Both Stam and magicka wardens are op

leepalmer95

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Everyone complains on the forums that magplar and DK have been over-nerfed because of overzealous forum QQ, and we all beg ZOS to restore magplar and DK to some of their former glory. But then we turn around and cry about wardens in exactly the same way we used to cry about magplars and DKs. What wardens need is a tweak, not a major, across-the-board nerf like magplars and DKs have received.

The key to balancing wardens without over-nerfing them, IMO, is Shimmering Shield. This skill needs the Wings treatment: it needs to become slightly less useful and significantly more expensive. Its magicka return needs to be removed and its cost needs to be the same as or greater than DKs' Wings. As is, this skill is simply too powerful for its functional cost: it gives the warden Major Heroism and virtual immunity to ranged builds for barely over 1000 magicka, meaning even stamina Wardens have virtually no opportunity cost for casting it.

I predict that if Shimmering Shield became significantly more costly, so that a pressured warden (and especially a pressured stamina warden) would have to seriously consider whether casting it was worth the cost, TTK on wardens would noticeably decrease, without impairing wardens to the extent that magplars and DKs have been impaired by over-nerfing.

You want to nerf Shield, but Reflective Scales actually has some big bonuses over Shield. 35% damage and extra projectile or 2% damage reduction and extra projectile.

Cost 3780 mag, reflects 4 projectiles, last 6 seconds, get Minor Ward
Cost 3780 mag, reflects 4 projectiles, last 6 seconds, does 35% additional damage

Cost 2701 mag, reflects 3 projectiles, last 6 seconds, does Icy bolt
Cost 2432 mag, reflects 3 projectiles, last 6 seconds, get 578 magicka return and Major Heroism

You need to understand the skills more.

The 35% extra dmg isn't that good, the only skill i see and actual noticeable amount of dmg is frags and even then its not high.

Everyone takes the shimmering morph and most people take the dmg morph so i'll compare them two.

3780 is a lot more expensive than 2432, a lot more. The actual cost for shimmering with the return is 678.... thats stupid cheap.

Shimmering also absorbs and doesn't reflect this means it works on skills that aren't reflectable like crushing shock/ warden pigeon. Thats a big important difference.

Finally major heroism is a very strong buff and it shouldn't be that easy to obtain. In order for other classes to get minor heroism which is a lot weaker they need to use a set or slot heroic slash.
Honestly whoever decided wardens need major heroism should be took off the balancing team.

Waffennacht

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Everyone complains on the forums that magplar and DK have been over-nerfed because of overzealous forum QQ, and we all beg ZOS to restore magplar and DK to some of their former glory. But then we turn around and cry about wardens in exactly the same way we used to cry about magplars and DKs. What wardens need is a tweak, not a major, across-the-board nerf like magplars and DKs have received.

The key to balancing wardens without over-nerfing them, IMO, is Shimmering Shield. This skill needs the Wings treatment: it needs to become slightly less useful and significantly more expensive. Its magicka return needs to be removed and its cost needs to be the same as or greater than DKs' Wings. As is, this skill is simply too powerful for its functional cost: it gives the warden Major Heroism and virtual immunity to ranged builds for barely over 1000 magicka, meaning even stamina Wardens have virtually no opportunity cost for casting it.

I predict that if Shimmering Shield became significantly more costly, so that a pressured warden (and especially a pressured stamina warden) would have to seriously consider whether casting it was worth the cost, TTK on wardens would noticeably decrease, without impairing wardens to the extent that magplars and DKs have been impaired by over-nerfing.

You want to nerf Shield, but Reflective Scales actually has some big bonuses over Shield. 35% damage and extra projectile or 2% damage reduction and extra projectile.

Cost 3780 mag, reflects 4 projectiles, last 6 seconds, get Minor Ward
Cost 3780 mag, reflects 4 projectiles, last 6 seconds, does 35% additional damage

Cost 2701 mag, reflects 3 projectiles, last 6 seconds, does Icy bolt
Cost 2432 mag, reflects 3 projectiles, last 6 seconds, get 578 magicka return and Major Heroism

You need to understand the skills more.

