PTS Update 17 - Feedback Thread for Outfit System

OlafdieWaldfee

I can't create an outfit with "no helmet" activated. It just can't be saved.
Is this intended?

Borvath

When there is something written in the search bar, you cant copy a dye ,you can only copy it if the search haven't hidden it.
Also why the cloth in the ebonshadow light motif dyes like a metal instead of like other cloths, it is very shiny.
Sorry for my english.

idk

I like the outfit system as tested on the PTS.

There is one change I would suggest and I expect it has been brought up before. When starting with the system, before an outfit slot has been chosen, if someone clicks on the armor/weapon slots that are greyed out a feedback is provided via a noise but I did not notice a visual message as we get with so many other things in game.

I would suggest a message on the screen stating that an outfit slot needs to be chosen.

idk

Adding to my previous comment.

Again, I'm sure this has been mentioned more than a few times. We need a decent means to preview in the outfit system. Currently there are no means to actuall see what it will look like until paying the gold.

Thai should be a basic feature in the game for crafting and in the guild stores. There is already a similar system for motifs in the crown store but I am talking about seeing the change of one individual piece on the current characters.

This is something I have seen in other games and done very well.

BroanBeast1215

Forgive me if this has been answered already but, does this outfit system require that the character in question has learned the motifs of the different styles? ive gotten thru the game so far without needing all the different(expensive in some cases) motifs by either not using crafted sets or by contracting a mastercraftsman for a set of armor. Im going to be mildly disappointed if I now have to spend gold on acquiring all the different motifs on top of the gold needed to make an outifit in the first place.

ADarklore

BroanBeast1215 wrote: »

Forgive me if this has been answered already but, does this outfit system require that the character in question has learned the motifs of the different styles? ive gotten thru the game so far without needing all the different(expensive in some cases) motifs by either not using crafted sets or by contracting a mastercraftsman for a set of armor. Im going to be mildly disappointed if I now have to spend gold on acquiring all the different motifs on top of the gold needed to make an outifit in the first place.

Yes, one of your characters has to know the motif in order to use that particular style; the motif knowledge is shared across all characters.

ADarklore

I have a question... do Outfits work with 'quick slots' like costumes do? Currently I have three costumes in quick slots and would be nice if Outfits could be added there as well.

niawrathb16_ESO

I found the system easy to use and understand, and I think being able to wear a tabbard over the outfit system is a nice touch and great for those of us who are proud to wear one.

The Outfit selection charge seems reasonable when considering the cost of crafting a new item instead of changing the appearance of via the outfit. The cost of the initial Motif isnt considered as you would need to learn the motif in either situation. Based on the gold cost on the EU PC/Mac server a CP 160 item would be at least 40k just for gold improvement materials for 1 item, so 2000g seems reasonable.

However the Dye charge seems unreasonable, it is free to dye all armour, its free to dye costume if you have an ESO subscription, so charging gold to dye with the outfit system doesn't make sense. 7 Armour with 3 dye slots each is 50g per dye spot plus up to 2 weapons (Front bar and Back Bar) again with 3 dye slots each are 350g per slot which is a total dye cost of 5,250g for a full dye change. Now some may say that this is a small sum and easily gained via stealing of selling and you would be right, but think on this
15 characters x 5,250g = 78,750g for your initial outfit dye. Now its starting to seem a bit pricier. Anytime you earn or unlock a new dye that you want to update your look with a better shade or unlock that colour on a new character you have to pay again. I know alot of people who change their look periodically such as for festivals or the most detailed eyes see their colours in new lighting as there is no way to preview dyes in the open world.

at the moment as an ESO plus subscriber with many costumes i have accumulated it is cheaper and more convenient/ less hassle to continue wearing costumes and dyeing them for free this is a shame for me as I was thoroughly looking forward to this amazing system which as usual you have gone above and beyond to deliver something spectacular.

There must be reasons for these decisions which if they were shared the community maybe more understanding or make alternative suggestions.

