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THE PROCALYPSE
-
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.4 -
Derra✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Waffennacht wrote: »I don't want them gone, I don't want them unplayable, I don't want everyone to re roll magicka again.
I think if they acted more like skoria - telegraphed and "timed" it would allow for counter play.
Or... Well I dunno. I don't want them gone but I also want some sort of reactionary gameplay, it's so counter intuitive
I don´t think you can consider skoria telegraphed either - atleast as soon as more than one player is using it. It only has a semireliable soundcue that´s not specific to the target it´s hitting.<Noricum>
I live. I die. I live again.
Derra - DC - Sorc - AvA 50
Derrah - EP - Sorc - AvA 500 -
The Uninvited✭✭✭✭✭
✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.Pandora's Promise (rip) | LND | Pactriotic | IKnowWhatUDidLastWinter's | The Uninvited |
Ride the paranoia | All life is pain | Only the grave is real0 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
No, gear strengthens your personal abilities. If I hit you with a sword in real life, the effectiveness of my attack is determined by the weight and quality of the sword, as well as how capable I am to swing the weapon quickly.
If ESO logic were applied to the same scenario; a five year old could pick up the same weapon then sluggishly swing the sword, and do pitiful damage to the child's target; however, a giant bear will then appear, and rip the victim in half. Because reasons.Edited by Strider_Roshin on June 16, 2017 10:47AM9 -
Prospero_ESO✭✭✭✭The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Do you actally know how the proc sets mentioned here work ?1 -
Bosov✭✭✭✭✭Cant all the proc damage sets have something like negate has? A different effect in PVE and in PVP? ''Viper sting, this effect will have no effect on human players'' ''Selene, the not so friendly bear wont harm human player'' ''Skoria, skoria has no problems with humans and his wrath will not occur'' Or just put a serious cooldown on it.. a cooldown of about 24 hours would be nice. That way a really bad player can still get his or her daily kill with some procs!
Stam NB = cloak, ambush, viper, suprise, (decent nb will now fear but most wont) incap, viper, selene, execute. Failed? Cloak and repeat the whole 4 button combo...
Mag temp/dk = place dots (fire stuff from dk, sweeps and purify damage thing from templar), hold block and wait for skoria to do your damage.
As a lower cp player or non cp player it is even worse.. you cant outheal/revcover from a viper, poisons and selene before the proccer does the same viper, selene and poison combo.
Edit :
The new DK tank meta overpreformed during Morrowind and got nerfed ASAP... Viper, Selene, Red mountain and all the other stuff does overperform in pvp (Yes it does, if it didnt 99% of the people wouldnt be using it) so shouldnt that be nerfed/changed in the next patch? Nah.. not likely. This will just be another proc patch to endure like the patch before they removed the abilty for proc sets to crit.Edited by Bosov on June 16, 2017 3:51PMXbox One - EU - GT : Bosov
PC - EU - @Bosov91
ESO Highight :
https://twitter.com/SlashLurk/status/8950683392733102082 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Strider_Roshin wrote: »The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
No, gear strengthens your personal abilities. If I hit you with a sword in real life, the effectiveness of my attack is determined by the weight and quality of the sword, as well as how capable I am to swing the weapon quickly.
If ESO logic were applied to the same scenario; a five year old could pick up the same weapon then sluggishly swing the sword, and do pitiful damage to the child's target; however, a giant bear will then appear, and rip the victim in half. Because reasons.
Lmao! I love this analogy3 -
Xvorg✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Guys, you're asking for something you don't want to see. Let's balance the game together leaving proc sets out of the equation, otherwise, I know some very pissed off mageblades that are eager on using the worst proc set this game has ever had...
Please, let's keep this as civil as possible to avoid chaos...Sarcasm is something too serious to be taken lightly
I was born with the wrong sign
In the wrong house
With the wrong ascendancy
I took the wrong road
That led to the wrong tendencies
I was in the wrong place at the wrong time
For the wrong reason and the wrong rhyme
On the wrong day of the wrong week
Used the wrong method with the wrong technique0 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Or we could go in the opposite direction. Let's give magicka a range of over-performing proc damage sets that require no effort to proc. What if the Nerien'eth totem immobilized you so that you couldn't avoid or mitigate the damage? What if Maw of the Infernal proc'd as often and had the single target burst of Selene?