The 35% extra dmg isn't that good, the only skill i see and actual noticeable amount of dmg is frags and even then its not high.

Everyone takes the shimmering morph and most people take the dmg morph so i'll compare them two.

3780 is a lot more expensive than 2432, a lot more. The actual cost for shimmering with the return is 678.... thats stupid cheap.

Shimmering also absorbs and doesn't reflect this means it works on skills that aren't reflectable like crushing shock/ warden pigeon. Thats a big important difference.

Finally major heroism is a very strong buff and it shouldn't be that easy to obtain. In order for other classes to get minor heroism which is a lot weaker they need to use a set or slot heroic slash.
Honestly whoever decided wardens need major heroism should be took off the balancing team.

Drop to 20% heal, you get Major heroism

The slabs only absorb a certain amount of damage

leepalmer95

Waffennacht wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Maura_Neysa wrote: »

casparian wrote: »

Everyone complains on the forums that magplar and DK have been over-nerfed because of overzealous forum QQ, and we all beg ZOS to restore magplar and DK to some of their former glory. But then we turn around and cry about wardens in exactly the same way we used to cry about magplars and DKs. What wardens need is a tweak, not a major, across-the-board nerf like magplars and DKs have received.

The key to balancing wardens without over-nerfing them, IMO, is Shimmering Shield. This skill needs the Wings treatment: it needs to become slightly less useful and significantly more expensive. Its magicka return needs to be removed and its cost needs to be the same as or greater than DKs' Wings. As is, this skill is simply too powerful for its functional cost: it gives the warden Major Heroism and virtual immunity to ranged builds for barely over 1000 magicka, meaning even stamina Wardens have virtually no opportunity cost for casting it.

I predict that if Shimmering Shield became significantly more costly, so that a pressured warden (and especially a pressured stamina warden) would have to seriously consider whether casting it was worth the cost, TTK on wardens would noticeably decrease, without impairing wardens to the extent that magplars and DKs have been impaired by over-nerfing.

You want to nerf Shield, but Reflective Scales actually has some big bonuses over Shield. 35% damage and extra projectile or 2% damage reduction and extra projectile.

Cost 3780 mag, reflects 4 projectiles, last 6 seconds, get Minor Ward
Cost 3780 mag, reflects 4 projectiles, last 6 seconds, does 35% additional damage

Cost 2701 mag, reflects 3 projectiles, last 6 seconds, does Icy bolt
Cost 2432 mag, reflects 3 projectiles, last 6 seconds, get 578 magicka return and Major Heroism

You need to understand the skills more.

The 35% extra dmg isn't that good, the only skill i see and actual noticeable amount of dmg is frags and even then its not high.

Everyone takes the shimmering morph and most people take the dmg morph so i'll compare them two.

3780 is a lot more expensive than 2432, a lot more. The actual cost for shimmering with the return is 678.... thats stupid cheap.

Shimmering also absorbs and doesn't reflect this means it works on skills that aren't reflectable like crushing shock/ warden pigeon. Thats a big important difference.

Finally major heroism is a very strong buff and it shouldn't be that easy to obtain. In order for other classes to get minor heroism which is a lot weaker they need to use a set or slot heroic slash.
Honestly whoever decided wardens need major heroism should be took off the balancing team.

Drop to 20% heal, you get Major heroism

The slabs only absorb a certain amount of damage

E.g. the only other way to get it is too basically be dead to the point where any execute at that point will finish you.

Or you just use a skill that negates any ranged build and get it always.

Yes i know they only absorb a certain amount but the amount for them to break 2 is very unlikely to happen. It requires the projectile dmg to be stupidly high and the only skill i can think of that does it is an assassins will on a very high dmg nb.