Here are my suggestions to improve the system:
-Weapons should be dye-able separate from the outfit system
-Dye stamps should be usable for the outfit system as this would give them more use.
-If the purpose of the charge is a gold sink incorporate a higher fee on the style selection and make the dye free
OR
-make the dye charge pet item not slot (50g for armour, 350g for weapons would be 1,750g total)
OR
-make the dye charge a flat rate fee like the guild heraldry of 1k - 2k gold.
My final suggestion is to make use of the ESO plus subscription I dont want non subscribers to be left out but perhaps a discount on the gold fee to subscribers?

mmogamerperson

@ADarklore They have their own drop down menu. I don't think they are quickslotable.

zassasaurus

Overall I really enjoyed the outfitting system, however I have a few suggestions for improvement.

• Im pretty unhappy about the gold cost, I understand why you have it i just think it could use some adjustment. 6k to change one piece is insanely expensive, that could be over 60k gold to change an outfit, not including dyes. I think prices should range from 100 to 2k gold at most. I personally think it would be good to make it so you use a crafting material for that style to change the outfit, or at least have the option to choose between gold and item style mats.
  
• Dyeing outfits should be free. There isn't a cost to dye costumes or regular armor in the game so its ridiculous that this has a cost. You could at least make it free for ESO+ members. At the VERY least add weapons dyeing to the regular gear dying screen and make that free of cost, as it is not possible to get differently coloured weapons in any other way, this at least needs to be free
  
• Dyes that we have not yet unlocked should be able to be previewed, just like you can preview motifs you dont yet have. I think it would be great, and people would be more motivated to work towards specific dyes if they knew what they looked like.
  
• Other items besides the helmet should be able to be hidden. I would like all items to be possible so I can show off skins and tattoos, you introduced the bathers towel so i dont see what difference it would make if people were to run around naked. At LEAST shoulders need to be able to be hidden, so many of the shoulder pieces dont even connect to my characters body it looks stupid.
  
• Hide helmet needs to still work on polymorphs, Xivkyn polymorphs are totally pointless without hide helmet, it just looks like you are wearing xivkyn armor of that weight, which you can easily do now thanks to the outfit system.
  

It seems strange to me that where you change outfit is in the character screen, took a while for me to work out where I could swap between outfits, I looked on gear selection screen, quickslot items, and all through the collections tab, doesnt really make sense where it is now.

I did also find one small bug, I put on the caluurions legacy set, and now the gloves are bugged. Any glove styles in the outfit systems which are just the hand part and dont cover the arm brace, the arm brace part of the caluurions glove item remains. Even if i take the actual item off, the bracer part of the glove remains on my character. This appeared to be bug out after using the outfit system, it was fine after equipping the item and after dying it, but after trying to use the outfit system it bugged out. I did this on two characters and the same bug occurred.

attempting to put grim harlequin light gloves on


attempting to put mazzatun light gloves on


with no gloves equipped after using the outfit system

Kazox

•Was the system easy to understand?
Yes

•Did you have any trouble finding an Outfit Station or accessing it?
No

•Did you find the Outfit System to be fun?
I have mixed feelings about it. The system was implemented very similar to what's available for Wildstar, save a few (important) differences:
1 - Hide helmet option seems to be bugged for me (cannot apply changes)
2 - I should be able to hide every item (e.g.: I want to use a skin, like shriven). There's a wardrobe item that allows me to run around in a towel, I don't see why I can't do the same wearing speedos...
3 - I understand having to pay for changing dyes, but why do I need to pay every time I change an item? Once I buy a t-shirt, I don't have to pay every time I want to wear it. The way I see it, when I learn a motif I should still have to pay the first time I apply an outfit change. From that point on, I should be able to use that same outfit item (chest, legs,...) as many times as I'd like (at the character level). An analogy to real life: I'm a taylor and I know how to sew a piece of clothing. I still need to pay for materials to build the item, but once I'm done sewing it, the outfit item is mine. Another character wants it, I pay for it. The current system design seems very greedy (Even if it turns out to be cheap to change items around).
4 - I wish the preview system was easier. I don't really enjoy double clicking to see what the item looks like it. Maybe a cursor over item preview option would be nice.
5 - A real nice to have would be to have an option to compare the before and after changes, to help me decide if the changes to the outfit were good or not.
6 - This is not a must-have item, but some of the older motif skins could use an update. Some armor items still look like I'm wearing a tatoo or a body paint instead of wearing an actual armor. I don't know, hire an intern to improve them or create a constest with your community to have us redesign some of the items. Just an idea.

