Un-nerf raidiant destruction.

Emmagoldman

@Destyran Is that true, hmmm, are your sure that it didnt *start* at 50% and increase damage based on a persons missing health and it once (db days) was based on mag.

Kashiwagi

Un-nerf my spell
Say you'll buff me again
Undo this hurt you caused
When you took my exec
Took it out of my life
Un-cry these tears
I cried so many fights
Un-nerf my spell...

Brutusmax1mus

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

Enough with the 50% thing. This is the most misleading tooltip in the game. The scaling is awful until about 35% and it only truly becomes a great execute around 20%.

Other Myths Busted

- Radiant has an incorrect death recap. You did not die to a 25k beam. You had one hit point left and would have died to an unarmed punch. It just shows all of the damage you would have gotten if you somehow survived with only 1 hit point left. Which you wouldn't, because you can't.
- Radiant is no longer powerful due to the 21% nerf. So now you're getting hit for 20k instead of 25k. Not that it matters because you're dead anyway. See previous point.
- Radiant spammers only push one button. Nope. You have to empower it first. That's 2 buttons. Even 3 if you include a CC.
- Radiant would be fixed if you lowered the distance. Nope. Only if you also lowered heavy armor. I can beam you from 5 feet just as easily as I can from 30 yards. If I was in light armor that would not be a viable option.
- Radiant is unfair to roll dodgers. Nope. Radiant is the only thing keeping roll dodgers in line. It's the exact rock to their scissors.
- Radiant was nerfed due to PVP. Nope. It was nerfed because people were hitting 60 to 80k damage ticks on bosses in PVE.
- Sam Bradford is a good quarterback. Nope. He stinks.

Everything here I agree with. Besides 1 thing

the 50% was not the reason it got nerfed correct,
but it was part of the problem. And yes it did
hit hard. At 50% With full Impen gold Julianos gear5/1/1 light/medium/heavy. I was getting 4k ticks on me. That's a continuous execution tick from 40yards out

It was excessive. And even with the nerfs is still the best pvp and pve execute. That alone is proof to uphold the nerf

Shield up and laugh since you're in light dude wtf. Even with 4k ticks that takes 2 seconds to drain 1 shield... Which probably have you magicka back to cast another. Don't complain about things hitting you hard if you're in light armor...

My light attack executioner weaves would hit for more than that anyway.

That works now, like I said this was only in retrospect to the old Radiant destruction "dude"


And when I was wearing 5 light, and everything is golded out with full impen no, just no. Light attack executioner hits barely harder. And had to be close range. I can easily dodge roll it as well. RD can't be avoided as easily, and before your inevitable "interupt" comment comes in, please tell me what gap closer has a 40yard range. Go on I'll wait.

You're using destro right? Flame reach is 28 yards. If you're further than that you might as well streak backwards and break the channel....... Dude.

Because every class is a sorc right?

Thought u said you were.. but every class and spec has a counter. Every. Single. One.
If you died to rd it's because you got beat to 25%hp. Basing a person using RD is the easiest way to turn the fight around.

Thal

Keep the nerf and make it fire based damage since it's... holy fire

Neoauspex

It's funny though, the nerf to Radiant Oppression made the skill useless for anything except the one thing that was it's biggest complaint: people firing it from the back of zergs at max range and getting no-skill kills with it. Now that's the only thing that works; you have to already be beaming a target when they dip to low health from other sources of damage. In a one-on-one fight, any class can just heal through it at it's current strength.

But check out the advantages of making the damage scale inversely with range:

- Firing it from the back of a zerg punishes the Templar's mobility/vulnerability more than it rewards them with damage output.
- Dodge rolling becomes an effective defense again because it can quickly increase your distance from the beamer.
- It differentiates the skill from Soul Assault.
- It matches the Templar "house" style of in your face combat effectiveness.

I just want it to be both effective and require skill to use properly. Right now it's the opposite ZOS.

Nelson_Rebel

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Brutusmax1mus wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

Enough with the 50% thing. This is the most misleading tooltip in the game. The scaling is awful until about 35% and it only truly becomes a great execute around 20%.

Other Myths Busted

- Radiant has an incorrect death recap. You did not die to a 25k beam. You had one hit point left and would have died to an unarmed punch. It just shows all of the damage you would have gotten if you somehow survived with only 1 hit point left. Which you wouldn't, because you can't.
- Radiant is no longer powerful due to the 21% nerf. So now you're getting hit for 20k instead of 25k. Not that it matters because you're dead anyway. See previous point.
- Radiant spammers only push one button. Nope. You have to empower it first. That's 2 buttons. Even 3 if you include a CC.
- Radiant would be fixed if you lowered the distance. Nope. Only if you also lowered heavy armor. I can beam you from 5 feet just as easily as I can from 30 yards. If I was in light armor that would not be a viable option.
- Radiant is unfair to roll dodgers. Nope. Radiant is the only thing keeping roll dodgers in line. It's the exact rock to their scissors.
- Radiant was nerfed due to PVP. Nope. It was nerfed because people were hitting 60 to 80k damage ticks on bosses in PVE.
- Sam Bradford is a good quarterback. Nope. He stinks.