Domander

3 things at once? Oh you mean like forward momentum, or heroic slash, or crushing shock or boundless storm or cleansing ritual or talons or cloak or

Rhaegar75

soooooooooo then....can someone suggest a good Stamina Warden build;

If you can't beat them at least I can study them; I can't join them cause I'll never betray my Magplar

Drachenfier

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

I really like having the extra healing, burst and mobility that a Stam warden offers. I do not have to spec crazy high into damage to get kills. My sword and board set up is only 3100 damage but I run three dots and have infinite recovery almost. 100 percent uptime on defile . The pressure is great.

What dots are you running on a stam warden with sword and shield?

Jjitsuboy98

Drachenfier wrote: »

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

I really like having the extra healing, burst and mobility that a Stam warden offers. I do not have to spec crazy high into damage to get kills. My sword and board set up is only 3100 damage but I run three dots and have infinite recovery almost. 100 percent uptime on defile . The pressure is great.

What dots are you running on a stam warden with sword and shield?

Well I was running viper, double dot poisons, and bleed from a 2h axe. But I swapped viper for bonepirate to get more stats. Really can't tell much difference to be honest.

On my new build I'm trying I'm running dual wield axe bleed, blood craze dot, double dot poisons. I'm not sure if blade cloak is a dot but I don't believe it is .....but I'm running that too.

Waffennacht

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

I really like having the extra healing, burst and mobility that a Stam warden offers. I do not have to spec crazy high into damage to get kills. My sword and board set up is only 3100 damage but I run three dots and have infinite recovery almost. 100 percent uptime on defile . The pressure is great.

What dots are you running on a stam warden with sword and shield?

Well I was running viper, double dot poisons, and bleed from a 2h axe. But I swapped viper for bonepirate to get more stats. Really can't tell much difference to be honest.

On my new build I'm trying I'm running dual wield axe bleed, blood craze dot, double dot poisons. I'm not sure if blade cloak is a dot but I don't believe it is .....but I'm running that too.

Whatcha using it in? Open World/BGs/Duels?

Hutch679

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Combo of harness mag (or the other morph), shimmering shield, healing ward, and living vines. Makes you have massive wards with massive healing.

Waffennacht

Hutch679 wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Combo of harness mag (or the other morph), shimmering shield, healing ward, and living vines. Makes you have massive wards with massive healing.

Which does jack @#$& against CC + 8k Surprise Attack + 8k Incap + execute in about 1 lag filled moment

Or hard CC that goes through block + 8k whip + 11k meteor through 4k impen

Hutch679

ak_pvp wrote: »

They are definitely overtuned. Shield should be more taxing, but similarly as effective. Also. make it 3 attacks per player, fek zergz.

Dive needs to be dodgable+ reflect/deflectable. Its power is in its raw damage+delayed hit.

Not sure about sub, I mean it hits ult level in heavy, but its sort of the defining feature.

Birds hit heavy armor wears for roughly 3500 non crit. That's hardly anything... and my mag warden is specced into damage (5 light, all gold necropotence and innate axiom). Still VERY difficult to kill heavy armor Templars, DKs, Mageblades, Stam wardens, and Mag sorcs. If they make the birds reflectable or dodgable, the damage needs increased by 10%-15% absolutely. Not to mention everything they do is on delay with no execute. If you survive their first burst, you have at a minimum 3 to 4secs before you even get hit again unless they spam birds which is not effective against competent heavy armor wearers. I don't believe anyone in here betching about mag wardens has even played one... gg anything heavy armor.

Jjitsuboy98

Waffennacht wrote: »

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

Drachenfier wrote: »

Jjitsuboy98 wrote: »

I really like having the extra healing, burst and mobility that a Stam warden offers. I do not have to spec crazy high into damage to get kills. My sword and board set up is only 3100 damage but I run three dots and have infinite recovery almost. 100 percent uptime on defile . The pressure is great.

