MAGBLADE pvp theorycrafting

kaithuzar

exeeter702 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

Why on earth would you EVER use blessing of restoration on a magblade, class that's known to struggle with bar space? O_o 1k resists, that's like 100 less damage from a hit. If you think that's worth a bar space....

Because it's also a "burst heal", something our class lacks.

Nb doesnt opperate on burst heals. When played right as a high damage build that relies on cloak / image, healing ward is the only true burst heal you need once you achieve LOS which image and cloak generally do.

When played as a tankier brawler type or as a dedicated NB healer, the pure attrition game comes into play as you work around their incredibly potent hot uptime.

Blessing of restoration does not qualify as a burst heal in pvp. There are far better ways to heal allies especially as a nb, and there are far better ways to heal yourself. And if you want the minors, just throw on mirage and you wont even need to worry as much about burst heals.

Frankly speaking, NBs that prance around sheild stacking like impoverished mag sorcs always make me sigh. NB healing potency accross the board is exceptional, and its easy to determine the bad nbs from the good when coming across those that understand how to play around that unique strength.

Firstly, "when played right" sounds to me as if you know "my playstyle" better than I do; this is highly debatable as it is a question of playstyle & should not be used as an argument for "the correct way to play".
I will agree that between cloak & shade you "shouldn't" need other sources of survivability per se, but with shade being broken this patch we've been forced to think outside of the box.

Secondly, I don't use swallow soul, it's reflectable by dk's & anyone wearing certain sets or using certain reflective abilities; I also don't run flame clench for this reason.
So if I'm not using swallow soul & im only interested in healing myself, my choices seem a bit limited.
I will note that as stated above, blessing of restoration had/has its place in my specific build for my specific playstyle.
For my updated build & playstyle I have chosen to go with refreshing path instead.

It's good to remember this is a theory crafting thread. If there was a "one size fits all" most efficient easy to use setup this thread wouldn't exist & the game would be completely boring imo, as half of my reasoning for playing is the interesting theory crafting for sets & skills to combine.

Subversus

jimijac0me wrote: »

@VirtualElizabeth - I don't think so, I love being a vamp, even IF those DB's hurt so much haha, I've been vamp since early days so kind of attached now and I feel like I'd be betraying all of those that I've bitten and brought into the fold

@Subversus on a melee build a gap closer is pretty great against streaking sorcs running away and reflecting dks though and probably the classes I'm strongest against usually, as I said though, I love cripple and agree with your comment in most circumstances. The worst thing I hate about lotus fan is in lag when you press it and nothing happens, you press it again then you just wind up lotus fanning over and over - I also do this when I'm playing drunk (most of the time! ) - most embarrassing!

TBH I think destro/resto is a stronger allpurpose kit regardless but dw melee more fun for me

Good point, ball of lightning sorcs can really only be stopped with a gap closer as cripple doesn't root em, it roots the ball, and they can still streak even if rooted if they go with the other morph.

But yeah, destro/resto is fairly good albeit melee is (a lot) more damage from my experience and it has snare immunity if you go with 2h.

Subversus

kaithuzar wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

Why on earth would you EVER use blessing of restoration on a magblade, class that's known to struggle with bar space? O_o 1k resists, that's like 100 less damage from a hit. If you think that's worth a bar space....

Because it's also a "burst heal", something our class lacks.

The 'burst heal' in my case is and has always been healing ward. I have so much hps that it's usually more than enough. If it works for you, however, then why not! What did you drop to make room for it?

You guys are really starting to make me feel like no one reads what I post here >.>

So I was specifically using it on my tankier build which was destro/resto & using 1 pirate 1 chudan
The duration of the minor buffs from blessing of restoration last longer than from mirage.
Healing ward by itself never seemed like enough, maybe if you have swallow soul on the same bar, but I don't like being an easy target for opponents wearing shield breaker or stack lots into shattering cp tree

My bar setup was: (destro & resto)
Sap, lotus, fear, crushing shock, mage light, meteor
Cloak, blessing of restoration, impale, healing ward, merciless, lights champion

My bar setup now: (2h & resto)
Sap, lotus, forward momentum, concealed, mage light, incap
Cloak, refreshing path, fear, healing ward, merciless, lights champion


I don't use cripple because I don't put any cp points into thaumaturge
I chose refreshing over blessing of restoration because refreshing has 3 different things it provides but with blessing I felt the minor buffs were less meaningful with lower resistances

Refreshing gives me a minor speed boost, a hot, & a dot (which I don't particularly care about but it's there)

The key imo, is to keep the hot up, make your opponent come to you (if 1v1 type scenario).

I use healing ward "strategically", meaning I use it when I don't want my opponents next attack to crit on me for big dmg. If they take down the shield, I don't get a heal, standing in path allows me to heal passively.
Healing ward primarily becomes useful when at low health, so from 60%+ health, it's more efficient to just let the hot from path tick on you. I'm also a high elf not an Argonian, if I was an Argonian, maybe I could rely on healing ward more.

How can you know when they crit big though? For example a stamblade with such a cheap ult can basically constantly crit big on you, and with defile attached to their burst it is pretty deadly.

Look I'm not saying that this is how you should play magblade, I know very well that the class has a LOT of viable setups. Hell I have 8 different setups in my outfitter addon, and I use like 5 of them based on how I feel like playing.

Only thing I really disagree with is using sap frontbar and merciless backbar, especially on destro resto. Merciless is key to your pressure and your burst, and having it on the lower damaging bar is just... Also, there really isn't any reason to run sap over entropy on destro resto. That playstyle revolves around kiting with the help of cripple, and being in melee range for sap sounds really counterproductive.

But hell, if it works then who am I to say you shouldn't do it. Could just simply be me having a different style of play.