Everything here I agree with. Besides 1 thing

the 50% was not the reason it got nerfed correct,
but it was part of the problem. And yes it did
hit hard. At 50% With full Impen gold Julianos gear5/1/1 light/medium/heavy. I was getting 4k ticks on me. That's a continuous execution tick from 40yards out

It was excessive. And even with the nerfs is still the best pvp and pve execute. That alone is proof to uphold the nerf

Shield up and laugh since you're in light dude wtf. Even with 4k ticks that takes 2 seconds to drain 1 shield... Which probably have you magicka back to cast another. Don't complain about things hitting you hard if you're in light armor...

My light attack executioner weaves would hit for more than that anyway.

That works now, like I said this was only in retrospect to the old Radiant destruction "dude"


And when I was wearing 5 light, and everything is golded out with full impen no, just no. Light attack executioner hits barely harder. And had to be close range. I can easily dodge roll it as well. RD can't be avoided as easily, and before your inevitable "interupt" comment comes in, please tell me what gap closer has a 40yard range. Go on I'll wait.

You're using destro right? Flame reach is 28 yards. If you're further than that you might as well streak backwards and break the channel....... Dude.

Because every class is a sorc right?

Thought u said you were.. but every class and spec has a counter. Every. Single. One.
If you died to rd it's because you got beat to 25%hp. Basing a person using RD is the easiest way to turn the fight around.

You're absolutely right there are counters to it, but not when they are executing you from behind groups. 50% from 40 yards away is too much.

20% range from far away is far easier to manage because the burst is far less now

THAT was the whole point of the nerf in the first place It's SUPPOSED to be an EXECUTE not a spammable Burst skill

Nelson_Rebel

Neoauspex wrote: »

It's funny though, the nerf to Radiant Oppression made the skill useless for anything except the one thing that was it's biggest complaint: people firing it from the back of zergs at max range and getting no-skill kills with it. Now that's the only thing that works; you have to already be beaming a target when they dip to low health from other sources of damage. In a one-on-one fight, any class can just heal through it at it's current strength.

But check out the advantages of making the damage scale inversely with range:

- Firing it from the back of a zerg punishes the Templar's mobility/vulnerability more than it rewards them with damage output.
- Dodge rolling becomes an effective defense again because it can quickly increase your distance from the beamer.
- It differentiates the skill from Soul Assault.
- It matches the Templar "house" style of in your face combat effectiveness.

I just want it to be both effective and require skill to use properly. Right now it's the opposite ZOS.

This would undoubtedly be buggy,
ZoS is not known for having skills to work properly in regards to scaling, especially with calculations involving distance scaling.

What ZoS did to balance it was the best option

Neoauspex

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Neoauspex wrote: »

It's funny though, the nerf to Radiant Oppression made the skill useless for anything except the one thing that was it's biggest complaint: people firing it from the back of zergs at max range and getting no-skill kills with it. Now that's the only thing that works; you have to already be beaming a target when they dip to low health from other sources of damage. In a one-on-one fight, any class can just heal through it at it's current strength.

But check out the advantages of making the damage scale inversely with range:

- Firing it from the back of a zerg punishes the Templar's mobility/vulnerability more than it rewards them with damage output.
- Dodge rolling becomes an effective defense again because it can quickly increase your distance from the beamer.
- It differentiates the skill from Soul Assault.
- It matches the Templar "house" style of in your face combat effectiveness.

I just want it to be both effective and require skill to use properly. Right now it's the opposite ZOS.

This would undoubtedly be buggy,
ZoS is not known for having skills to work properly in regards to scaling, especially with calculations involving distance scaling.

What ZoS did to balance it was the best option

I respect your opinion, but your logic is undoubtedly buggy. Your arbitrary speculation does not support the argument that the current option is "best".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

leepalmer95

Neoauspex wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Neoauspex wrote: »

It's funny though, the nerf to Radiant Oppression made the skill useless for anything except the one thing that was it's biggest complaint: people firing it from the back of zergs at max range and getting no-skill kills with it. Now that's the only thing that works; you have to already be beaming a target when they dip to low health from other sources of damage. In a one-on-one fight, any class can just heal through it at it's current strength.

But check out the advantages of making the damage scale inversely with range:

- Firing it from the back of a zerg punishes the Templar's mobility/vulnerability more than it rewards them with damage output.
- Dodge rolling becomes an effective defense again because it can quickly increase your distance from the beamer.
- It differentiates the skill from Soul Assault.
- It matches the Templar "house" style of in your face combat effectiveness.

I just want it to be both effective and require skill to use properly. Right now it's the opposite ZOS.

This would undoubtedly be buggy,
ZoS is not known for having skills to work properly in regards to scaling, especially with calculations involving distance scaling.

What ZoS did to balance it was the best option

I respect your opinion, but your logic is undoubtedly buggy. Your arbitrary speculation does not support the argument that the current option is "best".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

It still hits very hard? Im confused.

If you use it as an actual execute when someone is in actual 'execute' range e.g. 30%~ you'll 1 hit them so fast you dont even see the beam animation .