What dots are you running on a stam warden with sword and shield?

Well I was running viper, double dot poisons, and bleed from a 2h axe. But I swapped viper for bonepirate to get more stats. Really can't tell much difference to be honest.

On my new build I'm trying I'm running dual wield axe bleed, blood craze dot, double dot poisons. I'm not sure if blade cloak is a dot but I don't believe it is .....but I'm running that too.

Whatcha using it in? Open World/BGs/Duels?

Solo open world. Love Stam warden solo open world. But the main reason I'm trying to change more to dots is for added pressure to supplement burst. Sometimes burst misses. Dots stick. This new setup is in medium but with impregnable, quick cloak, shuffle, and ice fortress there is a decent amount of mitigation. Not to forget Dodge roll. I'm really tempted to try skoria tonight instead of blood spawn when I get home.

technohic

Has anyone visited Dolmen groups during the double XP event?

Waffennacht

.

technohic wrote: »

Has anyone visited Dolmen groups during the double XP event?

And they will be very disappointed. Especially in the beginning.

Hutch679

Waffennacht wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Combo of harness mag (or the other morph), shimmering shield, healing ward, and living vines. Makes you have massive wards with massive healing.

Which does jack @#$& against CC + 8k Surprise Attack + 8k Incap + execute in about 1 lag filled moment

Or hard CC that goes through block + 8k whip + 11k meteor through 4k impen

This. 2 counters to mag wardens that are brutal. Stam blades that hank from stealth and Mag DKs that abuse CC and poor game mechanics thanks to Zos and the forum users who massively complained about mag DKs for months/years.

technohic

Waffennacht wrote: »

.

technohic wrote: »

Has anyone visited Dolmen groups during the double XP event?

And they will be very disappointed. Especially in the beginning.

I can only hope. I've seen some nasty ones and then a bunch of bird and insect spammers.

Waffennacht

technohic wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

.

technohic wrote: »

Has anyone visited Dolmen groups during the double XP event?

And they will be very disappointed. Especially in the beginning.

I can only hope. I've seen some nasty ones and then a bunch of bird and insect spammers.

Gonna say most rolling then now are doing so because of what they've heard. It's a really different style, takes a bit to get use to. Guessing most fotm players won't like it right away

Jjitsuboy98

Waffennacht wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

.

technohic wrote: »

Has anyone visited Dolmen groups during the double XP event?

And they will be very disappointed. Especially in the beginning.

I can only hope. I've seen some nasty ones and then a bunch of bird and insect spammers.

Gonna say most rolling then now are doing so because of what they've heard. It's a really different style, takes a bit to get use to. Guessing most fotm players won't like it right away

Took me a few days but now I love it

Destyran

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Ever been in bgs with 3 spamming birds and all their subterranean assaults go off??

Did you ever see the red mountain viper velidreth combo a few patches ago? It was the equivalent of a old magblade bomb build with proxy

Waffennacht

Destyran wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Ever been in bgs with 3 spamming birds and all their subterranean assaults go off??

Did you ever see the red mountain viper velidreth combo a few patches ago? It was the equivalent of a old magblade bomb build with proxy

Nope, but have had 2/3 leaps at our group killing everything

Ultimate_Overlord

Waffennacht wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Combo of harness mag (or the other morph), shimmering shield, healing ward, and living vines. Makes you have massive wards with massive healing.

Which does jack @#$& against CC + 8k Surprise Attack + 8k Incap + execute in about 1 lag filled moment

Or hard CC that goes through block + 8k whip + 11k meteor through 4k impen

Warden is bad cause it dies to lag and dueling dk builds as vamp. Nice

Waffennacht

Ultimate_Overlord wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Hutch679 wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Combo of harness mag (or the other morph), shimmering shield, healing ward, and living vines. Makes you have massive wards with massive healing.