Metemsycosis

Melee bar set ups
Precise julianos + Amber + skoria

Dw: lotus fan/cripple, cloak, concealed, merciless/fear/cripple, impale, incap
Resto: degeneration, refreshing path, mist, ward, harness, soul tether

I work my burst around skoria and try to get it on cool down. Twisting path would be better damage, the healing is irrelevant mostly, but I use refreshing to proc transmutation on another setup and don't feel like changing it. If I want cripple and lotus fan I drop merciless resolve, otherwise keep it.

Trashs1

Metemsycosis wrote: »

Melee bar set ups
Precise julianos + Amber + skoria

Dw: lotus fan/cripple, cloak, concealed, merciless/fear/cripple, impale, incap
Resto: degeneration, refreshing path, mist, ward, harness, soul tether

I work my burst around skoria and try to get it on cool down. Twisting path would be better damage, the healing is irrelevant mostly, but I use refreshing to proc transmutation on another setup and don't feel like changing it. If I want cripple and lotus fan I drop merciless resolve, otherwise keep it.

how can u survive with only dmg and sustain sets in melee.... this will be ever a misterium for me..

look at my mage pal.. wizards riposte+pirate skeleton is best for me to go in melee range

technohic

Trashs1 wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

Melee bar set ups
Precise julianos + Amber + skoria

Dw: lotus fan/cripple, cloak, concealed, merciless/fear/cripple, impale, incap
Resto: degeneration, refreshing path, mist, ward, harness, soul tether

I work my burst around skoria and try to get it on cool down. Twisting path would be better damage, the healing is irrelevant mostly, but I use refreshing to proc transmutation on another setup and don't feel like changing it. If I want cripple and lotus fan I drop merciless resolve, otherwise keep it.

how can u survive with only dmg and sustain sets in melee.... this will be ever a misterium for me..

look at my mage pal.. wizards riposte+pirate skeleton is best for me to go in melee range

I’m not them and prefer a bit of defense myself either with a set or heavy armor but; it seems from my playing time; it comes down to whether you’re pressured or not more than your defense. I’ve been considering going full glass myself.

Datthaw

Subversus wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Exodium wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Exodium wrote: »

By the way you melee magblades out there what's your bar set ups like?

Mine are;
Dw bar: concealed, Cloak, Merciless, crippling grasp, mass hysteria

Resto: Entropy, healing ward, shadow image, Siphoning strikes, double take

My bars for 2h/resto magblade are

2h: mercy, FM, cloak, concealed, lotus. Incap ult
Resto: Healing ward, SiphoN strikes, fear, Soul swallow, cripple. Resto ult

I'm still pretty scrubish is on it but I run it as a burst/sustain type. Weave with resto from range then gapclose for combos

See I'd love to run lotus over cripple but you don't have a Siphoning skill for 8% mag I noticed?

Yeah the builds not by any means perfect. I'm rather uncomfortable in melee range

Cripple is really a must have for any magblade out there imo. Especially when you replace it with a gap closer, which you should never do seeing how cripple itself sorta works as one.

I do run it on my melee seyup, I just don't have it fron barred for a siphon skill passive

kaithuzar

exeeter702 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

Why on earth would you EVER use blessing of restoration on a magblade, class that's known to struggle with bar space? O_o 1k resists, that's like 100 less damage from a hit. If you think that's worth a bar space....

Because it's also a "burst heal", something our class lacks.

Nb doesnt opperate on burst heals. When played right as a high damage build that relies on cloak / image, healing ward is the only true burst heal you need once you achieve LOS which image and cloak generally do.

When played as a tankier brawler type or as a dedicated NB healer, the pure attrition game comes into play as you work around their incredibly potent hot uptime.

Blessing of restoration does not qualify as a burst heal in pvp. There are far better ways to heal allies especially as a nb, and there are far better ways to heal yourself. And if you want the minors, just throw on mirage and you wont even need to worry as much about burst heals.

Frankly speaking, NBs that prance around sheild stacking like impoverished mag sorcs always make me sigh. NB healing potency accross the board is exceptional, and its easy to determine the bad nbs from the good when coming across those that understand how to play around that unique strength.

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Subversus wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

Why on earth would you EVER use blessing of restoration on a magblade, class that's known to struggle with bar space? O_o 1k resists, that's like 100 less damage from a hit. If you think that's worth a bar space....

Because it's also a "burst heal", something our class lacks.

The 'burst heal' in my case is and has always been healing ward. I have so much hps that it's usually more than enough. If it works for you, however, then why not! What did you drop to make room for it?

You guys are really starting to make me feel like no one reads what I post here >.>

So I was specifically using it on my tankier build which was destro/resto & using 1 pirate 1 chudan
The duration of the minor buffs from blessing of restoration last longer than from mirage.
Healing ward by itself never seemed like enough, maybe if you have swallow soul on the same bar, but I don't like being an easy target for opponents wearing shield breaker or stack lots into shattering cp tree

My bar setup was: (destro & resto)
Sap, lotus, fear, crushing shock, mage light, meteor
Cloak, blessing of restoration, impale, healing ward, merciless, lights champion

My bar setup now: (2h & resto)
Sap, lotus, forward momentum, concealed, mage light, incap
Cloak, refreshing path, fear, healing ward, merciless, lights champion


I don't use cripple because I don't put any cp points into thaumaturge
I chose refreshing over blessing of restoration because refreshing has 3 different things it provides but with blessing I felt the minor buffs were less meaningful with lower resistances

Refreshing gives me a minor speed boost, a hot, & a dot (which I don't particularly care about but it's there)

The key imo, is to keep the hot up, make your opponent come to you (if 1v1 type scenario).