•Did you use gold or Outfit Tokens to change your Outfits?
In PTS I use tokens because I only pay 1 crown for them. Which currency I'll use once update is deployed will depend on token prices.

•Do you have any other general feedback?
Other than my comments above, the whole outfit system is pretty solid. Were I to give it a score, I'd say it's a 7 out of 10.

ADarklore

mmogamerperson wrote: »

@ADarklore They have their own drop down menu. I don't think they are quickslotable.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Gina, if this is true, are there plans to make it quick-slottable like costumes? I mean, having to stop and fumble through the UI just to change your outfit seems clunky compared to how costumes work.

Aerius_Sygale

ADarklore wrote: »

mmogamerperson wrote: »

@ADarklore They have their own drop down menu. I don't think they are quickslotable.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Gina, if this is true, are there plans to make it quick-slottable like costumes? I mean, having to stop and fumble through the UI just to change your outfit seems clunky compared to how costumes work.

Who has space for quickslotting Costumes? I certainly don't. Food/Drink, Potions and Repair Kits belong there. Those take up everything...

Elsonso

Aerius_Sygale wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

mmogamerperson wrote: »

@ADarklore They have their own drop down menu. I don't think they are quickslotable.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Gina, if this is true, are there plans to make it quick-slottable like costumes? I mean, having to stop and fumble through the UI just to change your outfit seems clunky compared to how costumes work.

Who has space for quickslotting Costumes? I certainly don't. Food/Drink, Potions and Repair Kits belong there. Those take up everything...

I have one slot reserved for a costume. When I am working on the fishing achievement, it seems silly to be standing there in full battle armor. It is easier to use a quick slot than to open Collections, find the costume, and turn it on and off.

Aerius_Sygale

lordrichter wrote: »

Aerius_Sygale wrote: »

ADarklore wrote: »

mmogamerperson wrote: »

@ADarklore They have their own drop down menu. I don't think they are quickslotable.

@ZOS_GinaBruno Gina, if this is true, are there plans to make it quick-slottable like costumes? I mean, having to stop and fumble through the UI just to change your outfit seems clunky compared to how costumes work.

Who has space for quickslotting Costumes? I certainly don't. Food/Drink, Potions and Repair Kits belong there. Those take up everything...

I have one slot reserved for a costume. When I am working on the fishing achievement, it seems silly to be standing there in full battle armor. It is easier to use a quick slot than to open Collections, find the costume, and turn it on and off.

I guess a single Costume quickslot would be manageable enough. Subtract least used potion, add favorite casual Costume. :P I personally like Jaqspur, in OR out of battle. I just like it.

mingimingi

If someone said this already, then rip but

The ability to **lock** certain pieces while randomizing others would be nice. LOCK chest, randomize legs, etc. Like how we do in the character creation.

ghastley

Bump for the "hide any piece", and a query as to how the "hide helmet" is finally going to be implemented. I understand that one is different from the others because of the Costume and Polymorph alternatives. Are we going to have two separate options - hide in Outfit, and "Hide Helmet" collectible?

GiantFruitFly

ghastley wrote: »

Are we going to have two separate options - hide in Outfit, and "Hide Helmet" collectible?

