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Shadowrend is too lol
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Dymence✭✭✭✭✭
✭Lord_Dexter wrote: »This thread need to close as OP have no real statistics or example but simple started a troll thread!
The only troll in this thread is you0 -
Alpheu5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭As for shadowrend specifically. After HotR hits, itll basically play the game for people - do significant damage, 100% uptime on minor main, almost 100% (uncounterable) uptime on necropotence for any class. But gear sets and abilities playing the game for people is really nothing new at this point.
This is pure hyperbole.Dalek-Rok - Argonian Sorcerer || Dalek-Shād - Argonian Nightblade || Dalek-Shul - Argonian Templar || Dalek-Xal - Argonian Dragonknight || Mounts-the-Snout - Argonian Warden || Dalek-Xul - Argonian Necromancer || Two-Spires - Argonian Arcanist || Dalek-Nesh - Argonian Sorcerer || Dalek-Kör - Argonian DragonknightJudas Helviaryn wrote: »Don't incorporate bugs into your builds, and you won't have [an] issue.0 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭As for shadowrend specifically. After HotR hits, itll basically play the game for people - do significant damage, 100% uptime on minor main, almost 100% (uncounterable) uptime on necropotence for any class. But gear sets and abilities playing the game for people is really nothing new at this point.
This is pure hyperbole.
Yeah, let's not compare shadowrend to torug's pact!0 -
cschwingeb14_ESO✭✭✭✭As a sorc that hates ZoS' pets, shadowrend will be perfect to finally get the necro bonus that NBs have easily had access to.
Whether it's viable will completely depend on how much Oblivion damage is out there. Because getting stunned and burst to less than 25% will become a death sentence. Big shield goes up, gets destroyed by execute. Oblivion keeps eating your health/hots until you are dead0 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Lord_Dexter wrote: »Lord_Dexter wrote: »This thread need to close as OP have no real statistics or example but simple started a troll thread!
By that logic you need to be banned from the forums as you provided no constructive reply to the ongoing discussion in this topic.
This tread is just troll and no constructive and what logic i said to be banned?
Not sure why are you soo much feaking out!
If you really think this set overperforming them clearly its a jolk,
OP monster proc sets are Salene and Skoria!
If you think this set is not overperforming on a sorc utilizing it to access necropotence you´re not correct.
This thread isn´t trolling because i tested with the OP.
Just to give some perspective. If you have petcurse on a target this set hits as hard as infernal guardian with lightattacks and as hard as skoria with heavyattack.
I just don´t see reasons not to use it (apart from the torugsmadness going on currently - but you can just use both because the set is good enough without necro).Edited by Derra on August 3, 2017 6:18PM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 503 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Glad we'll get to play with these new changes before QQ'ers get everything nerfed again2 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.Edited by Lord-Otto on August 3, 2017 8:00PM1 -
Aelakhaii_De_Mythos✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Glad we'll get to play with these new changes before QQ'ers get everything nerfed again
QQ'ing and legitimate feedback concerning certain setup isnt the same thing. I'ts pretty safe to assume that every experienced player sees these kind of problems as something else than QQ'ing and some closer to the lowering of quality gameplay.5 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.Edited by DDuke on August 3, 2017 8:29PM4 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.2 -
OdinForge✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
Did you just disregard amberplasm as a viable magicka set, and compare that to a stamina build running seducer? How does that even make sense? I don't even use amberplasm and I still dodge a lot on my magsorc without losing the ability to streak enough to kite or escape zergs.
The Age of Wrobel.3 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭You're not even close to dodging the way stamina builds can do it. Fairly obvious, if you're so clever.0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-OttoEdited by Ragnaroek93 on August 3, 2017 10:06PMI used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.
Why exactly are you talking about stuff on PTS if you can't play there at all? I guess for trolling purposes I used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.2 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.
Why exactly are you talking about stuff on PTS if you can't play there at all? I guess for trolling purposes
Oh, and you have played all changes live in Cyrodiil on the main servers with all players and at all the different traffic times, right?
You're just as theorizing as I am. Your tiny PTS experience is not to be taken for a true live experience. And my point stands there: stamina has adfitional utility with dodge, so magicka can have a scaling advantage with shields.0 -
Ragnaroek93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.
Why exactly are you talking about stuff on PTS if you can't play there at all? I guess for trolling purposes
Oh, and you have played all changes live in Cyrodiil on the main servers with all players and at all the different traffic times, right?