I use healing ward "strategically", meaning I use it when I don't want my opponents next attack to crit on me for big dmg. If they take down the shield, I don't get a heal, standing in path allows me to heal passively.
Healing ward primarily becomes useful when at low health, so from 60%+ health, it's more efficient to just let the hot from path tick on you. I'm also a high elf not an Argonian, if I was an Argonian, maybe I could rely on healing ward more.

How can you know when they crit big though? For example a stamblade with such a cheap ult can basically constantly crit big on you, and with defile attached to their burst it is pretty deadly.

Look I'm not saying that this is how you should play magblade, I know very well that the class has a LOT of viable setups. Hell I have 8 different setups in my outfitter addon, and I use like 5 of them based on how I feel like playing.

Only thing I really disagree with is using sap frontbar and merciless backbar, especially on destro resto. Merciless is key to your pressure and your burst, and having it on the lower damaging bar is just... Also, there really isn't any reason to run sap over entropy on destro resto. That playstyle revolves around kiting with the help of cripple, and being in melee range for sap sounds really counterproductive.

But hell, if it works then who am I to say you shouldn't do it. Could just simply be me having a different style of play.

Essentially there are little tricks that I learn from each playstyle that allow me to tweak & tune. For instance, I've been getting better at back bar fear, which would allow me to put merciless front bar.
Sap, I've been playing with in this one spot for years & it's just almost impossible for me to change that because I always expect it to be there.
From my perspectives, melding melee & range playstyle works for me as you're not stuck to one specific thing. But yes, you could very well stay ranged the entire time with entropy & remove the gap closer. I just don't want to be expected to do that while shade is broke.

Regarding the crit thing, you know what class you're fighting against, I can just tell directly before the dude comes in and does his dawnbreaker combo thing. I see him & think, he's coming in, then I'm gonna shield right before that.
There are sometimes 3 attacks going off on that, dizzying swing, dawnbreaker, reverse slice, with a light/heavy attack thrown in. One of them is likely going to crit, and I hope I have a shield up directly prior to that combo hitting me.

GreenhaloX

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

My bad, man. This is a pretty big thread, lots of pages and information, and I'm hardly the bookworm that's able to absolve everything. However, appreciate you re-stating your build pieces; definitely a nice shortcut then having to roll back through all these pages. Anyways, I use the hell of Refreshing Path for PvE, but it just doesn't seem to fit in for me in PvP. If you're going against 1, 2 or 3 and everybody rolling and hopping around like bunny rabbits in every which way directions, that straight and narrow Refreshing Path isn't helping much. It's not so easy to stay within the path. Oh sure, you may get a couple ticks of 1-2k health back after leaving the path, but that's hardly the help when you're getting 4 to 8k damage hits thrown at you. Oh yeah, it works very well in PvE where the adds and bosses are full frontal right on you. I used to slot it for PvP and works great throwing it onto the group that are bum rushing the doorway of the keep or outpost, but I find myself in more 1vX fight, then being in a zerg. So, I have to forgo that for something better useful for me.

For any class or players, there are just certain must haves and nice to have skills/abilities. Since I'm range staff MagBlade for PvP, Destructive Clench is one must have. Incap Strike, Lotus Fan, Disguise, Swallow Soul, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, and Mass Hysteria are the other must haves. I would love to be able to also in Leeching Strike, Merciless Resolve, and Sap Essence, but I can't fit that in for PvP. I don't do light armor, so no Annulment. The best alternate is Immovable. You have to slot in a cc/snare negating skill. Without such, you won't survive. You also have to be able to cc/snare them too; thus, the Clench, Mass Hysteria are life prolongers. I also slot Cripple on one bar and Swallow Soul on the other; this way, you get the Majicka Flood passive up on both bars. Plus, the Cippling Grasp does come in handy in zerg vs zerg fights. Also, to me, even though Vigor is barely half as efficient for mag than stam, I still have to slot it. Vigor is a saving grace after being hit by a siege weapon. For PvE, definitely, I have Leeching Strikes and Merciless Resolve and Refreshing Path slotted, but unfortunately can't fit it in for PvP. Swallow Soul and Vigor are the go-to for health regen hopeful. Also, for ultimate, the Incap is a must one bar, and I may drop Shooting Star or Eye of the Storm on the other; depends on the mode. However, in a zerg v. zerg fight, I drop in the Aggressive Horn.

As far as the monster pieces, if the Pirate and Chudan works for you, I'm not going to knock it. For me, as a range toon, the Skoria pieces (although, it doesn't proc as much as in PvE) was a life saver in few occasions where the proc was the killing blow. Particularly, in zerg vs zerg fights, I can be blasting away from range, while using DoTs like Clench, Crippling, and it will proc here and there, which does help a bit. Still, definitely, I have a harder time against DKs while 1vX. They have higher resistance capable build and that damn stam-based Vigor. Very nice when I'm on my stam toon, but not as much as a Mag going up against a high resist DK or any high resist stam toon sporting Vigor. Hell, even StamBlade are rolling around in heavy armor and Vigor; high resist and high self-heal, yeah, it is rougher fight. Seems like everyone and their dogs are rolling around with heavy and even resto. I was also having a hell of a time taking down a mag who kept on spamming resto healing; plus, I think that toon was also sporting heavy.

Datthaw

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

My bad, man. This is a pretty big thread, lots of pages and information, and I'm hardly the bookworm that's able to absolve everything. However, appreciate you re-stating your build pieces; definitely a nice shortcut then having to roll back through all these pages. Anyways, I use the hell of Refreshing Path for PvE, but it just doesn't seem to fit in for me in PvP. If you're going against 1, 2 or 3 and everybody rolling and hopping around like bunny rabbits in every which way directions, that straight and narrow Refreshing Path isn't helping much. It's not so easy to stay within the path. Oh sure, you may get a couple ticks of 1-2k health back after leaving the path, but that's hardly the help when you're getting 4 to 8k damage hits thrown at you. Oh yeah, it works very well in PvE where the adds and bosses are full frontal right on you. I used to slot it for PvP and works great throwing it onto the group that are bum rushing the doorway of the keep or outpost, but I find myself in more 1vX fight, then being in a zerg. So, I have to forgo that for something better useful for me.