Go ahead, buff Thunderbug and Storm Knight, then wait for the stam tears to roll in about how it's not fair that sorcs have shields AND can proc damage.
0 -
out51d3r✭✭✭✭Go ahead, buff Thunderbug and Storm Knight, then wait for the stam tears to roll in about how it's not fair that sorcs have shields AND can proc damage.
If they are going to stick to the proc set meta(and it seems clear that they are), something like this will be necessary.
I assure you though, even stam players get killed by proc sets constantly(just by other stam players usually). MANY of us want this crap gone. It's not really a stam vs magicka issue.
2 -
SanTii.92✭✭✭✭✭
✭Just make them scale with max pool, spell / wpn dmge already. It's stupid how tanks and in no cp the dish out so much dmge.When the snows fall and the white winds blow,
the lone wolf dies, but the pack survives.
Arg | Pc Na | Factionless Mag Warden.0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Just make them scale with max pool, spell / wpn dmge already. It's stupid how tanks and in no cp the dish out so much dmge.
Not max pool. i dont want max stat highelfs with backbar lich or redguard dks just getting high damage for stacking the resource that gives them bigger shields or more resource returns due to passives.
just make it apply to weapon/spell damage only.PS4 NA DC1 -
DEATHquidox✭✭✭
Depends on how they would implement it. What they should do is if they added CP have a set amount of CP each player can use in bgs and have it different then our original one in cyro and elsewhere so it's specific for pvp and pvp only and when you come out of bgs it's not the same only in bgs this would fix a lot of it but also ontop of it they need to address the issue and not just add more problems, beating around the bush always adds more problems. That's with life to.1 -
NBrookus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Go ahead, buff Thunderbug and Storm Knight, then wait for the stam tears to roll in about how it's not fair that sorcs have shields AND can proc damage.
If they are going to stick to the proc set meta(and it seems clear that they are), something like this will be necessary.
I assure you though, even stam players get killed by proc sets constantly(just by other stam players usually). MANY of us want this crap gone. It's not really a stam vs magicka issue.
I was more referring to the sheer number of nerf sorc threads that arise.
I'd rather see proc damage sets get severely curtailed in PvP, but if they aren't some sort of parity really needs to happen. Skoria is really the only comparable magicka set.1 -
revonine✭✭✭✭
Honestly you prob touched on what is probably the best solution. They're between a rock and a hard place with this as they have to balance pve too. A blanket nerf to the proc sets again would make pve-ers cry. It's either that and adjust certain problem sets individually.
I'm baffled because they wanted you to think about sustaining yourself with morrowind and on the other hand we have so many sets that offer free damage and no resource cost.
EDIT: maybe that's a solution. Have proc 5 pc sets like viper drain resources when activated.Edited by revonine on June 17, 2017 10:37PM0 -
The Uninvited✭✭✭✭✭
✭Prospero_ESO wrote: »The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Do you actally know how the proc sets mentioned here work ?
Yes I do, so let's focus on those.
Reasoning like "No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period." is flawed if only a few of them are overperforming.
Let's compare Velidreth to Valkyn Skoria:
Tooltip Valkyn: When you deal damage with a damage over time effect, you have an 8% chance to summon a meteor that deals 9000 Flame Damage to target and 4000 Flame Damage all other enemies within 5 meters. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.
That's 8% chance to deal a total of 13000 damage every 5 seconds IF you use dots.
Tooltip Velidreth: When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. Thie effect can occur once every 9 seconds.
That's 20% chance to deal 10320 damage every 9 seconds no matter what skill you use.
These are base tooltips not taking CP or attributes and enchantments into account. But it's clear to see where the problem lies.Pandora's Promise (rip) | LND | Pactriotic | IKnowWhatUDidLastWinter's | The Uninvited |
Ride the paranoia | All life is pain | Only the grave is real0 -
Ahzek✭✭✭✭✭
✭The Uninvited wrote: »Prospero_ESO wrote: »The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Do you actally know how the proc sets mentioned here work ?
Yes I do, so let's focus on those.
Reasoning like "No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period." is flawed if only a few of them are overperforming.
Let's compare Velidreth to Valkyn Skoria:
Tooltip Valkyn: When you deal damage with a damage over time effect, you have an 8% chance to summon a meteor that deals 9000 Flame Damage to target and 4000 Flame Damage all other enemies within 5 meters. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.