You're just as theorizing as I am. Your tiny PTS experience is not to be taken for a true live experience. And my point stands there: stamina has adfitional utility with dodge, so magicka can have a scaling advantage with shields.
I see. Torugs + Infused is also fine, because we weren't able to test it yet on live server Edited by Ragnaroek93 on August 3, 2017 10:50PMI used to think that PvP was a tragedy, but now I realize, it's a comedy.1 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.
Why exactly are you talking about stuff on PTS if you can't play there at all? I guess for trolling purposes
Oh, and you have played all changes live in Cyrodiil on the main servers with all players and at all the different traffic times, right?
You're just as theorizing as I am. Your tiny PTS experience is not to be taken for a true live experience. And my point stands there: stamina has adfitional utility with dodge, so magicka can have a scaling advantage with shields.
I see. Torugs + Infused is also fine, because we weren't able to test it yet on live server
After the bug fix, I'm thinking, it's pretty fine.
Edit:. Wait,
So which the @#__ is it? Sorc shield stacking OP? Necro + Shadowrend OP? Or is it Torug + Infused? Because it sure as @#$_ not the same build. Imo Torug is the antithesis of shield stacking - which would be good for the sorc is OP crowd.
But to hear that: Torug OP, Shadowrend OP, SA OP, Sorc OP, Warden OP, Panacea OP, Cloak OP, Magicka OP, Riposte OP, Oblivion Glyph OP, Skoria OP, Sorc OP (again because when a was typing this they made another thread), Bloodspawn OP, EotS OP, Incap OP, ... They all can't be true!!! Not to just you person I quoted, but to the forums.Edited by Waffennacht on August 3, 2017 11:17PM2 -
OdinForge✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.
Why exactly are you talking about stuff on PTS if you can't play there at all? I guess for trolling purposes
Oh, and you have played all changes live in Cyrodiil on the main servers with all players and at all the different traffic times, right?
You're just as theorizing as I am. Your tiny PTS experience is not to be taken for a true live experience. And my point stands there: stamina has adfitional utility with dodge, so magicka can have a scaling advantage with shields.
Where are those points you made that are still standing? Hopefully not post #131, there are zero valid points in that post. Apparently you think running amberplasm as a magicka build is the same as a stamina build running seducer. That's the level of reason you're working with here.The Age of Wrobel.3 -
Alpheu5✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Ragnaroek93 wrote: »Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
LOL
I would appreciate the comedy, if I didn't know you're probably being serious.
You should've used small font every time you write ᵈᵒᵈᵍᵉᵃᵇˡᵉ.
It's a pretty damn big downside to dodge roll when most of the attacks in the game are, you know, undodgeable.
If you think dodge roll is spammable, go do it over 10+ times in a row (hint: you need 15k+ stamina just to dodge roll once at that point even with 7 well-fitted & CPs in Tumbling) - it's mathematically impossible due to the stacking cost modifier. Unlike spamming dmg shields or heals, or permablocking.
Also, there are undodgeable heavy attacks in this game as well, so feel free to use those if you can't land other types of heavy attacks on dodge rollers (I can, with DW *shrug*).
Oh, and dodge rolling is available for everyone (especially for people wearing Amberplasm) - it's not a stamina exclusive thing.
Typical stamina delusion.
Dodgerolling five times in a row is very damn possible. I have yet to see a proper stam build to run dry because of dodgeroll. Compare that to the other evasive move with stacking cost - Streak. Five times Streak will run you dry easily.
Half of the moves in the game are undodgable? Rofl. You mean that OP Pulsar or Sap Essence that everyone spams left and right, especially in duels?
You compare shields to dodge. That is wrong to begin with. Shields are our heals. Our Vigor. Dodge and block are slotfree damage mitigation tools. Magicka doesn't have that. No, Amberplasm is not a valid excuse, as that binds us to a specific set. That's like asking stam builds to run Seducer, so you can afford your utility magicka skills.
Dodge grants you a plethora of tactical aadvantages. It is only fair that shields have good scaling in return, and a set to compliment that.
If dodgeroll builds are so overpowered than I guess you aren't afraid to create one on PTS and duel against my sorc?
@Lord-Otto
I'm afraid I can't do that. Out of my reach.