Which does jack @#$& against CC + 8k Surprise Attack + 8k Incap + execute in about 1 lag filled moment

Or hard CC that goes through block + 8k whip + 11k meteor through 4k impen

Warden is bad cause it dies to lag and dueling dk builds as vamp. Nice

Bad wouldn't be my word choice. It would be sub optimal in duels. Vamp doesn't matter.

It's at best 3rd/4th place in duels. At best.

Azurya

Micah_Bayer wrote: »

Well yes..its another nerf sor..i mean whoa..wait what? Okay well let's get to the basics, wardens have some skills that literally do three things as once..They are extremely versatile, you can be bad and still be great at warden. How about you nerf them in the pvp aspect and start buffing them in pve? That way you can stop the.."Oh they suck in pve so they have to be good somewhere like pvp.." Yes well not God's who can't die thank you very much.

you are a pain in the .....
just trying to get a nerf for all that bothers you, L2P
for example sorc are running around with herds of pets, nobody cares
NB can sneak, few like you care

ppl like you we have to thank for all those balancing, nerfing and whatelse is wrecking this game!

IT IS NORMAL TO DIE IN PVP, GET IT IN YOUR BRAIN!!!

Takes-No-Prisoner

Waffennacht wrote: »

technohic wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

.

technohic wrote: »

Has anyone visited Dolmen groups during the double XP event?

And they will be very disappointed. Especially in the beginning.

I can only hope. I've seen some nasty ones and then a bunch of bird and insect spammers.

Gonna say most rolling then now are doing so because of what they've heard. It's a really different style, takes a bit to get use to. Guessing most fotm players won't like it right away

Yup, I made my 3rd one for another alliance. It is not a brain dead spec, timing and execution is pretty vital to playing the class successfully.

BohnT

Azurya wrote: »

Micah_Bayer wrote: »

Well yes..its another nerf sor..i mean whoa..wait what? Okay well let's get to the basics, wardens have some skills that literally do three things as once..They are extremely versatile, you can be bad and still be great at warden. How about you nerf them in the pvp aspect and start buffing them in pve? That way you can stop the.."Oh they suck in pve so they have to be good somewhere like pvp.." Yes well not God's who can't die thank you very much.

you are a pain in the .....
just trying to get a nerf for all that bothers you, L2P
for example sorc are running around with herds of pets, nobody cares
NB can sneak, few like you care

ppl like you we have to thank for all those balancing, nerfing and whatelse is wrecking this game!

IT IS NORMAL TO DIE IN PVP, GET IT IN YOUR BRAIN!!!

You should never tell someone to L2P when you run in a 50+ zerg and do nothing else than spamming birds and Soulassault but still die to one burst attempt of a stamplar.

Warden is OP.
You can ignore all ranged builds while getting the best ult regen in the game with a skill that costs you almost nothing, a ranged spammable that deals more damage than Suprise attack while being undodgeable.
Just for slotting your sustain Tool, your nuke and your spammable you get free 6% damage dealt.
Then you get a cheap way of 10 seconds of major expedition + minor beserk.
Your AoE nuke ignores LoS, z-axis and block while applying major fracture
You get the best stam based heal in the game which applies even more buffs and can give you major mending.

Waffennacht wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Ever been in bgs with 3 spamming birds and all their subterranean assaults go off??

Did you ever see the red mountain viper velidreth combo a few patches ago? It was the equivalent of a old magblade bomb build with proxy

Nope, but have had 2/3 leaps at our group killing everything

A blockable ult with a smaller damage area that can't be used every 3 seconds vs a aoe nuke that ignores block and can be mixed with another skill
I can't decide what i should choose

Waffennacht

BohnT wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

Micah_Bayer wrote: »

Well yes..its another nerf sor..i mean whoa..wait what? Okay well let's get to the basics, wardens have some skills that literally do three things as once..They are extremely versatile, you can be bad and still be great at warden. How about you nerf them in the pvp aspect and start buffing them in pve? That way you can stop the.."Oh they suck in pve so they have to be good somewhere like pvp.." Yes well not God's who can't die thank you very much.

you are a pain in the .....
just trying to get a nerf for all that bothers you, L2P
for example sorc are running around with herds of pets, nobody cares
NB can sneak, few like you care

ppl like you we have to thank for all those balancing, nerfing and whatelse is wrecking this game!