For any class or players, there are just certain must haves and nice to have skills/abilities. Since I'm range staff MagBlade for PvP, Destructive Clench is one must have. Incap Strike, Lotus Fan, Disguise, Swallow Soul, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, and Mass Hysteria are the other must haves. I would love to be able to also in Leeching Strike, Merciless Resolve, and Sap Essence, but I can't fit that in for PvP. I don't do light armor, so no Annulment. The best alternate is Immovable. You have to slot in a cc/snare negating skill. Without such, you won't survive. You also have to be able to cc/snare them too; thus, the Clench, Mass Hysteria are life prolongers. I also slot Cripple on one bar and Swallow Soul on the other; this way, you get the Majicka Flood passive up on both bars. Plus, the Cippling Grasp does come in handy in zerg vs zerg fights. Also, to me, even though Vigor is barely half as efficient for mag than stam, I still have to slot it. Vigor is a saving grace after being hit by a siege weapon. For PvE, definitely, I have Leeching Strikes and Merciless Resolve and Refreshing Path slotted, but unfortunately can't fit it in for PvP. Swallow Soul and Vigor are the go-to for health regen hopeful. Also, for ultimate, the Incap is a must one bar, and I may drop Shooting Star or Eye of the Storm on the other; depends on the mode. However, in a zerg v. zerg fight, I drop in the Aggressive Horn.

As far as the monster pieces, if the Pirate and Chudan works for you, I'm not going to knock it. For me, as a range toon, the Skoria pieces (although, it doesn't proc as much as in PvE) was a life saver in few occasions where the proc was the killing blow. Particularly, in zerg vs zerg fights, I can be blasting away from range, while using DoTs like Clench, Crippling, and it will proc here and there, which does help a bit. Still, definitely, I have a harder time against DKs while 1vX. They have higher resistance capable build and that damn stam-based Vigor. Very nice when I'm on my stam toon, but not as much as a Mag going up against a high resist DK or any high resist stam toon sporting Vigor. Hell, even StamBlade are rolling around in heavy armor and Vigor; high resist and high self-heal, yeah, it is rougher fight. Seems like everyone and their dogs are rolling around with heavy and even resto. I was also having a hell of a time taking down a mag who kept on spamming resto healing; plus, I think that toon was also sporting heavy.

Damn you're not slotting two of the absolute must haves for me on a destro resto build. Mercy bow, I don't understand how you kill anything without this skill unless you run them out of resources. And siphon i cant imagine running without if, the mag regen and the heals from the weave coupled with swallow souls heals are just too nice for me to pass up.

To each his own though

GreenhaloX

Datthaw wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

My bad, man. This is a pretty big thread, lots of pages and information, and I'm hardly the bookworm that's able to absolve everything. However, appreciate you re-stating your build pieces; definitely a nice shortcut then having to roll back through all these pages. Anyways, I use the hell of Refreshing Path for PvE, but it just doesn't seem to fit in for me in PvP. If you're going against 1, 2 or 3 and everybody rolling and hopping around like bunny rabbits in every which way directions, that straight and narrow Refreshing Path isn't helping much. It's not so easy to stay within the path. Oh sure, you may get a couple ticks of 1-2k health back after leaving the path, but that's hardly the help when you're getting 4 to 8k damage hits thrown at you. Oh yeah, it works very well in PvE where the adds and bosses are full frontal right on you. I used to slot it for PvP and works great throwing it onto the group that are bum rushing the doorway of the keep or outpost, but I find myself in more 1vX fight, then being in a zerg. So, I have to forgo that for something better useful for me.

For any class or players, there are just certain must haves and nice to have skills/abilities. Since I'm range staff MagBlade for PvP, Destructive Clench is one must have. Incap Strike, Lotus Fan, Disguise, Swallow Soul, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, and Mass Hysteria are the other must haves. I would love to be able to also in Leeching Strike, Merciless Resolve, and Sap Essence, but I can't fit that in for PvP. I don't do light armor, so no Annulment. The best alternate is Immovable. You have to slot in a cc/snare negating skill. Without such, you won't survive. You also have to be able to cc/snare them too; thus, the Clench, Mass Hysteria are life prolongers. I also slot Cripple on one bar and Swallow Soul on the other; this way, you get the Majicka Flood passive up on both bars. Plus, the Cippling Grasp does come in handy in zerg vs zerg fights. Also, to me, even though Vigor is barely half as efficient for mag than stam, I still have to slot it. Vigor is a saving grace after being hit by a siege weapon. For PvE, definitely, I have Leeching Strikes and Merciless Resolve and Refreshing Path slotted, but unfortunately can't fit it in for PvP. Swallow Soul and Vigor are the go-to for health regen hopeful. Also, for ultimate, the Incap is a must one bar, and I may drop Shooting Star or Eye of the Storm on the other; depends on the mode. However, in a zerg v. zerg fight, I drop in the Aggressive Horn.

