I can make 40k / week minimum with 1 or 2 hours / day tops.

If someone won't do anything can't enjoy a lot of things, that how it is. You can blame the system always for sure it's not perfect but if people are not willing to do anything they can just blame themselves.
Oh and I forgot to mention I don't know any special motifs yet nor own a house so for my 10+ millions these systems (Outfit+Storage) are the perfect money sinks. Since I'm not new to the MMOs I know you actually need some plan to progress. Or just go after your mood. Tired of trials let's go grab some nodes, clean some dungeons etc. or stole something. This game offers so many ways to get some serious amount of gold in no time, honestly this MMO one of the best which offers some easy gold making.

Recremen

Baracuta wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

DocFrost72 wrote: »

Baracuta wrote: »

sudaki_eso wrote: »

How often are you guys planning on changing your outfit? If the max. amount of gold you have to pay is 25k then i dont really see a problem, its not really that much for you "dream outfit"
Most people probably wont use the most expensive motifs and as other have stated you can get a good looking outfit for 5-10k....I dont mind paying this amount every couple of weeks when i get bored of my older outfit...
That doesnt mean that i wouldnt mind if it was free for eso+ users but i can live with the decision from zos that you have to spend some money on it.

That's what the problem is. Many of us aren't looking at 5-10k every couple of weeks. We're looking at 5-10k every two days, depending on if we like what we've made. The more outfits a person has, the more frequently they'll change them.

Log in on one character a day and do writs, that is 6k gold (minimum) and takes all of ten minutes.

Grind for one (1) hour and sell all the trash you picked up = 40k gold.

Farm mats for 30 minutes, make anywhere from 10k-20k (luck depending).

This system is not expensive for those of us who have a system of making gold. I'm not saying you cannot disagree or be upset, but the argument you laid out is definitely not the strongest given how quickly gold flows in game.

It's the weakest of my arguments, I'll give you that. I myself am not a poor individual in ESO, having a gold-making routine that brings me in a comfortable amount each day for my interests. I, however, have people in my guild who A. Don't have any crafters, B. Aren't seriously invested into a trading guild, C. Only get on for RP, and D. Have very little time to be on the game anyways. They will not be able to use this in any large extent, having to save all of their gold for motifs as they struggle to farm the mats they need to up their crafting level to the point where they'll be able to learn the motifs they bought.

A will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

B can do as mentioned above and farm gold.

C This system is made for pve and pvp, RP you can wear anything already. In fact I'd go so far to assert that if all you do is rp, the new system offers nothing new at the expense of hide helm.

D will be at a disadvantage, agreed.

However, making the system less gold won't help A, since they know no motifs. Along the same vein, it won't help D for likely the same reasons. C Loses when this system goes live regardless, but it very well could help B.

I'm all for making this accessible to everyone, but the proposal won't help nearly as much as you think. The way to make it work for everyone would be something akin to how terraria does it: a "cosmetic" slot for every equipped item that displays regardless of what is worn underneath. We kinda got that, half baked.

You'll have to forgive my bad counterpoints. I'm, ah, not very good at explaining my thoughts on things that I don't know inside and out.
Also, I'm not so certain it's different from Terraria at all. It sounds like the exact same thing, but you can have multiple outfits you can switch between.

But can you see where I'm coming from in that the gold cost is entirely unnecessary? That's probably my main gripe with it.

EDIT: Also, the point I was trying to make with D is that they don't have enough time to farm the extra gold for editing the outfits. If they only get around 2 hours a day (And that's if they're lucky) they'll want to spend it doing something they actually get enjoyment out of.

Even if we're not talking about people with extremely limited gametime, your argument still stands. What is the actual purpose of the gold cost? To drive people to spend an extra hour a day farming just for gold? That's literally just a timewaster. It serves no value. You don't gain some long-term advantage like you would with any other kind of farming.

• You farm motifs because you get a permanent, long-term crafting benefit (and now a collections benefit as well)
• You farm gear because once you own said gear you're done, you have a long-term set you can play with
• You farm skyshards because you get permanent skill points out of it
• You farm achievements because you get permanent dye (account-wide) or title (character-specific) unlocks
• You spend hours on quests because at the end you have a (more or less) permanent memory of the story you experienced
• You spend hours in trials or dungeons because you're either farming the gear (see above) or experiencing the story (see above) or getting achievements ( see above). Or you just enjoy the challenge, as a regular part of gameplay.
• You spend hours in Cyro or battlegrounds either as a regular part of enjoyable gameplay, or to farm skills, or achievements, or AP so you can buy gear or motifs (see above * 5)

You don't have to go out of your way and farm extra gold for any of that, you are making gold the entire time for all your paltry expenses like gear repair or potions or whatever. Where's the equivalent for Outfitting? Who's gonna pay me to look fabulous? Where's my permanent unlock? Outfitting actually WOULD fit the above model if there wasn't a gold cost because you'd work towards learning the motifs and you'd have the permanent collections unlock and then you'd be done. That's how it ought to be.

xaraan

Apache_Kid wrote: »

Why should I have to pay gold to use motifs I already know. Why did I bother saving up all these style materials. And now I'm being charged to use colors I already unlocked just to dye the outfit?
Nah man the fact that there is a cost is lame as hell. I already own the motifs why am I paying gold to use them??

Agreed.

I get having gold sinks in the game, don't even mind a small gold cost, but the inflated pricing just screams the same tune as horrible motif drops rates - "buy it in the crown store instead!"

This also makes style stones practically worthless now.

I can see a small gold cost. But it should require a style stone more than gold and dying should require nothing.