People are still getting 55-60k crits in pve as well, its still strong there.

Nelson_Rebel

Neoauspex wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Neoauspex wrote: »

It's funny though, the nerf to Radiant Oppression made the skill useless for anything except the one thing that was it's biggest complaint: people firing it from the back of zergs at max range and getting no-skill kills with it. Now that's the only thing that works; you have to already be beaming a target when they dip to low health from other sources of damage. In a one-on-one fight, any class can just heal through it at it's current strength.

But check out the advantages of making the damage scale inversely with range:

- Firing it from the back of a zerg punishes the Templar's mobility/vulnerability more than it rewards them with damage output.
- Dodge rolling becomes an effective defense again because it can quickly increase your distance from the beamer.
- It differentiates the skill from Soul Assault.
- It matches the Templar "house" style of in your face combat effectiveness.

I just want it to be both effective and require skill to use properly. Right now it's the opposite ZOS.

This would undoubtedly be buggy,
ZoS is not known for having skills to work properly in regards to scaling, especially with calculations involving distance scaling.

What ZoS did to balance it was the best option

I respect your opinion, but your logic is undoubtedly buggy. Your arbitrary speculation does not support the argument that the current option is "best".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

You did nothing to contribute to the argument other than to try and insult me for having a fallacy? The definition of fallacy has nothing to do with what I said about RD being buggy.


Which still stands, ZoS has not once implemented a scaling damage modifer that works correctly. Hell they had critical damage modifiers not working properly for Months before Homestead patched it.

I have supporting information to back my claims, you just have a snobby attitude and linked to definition to a word that has no relevance to what I'm saying. That's called a fallacy as well there.


You know what's even better? Is that Radiant is STILL the highest performing Execute ingame after the nerfs. So excuse me while I sit here baffled at how you could even defend having radiant overpowered God mode

Neoauspex

@leepalmer95 I want it to hit less hard than it hits now when it's at full range. I'm not sure how you guys managed to interpret my post as wanting to buff Radiant Oppression. I want it to not be spammed by ten players in the back of a zerg; it should be effective when the Templar is at risk in melee and not effective outside of that.

@Nelson_Rebel I never defended "radiant overpowered God mode". I agree it needed a nerf, I just think it should have been nerfed differently in order to change how the skill is commonly utilized. And you didn't even click on the link! It's not the definition of a word it's a list of argument tactics that don't work. I was trying to be helpful. Be civil mate! I want the game to be awesome just like you do.

Destyran

But why take shards off is when it stuns 1 person and night blades have a unblockable aoe fear and sorcs have encase? Dks talons? Templars??????? A expensive spear that mini stuns and toppling charge that make you stun the enemy but land in a position where u cant attack?

Bramir

I have started leveling my Templar, and still my opinion is that under no circumstances should this ridiculous, pvp-ruining ability be 'un-nerfed'.

THEDKEXPERIENCE

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Neoauspex wrote: »

Nelson_Rebel wrote: »

Neoauspex wrote: »

It's funny though, the nerf to Radiant Oppression made the skill useless for anything except the one thing that was it's biggest complaint: people firing it from the back of zergs at max range and getting no-skill kills with it. Now that's the only thing that works; you have to already be beaming a target when they dip to low health from other sources of damage. In a one-on-one fight, any class can just heal through it at it's current strength.

But check out the advantages of making the damage scale inversely with range:

- Firing it from the back of a zerg punishes the Templar's mobility/vulnerability more than it rewards them with damage output.
- Dodge rolling becomes an effective defense again because it can quickly increase your distance from the beamer.
- It differentiates the skill from Soul Assault.
- It matches the Templar "house" style of in your face combat effectiveness.

I just want it to be both effective and require skill to use properly. Right now it's the opposite ZOS.

This would undoubtedly be buggy,
ZoS is not known for having skills to work properly in regards to scaling, especially with calculations involving distance scaling.

What ZoS did to balance it was the best option

I respect your opinion, but your logic is undoubtedly buggy. Your arbitrary speculation does not support the argument that the current option is "best".

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fallacies

It still hits very hard? Im confused.

If you use it as an actual execute when someone is in actual 'execute' range e.g. 30%~ you'll 1 hit them so fast you dont even see the beam animation .

People are still getting 55-60k crits in pve as well, its still strong there.

The invisible beam animation has ceased happening since the last update.

Marktoneth3

make it dodge able then

Destyran

Marktoneth3 wrote: »

make it dodge able then

No never gonna happen. Why do you need to dodge when rally and vigor already out heals it? And when templar had to put every thing it has on you wnd jab while walking a certain way just to do decent damage?

Bramir wrote: »

I have started leveling my Templar, and still my opinion is that under no circumstances should this ridiculous, pvp-ruining ability be 'un-nerfed'.

Well put 1000 hours into it and then xomment on this thread.

TequilaFire

They also should reduce the range on lethal arrow and poison injection if we were to follow some of you guys logic.
Spam that much?

Destyran

TequilaFire wrote: »

They also should reduce the range on lethal arrow and poison injection if we were to follow some of you guys logic.
Spam that much?

Yeah its honestly a stronger execute than RD