As far as the monster pieces, if the Pirate and Chudan works for you, I'm not going to knock it. For me, as a range toon, the Skoria pieces (although, it doesn't proc as much as in PvE) was a life saver in few occasions where the proc was the killing blow. Particularly, in zerg vs zerg fights, I can be blasting away from range, while using DoTs like Clench, Crippling, and it will proc here and there, which does help a bit. Still, definitely, I have a harder time against DKs while 1vX. They have higher resistance capable build and that damn stam-based Vigor. Very nice when I'm on my stam toon, but not as much as a Mag going up against a high resist DK or any high resist stam toon sporting Vigor. Hell, even StamBlade are rolling around in heavy armor and Vigor; high resist and high self-heal, yeah, it is rougher fight. Seems like everyone and their dogs are rolling around with heavy and even resto. I was also having a hell of a time taking down a mag who kept on spamming resto healing; plus, I think that toon was also sporting heavy.

Damn you're not slotting two of the absolute must haves for me on a destro resto build. Mercy bow, I don't understand how you kill anything without this skill unless you run them out of resources. And siphon i cant imagine running without if, the mag regen and the heals from the weave coupled with swallow souls heals are just too nice for me to pass up.

To each his own though

Yeah, I hear you. Like I said, I would love to slot in Merciless and Siphoning (not Leeching, by the way, as I mistyped previously.) The only way I could, if I get rid of the Shadow Disguise or Piercing Mark, Concealed Weapon or Destructive Clench, but these are just too crucial to me and outweigh Merciless and Siphoning. I'm still able to win some with what I have. If you think about it. You're going up against another NB who buffs up with Merciless or whatever that stam morph is and also buffs up with Siphoning or Leeching. It's a matter of who gets who first. Sure, if I forget to pop immovable and you stun me and I'm busy trying to break free while you're pommeling me; however, if I pop Mass Hysteria, Crippling or knocks you back with Clench and hit you with Lotus, Concealed Weapon and Incap and/or Swallowing Soul, and you're unable to break free, you can surely be toasted. This is without Merciless or Siphoning, which I have bested quite a few here and there. Initially, I had both the Merciless and Siphoning slotted, but I have been surviving 1 on 1 more and actually have been winning against 2 here and there. I still consider myself probably an average Joe in PvP, but I'm surviving more and winning a bit more. Pretty much when I die while 1 on 1 or 1 on 2 is when his buddy pommels me with lethal Arrow or Poison Injection from a distance or then I get ran over by his incoming 4 and more zerg buddies.

Metemsycosis

Trashs1 wrote: »

Metemsycosis wrote: »

Melee bar set ups
Precise julianos + Amber + skoria

Dw: lotus fan/cripple, cloak, concealed, merciless/fear/cripple, impale, incap
Resto: degeneration, refreshing path, mist, ward, harness, soul tether

I work my burst around skoria and try to get it on cool down. Twisting path would be better damage, the healing is irrelevant mostly, but I use refreshing to proc transmutation on another setup and don't feel like changing it. If I want cripple and lotus fan I drop merciless resolve, otherwise keep it.

how can u survive with only dmg and sustain sets in melee.... this will be ever a misterium for me..

look at my mage pal.. wizards riposte+pirate skeleton is best for me to go in melee range

I've been playing since release on console. Ik that's vague but my experience helps so much. CP helps too, because i can pad my ability to not get hit at all. Block, dodge, sneak cost reduction without using snb or medium armor. This has been a focus of mine since the beginning because light armor, outside of 'defensive sets,' is obviously squishy. Plus if you play with well timed aggression there's no real need to have high defenses as your opponent will be defending themselves not attacking.

ETA: my stats are like 38k max Magicka, 10k Stam, 22k health. 2k unbuffed spell damage, 2300 mag recovery, 1100 Stam recovery. On that build virtually no resists and no crit resist. I use dodge roll liberally with harness, healing ward, and elusive mist. If somehow I get stuck and have to take hits I'll likely die but I rarely get stuck. Catch my drift?

Metemsycosis

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

GreenhaloX wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

The more I think about it the more I feel like 1 pirate + 1 chudan is great but only one of either is nothing =/
(for light armor builds, maybe in heavy armor builds it matters more)
3k seems like a lot but I was leagues better off dueling a magdk when I was using grothdar so since I'm so dmg heavy I'm going to try grothdar open world again.
I think the amount of pressure it allows you to put on people(when you have a dmg heavy build) is the best mitigation of all ie... them running away & not dpsing you

I feel like resistances are more worth while the closer you are to cap. Meaning that if you have 25k and you do something to add another 3k it seems worth it but if you're at 10k and you add 3k it just feels meh(blah)

If you're just running around light or medium with 10-13k resistance, I'm not too certain you will fair too well against a MagDK or a StamDK who keeps on spamming Dizzying Swing and Executioner. If you're a MagBlade sporting 25k resistance with heavy, that's impressive, but then, how's the spell damage or dps? You're likely sacrificing some other resource pool to get that high of resistance. I haven't got my MagBlade down yet, but still working on it. It's hard to find a good balance build where you can have maj close to the 40k and Spell dmg in the 2k, while having sustain in the 2k. For me, I have to sacrifice recovery so to have my maj pool and damage up. You may be able to sport a build with 40k majicka and 3k recovery, but you're likely jabbing the enemy with an unsharpened knife.

I've done well against dk's even with having 10-12k resistances because i've been using refreshing path, forward momentum, grothdarr, and keeping fear up on their cc immunity cooldown

With the 25k+ resistance build I was wearing 5 light with that one too
but you're right damage was sacrificed a small amount

It's really not hard at all to get the stats you speak about, what's hard is getting penetration, sustain, and damage on heavy armor; but I listed a build above that should cover it.

I'm not sure how or what sets/build you are using that is giving you 25k+ resistance with 5 x light. That is just impressive that you say you have that stat. PvE-wise, I'm pretty much a heavy (HA) armor guy and run all HA sets on all my toons, both mag and stam. It's just because I mostly solo PvE, except for trials, of course. Even then, my best stam has about 22k spell and 18k physical, with all maxed class passives. I've tried light and medium sets, but the spell/phys resist are just horrible; for soloing, at least. I'm barely breaking 15K with medium. Particularly, in PvP, where you are practically using all impen, I can't bite how a light set is getting that high of resist. Unless, you're using that crazy CWC set, what is it, Temper Brass, I think, or Pariah. Those are the only two comes to mind which can offer high resist. However, with such high resist, you're sacrificing other resources pool, like majicka, damage and recovery.

