AD - another campaign that we will lose (Vivec NA)?

Juli'St

Unfortunately AD, as a faction, seems to be heading for yet another defeat. Already more than 2000 points behind EP - faction that has played with extreme organization, which is commendable. DC also makes another brilliant campaign, thinking, in my opinion, strategically.

I tend to lead a group in AD called FATE - it is a group formed spontaneously by 'pugs' (new players or those who are not organized in guilds). FATE was created by the leader of the guild ARS Imperatoria, Night Mother Listner - an excellent leader in my view. Several times, we lead up to two 'full' groups, 48 players and, rarely, up to 3. We always strive for loyalty to the faction - and I learned this from NML. In my second PvP campaign, I finished in 8th place in the overall rank of all factions and made this giant score only and exclusively participating in the campaign, thinking about the campaign, thinking in a collective way, never individual / selfish.

But, I did not open this topic to talk about a person or two, myself or the leader of my guild. It would not even make sense. However, I have illustrated some of the feelings that made me win campaigns - collective spirit, thinking about yourself, thinking of everyone at the same time. And I think that's the secret to winning a campaign. It is not enough to have the best players, it is not enough to have the oldest overlords, if this is not used collectively, it will not work. Making individual points - AP - in a campaign is not difficult, it is not necessary to become a selfish person to make points. I, for example, do many and many without thinking, only, in myself.

I always thought that campaign had some sense for being a campaign - having goals in a certain amount of time. As a game COLLECTIVELY, I think that's part of that idea. Otherwise, if I thought otherwise, I would leave the campaign and would do pvp in the new 4x4 arena or something.

I think that's it, I think the great secret to turning a bad score, bad campaigns, is to think collectively and AD can do that. AD deserves more, much more than the current score and situation.

Think about

Iskras

Minalan

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

Juli'St

Minalan wrote: »

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

@ZOS_BrianWheeler when we ll have a solution?

Malic

LOL

Mojmir

Team green isn't helping you?

Juli'St

Mojmir wrote: »

Team green isn't helping you?

You is AD? If not, try be constructive in this topic. Thanks.

Minno

Minalan wrote: »

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

Seriously? Maybe there should be an actual team green until we get a fix lol.

Mr_Nobody

The campaign is [snip].Im from EU but playing on NA servers, during my evening its like 2 bars ad/dc and pop locked EP steam rolling everything. I once logged in at like 11AM my time, DC had nearly every keep on the map... and pop locked, against 2 bars ad/ep. Weird.

Havent seen AD hitting pop locked ever though.

[edited for profanity masking]

Juli'St

Minno wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

Seriously? Maybe there should be an actual team green until we get a fix lol.

Yes, it is serious, like u or not this fact.

Goshua

...

antihero727

I think most AD are farming and not trolling zone chat ATM. It happens most of the time after a major patch. One faction dominates because "fair weather" faction hoppers move to the strongest faction at the time. Most of my guild is taking it easy, enjoying battlegrounds and farming new things. Without salt there can't be human life and Iskra provides us with plenty. We AD will not get goiter with them around. (Look it up)

Juli'St

antihero727 wrote: »

I think most AD are farming and not trolling zone chat ATM. It happens most of the time after a major patch. One faction dominates because "fair weather" faction hoppers move to the strongest faction at the time. Most of my guild is taking it easy, enjoying battlegrounds and farming new things. Without salt there can't be human life and Iskra provides us with plenty. We AD will not get goiter with them around. (Look it up)

Farmers hate who call ppls to participate in campaign. #fact

But the best keyboard in this game is F1. And u use without any moderation.

IxSTALKERxI

The reason the scoreboard looks like how it is, is due to population imbalance since update. EP has highest 24/7 population followed by DC who has a strong oceanic presence. AD are lacking decent players / guilds and population at certain times of day.

It generally goes something like this:

During the day and into prime time the map is pretty balanced although Pact Militia seem to be very organised this patch.
3am EST the map turns red
8am EST the map turns blue

As a result AD is in last.


Btw, Can someone please explain to me how/where these 'AP farmers' are farming so much AP and why they so detrimental to AD? No one on AD leaderboards even has much AP... and those that do have been fighting hard for the campaign, trying their best to hold back the large EP and DC forces.

Juli'St

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

The reason the scoreboard looks like how it is, is due to population imbalance since update. EP has highest 24/7 population followed by DC who has a strong oceanic presence. AD are lacking decent players / guilds and population at certain times of day.

It generally goes something like this:

During the day and into prime time the map is pretty balanced although Pact Militia seem to be very organised this patch.
3am EST the map turns red
8am EST the map turns blue

As a result AD is in last.