Why exactly are you talking about stuff on PTS if you can't play there at all? I guess for trolling purposes
Oh, and you have played all changes live in Cyrodiil on the main servers with all players and at all the different traffic times, right?
You're just as theorizing as I am. Your tiny PTS experience is not to be taken for a true live experience. And my point stands there: stamina has adfitional utility with dodge, so magicka can have a scaling advantage with shields.
I see. Torugs + Infused is also fine, because we weren't able to test it yet on live server
After the bug fix, I'm thinking, it's pretty fine.
Edit:. Wait,
So which the @#__ is it? Sorc shield stacking OP? Necro + Shadowrend OP? Or is it Torug + Infused? Because it sure as @#$_ not the same build. Imo Torug is the antithesis of shield stacking - which would be good for the sorc is OP crowd.
But to hear that: Torug OP, Shadowrend OP, SA OP, Sorc OP, Warden OP, Panacea OP, Cloak OP, Magicka OP, Riposte OP, Oblivion Glyph OP, Skoria OP, Sorc OP (again because when a was typing this they made another thread), Bloodspawn OP, EotS OP, Incap OP, ... They all can't be true!!! Not to just you person I quoted, but to the forums.
I think they were poking fun at the "Your tiny PTS experience is not to be taken for a true live experience" line since the Torug's + Infused situation can't be tested on live.
Not sure where this thread is going now because it went from being about Shadowrend itself being overpowered to multiple conditions being met that make it overpowered.
I'm also curious to know if people think Shadowrend in its live state is overpowered, because I haven't gotten wind of a single complaint about its current form.Dalek-Rok - Argonian Sorcerer || Dalek-Shād - Argonian Nightblade || Dalek-Shul - Argonian Templar || Dalek-Xal - Argonian Dragonknight || Mounts-the-Snout - Argonian Warden || Dalek-Xul - Argonian Necromancer || Two-Spires - Argonian Arcanist || Dalek-Nesh - Argonian Sorcerer || Dalek-Kör - Argonian DragonknightJudas Helviaryn wrote: »Don't incorporate bugs into your builds, and you won't have [an] issue.1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The point is that it's okay for shields to have massive scaling with magicka, as stamina builds have way easier acces to the extremely powerful dodge maneuver.
That's why I'm speculating that Necrorend won't shatter the balance. Speculation as in, not live yet.
Oblivion-Torug is less subtle. It's easy to test if it outperforms in PvE. PvP is still another matter and has to be judged from experience on live. Sypher wasn't impressed by the destro ult on PTS initially, Onslaught was supposed to rule them all, ... Experience changes things. I admit being worried about Torug, too, but that is because it's a gamebreaking mechanic if it is as bad as it seems.0 -
Aelakhaii_De_Mythos✭✭✭✭The point is that it's okay for shields to have massive scaling with magicka, as stamina builds have way easier acces to the extremely powerful dodge maneuver.
What is hard to understand here really?
You cant die with a magica char (1v1) because none can burst you down - if this continues.
Do you understand this point or not? If not i can explicate this for you thoroughly.
3 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Aelakhaii_De_Mythos wrote: »The point is that it's okay for shields to have massive scaling with magicka, as stamina builds have way easier acces to the extremely powerful dodge maneuver.
What is hard to understand here really?
You cant die with a magica char (1v1) because none can burst you down - if this continues.
Do you understand this point or not? If not i can explicate this for you thoroughly.
Stamina can easily outsustain you.3 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Man it´s really depressing reading about dodgeroll vs shields still with both sides bringing absolute unrealistic expectations and arguments to the table.
Yes dodgeroll sucks against enemies setup to fight you or when being outnumbered or against wardens.
No dodgeroll does not suck from the perspective of a single sorc fighting a stamblade.
Yes shields are incredibly strong in 1v1 encounters and shadowrend + necro are going to make it worse.
No shields are not good fighting multiple opponents that know how to deal damage (streak is though).
Arguably dodge is in a worse spot than shields are since morrowind because warden just counters it with every attack. Imo anything BUT singletarget dots that were preapplied or have no direct dmg component should be dodgeable (yes also magica aoes like eye of the lol).
Channels should still hit but with 30% reduced dmg (jabs heavyattack lightning/resto lolassault).