Actually, I have 6 stam toons (that include a StamBlade) that made it to Legionary. Well, I'm not really, I guess you can say hardcore, or an avid PvPer. I practically just took those toons into PvP to get Vigor and Caltrops. So, all are just sitting as Legionary. I like the Stamblade, so, I decided to create a MagBlade just for giggle and grins. I also have mag and stamsorc which both are brutal for PvEing. So, I figured, a MagBlade shouldn't be that bad. Well, my current MagBlade has so far gone farther in PvP than any other of my toons. I have so far made it to Lieutenant with this MagBlade. Again, I'm practically a soloist for PvP. Of course, you have to join in a zerg when you run into one, but, while traveling about, I'm a soloist. So, when I run into those other soloist or smaller gank group, I have killed and also been killed.

I'm still no way considered a good PvPer, but this thread has helped me out and gave me some ideas to better myself. The problem I see with MagBlade, at least for me, is self-healing and maj recovery. I have tried many different builds. I had ran with one that has over 2k maj recovery, but sacrificed my maj pool to around 35k. I practically had to enchant all gold maj recovery glyphs, so, my spell dam was really low, though. I wasn't killing much, and was getting my ass handed back to me a lot. After playing with different sets and build, I am currently running all all spell dam glyphs and a set combo that gives just maj and spell damage passives. I'm sitting around 41k maj and 2.2k spell dam (unbuff), but my maj recovery is crap. My spell resist is around 20k and phys around 17k (unbuff.) However, I find that I am surviving more and winning a bit more duels with this setup.

The only problem I have is against DKs. I know, because I run stam and MagDK in PvE, and the only diff for PvP, is you're sporting impen versus infused/divines for PvE. Particularly, those 2H and running HA sets. I been losing more to this DKs, although, I would win here and there. Usually, though, when I'm winning, they would just scamp away. I hate it when other toons/players run away chicken when they are losing and about to die. Anyways, a lot of those DKs, I'm not sure what build they are sporting, though. The ones, I mean, I popping Lotus Fan, Concealed Weapon, Piercing Mark, Incap strikes, Soul Harvest, Mass Hysteria; you name it, all the arsenal that a MagBlade has. I'm also throwing the kitchen sink at them, but they seem to survive. Particularly, when they pop that Vigor. That's pretty much gets me. I'm almost depleted my maj pool throwing everything at them and almost killing them, then they pop that damn Vigor.

Damn, stam can get a good 12-14k healing back; plus the Rally or Momentum they pretty much are back at full health. However, a MagBlade, we only getting about 5k back. I'm also popping Swallow Soul, but getting health recovery doesn't fair as well as I would like. I tried using Refreshing Path; oh sure, it's great for a zerg or a group, but doesn't help much when you're fighting one or two by yourself. I have been able to take out one or two other toons by myself, but I always seem to have trouble with the DKs, because of the good damn stam-based Vigor. My death recap, I'm seeing 5k Dizzying Swing and 7k Executioner and other 6k hits. With strike stats like that from the 2H, and their good self-healing, how the hell are you suppose to win with a MagBlade? I mean, damn, I'm killing world bosses by myself in PvE, but one DK is a freaking handful in PvP. There is something not right about PvP. Ha ha.

Bottom line.. what I'm seeing in PvP is, sure good sets/build helps and higher recovery may aid as well, but it all comes down to who has the higher damage outputs with better self-healing. I mean, with my StamBlade with the Vigor, Ambush, Surprise Attack, Shrouded Daggar, Piercing Mark and Poison Injection, I was tearing up DKs. However, with this MagBlade, because of it lower self-healing, I'm not fairing too well against toons with high resistance.

I think you may have misunderstood me, when I say 25k+ resistance I mean fully buffed.
I explained it earlier in this thread, gotta read everything man. 1 pirate, 1 chudan, blessing of restoration, 8% damage mitigation from cloak, and shadow passives; thow back bar wizard riposte on top & it's pretty tanky in 5 light.

For damage, 2k unbuffed is generally enough.
By the way, you're using refreshing path wrong, you gotta stand in it so the heals will tick on you and it will also damage your opponent if they come near you.
What platform do you play on? If pc na I can definitely help you out man

My bad, man. This is a pretty big thread, lots of pages and information, and I'm hardly the bookworm that's able to absolve everything. However, appreciate you re-stating your build pieces; definitely a nice shortcut then having to roll back through all these pages. Anyways, I use the hell of Refreshing Path for PvE, but it just doesn't seem to fit in for me in PvP. If you're going against 1, 2 or 3 and everybody rolling and hopping around like bunny rabbits in every which way directions, that straight and narrow Refreshing Path isn't helping much. It's not so easy to stay within the path. Oh sure, you may get a couple ticks of 1-2k health back after leaving the path, but that's hardly the help when you're getting 4 to 8k damage hits thrown at you. Oh yeah, it works very well in PvE where the adds and bosses are full frontal right on you. I used to slot it for PvP and works great throwing it onto the group that are bum rushing the doorway of the keep or outpost, but I find myself in more 1vX fight, then being in a zerg. So, I have to forgo that for something better useful for me.

If u use skoria and transmutation on the same build, refreshing path help proc both.