Btw, Can someone please explain to me how/where these 'AP farmers' are farming so much AP and why they so detrimental to AD? No one on AD leaderboards even has much AP... and those that do have been fighting hard for the campaign, trying their best to hold back the large EP and DC forces.

Problem is that when prioritizing the farm AP, we do not think about the strategy but
Make points. I think five consecutive defeats can exemplify or prove this without anyone here making 'theses' about. Criterion of practice has always been, is and will always remain the criterion of truth.

I will not cite specific examples, but I can tantalize more generally - as I did in my initial post - on the situation.

Talk in specific situations ends up involving guilds, groups and people and this is not the purpose of the topic: pointing or accusing people. Here we speak of 'ideas', one of them the sense of collectivity.

Sabbathius

Honestly, the situation seems very simple to me. Population imbalance, coupled with timezone distribution of said population, makes the situation unwinnable. Community, mentality, being part of the collective, cooperation, organization, individual skill, it's all well and good. However, if you don't have the numbers, you can't be everywhere at once against faction(s) that can. And if you don't have an even timezone presence, no matter how collective or organized or amazing you are, you will have to log off eventually. So you will STILL come back the next day and find yourself further behind than the day before, because other faction(s) had a free hand to do as they please, virtually uncontested. It is unavoidable. And that's not even factoring in the exploits and other underhanded tactics.

Now, it's possible to fix this. There's so many things that can be done, up to and including diminishing returns based on player number disparity, and of course the plugging of holes (like multi-faction queue exploit). But this is ZOS we're talking about, the guys who haven't been able to get Group Finder to work properly since 2.2, and fix Cyrodiil loading screens since beta. So I'm not exactly holding my breath.

Goshua

Juli'St

Sabbathius wrote: »

Honestly, the situation seems very simple to me. Population imbalance, coupled with timezone distribution of said population, makes the situation unwinnable. Community, mentality, being part of the collective, cooperation, organization, individual skill, it's all well and good. However, if you don't have the numbers, you can't be everywhere at once against faction(s) that can. And if you don't have an even timezone presence, no matter how collective or organized or amazing you are, you will have to log off eventually. So you will STILL come back the next day and find yourself further behind than the day before, because other faction(s) had a free hand to do as they please, virtually uncontested. It is unavoidable. And that's not even factoring in the exploits and other underhanded tactics.

Now, it's possible to fix this. There's so many things that can be done, up to and including diminishing returns based on player number disparity, and of course the plugging of holes (like multi-faction queue exploit). But this is ZOS we're talking about, the guys who haven't been able to get Group Finder to work properly since 2.2, and fix Cyrodiil loading screens since beta. So I'm not exactly holding my breath.

ZOS really seems dont care about exploits, cheaters, etc...

Ghost-Shot

Juli'St wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

I think most AD are farming and not trolling zone chat ATM. It happens most of the time after a major patch. One faction dominates because "fair weather" faction hoppers move to the strongest faction at the time. Most of my guild is taking it easy, enjoying battlegrounds and farming new things. Without salt there can't be human life and Iskra provides us with plenty. We AD will not get goiter with them around. (Look it up)

Farmers hate who call ppls to participate in campaign. #fact

But the best keyboard in this game is F1. And u use without any moderation.

Google translate yielded no results, what?

antihero727

Juli'St wrote: »

antihero727 wrote: »

I think most AD are farming and not trolling zone chat ATM. It happens most of the time after a major patch. One faction dominates because "fair weather" faction hoppers move to the strongest faction at the time. Most of my guild is taking it easy, enjoying battlegrounds and farming new things. Without salt there can't be human life and Iskra provides us with plenty. We AD will not get goiter with them around. (Look it up)

Farmers hate who call ppls to participate in campaign. #fact

But the best keyboard in this game is F1. And u use without any moderation.

This would be removed for something if mods could decode it.

Juli'St

Best part of this forum: ignore who not construct nothing; who go to forum to fight, ofend people, etc.

Ty ZOS for the 'ignore buttom'.

NBrookus

Minno wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

Seriously? Maybe there should be an actual team green until we get a fix lol.

You mean something other than DC faction stacking at Chim gate tonight while AD faction stacked at Ghartok and neither managed to get a scroll? While there was not a single crossed yellow/blue swords on the map? Trust me, there was no shortage of players on any faction. 80+ AD stacked up at a single keep is a whole lot of yellow shields.

It was enough to make you believe there actually was a coordinated Team Green.

Minalan

NBrookus wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

Seriously? Maybe there should be an actual team green until we get a fix lol.