Edited by Derra on August 4, 2017 6:20AM<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 505 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Maybe the whining would stop if ZOS reduced shield strength by 75%, allowed only 1 shield, adjusted the Matriarch heal and Conversion to half, and got Surge to a flat 500 heal every 2 seconds. Oh no, it wouldn't. Sorcs could still use negate or Destro Ult and kill steal. So let's change Wrath/Fury to a threshold of 2% HP. Maybe that would be ok then. After all there already was a time Sorcs were nothing more than negate monkeys.
I'm so tired of all the whining. All I want is to still enjoy my main. It's not OP in noCP at all.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Good it's getting buffed. It gives magicka more damage, sustain and shields. That's still less than what dodge does:
Completely nullifies dodgable damage, scales, breaks roots, grants root immunity, nullifies dodgable CC, grants a mini-sprint that ignores snares, lets you cancel into, persists after animation is complete.
That is a lot for such a spammable move. It's fair if magicka gets a similar flexible boon. Magicka arguably has less defensive options, so building around that seems like a good idea. And before that stuff got live, crying for nerfs is a bit premature. We'll see how it works out, eh?
Oh, and I forgot how the need for highly-telegraphed and dodgable heavy attacks directly affects your dps or sustain since Morrowind, another advantage of dodge.
Dude's delusional, ignore him. It's players like these that you usually *** on 1v1 a few times then they become irrelevant cause they will never improve.2 -
Anne_Firehawk✭✭✭✭✭Maybe the whining would stop if ZOS reduced shield strength by 75%, allowed only 1 shield, adjusted the Matriarch heal and Conversion to half, and got Surge to a flat 500 heal every 2 seconds. Oh no, it wouldn't. Sorcs could still use negate or Destro Ult and kill steal. So let's change Wrath/Fury to a threshold of 2% HP. Maybe that would be ok then. After all there already was a time Sorcs were nothing more than negate monkeys.
I'm so tired of all the whining. All I want is to still enjoy my main. It's not OP in noCP at all.
Something needs to be done to shields, it's the only defensive mechanic left that gets a flat 25% Bonus from CP, it needs to be toned down, *** knows why that didn't happen yet.
Also, the Linchal Grand Manor needs to be available for purchase with Gold
Edited by Anne_Firehawk on August 4, 2017 7:51AMAnne Firehawk | Legate | Bringer of Light | Voice of Reason | Divayth Fyr's Coadjutor | Dro-m'Athra Destroyer | Magicka DK forever
GUAR SQUAD OP
All Hardmodes done, WTB content.
Cancercrates are ruining the game
DD | Phoenix Reborn
GM | Tamriels Emporium
#permabanAPFlippers1 -
Feanor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭By all means, adjust Bastion. But don't kill shields in noCP.Main characters: Feanor the Believer - AD Altmer mSorc - AR 50 - Flawless Conqueror (PC EU)Idril Arnanor - AD Altmer mSorc - CP 217 - Stormproof (PC NA)Other characters:Necrophilius Killgood - DC Imperial NecromancerFearscales - AD Argonian Templar - Stormproof (healer)Draco Imperialis - AD Imperial DK (tank)Cabed Naearamarth - AD Dunmer mDKValirion Willowthorne - AD Bosmer stamBladeTuruna - AD Altmer magBladeKheled Zaram - AD Redguard stamDKKibil Nala - AD Redguard stamSorc - StormproofYavanna Kémentárí - AD Breton magWardenAzog gro-Ghâsh - EP Orc stamWardenVidar Drakenblød - DC Nord mDKMarquis de Peyrac - DC Breton mSorc - StormproofRawlith Khaj'ra - AD Khajiit stamWardenTu'waccah - AD Redguard StamplarAll chars 50 @ CP 1900+. Playing and enjoying PvP with RdK mostly on PC EU.1 -
Subversus✭✭✭✭✭
✭Imo harness and hardened and harness and healing ward shouldn't be stackable. That would leave sorcs with 2 shields as a class signature and leave everyone else with one.1 -
Lord_Hev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭It really is the same old misinformation being spread around. 90% of the sorcs out there have an average magic pool, and virtually all of them spec for sustain in both magic and stamina as only speccing for magic requires experience and knowledge of resource management that is needed to be self taught intuitively through actual practice.
This applies to 1v1 as well. A balanced build will sustain better against a well played stam build, whilst a max magic build will struggle with resources that are not fed to their harness magic stack.
1