Kode

Metemsycosis wrote: »

I've been playing since release on console. Ik that's vague but my experience helps so much. CP helps too, because i can pad my ability to not get hit at all. Block, dodge, sneak cost reduction without using snb or medium armor. This has been a focus of mine since the beginning because light armor, outside of 'defensive sets,' is obviously squishy. Plus if you play with well timed aggression there's no real need to have high defenses as your opponent will be defending themselves not attacking.

ETA: my stats are like 38k max Magicka, 10k Stam, 22k health. 2k unbuffed spell damage, 2300 mag recovery, 1100 Stam recovery. On that build virtually no resists and no crit resist. I use dodge roll liberally with harness, healing ward, and elusive mist. If somehow I get stuck and have to take hits I'll likely die but I rarely get stuck. Catch my drift?

I use similar sets and it works well, however I switch a little more between ranged and melee, with more emphasis on ranged. I don't use harness which is where you are gaining some of your sustain in melee. The biggest problem I can see is that if you get too much pressure you need to disengage rather than restack shields because your shields won't be large enough to come back.
I'm not saying it isn't viable, because I'm sure it is possible and is probably a lot of fun.

Each of us has a play style that they work best with. My advice to anyone is learn from others, but don't copy them.

kaithuzar

It's kind of a tough decision for monster helms because Skoria is obviously over powered but I just don't feel like we can utilize it as well as magdk's can.
You really need something more than cripple, I guess if you are using entropy or path or wall of elements; 2 or 3 of those skills combined then it's really good. But if you can't fit 2 or 3 of those abilities on your bar idk if it's worth it.
But maybe the best way IS to fit 2-3 of those abilities as it's so over powered.
Generally speaking though, a lot of you guys are correct that if you're destro/resto you probably should play at ranged & not use a gap closer, and slot flame clench instead of fear, but I've always liked the melee playstyle better as it makes me feel like less of a "sorc wannabe". You can combine melee/ranged styles which I've often done, but thinking back it probably does play somewhat weaker as you're not really great at any one thing, you're just OK at a lot of things.

Nebbles

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Kode

kaithuzar wrote: »

It's kind of a tough decision for monster helms because Skoria is obviously over powered but I just don't feel like we can utilize it as well as magdk's can.
You really need something more than cripple, I guess if you are using entropy or path or wall of elements; 2 or 3 of those skills combined then it's really good. But if you can't fit 2 or 3 of those abilities on your bar idk if it's worth it.
But maybe the best way IS to fit 2-3 of those abilities as it's so over powered.
Generally speaking though, a lot of you guys are correct that if you're destro/resto you probably should play at ranged & not use a gap closer, and slot flame clench instead of fear, but I've always liked the melee playstyle better as it makes me feel like less of a "sorc wannabe". You can combine melee/ranged styles which I've often done, but thinking back it probably does play somewhat weaker as you're not really great at any one thing, you're just OK at a lot of things.

I think to be a sorc-wanna-be, you have to try to emulate the way sorcs fight... I don't recommend that. I think it is pretty easy to outplay a sorc on a nightblade. But if you try to shoot it out with one... you dead. That is where Nightblade diversity comes in. I think being versatile makes you stronger, not weaker. When someone wants to range me, I can get in close. When they want to melee me, I get out. If there is one thing Nightblades do well, it is versatility.

I made a sorc pretty mad. He got all but-hurt because I "ganked" him... So when I seen him again, I stood out in the open buffing. He ran for me and I cloaked into an opener combination and downed him almost as quickly as the "gank". He didn't say anything after that, but I am sure to him it was still ganking because I didn't stand there and let him burst me.

Datthaw

kaithuzar wrote: »

It's kind of a tough decision for monster helms because Skoria is obviously over powered but I just don't feel like we can utilize it as well as magdk's can.
You really need something more than cripple, I guess if you are using entropy or path or wall of elements; 2 or 3 of those skills combined then it's really good. But if you can't fit 2 or 3 of those abilities on your bar idk if it's worth it.
But maybe the best way IS to fit 2-3 of those abilities as it's so over powered.
Generally speaking though, a lot of you guys are correct that if you're destro/resto you probably should play at ranged & not use a gap closer, and slot flame clench instead of fear, but I've always liked the melee playstyle better as it makes me feel like less of a "sorc wannabe". You can combine melee/ranged styles which I've often done, but thinking back it probably does play somewhat weaker as you're not really great at any one thing, you're just OK at a lot of things.

Skoria is amazing on destro resto, you have 3 consistent dots at all times. Flame reach, cripple and degeneration, they proc skoria very well. As far as offensive monster sets it's gotta be the best

kaithuzar

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

Trashs1

kaithuzar wrote: »

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

wait what? nooo!

all nirn frontbar if not torugs pakt!

sharp does kinda 0.5% more dmg but nirn also affects your healing. dont hear on the preposter!

@kaithuzar plz dont give advices if u dont know the mechanics well....

Calboy

Infused all day for me

kaithuzar

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

wait what? nooo!

all nirn frontbar if not torugs pakt!

sharp does kinda 0.5% more dmg but nirn also affects your healing. dont hear on the preposter!

@kaithuzar plz dont give advices if u dont know the mechanics well....

@Trashs1 plz don't belittle me if you have no idea who you're talking to.

I'm very well aware that spell damage affects healing but he also didn't go into his playstyle or bar setup.
Even then I still recommend sharpened as I'm currently running around with 15k pen, 3k buffed dmg & decimating people.

Trashs1

kaithuzar wrote: »

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

wait what? nooo!

all nirn frontbar if not torugs pakt!

sharp does kinda 0.5% more dmg but nirn also affects your healing. dont hear on the preposter!

@kaithuzar plz dont give advices if u dont know the mechanics well....

@Trashs1 plz don't belittle me if you have no idea who you're talking to.