That's 8% chance to deal a total of 13000 damage every 5 seconds IF you use dots.
Tooltip Velidreth: When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. Thie effect can occur once every 9 seconds.
That's 20% chance to deal 10320 damage every 9 seconds no matter what skill you use.
These are base tooltips not taking CP or attributes and enchantments into account. But it's clear to see where the problem lies.
Actually, skoria is much stronger than velidreth in any non gank scenario. Veli is one of the few sets you can actually have some control about getting hit by and the cooldown is pretty long. That + the high chance on any dmg make it easily predictable. On the other hand, against a dedicated build you will have skoria meteor proccing every 5-7 seconds, with no reactive counterplay whatsoever.
Not i use neither, and hate all procc sets equally, so im not biased in that regard.Jo'Khaljor3 -
Strider_Roshin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭The Uninvited wrote: »Prospero_ESO wrote: »The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Do you actally know how the proc sets mentioned here work ?
Yes I do, so let's focus on those.
Reasoning like "No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period." is flawed if only a few of them are overperforming.
Let's compare Velidreth to Valkyn Skoria:
Tooltip Valkyn: When you deal damage with a damage over time effect, you have an 8% chance to summon a meteor that deals 9000 Flame Damage to target and 4000 Flame Damage all other enemies within 5 meters. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.
That's 8% chance to deal a total of 13000 damage every 5 seconds IF you use dots.
Tooltip Velidreth: When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. Thie effect can occur once every 9 seconds.
That's 20% chance to deal 10320 damage every 9 seconds no matter what skill you use.
These are base tooltips not taking CP or attributes and enchantments into account. But it's clear to see where the problem lies.
Actually, skoria is much stronger than velidreth in any non gank scenario. Veli is one of the few sets you can actually have some control about getting hit by and the cooldown is pretty long. That + the high chance on any dmg make it easily predictable. On the other hand, against a dedicated build you will have skoria meteor proccing every 5-7 seconds, with no reactive counterplay whatsoever.
Not i use neither, and hate all procc sets equally, so im not biased in that regard.
Agreed. I'd take a velidreth user over a Skoria user any day.0 -
Prospero_ESO✭✭✭✭The Uninvited wrote: »Prospero_ESO wrote: »The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Do you actally know how the proc sets mentioned here work ?
Yes I do, so let's focus on those.
Reasoning like "No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period." is flawed if only a few of them are overperforming.
Let's compare Velidreth to Valkyn Skoria:
Tooltip Valkyn: When you deal damage with a damage over time effect, you have an 8% chance to summon a meteor that deals 9000 Flame Damage to target and 4000 Flame Damage all other enemies within 5 meters. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.
That's 8% chance to deal a total of 13000 damage every 5 seconds IF you use dots.
Tooltip Velidreth: When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. Thie effect can occur once every 9 seconds.
That's 20% chance to deal 10320 damage every 9 seconds no matter what skill you use.
These are base tooltips not taking CP or attributes and enchantments into account. But it's clear to see where the problem lies.
Imo dmg, healing, shields from procs is free damage, healing or a shield, this should never ever happen in pvp. These things should only come in pvp from ablilities and should be counterable. Otherwise the factor of skill becomes irrelevant to a certain degree. In BG´s people are carried by the sets they wear, what is the reason to do BG´s then or PvP in general. It´s pointless if someone can´t compete because he did not farmed his ass of fungal grotto.1 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭The Uninvited wrote: »Prospero_ESO wrote: »The Uninvited wrote: »Strider_Roshin wrote: »leepalmer95 wrote: »Not all procs are OP though and a universal nerf will bury the unused sets, i don't want more unused sets either.
Hoping zos adjust individual proc sets viper/ selene/ skoria/ red mountain etc... rather than flat out nerf them all again.
No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period.
Abilities should damage players, not armor.
Following that reasoning, you should go into Cyrodill naked. Even sets that boost stats give more damage than just abilities.
Do you actally know how the proc sets mentioned here work ?
Yes I do, so let's focus on those.
Reasoning like "No damaging proc sets should work on player. Period." is flawed if only a few of them are overperforming.
Let's compare Velidreth to Valkyn Skoria:
Tooltip Valkyn: When you deal damage with a damage over time effect, you have an 8% chance to summon a meteor that deals 9000 Flame Damage to target and 4000 Flame Damage all other enemies within 5 meters. This effect can occur once every 5 seconds.