You mean something other than DC faction stacking at Chim gate tonight while AD faction stacked at Ghartok and neither managed to get a scroll? While there was not a single crossed yellow/blue swords on the map? Trust me, there was no shortage of players on any faction. 80+ AD stacked up at a single keep is a whole lot of yellow shields.

It was enough to make you believe there actually was a coordinated Team Green.

Other teams always stack up on the team in the lead. When EP is 2,000 points up on everyone else, who else do you expect them to attack?

Nobody wants to fight over second place. They want to be the big dog. Suck it up, it happened to DC constantly when they were winning three or four campaigns in a row.

And that's when the game is the most fun. Chaos. 100 enemy running around in your tri-keep backyard. I was like a dog chasing cars on a freeway, never sure which one I wanted. So many targets! No long horse rides. Constant 1vX action. Ganking. Escapes. Long running fights in the scroll temples. Killing the people camping your base. You have to admit that the PVP is fun, even when you're on the receiving end of a double team.

Omnipresent

lol ya we prolly lose, fare gets turned red or blue and all u see in zone chat is peeps still worried about sej n stuff... theres just not enough organization in ad right now, especially when it seems like blues eat drink n *** oraganization, even reds beat us on that part

Omnipresent

bottom line is we need more peeps leading groups, the ones we got now ROCK.. peace to telels and night Mother(and anyone else i didnt mention) but ya...we need more

NBrookus

Minalan wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

Minno wrote: »

Minalan wrote: »

With factions stacking 6- 7 full raids by cheating the queue and faction lock, who the *** cares who wins this one?

Right now it's a competition between who can cheat the most, and field the most players at once at the expense of other factions.

When one faction is steamrolling the whole map and pulling emp prime time with triple locks, it's not because they're THAT good.

Seriously? Maybe there should be an actual team green until we get a fix lol.

You mean something other than DC faction stacking at Chim gate tonight while AD faction stacked at Ghartok and neither managed to get a scroll? While there was not a single crossed yellow/blue swords on the map? Trust me, there was no shortage of players on any faction. 80+ AD stacked up at a single keep is a whole lot of yellow shields.

It was enough to make you believe there actually was a coordinated Team Green.

Other teams always stack up on the team in the lead. When EP is 2,000 points up on everyone else, who else do you expect them to attack?

Nobody wants to fight over second place. They want to be the big dog. Suck it up, it happened to DC constantly when they were winning three or four campaigns in a row.

Oh no, the gate ticks were epic. Thank you, please come again. Unfortunately the lag was epic, too.

Ilpagliaccio

Normally, I leave delusional people alone but not today. You Hskbrets are harshing my mellow. If you think EP hasn't gotten double teamed on a more frequent basis since release, then you're smoking some mighty dank--also, would you please share. EP has experienced this level of AD/DC aggro innumerable times while in distant third--the whole "hurr durr 1st place" claim is obnoxious at best.

If the AD/DC guilds,who wanted to stack together last night, want to lie to ease their embarrassment, then more power to them. I know I'd be ashamed if I were part of an 8 guild,cross-faction stacking effort that couldn't even get scrolls,while all populations were tied at pop-lock btw. That's an embarrassment on such a level that you'd think Donnybrooks himself was leading them. Praise be Commander Donnybrooks,Scourge of Cyrodiil.

A few facts in closing that tie my point together:

1. EP,as a whole, consistently makes more AP than the other factions since Wabba 1(by about 20% on average)--EP NA 1st GO Worlds btw. To even compete with the amount of action/AP that EP gets, locked-pop Wabba 1AD had to crown an emp daily during Oceanic primetime. I'll edit in a SS of Wabba 2 Leaderboards here:
   Wabba 2 is relevant to the point of AP gains because it was the only full-on AP farming campaign NA ever had, and a typical Emp reign would make about 1 mil AP in 10 hours(100k ap/hr prior to AP gain buffs). Of the top 5 on overall leaderboards, only Permared and Crystalized had Emp reigns. 3 EP in top 5 versus 2 AD in top 5. All of the players in top 5 were part of their respective factions' emp groups, and AD had Emp daily, EP did not. I think I hammered this point home enough that even BoD members could understand it.
2. Chal and BRK see a significant amount of fighting compared to Roe and Ash,so much so that I left an AD alt in Roe during a TF cycle (while EP was 3rd mind you) and he was alive inside the keep 10 hours later, gg no re. I could have done the same yesterday and not seen any action at Roe while pop-locked AD/DC donated AP ticks at gates/scroll temples. I loved the Brindle and Bloodmayne claims yesterday too: "AD Castle" and "Be Quiet Iskra" respectively. Thanks again for the gate ticks, BoD,AK,CoH,Dom Dom,DK, Venatus,et al.
3. The numerous AD/DC rerolls to EP this cycle reaffirm the aforementioned points on an almost daily basis. Yes, people swap to the winning faction, and that's what a lot of AD/DC have been doing--Thanks for adding @names to the default UI,ZoS. Oh, my point is that bandwagoners are reiterating what has been known for 3 years as if their thoughts are original, amusing. It's as if AD/DC players don't realize that BRK and Chal get more action and AP, and as a result, EP overall gains more AP, which in turn translates to more gold per campaign. I made almost 2 mil gold from pvp last cycle, nom nom.