IT IS NORMAL TO DIE IN PVP, GET IT IN YOUR BRAIN!!!

You should never tell someone to L2P when you run in a 50+ zerg and do nothing else than spamming birds and Soulassault but still die to one burst attempt of a stamplar.

Warden is OP.
You can ignore all ranged builds while getting the best ult regen in the game with a skill that costs you almost nothing, a ranged spammable that deals more damage than Suprise attack while being undodgeable.
Just for slotting your sustain Tool, your nuke and your spammable you get free 6% damage dealt.
Then you get a cheap way of 10 seconds of major expedition + minor beserk.
Your AoE nuke ignores LoS, z-axis and block while applying major fracture
You get the best stam based heal in the game which applies even more buffs and can give you major mending.

Waffennacht wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Ever been in bgs with 3 spamming birds and all their subterranean assaults go off??

Did you ever see the red mountain viper velidreth combo a few patches ago? It was the equivalent of a old magblade bomb build with proxy

Nope, but have had 2/3 leaps at our group killing everything

A blockable ult with a smaller damage area that can't be used every 3 seconds vs a aoe nuke that ignores block and can be mixed with another skill
I can't decide what i should choose

What's unblockable? Cuz it's not n storm/Permafrost, because they are.

Edit: oh you're comparing leap to Sub Assault. Well I would then compare whips to Permafrost and raise you Talons

BohnT

Waffennacht wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

Micah_Bayer wrote: »

Well yes..its another nerf sor..i mean whoa..wait what? Okay well let's get to the basics, wardens have some skills that literally do three things as once..They are extremely versatile, you can be bad and still be great at warden. How about you nerf them in the pvp aspect and start buffing them in pve? That way you can stop the.."Oh they suck in pve so they have to be good somewhere like pvp.." Yes well not God's who can't die thank you very much.

you are a pain in the .....
just trying to get a nerf for all that bothers you, L2P
for example sorc are running around with herds of pets, nobody cares
NB can sneak, few like you care

ppl like you we have to thank for all those balancing, nerfing and whatelse is wrecking this game!

IT IS NORMAL TO DIE IN PVP, GET IT IN YOUR BRAIN!!!

You should never tell someone to L2P when you run in a 50+ zerg and do nothing else than spamming birds and Soulassault but still die to one burst attempt of a stamplar.

Warden is OP.
You can ignore all ranged builds while getting the best ult regen in the game with a skill that costs you almost nothing, a ranged spammable that deals more damage than Suprise attack while being undodgeable.
Just for slotting your sustain Tool, your nuke and your spammable you get free 6% damage dealt.
Then you get a cheap way of 10 seconds of major expedition + minor beserk.
Your AoE nuke ignores LoS, z-axis and block while applying major fracture
You get the best stam based heal in the game which applies even more buffs and can give you major mending.

Waffennacht wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Ever been in bgs with 3 spamming birds and all their subterranean assaults go off??

Did you ever see the red mountain viper velidreth combo a few patches ago? It was the equivalent of a old magblade bomb build with proxy

Nope, but have had 2/3 leaps at our group killing everything

A blockable ult with a smaller damage area that can't be used every 3 seconds vs a aoe nuke that ignores block and can be mixed with another skill
I can't decide what i should choose

What's unblockable? Cuz it's not n storm/Permafrost, because they are.

Edit: oh you're comparing leap to Sub Assault. Well I would then compare whips to Permafrost and raise you Talons

well you were the first one to mention that your Group wiped to '2-3' leaps as an answer to someone talking about shalks.