That's 8% chance to deal a total of 13000 damage every 5 seconds IF you use dots.
Tooltip Velidreth: When you deal damage, you have a 20% chance to spawn 3 disease spores in front of you that deal 10320 Disease Damage to the first enemy hit. Thie effect can occur once every 9 seconds.
That's 20% chance to deal 10320 damage every 9 seconds no matter what skill you use.
These are base tooltips not taking CP or attributes and enchantments into account. But it's clear to see where the problem lies.
Actually, skoria is much stronger than velidreth in any non gank scenario. Veli is one of the few sets you can actually have some control about getting hit by and the cooldown is pretty long. That + the high chance on any dmg make it easily predictable. On the other hand, against a dedicated build you will have skoria meteor proccing every 5-7 seconds, with no reactive counterplay whatsoever.
Not i use neither, and hate all procc sets equally, so im not biased in that regard.
Skoria forces you to run dots though, but i think the main reason veli is more of a problem I my opinion is the stamina I general has higher burst damage than magicka. That's just puts veli over the top most skoria users have low burst damage with skoria usually being there only burst option1 -
Qwazzy✭✭✭✭Like the has no effect on players idea. Great solution!Smallscale/Solo player on multiple servers
PC North America - CharactersAD Sorcerer - PvP 16
AD Templar - PvP 33
AD Nightblade - PvP 17
AD Dragonknight - PvP 19
AD Necromancer - PvP 22
EP Sorcerer - PvP 20
EP Templar - PvP 21
EP Nightblade - PvP 20
DC Sorcerer - PvP 16
DC Templar - PvP 24
DC Nightblade - PvP 18Xbox North America - CharactersAD Sorcerer - PvP 32
AD Sorcerer - PvP 20
AD Sorcerer - PvP 14
AD Templar - PvP 41
AD Templar - PvP 16
AD Templar - PvP 14
AD Warden - PvP 29
AD Nightblade - PvP 27
AD Dragonknight - PvP 18
AD Necromancer - PvP 14Xbox Europe - CharactersAD Sorcerer - PvP 42
AD Templar - PvP 36
EP Sorcerer - PvP 160 -
Lokey0024✭✭✭✭✭I keep getting double selene proc on top of viper for a total of 17k dmg in 1 second1 -
thankyourat✭✭✭✭✭
✭I feel the biggest problem with double stacking proc sets is when fighting multiple people using them i don't really struggle fighting one proc player, but if it's multiple it's almost impossible to counter0 -
ezeepeezee✭✭✭✭Extinct_Solo_Player wrote: »Inb4 blanket nerf to everything that counts as a proc set
That already happened.0 -
Jules✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Vendor has 2 diff proc sets
Proc build is the featured build on zos website
GG boys well played3 -
TheBonesXXX✭✭✭✭✭
✭They nerfed camo hunter.. and then put old camo hunter mechanic into gear.
They nerfed bats and impulse.. only to come up with prox det, eye of the storm, and more det sets..
I don't think anyone here actually sees the totality of the problem, because most people get their desired changes then scamper off into the sunset.
They nerfed meteor.. then put the *** into more gear.. and buffed meteor again.
Turn off tab assist
Imagine how much more skill this game would need if players actually had to aim.0 -
nCats✭✭✭Vendor has 2 diff proc sets
Proc build is the featured build on zos website
GG boys well played
To be frank, proc builds are featured everywhere; one who goes to see a top pvp stream on twitch will often be exposed to one or other stacked proc set build. It is not to issue blame (although I think spreading the news helps spreading those builds): we don't see people trying more complex builds from various streamers as often as we see procs.
Issue is, the pvp community in this game is actually extremely casual in its mentality. Safe broken builds, zerg play, poisons on both bars --- somehow, people here want it easy. I often see people say ``why should I wear X instead of Y to put myself to disadvantage" --- but it's a game, you're not getting your salary out of this, not fighting for your existence. Because of such an approach, many put the ``difficulty setting'' to supposed minimum and become all similar (are there non double proc stamblades in bg? or is it all the same person?). This similarity and non-variety is actually something which I find most unamusing about the current meta. My best fights have been with unusual opponents.
This mentality does not have to be imminent. I know of other multiplayer pvp games where a whole side is put to disadvantage, but is nonetheless played by those who like more challenge. I do not see this being reproduced in ESO though.
3