doublestuffed

AD has become an absolute cess pool. I prefer getting AP and good fights. When the groups I run in try to do anything beneficial for the the alliance, they *** over any opportunity we've given them. The good guilds just don't run anymore.

Juli'St

doublestuffed wrote: »

AD has become an absolute cess pool. I prefer getting AP and good fights. When the groups I run in try to do anything beneficial for the the alliance, they *** over any opportunity we've given them. The good guilds just don't run anymore.

Np, your choice not fight a campaign... but not talk about a campaign, GUILDS (HAVE MANY IN CAMPAIGN) if u not fight her.

bye!

Juli'St

"Nobody wants to fight over second place."

...to first place, need up to 2rd place.

So simple...

Juli'St

Ilpagliaccio wrote: »

Normally, I leave delusional people alone but not today. You Hskbrets are harshing my mellow. If you think EP hasn't gotten double teamed on a more frequent basis since release, then you're smoking some mighty dank--also, would you please share. EP has experienced this level of AD/DC aggro innumerable times while in distant third--the whole "hurr durr 1st place" claim is obnoxious at best.

If the AD/DC guilds,who wanted to stack together last night, want to lie to ease their embarrassment, then more power to them. I know I'd be ashamed if I were part of an 8 guild,cross-faction stacking effort that couldn't even get scrolls,while all populations were tied at pop-lock btw. That's an embarrassment on such a level that you'd think Donnybrooks himself was leading them. Praise be Commander Donnybrooks,Scourge of Cyrodiil.

A few facts in closing that tie my point together:

1. EP,as a whole, consistently makes more AP than the other factions since Wabba 1(by about 20% on average)--EP NA 1st GO Worlds btw. To even compete with the amount of action/AP that EP gets, locked-pop Wabba 1AD had to crown an emp daily during Oceanic primetime. I'll edit in a SS of Wabba 2 Leaderboards here:
   Wabba 2 is relevant to the point of AP gains because it was the only full-on AP farming campaign NA ever had, and a typical Emp reign would make about 1 mil AP in 10 hours(100k ap/hr prior to AP gain buffs). Of the top 5 on overall leaderboards, only Permared and Crystalized had Emp reigns. 3 EP in top 5 versus 2 AD in top 5. All of the players in top 5 were part of their respective factions' emp groups, and AD had Emp daily, EP did not. I think I hammered this point home enough that even BoD members could understand it.
2. Chal and BRK see a significant amount of fighting compared to Roe and Ash,so much so that I left an AD alt in Roe during a TF cycle (while EP was 3rd mind you) and he was alive inside the keep 10 hours later, gg no re. I could have done the same yesterday and not seen any action at Roe while pop-locked AD/DC donated AP ticks at gates/scroll temples. I loved the Brindle and Bloodmayne claims yesterday too: "AD Castle" and "Be Quiet Iskra" respectively. Thanks again for the gate ticks, BoD,AK,CoH,Dom Dom,DK, Venatus,et al.
3. The numerous AD/DC rerolls to EP this cycle reaffirm the aforementioned points on an almost daily basis. Yes, people swap to the winning faction, and that's what a lot of AD/DC have been doing--Thanks for adding @names to the default UI,ZoS. Oh, my point is that bandwagoners are reiterating what has been known for 3 years as if their thoughts are original, amusing. It's as if AD/DC players don't realize that BRK and Chal get more action and AP, and as a result, EP overall gains more AP, which in turn translates to more gold per campaign. I made almost 2 mil gold from pvp last cycle, nom nom.

Who LOSE for ONE YEAR, EP, cant talk much about 'victory'... so, 'friend', dont sing victory before the time...

kevlarto_ESO

I was hoping that maybe the battlegrounds would spread out the players a bit guess not, I remember all the cries for small scale why are people not using them they broke ? I was hoping that once sustain had taken the hit it did, cheaters would be easy to spot and less likely to cheat, I guess not, I guess pvp is still not fun from the sounds of it, and with the horrible clueless dev team it will stay that way, guess I will continue my journey through Morrowind until I am done with it and then journey off to the forgotten lands or something LOL.