I'm very well aware that spell damage affects healing but he also didn't go into his playstyle or bar setup.
Even then I still recommend sharpened as I'm currently running around with 15k pen, 3k buffed dmg & decimating people.

i didnt want to offend you and 15k pen is nice ofc. but take in your mind also shields which this penetration does nothing for. nirn is allways the better choice.

Koensol

What do you guys think of running War Maiden front bar + Lich back bar + 2 pirate skelly, destro + resto 5L2H?

Currently running a group support healing magblade with 5 riposte, 5 trans and 2 pirate skelly. Amazing support and very tanky. I also want to play more in solo with it, and I found that it can kill just fine as well if you land combo's, but against more competent players the damage just isn't there. So I switched to 5 war maiden, 5 trans, 2 pirate skelly. Its okay in duels, but I feel at 1600 my sustain could use some help. Running siphoning strikes and ele drain helps, but it just doesn't feel optimal.

Any tips? I prefer staying with pirate skelly as I absolutely love it. Skoria feels meh on magblade when compares to magplar or magdk. Especially since I don't use clench, but in stead go more in melee range with fear + soul harvest + will combo's. And what do you think about running impale?

Adenoma

I don't have a bar slot for impale unless I run spell power + crit potions. It definitely devalues Skoria for what I'm running to do that - I end up losing the DOT from degeneration.

For no-CP I've been enjoying 5x overwhelming/transmutation/2x Skoria. Running elemental drain and mass hysteria for my CC and it lets me sustain really well.

Trashs1

Adenoma wrote: »

I don't have a bar slot for impale unless I run spell power + crit potions. It definitely devalues Skoria for what I'm running to do that - I end up losing the DOT from degeneration.

For no-CP I've been enjoying 5x overwhelming/transmutation/2x Skoria. Running elemental drain and mass hysteria for my CC and it lets me sustain really well.

surge is kinda interesting. i used it for some months on my mageplar.

im going to try something different after next patch comes life

either infused torugs+ lich backbar + monsterset or torugs and the new magica proc set+ 1 domihaus

kaithuzar

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

wait what? nooo!

all nirn frontbar if not torugs pakt!

sharp does kinda 0.5% more dmg but nirn also affects your healing. dont hear on the preposter!

@kaithuzar plz dont give advices if u dont know the mechanics well....

@Trashs1 plz don't belittle me if you have no idea who you're talking to.

I'm very well aware that spell damage affects healing but he also didn't go into his playstyle or bar setup.
Even then I still recommend sharpened as I'm currently running around with 15k pen, 3k buffed dmg & decimating people.

i didnt want to offend you and 15k pen is nice ofc. but take in your mind also shields which this penetration does nothing for. nirn is allways the better choice.

Of course I have heard that argument & made that argument in the past. I now side with SypherPK & KenaPK that "shields are not up forever, & in that instant, whether through fear, etc... they're going down."

I am pretty sure I actually explained this earlier if you had read the whole thread.

Trashs1

kaithuzar wrote: »

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

wait what? nooo!

all nirn frontbar if not torugs pakt!

sharp does kinda 0.5% more dmg but nirn also affects your healing. dont hear on the preposter!

@kaithuzar plz dont give advices if u dont know the mechanics well....

@Trashs1 plz don't belittle me if you have no idea who you're talking to.

I'm very well aware that spell damage affects healing but he also didn't go into his playstyle or bar setup.
Even then I still recommend sharpened as I'm currently running around with 15k pen, 3k buffed dmg & decimating people.

i didnt want to offend you and 15k pen is nice ofc. but take in your mind also shields which this penetration does nothing for. nirn is allways the better choice.

Of course I have heard that argument & made that argument in the past. I now side with SypherPK & KenaPK that "shields are not up forever, & in that instant, whether through fear, etc... they're going down."

I am pretty sure I actually explained this earlier if you had read the whole thread.

yes i also feel in my personal experience, as a no cp only player, that shields got less an issue than in the past.

this topic is a way to long to get all the information out here... if only someone had the time/pasion to make a mageblade faq ^^

Vermintide

I wish fear had more range. So useful, but you have to be right on top of someone... Also how do we feel that AOE caps are going away, but fear is still only gonna hit two people?

Subversus

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Trashs1 wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

Nebbles wrote: »

Hey all,

Been reading this thread and got a lot of great info from it. Thought I might put my quick question in here.

Destro/Resto magnb, full lightarmor, only play no-cp campaigns. Not too much of a min maxer, all those numbers hurt my head.

So, I finally got a destro staff to finish my build. Its training so I have to change its trait. In the past, sharpened was always the one to go for (Ive returned after a long break). But now I hear that infused or nirn could be better.

So, before I spend my currency on changing traits, any sage advice? Sharpened, nirm, infused (with what enchant?).

Im a simple man, so no need to overly explain why. Just trying to get viewpoints. Thanks!

Sharpened is still the way to go imo for many builds. If you're using spinners then you can probably go nirn, I would only go infused if you are using that torugs pact build.

wait what? nooo!

all nirn frontbar if not torugs pakt!

sharp does kinda 0.5% more dmg but nirn also affects your healing. dont hear on the preposter!

@kaithuzar plz dont give advices if u dont know the mechanics well....

@Trashs1 plz don't belittle me if you have no idea who you're talking to.

I'm very well aware that spell damage affects healing but he also didn't go into his playstyle or bar setup.
Even then I still recommend sharpened as I'm currently running around with 15k pen, 3k buffed dmg & decimating people.

i didnt want to offend you and 15k pen is nice ofc. but take in your mind also shields which this penetration does nothing for. nirn is allways the better choice.

I do agree here, nirn will ALWAYS be the better choice for magblade pvp period. The class is not a burst class or whatever, the strengths come in healing a lot. If you don't play around those strengths why are you even playing magblade at this point.