It appears so. The one in outfits hides the helmet only specific to the outfit it is set up with while the one with collectible hides helmet on costumes and outfits. It does have redundant overlapping but I guess zos wanted more specific customization per outfit without having to go to collections.

I want hide any piece to show up on live as well but given that it wasn't added on 3.3.4 makes me think it won't as of soon. If it I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Kendaric

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

This is the official feedback thread for the Outfit System. Specific feedback that the team is looking for includes the following:

• Was the system easy to understand?

Yes, it's easy enough.

[*] Did you have any trouble finding an Outfit Station or accessing it?

No, they are easy enough to find. Can't judge it from a new player's perspective though, but for anyone who played ESO for some time it's not a problem at all.

[*] Did you find the Outfit System to be fun?

Mostly yes. I loved the fact that you can use it to preview styles. However, I do think the prices are a bit high for some motifs and dyes should be free.

[*] Did you use gold or Outfit Tokens to change your Outfits?

I used both. I'll probably use tokens on my normal server (depends on the cost though), considering that I need the gold for motif pages.

[*] Do you have any other general feedback?

Yes... I think outfit slots should be accountwide once purchased. The way it is now, the outfit system can probably get pretty expensive if you have multiple characters.
Shoulders should have an "invisible" option similiar to helmets. I'd actually prefer it if all armor could be hidden, but I can understand why you're not doing it.
Basing the cost of a piece on the supposed rarity of a motif is a bad idea in my opinion.

Truthsnark

My only issue with the outfit system is that the "Hide Helm" functionality has been blown up on PC. None of this is OK, particularly the first two points, and needs to be fixed.

From opaj:
- If you have a polymorph, you can no longer hide your helmet.
- If you are wearing a disguise, you can no longer hide your helmet.
- If you are wearing a hat, you cannot easily toggle between wearing the hat and hiding your helmet.

Vehlir

Are you able to make outfits with Dungeon pieces that aren't currently motifs yet?

For example the new Fang Lair pieces have a cool look to them, but aren't yet craftable motifs. Does that mean I won't be able to utilize them in outfits yet?

Elsonso

Vehlir wrote: »

Are you able to make outfits with Dungeon pieces that aren't currently motifs yet?

No, you cannot.

Vehlir

lordrichter wrote: »

Vehlir wrote: »

Are you able to make outfits with Dungeon pieces that aren't currently motifs yet?

No, you cannot.

Thanks!

peacenote

Was the system easy to understand?
Yes, fairly easy.

Did you have any trouble finding an Outfit Station or accessing it?
No

Did you find the Outfit System to be fun?
It was enjoyable to use, generally speaking.

Did you use gold or Outfit Tokens to change your Outfits?
Gold

Do you have any other general feedback?
The "guts" of the system is fantastic. It's so flexible and I am really impressed that you took the time to implement this into the game as standard functionality. That said, I have one major issue with this system.


It makes absolutely no sense sense, whatsoever, that changing an outfit costs gold.

Hear me out on this. It is clear that this was intended as a way to incorporate a crown store cost (outfit tokens) into the feature (which is income you need to continue to develop the game) and that the gold cost was added to allow the functionality to be used by all. I support the game as an ESO Plus subscriber and I purchase items from the Crown Store, and have no issue paying for things to support the game. I enjoy this game very much. But from a logical, "how ESO is today" standpoint, charging gold or outfit tokens to change the look of your outfit just doesn't fit with the game and should be, imho, completely eliminated.

First.... WHO ARE YOU PAYING? Seriously. I mean on a very basic level. I understand that gold is not real money, but I mean, in game, ***who*** are you paying?? Have you ever noticed that when you spend gold in game, you're interacting with an NPC? The other crafting stations don't sell mats and furnishings built into them and take gold. There are NPC merchants nearby to do this. There are NPCs manning every store. There are NPCs manning every bank and guild trader. You have to pay an NPC to repair your gear... you can't just click a button out in the world to have gold magically disappear to get this done. ESO does not have vending machines!! There is no NPC standing by the Outfit station and thus we should not be paying gold. I could deal with the crystals needing to re-trait because you could say that they were materials, like crafting materials needed to produce items at stations... but this just plain illogical, to have the outfit stations take gold.