Waffennacht

BohnT wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

BohnT wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

Micah_Bayer wrote: »

Well yes..its another nerf sor..i mean whoa..wait what? Okay well let's get to the basics, wardens have some skills that literally do three things as once..They are extremely versatile, you can be bad and still be great at warden. How about you nerf them in the pvp aspect and start buffing them in pve? That way you can stop the.."Oh they suck in pve so they have to be good somewhere like pvp.." Yes well not God's who can't die thank you very much.

you are a pain in the .....
just trying to get a nerf for all that bothers you, L2P
for example sorc are running around with herds of pets, nobody cares
NB can sneak, few like you care

ppl like you we have to thank for all those balancing, nerfing and whatelse is wrecking this game!

IT IS NORMAL TO DIE IN PVP, GET IT IN YOUR BRAIN!!!

You should never tell someone to L2P when you run in a 50+ zerg and do nothing else than spamming birds and Soulassault but still die to one burst attempt of a stamplar.

Warden is OP.
You can ignore all ranged builds while getting the best ult regen in the game with a skill that costs you almost nothing, a ranged spammable that deals more damage than Suprise attack while being undodgeable.
Just for slotting your sustain Tool, your nuke and your spammable you get free 6% damage dealt.
Then you get a cheap way of 10 seconds of major expedition + minor beserk.
Your AoE nuke ignores LoS, z-axis and block while applying major fracture
You get the best stam based heal in the game which applies even more buffs and can give you major mending.

Waffennacht wrote: »

Destyran wrote: »

DeadlyRecluse wrote: »

OP is a strong word.

Stamina Warden feels a little overtuned, but 7th Legion in general feels a little overtuned...

I haven't found a solo magicka warden that felt really, really dangerous in the way that stam wardens do. Frequent stalemates, though.

The strangest thing, IMO, is that even potato wardens take longer than they should to kill. I haven't put my finger on which passives/skills are directly responsible for that.

Ever been in bgs with 3 spamming birds and all their subterranean assaults go off??

Did you ever see the red mountain viper velidreth combo a few patches ago? It was the equivalent of a old magblade bomb build with proxy

Nope, but have had 2/3 leaps at our group killing everything

A blockable ult with a smaller damage area that can't be used every 3 seconds vs a aoe nuke that ignores block and can be mixed with another skill
I can't decide what i should choose

What's unblockable? Cuz it's not n storm/Permafrost, because they are.

Edit: oh you're comparing leap to Sub Assault. Well I would then compare whips to Permafrost and raise you Talons

well you were the first one to mention that your Group wiped to '2-3' leaps as an answer to someone talking about shalks.

He asked if anyone had fought 3 wardens spamming birds and sub assault. Which I have not. I have had Leaps do that, if I played in organized or pre-mades I may not have seen either.

It wasn't a comparison, but now that you mention it. I haven't seen a single Stam warden win without LoS. At which point, whomever is facing the warden can just choose to disengage.

While I have seen many DKs face tank several players and then drop much more devastating ults.

While Sub Assault is good, it's damage doesn't compare to a well built build using an ult.

I have Never had sub Assault or fissure deal 11k through 4k impen

GrigorijMalahevich

Any ranged build feels useless against any warden with shimmering shield... Shimmering shield needs some serious thought proccess, either make it very expensive or make it a chance to abosrb projectiles something like 25%. Heavy armored warden can keep 100% uptime on it...

If I meet solo warden in Cyro and that warden that can swim very fast, I know time is going to be wasted... I just try to not engage it.

I am not really a person that complains, but seriously, it needs some more thinking.

P.S. there was a question “if warden is OP why there are not million wardens in Cyro” - are you sure? Nightblade is still every second enemy I encounter, but wardens are going from 5% to 25% in two weeks...

CatchMeTrolling

Anytime you guys say something is op people will jump on it so you should expect an increase whether it’s gear, skills or a class. Although there’s not many wardens in open world, I encounter most In bgs for obvious reasons.