Second... right now, it costs no money to dye anything. It costs no money to equip a costume. It costs no money to equip crafted or dropped equipment. It costs no money to put on a title. You should not have to pay an invisible no-one to change your appearance. It doesn't go with how we change our appearance today. It feels "wrong." The outfit system should have been a free "make your own costume" functionality and, once finished, they should become custom, name-able collectibles that work the same as purchased costumes and can be used in quick slots. If anything we should be required to use crafting mats, which we inexplicably are not.

The outfit system should have launched with new crown store costumes, motifs, dye stamps, and other items that could be purchased to support the game, but the system itself should be completely free. I am not objecting to gold sinks or crown store items. I am objecting to the completely bizarre and illogical implementation of paying gold to change how I look. WHY???

The one exception to this, I would suggest, is that it could, possibly, make sense to pay to apply a style or dye you haven't yet unlocked. I can see outfit tokens being re-purposed for this. Make them cheaper than buying a motif in the crown store, and let crafters make them on cooldown. I can see people paying for the ability to apply motifs they don't have, and it could be a nice source of income for ESO because it would scoop up the micro transactions of people willing to pay a small amount to make that outfit perfect. Hit the sweet spot with the price and you're golden. But even then, it should be an object to obtain, not a direct "make my gold evaporate" type thing.

Whether the cost is reasonable or not almost doesn't matter. It just, simply, makes no sense.

Sandman929

peacenote wrote: »

First.... WHO ARE YOU PAYING? Seriously. I mean on a very basic level. I understand that gold is not real money, but I mean, in game, ***who*** are you paying?? Have you ever noticed that when you spend gold in game, you're interacting with an NPC? The other crafting stations don't sell mats and furnishings built into them and take gold. There are NPC merchants nearby to do this. There are NPCs manning every store. There are NPCs manning every bank and guild trader. You have to pay an NPC to repair your gear... you can't just click a button out in the world to have gold magically disappear to get this done. ESO does not have vending machines!! There is no NPC standing by the Outfit station and thus we should not be paying gold. I could deal with the crystals needing to re-trait because you could say that they were materials, like crafting materials needed to produce items at stations... but this just plain illogical, to have the outfit stations take gold.

That's a really good point. Is the gold being converted magically into material and dye or is there a physical coin slot on the stations? Are we paying the station?

peacenote

Sandman929 wrote: »

peacenote wrote: »

There is no NPC standing by the Outfit station and thus we should not be paying gold. I could deal with the crystals needing to re-trait because you could say that they were materials, like crafting materials needed to produce items at stations... but this just plain illogical, to have the outfit stations take gold.

That's a really good point. Is the gold being converted magically into material and dye or is there a physical coin slot on the stations? Are we paying the station?

One more thing I realized about this, too. If there is still a gold cost for the outfit stations that people can get with writs, that means we will be paying gold, in our own homes, to no one! Is there an outfit station company that's coming to collect the gold? My permissions do not allow them to enter. Talk about adding insult to injury, since the stations are so expensive, too! If I use an outfit station at a friend's house, shouldn't the proceeds go towards the person who bought the station? Shouldn't I get the gold if people use it in mine?

I really am surprised people are not more upset about this. Everybody seems to notice when an outfit clips or there is a stylistic error in a costume, house, or furniture item. But nobody noticed when ZOS built something that is in conflict with the core design of how and why we interact with NPCs in game? This shouldn't go live like this. With this implementation, I am now wondering....

• Why can't I just repair my gear mid-dungeon, then, for gold?
• Why do I have to go to Coldharbor to see and buy the luxury furniture?
• Why can't I list items in my guild store by choosing an item in the game menu right in the middle of Cyrodiil?
• Why do I have to go to a station AT ALL to edit my outfit?

Some world logic needs to remain untouched and consistent in order to maintain the believability of in-game limitations while you are playing. Even though it is a fake, magical game world. In fact, even more so BECAUSE it is a fake, magical game world. No one will understand how anything works if changes keep being made in this way. Appearance changes should be free if you know the motif. Just like it works when you use any other item or feature to change how you look in the game.

iRouge

Here’s my feedback:

Was the system easy to understand?
Yes.

Did you have any trouble finding an Outfit Station or accessing it?
Nope I have one at home.

Did you find the Outfit System to be fun?
Fun isn’t the word, but interesting and enjoyable.

Did you use gold or Outfit Tokens to change your Outfits?
Both to test.

Do you have any other general feedback?
-Dyes should not cost money, especially when they take effort to get, that is robbery and insulting.

-Hiding helmet should remain in the game settings for quick function keybinding usage, although I did discover that costume helmets can be hidden under the hat section in collectibles, which can also be quick slotted. I don’t know if this was always the case, but it’s there.

-An option to hide shoulders is probably just as important as the hide helmet option now as a lot of the shoulders appear to be floating and don’t work well with some outfit combinations such as light lvl 1 styled shirts. Also for maximum creativity and customisation all outfit slots: hands, feet, chest, etc should be given the option to be hidden.

-Suggestion to have looted clothing as part of the outfit options as they’re just sitting there useless as no one wants to break their gear sets and this is the best opportunity for them to not go wasted. Perhaps looting the particular item unlocks it in the outfit collectibles, since they can’t be learnt, similar idea can work in the future for other cool items that can’t be crafted.

This is an amazing idea and would literally soar if the focus is kept on allowing maximum customisation and not gold draining. But definitely the right track!

ADarklore

peacenote wrote: »

2. I did not test this, but outfits seem to be per character. If I cannot apply a motif I have learned on one character to an outfit for another character without also having to learn the motif on that second character, or make an outfit and then transfer it to a different character, this system will have very, very little value to me.

Apparently you are not aware that motifs, for the Outfit System, are ACCOUNT WIDE. Meaning that all the motif knowledge your Crafter has will be available on your non-crafter characters- just be sure to log onto your Crafter FIRST, when this goes Live, so that the knowledge does get imprinted into the game. They never tell you this, found out the hard way, that you have to log into each character that knows a motif before it becomes account wide.

Second, achievement dyes are also ACCOUNT WIDE. Achievements themselves are per character, but once you unlock a dye from an achievement, it becomes account wide.

peacenote

ADarklore wrote: »

peacenote wrote: »

2. I did not test this, but outfits seem to be per character. If I cannot apply a motif I have learned on one character to an outfit for another character without also having to learn the motif on that second character, or make an outfit and then transfer it to a different character, this system will have very, very little value to me.

Apparently you are not aware that motifs, for the Outfit System, are ACCOUNT WIDE. Meaning that all the motif knowledge your Crafter has will be available on your non-crafter characters- just be sure to log onto your Crafter FIRST, when this goes Live, so that the knowledge does get imprinted into the game. They never tell you this, found out the hard way, that you have to log into each character that knows a motif before it becomes account wide.

Second, achievement dyes are also ACCOUNT WIDE. Achievements themselves are per character, but once you unlock a dye from an achievement, it becomes account wide.

No, definitely did not know that. That's a really good heads up. Do you know how it works if you learn other motifs later?

For dyes, do you mean for the outfit system only as well? Because I'm fairly certain that right now, in game, my main can't use the werewolf achievement color even though I have an alt that's a werewolf.

Malborn66

Implementation of Hide Helmet function sucks! Please put it back on the Gameplay Settings irrespective of your Outfit system.

Many of my toons do not show Helmets and you are screwing this up big time.

You cannot even make Hide Helmet work in PTS so it should not go Live!